Metagame SV RU Metagame Discussion (April Shifts #403)

Status
Not open for further replies.
With Rhyperior likely falling to RU in the next tier shift in a few months thanks to Zapdos leaving the UU tier, I wonder if Thundurus-I will be re-evaluated at any point in the future.

The mon can be quite a bit obnoxious at times spreading paras all over the place, but I do like its role compression for some teams, being a flying type that can shut down setup stuff with Taunt. Do note that my role compression comment is mostly due to exp with the mon back when it (and Rhyperior) was NU, but I can see it apply here if Rhy ever drops down to RU.
 
With Rhyperior likely falling to RU in the next tier shift in a few months thanks to Zapdos leaving the UU tier, I wonder if Thundurus-I will be re-evaluated at any point in the future.

The mon can be quite a bit obnoxious at times spreading paras all over the place, but I do like its role compression for some teams, being a flying type that can shut down setup stuff with Taunt. Do note that my role compression comment is mostly due to exp with the mon back when it (and Rhyperior) was NU, but I can see it apply here if Rhy ever drops down to RU.
Just as a props up but Thundurus therian was in RU before with Rhyperior and it didnt stop it from being broken, and the same would apply for normal Thundurus due to Grass knot :worrywhirl:
 
I love posting yaaaaaay

Winners of the ban:

:yanmega:
yanmega hate squad rejoice, for this mon has only gotten even better. Thundi was both its best offensive check and could turn the hax game around on it with TWave unless you popped tera early. Kilowattrel is 2HKOed by it, even air slash, and pom-pom does take it decently, but both have to actually take an air slash before being able to do anything and also both have to click the worst move of all time to deal with a possible tera (30% chance of flinch + 30% chance of hurricane missing is agonizing). Your best offensive checks before any hax are like, tera steel flygon now? Pom-Pom? Offensive heattom if you can somehow fit that on offense? Good luck.

:oricorio-pom-pom:
Unlike all the other electrics, who somehow get worse despite thundi leaving since a lot of their viability was soft checking it, pom pom is probably the best approximation of NP thundi left in the tier. It's nowhere near as good and not going to immediately take over, but if you want to boost and click electric moves with strong coverage pom pom's probably it since raikou's kind of a fraud. Definitely worth experimenting with more!

:espeon: :gengar: :zoroark-hisui: :terrakion: :ninetales-alola:
All of these loosely benefit from being strong setup breakers who came up just short of Thundi's speed tier and now no longer have to deal with that. Half of them could viably run scarf and half of them could dodge twave in some way, but luckily that's not something they have to worry about at all anymore! 110 also just gets a lot better as a speed tier with thundi gone, even if there's other things faster than it.

:noivern: :azelf: :barraskewda: :ribombee: +
Most of the things that were faster than thundi got better both for not having to risk getting twaved and also now being our fastest pivots left, with skewda literally being the fastest and azelf being the slowest here. If you think about it, Azelf also is fast, can pivot, knock, and thunder wave, and is therefore exactly like thundi! Most of these were already good mons (use azelf more please) getting a minor buff.

:literally every setup sweeper that now can pick the tera they want instead of having to compromise between what they want and tera ground/dark:
yeah.

Losers of the ban:

:raikou:
Sure, Raikou is a base 115 speed pivot and a boosting electric, but a lot of its former viability was due to being able to beat back Thundi thanks to being faster than it and immune to para, the only non-scarfed mon in the tier with this distinction. It's not as strong as Thundi and outclassed by Pom Pom as a boosting electric thanks to Pom Pom's better moves in spite of lower stats, and outclassed by Kilowattrel as an electric type fast pivot.

:bellibolt: :palossand:
Poor guys. Belli was a good defensive check to thundi and scared it back out, which was a good quality to have for a mon that doesn't actually check much on typing alone. It's still a decent, if esoteric, wall and pivot but thundi was definitely the best mon it checked. Palo only checked the pivot set but did it well. It's been trending downards for a bit now and this probably won't help, even if NP shredded it.

:torterra: :toxtricity:
Niche HO guys who benefited from switching into both Thundi sets, setting up, and trying to sweep, who obviously can no longer do that. Tort's pretty definitively worse than Cloyster now, and Toxtricity's one other cute party trick of dunking on Chansey doesn't feel like enough to justify using it at this point.

:chansey:
This mon's still sleeper good since a lot of our most controversial mons happen to be strong special attackers, but we did in fact just lose a controversial strong special attacker. At least the remaining ones don't always run knock?

:gligar:
poor glig's just getting bullied by the recent tier changes. I guess it didn't do a ton back to thundi but it didn't let it make progress either, especially if it was NP. It's still got the god typing and movepool but it can't quite flex it as well now that its two most prominent winning matchups are gone.

I really couldn't tell you:

:kilowattrel:
so, this was already gaining ground as a soft check to the pivot set and a decent check to NP set thanks to its speed tier and typing blanking paralysis. It's likely to become the next best pivoting electric in the tier thanks to its access to roost and great stab combination, but the lack of prankster twave, knock off, or taunt removes a lot of the utility it had. It'll probably be used more, but probably not get that much better? I really don't know.
 
Last edited:
With Thundurus gone, there's a new best fast electric type Legendary:
1729362874308.png

It's Raikou's time to shine, I say for like the 3rd time now.

Compared to Thundurus, Raikou has a big disadvantage due to its lower SpA and lack of knock off. Prankster twave isn't even the reason why copy-pasting the pivot Thundy set onto Raikou won't really work, it's not having knock and doing less damage. Raikou's extra speed isn't even that big of a deal, only really mattering for Maushold and Azelf now that Thundurus itself is gone. But what does Raikou do well? Its high bulk in comparison to Thundurus creates more setup opportunities, and calm mind is good enough, perhaps even better than nasty plot.
Raikou @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Discharge
- Scald / Extrasensory
- Aura Sphere / Extrasensory
- Calm Mind

Raikou @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Scald
- Volt Switch
- Calm Mind

Raikou @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Fairy / Flying
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Discharge
- Scald
- Substitute
- Calm Mind
Standard CM raikou with 3 attacks can basically inherit Thundurus' legacy. You have an electric move, a fighting move, a psychic move and an anti-ground coverage move. Unfortunately you are under more pressure to run scald due to hippo actually being a threat, but fortunately scald is better than grass knot due to that 30%.The annoying mons for scald/aura sphere are Amoonguss and Chesnaught, both of which kind of hard wall you and force you out. Extrasensory/aura sphere is best for coverage, but hippo can be a problem since even a +1 tera fighting aura sphere is topping out around 66% vs physdef hippo. If you run scald and extrasensory then you have a great matchup vs tera poison Slowbro while beating hippo and the grass types, but you don't do as much vs cyclizar and Hoodra becomes a real problem. I think discharge is better than Tbolt because paralyzing a bike in the early game sets up a sweep in the late game.
The second set is based on a set I had been running with Thundurus, using both nasty plot and volt switch to let you act as a pivot in the early game then a sweeper in the late game. You run scald to beat the volt blockers, since you're not as worried about being walled by Cyclizar or Amoonguss when you can just volt switch on them.
Then finally we have the Raikou set that I am going to shill for: subCM. This is a set I first promoted with tera blast flying back when Quagsire was the most annoying ground type. What do you do when the most annoying mon for CM Raikou wins by poisoning you? You substitute on it. SubCM is great vs Amoonguss because they just can't do anything and probably instantly lose when you are at +1/+1 with a sub with an Amoonguss out. It's also great vs cyclizar because they can't use dragon tail if you're behind a sub. Max HP is an option to make dragon tail/knock from bike and Hoodra, body slam from Jirachi and more weak moves nearly never break your sub. Tera fairy or just burning them with scald can also help with these moves though. Discharge and scald are both great options because of their status chances. They both create opportunities for Raikou to just click sub and then start boosting. `It can be hard to use this set in the midgame, but once you get going, you just beat everything. The walls lose the long game, faster mons can't revenge kill if you have a sub up and even something like tera ground Volcanion gets PP stalled before it breaks you.
 
Yo! Sup RU. I wanted to make a post about a pair I've been enjoying lately: Magnezone + Maushold.

Normal (13).png

Maushold-Four @ Protective Pads
Ability: Technician
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Population Bomb
- Bite
- Tidy Up
- U-turn

Protective Pads is solid against the rocky helmet spam. Lot of people think, "Tera Steel + Rocky Helmet will kill" or that rocky helmet on its' own will be enough. Nope. Tera Ghost is for surprise factor on opposing Maushold and Conkeldurr's Mach Punch.

