I would assume not, it probably works more like torch song or esper wing then a sheer force move
Also
looks neat running 
, basically just fighting type 
which can be used for other gambits
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Metagame Pokemoves!
- Thread starter prunyy
- Start date
Also
looks neat running , basically just fighting type which can be used for other gambits
Buuttttt Torch Song is boosted by Sheer Force
Don't see how Pokemoves being called by Sleep Talk cause problems
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We may as well ask the big question here: can Pokemoves be called by Sleep Talk?
Even if they can't, this set looks really annoying but might still end up not getting Komala restricted. Komala!Move thuds into Ghosts, and the set randomly gets mostly hosed by Gholdengo, who gets a nice firm hit in before getting Dragon Tailed out the hard way. If you have no Ghosts, though, several Pokemon outspeed Noivern (e.g. Weavile, Darkrai, Zamazenta), and Meowscarada speed ties in an emergency.
Absolutely 100% agree with this. As it stands , HO is by far the best playstyle, with offense and gliscor bo being somewhat viable. This is not a heathy environment and greatly restricts potential teambuilding. Claims that “this would be just like mulitbilities” aren’t justified, as many oms are arguably similar (cross evo and mnm?) but feel different in practice. For example, this meta still gives coverage dependent mons coverage, gives mons lacking good stab good stab, and heightens power of bp. It’s also still dependent on getting the move off, adding a further degree of positioning than simply selecting two abilities.
Ok so to address all the remarks that this meta will be too HO at the moment, at its current state, yes, it would be.
The idea that I am currently proposing to the rest of the council is to just outright ban everything above 125 BP or so. This will hopefully bring the power level down a lot to the point where Pokemoves are similar to that of Close Combat. While CC is a relatively strong move and gives downsides after usage, unlike Pokemoves, I would hope that this would bring the power level of the meta down where it isn't as braindead as clicking big funny nuke button. It would still probably favor offense though.
There is some more defensive counterplay with more Pokemoves restricted as many tankier mons can live CC Base Power moves decently well and the fact that the Pokemove is revealed also helps on switching in tanky mons. We also have abilities like Regenerator from Torn-T, Unaware from Dondozo, Fur Coat from Persian-A, Vessel of Ruin from Ting-Lu, Intimidate from a lot of mons, even immunity abilities to some extent which also aid some defensive play. Offensive mons also have to risk revealing a move when they'd rather keep their coverage private for a surprise element.
Down the line, I would hope to eventually remove restrictions and to have the cutoff at least 135 BP but it is quite hard to tell at the moment what a difference of 10 BP can do other than staring at calcs all day.
I think that we should wait to change the premise and only do so if the meta drops severely in popularity or there is some coding issue.
The idea that I am currently proposing to the rest of the council is to just outright ban everything above 125 BP or so. This will hopefully bring the power level down a lot to the point where Pokemoves are similar to that of Close Combat. While CC is a relatively strong move and gives downsides after usage, unlike Pokemoves, I would hope that this would bring the power level of the meta down where it isn't as braindead as clicking big funny nuke button. It would still probably favor offense though.
There is some more defensive counterplay with more Pokemoves restricted as many tankier mons can live CC Base Power moves decently well and the fact that the Pokemove is revealed also helps on switching in tanky mons. We also have abilities like Regenerator from Torn-T, Unaware from Dondozo, Fur Coat from Persian-A, Vessel of Ruin from Ting-Lu, Intimidate from a lot of mons, even immunity abilities to some extent which also aid some defensive play. Offensive mons also have to risk revealing a move when they'd rather keep their coverage private for a surprise element.
Down the line, I would hope to eventually remove restrictions and to have the cutoff at least 135 BP but it is quite hard to tell at the moment what a difference of 10 BP can do other than staring at calcs all day.
I think that we should wait to change the premise and only do so if the meta drops severely in popularity or there is some coding issue.
Wouldn't that also help quite a few offensive Pokémon too? I mean, I support the decision though
it does for sure, but I also don't necessarily think that's a problem. The ones that are overbearing can be banned, and the ones that arent can flourish on both balance and offensive playstyles without being forced to give up too much momentum
There is no currently because the format doesnt exists yet.
I recommend you guys to stop trying to fix a problem that isnt here yet, is derailing the thread, the format was approved like this for a reason, as I said in my previous post just try to have fun with the way it is.
May also add that I oppose to turn this format into another variant of AAA, we got enough of those, if we were to change the format it would be in a different way, but that shouldn't be discussed until is proved to be needed.
Now please, discuss the format presented in this thread.
Maybe instead of making a massive banlist, just cap the BP at 125.
That will remove the need for the high BP banlist, because a Hoopa Pokémove will have the same BP and worse ability than an Azelf Pokémove
Making changes that are not consistent is not a good idea. Right now the premise says that the base power is dependent on the higher of the two attacking stats. Having another rule that it caps at 125 BP doesn’t really fit with how OMs are designed. Having a bigger banlist is less of an issue than making arbitrary changes to the premise.
