1. GET SMOGON SHIRTS HERE! First time ever. Limited time only & next time the design will be different, so get it while you can!
  2. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  3. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

The Stat-Swap Metagame!

Discussion in 'Other Metagames' started by Celever, Jun 8, 2013.

  1. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,772
    (Approved by Arcticblast, Joim'll program it)
    Shout-out to Eagle4 who did more than half of the list and kept annoying me to get this done!​


    Welcome to the stat-swap metagame! Do you ever wish that Unown could be viable in OU? Or that your favourite leek-holding duck could finally brave bird through something.. anything? Well this is the tier for you! The way this works is that the stats of a pokemon get switched with another pokemon, but nothing else! This means that if something with an eccentric movepool but bad stats get paired up with something with fantastic stats but a bad movepool, the latter pokemon could finally become a top-tier threat! The list is previously prepared for this tier, since otherwise you would end up with some hilariously broken stuff and gen 6 would be out by the time we actually get a list together for the pairings. As much as possible, we have tried to get a large break between tiers, or just to have a pokemon benfit a lot from the pairing, but there are so many pokemon and not all can have partners, evident by our trio at the end. Also a few LCs have been brought into this, otherwise it would be too hard to justify all the pairings! Also, dream world abilities are all released
    Can you think of a pairing you think is a great idea? Can you find a place for the two out-cast pokemon? Make a post! Also post if I forgot a pokemon or put one down twice! I'm derpier than a Stunfisk who swapped stats with a Bidoof! (We all know it's true...) If Eagle4 (since he is pretty much a co-host by now) and I like it, it may be implemented! Now, for the part you have all been waiting for, the list!
    (ctrl+f is recommended for finding a pokemon. I still say Charizard should be paired with Ho-oh...)
    Show Hide
    1. Doduo vs Zweilous
    2. Cradily vs Armaldo
    3. Sigilyph vs Xatu
    4. Slakoth vs Archeops
    5. Machamp vs Golurk
    6. Emolga vs Pachirisu
    7. Bouffalant vs Rampardos
    8. Ursaring vs Beartic
    9. Cubone vs Sharpedo
    10. Gardevoir vs Gallade
    11. Swoobat vs Crobat
    12. Heatmor vs Durant
    13. Glalie vs Cacturne
    14. Leafeon vs Espeon
    15. Gliscor vs Drapion
    16. Kabutops vs Omastar
    17. Probopass vs Bastiodon
    18. Electrode vs Amoonguss
    19. Forretress vs Ferrothorn
    20. Jumpluff vs Whimsicott
    21. Parasect vs Breloom
    22. Solrock vs Volcarona
    23. Lunatone vs Cresselia
    24. Heracross vs Vespiquen
    25. Glaceon vs Umbreon
    26. Mantine vs Skarmory
    27. Ditto vs Mew
    28. Azumarill vs Lopunny
    29. Chandelure vs Mawile
    30. Ninjask vs Shedinja
    31. Beautifly vs Masquerain
    32. Pelipper vs Swanna
    33. Sawsbuck vs Victreebel
    34. Manectric vs Raichu
    35. Nidoking vs Muk
    36. Nidoqueen vs Weezing
    37. Slowbro vs Slowking
    38. Tentacruel vs Hitmontop
    39. Larvitar vs Tyranitar
    40. Ariados vs Galvantula
    41. Pidgeot vs Swellow
    42. Venusaur vs Exeggutor
    43. Moltres vs Unfezant
    44. Slaking vs Regigigas
    45. Staraptor vs Farfetch’d
    46. Linoone vs Furret
    47. Hariyama vs Primeape
    48. Lickilicky vs Blissey
    49. Chatot vs Exploud
    50. Spiritomb vs Sableye
    51. Zapdos vs Articuno
    52. Seviper vs Zangoose
    53. Hitmonlee vs Hitmonchan
    54. Gligar vs Scyther