Surprised (1).png


Magnezone @ Expert Belt / Choice Specs
Ability: Magnet Pull
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Tera Blast
- Volt Switch

Great for getting chip or flat out knocking out steel types that could get in the way of a Maushold sweep.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2231766016-dhsrm19pxmluah9lvim4wi4znopmf7zpw - vs Rain
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2231762091-uq0qq81obujwswqi2v29w4xg4x7ng62pw vs Hail

The last replay has a few misplays. I am super unfamiliar with versing hail teams in this tier so, I was unsure of how to handle it. But it still showcases Maushold and Magnezone's sets. I think I could've done better with Maushold there though, couple missed opportunities.
 
So, projected shifts went out about 11 hours ago (or so), so I wanted to talk about them (there is a LOT of changes for the tier potentially)

:pmd/revavroom: One of the big HO goons, this will be a decent loss to the playstyle. Reva in UU was really good, as it quad resisted first impression from lokix and the faster pace of the tier allowed its hits to sting more. Now, why do I say decent loss instead of massive loss? Well, for me (and another HO user on discord), reva has been falling off a bit. Its certainly still powerful, but other steel's such as Bisharp and Lucario compete with it, while it can feel like its hard walled by mons such as hippo and bro (tera blast grass sets aren't great since you give up iron head, which can cheese out wins, and ofc you need to tera). So yeah, a loss, but to me, not a horrible one.

:pmd/mew: Mew is a decently powerful mon in the tier (with even some calling it broken, but I digress), and losing it is pretty big. There are ofc, the NP sets, which are quite threatening but have only alright bulk to setup and don't have OHKO potential against bulkier targets. There's also the bulky spikes set, popularised by stresh which can pack tons of utility and passive damage, and finally, the lead hazard setter (the set that is used in UU) that is fine enough (though we do have a million other hazard leads because why not). However, I doubt this will be staying in UU long. Deo-S might fall to UU, and it will outclass mew entirely.

:pmd/metagross: This will be an amazing mon in the tier, and it will be exciting to see. Metagross has great bulk and a ton of powerful moves, from rocks, to knock, to psychic fangs, to heavy slam/meteor mash, to psychic noise, to bullet punch and even boosting potential in agility and hone claws. It does have competition however, as jirachi shares its typing and can do some things it can also do, but the two are quite different in there own ways, so they probably will co-exist together. It can also struggle into some defensive mons, such as slowbro and hippo, so it should probably be fine. It however, is definetely going to be a top tier mon.

:pmd/mamoswine: Yeah lmao, this thing is going straight to RUBL. Like, wtf walls this? Slowbro maybe, but tera ground e-quake 2hit ko's with LO or soft sand. Geezing takes way too much from LO attacks to be comfortable switching in (flinch chance will happen) as it does 40% min with LO and 32% without. It also has knock to annoy any switchins and even trailblaze to hit water types while raising its speed stat. It can even use curse to setup, with ice shard giving it use against faster mons. Heck, it can even try a rocks lead set because why not lol.

:pmd/rhyperior: Welcome home rhyperior, you were missed. Ngl, another ground type is appreciated and it will probably be good. Its very offensively threatening, while having good bulk to sponge hits (especially with solid rock). Basically a love child between krook and hippo but take away knock and recovery (and a lot of other things... This analogy was bad lol).

:pmd/necrozma: Necrozma fell to NUBL last shift, so its probably going to be flip flopping between these placements lol. Necrozma is a good mon, with a decent amount of versatility, but can feel weird to fit due to its low speed and mono psychic typing.

:pmd/suicune: This took way longer then it should have lmao. Suicune is an amazing mon in the tier, with it potentially 6-0'ing balance teams if it gets a free turn, though I use vapo, so I don't have any issues :) There have even been some talks of it being broken, but those seem to pop up now and then, so we will see if those sentiments stick this time. The reason it took longer was probably cause a mon like suicune isn't appealing to the HO infested ladder.

:pmd/amoonguss: Unfortunately, the sleep ban has not been kind to this mushroom at all. Amoonguss is certainely a great mon in RU, as its able to stuff a lot of the fighting types in the tier, but it can struggle into the many steel/poison types, with it having to use stomping tantrum in order to hit them. It also isn't a HO mon, and commonly fits onto bulkier teams that can afford it letting in said mons. I hope this mon doesn't fall, as its very cool and has unique techs such as AV and eject pack leaf storm, but I honestly wouldn't be surprised if it does.

Some other cool usage stats:

:pmd/azumarill: Azu almost dropped, and this one I'm unsure about. It would probably be broken, as CB hits like a truck and has no switchins (slowbro is 2hit ko'd by play rough, so good luck) and it even has jet to finish off frailer targets (tera water aqua jet 2hit ko's gapdos, which isn't a frail mon btw). It does struggle with that speed stat though, and amoonguss potentially walls it, so idk.

:pmd/blissey: Blissey almost projected to drop makes the stall main in me happy about this. Chansey is a pain to work with, as not only is it necessary (good luck walling special sweepers without it LOL), but it forced you to always have hazard removal, and our options either were 1. bad or 2. not very bulky (even geezing can feel frail at times, but it also had to use pain split or rest lol). Blissey means you can at least try boots spam (I'm thinking magic guard reun+gastro could be good in order to wall most knock users, though ofc, you might have to drop quag because of that) and if blissey's item is knocked, it doesn't lose an insane amount of bulk.

:pmd/cyclizar: Cyclizar is still the number one used mon in the tier, and honestly, I ain't even surprised. While others have said its fallen off, cyclizar still is probably the best hazard remover in the tier, and can answer many powerful special threats. It also has quite the flexibility in its last moveslot, as it really only needs spin, knock and u-turn. Draco meteor is the standard, but all of d-tail, facade, double edge, iron head, overheat, power whip and niche options such as t-bolt and ice spinner can work.

:pmd/bisharp: Not surprising too, bisharp has only been getting better over time (with some even wanting it banned). Bisharp can revenge kill tons of things with its typing/priority, and SD can turn it into a powerful sweeper. Not much to talk about here, I think everybody knows about this mon.

:pmd/zapdos galar: Okay, this one is a bit surprising. Don't get me wrong, gapdos is an amazing mon in the tier, I personally think it is the single best scarf mon in the tier, but it was hovering around the 10s in usage. Three HO mons being added into the tier is definetely going to help it, and maybe people have caught up, but we will have to see if it keeps up this usage.

:pmd/goodra hisui: Hoodra had some fraud claims thrown around recently, but it seems that this may be untrue. Hoodra is mainly known for its specs sets, which have massive damage output while also being good defensively. However, it has been experimenting with different sets lately, from AV, to lefties, to curse and even CB. This mon is definetely powerful, and it will be seen if it continues its run, or flops as the haters have said. (also the current RU research academy session being on Hoodra definetely helps it out lol)

:pmd/kleavor: No surprise here, ladder is ladder, and that's just HO. Kleavor is definetely the worst of the traditional HO leads, but due to stone axe being an interesting move, ladder thinks it being guarenteed to get rocks up (spoiler alert, every HO lead can get rocks up reliably most of the time, and do something else after they do that), its used more. It certainly isn't a bad lead, SD sets can be pretty great at dealing big damage (I prefer SD trailblaze versions to outspeed other mons), but it should absolutely not be number 5 in usage.

1730505817216.png

PLEASE UU, STOP USING TRASH ASS DONPHAN AND GIVE IT TO US. PLEASE I AM BEGGING ON MY KNEES GIVE US IT
 
Last edited:
Don't think being Top 25 most used counts as trash kekw
It's C rank in UU, which means it has a niche, but its not really good in the tier. And it just lost one of its best matchups in Zapdos, as it was a ground type that could offensively pressure it (though just use rhyperior in that case). So yeah, it def is trash (also just use excadrill lmao, sure, it has a ground weakness but you have a mon that is much more threatening and is also a steel type).
Also usage stats are unreliable for showing how good mons are, slowbro, right now S rank and at worst, an A rank mon, is number 20 in usage in RU. This thing should be top 10 at the very least, if not top 3.
 
