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VGC Pokemon of the Week: Scizor

Discussion in 'VGC' started by Jellicent, Jan 27, 2013.

  1. Fantom0

    Fantom0

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    Ooh, Metagross, an old favorite ^_^
    THE bulky steel to use and, of course, a solid check to most vgc dragons, I personally find Metagross to be one of those pokemon that is a real game changer, particularly when those stupid Swagger Cresselias started gaining popularity. Metagross has always been a popular choice for a lot of vgc teams, and it isn't hard to see why - massive base stats, great STABs, only two weaknesses, sacred ability that shrugs off Icy Wind and Intimidates, huge movepool featuring elemental punches and priority... the list goes on. It is one of the few pokemon that can check Latios without the risk of being fragged by Draco Meteor and then still be able to handle a large number of common partners to the thing, such as Hitmontop.

    The introduction of the Therians to vgc has allowed Metagross to shine a bit more over its more recent rival Scizor, courtesy of its higher bulk, immunity to Intimidate and access to Ice Punch. I can't really say that Metagross is definitely better, or more popular, than Scizor, but Metagross is one of those pokemon that will always be around, and will always be dangerous.

    Metagross has a fair few viable teammates - because it is one of the best counters to Tyranitar, it can form the 'weak against TTar + strong against TTar' combo (if you don't know what that is, it speaks for itself), which means it likes to pair up with stuff like Thundurus, Latios, Cresselia etc. Thundurus and Cresselia are particular favorites since they can control opponent's speeds, making it easier for Metagross to do damage.

    Metagross's huge bulk means true counters aren't that easy to come across - even Garchomp is beaten if Metagross has a Life Orb or Steel Gem. Heatran is one of the best counters, being able to outspeed the 'Gross, though it needs Fire Blast or Overheat to be guaranteed the KO - and even then, if Metagross is somehow faster, it can really dent Heatran with Earthquake. Gastrodon is another good counter, since Metagross cannot OHKO it, but Gastrodon can with Ground Gem Earth Power, though it really needs to pay close attention to Metagross's partner. The best is Landorus-T, holding Life Orb or Ground Gem, because it will definitely OHKO Metagross with Earthquake, even with the spread multiplier on, which is helped by the fact that Metagross rarely carries Shuca Berry.

    My current favorite set is not the usual. It was used by RubeNCB in the UK nationals last year, with a few tweaks:
    [​IMG]
    Metagross @ Lum Berry
    Adamant: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
    Trait: Clear Body
    -Earthquake
    -Ice Punch
    -Bullet Punch
    -Protect
    I like this set a lot because it really helps against a lot of things in the current metagame - Earthquake as a great spread move and to deal with enemy 'Grosses, Ice Punch for the Therians, and Bullet Punch because it's great priority. Not much else to say.
    Obviously there are sets that use Metagross's strong STAB options, but this set works really well in the current Metagame.
  2. hathater

    hathater

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    normal gem explosion can hurt i would say. but, dusclop or any ghost type can counter explosion
  3. Baz Anderson

    Baz Anderson

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    I always found a non-STAB, spread Earthquake from Metagross extremely underwhelming.

    Trick and a Choice Band/Scarf is probably under appreciated on Metagross too.
  4. Fantom0

    Fantom0

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    Earthquake still eats large chunks of health from things like enemy metagrosses. I wouldn't say it's that underwhelming.
  5. The Knights of Wario Land

    The Knights of Wario Land

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    I always find it extremely difficult to use Metagross, because its movepool is just so incredibly vast that I find hard time deciding on what set I want to use. Having to choose between Earthquake, Zen Headbutt, and Meteor Mash is incredibly difficult for me, because you lose spread, Hitmontop/Amoonguss, or pure power coverage if you opt out of one of them. I try to use Band then so I can put them all on a set, but then I find I really would have liked Protect.

