Project Research Projects - Iron Hands @ post 64

[Betticus IV]

IDGCH Betti

Have to keep the momentum going, while I am only in the 1500s rn, wanted to make an early post as what I am using deviates a bit from what has been proposed/what I have been doing. I already used offensive chomp during seasonal, and found tinted to be an amazing offensive pairing with mons like stail and zarude due to it clearing the pesky steels for them. I think maw is fine, but the damage amp tinted provides in comparison to dmaw for defensive ghold/corv is what sets it above for me. I wanted to use a more utility based chomp instead, so hopefully don't overlap too much with what porcupine wanted to use.


Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Spikes
- Dragon Tail
- Earthquake

Pretty standard chain chomp. I had tried fluffy while building for ssnl, but found it had no longevity even with terrain support, so I decided here I would fully lean into it being the regen mon.



My initial build, I think the ideas are there but the tusk and ghold slots didn't feel right, and I was pretty weak to most physical attackers, needed to make a change.



Much cleaner, and fluffy ghold has great physdef synergy with chomp, as it covers for the chien and zama weakness. AV treads rounds out the spdef and immunity core much better than AV tusk/wbb ghold. Zarude and stail still have very nice synergy with chomp and ghold, so I kept them the same. I also actually thought seed bomb on zarude would be a cool tech for fluffy tusk after seeing it used against me for hamu, but never had the opportunity have it load into the mu.

I really like this build, chomp has great longevity, can survive basically any hit, and punishes all removers while having consistent removal in treads.

replays

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452358817-g5krlglurh1nwtugvv6fw05n4lf9o3epw

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452436001-njciolqd7et34ymcmyv8qsbcqkmvyohpw

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452440743-0ul5rwtx3wxbg489fafu219io13v96npw

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452451886-e37k46mlas1kkunxlbbgtlm3aia169qpw

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452456218-o9xovu8vbk5i35bcgn5qjl4tayj1pappw

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452458246-9kef9cwgwgis7x8t3yncaplk63tckvtpw

I think the bonk replays showcase how even tough mu's like opposing offensive chomp + other overloads is still very playable, just have to get the plays/midgrounds right.

Will probably ladder a bit more with different compositions as the deadline comes closer, but this initial run was fun. The only really bad problem mu was like moldy hearth flame + spike stack, but that felt like a very niche team comp/ladder moment as literally any other fire would be fine to beat as moldy.

 

[Time2Bonk]

IDGCH Horse

Like any other sane person I decided to spend most of my day laddering and building jank, got to around 1500s after a couple ups & downs but so far I'm not really getting to show off chomp too much. Either the lower elo matches go something like this or sinistcha just pops off on its own (cause it's really good right now with it's spinblocking capabilities & getting to roulette wheel with WBB / Fluffy) and I don't have to use anything else. So far though I think my initial cook with Scale Shot + Fire Blast doesn't really work in practice like I'd hoped, most people seem to have a fairy ready to switch in or they simply stay in because vibes or smth and it flops so that's a shame. I tried Tinted Lens like Betticus talked about and while I miss the inital power versus neutral targets like Zapdos & Tusk being able to just nonchalantly click SD and OHKO Gholds and Corvs is really nice. Most of my teams are a little wonky as mentioned earlier but I'll post them anyways and if some bored soul wanna critique them then I'd be happy to listen :)

Like, 2 Replays where chomp actually does something of significance

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452338197-sydgqfuv2a9npq2u70xu482c5nnjxe3pw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452563500-mfprvhqwgl3w4yyjb3gb4djr4098k0tpw

 

[porcupine21]

Sooooo I lied. I’m glad Betti used the utility chomp because when I actually sat down to team build I could not figure out how to fit this guy on a utility slot. This may be due to my limitations as a teambuilder, as I have found myself struggling quite a bit with defensive mons that do not provide pivoting and/or easy options to reposition. I initially tried running Tinted alongside a Deo-S hazard lead and some other stuff but eventually settled on this:

Importable

Corviknight @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Fluffy
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Brave Bird
- U-turn
- Roost
- Defog

Garchomp @ Loaded Dice
Ability: Adaptability
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 24 HP / 176 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Scale Shot
- Earthquake
- Fire Fang
- Swords Dance

