The UU Viability Ranking Thread

Overall, Quag has absolutely no offensive pressure, gives too many things free switch-ins, is an unreliable stealth rock setter and look:
252 Atk Reckless Mienshao Hi Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 199-235 (50.5 - 59.64%) -- 84.77% chance to 2HKO
it gets easily 2 hit by a scarfed mienshao even with maxed out physical defense.
And it also can't take anything at all on the special side:
252+ SpA Porygon2 Tri Attack vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Quagsire: 175-207 (44.41 - 52.53%)

If you want to use Quagsire to stop moxie sweepers, that moveslot is better used by something that counters that moxie sweeper in the first place. Let's say your opponent has a LO Honchkrow. True, quag ignores its boosts, but becuase Quag is so frail, you essentially have to give Honch a free kill before sending it in becuase it gets 2HKO'd by Brave Bird.

I agree it may seem on the same level as something like Swampert on paper, but Swampert boasts much better defenses, the ability to hit much harder, a greater variety of viable sets and roar, which gets rid of boosters anyway. In a typical UU battle, quagsire will only very rarely be given a reason to come in, and most of those reasons have u-turn or potential coverage moves to take it down.
 

SJCrew

Believer, going on a journey...
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Even if Quagsire manages to switch into something, its lack of any offense or support movepool leaves it with no way to use its momentum. Quagsire is beyond irrelevant, bordering unviable.
 

ScraftyIsTheBest

On to new Horizons!
is a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

Nominating Machamp for C-Rank. Machamp struggles to do well in UU because of its speed, and it is simply too slow to compete in this metagame. Machamp is outsped by many threats in this metagame, and is inferior to other Fighting-types because it isn't that bulky. No Guard DynamicPunch is the only thing Machamp has going for it, and that is very luck reliant if Machamp plans to succeed. Faster teams can wear Machamp down pretty easily, and bulkier Pokemon such as Cofagrigus can handle Machamp quite well. No Guard at the same time is also a detriment to Machamp, because it cannot fish for a miss against Pokemon who rely on inaccurate moves like Chandelure, Shaymin, and Mienshao. DynamicPunch is also weaker than Close Combat or Hi Jump Kick. I'd much rather use Mienshao or Heracross for my Fighting-type on most teams because they are much more rewarding, and in general I really don't consider Machamp a choice on most of my teams. I think that Machamp should be RU because of how ineffective it is, though it does get some chances to be annoying, just not that often.

Also, I'm thinking Poliwrath could be on the rankings, maybe in C but no higher, it's a good Pokemon with a cool defensive typing and Circle Throw, walls plenty of threats and is a decent mon overall.
 

Cheryl.

Celesteela is Life
I know this thread has been dead for about 2 years now, but I think we could use some more discussion on some stuff (Also Gen 5 UU is bae), including this new nomination:


Nominating Houndoom for B-Rank. Houndoom isn't the most common thing in BW2 UU, nor the best thing, but I feel like C is underestimating it's capabilities. It can actually provide a lot of offensive utility to a lot of teams, Pursuit trapping Psychic-types like Mew and Victini, while also having Flash Fire to eat up Flare Blitzes and V-Creates, making it an effective check to Choice-locked Fire-types. It also has a good Nasty Plot set that can sweep teams pretty nicely late-game. It's STAB coverage is really good, as it helps it get through mons like Slowbro and Slowking more effectively, and not many teams carry a good enough check to Doom because of it's relative rarity. Houndoom does have some flaws, however, like it's frailty, bad defensive typing outside of being immune to Psychic and Fire type moves, and 95 Speed not always pulling it's weight against more offensive teams. (Doom does have Sucker Punch, however, so that helps) But, even with it's flaws, the utility Houndoom provides to a team while also having only a few good full counters depending on it's set makes it worthy of a rise imo.
 
Hi dead thread but Victini should be S lol

On one hand Victini's defensive typing is terrible and its bulk is somewhat underwhelming when you considered that it is mitigated by V-create's defense drops which leave it a sitting duck for Pursuit users like Krookodile etc. after it's come in and nuked something. Its Stealth Rock weakness is also quite unfortunate, really reducing its staying power and undermining what is a fairly decent 100 / 100 / 100 bulk.