    55. Cacnea vs Infernape
    56. Accelgor vs Escavalier
    57. Charizard vs Gyarados
    58. Snorlax vs Sudowoodo
    59. Ampharos vs Miltank
    60. Wailord vs Relicanth
    61. Absol vs Skuntank
    62. Rapidash vs Keldeo
    63. Mandibuzz vs Braviary
    64. Dewgong vs Cloyster
    65. Unown vs Thundurus-T
    66. Kingler vs Crawdaunt
    67. Marowak vs Kangaskhan
    68. Mr. Mime vs Kadabra
    69. Poliwrath vs Jynx
    70. Arcanine vs Entei
    71. Persian vs Purugly
    72. Venomoth vs Butterfree
    73. Sandslash vs Claydol
    74. Lapras vs Vaporeon
    75: Kecleon vs Sceptile
    76. Dragonite vs Noctowl
    77. Jolteon vs Raikou
    78. Meganium vs Vileplume
    79. Typhlosion vs Camerupt
    80. Feraligatr vs Krookodile
    81. Beedrill vs Fearow
    82. Seaking vs Bascullin
    83. Delcatty vs Serperior
    84. Dunsparce vs Excadrill
    85. Lanturn vs Lumineon
    86. Quagsire vs Stunfisk
    87. Bellossom vs Ludicolo
    88. Ledian vs Scizor
    90. Stantler vs Delibird
    91. Blastoise vs Empoleon
    92. Raticate vs Stoutland
    93. Arbok vs Eelektross
    94. Clefable vs Gengar
    95. Slowpoke vs Politoed
    96. Wigglytuff vs Audino
    97. Maractus vs Minccino
    98. Dugtrio vs Dodrio
    99. Murkrow vs Victini
    100. Fraxure vs Hydreigon
    101. Tangrowth vs Yanmega
    102. Gothitelle vs Reuniclus
    103. All Rotom Formes vs All Simi Formes
    104. Shelgon vs Shuckle
    105. Dragonair vs Milotic
    107. Plusle vs Illumise
    108. Minun vs Volbeat
    109. Vanilluxe vs Garbodor
    110. Electivire vs Magmortar
    111. Liepard vs Granbull
    112. Donphan vs Starmie
    113. Bronzong vs Chimecho
    114. Alakazam vs Wobbuffet
    115. Houndoom vs Girafarig
    116. Lilligant vs Leavanny
    117. Luvdisc vs Alomomola
    118. Zebstrika vs Luxray
    119. Virizion vs Terrakion
    120. Abomasnow vs Castform
    121. Carracosta vs Torterra
    122. Salamence vs Druddigon
    123. Crustle vs Torkoal
    124. Steelix vs Aggron
    125. Emboar vs Grumpig
    126. Magcargo vs Gastrodon
    127. Cryogonal vs Regice
    128. Registeel vs Regirock
    129. Dustox vs Mothim
    130. Mightyena vs Darmanitan
    131. Altaria vs Golduck
    132. Ambipom vs Vigoroth
    133. Banette vs Weavile
    134. Beheeyem vs Jirachi
    135. Bibarel vs Floatzel
    136. Bisharp vs Latios
    137. Celebi vs Tropius
    138. Cherrim vs Munchlax
    139. Seismitoad vs Toxicroak
    140. Cinccino vs Flareon
    141. Rhydon vs Pichu
    142. Cobalion vs Samurott
    143. Cofagrigus vs Dusclops
    144. Lucario vs Zoroark
    145. Gigalith vs Golem
    146. Corsola vs Relicanth
    147. Drifblim vs Hypno
    148. Dusknoir vs Magnezone
    149. Gorebyss vs Huntail
    150. Honchkrow vs Landorus
    151. Kricketune vs Meloetta
    152. Roserade vs Scolipede
    153. Sawk vs Throh
    154. Swalot vs Landorus-T
    155. Swampert vs Whiscash
    156. Mienshao vs Scrafty
    157. Carnivine vs Spinda
    158. Kingdra vs Suicune
    159. Mamoswine vs Heatran
    160. Porygon-Z vs Porygon2
    161. Qwilfish vs Octillery
    162: Sunflora vs Ninetales
    163. Walrein vs Sealeo
    164. Haunter vs Mismagius
    165. Shaymin vs Phione
    166. Latias vs Metagross
    167. Musharna vs Pinsir
    168. Magneton vs Klinklang
    169. Magikarp vs Smeargle
    170. Tauros vs Rhyperior
    171. Shiftry vs Togekiss
    172. Haxorus vs Piloswine
    173. Froslass vs Misdreavus
    174. Riolu vs Timburr
    175. Pikachu vs Medicham
    176. Azelf, Mesprit and Uxie's stats have all been set to the average of each, so, 77/102/102/102/102/96
    177. Hippowdon vs Vibrava
    178. Garchomp vs Aerodactyl
    179. Chansey vs Happiny
    180. Surskit vs Seadra


