Also lowers quality of the ladder experience as a whole if bots have no volumetric limitations set. Not sure if this is the correct thread, but has the OU council been discussing how ladder bots should be handled if they become more prevelant? beyond the excadrill tier usage situation that happened recently I mean. Because (I don't know if the data supports this, it just feels this way to me) ladder bots have become more salient in general discussions recently.
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Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v4 [ survey results -- see post 21,221 ]
- Thread starter TPP
- Start date
I’ve always said SV OU is gonna be looked back on as one of the weaker meta games. Especially when players are going to have to return to this OU, and there aren’t hundreds of players creating defined meta trends.
Only reason it’s seen as good enough right now is because it’s still current. Let’s just all agree to never keep a generational mechanic for the pure sake and fun factor of it.
What SV OU could have been will always make me a bit sad.
Would have loved to see the natural interactions between the mons- consistent win conditions like Tusk/Val always checking Gambit 1v1, instead of the Dark/Fighting type magically becoming a Fairy and laughing at the idea of a competitive meta where you can map your endgame.
I assume the less players SV has the worse it's going to get. Smaller sample sizes to see what new Tera tech is catching players off guard mean less data to build around. If I was forced to play this meta a few years from now in a tour I would 100% take advantage of this and bring sets that are wildly uncommon to catch players off guard.
There will absolutely be high-level tournament games won by some goofy nonsense- either a Tera set that went out of favor but they brought it back, or something brand new/niche af, but either way just going to leave a sour taste when it happens. It has already happened many times, and it won't get better. This thing will not age well. SV OU is not shelf-stable lmao
Tons of cool new mons, moves, abilities, items lowkey gone to waste. The QoL changes like recovery nerf, no scald spam, and toxic distribution overshadowed by how janky the game is.
Seriously hope everyone had a fun time, but just know there was maybe the best OU meta we've ever could have had buried underneath a meme mechanic.
You can think whatever you want about the tier, but I just want to point out that this has never happened and the opposite is normally the case. Every CG format is put under a microscope by the active playerbase and scrutinized far more than older generations.
You know what, fair enough. In a years time the player base might be looking at SV OU fondly while dealing with whatever mess GF hands us come Gen 10. It very well could become another Gen 8 redemption story, and old posts like mine can be looked upon and mocked. Frankly I probably shouldn't have even made that post cause it really just added nothing, so, sorry. Call it my final vent as a player who was come in and out of SV OU for the past 3 years. I really have given this Generation a fair shake, and after playing various other metagames in between my stents in SV OU I can firmly say "Not for me."
For what its worth I do think you and the Council, past and present, have done a genuinely good job handling this Gen. I'm glad that ya'lls hard work has lead the meta to a state where people are fully enjoying it casually, and competitively. If you want to delete my prior post go for it. I wish you all the best RNG.
Happy Holidays Smogonites, I am here to gift you with 5 of the most absolute heat sets. One of these is freshly baked by me, the rest are from the innovative geniuses in the builder.
Ceruledge @ Life Orb
Ability: Weak Armor
Tera Type: Ghost/Fairy
EVs: 152 HP / 252 Atk / 104 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Bitter Blade
- Poltergeist
- Close Combat/Tera Blast
- Shadow Sneak
It’s times like this where I realize Ceruledge doesn’t need an SD boost to destroy everything in its wake. Everyone who sees Poltergeist during battle will assume its safe to go into Garg, only to eat a fat Close Combat to the face. Tera Ghost LO Ceru still 2-shots a majority of the tier. Throw this with any generic Tusk + Hatt core and you got a goated breaker.
Darkrai @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Bad Dreams
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Dark Pulse
- Tera Blast
- Rest
Idk who was behind this creation, but they conceived the most diabolical Darkrai set known to humanity. Have you ever wanted to rid Darkrai of its weakness to getting chipped over the course of a game by U-Turn, Status. and Salt Cure. Tera Fairy and Resto Chesto solves all those problems. As demonstrated by the late Roaring Moon, Dark/Fairy coverage is amazing, with G-Weez as the only switch-in (loses the 1v1 if Screens are up or if its Strange Steam). Tera Blast also cleanly snipes Gambit/Samu/Slither/Ting/Zama/Tusk without sacrificing a slot for an additional coverage option.
Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 244 HP / 12 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Protect
This is not a new set at all. Its been around since the Gen 5 days, but I am gifting it to y’all anyways because Subtox holds up to this day. If you know what you’re doing, this set is broken vs Offense and any team lacking Gliscor, Tera Steel Lati, or the Steel birbs which the team could easily be built to humble. With the right positioning, Subtox Gliscor can 1v1 nearly every sweeper in the tier. Plus you get to employ the devious strat of PP stalling the opponent. With Tera Dark, you prevent Psychic Noise from fucking you up, and get to 1v1 Hatt via PP stalling Draining Kiss. Pair this with other ambiguous rockers like Tusk, Garg, Clef, or Tran so they never know who’s setting rocks.
Kyurem @ Assault Vest
Ability: Pressure
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Ghost/Steel/Fairy/Poison/Ice
EVs: 56 HP / 176 SpA / 76 SpD / 200 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Freeze-Dry
- Endeavor
AV Kyurem has risen as the trade machine and special tank of BO teams. The 4th slot allows for endless creative expression. Most people run Dragon Tail or Draco, but I was feeling spicy when I decided to revive some good ol’ tech from Setsu , Endeavor Kyurem. I brought this to OUFL. Endeavor means no matter what, Kyurem is always taking something with it. It also means you bait Blissey into being at extremely low HP so something else on Kyurem’s squad can start sweeping the entire Stall team. Fortunately I didn’t need it and I can just spam my Ice and Ground moves.
(EV spread lets Kyurem tank Enam’s Specs boosted Moonblast and outspeed max Speed Pech and Tusk)
Moltres-Galar @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Berserk
Tera Type: Dark/Fairy
EVs: 24 HP / 252 SpA / 232 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Fiery Wrath
- Hurricane
- Agility
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-2499179475-4qmt6ir2xgwak19h9agah8a53mtj6ahpw
After robbing Storm Zone of his ladder points one time while I was celebrating a well-played (and lucky) OUFL game, I am convinced Goltres is secretly the 3rd most braindead mon in the meta. This mon is so fat under screens that getting both a Nasty Plot and Agility boost is not unrealistic. It resists common priority like Sucker Punch and Grassy Glide while packing that crucial Dark/Ghost resistance to keep Specs Pult and Scarf Ghold from 6-0ing Offense. Shoutouts to Vert for inventing Tera Dark Goatres. The premise of this set is that Gambit will always click Iron Head in front of you, so instead you 2-shot with +2 Tera Dark Fiery Wrath while eating Iron Head + Sucker under screens. It also lets you OHKO Raging Bolt, Kyurem, AV Gking, and potentially OHKO Gliscor after a boost. With how spammed screens are rn, I’d be shocked if this somehow becomes OU proper.
Ceruledge @ Life Orb
Ability: Weak Armor
Tera Type: Ghost/Fairy
EVs: 152 HP / 252 Atk / 104 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Bitter Blade
- Poltergeist
- Close Combat/Tera Blast
- Shadow Sneak
It’s times like this where I realize Ceruledge doesn’t need an SD boost to destroy everything in its wake. Everyone who sees Poltergeist during battle will assume its safe to go into Garg, only to eat a fat Close Combat to the face. Tera Ghost LO Ceru still 2-shots a majority of the tier. Throw this with any generic Tusk + Hatt core and you got a goated breaker.
Darkrai @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Bad Dreams
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Dark Pulse
- Tera Blast
- Rest
Idk who was behind this creation, but they conceived the most diabolical Darkrai set known to humanity. Have you ever wanted to rid Darkrai of its weakness to getting chipped over the course of a game by U-Turn, Status. and Salt Cure. Tera Fairy and Resto Chesto solves all those problems. As demonstrated by the late Roaring Moon, Dark/Fairy coverage is amazing, with G-Weez as the only switch-in (loses the 1v1 if Screens are up or if its Strange Steam). Tera Blast also cleanly snipes Gambit/Samu/Slither/Ting/Zama/Tusk without sacrificing a slot for an additional coverage option.
Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 244 HP / 12 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Protect
This is not a new set at all. Its been around since the Gen 5 days, but I am gifting it to y’all anyways because Subtox holds up to this day. If you know what you’re doing, this set is broken vs Offense and any team lacking Gliscor, Tera Steel Lati, or the Steel birbs which the team could easily be built to humble. With the right positioning, Subtox Gliscor can 1v1 nearly every sweeper in the tier. Plus you get to employ the devious strat of PP stalling the opponent. With Tera Dark, you prevent Psychic Noise from fucking you up, and get to 1v1 Hatt via PP stalling Draining Kiss. Pair this with other ambiguous rockers like Tusk, Garg, Clef, or Tran so they never know who’s setting rocks.
Kyurem @ Assault Vest
Ability: Pressure
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Ghost/Steel/Fairy/Poison/Ice
EVs: 56 HP / 176 SpA / 76 SpD / 200 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Freeze-Dry
- Endeavor
AV Kyurem has risen as the trade machine and special tank of BO teams. The 4th slot allows for endless creative expression. Most people run Dragon Tail or Draco, but I was feeling spicy when I decided to revive some good ol’ tech from Setsu , Endeavor Kyurem. I brought this to OUFL. Endeavor means no matter what, Kyurem is always taking something with it. It also means you bait Blissey into being at extremely low HP so something else on Kyurem’s squad can start sweeping the entire Stall team. Fortunately I didn’t need it and I can just spam my Ice and Ground moves.
(EV spread lets Kyurem tank Enam’s Specs boosted Moonblast and outspeed max Speed Pech and Tusk)
Moltres-Galar @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Berserk
Tera Type: Dark/Fairy
EVs: 24 HP / 252 SpA / 232 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Fiery Wrath
- Hurricane
- Agility
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-2499179475-4qmt6ir2xgwak19h9agah8a53mtj6ahpw
After robbing Storm Zone of his ladder points one time while I was celebrating a well-played (and lucky) OUFL game, I am convinced Goltres is secretly the 3rd most braindead mon in the meta. This mon is so fat under screens that getting both a Nasty Plot and Agility boost is not unrealistic. It resists common priority like Sucker Punch and Grassy Glide while packing that crucial Dark/Ghost resistance to keep Specs Pult and Scarf Ghold from 6-0ing Offense. Shoutouts to Vert for inventing Tera Dark Goatres. The premise of this set is that Gambit will always click Iron Head in front of you, so instead you 2-shot with +2 Tera Dark Fiery Wrath while eating Iron Head + Sucker under screens. It also lets you OHKO Raging Bolt, Kyurem, AV Gking, and potentially OHKO Gliscor after a boost. With how spammed screens are rn, I’d be shocked if this somehow becomes OU proper.
When there's an issue in the tier (a Pokémon that's been outstanding aganist the competition and therefore being problematic), or a certain set / move that hasn't a counterplay developed at the moment, there's usually a lot of activity around it. I know that there's also the influence of having both natdex OU and ZA OU active at the momment (as well as the lower tiers / Ubers / LC), which divides the playerbase, but the lack of "complaints" and issues brought up by the playerbase (Ceruledge and Screens are the only two recent things that come to mind) is a sign of the tier actually improving.
Does that mean it's perfect? Of course not, everything can always be better (I have my personal issues with some stuff that I won't talk about in this post) but compared to the start of the year, I think we can all agree that SV OU has greatly improved. I don't know how the gen will be after it stops being CG (I honestly don't care, I always think about the present, that's why I never see arguments when banning / unbanning a Pokémon of "X will be broken, Y combination is gonna break the tier" as valid) but at the momment, we've improved. And that's really nice.
Happy holidays
Does that mean it's perfect? Of course not, everything can always be better (I have my personal issues with some stuff that I won't talk about in this post) but compared to the start of the year, I think we can all agree that SV OU has greatly improved. I don't know how the gen will be after it stops being CG (I honestly don't care, I always think about the present, that's why I never see arguments when banning / unbanning a Pokémon of "X will be broken, Y combination is gonna break the tier" as valid) but at the momment, we've improved. And that's really nice.
