Unpopular opinions

[Hugin]

It'd be interesting if Pokemon leaned MORE into the utopia side of things. The world is peaceful enough that kids generally leave home at 10-15, spend a wandering from city to city on foot or via public transit, earning cash by having training matches with adults, figuring out how to survive on their own. This is a fundamental aspect of their culture, the early stages of job training/job selection among youth, and a way for people to leave their hometown and experience life in other areas.

Just, what's that like, mechanically? Presumably there's hostels where trainers on the gym challenge tend to stay. Are there restaurants with a discount on meals for trainers as a way of giving them cheap food? What does it look like when you have ten 12 year olds under one roof, all with pre-existing drama, all preparing for a sports match the next day? I can see all sorts of interesting stories/a day in the life sort of setups that we really haven't seen because they're afraid to look at the details too closely.

Also I just realized that this whole deal sounds like when 18 year olds take a gap year before college and backpack across Europe or follow a band on tour.

 

[AztecCroc]

Presumably there's hostels where trainers on the gym challenge tend to stay.

According to the anime that is just another function of Pokémon Centers.

 

[Basedwell]

The most unrealistic part of Pokemon is that everyone would pay up without complaint. The one time I money-matched someone in chess, it was at a bar for 20 bucks with a guy twice my age. I was beating so badly after 15ish moves and he resigned, but didn't pay up lol.

 

[pika pal]

The most unrealistic part of Pokemon is that everyone would pay up without complaint. The one time I money-matched someone in chess, it was at a bar for 20 bucks with a guy twice my age. I was beating so badly after 15ish moves and he resigned, but didn't pay up lol.

To be fair I doubt you had a Thunder shooting lizard while his was unconscious which probably incentivizes honoring the wager.

 

[pokemon4eva]

The most unrealistic part of Pokemon is that everyone would pay up without complaint. The one time I money-matched someone in chess, it was at a bar for 20 bucks with a guy twice my age. I was beating so badly after 15ish moves and he resigned, but didn't pay up lol.

Ghetsis: My calculations! My perfect plan! Nooooo, it's falling apart!!! *hands you cash*

Lysandre: It's over, there's no hope left for this world... *hands you cash*

Guzma: GUZMAAAA! WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOUUUUU??? *hands you cash*

Lusamine: How can you be so awful?! *hands you cash* (surprisignly Motherbeast Lusamine doesn't give you cash, they aren't that farfecthed)

 

[Basedwell]

Ghetsis: My calculations! My perfect plan! Nooooo, it's falling apart!!! *hands you cash*

Lysandre: It's over, there's no hope left for this world... *hands you cash*

Guzma: GUZMAAAA! WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOUUUUU??? *hands you cash*

Lusamine: How can you be so awful?! *hands you cash* (surprisignly Motherbeast Lusamine doesn't give you cash, they aren't that farfecthed)

do you think the grunts have a union to negotiate how much they pay up for losing? becasue they all pay the same amount

It'd be interesting if Pokemon leaned MORE into the utopia side of things. The world is peaceful enough that kids generally leave home at 10-15, spend a wandering from city to city on foot or via public transit, earning cash by having training matches with adults, figuring out how to survive on their own. This is a fundamental aspect of their culture, the early stages of job training/job selection among youth, and a way for people to leave their hometown and experience life in other areas.

Just, what's that like, mechanically? Presumably there's hostels where trainers on the gym challenge tend to stay. Are there restaurants with a discount on meals for trainers as a way of giving them cheap food? What does it look like when you have ten 12 year olds under one roof, all with pre-existing drama, all preparing for a sports match the next day? I can see all sorts of interesting stories/a day in the life sort of setups that we really haven't seen because they're afraid to look at the details too closely.

Also I just realized that this whole deal sounds like when 18 year olds take a gap year before college and backpack across Europe or follow a band on tour.

humans are very resourceful, in a world with over 1,000 types of magical creatures they would find countless ways for Pokemon to influence and improve our quality of life. And with Pokemon fighting culturally prominent for thousands of years, the strategies developed would be insane. Pokemon would be very much pay to play and most of the best trainers would likely have autowin strats. Information would be vital, so training would take place in secret. prominent trainers would be stalked in order for opponents to gain insights to their team and movesets.

i do think that the more "real" you try to make the world, the more the utopia part feels unrealistic. You could tell a similar type story to Hunter x Hunter where it takes place in a very real world while still being told from a naive child's perspective, but A. HxH is trying to contrast itself with Shounen, where the suspension of belief is similar to Pokemon, but less justifiable. and B. Pokemon at its core is for kids and it wouldn't fit. If they were to do something more mature, that would be the best route, but they aren't which is okay.