On the other hand... Victini's Choice Banded V-create is probably the single most threatening attack in the entire tier. Seriously. If Victini comes in for free you are just fucked. If you have run out of Fire resists or your Fire resist is something like Darmanitan then enjoy watching it die after Stealth Rock, which is common in UU anyway thanks to the lack of good spinners / hazard control. But wait! Victini also gets other ridiculously powerful moves such as Bolt Strike, meaning not even your bulky Water-type is safe. And if you predict a Dark-type switch-in you can always just U-turn out of there. With Chandelure gone the best Flash Fire user in the tier is no more, meaning you have to use lol Houndoom... which I guess Pursuit traps Victini but still sucks lol. But wait! Victini can also viably run a mixed set which means that Gligar switch-in of yours gets destroyed by Glaciate and your sure-fire Choice Band Victini counter in Rhyperior gets smoked by a Grass Knot. V-create still hits reasonably hard with just a Life Orb boost anyway. Not as strong by any means, but still.

No, it is not meant to sweep most of the time. But give Victini the slightest opening and it will come in, taking advantage of its ridiculously powerful STAB, ability to run a range of sets from Band to Scarf to Mixed, and good Speed tier of 100 to fuck you up. Band and Mixed to a lesser extent threaten defensive / balancedy teams and Scarf threatens offensive teams so it isn't like it's not threatening to every team archetype lol

Sam what u think
 
I think Alomomola could make it into C-Rank. While it faces competition from other bulky Water-types such as Slowbro and Suicune, Alomomola has a couple of useful traits. Firstly, it's bulkier physically than its competition, which means it can be an excellent physical wall. It also has the ability to pass Wishes, and its absurd HP makes it a good Wish Passer, restoring large amounts of HP to its teammates. It has Wish+Regenerator to constantly come in and repeatedly counter things such as Scarf Mienshao, Darmanitan, etc. It can do a really good job at walling things, and can form a good core with Pokemon such as Roserade and Amoonguss, the former benefitting from Wish if it's using Rest. Of course, Alomomola has flaws such as its miserable special bulk and lack of offensive presence, and it faces stiff competition from Slowbro and Suicune as a bulky Water-type. However, Alomomola's qualities, of which I have stated, allow it to carve a niche for itself, thus being worthy of C-Rank.
 
Dead thread, but nominating Victini to S. This thing has two things really going for it in this tier: Versatility and Firepower. My favorite Victini set from back in the day is the Banded set. When Banded Victini gets a free switch in, something is gonna get destroyed. Between V-Create and Bolt Strike, you outright nuke most of the tier. You either need an extremely bulky Snorlax, Swampert, or Rhyperior to sponge that coverage without getting 2HKO'd. And even if they come in, Victini can freely U-Turn out to something else that threatens either of them. And don't think for a second that Rhyperior or Swampert are safe before you know the Victini set because Victini can also run a special attacking set with Grass Knot that will blow them both out of the water. Then there's also the Choice Scarf set that allows Victini to get the jump on faster threats such as non-Scarfed Mienshao, Cobalion, Weavile, and Raikou (also without Scarf) and slap them silly. Your best option against this thing is to figure out the set and then revenge kill/Pursuit it. In summary, the versatility and firepower of Victini (and its absolute NUKE in V-Create) warrant it to be in S rank.
 

DnB

#DnB4608, its way easier on discord :>
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
just my 2 cents