Happy holidays
I kind of disagree. We've reached a stagnant point in which offense is overinflated, and people still somehow don't realise Darkrai and friends should be on every team, balance or otherwise.
I've reached my limit with this meta. I will admit, I am just some guy. I don't have qualifications. But I speak as someone who's played for about half a year now, and reached around 1676 (if memory serves) on an alt account. Unfortunately I was too stupid to SC, and my ladder ranking has since fell.
Anyway, HO has far too many tools, IMO. Does that make it broken? Not neccesarily. I agree with the somewhat common sentiment that there aren't any banworthy offensive threats. My take is that there are so many offensive threats that you cannot build a consistent balance/bulky team without having a glaring weakness to something common in the meta. It's unpleasant.
The amount of times I have changed balance teams, only to trade issues with Raging Bolt for Iron Valiant, or Wogerpon, or Iron Def Zam, or one of the 50 Dragonite sets has gotten ad nausiem. And I just don't see a point in engaging competitively when I face HO 7 games in a row, and can only win half of them. I can't think of anything glaringly broken, but clearly something needs to change if we want balance to be the most viable archetype (which makes for a more competitive meta, btw).
As for people complaining about Alo: How are you struggling with Alo? Knock Off, Hazards, Will-O-Wisp, Taunt, WOGERPON! I honest to God have no idea how you could lack an out to Alomamola unless you're building a team without a breaking core.
People mistake what's immediately enjoyable to win with for what's balanced. Balance isn't flashy, but it's consistent and if you have an attention span, is fun.
I've reached my limit with this meta. I will admit, I am just some guy. I don't have qualifications. But I speak as someone who's played for about half a year now, and reached around 1676 (if memory serves) on an alt account. Unfortunately I was too stupid to SC, and my ladder ranking has since fell.
Anyway, HO has far too many tools, IMO. Does that make it broken? Not neccesarily. I agree with the somewhat common sentiment that there aren't any banworthy offensive threats. My take is that there are so many offensive threats that you cannot build a consistent balance/bulky team without having a glaring weakness to something common in the meta. It's unpleasant.
The amount of times I have changed balance teams, only to trade issues with Raging Bolt for Iron Valiant, or Wogerpon, or Iron Def Zam, or one of the 50 Dragonite sets has gotten ad nausiem. And I just don't see a point in engaging competitively when I face HO 7 games in a row, and can only win half of them. I can't think of anything glaringly broken, but clearly something needs to change if we want balance to be the most viable archetype (which makes for a more competitive meta, btw).
As for people complaining about Alo: How are you struggling with Alo? Knock Off, Hazards, Will-O-Wisp, Taunt, WOGERPON! I honest to God have no idea how you could lack an out to Alomamola unless you're building a team without a breaking core.
People mistake what's immediately enjoyable to win with for what's balanced. Balance isn't flashy, but it's consistent and if you have an attention span, is fun.
Yeah, you're right that the tier has improved since the start of the year, and that's mainly 'cause gigathreat Roaring Moon was banned. That thing was so unfair to face and cheap. I believe many players if you ask them whether they view things as glass half-full or glass half-empty, they'd say glass half-empty with their pessimistic approach.
I personally do not enjoy Tera's presence in SV OU, but the OU Council has ensured that there was more tiering action this gen than in any other generation to compensate for Tera greatly increasing the power of set-up sweepers, and that has resulted in there being a more playable meta than at the start of the year. If ABR had been the tier leader for SV OU instead of Finchinator, we'd be getting a very clearly inadequate number of bans much like how Gen 7 OU remained unbalanced at the end of the generation with it being really match-up fishy.
So I thank the SV OU Council for its more proactive approach this generation since it is what the playerbase has needed. Happy holidays, everyone.
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Good Morning, Smogon!
I came up with this Apple spread earlier because I didn't like how much standard Life Orb sets hinder apple's good defensive utility and found this to be a nice midground.
TLDR: It does about everything you expect from Apple and more on both the defensive and offensive sides.
I came up with this Apple spread earlier because I didn't like how much standard Life Orb sets hinder apple's good defensive utility and found this to be a nice midground.