 

[Bakugames]

im late but as much as i love alola it runs pretty concise with "gamefreak is dogshit at showcasing indigenous people in good light". you could try to explain that the fact youre from the yamato japanese region educating the ainu on their incorrect religious beliefs is just a side effect of the isekai stuff but why the fuck is the alolan protag from kanto. literally 0 narrative importance and its not like pokemon ever gave a shit about making a realistic "newcomer" to a region considering the only other time youre ever from another region is in hoenn

 

[Mad Ram]

im late but as much as i love alola it runs pretty concise with "gamefreak is dogshit at showcasing indigenous people in good light". you could try to explain that the fact youre from the yamato japanese region educating the ainu on their incorrect religious beliefs is just a side effect of the isekai stuff but why the fuck is the alolan protag from kanto. literally 0 narrative importance and its not like pokemon ever gave a shit about making a realistic "newcomer" to a region considering the only other time youre ever from another region is in hoenn

I'm not sure about that. Japanese immigrant to Hawaii is pretty realistic. Japanese-Hawaiians actually outnumber natives.

 

[Basedwell]

It's Pokemon not Wokemon

 

[Bakugames]

I'm not sure about that. Japanese immigrant to Hawaii is pretty realistic. Japanese-Hawaiians actually outnumber natives.
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im not saying its not /realistic/ per se, but its not a necessary plot point that needed to happen and it coupled with the fact that alola is portrayed with quite a few tourist trap stereotypes + youre not even implied to have any connections to hawaii, youre straight up some random ass kanto kid whos family just decided to pack up and move to hawaii doesnt help at all. japan treats hawaii pretty similarly to the us so im not really favorable to it as an explanation tbh

It's Pokemon not Wokemon

wokemon is pokemon if it was good

 

[Karxrida]

Pokémon has free healthcare it's already woke.

 

[Basedwell]

Pokémon has free healthcare it's already woke.

no??

Gens 1 & 2: Pokeshops established by government in light of Pokemon's sudden appearance. Eventually they will be privatized for "efficiency" and sold off to the highest bidder, then costs will skyrocket
Gen 3: You get free membership because your dad is a gym leader
Gen 4: Same thing but with your mom
Gen 5: Temporary measure to appease Team Plasma
Gen 7: Effort to increase Pokemon usage because of the newly established Elite 4
Gen 9: Included in the tuition of your school

There are Pokemarts in every town like they're vape stores. Most trainers don't use items in battle. How else would they get enough traffic?

edit: You pay 0 taxes on your earnings too.

 

[Ironmage]

Pokémon has free healthcare it's already woke.

Let's also not forget that, as early as gen 1, the correct response to someone saying "this should be run like a business" is to force them at clawpoint to rethink their life.

 

[pokemon4eva]

im late but as much as i love alola it runs pretty concise with "gamefreak is dogshit at showcasing indigenous people in good light". you could try to explain that the fact youre from the yamato japanese region educating the ainu on their incorrect religious beliefs is just a side effect of the isekai stuff but why the fuck is the alolan protag from kanto. literally 0 narrative importance and its not like pokemon ever gave a shit about making a realistic "newcomer" to a region considering the only other time youre ever from another region is in hoenn

the fact that the signature character of the hawaiian region Alola and her family which the plot revolves around them are all white

ok but srs, the plot of Lillie (and the protagonist by extension) getting to travel and know about this welcoming region works well within the story, she is not just an outsider culturally but also emotionally since she has been sheltered for a good portion of her life

 

[Esserise]

im late but as much as i love alola it runs pretty concise with "gamefreak is dogshit at showcasing indigenous people in good light". you could try to explain that the fact youre from the yamato japanese region educating the ainu on their incorrect religious beliefs is just a side effect of the isekai stuff

I don’t really like the optics of Legends: Arceus, but strangely enough I think the nuances actually get a lot murkier the deeper you look into the details of the game’s lore. Because technically, the Diamond and Pearl Clans are stated to have been settlers themselves, who came to Hisui well after the original Celestica people (who understood the true unity between Arceus and time and space and all that) were scattered by some vague upheaval. So in a way, the game’s actual indigenous Hisuians are all but extinct, and it’s their name and belief system that were coopted by unrelated settlers, who are now seen as the indigenous population by the newest round of settlers, and then there’s you, a kid from the modern day whom the god that the original Celestica people recognized decides to catapult back into the past to bridge all these gaps.

but why the fuck is the alolan protag from kanto. literally 0 narrative importance and its not like pokemon ever gave a shit about making a realistic "newcomer" to a region considering the only other time youre ever from another region is in hoenn

Honestly I think they mostly just did it for the 20th anniversary glitz. “What if we made the player come to the new region from Gen 1 land?”

 

[CPU]

Yeah, I always felt that the MC being from Kanto in Gen 7 was a part of the Gen 1 references they focused on for the 20th anniversary.

 

[Mad Ram]

japan treats hawaii pretty similarly to the us so im not really favorable to it as an explanation tbh

I think you need to sit down for this...


And to make sure this isn't just some shitpost, I will back it up that it is very likely the reason for the protagonist being from Kanto is because of the 20th anniversary mixed in with the large Japanese presence already and maybe the theme of the islands being welcoming that was also brough up here.

 

[Bakugames]

I think you need to sit down for this...

is this about the ryuukyuu kingdom or the ainu people (or korea) u gotta be specific

 

[Mad Ram]

I'll be honest, I wasn't sure what you meant by "treats pretty similarly to the US" and I thought you meant it as "they think Hawaii is just like the US" to which... I mean there is a reason for that. Being in the US would do that.