In other news, banner art coming soon!
I Spent some time on the kitchen and i got a funny set to share:
Pressure Stall+Regenerator
(
)
Deoxys-Speed @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 188 HP / 252 SpA / 68 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Tornadus-Therian
- Psychic Noise
- Substitute
- Protect
Given that defensive counterplay will probably be extremely limited early on due to the immense base power of pokemoves, i realized i could abuse a weakness that they all have: 8 PP. With Deo's immense speed and access to pressure, it can use Protect and Substitute to quickly drain the power points of any pokemoves being spammed, while still being an offensive threat on its own right due to its solid special attack, ability to run modest viably and plethora of great coverage.
There is a lot of freedom to be had with the specifics of this set, I believe the most important element is substitute, as that can single-handendly stall out a pokemove and, well, be substitute. Psychic noise is useful for messing with bulky pokémon that might try to wall it and guarantee progress even in matchups where it would otherwise be a sitting duck. I chose to go with as my pokemove as it can give Deo a more aggressive way of healing its HP with regenerator and serve as a generally strong move to chip things away with, but Recover > Protect is an option that frees your pokemove slot while still keeping the longevity, and bulkier/faster EV spreads can work just as well.
Pressure Stall+Regenerator
()Deoxys-Speed @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 188 HP / 252 SpA / 68 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Tornadus-Therian
- Psychic Noise
- Substitute
- Protect
Given that defensive counterplay will probably be extremely limited early on due to the immense base power of pokemoves, i realized i could abuse a weakness that they all have: 8 PP. With Deo's immense speed and access to pressure, it can use Protect and Substitute to quickly drain the power points of any pokemoves being spammed, while still being an offensive threat on its own right due to its solid special attack, ability to run modest viably and plethora of great coverage.
There is a lot of freedom to be had with the specifics of this set, I believe the most important element is substitute, as that can single-handendly stall out a pokemove and, well, be substitute. Psychic noise is useful for messing with bulky pokémon that might try to wall it and guarantee progress even in matchups where it would otherwise be a sitting duck. I chose to go with
as my pokemove as it can give Deo a more aggressive way of healing its HP with regenerator and serve as a generally strong move to chip things away with, but Recover > Protect is an option that frees your pokemove slot while still keeping the longevity, and bulkier/faster EV spreads can work just as well.Idk Prankster Spite Sableye might do a better jobI Spent some time on the kitchen and i got a funny set to share:
Pressure Stall+Regenerator
Deoxys-Speed @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 188 HP / 252 SpA / 68 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Tornadus-Therian
- Psychic Noise
- Substitute
- Protect
Given that defensive counterplay will probably be extremely limited early on due to the immense base power of pokemoves, i realized i could abuse a weakness that they all have: 8 PP. With Deo's immense speed and access to pressure, it can use Protect and Substitute to quickly drain the power points of any pokemoves being spammed, while still being an offensive threat on its own right due to its solid special attack, ability to run modest viably and plethora of great coverage.
There is a lot of freedom to be had with the specifics of this set, I believe the most important element is substitute, as that can single-handendly stall out a pokemove and, well, be substitute. Psychic noise is useful for messing with bulky pokémon that might try to wall it and guarantee progress even in matchups where it would otherwise be a sitting duck. I chose to go with
The idea is to use Ability Shield with Cyclizar and Slaking. However, every abuser is too slow. Not sure it would work. Broken maybe?
Roaring Moon @ Booster Energy
Anyways, question: do abilities activate before damage is dealt or after damage is dealt?
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
- Knock Off
- Acrobatics
- Dragon Dance
Please ban Gliscor. It's gonna be broken.
Roaring Moon @ Booster Energy
Anyways, question: do abilities activate before damage is dealt or after damage is dealt?
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ursaluna
- Dual Wingbeat
- Facade
- Protect
- Regidrago
Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ursaluna
- Dual Wingbeat
- Facade
- Protect
- Regidrago
- Acrobatics
- Dragon Dance
Please ban Gliscor. It's gonna be broken.
Gouging Fire @ Booster Energy
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Raging Fury
- Outrage
- rillaboom
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Raging Fury
- Outrage
- rillaboom
This seems like it could be interesting to hit grounds and rocks that normally hit gouging, as well as get pseudo-stab on it and reduce ground damage
Remember that Pokemoves give the Primary ability of the Pokemon, not the hidden. Based on your wording you are implying that using Rillaboom would set Grassy Terrain, but it would give Overgrow as an ability, not Grassy Surge.
Oh I misunderstood the om
Enough time has passed…
had to get this vote out asap so hisui hasn’t voted yet, will update when they do
This is pretty self explanatory. These bans are pretty much needed for the meta to be playable and not overrun by HO. Hopefully 125 BP will be a good starting point.
