Venomoth in OU?

notorious

Sorry for the lame title couldent think of anything but venomoth is here.

The main point of the team is to use venomoth and jolteon to pass subs to duggy to trap and kill or gyrados to set up.

I've been using this team on shoddy and had some good success at the begining but now its been sorta crappy. So I figured you guys could help me out, so here it is.


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Venomoth
Shield Dust
Leftovers
Jolly
252hp/252speed/6spdef
-Baton Pass
-Toxic spikes
-Substitute
-Sleep Powder

This is my lead and is actually a very good one. I sleep what im faster then, which is actually alot. Then I sub and set toxic spikes. If opponent switches out I baton pass to a counter. Beats the very common lead of bronzong by subbing on first turn. Really works well with my duggy and gyrados. I need help on evs and nature for this poke since its not very standard.
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Dugtrio
Arena Trap
Choice Band
Jolly
6hp/252att/252spe
-Sucker Punch
-Earthquake
-Stone Edge
-Aerial Ace

Pretty standard, revenge kills lots such as Deoxys S. This so far has worked great espically with venomoth and jolteon since it can recieve the subs and trap and kill. Only thing I was wondering about is if its worth putting a life orb on or if I should stick with choice band.
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Garchomp
Sand Veil
Choice Scarf
Lonely
252atta/252spe/6spdef
-Outrage
-Fire Blast
-Earthquake
-Crunch

This thing works wonders and is way better then my old chain chomp(even though no one expected it). It beats the chomps everyone is currently using and revenges alot.
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Jolteon
Volt Absorb
Leftovers
Timid
6hp/252spe/252spatt
-Baton Pass
-Substitute
-Thunderbolt
-Hidden Power Ice

Works great with Duggy for passing subs to, and beats up alot. Pretty standard set and works good with my team I believe there is nothing wrong with this set.
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Gyrados
Intimidate
Leftovers
Adamant
216hp/16att/176def/102spe
-Taunt
-Earthquake
-Dragon Dance
-Waterfall

Well everyone and there dog uses this poke and this exact moveset, so I'm going to conform and use it too. Matty suggested using gyra on my team and to tell you the truth its been working wonders. It's the standard bulky set, which works great with my baton passing subs.
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Porygon 2
Trace
Leftovers
Modest
252hp/96def/64spatt/98spdef
-Discharge
-Ice Beam
-Recover
-Hidden Power Ground

I love this thing, it counters so much. Gyrados, Heatran, and Vaporeon to name a few. I use Hidden Power ground for magneton and heatran, not many pokemon use status moves against this so thats why no magic coat. I'm not so sure about the ev spread on this one either since I'm pretty sure I didn't look it up.




Ok, moving on, to go with the theme of passing subs to trap and kill maybe i should put magnezone on this team. That though would give me another ground weakness to go with jolteons. The members of the team i would like to keep are Venomoth, Duggy, P2, and Jolteon. If they need to be changed though suggest it. I also feel I need help on some of the ev spreads.


I would like to make this a wifi team in the future but dont want to get the wrong moveset, evs, and what not.

Well thanks for you time and help. Hope this is a little bit of a non standard team.


Edit: Put pictures in for flare
Edit2: Got rid of mamo and put in bulky gyra.
 
I can't really give much feedback here, but for Venomoth to really work in OU, you'll need much more speed, since it doesn't out-speed any OU starter. (Well, I don't think any)

I'd go with more speed EVs, or at least Choice Scarf or Specs. Probably Scarf, for that speed.
 
Thanks for the input.

Well putting more speed in it is an option but choice scarf would really ruin the set since its meant to do more then just one move and switch out. Its meant to pass subs to duggy and friends.
 
thetorsoboy said:
since it doesn't out-speed any OU starter.
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Venomoth has a higher base speed than (obviously) Bronzong, who has become the most widely-used starter, as well as Gyarados.

However, Venomoth seems like it would be prone to getting KO'd in one hit, so it's risky to play especially considering Sleep Powder only works 75% of the time. Leftovers seems like a bad item pick for it, though I admit I have a hard time coming up with a better one (Maybe Life Orb, Lum Berry or even Focus Sash?)
 
Jigglypuff said:
Venomoth has a higher base speed than (obviously) Bronzong, who has become the most widely-used starter, as well as Gyarados.
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Yep which most the time my venomoth will put to sleep even with lum berry because I will use sub and he will use hypnosis. Other leads that it is also faster then is hippowdon, tyrantar, and abomasnow off the top of my head. Also if its a faster sleeper I just switch to my mamo to absorb it.
 
both base 90, +speed 252 would tie roserade leads.
then it would be a toss-up who would go first.

EXCEPT HP FIRE VARIANTS. Those roserades would have 1 LESS SPEED.
IIRC most roserades run HP fire for coverage and steel types.
 
Regarding Chomp, Fire Blast is usually better unless you have Swords Dance. As you are using Scarf, you should probably run FB and a Lonely Nature.
 
Jigglypuff said:
Venomoth has a higher base speed than (obviously) Bronzong, who has become the most widely-used starter, as well as Gyarados.

However, Venomoth seems like it would be prone to getting KO'd in one hit, so it's risky to play especially considering Sleep Powder only works 75% of the time. Leftovers seems like a bad item pick for it, though I admit I have a hard time coming up with a better one (Maybe Life Orb, Lum Berry or even Focus Sash?)
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Well life orb would not be a good item considiring that it has no attacks. The other two might work but the ev set I was running almost never got KO'd in one hit so focus sash would not work well. Lum berry seems the better of the two suggestions. Maybe wide lens instead for better chances of sleep.