It's C rank in UU, which means it has a niche, but its not really good in the tier. And it just lost one of its best matchups in Zapdos, as it was a ground type that could offensively pressure it (though just use rhyperior in that case). So yeah, it def is trash (also just use excadrill lmao, sure, it has a ground weakness but you have a mon that is much more threatening and is also a steel type).
Also usage stats are unreliable for showing how good mons are, slowbro, right now S rank and at worst, an A rank mon, is number 20 in usage in RU. This thing should be top 10 at the very least, if not top 3.
But Rhyperior is the one that dropped off hard in usage after the ban and has low 1 month usage to drop to RU whereas Donphan is still thriving
 
After Thundurus's ban, let's see the main mons that have been discussed for a potential suspect down the line (as far as I know)


:bw/yanmega:
elo terrorist Yanmega brings its trusty Tera Blast Ground to decimate entire teams even more freely now that its best offensive check is gone. This has led to higher Chansey usage in tournament (great...), and more niche mons like Oricorio-Pom-Pom could see a bit more usage due to this. Meanwhile, it's still punching holes in any team that doesn't have Chansey, and always has a 30% chance to get past its ""checks"" and ""counters"" because of healthy game design decisions. It's the number 1 mon I'd like to see suspected, however, it's kind of a ladder menace due to its bad MU into now popular Chansey putting its reliability in question for tournament play. I sure hope the council can see past that however, and improve the quality of ladder with this suspect test...

:bw/bisharp:
Kind of a new face in the 'might be broken' landscape, Bisharp is getting a lot of heat for being a very bulky mon for how threatening it is. +2 Iron Head has a chance to straight up 2HKO max HP/Def Chesnaught and almost 2HKOes Hippowdon (you just need like 10% of chip for it to be a 2HKO. Factor in the 30% chance of flinching and you get the picture. It has counterplay in Will-O-Wisp from mons like Talonflame or Slither Wing, Flame Body, Encoring on Sucker Punch, or simply Fighting breakers able to handily tank Sucker Punch (so, no Gallade). However, these forms of counterplay are either liable to 50/50 situations (Sucker Punch as a whole), or can be bypassed by Tera: Tera Fairy/Flying/Ghost makes your Fighting breaker useless, +2 Tera Dark Throat Chop straight up 2HKOes Hippowdon no questions asked, Tera Fire ignores Burn. I don't know what I would vote for a Bisharp suspect, but I would like to see a suspect happen to have further discussion on the mon.

:sv/maushold:
This may just be me, but this mon is already cheese incarnate, and now that people unironically run Protective Pads to ignore the #1 form of counterplay in Rocky Helmet and just roll the dice for Population Bomb accuracy checks, it's just bullshit and I can't stand it anymore.

:sv/armarouge:
I don't have a problem with Armarouge personally, but I understand that I run mons like SpDef Hoodra a lot more than the average guy so I'm most likely biased on that one. Regardless, I still understand why this mon is a problem teambuilding-wise. Our fire resists are kinda ass and limited to mons that lose to Armarouge (the Dragons get psyshocked and tera fairy ignores dmeteor), and good luck playing around Weak Armor procs consistently when Cyclizar needs to click buttons eventually. Weakness Policy cheese is just the cherry on top.

:sv/volcanion:
Speaking of Fire-types in a tier with ass resists, Volcanion is the strongest wallbreaker in the tier imo. The combination of the sheer power of Steam Eruption combined with a Fire STAB, great coverage in Earth Power/Body Press, Taunt to prevent fat mons from tanking long term, and Water Absorb to invalidate 99% of defensive waters as answers, are imo way too much to handle both in game and in the builder. Lots of teams resort to Seismic Tossing it asap with Chansey or running Noivern/Salamence to switch into it because apparently, taking 40% + burn damage on the switch is a really fucking good performance against Volcanion. I would like to see it suspected at some point.

:gs/slowbro:
most hated mon from tournament players by far. It is quite the daunting task to break through Slowbro tanking half the tier seemingly effortlessly and still having to play around the Calm Mind win condition late game. Spreading burn left and right through broken Scald and Psychic Noise existing make it even more threatening than it has any right to be. I'm still on the fence personally though, Slowbro is a useful glue mon to keep teams together and allow for leeway in teammate choices since it does so much so reliably, and it's not unkillable either since it's eventually gonna have to eat a Knock Off, then constantly switch into big wallbreakers on rocks + spikes. We also have plenty wallbreakers like Flame Orb Conk, Magnezone, or Basc-F to hit it where it hurts. But yea, I definitely see where the pro-ban sentiment stems from.

:gs/suicune:
refer to this
:gs/suicune:
Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Protect

You know it, you've faced it, and, let's be honest, you've lost to it. VinCune is a prime example of a tolerated 'MU fish'. VinCune does very 'ok' into HO since being a fat water with scald automatically lets you participate to some extent to the MU, but where VinCune shines is in the balance/fat/stall MUs. The more defensive and slow a team is, the more susceptible it is to VinCune, and the more you need to build specifically not to lose to it. Defensive counterplay is quite broad and restrained at the same time, ranging from a simple fast Encore from Jirachi, to your own Calm Mind mon that can beat VinCune, like Fezandipiti, or just from mons that beat it, like Haze Vaporeon or Ruination Wo-Chien. The thing is, despite having listed 3 different tactics to beat VinCune reliably, I haven't listed a lot of mons. That's simply because, frankly, there's not a lot of them that reliably handle it! Frailer Encore users risk getting hit by Scald on the switch, and other Calm Mind setters or fat mons lose to Suicune due to Pressure. It even runs Tera Dark to prevent Stored Power and Psyshock from scaling better than it. Even Volcanion, who literally cannot be damaged by Suicune, is forced to run Taunt, else it gets PP stalled and ultimately loses the 1v1.
Defensive teams have to rely quite a bit on offensive counterplay to handle Suicune if Wo-Chien/Vaporeon can't fit in the team, but since they have much less slots for these offensive mons, they have to tailor their attackers to play around Suicune, by running the likes of Thundurus, have faster mons that can pressure with Knock Off or status like Cyclizar, and then sweat during the game. The pressure Suicune puts both in the builder and in-game is, I believe, a lot of the reasoning behind its A rank in the VR, despite having several common unwinnable MUs. Ultimately, Suicune's MU-fishy nature shapes the metagame to some extent, favoring Calm Mind users like Fezandipiti or Psyshock Slowbro. The reason VinCune is tolerated is because its best answers are also quite popular already, Jirachi is consistently one of the highest used mons in the tier, Fezandipiti is the best Calm Mind wincon in the tier and so on, and how much of this is attributed to Suicune's existence, no matter how important, is not exactly known, but present. Its variance in sets don't impact many, if any, of its matchups, which is also a very important point.
Regardless, VinCune has clear, sturdy, failproof counters and counterplay tactics that are viable enough to not open up holes too big elsewhere.

all in all, I wouldn't mind if any of the mons listed here outside of slowbro would be suspected, the tier is in a pretty good spot rn I'd say, I do hope fat/stall doesn't become too prevalent though, which is something that could be happening right as we speak. However, that doesn't mean that we can't make it better. A Yanmega ban to make ladder better to play would be a great start imo.


Since we're in a stable phase of the tier, I think this is a perfect time to have a community survey to see the opinion of the playerbase on the mons I listed + more if I forgot any, and to see the difference in opinion between ladder players and tournament players, especially on Yanmega and Slowbro.


I would also like to see the opinion of the council on the current state of the tier and what they think is the next step for the tier. We haven't heard from you for a long while now, and I'm not alone when I say that it would be great if the council was closer to the playerbase, like the councils from other tiers feen TheFranklin ...
 
