This has brought me a 9/10 win rate on Shoddy...

Cerulean21

Cerulean21

This is my new Wifi Team, which I have been testing on Shoddy and working on for the last week. It has a pretty high win rate (9/10) and works really well. Well, here it is

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Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Impish
252HP, 240 Def, 16 SpDef
Ability: Sand Stream
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
- Slack Off

I absolutely love Hippowdon. He's just so hard to kill and Slack Off really helps his durability. He's my lead, and a great one too. First turn Stealth Rock if Hippo can afford it (read: The opponent has no Special Attack that's super effective on him). Earthquake is for STAB and has very good type coverage alongside Ice Fang. The latter is a necessity for countering the physical Dragons (I will later come to SpecsMence, whose popularity seems to have severely decreased recently as within the last week, I've been facing only about two of them). Hippo is my primary physical Wall and works nicely alongside Milotic as he covers her electric weakness (and Grass is far less common). Due to his high HP, he can survive weaker Special Attacks that don't deal SE damage to him, which can be quite useful from time to time. The only thing that truly bothers the big Hippo are Toxic Spikes, since I don't have a Spinner on this Team. Sand Stream also negates Focus Sash Strategies.

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Hariyama @ Leftovers
Impish
244HP, 12 Atk, 252 Def
Ability: Thick Fat
- Close Combat
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off / Rest
- Whirlwind / Sleep Talk

Well the fat Sumo is there to counter a few specific threats, namely Tyranitar and Weavile. Hariyama can switch into anything the big Dino or the speedy Weasel have to offer and force them out or OHKO with Close Combat. He's also my main answer to Blissey (and to a lesser extend Cresselia) who will fear losing their Leftovers and thus being more vulnerable to the Sand Storm. He actually also works well together with Celebi, as due to Thick Fat and his typing, Hariyama resists Fire, Ice, Bug and Dark, which Celebi is weak to. Whirlwind is for PHazing support, though I'm considering RestTalk for even more durability.

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Garchomp @ Life Orb
Jolly
4HP, 252 Atk, 252 Spd
Ability: Sand Veil
- Swords Dance
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Fire Fang

Awesome Sweeper. He only got a maximum of ten turns to Attack, but usually takes out half of the opposing Team. After a single Swords Dance, he causes massive damage even to Skarmory and Bronzong with Fire Fang. Sand Veil helps to set up, though it's pretty risky. He does not have as many resistances as his fellow Dragons due to an inferior (defencive) typing, but he has the Speed that Dragonite dearly misses (and I miss Dragonite, but hey, this is an acceptable substitute).

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Milotic @ Leftovers
Calm
252HP, 24 Def, 232 SpDef
Ability: Marvel Scale
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Recover
- Hypnosis

You can say what you want about Milotic, but she really makes a decent special Wall, even against attacks that she's weak to. She can switch in on SpecsMence Draco Meteor without risking death next turn and threaten with Ice Beam, though I usually go for Hypnosis on the switch. I used to have Mirror Coat in that spot, mainly for Starmie and Cresselia (as this uses the Charge Beam boost of the latter against her), though Hypnosis definitely has it's uses. The free turn gained from a successful Hypnosis usually lets Milotic recover her HP and Attack or Switch to a counter to whatever is in there or whatever comes in. Milotic may not have 714 HP and natural Cure, but she has a good typing that brings her some useful resistances, namely to fire and Ice, and she has Hypnosis to incapacitate her opponents.