Zapdos @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: No Guard
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- U-turn
- Zap Cannon
- Hurricane
- Roost

Zamazenta @ Choice Band
Ability: Sword of Ruin
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Crunch
- Stone Edge
- Heavy Slam

Swampert @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Flip Turn
- Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Mirror Coat

Latios (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Hadron Engine
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Flip Turn
- Luster Purge
- Draco Meteor
- Thunderbolt

Adaptability is just generally strong and while I considered Ruin I feel like Zama is just a better user of that. Unfortunately the team feels like 5 annoying mons+ the occasional Chomp especially when No Guard Zap is just throwing hands(wings?). I’m near 1400s and the 2 wins I did get against higher ranked players are ones where Chomp did not do much of anything.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452165098-2godd7wjcobquqepdxr7djds7p1rk2tpw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452218374


I’m more interested in what others have to say because I feel like there’s something I’m not quite getting when it comes to Chomp but I believe this is a half-decent team that can utilise Chomp decently. Would also love some more inputs on how Chomp can be used as utility!

 

[GlalieGoesBoom]

idgch mattuah



Garchomp @ Leftovers
Ability: Delta Stream
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Scorching Sands
- Dragon Tail / Flamethrower
- Rest
- Spikes

Clearly winning a room tour means that this set must be good

 

[UT]

Anyone have anything to report from this week?

I have been struggling mightily to get non-SD sets to work; Scale Shot / Earthquake / Swords Dance / Filler has been by far my most consistent set.

Hilariously my favorite Filler move has been Technician Bite, which I have clicked once more than Stealth Rock and twice more than Fire Fang.

 

[Betticus IV]

IDGCH Betti

Have to keep the momentum going, while I am only in the 1500s rn, wanted to make an early post as what I am using deviates a bit from what has been proposed/what I have been doing. I already used offensive chomp during seasonal, and found tinted to be an amazing offensive pairing with mons like stail and zarude due to it clearing the pesky steels for them. I think maw is fine, but the damage amp tinted provides in comparison to dmaw for defensive ghold/corv is what sets it above for me. I wanted to use a more utility based chomp instead, so hopefully don't overlap too much with what porcupine wanted to use.


Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Spikes
- Dragon Tail
- Earthquake

Pretty standard chain chomp. I had tried fluffy while building for ssnl, but found it had no longevity even with terrain support, so I decided here I would fully lean into it being the regen mon.



My initial build, I think the ideas are there but the tusk and ghold slots didn't feel right, and I was pretty weak to most physical attackers, needed to make a change.



Much cleaner, and fluffy ghold has great physdef synergy with chomp, as it covers for the chien and zama weakness. AV treads rounds out the spdef and immunity core much better than AV tusk/wbb ghold. Zarude and stail still have very nice synergy with chomp and ghold, so I kept them the same. I also actually thought seed bomb on zarude would be a cool tech for fluffy tusk after seeing it used against me for hamu, but never had the opportunity have it load into the mu.

I really like this build, chomp has great longevity, can survive basically any hit, and punishes all removers while having consistent removal in treads.

replays

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452358817-g5krlglurh1nwtugvv6fw05n4lf9o3epw

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452436001-njciolqd7et34ymcmyv8qsbcqkmvyohpw

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452440743-0ul5rwtx3wxbg489fafu219io13v96npw

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452451886-e37k46mlas1kkunxlbbgtlm3aia169qpw

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452456218-o9xovu8vbk5i35bcgn5qjl4tayj1pappw

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2452458246-9kef9cwgwgis7x8t3yncaplk63tckvtpw

I think the bonk replays showcase how even tough mu's like opposing offensive chomp + other overloads is still very playable, just have to get the plays/midgrounds right.

Will probably ladder a bit more with different compositions as the deadline comes closer, but this initial run was fun. The only really bad problem mu was like moldy hearth flame + spike stack, but that felt like a very niche team comp/ladder moment as literally any other fire would be fine to beat as moldy.

Experimented a bit with spikes mixed adapt sets, but those felt mid asl unless I ran into some fat/stall structures that didn't have a wbb steel bird. Just gets outpaced and kills itself too quickly with life orb most of the time. I decided to try out wise glasses over the usual life orb because I really disliked the residual chip, but it does impact some calcs, especially eq, which is annoying. Due to this I found myself using the above team most of the time.