Last edited:
:gs/suicune:
refer to this

Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Protect

You know it, you've faced it, and, let's be honest, you've lost to it. VinCune is a prime example of a tolerated 'MU fish'. VinCune does very 'ok' into HO since being a fat water with scald automatically lets you participate to some extent to the MU, but where VinCune shines is in the balance/fat/stall MUs. The more defensive and slow a team is, the more susceptible it is to VinCune, and the more you need to build specifically not to lose to it. Defensive counterplay is quite broad and restrained at the same time, ranging from a simple fast Encore from Jirachi, to your own Calm Mind mon that can beat VinCune, like Fezandipiti, or just from mons that beat it, like Haze Vaporeon or Ruination Wo-Chien. The thing is, despite having listed 3 different tactics to beat VinCune reliably, I haven't listed a lot of mons. That's simply because, frankly, there's not a lot of them that reliably handle it! Frailer Encore users risk getting hit by Scald on the switch, and other Calm Mind setters or fat mons lose to Suicune due to Pressure. It even runs Tera Dark to prevent Stored Power and Psyshock from scaling better than it. Even Volcanion, who literally cannot be damaged by Suicune, is forced to run Taunt, else it gets PP stalled and ultimately loses the 1v1.
Defensive teams have to rely quite a bit on offensive counterplay to handle Suicune if Wo-Chien/Vaporeon can't fit in the team, but since they have much less slots for these offensive mons, they have to tailor their attackers to play around Suicune, by running the likes of Thundurus, have faster mons that can pressure with Knock Off or status like Cyclizar, and then sweat during the game. The pressure Suicune puts both in the builder and in-game is, I believe, a lot of the reasoning behind its A rank in the VR, despite having several common unwinnable MUs. Ultimately, Suicune's MU-fishy nature shapes the metagame to some extent, favoring Calm Mind users like Fezandipiti or Psyshock Slowbro. The reason VinCune is tolerated is because its best answers are also quite popular already, Jirachi is consistently one of the highest used mons in the tier, Fezandipiti is the best Calm Mind wincon in the tier and so on, and how much of this is attributed to Suicune's existence, no matter how important, is not exactly known, but present. Its variance in sets don't impact many, if any, of its matchups, which is also a very important point.
Regardless, VinCune has clear, sturdy, failproof counters and counterplay tactics that are viable enough to not open up holes too big elsewhere.

I get the appeal of using protect but I find roar suicune like 10x better. Roar suicune can easily win Calm mind wars (assuming it's not the only mon left.) This easily takes advantage of many cm users like fez, slowbro, reuniclus, and suicune not running roar. And with spikes it can just chip his usual check with SR or even spikes if you can somehow get that up. It also really helps that water is a great typing and the only strong electric attacker, Magnezone, can be outsped and outright beaten if you have a sub up.

This also isn't mentioning the less popular but still threatening resttalk suicune. I think its not that good but I have lost to it before because I was expecting Vicune so I think it's worth mentioning, especially with it being able to tank physical hits better and somehow still outspeeding conkeldurr

While I make him sound broken he also struggles against HO or never getting that crucial set up turn and a fast knock or status can also shut him down.
Either way thanks for listening to my rant of suicune and his annoying bulky varients from a suicune player.
 
is defiant /competieive-spam doing well in the tier right now? especially because it can 'block ' defog
Bisharp, Zapdos-G and Empoleon are great mons who can use these abilities to punish Defog, but you don't run them specifically for this. In fact, Bisharp does not want to switch into two of our three defoggers, them being Talonflame and Weezing-G, but it does allow it to punish Sticky Web, although the move is rare. Kilowattrel is a good mon rn with access to Competitive, but still pretty much exclusively run Volt Absorb.

tl;dr defiant/competitive "spam" does not exist but Empoleon uses the ability well since it beats our defoggers.
 
I'm a new player to this tier and after 20 or so games on ladder I can confirm :empoleon: is my favorite mon to use.
Empoleon @ Petaya Berry
Ability: Competitive
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Grass Knot
- Agility
- Substitute
Water/Grass hits the tier really well, and :goodra-hisui:-beating mons like :krookodile: or :zapdos-galar: already fit alongside :empoleon: really nicely. A mon that can punish webs and defog is so valuable and it switches into :talonflame: and :weezing-galar: super well unlike :bisharp:. I've been familiar with its defensive sets since indigo disk released, still enjoying its tools like knock or flip that make things a lot more fluid in the teambuilder.
 
Alrighty I haven't had much time to express my thoughts on the meta lately and this post is still not really it kek but I'd like to talk about a recently acquired Pokemon that I feel like is very underestimated in the tier right now: Ninetales-Alola. We all know that Ice and Fairy coverage is extremely valuable at the moment because it shuts down the Dragon-types we find everywhere like Cyclizar, Noivern and Salamence while nuking other top tiers such as Krookodile, Slither Wing, Yanmega or Gapdos. But despite this, Ninetales-A still seems to be only considered niche at best by most.
It has been used two times in SCL for the moment, once by Franklin as a Veil setter to setup Cetitan and the other time was by elodin with an horrible Calm Mind Draining Kiss set which I can't believe worked as well as it did (mostly thanks to its Tera Water but still). Anyway, I think this Pokemon has a lot more potential and shouldn't belong in the same VR tier as Rotom-Heat and Muk-Alola for a couple reasons. I kinda mentioned the first reason earlier but Ninetales-A can easily take advantage of some popular meta trends such as the domination of Krookodile, the load of fat CM sweepers, offense staples like Yanmega and Flygon and priority moves. The second is that it's not walled as hard as people think by our Steel-types which has been a common answer in discussions I had about Ninetales' viability.​

Ninetales-Alola @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Snow Warning
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Moonblast
- Blizzard / Encore
- Tera Blast
This set is in my opinion the best way to use Ninetales-A and it's probably not close. SV gave a way for Ninetales-A to hit Steel-types hard so we should use it. Still Ninetales-A is held back by it's mediocre SpA stat which means it will need support to chip at these targets. The good news is that Steel-types tend to switch in a lot and so easily take enough chip damage to put them in Ninetales-A's range, for instance you need rocks equivalent chip to KO Utility Jirachi, 2 layers of Spikes equivalent chip to KO 120 HP Hoodra and like 3 layers equivalent for full SpD Empoleon. It is also quite easy to setup thanks to its STAB combination being very threatening for most of the tier's staples which means it forces a lot of switches and you can somewhat comfortably get in on defensive staples too like Slowbro, Empoleon, Gastrodon, Gweezing ans such. I feel like it's not that complicated to see how Ninetales-A can be useful in the tier however I understand that it can feel difficult to use sometimes. I thought about how we could make it less awkward and explored the non-tera reliant options which led me to interesting findings.​

Ninetales-Alola @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Snow Warning
Tera Type: Ghost / Water
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Hex
- Moonblast
- Blizzard / Encore
This set has been doing wonders since I started using it. You can easily pair it with a Pokemon able to Thunder Wave Steel-types like Jirachi and Empoleon, I used Reuniclus, Klefki, my own Jirachi and Cresselia to a lesser extent which have all worked well. This set is obviously not Tera reliant and can deal with Steel-types pretty effectively on top of that: para'd Jirachi is 2HKO'd by +2 Hex, you need 3 spikes layers equivalent chip to 2HKO full SpD para'd Empoleon with the same hit, you also OHKO full HP para'd Reuniclus and Slowbro either at +2 or unboosted with Tera Ghost. Tera Ghost allows you after a Nasty Plot to OHKO para'd Empoleon with a more offensive spread and Armarouge without status (without Tera you're always a little short of a few %). It has a few defensive uses against Poison- and Fighting- types moves Ninetales-A can have to deal with from faster threats like Gengar or Scarf Gapdos, Krookodile and Mienshao. Tera Water is also useful against Hoodra, Bisharp (rip Kush) or Revavroom.​

:ninetales-alola::reuniclus::cyclizar::hippowdon::volcanion::zapdos-galar:
This is the Ninetales-A team I enjoy the most right now, I don't think I lost with it yet after a bunch of friendlies and a dozen ladder games, feel free to use it if you like the idea.

I am by no means saying Ninetales-A is top tier I think that's pretty clear, my aim behind this post is to spark more discussions about the mon because it's very under explored and the support it can need is oftentimes quite easy to slot. Dark Pulse is another move I thought about which is interesting because it reaches thresholds Hex can't without status such as the OHKO on Armarouge at +2, it's also pretty good since it doesn't require support at all but on the other hand it doesn't allow Ninetales to really break past Empoleon, Hoodra and Registeel for instance. I tried double dance with Tera Ground just to mess around and it was super fun to stomp on offenses and BO with it but it's of course quite inconsistent since it's hard to actually find the timing to setup. Another useful aspect of Ninetales-A is its trade potential, especially against offensive threats like Yanmega which will always lose to it pre or post Tera. Thanks to the snow buff, it's not as easy to revenge kill as you might think for top tiers like Krookodile or Gapdos and it can also prevent mons like Salamence, Flygon, Hilligant, and even Gyarados from getting out of hands. Anyway that mon is cool, you should try it if you haven't, and if you have, you should give it another chance! I'll try to post more in this thread since I spent significant time in the lab lately because I find the meta very enjoyable so see you next time gamers.​
 
Anyway that mon is cool, you should try it if you haven't, and if you have, you should give it another chance!
Okay the embodiment of RU, I did now let me live.

