Scolipede
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The Top 10 Titans of the 5th Gen NU Metagame [General Discussion]
- Thread starter Lasagne
- Start date
Scolipedophile
Scolipede
not winning by enough imo
not winning by enough imo
Scolipedophile
Scolipede - a large number
Samurott - 2
Scolipede is the 5th most influential pokemon in BW NU!
Thanks to scorpdestroyer for the Scolipede nomination!
Choose from the following:
Amoonguss / Absol / Samurott / Emboar / Cinccino
I've also decided that at the end, once we have our list, people can raise issues with the list, and if enough people agree with the point raised then that change will be made (some people have been stating that they're not happy with the Pokemon currently available to be voted for).
Samurott - 2
Scolipede is the 5th most influential pokemon in BW NU!
Thanks to scorpdestroyer for the Scolipede nomination!
Now we vote for spot #6!
What effect did Scolipede have on the metagame?
Scolipede is the most influential Pokemon in the current metagame in my opinion, even though it's only been here for a few months. Before Scolipede, the metagame was much slower, as there were many top defensive stall mons and not many extremely effective stallbreakers, especially with the rise of Emboar. Once Scolipede dropped, the metagame instantly transformed to a fast-paced, Spikes-stacking offensive based one. With its blazing Speed, it almost always guarantees two layers of Spikes and paved the way for offensive teams to pressure opponents every time they made a switch. Because of its blazing Speed and remarkable offensive stats, Pokemon like Musharna and Gardevoir, that once almost centralized the metagame, dropped in usage greatly. Pokemon that could outspeed, on the other hand, rose greatly in usage, such as Swellow, Choice Scarf Charizard, Serperior, and Choice Scarf Tauros. Kangaskhan's rise in power, though mainly due to Jynx, was in part due to Scolipede, I am sure. Because it was such an amazing Spikes stacker, Garbodor and Roselia, once the premier Spikers of the metagame, fell sharply in usage. Other offensive Bug-types such as Pinsir dropped sharply as well, since most people thought that Scolipede was better (i agree). At first, most people used Scolipede for offense but as the meta progressed, people began to realize that Scolipede could be used as a bulkymon too, meaning that Scolipede saw use on even more teams. In addition, Weezing and Misdreavus saw a rise in usage and they began to run less common moves as well: Weezing started running Fire Blast and Misdreavus started running Foul Play as well as Taunt. Meanwhile, Tangela, which cannot defeat Scolipede reliably, saw a drop in usage in favorthat physical walls that can (Weezing, Missy). It also popularized defensive Seismitoad as a teammate, which shares great type synergy with BulkyPede. Everytime I build a team, I find fitting in Scolipede was really easy and it often brings waaaay more benefits than harms to the team.
In what main roles was Scolipede used?
Firstly, it was a Spikes setter that can defeat common leads with ease thanks to Aqua Tail. With Spikes and enormous Speed, it could set up multiple layers of Spikes before dying, and with Swords Dance, it could also do major damage while setting up Spikes. Scolipede is also a decent sweeper with SubSalac, and is very scary if teams aren't prepared for it, or if it's late in the game. It defeats most other hazard setters with ease, with Aqua Tail beating Golem and Gigalith, Rock Slide taking out opposing Scolipede, Megahorn hitting hard in general, and Earthquake (though rare) hitting Garbodor, Metang and Regirock.
What caused it to have a significant impact?
Basically Spikes, Toxic Spikes, Swords Dance, coverage moves, amazing STAB. Also, it became the focal point for Spikes stacking offense since it Spikes up so easily.
The reason for its success in my opinion is a) its Speed and b) its offensive moves. The combination of both allows it to Spike up usually two layers guaranteed with a Focus Sash, and I can probably count the common Pokemon that outspeed it on one hand. Meanwhile, the combination of Megahorn hitting non-resists, Mush and Tangela hard, Aqua Tail covering Golurk, Golem and Regirock, and Rock Slide beating Charizard and Jynx, makes it a tough Pokemon to switch into. It has few outright counters, with the most common one being Misdreavus which can Taunt it, Will-O-Wisp it, and wall it (and eventually kill it). Less common ones include Alomomola, Shelgon and Weezing, but they don't exactly appreciate Toxic Spikes (apart from Weezing of course!), and often get set up on. Garbodor and Regirock can usually tank hits and often KO back, but if Scolipede has already set up, it will deal a large chunk of damage before dying. It is easier to check though, but that means you need a rare free switch in. Scarf Pokemon like Tauros, Jynx and Charizard can OHKO it, while Kangaskhan can 2HKO it with the combo of Fake Out + move
How do/did you deal with this Pokemon in NU?