Triffit (Hydrapple) @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 168 Def / 72 SpA / 16 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Fickle Beam
- Leaf Storm
- Earth Power
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 168 Def / 72 SpA / 16 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Fickle Beam
- Leaf Storm
- Earth Power
+2 72+ SpA Life Orb Hydrapple Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 172+ SpD Ceruledge: 354-419 (100 - 118.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Ceruledge Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 181-214 (43.5 - 51.4%) -- 6.6% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Libero Cinderace U-turn vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 168-200 (40.3 - 48%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+2 72+ SpA Life Orb Hydrapple Fickle Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Multiscale Dragonite: 305-360 (94.4 - 111.4%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Dragonite Ice Spinner vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 312-368 (75 - 88.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 72+ SpA Life Orb Hydrapple Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Iron Crown: 286-338 (89 - 105.2%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Iron Treads Ice Spinner vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 248-296 (59.6 - 71.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Iron Valiant Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 156-184 (37.5 - 44.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Supreme Overlord 5 allies fainted Kingambit Kowtow Cleave vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 186-219 (44.7 - 52.6%) -- 21.5% chance to 2HKO
+2 252 Atk Wellspring Mask Ogerpon-Wellspring Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 352-416 (84.6 - 100%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
72+ SpA Life Orb Hydrapple Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Ogerpon-Wellspring: 257-304 (85.3 - 100.9%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Life Orb Ceruledge Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 181-214 (43.5 - 51.4%) -- 6.6% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Libero Cinderace U-turn vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 168-200 (40.3 - 48%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+2 72+ SpA Life Orb Hydrapple Fickle Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Multiscale Dragonite: 305-360 (94.4 - 111.4%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Dragonite Ice Spinner vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 312-368 (75 - 88.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 72+ SpA Life Orb Hydrapple Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Iron Crown: 286-338 (89 - 105.2%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Iron Treads Ice Spinner vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 248-296 (59.6 - 71.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Iron Valiant Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 156-184 (37.5 - 44.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Supreme Overlord 5 allies fainted Kingambit Kowtow Cleave vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 186-219 (44.7 - 52.6%) -- 21.5% chance to 2HKO
+2 252 Atk Wellspring Mask Ogerpon-Wellspring Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hydrapple: 352-416 (84.6 - 100%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
72+ SpA Life Orb Hydrapple Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Ogerpon-Wellspring: 257-304 (85.3 - 100.9%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
Assuming we are in the last few months of SVOU (under the impression that Champions does release mid 2026 around spring-summer) and since the year is closing up, what is everyone’s top 5 and bottom 5 pokemon/sets from this year of SVOU? what do you hope changes going into the next year and eventually next OU metagame?
I’m actually quite curious to see what plans are being made for Smogon to deal with Champions. It’s an entirely separate spinoff game that will operate independently of generations. I do not think (and I would suggest this as the course of action) that Gen 9’s tier closure date on Smogon will be affected by the release of Champions just as it was not affected by the release of PLZA, rather the tier closes once Gen 10 is out just like most people are expecting.
How Champions will be handled will probably be like how VGC is currently handled on Showdown, based on “seasons” instead of Regs (because Champions will most likely operate on a “season” basis based on some leaks that not every gimmick will always be usable in battles).
Wanted to share a couple of teams I used in tours in the last couple of months and that I really liked.
- Tera Blast Fairy SpDef Dragonite + Stone Edge Great Tusk Offense
Built this around the time Storm built a webs team with the same Dragonite set and Head Smash Great Tusk. I really liked the combo but thought Webs were not as needed, and that Taunt on Great Tusk would allow me to keep Corviknight weakened. The combo of Darkrai, Ogerpon-W, and Ceruledge deals with bulkier teams, while Glimmora rounds out the team with entry hazards and removal. I peaked ladder with these 6 though no Dragon resist is very rough; perhaps something like Heatran > Ceruledge could keep the good matchup against Steel-types while being decent into defense.
- Rest Darkrai + Rest Dragonite Screens
I had been spamming the Darkrai set from the previous paste, so figured Tera Blast Fairy would be a fun way to turn the tables on Zamazenta. Rest Darkrai + Dragonite just seemed fun and screens felt an easy way to make it work. Kyurem and Primarina round out the team and handle fat. Calm Mind Primarina straight up 6-0s some structures right now, mainly the Kyurem-Torn-Hatterene ones, so despite the team being rather inconsistent, it just wins on the spot often.