Ninetales-Alola @ Choice Specs
Ability: Snow Warning
Tera Type: Ground / Ice / Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Blizzard
- Moonblast
- Freeze-Dry
- Tera Blast / Dark Pulse

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2249393529-bwc7xhzceeqhy9e7aud9wrz4t82odqipw - only replay I could get that showed off the set well. Other times it was bad teams or me getting used to ninetales-a.
Two free teams -
https://pokepast.es/85e11e661a29e7bb
:Umbreon: :Ninetales-Alola: :cyclizar: :conkeldurr: :Gengar: :Magnezone:
https://pokepast.es/99949944914785d8
:Ninetales-Alola: :Zapdos-Galar: :Volcanion: :Azelf: :weezing-galar: :Umbreon:

Choice Specs was not the first set I went for on Ninetales-A, it was actually an agility + calm mind set that sucked and could not pull off. Choice Specs is honestly pretty cool and can hit surprisingly hard. Yes, base 81 SpAtk is very low but ice + fairy are good STABs and Blizzard + Choice Specs helps to make up for the lack of power. Bulky steel types like Registeel and Empoleon are both a problem but so long as you have switch-in for either or, then it's not too bad. Plus, tera ground is a thing. Chansey is of course a problem always. But yeah, even a choice specs dark pulse does a lot of damage to Jirachi (45-54% to common bulky sets).

A lot of common mons are weak to Ninetales' STABs, but nasty plot felt too slow and too much of a commitment. Ninetales-A is pretty bulky so, with good hazard removal it can come in on threats that are throwing out the wrong move. It has a few important resists and a great immunity to dragon so, why not take advantage of that while keeping up with the fast pace of the metagame. It can come in and out repeatedly and fire off blizzards super easy. The speed tier is awkward but Noivern (no specs), Talonflame (no fire STAB), Zoroark (no specs), and Raikou don't OHKO it; only Gengar and Azelf are the only ones (that naturally out speed) can KO it. Barraskewda can't without rain or tera.
 
Yanmega banned? Let's go over some winners and losers then.

Winners:
Normal.png
Normal.png
Normal.png
Normal.png
Normal.png

These are just a couple. Gyarados gains new advantage as being able to more easily take up the tera hog slot on HO, and tera flying t-blast sets have always been moderately threatening. It's recent SCL success is a good tell of its quality with sets like RestoChesto being amazing at just stealing games if it gets going. I think Gyara or Oricorio forms will be the attempted replacement for Yanmega, but we'll see. Conk appreciates mach being more spammable into HO, as do slither and flygon for first impression spam. Slowbro very much appreciates its HO matchup being drastically improved as Yanmega pmuch hard stopped all CM slowbro attempts by putting it in a catch 22 and threatening it really bad even after a CM. Honestly there's not a ton of obvious winners as the okidogi rise since yanmega was never really a wall for things, just a goofy sweeper that sometimes lucked its way into free wins.

Losers:
Normal.png
Normal.png
Normal.png

Rotom heat once again losing another mon it checks so people can now use it 0 times instead of 1 time a tournament. Kilowattrel was never a good yanmega answer but people sought out using it as a thundurus replacement, which it barely performed but was good enough cope for most people. Still think it's mostly a B- pokemon but its still serviceable. Crawdaunt's biggest claim over conk was Aqua Jet's superior HO mu thanks to tera ground yan and armarouge giving it good targets over mach. Now, Yan is gone so arma is the only real target for jet. Even worse, Gyarados picking up steam makes that niche even less useful when you can again just nab conkeldurr for better just about everything. Unfortunately a worse Male Legion even in that niche.
 
Hi chat, so recently i finished my ru summer ssnl run, falling just short vs guille in a couple absolute banger finals sets. shoutouts guille btw for taking home the chip after he signed up bc gk was badgering him lol. So I wanted to put together this post as a kinda dump for all the teams I used and maybe provide a lil bit of background for why I was building and bringing the stuff I did. This won't be like, a full paste of all the teams I used but itll be everything from week 11 onwards bc thats where I got knocked out of winners and started the losers bracket run. Before we jump into the teams though I want to mention a little bit of my mindset personally going into these rounds. As the tour progressed I really wanted to take opportunity to show that RU as a tier, is deep as hell. Scl, ssnl, and ru cup have all played a factor in pushing forward the ru community and done wonders to further develop the meta through shifts and suspects. My mentality as I got into these later rounds was to try and do my due diligence not only to win, but to try and show how open the meta is. Imo, you can really bring just about anything and as long as you surround it with the right supporting cast you can find great success with it. With that being said lets get it:
This was the start of my losers run after getting knocked into the lower bracket by franklin. To be honest, this was a super busy week for me, I had been coming back from traveling the previous weekend so I needed to extend my last round gaming vs franklin into this week. Lost, then had some obnoxious scheduling issues to deal with so teams were kinda decided on the fly and I just used stuff that I already had lying around the builder.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-800394
I have nothing really interesting to say about this team, just a bunch of standard nonsense, if you've seen my games before you might recognize this 6, it was one of the first builds I had with goodra when it dropped to us in shifts a few months ago and I've passed it to a bunch of ppl at this point.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-800430
this team is slightly more interesting but also not really. theres a scrafty which is cool, this one was a sub dd scrafty which I was trying out and it kinda did something but also not really lol. nasty plot thund was also cool, broke through one of the better "checks" regular thund normally has in kilowatt so that was neat, that mon really could just do whatever it wanted and you had to just deal with it LOL

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-800451
this was the team I built for franklin last round and I really did just want to use it again bc I thought it looked cool and was sad it didnt get to pop off before. The main idea behind the team was basically just calm mind spam. Three calm mind guys, bike+rachi for removal, rocks, and backbone as well as pivots to buy free turns to get the calm mind guys in, and then salamence as an intimidate bot which can also just eviscerate teams from time to time and appreciates the free turns bikerachi buys you. definitely got a bit lucky with an early cane confuse from mence taking out zause's only counterplay to all the cm guys in scream tail, but also was left a little confused why he didn't just switch out scream tail and switch it back in later, that mon was killer vs basically everybody. I also had my own scream tail that ended up clutching the game after the opposing one folded. Off the recommendation from tsuki, this will be a trend btw, I used booster speed cm scream tail as the main focus building around this team. A super fast cm mon with access to some crazy coverage and cant be phazed by smth like bike dragon tail was just a really cool concept and I wanted to roll with that.

teams: https://pokepast.es/c97770688fbcaae3
evi in general is hard to prep for bc like me, she is also a crack connoisseur and will not hesitate to bring cool/off meta picks herself. This is reflected, at least in my eyes, in the double torn-i teams she loaded as well as the regidrago in g3. As such instead of trying for a hard cteam of sorts, I just decided to build some stuff I thought looked cool and see how it rocked.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-803026
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-803029
I used the same team for both these games since I lost the g1 and im a salty mf so I wanted the immediate spin back lol. But the concept was basically, at the time, we were seeing a big uptick in volcanion usage in scl I think. So that had me thinking about some of the other waters we have available to us and as I was scrolling through NU i came across goatraquanid. Instead of the webs setter role in which we sometimes see araq fill, I decided to go with POWER and went all in with a banded spread. After decide on araq I decided to overload on the water angle and added volcanion with the idea that the offensive waters would help each other out muscling/chipping down checks so the other ones life was easier later. Beyond that the rest of the teams are largely just staples, rocks regi with twave to slow things down so the waters have an easier time breaking, bike for removal and a pivot to get the waters in, amoongus to provide a little bit more backbone and a tox spreader so the waters could have an easier time breaking later. The most interesting guy is my choice of scarfer in flygon. You don't really see scarf flygon much at all lately for a plethora of reasons but for this team specifically, I chose him because I was focusing in on the fact he was a fast scarfer who did not care ab being thrown in on electric moves. When ur running with two waters as ur main source of offense I was hella paranoid by the fact of fast volters blowing me up. At this point thundy was banned but I was still wary about the random kilowatt or rotom or whatever ruining my day. Flygon also has the added benefit of the ground immune and having uturn access so that was definitely a big plus.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-803030
I wanted to try out fezmag with this team. A core that was super popular last year and apparently even had conversations about banning them? So i took the opportunity to try out this core myself but with my own personal flare on some stuff, most notably the fez set. I've made a post ab thief fez in the ru gimmicks thread but I really like this mon so I will continue to try and use it where I can lol. The main premise is you can get a pseudo knock off on stuff you might otherwise have a harder time removing an item from. Ppl love to throw in guys like rachi, hoodra, registeel, or in the case of the game itself rotom-h into fez and taking off their items is super clutch. Especially when you consider these might be a bit harder to remove with a traditional knock mon like krook or gapdos who the aforementioned mons might be more wary of. Beyond that though the team is pretty standard, hippo+vern for rocks/removal, amoongus for a bit more backbone and suicune as the closer bc suicune is a scary mf whose life is made somewhat easier with the presence of zone. Mostly for trapping roar empo who is imo one of the better suicune answers we have.