S Rank
  • Kingdra
    agree
  • Shaymin > A
    You rarely see Shaymin these days, it just doesnt have the power and lacks speed and you kinda have to get the 50% Seed Flare Drop to do something with it. SubSeed can be so annoying, but Roserade or flying types are everywhere
  • Snorlax
    agree
  • Togekiss
    agree, this thing can easily 6-0 stall builds with its bulky heal bell + nasty plot set, or be annoying AF with trick
  • Zapdos
    agree, so many options, offensive, defensive. has some hard checks like umbreon, but it can easily stall it out with sub f.e.
A rank
  • Cofagrigus
    agree, best spinblocker in the tier
  • Crobat > B
    idk, speed is good, but electrics are everywhere. it just feels annoying to me, not like a threat, just as a useless mon that taunts and u-turns around
  • Darmanitan
    agree, you dont see it that often today, but thats because everyone preps so hard for tini, which also means u prep for darm. still really good
  • Flygon
    agree, rly good cleaning mon, you have to get some turns right, but every scarfer that can threaten hera/tini is good
  • Heracross
    scarf is still really good, but more people start to run other sets like SD, band or resttalk which are also so powerful
  • Mew
    weird mon, but has to be A, just because it can do so many things
  • Mienshao
    agree, fastest scarfer in the tier + LO sets are so strong against teams without a ghost type (scarf raikou sucks)
  • Nidoqueen
    agree, LO with focus blast can just 6-0 certain defensive builds that rely on umbreon, defensive is also super solid
  • Qwilfish
    agree, spikes are great + the ability to wall heracross
  • Raikou > S
    you have to prep for this thing, and even if you do, it can run life orb + stuff like extrasensory to get a surprise KO, really good mon
  • Rhyperior > B
    idk, i dont really like it. bronzong is everywhere and while i like its ability to hit xatu, it just feels bad to have a rocker that hard loses to the best spinner in the tier
  • Roserade
    agree, best spiker in the tier, you can even fish for matchup and go with t-spikes to get an easy win
  • Sharpedo
    agree, big threat, great cleaner, most of its switchins get chipped a lot and it oftentimes just needs a little hazard dmg on everything to win
  • Slowbro > B
    idk, its good but electrics, bugs and grass is everywhere, regenerator makes up for it tho
  • Slowking > B
    better than slowbro in this tier, because it can stop kingdra. just seems weird to run thesem when you can have blastoise for spinning
  • Swampert > B
    same as above, i think seismitoad does its job better, a water immunity is way better
  • Umbreon
    agree, best special wall in the tier and really hard to break
  • Venomoth
    agree, super weird mon, almost no usage, but if u use it its so scary. i used phys def venomoth to wall heracross, also won me a game. niche pick but super scary
  • Victini > S
    band is good, but everyone preps for it, thank god it can use so many other things. i rly like colbur berry atm, fake a choiced set, get a surprise KO with grass knot or survive pursuit to come in again later. specs is also super underrated
  • Weavile
    agree, also a niche pick, but does its job in trapping psychics. also dark + ice is a cool stab, although it kinda needs SD to KO stuff
B Rank
  • Ambipom > C
    never seen it, and while i can see it being annoying, mienshao just seems better
  • Amoonguss > C
    roserade has spikes, this does not. i think sleep is still not banned in this tier (it should), but even then, it just doesnt do enough outside of stall builds, which also rather run roserade for hazards
  • Arcanine > C
    great fire check, but overall just doesnt do enough. i can see a funny HP grass variant working, but hazards are king and i would rather use my own offensive fire type, than a mon that just checks opposing fires and does nothing else
  • Azelf
    agree, great rain/HO lead, can even so some scary choice/NP work
  • Azumarill > C
    the slower the meta, the better azu is, but many stallteams are using stuff like seismitoad or qwilfish to wall it and electrics are everywhere
  • Blastoise > A
    idk, its not a huge threat, but just really good in what it does. best spinner in the tier, even with foresight and you can even run a more offensive variant to 2HKO ghosts and surprise people, really solid mon
  • Bronzong > A
    great rocker, can wall so many things and be annoying with toxic, loses hard to xatu but what can u do
  • Cincinno > C
    uhm. i can see it being strong, but it hard loses to ghosts & steels which are everywhere
  • Cresselia
    agree, weird mon again, but can do so many things and some weird sub CM or resttalk CM variant in the lategame are just devistating
  • Cobalion
    agree, can be a support mon or offensive with SD, kinda weak but does its job
  • Druddigon
    agree, im a huge druddigon fan in this tier, mostly defensive variants with rocky helmet are so annoying and chip everything down
  • Empoleon
    agree, a rocker that can go offensive and beats most other rockers, or just go defensive to wall kingdra, great mon
  • Honchkrow > C
    it can be so scary, but with raikou/zapdos on every team, it just feels so hard to set up. you want sub to be safe, sucker is needed, as is brave bird, but on the other hand, pursuit can be so good, but you also kinda need night slash. scary but too hard to get going
  • Machamp > C