Misdreavus is probably the best counter since it can take hits and cripple it with Will-O-Wisp and make it easier to deal with, and it became an even greater defensive Pokemon for being able to counter both Sawk and Scolipede. Golem is one other hazard setter that can beat Scolipede with Rock Blast, but will probably take significant damage / still allow Spikes / not take it down if Rock Blast is a bitch and hits twice. As mentioned earlier, Choice Scarf Pokemon that are powerful are also decent checks to Scolipede. I find that the most useful way to check Scolipede is to switch in on Spikes / after a kill and force it out / kill it, since the Stealth Rock weakness sucks and all.
Choose from the following:
Amoonguss / Absol / Samurott / Emboar / Cinccino
I've also decided that at the end, once we have our list, people can raise issues with the list, and if enough people agree with the point raised then that change will be made (some people have been stating that they're not happy with the Pokemon currently available to be voted for).
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Absol
is dark
and was a more offensive version of what skuntank tries to be, as in its sucker punch actually gets a fuckton more kos. plus, crits EVERYWHERE. there really isn't a wrong answer between absol/emboar/samurott for the next 3 spots though, they all have strengths/weaknesses but what pushes absol over the edge for me is that it's been able to compete in the tier in metagames that had hugely powerful threats in them and still be just as effective. emboar only really started to see use once magmortar moved up, and samurott took a little while to really gain traction.
is dark
and was a more offensive version of what skuntank tries to be, as in its sucker punch actually gets a fuckton more kos. plus, crits EVERYWHERE. there really isn't a wrong answer between absol/emboar/samurott for the next 3 spots though, they all have strengths/weaknesses but what pushes absol over the edge for me is that it's been able to compete in the tier in metagames that had hugely powerful threats in them and still be just as effective. emboar only really started to see use once magmortar moved up, and samurott took a little while to really gain traction.
Absol was always a pretty damn threatening presence: an obscenely powerful Sucker Punch can stop threats almost as cold as how Kanga do, and unlike Kanga, it can boost so it can literally rip defensive dudes to shreds. Pursuit only made it trickier to play around, and is arguably the proponent for the trapping combo in NU aka Pursuit + Sucker Punch that played insane mindgames with its victims. Unlike its eventual successor Skuntank, Absol hits like a doomsday truck and has Superpower. Also, Super Luck Night Slash asdfghjk
Yeah you tell me.
Yeah you tell me.
OK, I made this whole thing look more professional. Each post that states the winner of a round has the nomination form for that Pokemon embedded in a quote. In the OP, where the list is, each name and image for each Pokemon in the top 10 so far links to its nomination post. Every post is just a bit prettier too :)
Anyway, voting for Samurott. Will add in reasons later
Anyway, voting for Samurott. Will add in reasons later
Absol is the nightmare of every Psychic and Ghost-type, and Psychic spam only got more popular once it left the tier since Skuntank looks stupid compared to it
Samurott
He can go Physical, Special and even Mixed, so is a bit hard to guess wich set is running, not counting that the sets changes their counters.
He can also use sub salac set and in the standard Special set, he can function as a Hazards stopper with Taunt and decent speed.
With his physical set he has SD to power up and Aqua Jet to remedy of his speed and once he's in torrent range, it's HELL !
He can go Physical, Special and even Mixed, so is a bit hard to guess wich set is running, not counting that the sets changes their counters.
He can also use sub salac set and in the standard Special set, he can function as a Hazards stopper with Taunt and decent speed.
With his physical set he has SD to power up and Aqua Jet to remedy of his speed and once he's in torrent range, it's HELL !
Absol
Samurott if only because it has been around since the beginning of NU (because I agree that Emboar, Absol, and Samurott don't have a right or wrong placement from here). It's not really as effective now as it used to be, so newer players might not understand just how dominating it once was. Samurott played a lot like Victini does in UU; there was no way of telling whether it was going to be physical or special, and mispredicting and bringing the wrong wall against the wrong set could very easily cost you the game. Outside of how unpredictable Samurott could be, both of its popular sets were incredibly good, so even if you predicted correctly against it, you still weren't in the clear. The SD set can break through any physical wall in the tier, and the special set combined with hazards can do the same against most special walls. Samurott has always adapted with the metagame to remain as one of the most effective wallbreakers since the beginning of NU.
I vote for Samurott, it has always been threatening.