teams: https://pokepast.es/117da6313b38aa11
tsuki was one of the ppl i talked to a lot regarding random mons I should bring for this tour as well as someone I would test against from time to time and is great friend within the ru community so I knew I had to bring out the a-game this week. Also suicune bc for one reason or the other, the universe has made that mon her kryptonite.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-804402
i've been looking to make iron thorns work for a while now and I decided that since tsuki was a fat enjoyer this was as good as any to try out the mecha godzilla. Taunt+tera fly was the choice for this spread as it helped me buy free turns for setup against would be answers like whirlwind Hippowdon, quagsire, gligar, or choice locked krooks. With thorns at the center I constructed the rest of the team to help facilitate his job sweeping as well as provide defensive backbone since thorns really is basically a 0 from what he brings as a defensive switchin lol. Gastro and rachi formed a hazard stacking/defensive backbone for the team with gastro being my dedicated water check for guys like volcanion specifically. Encore Jirachi is just so flexible with the number of things it can encore lock then uturn out of to give thorns setup opportunity. Chesnaught and slowbro were also setup guys who don't necessarily NEED to depend on tera so if iron thorns was thwarted I still had guys in the back who could act as my wincon while also providing some much needed defensive utility to the team. CM slowbro is still a menace, that guy is tremendous and covert cloak is just a great item that helps vs guys like fez mainly who might try to fish toxic chain procs on you. Last but not least this game was either concurrent to or right after the week I saw feli use a switcheroo scarf noivern with defog in scl and I just so happened to need some speed control and a removal option and I didn't like how bike necessarily looked on the build so I landed on the funny noivern lol. Glad to report the iron thorns did pop off and really that is all i can ask for in life lol.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-804410
this was a team I had lying around from who knows how long ago and really the only reason I brought it was because it had vincune which I thought had decent odds to 6-0 tsuki. That was a correct assumption on my part hej

teams: https://pokepast.es/aeaa8a6d10f0d53c
yeah I had this game circled on calender. I knew that if I wanted to continue my run sooner or later I'd have to run up vs the guy who sent me to losers to begin with and lo and behold, week 14 just so happened to be that week. I brought some funny stuff vs frank the first time we played and I got slammed so what did I do this week? if you guessed continue to bring funny stuff you would be correct!

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-805528
this team was a lot of fun to build and yes, that is a dipplin on your screen and yes, the dipplin did put in work. The specific reasoning behind bringing dipplin? honestly I kinda just wanted to build with dipplin so I started there and just kept going. dipplin, especially the spread I ended up going with gives you a really interesting defensive profile because of its unique combo of sticky hold as an eviolite mon. With like the biggest concern of all eviolite mons, getting your eviolite knocked off, not being an issue for dipplin I could use this guy as basically my dedicated knock off absorber which was cool. With the sp def investment I went with dipplin also turned out to be a good guy to sponge hits from random ghosts in the tier. Specs horo and basculegion and stuff fail to get 2hkos on this spread with the incredibly spammable ghost stab which is very convenient. Rounding out the classic fire/water/grass core I tacked on empo which also doubled as my steel/rocker/pivot guy and talon as my removal and called it there as far as the defensive core was concerned. Beyond that I kinda just surrounded them with big progress makers. As far as special breakers go gardevoir is a bit niche but I wanted to try it out here bc of its high impact trick potential+being able to click specs moonblast truly is very fun. I wanted to try out av golurk bc there had been some discussion in the discord that week about various golurk spreads and av lurk came up and I figured he was interesting here, mainly as a stop to armarouge which I was big afraid of. Finally Scarf Gapdos is really just one of the great progress makers in the tier, so hard to find proper ways to deal with knock/uturn/threat of dual stabs from this guy over the course of a game.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-805537
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-805540
tbh i hate this game lol. I played like a tool, got tilted after my hoodra got burnt by a glowbro flamethrower and kinda went into a spiral afterwards. The team is nothing special though, this is like the most boring of the squads I fielded during the entire tour. Everything does what you think it does with the exception of maybe hoodra which is my own take on sp def hoodra. Feli thinks he invented protect hoodra and this game did happen after he used it in scl but this is a guy I've had waiting in the wings for ages ready to spring whenever I felt necessary...
so I got tilted after that first game and my thought process going into this g2 was fuck it, thats a good team I just played like dog water, lets just load it again and surely nothing could go wrong. Well i rolled a crazy good matchup and even through prolonged lowkey throwing the team did manage to clutch up. Nothing super much to add here. Actually I do have something to add, I really should stop letting my talon get knocked by stuff lol...

teams: https://pokepast.es/5e4f9bb03578aed1
0ysters another buddy, he was my captain for this years ruwc and was the guy who sent franklin down to the losers bracket so he was someone I was wary of. With all that being said he has a very distinctive type of building I was already pretty familiar with so I just tried to build some stuff with that in mind and see how things worked out.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-807082
These first couple teams are some recycles I thought would work well into 0yster's builds. This is a team I built ages ago featuring tghost dd scrafty and banded golurk which I thought both looked powerful into the scout. Unfortunately I terad the scrafty maybe a taaaaad too early not realizing that was like, my only dark resist and after that 0ysters krook had a field day blowing up the team and stuff. One day the og oras venu spread will prevail though I'm sure of it...

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-807085
This was another recycled team I built for my ptpl mu vs ciel. Unfortunately I lost that game as part of the most heartbreaking week's I have ever been apart of but I thought the team was good so I wanted to give it another chance to do its things and do its thing it did. the main premise here was funny trapper volcanion remove guys like slowbro from the opponents teams so rachi can have an easier time paraflinching and gapdos has one less guy who can confidently switchin on brave bird clicks. I think glowbro is crazy underrated rn as a toxic guy who actually has meaningul ways to threaten both steels/poisons who inherently are immune to toxic. You also can get free entries on other toxic guys like amoongus or umbreon who had been lowkey annoying me lately when I built this team. hippo and bike were there as the rocker+removal combo, nothing super interesting in that regard. I will say theres been some pretty targetted hate towards hippo in the community lately which is personally a bit baffling to me with the main complaint being him being passive. Like this is valid for sure esp if you're gonna be running mono eq like I was here, but hes still a fabulous guy to get up rocks disrupt the opp with whirlwinds and discourage random contact clicks while he still has his helmet. Sand is also sneakily incredibly valuable if you can leverage it right to keep mons low. in this game there were a couple turns where sand cancelled out wochs lefties regen i think which is a small detail overall but can matter big time if you extend it long enough over the course of a game.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-807089
I thought banded terrakion looked crazy into 0ysters scout so I just went for it lol. rotom and slither are there as para bots bc I went with adamant terrakion for added power, which I definitely felt btw, so he was a bit slower than most. feli can crucify me again over fimpless slither but I will maintain while that option is good, I'd hardly consider it a mandatory inclusion on all slither sets. Here i thought slither was nicer as a para/pivot bot so thats what I went for. The regi set is smth I had been talking to a couple ppl ab at the time, feen I think being the main one, where we were like, rest regi is probably fire, so I decided to try it out lol. It didn't actually end up clicking rest at all though so rip to that, but it couldve! bike is regular nothing really doing ab that. I think the necrozma set is one of the more interesting ones on this team though. I was really leaning into some of the scummy para nonsense shenanigans with this spread having dark pulse on there. dpulse was also nice to cover random psychics like slowbro, reuni, or rachi which actually did come up in the game. Rocky helmet was the item of choice mostly bc i wanted some guy to deter maushold from blowing me up without needing to burn a tera on regi and yeah, i thought it would be cool to see how necro faired as a helmet guy which he did a decent job at.