Also, we are the OMotM for August!
All Pokemoves above 125 BP have been BANNED!
| :O | prunyy | Lectrys | BandedBodyPress | Hisui Guy |
| Ban all moves above 125 BP | Ban | Ban | Ban | Abstain |
This is pretty self explanatory. These bans are pretty much needed for the meta to be playable and not overrun by HO. Hopefully 125 BP will be a good starting point.
Also, we are the OMotM for August!
tryna come up with some less "murder" mons and here's what I've thought up so far
+ 
+
ok i lied heres' one more murder monster, this time its' speed control
+ 
+ Gholdengo @ Leftovers/Heavy Duty Boots
Ability: Good as Gold
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Make It Rain
- Haunter (115 BP Ghost Special Move w/ Levitate)
- Thunder Wave
- Recover
shutting down the ability to hit Gholdengo with Ground Type moves makes it harder for players to check TWave sets, but I could see a fast sweeper set working too.
Ability: Good as Gold
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Make It Rain
- Haunter (115 BP Ghost Special Move w/ Levitate)
- Thunder Wave
- Recover
shutting down the ability to hit Gholdengo with Ground Type moves makes it harder for players to check TWave sets, but I could see a fast sweeper set working too.
+ Terapagos-Terastal @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Tera Shell
Tera Type: Stellar
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
- Tera Starstorm
- Rapid Spin
- Toxic
-Tornadus-Therian
Regenerator helps keep Tera Shell active without wish support, allowing Terapagos to come in, spin away hazard, toxic stuff, and hit hard with Tera Starstorm + Torn-T (which particularly helps against fighting types).
Ability: Tera Shell
Tera Type: Stellar
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
- Tera Starstorm
- Rapid Spin
- Toxic
-Tornadus-Therian
Regenerator helps keep Tera Shell active without wish support, allowing Terapagos to come in, spin away hazard, toxic stuff, and hit hard with Tera Starstorm + Torn-T (which particularly helps against fighting types).
ok i lied heres' one more murder monster, this time its' speed control
+ Dragapult @ Choice Band/Life Orb
Ability: Infiltrator
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ceruledge
- Dragon Darts
- U-turn
- Sucker Punch
Yeah, I do think Dragapult with 125 BP Ghost phys stab will probably be a bit too much, I'm optimistic it won't be though
Ability: Infiltrator
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ceruledge
- Dragon Darts
- U-turn
- Sucker Punch
Yeah, I do think Dragapult with 125 BP Ghost phys stab will probably be a bit too much, I'm optimistic it won't be though
remember, it takes the primary typing so this would be fire type
You can stack similar abilities?
Like Filter and Prism Armor or Toxic Boost and Guts?
Like Filter and Prism Armor or Toxic Boost and Guts?
At least for posterity, this is to record that, as of right now this August 1, Pokemoves give the opposing mon the ability instead of your own mon. Example replay here:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pokemoves-2171208746
Note Body Press's damage remaining roughly the same before and after Blissey uses Persian-Alola!Move, and more notably Ceruledge!Move granting Flash Fire to the mon it hits.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9pokemoves-2171208746
Note Body Press's damage remaining roughly the same before and after Blissey uses Persian-Alola!Move, and more notably Ceruledge!Move granting Flash Fire to the mon it hits.
I played several battles today (August 1st) and there seem to be some bugs: Sometimes the primary ability used will attach to the opponent instead of my own mon, for example:
The opposing Dondozo used slakoth, but it can use Dive as usual while my own Raging Bolt become Truant instead of Levitate (from latias).
The opposing Dondozo used slakoth, but it can use Dive as usual while my own Raging Bolt become Truant instead of Levitate (from latias).
Pick the worst possible abilities possible for now
May I ask you something because I'm not sure I've understood how this meta works and the description is not really clear to me.
"The Pokemove "Bulbasaur" will be a Grass-type special move with 65 base power that will give the Pokemon that used it Overgrow together with its regular ability until it switches out. It also has 100% accuracy and 8 PP."
Ok so let's say I put
in my 
's moveset.
It will have 115 BP (since Flamigo Atk = 115) while being Flying type, am I right so far?
Does need to use Flamigo first so Scrappy can then apply to normal/fightings moves?
Will benefit from Scrappy when it uses Flamigo as a move only? Or at any time? Or at at any time until it switches out?
Thanks for you help.
"The Pokemove "Bulbasaur" will be a Grass-type special move with 65 base power that will give the Pokemon that used it Overgrow together with its regular ability until it switches out. It also has 100% accuracy and 8 PP."
Ok so let's say I put
in my 's moveset.It will have 115 BP (since Flamigo Atk = 115) while being Flying type, am I right so far?
Does
need to use Flamigo first so Scrappy can then apply to normal/fightings moves?Will
benefit from Scrappy when it uses Flamigo as a move only? Or at any time? Or at at any time until it switches out? Thanks for you help.