 

[Hugin]

Here's an unpopular opinion: The pokemon games aren't woke. I appreciate the fandom's efforts to fix that, but I think it's important that we remember what the source material actually is. Because, yeah, there's the imperialism of Alola/Hisui. The female characters are faster to speedrun for various reasons, but a good chunk of those reasons are sexism(female chars talk more so the male rival is faster, etc). The devs actively scrub any potential gay or trans expression out of the games, purely because they can.

Again, I understand and agree with people pushing back and fixing that. But it's important to remember that these games are sexist, transphobic, and racist, so that we remember where to push back.

 

[Esserise]

The devs actively scrub any potential gay or trans expression out of the games, purely because they can.

Maybe this is just a nitpick (because I do agree with your overall point), but I feel like the phrasing of this makes it sound like someone has been attempting to put queer representation into the games, which then got suppressed and removed by the devs. Whereas, unless there’s specific examples of that happening that I don’t know about (which I grant could very well be the case), my expectation would be that it’s more a case of the devs just not bothering to put any queer representation into the games in the first place. Not that that’s any better, of course.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

Idk, not really sure how you can encounter a major character like Penny, who's about as androgynous as humanly possible and whose ace tera Pokemon is Sylveon, and not walk away from that thinking that there's at least some kind of subtext going on.

 

[Hugin]

Maybe this is just a nitpick (because I do agree with your overall point), but I feel like the phrasing of this makes it sound like someone has been attempting to put queer representation into the games, which then got suppressed and removed by the devs. Whereas, unless there’s specific examples of that happening that I don’t know about (which I grant could very well be the case), my expectation would be that it’s more a case of the devs just not bothering to put any queer representation into the games in the first place. Not that that’s any better, of course.

I'm talking about changing dialogue depending on if you're male or female so that a potentially romantic line is only heard if it will be straight. Character customization so limited that bodies designated as male can't have long hair, while those designated as female can't have short hair. When they finally got rid of genderlocking clothes, they also got rid of the ability to wear skirts.

Situations where the default would allow players to be even slightly queer are removed, despite that requiring additional work from the devs. That's a deliberate choice by them and it shouldn't be ignored.

Idk, not really sure how you can encounter a major character like Penny, who's about as androgynous as humanly possible and whose ace tera Pokemon is Sylveon, and not walk away from that thinking that there's at least some kind of subtext going on.

I'm sure they aren't making decisions based on the fact that Trans Flag Sylveon is a meme in the US. And, like, I enjoy Penny, and if people relate to her ABSOLUTELY that's a good thing. But don't let headcanon satisfy you, we should be demanding better from TPC.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

I'm sure they aren't making decisions based on the fact that Trans Flag Sylveon is a meme in the US. And, like, I enjoy Penny, and if people relate to her ABSOLUTELY that's a good thing. But don't let headcanon satisfy you, we should be demanding better from TPC.

I guess I don't disagree on that last point, but SV really does not shy away from nonconforming gender presentation or body types.

So much so that one of my takeaways from playing it was "that had a little more gay energy than I expected, going in" (laudatory).

And that's even putting aside the fact that you don't pick "boy or girl" characters anymore. Or that Dendra clearly has some kind of BDSM lesbian kink thing going on with Tulip. (A fighting vs psychic bet where the loser "has to do anything." Please, I wasn't born yesterday. That isn't subtle.)

Spoiler

I'm seriously only like 25% joking.

 

[Esserise]

Idk, not really sure how you can encounter a major character like Penny, who's about as androgynous as humanly possible and whose ace tera Pokemon is Sylveon, and not walk away from that thinking that there's at least some kind of subtext going on.

I mean I personally think, for instance, that Bede from SwSh is pretty blatantly queer-coded, but then that just folds back into Hugin’s point about demanding better, because even if I’m right that it was deliberate, it still means Game Freak weren’t bold enough to just come out and say it.

(Although, my understanding is that Japan is generally more conservative on LGBTQ+ issues, so to some extent this doesn’t really surprise me.)

I'm talking about changing dialogue depending on if you're male or female so that a potentially romantic line is only heard if it will be straight. Character customization so limited that bodies designated as male can't have long hair, while those designated as female can't have short hair. When they finally got rid of genderlocking clothes, they also got rid of the ability to wear skirts.

Situations where the default would allow players to be even slightly queer are removed, despite that requiring additional work from the devs. That's a deliberate choice by them and it shouldn't be ignored.

Ahh, okay, I see what you mean now. I had forgotten about the handful of gender-dependent romantic dialogues, but recalling them now, that one-sidedness always did irk me.

The point about hairstyles is interesting to me, because there are lots of male characters who have long hair or less traditionally masculine styles in the games — in fact that’s one of the things I generally quite like about GF’s character design. It’s more in the personal customization area where you see those forms of expression become significantly more limited (which is absolutely to my own frustration as well, as someone who mostly identifies as male but has very long hair and a preference for feminine fashion).