- Fast AV Hoopa-U + Slow Toxic Pecharunt Hazardless BO
This is my favorite team and the best of the 3 in my opinion. I was very comfortable with the latter 4 from a team I had with them and AV Glowking. The lack of pivoting was very rough however, so I wanted to use Pecharunt instead while still having an AV Pokemon that was able to beat fat. Hoopa-U does this while greatly improving the team's matchup against Kyurem, Darkrai, and Latis. Toxic Pecharunt cripples Ting-Lu so Hoopa-U has an easier time against it. Furthermore, a really slow Pecharunt allows it to pivot after ~168-170 Speed Corviknight. If the Corviknight decides to go much slower, it would end up slower than bulky KIngambit, allowing me to well, run bulky Kingambit. Also important to have Low Kick to help against opposing Kingambit. The Atk EVs on Ogerpon-W let it OHKO SpDef Gliscor after Tera Water, while tanking attacks such as LIfe Orb Zamazenta's Close Combat and Choice Specs Dragapult's Draco Meteor. As for bad matchups, SD Gliscor is a bit rough if they burn Tera, but its very playable; you have to be careful against stall since you might over rely on Hoopa-U and have something like Tera Dark Gliscor clicking Toxic against Hoopa-U and winning on the spot. For potential changes I also considered a slower Cinderace, since it makes it easier to pivot against opposing Cinderace and avoids Pecharunt having to eat a Will-O-Wisp.
Hope you find them fun!
- Tera Blast Fairy SpDef Dragonite + Stone Edge Great Tusk OffenseBuilt this around the time Storm built a webs team with the same Dragonite set and Head Smash Great Tusk. I really liked the combo but thought Webs were not as needed, and that Taunt on Great Tusk would allow me to keep Corviknight weakened. The combo of Darkrai, Ogerpon-W, and Ceruledge deals with bulkier teams, while Glimmora rounds out the team with entry hazards and removal. I peaked ladder with these 6 though no Dragon resist is very rough; perhaps something like Heatran > Ceruledge could keep the good matchup against Steel-types while being decent into defense.
- Rest Darkrai + Rest Dragonite ScreensI had been spamming the Darkrai set from the previous paste, so figured Tera Blast Fairy would be a fun way to turn the tables on Zamazenta. Rest Darkrai + Dragonite just seemed fun and screens felt an easy way to make it work. Kyurem and Primarina round out the team and handle fat. Calm Mind Primarina straight up 6-0s some structures right now, mainly the Kyurem-Torn-Hatterene ones, so despite the team being rather inconsistent, it just wins on the spot often.
- Fast AV Hoopa-U + Slow Toxic Pecharunt Hazardless BOThis is my favorite team and the best of the 3 in my opinion. I was very comfortable with the latter 4 from a team I had with them and AV Glowking. The lack of pivoting was very rough however, so I wanted to use Pecharunt instead while still having an AV Pokemon that was able to beat fat. Hoopa-U does this while greatly improving the team's matchup against Kyurem, Darkrai, and Latis. Toxic Pecharunt cripples Ting-Lu so Hoopa-U has an easier time against it. Furthermore, a really slow Pecharunt allows it to pivot after ~168-170 Speed Corviknight. If the Corviknight decides to go much slower, it would end up slower than bulky KIngambit, allowing me to well, run bulky Kingambit. Also important to have Low Kick to help against opposing Kingambit. The Atk EVs on Ogerpon-W let it OHKO SpDef Gliscor after Tera Water, while tanking attacks such as LIfe Orb Zamazenta's Close Combat and Choice Specs Dragapult's Draco Meteor. As for bad matchups, SD Gliscor is a bit rough if they burn Tera, but its very playable; you have to be careful against stall since you might over rely on Hoopa-U and have something like Tera Dark Gliscor clicking Toxic against Hoopa-U and winning on the spot. For potential changes I also considered a slower Cinderace, since it makes it easier to pivot against opposing Cinderace and avoids Pecharunt having to eat a Will-O-Wisp.
Hope you find them fun!