    I sincerely hope you enjoy this meta-game! Thank you for taking part in the Stat-Swap Metagame!

    The list is still being finalized, I appreciate your patience.
  2. The Reptile

    The Reptile we're all skeletons on the inside
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2011
    Messages:
    1,283
    Rapidash vs Keldeo

    This one is pretty neat. Rapidash, while having some good stats behind it, has a poor special movepool. However, it does have more bulk, so maybe we'll see Sunny Day Rapidash? Anyways, Keldeo is pretty cool, since it has good STABs and Aqua Jet, not to mention Sword Dance.

    Lucario vs Zoroak

    Hey look, Lucario doesn't need to rely on priority anymore! Lucario is rather threatening now, being able to go for either a Nasty Plot or a Sword Dance thanks to it's much higher base 105 speed. Zoroak only worsens though imo, since it's now slower and a bit weaker; the extra bulk helps with nothing. Still, Lucario is pretty cool now, so that's a thing.

    Slowpoke vs Politoed
    Sunflora vs Ninetales
    Abomasnow vs Castform

    Welp, I hope you guys like Sand. :P

    Hippowdon vs Vibrava
    Larvitar vs Tyranitar

    [EDIT: Yay, no more weather! (Now it's time to bring a weather starter when no one else brings weather. Hehehe...>:) )

    Spiritomb vs Sableye

    Sableye actually has bulk now, along side his Prankster shenanigans. Hope you didn't mind getting burned!
  3. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,772
    Oops, I missed that. If something broken gets brought up here then I'm gonna have to change it. xD

    Anyway so yeah, sand needs a nerfed starter too. This meta ain't being no weather wars!! Or uh.. just weather!!
  4. Darknesscrusher

    Darknesscrusher

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2013
    Messages:
    242
    Hmm... Could Cubone/something with nice attacking stats be added?
  5. Sound

    Sound

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2012
    Messages:
    219
    Latias vs Metagross

    Dragons just took a hit.

    Dunsparce vs Excadrill

    An agility set with serene grace Rock Slide would be trolly. Return/Rockslide/Earthquake hits plenty of stuff.

    Ledian vs Scizor

    I'm guessing this was to troll Scizor, but now I really want to try out Iron Fist 130 attack Ledian.

    Donphan vs Starmie

    Both got the short end of the stick here.

    Archeops vs Aerodactyl

    Too bad the spinners got hurt.

    Azumarill vs Lopunny

    Oh, what fun this will be. :)


    I can't wait to try this, it looks interesting.
  6. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,772
    Done! Cubone broke up some broken stuff too, good idea, lol.
  7. Eagle4

    Eagle4

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2012
    Messages:
    1,619
    Shelgon vs Shuckle

    Shelgon's new stats: 20/10/230/10/230/5

    With eviolite, Shelgon is probably the bulkiest mon in the tier, taking every hit with ease. A combination of Wish, Protect, Roar and Toxic can outlast many opposing Pokemon. A Choice Band Adamant Outrage can 2HKO Shelgon at best.

