NOC Lumiose Legends Mafia - GAME OVER (Mafia Win)

charlieum said:
Focus on actual wagons probably because if deadline rush hits it is better to have your thoughts on them sorted out than people who are non-factors in it.
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Sure I can do that. Gonna respond to des post first since that is faster but I will go thru each wagon voter rq afterwards
des121 said:
Why is charlie scummy?

I feel like he just is because of the tmi post as well as he didn't really give me enough information about him being on town side for me.
Pulsar is scummy because she wasn't active for a long time and didn't vote yet.
I don't think ne is scummy bc of good reasons in his posts.
Dbd isn't scummy to me I meant on day 2 but I would need more information from him
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- What information would you look for when you say someone is "town side?" Because I have liked charlie's solving attempts + general thread presence thus far. So I want to see what you're coming from.
- Pulsar just needs to be subbed out like a fairy said if she isn't going to post. Honestly that may be a better solution? Then we can read the sub with pulsar's inactivity in mind. But failing that I think the policyvote isn't the worst option (but isn't our best either)
- Can you elaborate more on why DBD is scummy to you personally? And what information do you need?
 
sunny004 said:
Sure I can do that. Gonna respond to des post first since that is faster but I will go thru each wagon voter rq afterwards

- What information would you look for when you say someone is "town side?" Because I have liked charlie's solving attempts + general thread presence thus far. So I want to see what you're coming from.
- Pulsar just needs to be subbed out like a fairy said if she isn't going to post. Honestly that may be a better solution? Then we can read the sub with pulsar's inactivity in mind. But failing that I think the policyvote isn't the worst option (but isn't our best either)
- Can you elaborate more on why DBD is scummy to you personally? And what information do you need?
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Like he was scummy in the first ever post I don't know to be honest bc I'm trying to read and become good. From dbd like more posts and thoughts. Same with charlie
 
btw it can never be both dbd and lechen because they tend to pla
bluedoom said:
I'm looking at this atm and trying to think what the maf play is here. I have a hard time believing that the AS wagon i pure just becauuse...I'd have to look in sunny/pulsar/af/hyhy/mekkah/skip/ag/lechen/dbd. Eh ok the pool is big but heres where I'm at:

I honest;ly think that ag and Lechen are still town. This is just going off of meta but their play has been similar to what they did in low power mafia. In low power mafia lechen spent the entire game getting offended at being scumread/being called a lowposter and using OMGUS votes, while ag kinda made a bunch of wild votes and theories that rubbed people the wrong way and made them misvote him. If anyone would like to convince me that I'm wrong here, by all means, but I'm not seeing these two as scum so far.

Hyhy is my top town read, he's very invested and I imagine that scum!hyhy is quiet.

If I trust ag, then I'll have to take his word that af is greenchecked. This reduces the offwagon pool to mekkah/dbd/sunny/skip/pulsar. Suddenly this isn't as convincing for me to think that AS wagon was pure.

Of the AS wagon, I think charlie looks good. There's been a consitent thought process, progression, and I think charlie has not had static votes/a static game view for me to be concerned. CK...ehhh. I don't like the vig shot but this isn't someone whom I'd vote today unless there's some weird counterclaim. I think CK has been more active in the discussion and I think unvoting aligning before voting again because he got scumread for unvoting algning is more teling, because if he's scum he has the TMI to know that AS flips town to run off of the towncred on that.

That does leave me with NE/Vizh/des. I'm really starting to wonder if des is scum since we haven't seen her ask people about their reads on her, there doesn't seem to be that weird self conscious play that I saw in low power mafia. Unsure on Vizh, but NE my view is still the same as last phase. Agree with charlie's view on him, and also, he isn't showing the townie ego thatt I'd expect of him here.

Of the off wagon pool, I'd look into sunny/skip/pulsar today. Mekkah's content is honestly fine, and while I don't think dbd has done anything townie, I do think that the claim that he got roleblocked is a point in his favour, slightly..

