Which Pokemon centralize the Uber Metagame?

[kd24]

Which Pokemon can even overcentralize the uber metagame? And who is the strongest Uber?

We know that pokemon that are uber are there because they overcentralize the OU Metagame. However how do we know this isn't the case in the uber metagame as well? Is there a currently legal uber pokemon that you think is too powerful to be a part of the uber metagame? And which one is the best currently? Lets look at the 5 most used uber pokemon:

1. Kyogre
2. Groudon
3. Darkrai
4. Rayquaza
5. Dialga

http://shoddybattle.com/statsPHPSESSID=1294302c442fce2b8ca2215c418390fa

Now all of these pokemon bring something special to the uber metagame.
So we have to look at what the definition of overcentralizing means. It means that your team has to be prepared to fight this pokemon and you need a few certain counters to stop it. The metagame can be expected to center around this pokemon. Obviously if these 5 are the top used we have to be able to expect them to come up. So lets us look at these pokemon.

Kyogre:

HP: 100
Atk: 100
Def: 90
SpA: 150
SpD: 140
Spe: 90

Groudon:

HP: 100
Atk: 150
Def: 140
SpA: 100
SpD: 90
Spe: 90

Darkrai:

HP: 70
Atk: 90
Def: 90
SpA: 135
SpD: 90
Spe: 125

Rayquaza:

HP: 105
Atk: 150
Def: 90
SpA: 150
SpD: 90
Spe: 95

Dialga:

HP: 100
Atk: 120
Def: 120
SpA: 150
SpD: 100
Spe: 90

So what do they all do?

Kyogre: Has a Water Spout that can destroy many pokemon in the Uber metagame. Usually running a Scarf set, Kyogre can also run a CM set or a Rest Talk set. So how does one counter Kyogre? Well the Scarf Water Spout set will be best countered by Latias, however Ice Beam can still hurt very bad. Blissey is your safest option, but with no Special Defense EVS expect to be 2HKOed. Dialga is another counter but again, Special Defense is needed. Kyogre has made his name known being the most used pokemon and is one of the the most dangerous pokemon. You need a Special Defensive Pokemon for this thing.

Groudon: The other weather starter Groudon has many tricks, including Rock Polish, Support, Band, and Scarf. Once Groudon uses Rock Polish almost nothing can stop it. God help you if he gets off a Swords Dance and a Rock Polish. His Sun also benefits many Pokemon that can be used effectively in the uber metagame, most notably Heatran, Jumpluff, and Ho-oh. Your best bet for a counter is Latios but beware of Dragon Claw or Rock Polish. Lugia also counters extremely well with Reflect and Ice Beam and Roost.

Darkrai: Darkrai has so many tricks. Dark Void is the sweetest as it gives you almost a perfect sleeping move (80%). Dark Pulse gives you that flinch and makes a great STAB. Calm Mind and Taunt help stop Blissey and other walls and Sub + Focus Punch can defeat a ton of pokemon. Ice Beam and Thunder help for Kyogre and Groudon and Spacial Rend is amazing for Rayquaza and Palkia. Your best counter will be Dialga although beware of Focus Blast. Dark Void renders many of his counters useless. Mewtwo can usually come in on most of his attacks and OHKO with Aura Sphere but beware of Dark Pulse, which can actually OHKO.

Rayquaza: The dragon of mayhem and my personal pick. Rayquaza boasts 150 in each of its attack stats as well as actually respectable defenses unlike Deoxys. Rayquaza can basically outspeed and ohko 9/10 of the uber metagame after a Dragon Dance and using Extremespeed and Outrage. Yeah thats power. Rayquaza also can use Swords Dance and Support attacks making him so much more deadly. But he can be countered. Your best bet will always be Lugia. No other counter is a good as him. A Steel type is also important to catch him in outrage. Many players use shuckle and registeel in Ubers just to catch rayquaza in outrage and defeat him.

Dialga: Finally the newest legendary of D/P Dialga. Dialga can run a plethora of sets such as CB, Specs, Mixed, RestStalk, Support, and even Mixed Support. Thunder, Fire Blast, Draco Meteor, Brick Break, Earth Power, Dragon Claw, Aura Sphere, ... what doesnt he have? His best counter is Mewtwo who ohkos with aura sphere. Nothing else can really come in on any of his other attacks. Blissey can help but Brick Break will always OHKO.

So which one of these 5 Pokemon are really the cream of the crop of uber play and which one can even be called overcentralizing?

I pick Rayquaza for overcentralizing as you need Lugia or a Steel type on your team to beat him and I pick him as the best as well.

 

[Lawman]

I took 13 posts but we finally got a decent poll here, ha!

Anyways, I would vote for Rayquaza out of those 5 as well. The other 4 have their multiple counters, but Rayquaza is the most threatening out of them. You are required to have a resist to Dragon primarily due to him. I wouldn't call him too over centralizing (as in how much Garchomp is in OU right now), but I have seen several teams struggle against him back when I actually played Ubers.

 

[ultimifier]

i would say that although he is not the most used, rayquaze centralizes the uber metagame the most.

although kyogre is used most, most of his counters are there because they are simply necessary. blissey is needed for lati@s and random specs users and latias is there for a very fast special wall. dailga and palkia are also amazing pokemon, and the fact that they can caounter kyogre is just a bonus.

rayquaza, on the other hand, NEEDS to be countered by a specific pokemon. since after a DD almost nothing can outspeed it, every team needs AT LEAST 1 pokemon that can survive a DD adamant life orb outrage, whether it be a metagross, forretress, groudon or lugia.

im taking a break from shoddy battle and have sunk to 25 on the uber ladder, but was 9th on my last day. On EVERY one of my teams i used 2 pokemon that could survive a fully powered outrage from rayquaza. this is because if a rayquaza is hidden until your single counter is weakened you lose. after a DD, with your rayquaza counter at half health, say good bye to at least 2 of your pokemon.

meanwhile, of the four pokemon i mentioned to stop rayquaza, lugia gets butt fucked by stealth rock and the two steels get absolutely obliterated by a life orb overheat. for these reasons i feel groudon is the best rayquaza counter (still get destroyed by any specs set) and is why he is number 2 on the ladder.

 

[stormtrooper]

i would say darkrai and dialga centralize the metagame becuase you need at least one pokemon to take sleep from darkrai and dialga is extremely hard to counter and can destroy you if you dont predict right. Rayquaza also centralizes the game because most teams have a steel type and lugia to stop him. Why doesnt this thread have other ubers like palkia,mewtwo and deoysts-attack?

 

[Janenmori]

I really wonder why Mewtwo lacks mention. As you said it can counter Darkrai and Dialga quite well, as well as just about everything else. Out of the five, I would say Rayquazza is the best. I like to think of him as the Gyarados or Garchomp of Ubers. Once he gets set up, it takes a hell of a lot to bring him down. The only let down he even has is his base 95 Spd which is made up for in spades by Dragon Dance. I really think and self respecting Ubers player should really fear this guy if they do not wish to have their asses handed to them.

 

[Ditto]

Well personally my favorite is BUlga, but the one I see most often is ScarfOrge (I use one too, so I can't talk). The thing I am quite upset about though is the lack of Impish Groudons on Smogon. We have some excellent Jolly and Adamant ones, even a Modest, but no Impish which are becoming more popular now.

EDIT: TWave Groudon can stop a DDQuaza sweep. Can survive an Outrage after a DD and then TWave so another poke like Kyorge can Ice Beam Quaza