teams: https://pokepast.es/3b074b4c23e4378e
the big one. Coming from losers bracket I was looking at a steep hill to climb needing to force the reset and clutch two different sets. Leading up to this, the week i played vs 0yster was an extension bc of some scheduling stuff so the timing was a little bit rushed for me esp since i wanted to actually prep brand new stuff and not recycle for this one. But thankfully guille had a really straightforward scout and I was able to put together 5 squads that I was excited to debut

first set:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-807484
i consulted hjk on what he thought could be a cool mu into guille since he was also a big fat enthusiast and he suggested fsight+strong phys attacker could be the moves so I tried a fightsight strat based around mienshao and slowbro. I made the mistake of running boots on this mienshao bc guille really like playing with hazards and I wanted to give myself the flexibility to play with my regen mons without NEEDING to get like spikes/rocks off but that really bit me in the ass. I missed out a really close KO vs talon with a perfectly lined up cc -> future sight, got burnt by flame body and the game really ended right there. cm taunt covert cloak fez was also a huge menace, that guy has been flying a little low on the radar for whatever reason but these sets as a whole are a great example of what it can do to an unprepared team.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-807489
I decided that after that first game, my issue was I was playing far too honest. So for this game I loaded three mons that could paralyze you, Jirachi and Oricorio to flinch guys down. Taunt oricorio in general also had an amazing matchup into most of what guille had brought in the past so I was pretty confident it would be putting in work regardless of what i was looking at. guille brought some super hot fire to this one with specs sylv with sball+hyper voice cosplaying as zoro as well as hariyama doin his thing, which ended up just trading with weezing on turn 1 lol. This game looked like a super oricorio game though so after a few turn of just paralyzing everything and being annoying and stuff I managed to position ori in on jirachi get up a couple quiver dances and then kill every mon with ori. bird is silly, yanmega ban was to pay for the sins of air slash...

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-807494
this team was created after another consult with hjk where he told me armarouge is a great mon at piecing up fat. I really leaned into it with modest nature on this one which does notably miss out on a couple speed tiers with a weak armor proc (notably being slower than the scarf 110s at +2) but the extra power guarantees a roll on like cyclizar which did end up coming up in the game! tera ground was for fun to stop any twave shenanigans from a klefki or smth in my mind but ended up doing the same vs a rotom. This team from guille he has also spammed during the tour so I was wary of it and that grimmsnarl set in particular is what inspired the geezing set from me which worked basically perfectly as I wanted him to. the crux of the matter really was on armarouge tho who managed to 6-0d after I got a free turn in front of jirachi bc that is the nautre of armarouge hej.

reset:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-807501
i had a stupendous game for like 70% then cosmic power jirachi came in to ruin my day. If there was one thing I would've changed ab how I played this game, I wouldve gone for the tera on volcanions tera dark instead of cloyster tghost and then leaned into trying to kill the rachi with fire spin+burn damage with taunt to keep it off wish and stuff. Such is life, you live and you learn. Also had I protected the last turn in front of the jirachi i think that extra 5% also would've been huge... But into the team. The concept behind this one was just that I thought cloyster looked good into the squads he was bringing esp the HO stuff I had seen him load from time to time. Tghost was to thwart potential entei espeeds and protect was to guarantee I was safe from ever being revenged by slither wing fimp. Classic trapper volc for in case I didnt run into an HO matchup. Clear smog tect muk again as anti HO tech as well as being a guy I think in general has been underused lately. the weezing was definitely my biggest fumble on the team. i wanted to try out sp def weezing as a more reliable way to counterplay vs palossand being able to eat shadow balls better and run the ones but if i wanted to do that i shouldve been wisp, or if i wasn't wisp I shouldve invested more into phys def which did end up biting me in the game. Such is life though and I know to just throw some random def evs into the geezing now lol. otherwise pretty standard stuff from the rest of the guys

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-807506
I've been playing more ss ou lately both as part of oufl and as part of the masters run, and i was reminded of this mew set. So i just wanted to build around the mew set bc its really good at picking out random mons on fat and eviscerating them. also bottom line this team gets 6-0d by the taunt fez spread that guille brought and I basically had to all in on the mew funny to not lose off lead. which is what I did and i did not lose on lead lol. also I had a couple weird turns doubling around with chansey before getting mew in, that was just to setup a situation where I knew I could get mew in on a turn that taunt or moonblast was not being clicked so I had the freedom to go about the trapping funny. After that the game played out pretty straightforward. None of the sets beyond the mew were particularly notable. Maybe the closest to being off standard was body press bro which I was trying out in this series and worked really well actually, definitely can color me impressed.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-807508
you may have noticed i mentioned i only built five teams in for this set and this is the 6th game... yeah so I just pulled a rain from ages ago bc I thought rain was fun and I wanted to use it lol. This is a pretty well known setup at this point though so most of these sets are pretty straightforward as far as what they want to do. The only thing I think is worth commenting on further indepth would be the politoed set which was perish trap toad. in the past when thundys were in the tier, I was running protect+tground to more effectively trap those guys but now I honestly shouldve just been rest which probably would've served me better as far as preserving toed and trying to win the game. The game ended up boiling down to a kilowatt vs cm water fez staring comp where kilo SOLD and went 3/5 on thunders I think with two really unfortunate early misses which then further boiled down into a 50/50 between skewda and fez to seal the game which guille made the great call reading my immediate cc instead of flip for chip.

teams: https://pokepast.es/7f66b9667ecf5c80
Some final thoughts as I wrap up this post. This was my first run in an ru ssnl and I would like to thank everyone who made the experience, both playing vs as well as supporting and help test against, a great one, yall are goats. If you actually sat through and read some of or all of this post, I hope I made sense in the thought process that I had going into these games and ty for your time. Finally, I came in with the idea that the tier really is wide open rn with a lot of really cool/underexplored mons and teams still on the table and I hope that through these games I was able to show at least a lil bit of that. tyty all for reading once again and shoutouts Guille again for a banger finals series
 
Alright, so, these projected shifts are big, so this may take a while.

:pmd/rhyperior: MY BOI IS BACK. I didn't expect rhyperior to drop, but I am so happy I was wrong. Very offensively threatening while having great bulk. At worst, this is going to be A- tier.

:pmd/araquanid: Goodbye my sweet prince, you will probably be missed. Araquanid is kinda outclassed by ribombee in RU, but it still has a niche as a strong attacker and a webs setter that destroys talonflame. However, this isn't the case in OU as it destroys a lot of the rockers and removers, so that's great.

:pmd/revavroom: We already expected for this to rise, revavroom is great on UU HO, and has been falling a bit off in RU. You might be missed, but getting rid of a mon that has elements of hax (gunk shot and iron head) will be nice.

:pmd/mew: Don't expect this one to last long lol. Mew is probably now going to rise to UU, but with deoxys speed also probably dropping to UU, its going to take the whole hazard setter lead thing away from Mew, so expect this to drop to RU in three months.

:pmd/metagross: Yay, metagross is probably dropping. Great mon that might compete a bit with jirachi, but has lots of tools to make itself stand out. It has offensive sets in agility and hone claws, more defensive sets with stealth rocks and knock off, a priority option in bullet punch and even the ability to go mixed with grass knot or future sight. It does struggle a bit with our defensive mons, so it should be fine in the tier.

:pmd/mamoswine: Hello straight to RUBL mon, how are you? Yeah, mamoswine is going to be way too destructive. Sure, rhyperior can potentially take two icicle crashes in a row once, but that's just asking for a flinch to happen and with any hazards in play, you are doomed. And before anybody points to rotom heat, rock blast.

:pmd/suicune: Long time coming, suicune is an amazing mon in the tier that can rip through bulkier teams quite easily. It can flop a bit if its prepared for, but its still a powerful threat regardless.

:pmd/amoonguss: Yeah, unfortunately this is dropping. Has a decent amount of utility, but sadly can't hack it as its quite passive in the tier. Rip to a legend.

:pmd/politoed: I'm actually shocked this is dropping. Rain isn't really good in the tier, but its one of those playstyles ladder LOVES. Drizzle is probably going to be banned from NU, as manual rain is already destructive in the tier. So politoed is probably dropping all the way down to ZU lol.

:pmd/torkoal: A drop that isn't really shocking, torkoal hasn't made sun that much better in the tier. Its another mon that low ladder spams, which is probably the only reason it lasted so long in the tier.


Some other cool usage stats:
Just a quick note, but none of the HO goons were in the top 5, with the closest being kleavor with 14.9% usage at number 7. Maybe the ladder is un-HO'ing? (cope)

:pmd/cyclizar: The number one once again, cyclizar has proven itself that the fraud claims may be false. Great spinner, can check a lot of special threats and has tons of utility.