Vote: NightEmerald
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i think everything up to the that leaves me with part is okay, im interested but kinda not in the lechen stuff because i dont think it really justifies itself but it gives unagenda'd so like, limited time, do not care

the des read is just wrong, like im pretty sure des is>=their 'asking about own reads' frequency
i think vizh having no analysis is weird
i need to reread their thoughts on me d1 but i think "not having towny ego" isn't really a good reason

regardless, I think this reads more 'tunnelled town' than 'scum'
 
sunny004 said:
Sorry I got a bit sidetracked

Will respond to this first since it is most salient. Bullet points will be in relative order to his

- This is probably the most fair point (wrt tommy vote), and why I said it was weird but not damning.

- (combining this and last point) But surely you have to recognize that there is a difference between an outsize focus on two players and hedging your votes elsewhere? The issue that I have with it is that the bulk of your solving pressure seems to be focused on these two players and really nowhere else. So to answer your last point I don't see a contradiction there at all. You can focus most of your energy on only a select subset of the playerbase while hedging and giving token references to being open to the rest of the list. I don't think they are mutually exclusive.

- wrt D1/D2; I fail to see how your tone-setting argument doesn't apply in D2 (or if it applies in D2, how it applies in D1). There is still a lack of interaction from DBD and pulsar D2. I'm not saying that this necessarily clears them or makes them not a good vote (in fact, if not you I think they are in my top vote options too) but my main issue is with the apparent inconsistency with reasoning here. Why doesn't this apply to a D2 pulsar vote? Maybe this is just me approaching from an OC mindset but Idk what merited the shift here.

- Same thing wrt casing you for casing NE. I am also not a big fan of NE's behavior here but again wrt busser / busee I find the way you are going about this to be off. I don't have an issue with the particular target of your pressure but rather the way you are approaching it
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I mean with NE its a meta read and I was the guy's scum buddy in the previous game so fmpov I feel like i can read him better? Like I'm not tunneling on the dude because lolinactive, I'm focusing on him because I expect him to be more motivated as town and had first hand experience as his buddy in the previous game. I've used a similar reasoning for why I tr other less active/arguably scummy slots(ag/lechen). It looks like a tunnel until you realise that I'm trying to bring in my experience in the past game into reading some of these slots. The reason I'm able to put more effort in reading certain slots is by going off of past experiences/meta reads that I have on them, it is extremely difficult for me to read slots like des/af for example just based on play alone.

With skip I've actually been hedgy earlier in the same and I definitely am not playing like a tunneler given the pulsar vote in between, I dunno why my skip vote would be considered a tunnel given that I got flak for *not* voting skip earlier in the game in the first place (because I was paranoid of possibly voting lynchbait).

D2 I'm more ok voting an inactive because I have a bigger pool of townreads that I'm more confident in, a lot of it is also by poe, I think I'd rate my solve as something like:

Ne/pulsar/skip

Dbd/des

You/mekkah

Vizh

Ag/Lechen

Charlie/hyhy/CK


In terms of scummier to towniest. Af is weird to place because nothing about her pings me as town but also, trusting AG's word on her role there

-I'm kinda confused about the last point, what do you dislike about my approach to ne?
 
Also I see people throw around the words analysis, reasoning and solving a lot, sometimes as a response to "they posted a wall but there's no analysis"...I am finding it hard to understand. HyHy posts a lot of stream of consciousness kind of stuff, he doesn't get that accusation, he just gets townread by half the game. skipper, Vizh and Tommy posted a fair bit and they have all at one point or another got that thrown at him (for example NE in 2040 just now), is there some telltale sign of solid analysis that I'm missing here?
 
Mekkah said:
Also I see people throw around the words analysis, reasoning and solving a lot, sometimes as a response to "they posted a wall but there's no analysis"...I am finding it hard to understand. HyHy posts a lot of stream of consciousness kind of stuff, he doesn't get that accusation, he just gets townread by half the game. skipper, Vizh and Tommy posted a fair bit and they have all at one point or another got that thrown at him (for example NE in 2040 just now), is there some telltale sign of solid analysis that I'm missing here?
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bd never actually gave reasons why vizh was town/scum, he just called it unsure and moved on. hence, no analysis
 
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