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I honestly think that terastalization is keeping the meta from being actually balanced. It brings a lot more harm that good, and it wasn't thought for closed sheets meta, nor a singles format.
For every cool Yanmega set, or band / scarf cool surprise with Landorus, you have 20 kingambits, Dnites and the mickey mouse sweeper trending at that momment.
But they've decided to keep at least until SV stops being CG, so there's, unfortunetly, no point in discussing it. I respect their decission of course.
Despite this, we're lucky that the tier leaders are being really active this gen. If the council wasn't the one we had this gen, I'm sure SV OU would be dead at this point.
Honestly this is the end all be all. Tera is really cool on underrated mons (Garg is going right to NU once it goes), but for every single cool mon there's a Roaring Moon or Gambit that gets to utterly warp matches by selecting its checks or answers. Its unfortunate, tera as a concept is cool, but the mons that abuse it really do a lot of weight lifting for why some mons need their weaknesses clearly kept
I understand having gripes with Tera, but this is an awful take. Garganacl would in no way go to NU if Tera were gone and would be UU at worst with Tera banned. In some OU matches, Garg doesn't even need to Tera since it checks stuff such as Dragapult, Zapdos, Moltres, Kyurem, Pecharunt, Iron Moth, and Ceruledge. Salt Cure is just a very good move even if there is counterplay to it, and Purifying Salt is one of the best defensive Abilities in the game.
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Happy New Year, OU! Thanks to everyone for playing and commenting this year. Excited for the last months of SV and the hopeful drop of Gen ten later in 2026.
Is the Solgaleo ladder dropping tomorrow? Still can't believe we reached the goal!
No clue, I have nothing to do with that ladder or the accompanying rollout/discussion. Sorry
we're getting our own discussion thread for this, so i'm told, so let's keep mentions of it to there so the mods don't have to spend their holiday season deleting posts
Garg is good in nduu without needing Tera and still has viability even in ou. More limited obviously and has to be built around more consciously but this is a gross over exaggeration of how much it depends on Tera. It would imply it’s outright terrible without it, but garg is fundamentally a much not well rounded Pokémon by itself and agi brings a lot of good traits for teams. Hell it performs in ou games now without always using Tera. And Salt Cure is a busted move
And speaking of Garg
Garganacl @ Leftovers
Level: 100
Careful Nature
Tera Type: Water
Ability: Purifying Salt
EVs: 252 HP / 52 Def / 204 SpD
- Salt Cure
- Protect
- Recover
- Curse
Still my favorite set of this mon. It’s surprisingly flexible on a turn to turn basis despite having only one move and alongside hazards is pretty good at forcing lots of progress, potentially doubling as a wincon late game.
there are even some limited scenarios where lack of tera helps garg. ever had a game where you've needed to tera a very important water-type or steel-type to preserve it better long-term against salt cure?
I feel like I should clarify for the sake of my own character, but I was exaggerating more than being serious. I fucking LOVE Garg and use it a lot when applicable, so I was more poking fun that rock type is a suffering existence. Ain't nothing is going to reduce the fact that Salt Cure being clicked is a pure dopamine button. (I should start using more tone indicators since I was being very much in jest LOL.)
Happy New Year, everyone. I hope Roaring Moon was not the last tiering action of the generation as SV OU could still use some improvement, and the competitiveness score of SV OU in October tracked lower than what was the high-water mark of SS OU. There is still at least one thing that could improve the tier overall if the playerbase can eventually agree to what that is instead of be split on what individual groups of players believe is a problem.
That is not to say the OU Council has done a bad job this generation as under any previous OU Council SV OU would be dead as Achohermano put it since the pace of tiering action would be nowhere near enough to deal with the unprecedented number of broken threats this generation had whether they were broken with out without Tera. Let's hope that as the dust settles, the community can agree on at least one final thing before Gen 10 comes in November.
That is not to say the OU Council has done a bad job this generation as under any previous OU Council SV OU would be dead as Achohermano put it since the pace of tiering action would be nowhere near enough to deal with the unprecedented number of broken threats this generation had whether they were broken with out without Tera. Let's hope that as the dust settles, the community can agree on at least one final thing before Gen 10 comes in November.