What I said in the original post mostly stands. Chainchomp structures could be explored more, though they are pretty limited here due to magic bounce not existing (native abils when?), so treads/tusk being basically mandatory makes it tough. Played a bit more with SD tinted, though I didn't make anything new, just the team I used vs Greybaum in ssnl. I think I saw some tinted sets posted in discord that were 3A, but I don't really like those and think the main draw of tinted chomp is it lures corv in pretty hard and forces more interactions with rocks.

Here are some more replays from my laddering, bounced around the top ten the past two weeks, even peaking at 1680, tho 1640 as of now isn't too bad.

Replays

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2453175614-k98opjfgc97gdjsa4bixs0jc7p3iqa5pw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2453205295-yqyimvpx1d6hqnvwuwsxpmcq9d71j7cpw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2454559478-44p5evrj9hepl5ggbundks49j2tbr8dpw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2454617094-ud3ge7tndudhj01jbgk7hik8lvhwl17pw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2454662995-w788lt9w3p4fylg8ac5fdlq939dcca6pw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-2454726025-dfqdci0bv3s1bxl93bjw2xkuoe0svw6pw

 

[UT]

another 3k to Betticus.

This period we're looking at Landorus-I! Famed in standard play for its Sheer Force Life Orb sets that's...not nearly as impressive when everyone and their mother has Sheer Force. It's featured on the VR for a myrid of sets and abilities including Fluffy and Primordial Sea; it has an excellent movepool including U-turn, Nasty Plot, Stealth Rock, Weather Ball, and Taunt; but like, what does it actually do? Do any of these sets really stand out? How does it differentiate itself from Lando-T and even Great Tusk?

Deadline is <t:1761573600:F>, prefix is LAAAN.

 

[matte]

laaan matte

just using standard fluff but i do like random immunes like wbb and how primsea makes it more of a threat
we'll see how it shakes out

 

[Lightniong]

laaan wolf

probably trying out desoland

 

[UT]

matte post some sets or a team or something and you can win this week.

Then we need to figure out a more interesting mon or something I guess...

 

[matte]

this set was just wbb util, max spdef for ghold and hadron moth
- just reused this hands team, lots of pivoting to cycle regen on hands more and tusk is a nice breaker vs ladder (can also be moldbreaker + cb if u want)
laddered a bit this cycle, ladder really favors pons, chomps and random fires which made fluffy pretty bad, i liked wbb because how common these fires where. its taunt util and rocks are very nice and nothing can remove vs u, esp cinderace if ur wbb.

also tested other sets like bulk up fluffy and primsea, both were okay i liked primsea more bc it give him more of an offensive profile but overall i think hes better with a defensive profile (esp all the crazy stuff ladder runs)

 

[The Hisui Region]

Landorus (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Primordial Sea
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Sandsear Storm
- Weather Ball
- U-turn
- Stealth Rock
welcome to landotown usa, population me and UT. while the therian tiger has a viable role as a physical scarfer, often trading a fire weakness for increased defensive utility in the form of fluffy, its genie counterpart is quite the antithesis. boasting a modest (er...timid?) 115 special attack and a humble 101 speed, landorus incarnate is not exactly the picture of a good special attacker. however, with sandsear storm's potent offensive type hitting a large portion of the meta for super effective damage, weather ball acting as a second powerful stab due to psea, access to u-turn and stealth rock to play proactively and generate momentum, and a useful defensive profile (fire immunity from the ability to boot), landorus incarnate proves that even though it's not a tiger, it can still earn its stripes.

team that i put together. pivot move on everything + cleaner is pretty nice eh? cinderace helps with rocks because it's not that easy to click with lando. iron hands is a very strong regen vester that doesnt enjoy facing tusk which lando can switch into and punish well (shoutout great tusk for not running ice move in this meta). meow is a broken ahhhh mon, can threaten random birds and spdef and knock is an excellent progress maker, great guy for lando to pivot into. corv helps with longevity and is also just a crazy glue for any team, great for getting lando and friends in. timid deo cleans after the boys have done their jobs, setup sflo is very scary especially when lando is breaking the steels it struggles with. the team's not a mozart or anything but it performed pretty well on ladder and every teammate has some way of synergising with lando which is pretty cool. anything that can break corv or hands is scary, notably primarina, but ace can live a moonblast and speed control can help offensively check a lot of stuff.