Archer said:
Regarding Chomp, Fire Blast is usually better unless you have Swords Dance. As you are using Scarf, you should probably run FB and a Lonely Nature.
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Thanks didn't think of that I shouldve but didnt lol.

Thanks for the suggestions guys and I changed the evs on venomoth i'll have to see if it works better then the bulky set though.
 
I like the Wide Lens idea. Maybe instead of Toxic Spikes (Since you'll be scared of Heracross and its ilk), you can take more advantage of it with Stun Spore or Toxic (more preferably the former as it's harder to manage while paralyzed than poisoned).

I think Life Orb could be worth a try on Dugtrio, though I haven't tried it myself.
 
Well, I'm using a Timid 'Moth with 216 Speed EVs, and a lot of HP. It's a bulky set, with Roost, Toxic Spikes, Bug Buzz, and Sleep Powder.

It's nice.
 
doppio said:
I like the Wide Lens idea. Maybe instead of Toxic Spikes (Since you'll be scared of Heracross and its ilk), you can take more advantage of it with Stun Spore or Toxic (more preferably the former as it's harder to manage while paralyzed than poisoned).

I think Life Orb could be worth a try on Dugtrio, though I haven't tried it myself.
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Double powder would be cool but most the time toxic spikes have been very succesful. I've actually never had a hera problem, the toxic spikes usually wear it down and venomoth can switch in on close combats like a champ.

I also havent seen to many hera's anyways. I would though like to try double powder out sometime.

I also im really thinking of switching to life orb for duggy but I think then alot of stuff i would ohko now become 2hko's. Im not sure about that though.

thetorsoboy said:
Well, I'm using a Timid 'Moth with 216 Speed EVs, and a lot of HP. It's a bulky set, with Roost, Toxic Spikes, Bug Buzz, and Sleep Powder.

It's nice.
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I really like that set but it wouldent really work well on my team, i also dont think bug buzz would be doing alot of damage in OU im not positive about that though. Im sure your set though is for UU anyways.

Im going to assume thats with leftovers right?

I ran a similar set with psychic/roost/sleep powder/utrun(not sure if those are the exact moves though) and as far as i recall it only did somewhere around 20% to hera. So venomoth isent going to be really dishing out the damage in OU. Thats why I have no attacking move. Which could cost me if its my last poke, even with an attack though it probly would get beat.

Though your set would be really good in UU, so I might try it out there. Thanks for pointing out that set.

Watch out for Reversal Lucario it can destroy your team after Dugtrio goes down.
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Well I have got beaten by one before and for some odd reason Im thinking it was you who beat me with it lol. I know i've versured you once before.

Im not to worried about reversal lucario though since there quite rare.
 
notorious said:
Double powder would be cool but most the time toxic spikes have been very succesful. I've actually never had a hera problem, the toxic spikes usually wear it down and venomoth can switch in on close combats like a champ.

I also havent seen to many hera's anyways. I would though like to try double powder out sometime.

I also im really thinking of switching to life orb for duggy but I think then alot of stuff i would ohko now become 2hko's. Im not sure about that though.
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Yeah. If it is just one move Wide Lens is helping with accuracy, it is generally thought of as a waste. I think Venomoth needs to hang on to all the HP it can, so Leftovers is best along with Toxic Spikes IMO.

I did notice that you had Dugtrio in case that issue ever arose, and it handles all Heras except the Scarfed ones. Using Life Orb, it seems like Spikes and Stealth Rock would help it vastly in that regard. Toxic Spikes may already do the trick for a decent number of Pokemon. Just make sure their confirmed spinner is taken care of, lol.

Ordinarily I would mention Petaya for Jolteon, but seeing as you've got one other Pokemon that uses special attacks, that's fine. (But maybe Bright Powder so you have a better chance of getting a sub to another pogey, lol, jk mostly.)
 
doppio said:
Yeah. If it is just one move Wide Lens is helping with accuracy, it is generally thought of as a waste. I think Venomoth needs to hang on to all the HP it can, so Leftovers is best along with Toxic Spikes IMO.
You saying that convinced me to stick with Leftovers I definatly will try double powder in the future though.

I did notice that you had Dugtrio in case that issue ever arose, and it handles all Heras except the Scarfed ones. Using Life Orb, it seems like Spikes and Stealth Rock would help it vastly in that regard. Toxic Spikes may already do the trick for a decent number of Pokemon. Just make sure their confirmed spinner is taken care of, lol.
Most spinners I can take care of and then reset the spikes so its all good.

Ordinarily I would mention Petaya for Jolteon, but seeing as you've got one other Pokemon that uses special attacks, that's fine. (But maybe Bright Powder so you have a better chance of getting a sub to another pogey, lol, jk mostly.)
Bright powder is lots of fun if you like pissing people off lol, which I do.
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Ok still need some help here.
 
matty said:
Venomoth leads usually do well if the are Sashed. I'd recommend that.

The other thing is if you are passing Subs, get something that can set up behind a sub like a Gyara or Lucario. If you manage to pass a sub from a jolteon while they say EQ you and you pass it to a Gyara, then you are getting basically atleast one maybe 2 free DDs. With that, you are going to sweep teams. Just a thought :)
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Sash wont work for this set but your secound point is very good. I usually just pass subs to duggy to trap and kill depending on the poke but the setting up is a better idea. Who should I get rid of though? I'm thinking mamo but losing ice shard is not very good.


Edit: Thanks Matty for the suggestion. Gyrados has been working wonders on my team. Replaced mamo with it.
 
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