    Gothitelle vs Reuniclus

    Gothitelle's new stats: 110/65/75/125/85/30

    Gothitelle becomes an effective trapper, with stats able to take hits and fire off high power moves.
  8. Infernis

    Infernis

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2012
    Messages:
    768
    Oh man, Shelgon's gonna be great. Some of my favorites:

    Medicham/Pikachu: Medicham's stats are universally lowered, except for 10 more speed. Sad for Medicham. Pikachu, on the other hand, becomes more of a nuke. Even slower, but with much better SpA with that Light Ball.

    Lopunny/Azumarill: Screw Lopunny, Azumarill is going to be the greatest offensive water type in the game short of Kyogre. 552 attack right out of the gate with base 105 speed. More than double the base speed. Slap a choice band on that shit and slam things with 828 Atk Aqua Jet or Waterfall. Maybe Ice Punch for shattering that Shelgon. Good gods, it's not even that much frailer.

    Golurk/Machamp: CB Golurk needed Close Combat, right? And Machamp wanted Shadow Punch? :naughty:
  9. The Reptile

    The Reptile we're all skeletons on the inside
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2011
    Messages:
    1,283
    Rhydon vs Pichu

    This is probably the most random thing ever. :u. Pichu would be OK as an Eviolitemon, it has Encore and Wish as support moves. It's defenses are pretty good, and Lightning Rod is a neat ability, not to mention Fake Out is pretty nifty. Sadly, it's attacking movepool is complete crap, although it DOES have a 120 BP STAB attack in Volt Tackle (idk what the egg illegalities are there). But yeah, Pichu is pretty neat now.

    Also

    252+ Atk Choice Band Pure Power Azumarill Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Shellgon: 122-144 (50 - 59.01%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    252+ Atk Choice Band Pure Power Azumarill Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Shellgon: 98-116 (40.16 - 47.54%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
    252 Atk Choice Band Pure Power Azumarill Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Shellgon: 110-130 (45.08 - 53.27%) -- 32.42% chance to 2HKO
    252 Atk Choice Band Pure Power Azumarill Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Shellgon: 90-106 (36.88 - 43.44%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

    Holy shit Shelgon, you bulky

    To puck Azu's power in perspective...

    252 Atk Choice Band Pure Power Azumarill Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 156-184 (46.7 - 55.08%) -- 13.67% chance to 2HKO
    (That's just normal OU SKarmory fyi)
  10. Snaquaza

    Snaquaza

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2013
    Messages:
    1,044
    Yanmega just got Tangrowth stats, besides a bit lower Sp. Attack and losing a lot of speed, it just got amazing physical defensive stats, and is has a good attack now and it speed is raisable by speed boost, prepare your spinner guys
  11. TerrickTerran

    TerrickTerran

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2006
    Messages:
    457
    Does Relicanth swap with Corsola or Wailord? It's listed with both.

    Shedinja with Ninjask's stats is rather interesting IMO. Ledian with Scizor's stats is interesting though it still gets ripped by rock moves.
  12. Infernis

    Infernis

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2012
    Messages:
    768
    I dunno guys, I think Yanmega might have this one in the bag. It's practically bug/flying Tangrowth with Speed Boost and some serious firepower. It's a (physically) bulky speed booster, which is rather new. Admittedly it has to rely on the crappy STAB moves that Bug and Flying generally deal with, but it can do so with 100/110 offenses. It starts off slow, but rapidly gets faster. An offensive set with Bug Buzz/Air Slash/Protect/U-Turn would make for a pretty darn good pivot. (But yeah, get a spinner or bouncer.)

    Celebi/Tropius: The gods saw the fruity dinosaur, and saw that it was good. A universal rise in stats for the Bananasaur means that it just got a whole lot scarier. Meet your new sun god, with Solar Power, base 100 SpA/Atk, and 100 speed to fly around like the king of the rainforest. Fuck yeah, it's Dino Time.