    same as above, really scary mon, but its just super slow and feels like dead weight against qwilfish/ghosts
  • Meloetta
    another weird psychic legendary. but i like it, specs can be super good, but also the transform variant can be a cool breaker
  • Nidoking
    agree, a worse nidoqueen atm because you need the bulk in this meta. and while its super strong, it just doesnt have quite the power to 1HKO stuff
  • Porygon-2
    agree, great answer to electrics (without toxic) and in general it needs heal bell support, but it can be a cool stop to many special attackers
  • Porygon-Z
    agree, can be super scary if you get the right matchup and has decent bulk to survive a hit
  • Rotom-H
    agree, cool support mon, great scarfer
  • Sableye
    agree, super underrated spinblocker in the tier and overall just super annoying to deal with
  • Scolipede
    agree, great hazard lead for HO and while it can be hard to set up more than 1 layer, it can still be annoying with stuff like endevour
  • Scrafty > A
    now that a bold statement, but im serious. i experimented around with scrafty a lot during UUFPL and this mon is so underrated. Bulk Up and Dragon Dance are both great options, and many teams are just not ready for it, it just farms defensive teams
  • Smeargle > C
    idk, spore is still allowed but many teams are fast, making it hard for smeargle to set up more than 1 hazard. untiered if sleep gets banned
  • Suicune
    agree, very annoying mon, hate roserade & electrics, but when it gets going, it just wins
  • Tornadus
    agree, great rain mon, but even some bulk up sets can work. raikou/zapdos exist tho which really hold him back
  • Virizion
    agree, really cool and scary. has to rely on stone edge tho to hit many things, but if u hit, u win :)
    special sets are also good, but it needs a lot of team support to clean games
  • Xatu
    agree, i really like it in this meta, just prevent hazards from so many things, hard check to bronzong. should be used more!
  • Yanmega
    agree, niche mon, worse venomoth imo but more immediate power that can 6-0 in certain matchups. kinda slow tho
C Rank
  • Abomasnow
    ugh, never seen it, but i guess C is alright
  • Accelgor
    its okay i guess, speed is good but i have never seen it
  • Bisharp > B
    people are sleeping on this. this thing has so much breaking power and if u get that 1 little iron head flinch, it often means GG. if u dont, you get big damage on the opposing physical defensive mon. really good mid game breaker
  • Clefable
    ye, niche in stall builds, can wall so many things and while it doesnt do a lot itself, it just sits there and knock everything off
  • Crustle > untiered
    uhm, i guess shell smash exists, but really hard to set up in this tier
  • Cryogonal > untiered
    alternative spinner that can sit on electrics. but wait, it cant because of calm mind & heat wave
  • Durant
    very niche, if you feel lucky and heracross is too slow for you. seems very strong on paper, but this tier is a lot bulkier than RU
  • Escavalier
    pursuit is cool, resttalk SD can win in stall matchups but yea overall, it can at most nuke 1 thing and then die
  • Ferroseed
    i think this thing is great, leech seed is so annoying for many teams but oh well, fire and fighting is everywhere
  • Gligar
    very underrated, but it just seems like a worse bronzong. it has more bulk and does better in walling heracross, but it can only be used on stall
  • Golurk > untiered
    i guess there is a niche for a rocker + ghost typing. except it loses to the best spinner in the tier and dies to all the grass & water moves
  • Hitmontop
    cool mon, has its uses but can feel like dead weight sometimes
  • Houndoom
    oh, never thought about this thing lol. best victini answer in the tier, deserves a spot here i guess, but other than that it sucks
  • Kabutops
    rain.
  • Krookodile > B
    idk, i feel its nice to have a fast pursuit trapper, but just feels like flygon without u-turn, but pursuit. used it a little and liked it
  • Lilligant
    sleeper pick, cool mon, once it gets going it wins, roserade exists tho
  • Magneton
    i guess you can trap bronzong. but overall just seems very weak in this tier
  • Milotic > untiered
    just does too little in this tier, every other water type has rocks/spin or some other cool stuff, milotic is just milotic, it sits there, eats some hits and does nothing
  • Mismagius
    can be really scary because no one expects a fast spinblocker, but yea, its niche
  • Omastar
    rain
  • Registeel
    i guess it can work, but really hard with bronzong around. resttalk curse can clean some games, but its really hard to set that up
  • Rotom-C
    theres a niche for a electric type with grass stab, trick is also great
  • Sceptile
    tbh, doesnt look bad here, can definetely clean some games
  • Tangrowth
    i guess has some uses in stall if u dont want to use roserade or ferroseed
  • Uxie
    i guess has some niche uses as a lead, although subcm could work
  • Zoroark
    cool mon, fuck team preview


Kokoloko Rank

LonelyNess Rank
remove those ranks :)

overall seems like a solid VR, havent seen most of the C rank mons but theres always that one crazy guy that makes it work. im just talking about my experience over the last year, but it just feels nice that most of the tier looks like 10 years ago, solid meta :)
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 2)

Top