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Jirachi @ Leftovers
Impish
252HP, 220 Def, 36 Spd
Ability: Serene Grace
- Wish
- Zen Headbutt
- U-Turn
- Reflect

Wish Passer and Team supporter. Once Reflect is up, Jirachi can take quite a bunch of hits, which allows him to set up Wish and U-turn to the one who needs healing (should Garchomp have survived his rampage through the opposing team (which is rare), he's usually a good candidate, same goes for Hariyama, or Milotic if she has to switch on on something slightly problematic). Jirachi also brings in a few useful resistances like Dragon and counters some Pokemon like non-T-Wave Blissey (Zen Headbutts Serene Grace Flinch abuse) and Gengar (who falls to affromentioned move)

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Celebi @ Leftovers
Relaxed
252HP, 180 Def, 76 SpDef
Ability: Natural Cure
- Heal Bell
- Grass Knot
- Leech Seed
- Recover

Cleric and Gyarados Counter mainly (and a very good one too). Leech Seed helps him recover during Sand Storm, however, I'm considering Psychic, since this is completely walled by Grassers (and Gengar). Grass Knot hurts Gyarados (2HKO after Stealth Rock) and other hevier Waters like Swampert and Milotic.

So.... That's it. This Team actually works pretty well even though it heavily relies on switching hand has no Spin support (probably because 4/6 resist Stealth Rock).
 
Yeah, about that no spinner thing... I would say it's OK on this team, but Toxic Spikes basically means you lose :(

Celebi, a pokemon who is supposed to attempt to "stall" really doesn't like poison. Usually you can just switch out of it, but when there is toxic EVERY time you come in, it spells trouble. Same with Garchomp, Hippowdon, and maybe Milotic.
 
Yeah, that's true. Celebi has Heal Bell, which can ease some of the pain, but Toxic Spikes are big trouble. Luckily, they are not that common :)
 
I suppose if Toxic spikes does prove to be a big problem you could try switching Milotic for Vaporeon with a similar EV spread, and letting that do the Wishing whilst switching Jirachi for Forretress which can Rapid spin as well as still setting up Reflect for your team.
You do lose U-turn though, but like I said its only a contingency plan for if Toxic spikes proves to be a problem...
 
jigokujin73 said:
Guts would go well with Sleep Talk on Hariyama.
Click to expand...

Although Guts+Sleep Talk may be tempting, it is overall better to go with Thick Fat because it prevents Weavile from getting past you if it is the SD/Focus Sash variant. Anyway, the extra resistances included with Thick Fat is why it is better to use than Machamp for this purpose. Specs Heatran will OHKO all the time if Hariyama doesn't have Thick Fat- Scarf Heatran soundly 2HKO's.

You may want to consider Substitute on Garchomp. Substitute will prevent status on your only sweeper, and while Celebi may be able to heal the status immediately with Heal Bell, Celebi won't like switching in on several Ice Beams.

Milotic is naturally weak on the physically defensive side. I would suggest Rest/Sleep Talk over Recover/Hypnosis for the added defense boost. A Milotic without defense ev's is like a Blissey without 252 defense ev's. This also allows you to absorb sleep comfortably in case you don't decide to run Rest/Sleep Talk on Hariyama. It also allows your only true special wall withstand Toxic Spikes. Milotic also needs more special attack ev's- at least use 28 ev's as it will guarantee a OHKO on Salamence iirc.

I think you mean Bold Nature on Celebi- I don't think being outsped by Max speed Adamant Tyranitar and just about any Gyarados is something to be proud of. Leech Seed and Recover is slightly redundant- choose one and put Psychic over the other one. Psychic really is useful on Celebi for reliable damage. Another alternative is to use Thunder Wave to spread around paraylsis. With Thunder Wave, Grass Knot isn't needed as much, and potentially Psychic could be used instead.


Sorry I made a wall of text, but I hope that it was helpful.
 
I believe you have nearly everything covered in this team apart from the uncommon Togekiss. Nasty Plot variants will OHKO Celebi and Hariyama, while the remaining team members are respectively 2HKOed all of which whoare not able to OHKO in return. Roost, Nasty Plot, Aura Sphere and Air Slash is your biggest worry. Although you are able to bring forth Milotic in order to use Hypnosis, but this argument is assuming that you have already slept one of their Pokemon.