    Solarbeam/Leaf Storm
    HP Fire
    Earth Power/Earthquake
    Air Slash
  13. lousy918

    lousy918

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2012
    Messages:
    325
    would bronzor work over shelgon

    why are some missing adamant? o.O
  14. The Reptile

    The Reptile we're all skeletons on the inside
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2011
    Messages:
    1,283

    Because Jolly is also a good nature now that Azumarill has a usable speed (base 105). However, some people might want to run Adamant. So I decided to show calcs for both. :P
  15. SpartanMalice

    SpartanMalice

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    391
    I was actually going to suggest a metagame kind of like this, but wasn't sure if it would get approved. I had a different idea about it though, swapping stats by usage statistics (Top OU pokes get switched with Top NU pokes, and so on) so that people won't think I'm giving my favourite mons great stats on purpose. :p

    Regardless, it's nice to see a meta like this on here. I haven't read the whole list, but here's a few I find interesting:

    4. Garchomp vs Aerodactyl
    9. Cubone vs Sharpedo
    18. Electrode vs Amoonguss
    28. Azumarill vs Lopunny
    33. Sawsbuck vs Victreebel
    42. Venusaur vs Exeggutor
    50. Spiritomb vs Sableye
    51. Zapdos vs Articuno
    56. Accelgor vs Escavalier
    57. Charizard vs Gyarados
    62. Rapidash vs Keldeo
    69. Poliwrath vs Jynx
    70. Arcanine vs Entei
    75: Kecleon vs Sceptile
    76. Dragonite vs Noctowl
    79. Typhlosion vs Camerupt
    80. Feraligatr vs Krookodile
    84. Dunsparce vs Excadrill (Faster paraflinch!)
    88. Ledian vs Scizor
    91. Blastoise vs Empoleon
    92. Raticate vs Stoutland
    100. Fraxure vs Hydreigon
    101. Tangrowth vs Yanmega
    112. Donphan vs Starmie
  16. Anty

    Anty

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2013
    Messages:
    798
    I've got a few (some might have been done)

    Wormadam vs shaymin
    Wormadam-t vs bronzong
    Wormadam-s vs donphan
    Whiscash vs swampert
    Swoobat vs hydriegon

    It would be fun to use these guys more especially worm-t, dd whishcash and swoobat that could take a hit but the loss of speed will hurt.
    Krikitune could also be scizor because of bug type, technition and a similar move set.
  17. The Reptile

    The Reptile we're all skeletons on the inside
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2011
    Messages:
    1,283
    Hey, I have a suggestion for this. Can we please get

    Seadra vs Surskit

    Seadra isn't very good anyways outside of maybe PU, but it does have neat stats. Seeing a Water / Bug type in action would be neat, which is why I suggest this. Seadra also has a neat 95 Special Attack to use. It would also get a nice defense and eviolite to use it with. Flavorise, they both get Swift Swim and are both Water-types. That's all I have, but I hope it's good enough. :u
  18. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,772
    That would require changing the list majorly, bringing more LCs into this for no massive reason, to be honest, but...

    ...this is more what we are looking for. Doesn't require changing match-ups, and surskit could finally have some uses on very niche teams. Added! :)
  19. Heroes and Cons

    Heroes and Cons

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2012
    Messages:
    162
    Ninjask and Shedinja...

    Well ninjask is now useless even as a baton passer, but shedinja looks like it could become a potent Pokemon if you aren't prepared for it.
  20. Arceus11

    Arceus11

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2012
    Messages:
    16
    This is a really cool idea with a ton of potential for fun match-ups. That said, there are several rather boring swaps that don't change much or even hurt both pokemon.