    Metagross is definitely one of the best physical attackers in the meta however due to Clear Body providing immunity against the abundant Intimidate, but I personally can't find a solid usage for Metagross. Lum Berry Swagger is a possibility, but I hate using that because Swagger feels cheap and it just feels too boring.
  6. Jellicent

    Jellicent ~the spirit who loves spirits~
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Community Contributor Alumnus
    Ruiner of Alph

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    [​IMG]
    Type: Rock / Fighting
    Base Stats: 91 HP / 129 Atk / 90 Def / 72 SpA / 90 SpD / 108 Spe
    Ability: Justified

    With fantastic Attack, dual STAB, good Speed, and decent bulk, Terrakion is a definitely an offensive threat to prepare for in VGC. So, what are its bet sets, roles, teammates, and counters? Discuss anything and everything related to Terrakion in VGC~
  7. The Knights of Wario Land

    The Knights of Wario Land

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    Terrakion is definitely one of those Pokemon that's pretty difficult to prepare for, due to how many items and sets it can run: Focus Sash, Life Orb, Fighting Gem, the Beat Up set, etc. Rock Slide is almost always a given on Terra, but choosing between Sacred Sword and Close Combat can be difficult: Sacred Sword hits past stat boosts but is less powerful, while Close Combat can nuke a surprising amount of things but leaves Terrakion more frail. Protect is almost always on every set too (sometimes Quick Guard), but the final moveslot can be variable: Swords Dance, X-Scissor (my preferred choice), Earthquake, etc. The metagame shifts has actually given Terrakion a better time too, as most Thundurus don't run max speed anymore, letting Terrakion smack them hard with Rock Slide.

    Intimidate doesn't cripple Terrakion as much as other physical attackers, but is still a big problem he has. Scizor and Metagross are pretty good counters as Bullet Punch hurts Terrakion very much. Cresselia is also another obvious counter.

    Anyways, those are my thoughts. Good Pokemon.
  8. hathater

    hathater

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    Durant is a counter, higher speed and iron head. For terracott, amoonguss with rate powder.
  9. Jellicent

    Jellicent ~the spirit who loves spirits~
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    Ruiner of Alph

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    [​IMG]
    Type: Grass / Fighting
    Base Stats: 60 HP / 130 Atk / 80 Def / 60 SpA / 60 SpD / 70 Spe
    Abilities: Effect Spore / Poison Heal / Technician

    With a great base 130 Attack, Technician-boosted Mach Punch and Bullet Seed, and access to the rare Spore, Breloom manages to fill some key niches in VGC. So, what are its best roles, sets, counters, and teammates? Everything about Breloom is up for discussion~
  10. Mizuhime

    Mizuhime dreams can come true, but nightmares are dreams too
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    Doubles Queen

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    Liepard Breloom combo that's been taking over the meta lately, Fake out, and encore support from Liepard helps Breloom get off a few spores and puts your opponent at a disadvantage right away if they aren't ready for it
  11. tlyee61

    tlyee61

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    Breloom also pairs really nicely with Volcarona (and any other water type) the opponent usually has to choose between having gone of their mons put to sleep or Volcarona getting a QD up. Now that I think about it, liepard could be a nice 3rd member to make a top moth style combo too, or pair with breloom
  12. hathater

    hathater

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    Togekiss can let breloom spore safely with follow me, then spam bullet seed and Mach punch.
  13. lucariojr

    lucariojr goodra will hunting
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    breloom's 'alright', but i can't say i've had much trouble with it courtesy of its frailty, 70 base speed and intimidate. part of a well-oiled team includes multiple checks to amoonguss, and thanks to spore and similar typing, teams can easily deal with breloom. i kind of like it, but it's pretty easy to work around. here's the spread i used:

    breloom @ focus sash
    adamant, technician
    120 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 132 Spe

    Bullet Seed
    Mach Punch
    Spore
    Protect

    speed EVs outspeed cress and some rotom-a. you could run more speed for the speed creep, but i wouldn't recommend running 252 speed.

    e: here's mine :) https://www.pokecheck.org/?pk=3852113 (i meant to name it 'kangashroom', but thats 11 characters)
  14. The Knights of Wario Land

    The Knights of Wario Land

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    Breloom is one of those Pokemon I just flat-out hate to face, because in the hands of great players he's nearly unstoppable. As Lucariojr said, Breloom has enough speed to instantly put to sleep Cress, Rotom-A, and other mid-speed tier Pokemon, and the Focus Sash allows him to live a hit from a faster threat and then Spore them. Technician Bullet Seed has also completely ended using Rindo Gastrodon in my testing, because of the multi-hit nature. Sand and Hail are good ways of dealing with Breloom, as they eliminate its Sash and allow the partner to easily pick on its frail defenses.