Another similar Pokemon in terms of "usage" or "popularity" that seems to pose an immediate threat is Azelf. Yet again, Nasty Plot providing the boost in special attack to start tearing away your team. Flamethrower, Thunderbolt and Psychic after a Nasty Plot (and Life Orb) - Will OHKO your team depending on the attack it uses.

Finally, your Lucario "counter" or switch in is no where to be seen. Lucario is a tough Pokemon to account for when everything in this particular team is OHKOed by the combination of its popular set: Swords Dance, Close Combat and Crunch (with Life Orb). Your only way around: bring in Garchomp and take 70% from the priority move, Extremespeed. But what if the opponent decides to keep hos Lucario for later? You're then forced to bring in Garchomp again (who may take a Close Combat this time around) which would then signal the end for your team's run.

I would consider replacing Hariyama to aid the Azelf, Lucario and Togekiss difficulties. Alot of people here are forgetting that Jirachi is a reliable Weavile counter in some respect - all apart from Night Slash that gets that timed critical hit. All Tyranitar are countered by Hippowdon apart from Ice Beam variants - which we would consider to be "Boah". With its set: Substitute, Focus Punch, Ice Beam and Crunch / Dark Pulse. Jirachi has the defensive capabilities to avoid defeat to a similar set. Dragon Dance, Choice Band and all other Tyranitar are respectively countered by Hippowdon.

What to replace it for?

Well we have to remedy Azelf, Togekiss and Lucario on one swing. I can say with confidence that it's impossible to do so. But one Pokemon does spring to mind that can counter both Togekiss and Azelf well. It's actually a fantastic Pokemon in conjunction with Celebi which combination is well-known as CeleTran. Yes, you got it...Heatran!

Now Heatran brings a whole new purspective to the table. He has the amazing ability to use Rest and Sleep Talk with an EV spread that focuses on special defense. Which when paired with Celebi, is an almost clear-cut Blissey replacement in which both do a fantastic job in covering most special threats out there. This will also help you with Mismagnuis' Calm Mind and Substitute setting up set. Here's the Heatran set:

Heatran (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP/90 SAtk/168 SDef
Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Now you have a reliable Azelf and Togekiss counter, aswell as a Pokemon who also can stop Weavile in its tracks - who can't OHKO with Life Orb Brick Break and is OHKOed in return with Lava Plume.


Before I get off there is something I would like to mention...Toxic Spikes can really cause you some havoc. Milotic, Hippowdon, Garchomp and Celebi are effected by this (assuming you do go with my change). Celebi does indeed have Natural Cure, but it has to deal with poison when it switches in every time which would basically nulify what Natural Cure actually did when healing Celebi.
 
Wow. I'm really looking into that Heatran Thing. It seems like a pretty good idea to me, even though I loose a reliable Blissey counter. I'll test that on Shoddy to see how it works.

@ DFA: I'll change those EVs you suggested for Hippo. Seems like it could make quite a difference.

@ Kingdrom: Whilst SleepTalk may be tempting to activate Marvel Scale, it doesn't really work for a Special Walling Milotic. She's supposed to take Special Hits, so the Defence boost is not that important, however, Hypnoses is very important, as with that, she can take on Threads which she normally couldn't
 
I wouldn't ever consider to find a Blissey "counter" and add it to the team. It's not going to do anything that's worth worrying about and you have Celebi who can switch in freely against her. I know a team is bad when it's contributed to "special attacking" and you have quite alot of offense but no way to get around Blissey (which would need solving) - but your team has many ways to handle Blissey without it being a "threat" to your team.

Now I know I left the Lucario weakness unattended to but I feel that Thunder Wave on Celebi would be crucial in your attempt to OHKO it back with Hippowdon, (just incase Garchomp has fallen).
 
Yeah you're probably right. I guess it's just because I usually build Stall Teams, and Blissey is just always a real pain in the ass for me. Yeah, Lucario could be trouble.... Especially SpecsVariants
 
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