    29. Mightyena vs Mawile
    130. Chandelure vs Darmanitan
    Mightyena and Mawile both have poor stats but are cool otherwise, switching them gives Mawile a slight boost, but who honestly cares if two bad mons switch stats, unless one is Slaking and the other is not Regigigas. For Chandelure and Darmanitan, they both have rather terrible movepools unsuited for the other's primary attacking stat. Chandelure's best physical stab is flame charge and Darmanitan has little coverage.

    However, if it were something like this:

    Mighyena vs Darmanitan
    Mawile vs Chandelure
    Now mighyena can actually use its good traits: Sucker Punch off 140 attack is nice, and it gets elemental fangs for coverage. It can either use Moxie for sweeping or potentially Quick Feet for boosting that 95 speed. Mawile, on the other hand, can fire off sheer force boosted special attacks like Flash Cannon, Flamethrower, Ice Beam, and Focus Blast. It also has gets decent 60/90/90 defenses, steel typing, and intimidate if you want to use a bulky attacker. Darmanitan and Chandelure still suck, but they sucked the other way too.

    I will probably post more ideas later. Cool idea for an om, though, and I can't wait until it's playable.
  21. SpartanMalice

    SpartanMalice

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    391
    IMO Charizard kinda gets nerfed even harder by getting Gyarados' stats. Without Intimidate, which gave Gyara better defenses, and an 81 base speed, 125 attack isn't all that good for it. Switching it with Ho-Oh would make it too OP and Ho-Oh weak.

    I'd prefer it switched stats with something faster, like Latios and just ban Solar Power (with those stats it won't need it to wreck things anyway), and Latios with Charizard's stats and soul dew boosts won't be too OP either. That's just my two cents though.

    Gyarados on the other hand gets some benefits, the defenses aren't much different and with Intimidate it can run a special set with 109 SpA.

    BTW:

    4. Garchomp vs Aerodactyl
    178. Garchomp vs Cacnea
  22. Anty

    Anty

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2013
    Messages:
    798
    None of the mons I mentioned were LC, they are all pu which would be nice to improve, also, you mentioned sirscuit, who is lc.
  23. SpartanMalice

    SpartanMalice

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    391
    And Wormadams all have a decent niche too, bug/ground and bug/steel are great typings to work around with. BTW Unown even with Thundy-T's stats still gets only one hidden power I think.

    Jirachi getting Beheeyem's stats is nice, no more flinching, and possibly an Earthquake from a powerful mon could take it out early.
  24. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,772
    I know that you didn't say any LCs, but in order to make those match-ups work I would have to split up ready-made pairs and bring in LCs to make a few pokemon have good stats. Variety is good, but having 3 wormadams have good stats for almost no reason isn't really what this thread is about.

    On the note of variety is good, I like the idea that Arceus11 had and that will be changed.

    Also I'm gonna go Cacnea vs Infernape, Archeops vs Slakoth and Aerodactyl vs Garchomp now. The list was missing archeops and garchomp was there twice.
  25. Infernis

    Infernis

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2012
    Messages:
    768
    Sawk/Throh is pretty interesting. Sawk doesn't get a whole lot out of it, but can pull off a a Sub BU set just about as well as Throh could, plus Close Combat. Throh on the other hand gets base 125 attack with Guts and decent speed. Immunity to status while changing moves with the power of a CB is pretty flippin' great. Let something with a slow U-Turn/Volt Switch take a hit, let Throh in to wreck some shit.

    Against OU Skarmory:
    252+ Atk Guts Throh Superpower vs. 224 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 178-211 (54.43 - 64.52%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    Actually a bit more than Azumarill's Waterfall, though not quite as much as Azumarill's Aqua Tail.

    If you manage to get status'd by something while holding a Choice Band, I think that Throh can do more damage than most anything else right off the bat.

    252+ Atk Choice Band Guts Throh Superpower vs. 224 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 267-315 (81.65 - 96.33%) -- 56.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

    You know, OHKO'ing OU Skarmory after rocks with a neutral attack, like you do.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)