    I'm trying to use Breloom but I'm having a pretty hard time around him. Been practicing with R Inanimate's Winter Regionals team which features Life Orb Breloom, but I feel like Focus Sash is the better item about 80% of the time.

    tldr: the new Breloom definitely is leaving an impact on the meta, but will probably never be the hugest threat around like Cresselia or Metagross.
  15. Little Green Yoda

    Little Green Yoda

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    Biggest issue with Breloom (in my limited experience using it) is that so many things resist both STABs and it's vulnerable to Intimidate spam. The fast sleep is great but if Breloom or its partner can't muster enough offense to take advantage of those sleep turns, it's all for naught. Quick wakeups are the bane of a Breloom user, as are two hit Bullet Seeds.

    Running bulk instead of max speed is not a bad idea. Most people probably assume a Breloom is max speed upon seeing it for the first time anyway.
  16. Jellicent

    Jellicent ~the spirit who loves spirits~
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    [​IMG]
    Type: Water / Grass
    Base Stats: 80 HP / 70 Atk / 70 Def / 90 SpA / 100 SpD / 70 Spe
    Ability: Swift Swim / Rain Dish / Own Tempo

    With two great abilities in Swift Swim and Rain Dish, Ludicolo seems custom-made for rain teams. So, what do you find are its best roles, sets, teammates, counters, etc.? Anything about Ludicolo in VGC is up for discussion this week~
  17. tlyee61

    tlyee61

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    hey, don't have enough time for a long analysis of Ludi, but I'll contribute a little to get a discussion going. I like Ludi as a fast, offensive variant or a really bulky SubSeed set. I find that Heatran, Rotom-H, Thundurus and Terrakion make really good teammates for Ludicolo. really, any Pokemon weak to gastrodon and rotom-w enjoy it. Any specially bulky mon can counter Ludicolo pretty well. Also, kingdra outspeeds it and can fire off HH LO dracos at it. empoleon also makes for a good check, as it can wall it, but can't do much damage back either :/
  18. Jellicent

    Jellicent ~the spirit who loves spirits~
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    Ruiner of Alph

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    [​IMG]
    Type: Bug / Steel
    Base Stats: 70 HP / 130 Atk / 100 Def / 55 SpA / 80 SpD / 65 Spe
    Ability: Swarm / Technician / Light Metal

    With solid typing, high Attack, and powerful priority, Scizor fits in nicely on a variety of teams. So, what are its best sets, teammates, counters, and niches in VGC? Anything and everything about Scizor in VGC is up for discussion~
  19. tlyee61

    tlyee61

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    welp, this is awkward that I was the only one to post about Ludi xP. Almost everybody uses Cybertrom's Swords Dance Scizor. Nice counters are Thundurus, Jellicent, Chandelure, Gyarados and most other Water and Fire types that resist Bug and Steel. However, this makes TTar, Chadelure, Thundurus, Terrakion and Rotom-W great partners for it! It is great at sweeping teams after getting a SD up!
  20. lucariojr

    lucariojr goodra will hunting
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    i don't like scizor anymore since eveyone uses hp fire cress and it really can't take a hit on the special side (which is pretty much all that matters nowadays) outside of resisted draco meteors. i do like how it gives feint support and nice priority though, as well as having a fairly diverse movepool with cool tech options like acrobatics.
  21. AuraRayquaza

    AuraRayquaza

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    A nifty trick used by huy ha was to use an occa berry with natural gift. It gives a 60 BP fire type attack, boosted by technician to give 90 BP, to catch opposing scizors off guard
  22. tlyee61

    tlyee61

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    A nifty trick used by user: AuraRayquaza was to necrobump the thread. -_-
    Spirit likes this.
  23. gligar101

    gligar101

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    I might have t use that.... something for me to do for 6 gen VGC..

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