other options:
- desolate land
**** hits steels better, especially those with immunity abilities, but psea can immediately threaten tusk and do damage to wbb corv/skarm, plus a fire immunity is generally more valuable than a water immunity
- aerilate
**** bulk up/sd/plot aerilate (body slam, tera blast) sound cool, on the special side flying doesn't really hit anything but body slam has a few targets like sinistcha, other lando, moltres, tusk, chesnaught, and random levitators. resto chesto might be able to setup on stuff too and sponge status conditions for long enough
- surge surfer
**** could be very threatening with plot
- fluffy
**** obviously good on this mon, but this ability is the most used on both landoruses (landori???) and i wanted to highlight less explored options
- immunity abilities
**** good on almost anything, but they don't compliment lando's offensive prowess as well and just aren't that cool

as anything like sword of ruin or even regenvest would obviously fit better on the tiger, i believe lando-i is much better utilized as an offensive special attacker, especially with scarf. primordial sea is my favorite pick but i think other options have a lot of potential too. however, hastily conducted research is rarely thorough research, and as i conclude my paper, i'm still sure there's more to be explored. til next time folks
laaan thr

 

[Giagantic]

For Landorus-Incarnate I ran mostly regenvest in the following two variants:

Landorus (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 177 SpA / 79 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Earthquake
- Smack Down
- Psychic
- U-turn

This obtains a 2hko on defensive pecharunts with psychic seeing as Earth Eater / Levitate is fairly common. However you really effect it's already low spdef by doing this. Since I don't want to decrease its attack with a negative nature, and evs are already tight enough as is, I decided to go negative speed nature which effects Landoi the least. The other is basically the same set but without the spa investment:

Landorus (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 244 SpD / 12 Spe
Careful Nature
- Earthquake
- Smack Down
- Psychic
- U-turn

This set emphasizes it's limited Spdef as much as it can, the little bit of speed investment just lets it outspeed base 100s that don't invest at all in speed. Minus Spa misses out on 2hko-ing peachrunt with psychic but still 3hko's confidantly and allows Landoi to pressure opposing peacharunts, great tusks, and other super effective threats that may be able to eat eq's.

2 Calcs below:

Hide

0- SpA Landorus Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Pecharunt: 146-174 (38.4 - 45.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
172 SpA Landorus Psychic vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Pecharunt: 190-224 (50 - 58.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Now as for the critic of regenvest Landorus in general, as it mostly applies to T and I since they have the same defensive stats. It is a more offensive regenvester and as a result has trouble tanking really powerful SPA attacks from the likes of Specs Gholdengo with Make it rain and a spdef drop from Shadow Ball is very dangerous for it if it just spams Sballs. The worst weakness however is probably its quad ice weakness and water weakness meaning Zapdos that run Weather Ball can actually 3hko regenvest and Deoxys-speed protean/sflo can use Ice Beam to nuke Lando. What does it handle then you may be thinking, well... it can offensively pressure a lot defensive stuff such as defensive Great tusks, Corv, Peacharunt, etc.. and acts as a physical switch in for some hits as well such as fighting, but as a whole I rate it at best a B- to C+ set. It has a lot of flaws that prevent it being any higher then this, arguably could be rated lower into the C range if you wanna be harsh on it. Sadly its middling spdef really holds it back at the end of the day and getting knocked basically results in you having something that can't take literally any special hits.

 

[UT]

matte won last week by technicality.



Iron hands it a ball of stats with setup, powerful STAB options, pivoting, and useful coverage. It can be a defensive set piece or a wallbreaker. But how do we get the most out of it?

Deadline is <t:1763481600:F>, prefix is IHAAA, let's see some more participation this time plz. Also want to focus in addition to sets, what teams / teammates work well with it, esepcially to beat that fucker Pecharuant.

 

[The Hisui Region]

esepcially to beat that fucker Pecharuant.

 

[UT]

IHAAA Talon

I'm just saying...

Latios (M) @ Terrain Extender
Ability: Hadron Engine
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Flip Turn
- Recover

Iron Hands @ Punching Glove
Ability: Surge Surfer
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Drain Punch
- Earthquake
- Thunder Punch
- Belly Drum