:pmd/bisharp: Is this really a surprise? Bisharp has shown itself to be one of the best mons in the tier, with it doing especially well against offense. It also helps check the dangerous ghost types of the tier, and can be a defensive pivot against so much more.

:pmd/krookodile: Krookodile has established itself as the best ground type in the tier, and for good reason. It's amazingly offensively with knock+e-quake doing solid damage to most things in the tier, with gunk shot handling everything that resists the moves, and knock off removing items. It also is quite good defensively with intimidate and its typing. Definetely deserved number three.

:pmd/goodra hisui: Hisuian Goodra has established itself as a top tier mon, with its walling prowess, powerful attacks and good utility. Its able to soft check a large portion of the metagame, with either sap sipper or gooey, and is overall just a versatile mon.

:pmd/zapdos galar: Yeah, remember when I said that it was unexpected to see gapdos in the top 5? Nope, not anymore. Gapdos in the last month has skyrocketed in viability, as its choice scarf sets are the best speed control option in the tier and it can be difficult (though not impossible) to deal with. Pokemon such as bellibolt and talonflame have risen in usage too, so its not all sunshine for this mon.
 
Last edited:
Hello RU! Here with a new spin on the current RU metagame. Firstly, laddering up to experiment with new teams and different playstyles in the beginning was rough, I lost a lot. But kept going because there is a lot of fun stuff that had to be shared and I needed solid replays and good teams (or at least decent).

Eject Button is a wild item to use but it has a niche on regenerator mons like Slowbro, Amoonguss, and Reuniclus. Being able to take advantage of a wall for one turn to take a hit is very valuable and can come in clutch in a lot of cases that could help the flow of a game go in your direction. The reason for having this item on a regenerator mon specifically is due to the ability recovering HP on the switch out, being able to take a big hit and shrug it off helps to build a lie against your opponent: "You can't hurt my team." Not only that but to also now have to deal with an offensive threat after that brings in the question: "What now?" Getting off free chip with regen Mienshao or protective pads Maushold in combination with fat regenerator mons sponging off hits can be really annoying and frustrating. Not only that, but it can make the team seem more intimidating. The downsides are only getting to use the item once and making sure the eject button mon doesn't need to stay in to wall a threat.
I like using this mechanic/strat on weather offense but it definitely works better on balance.
I want to experiment more with this idea against seasoned players so if anyone who is seasoned wants to help me out, let me know.

Slow U-Turn/Volt Switch/Flip Turn is a cool idea and I've found that Flip Turn is hard to pull off with Volcanion around (to a lesser extent Gastrodon and Vaporeon due to usage). Gligar pulls this idea off really well due to the high bulk and great synergy with Umbreon. No recovery? No problem with wish support. Gligar is a great physical defensive pivot and immunity to Thunder Wave and Toxic/Toxic Chain. This idea comes from wanting to bring in offensive threats safely and consistently.
I think there is a lot more potential with this idea, but I need to experiment more with other mons and see what else is missing. Feel free to give it a shot yourself.

Special Thanks to Rarely Me for helping me out with experimenting teams. Really appreciate it.

https://pokepast.es/96c83935acb6ca54
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2255647312-yar623pnx8kcheq4cbk2cycbwidkv0mpw

https://pokepast.es/bfc33b3e9394b50b
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2255023224-4s6ukanlzsfdze1lmhzbub4mqx2p8dcpw

https://pokepast.es/b9fc3b3086ff7252
https://pokepast.es/8d6f45d5a66fe833 (probably a better version)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2255652939-oclrftqb0ahc3r0c4prlf05sfx9nlqepw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2256142817-s4nfgmqb1ymz8t6zwsnot9v736xvsanpw

https://pokepast.es/3346b8b0871dc001
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2251952322-0oq4fi3nlhysar5iyrcg8ymse2ud3pkpw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2251212113-3r1csodk18wtzdyedc5qa3fstk8mt8ipw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2250636667-yhwu3scfb1yaaq0no7t03jfxzymle9kpw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2250639838-kzu3e6wu8myaoxr0rc2ilnd1n49zamvpw
 
It's been a while since I posted here but with my presence in RU ramping back up during RUBD I figured I would revive the thread a bit and talk about some stuffs. I'm pretty happy generally with the metagame as a whole, though teambuilding can still be arduous at times due to several reasons I'll discuss below. Please enjoy;

The Breakers

:Volcanion: :zapdos-galar:
These two are noticeably ahead of the competition to me and are arguably S rank mons, offering tremendous upside while fitting on most teams quite naturally. It doesn't take much effort to find replays that come down to Gapdos speed ties, which isn't a great representation of the tier but definitely exists. Volcanion just kind of invalidates bulky offense and fatter teams because of how effective its STABs are in conjunction with Taunt. These two are not broken or uncompetitive, but are quite centralizing and need to be accounted for at all times, often requiring multiple answers to their coverage options.

:basculegion-f: :conkeldurr: :crawdaunt: :Gardevoir: :goodra-hisui: :magnezone: :salamence: :slither wing: :Zoroark-hisui:
There are plenty of viable wallbreakers, like the ones mentioned above and a plethora of lower tier demons like Chandelure and Golurk which I won't bother going over for now. I think the tier has a lot of really great immediate power to keep teams from getting fat and lazy, though it can be difficult to account for the seemingly infinite combinations of breakers that can mesh well. My general philosophy in the builder lately has been to use stuff like AV Magnezone and fatter Salamence and Slither Wing sets to try and combine their offensive prowess with some defensive utility, which applies to a fair amount of our breakers honestly.

The Setup Demons

:Armarouge: :bisharp: :Fezandipiti:
These three are, without a doubt, some of the most potent offensive setup sweepers around. I don't think anybody can say they haven't been gamed by a Weakness Policy Armarouge at some point in their RU career, nor can you say you've beaten the Bisharp mind games consistently. Fezandipiti, however, sets itself apart because of Toxic Chain, great natural bulk, awesome utility options like Taunt and U-turn, and pretty nice typing in Fairy and Poison. These three are my top picks for mons I hate to see get one boost.

:gengar: :maushold: :mimikyu: :necrozma: :Oricorio-pom-pom: :Reuniclus: :Revavroom: :salamence: :slowbro: :suicune:
All of these, plus basically every other NUBL mon, can make life difficult if given just one turn to set up. I think a trend in RU and lower tiers as a whole is that bulky Psychic-types kind of just win games late, with the obvious Slowbro mention here but also stuff like Necrozma and Reuniclus being absurdly good in their spots as well.

The Fats

:Fezandipiti: :noivern: :slowbro:
Okay okay, hear me out. Fezandipiti, as discussed above, is a quite beefy mon that can use bulkier setup sets to great success. Noivern, however, finds a spot here as it can do a lot of things really well and checks one of the premier offensive threats mentioned above in Volcanion. Super Fang sets have been popular lately for good reason, as it forces a ton of progress so smoothly and can seemingly always help position its teammates to win. Slowbro is Slowbro, it's naturally beefy and can CM up in front of a lot of stuff safely.

:amoonguss: :cyclizar: :empoleon: :goodra-hisui: :hippowdon: :jirachi: :quagsire: :reuniclus: :rhyperior: :slither wing: :talonflame: :umbreon: :Weezing-Galar:
Before I talk about the second-class fat mons, can we just acknowledge how all of these fold to Taunt Volcanion? Anyway, I think all of these still fulfill roles for teams effectively if used right, especially Cyclizar of course but that's kind of fallen out of favor to me. I think Rhyperior usage will continue to grow and it'll be rightly regarded as an A caliber mon, though it does have legitimate competition in the often laughed about Hippowdon.

The Overlap

I tried to avoid going over every lower tier mon that is usable in the above categories because it'd be quite repetitive, but the astute readers amongst you probably noticed some significant overlap between roles, as I alluded to. A lot of our options can effectively function as defensive and offensive pieces depending on their matchups, which is quite good honestly because it opens up the builder a lot and gives a significant edge to people who take the time to understand the intricacies of the tier. I think the metagame often rewards the better player and builder, though we're not immune to some cheesy elements as well with stuff like ParaSpam and flinch shenanigans being quite good. Overall, I'd rate the tier favorably and will say that I am happy with the progress the council and people have done lately. Metagross dropping will provide another pretty cool multifunctional piece to the puzzle, though Mamoswine dropping may end up making things far more convoluted because of how monstrous it can be, but we'll see. Expect more FlamPoke again moving forward, especially in the win column.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top