Why is Fletcher picked over Giggs and Hargreaves? He doesn't really deserve a starting line-up imo, especially after the performance against Chelsea. Tevez should also be in the line-up to give Rooney and Berbatov more support options.
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The Soccer thread
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Fletcher is never picked "over" Giggs at all, Giggs will only ever play support striker or left wing. Fletcher is usually right-central midfield or right wing, sometimes right-back. At the moment it's a coin toss with Fletcher and Hargreaves IMO, Fletcher has played more and has more match fitness and has managed to become our top scorer in the opening games, so I see no reason for him to be left out. I would agree that Hargreaves is in general, the better player, but form wise, fitness wise and goal wise, Fletcher is currently better so I see no reason why Hargreaves should instantly be chosen over him. Though if Fletcher does start, I'm expecting him to be subbed off eventually, for Hargreaves or Anderson depending on which team Sir Alex chooses.
I really don't think we should go with Berbatov, Rooney and Tévez right away again, since it didn't really work against Liverpool. I'd prefer Rooney or Tévez with Berbatov,. Though I'd love to see something like:
----------- Hargreaves ---------
Ronaldo - Tévez --- Rooney -Nani
-------------- Berbatov --------
Just to go absolutely crazy and try to overwhelm a team.
I really don't think we should go with Berbatov, Rooney and Tévez right away again, since it didn't really work against Liverpool. I'd prefer Rooney or Tévez with Berbatov,. Though I'd love to see something like:
----------- Hargreaves ---------
Ronaldo - Tévez --- Rooney -Nani
-------------- Berbatov --------
Just to go absolutely crazy and try to overwhelm a team.
Good game for Liverpool, but what the fuck was going on with the ManU game? Was the ref on drugs or what? The ref missed like 15 decisions in Bolton's favor and the penalty was NOT a penalty. I don't really care about Bolton but I feel bad for them because they played really well. :/
edit - okay rooney scored too but ehh
edit 2 - bolton suck. never mind.
edit 3 - the referee is making me rofl hahahahahah.
edit - okay rooney scored too but ehh
edit 2 - bolton suck. never mind.
edit 3 - the referee is making me rofl hahahahahah.
That is such a poor game for ManU. They have 80% possesion in the whole game, have like 30 shots for goal and still fails to put up a more respectable scoreline. They have a dominating midfield, but the forwards lack flair and just don't seem to be able to get the final touch right.
On the other hand, credits to Bolton for putting up a solid defensive display.
On the other hand, credits to Bolton for putting up a solid defensive display.
Hopefully we can continue to win the following games to come, since we now seem to be improving match-by-match. I'll admit that we lack that end-product. I sometimes feel our forwards, like Tevez and Ronaldo for example, are individuals who love to dribble the ball too often, and only pass when they are in desperate situations. It gets frustrating to see the final-third of the pitch being used so often by our offense, but with no finishing touch.
Are you sure you are not describing Liverpool? :(
They have done until this game, to be honest. Rooney has been non-existant, so to speak. The same applies for Berbatov. Ronaldo's played two matches in the EPL this season. Tevez has no end-product, as many fans have established. But today, some performences, particulary Rooney, and I suppose Berbatov's contribution to getting stuck in, have improved.
That's also what the commentators had to say, and I wholeheartedly agree. Well, of course Rooney, and considerably Ronaldo don't necessarily fit into that list of players, but I did say 'end-product' and not 'flair'.
I'm pleased for Rooney and I hope he can utilize this form consistantly with goals, instead of scoring far less than what we expect from him.
Ronaldo may have made some convincing runs, but most were unsuccessful to even trouble the defense. I was embarrassed for him after his petulant display on the penalty appeal. Apart from the penalty, I wouldn't merit Ronaldo's performence in this game at all. Regardless, the penalty was taken well.
Tevez, as usual, keeps possession of the ball but could not deliver much; Bolton's keeper should have kept Tevez's shot outside of the box in his hands, but failed to do so, and as a result it made the shot look more of a threat. I am greatful for his contribution to the team, but there is certainly no end-product within his game so far.
He said they lack flair, not end product, and the lack of end product will improve in coming games
It's impossible to judge attacking players at Anfield and Stamford Bridge cos they won't see much of the ball. We are still finding the right combination and both Ronaldo and Rooney have been short of match practice in the build up to the season.
It's impossible to judge attacking players at Anfield and Stamford Bridge cos they won't see much of the ball. We are still finding the right combination and both Ronaldo and Rooney have been short of match practice in the build up to the season.
Here's one of the things I have a bit of an issue with. We all think that Rooney is a striker, but I'm not so sure. We already know he plays better with another striker in front of him, I.e. Saha/Ruud. Thing is, he runs around so much and puts in so much effort, I personally think he's a midfielder being played as a striker. Compare him, albeit in certain ways specifically, to other midfielders such as Keane and Scholes. He runs around as much as Keane with the same effort, but he scores goals and makes assists like Scholes. I can only imagine a formation like this:
------------VDS
Brown - Rio - Vidic - Evra
--------Hargreaves
Ronaldo - Rooney - Giggs/Nani/Park
----Berbatov - Manucho/Tevez
Hargreaves holding right in front of the back four, with Rooney feeding balls around the pitch to Ronaldo, Berbatov, Manucho, Tevez, or the left wing. Each year since Rooney has joined, his goal tally has gone down, but his assists have gone up, and now he's sort of at a balance between the two. I'd say slot him into the playmaker's spot and take some pressure off him.
Now I want to talk about another team, my 2nd team after United: SV Werder Bremen. How I wish I could have seen their last couple of games. 5-2 against FC Hollywood, and then a dramatic 5-4 game today. For my money, Werder Bremen is the most pure attacking football club in the world today. More so than United, Arsenal, Barcelona, or Madrid. They don't give a shit about defending so because they know they can score more. It's not exactly the way to win a ton of championships, but it's incredible to watch. While I said in the previous sentence it's not the way to win a championship, I sure hope I'm wrong about it this year. I'd love to see Diego win a title this year. Not to mention Özil who has been on fire the past few matches.
So to recap: Rooney should be a midfielder, and Werder Bremen are incredible.
As far as I know Rooney is a second striker? And not a CM? He can't really track back and tackle well enough to be a midfielder.
Well yes, I know that Sir Alex is using him as a second striker, but I think he should be used in midfield. As for not tracking back, I can't say I agree with you. I've seen him track back numerous times. I've seen him defending where Wes should be, and back by Evra too. As for the tackling... Well, just look at Scholes. Don't need to tackle to be a midfielder.
I don't really follow ManU's games, so I wouldn't really know a lot. But from the games I have seen, Rooney looks fine as the "hole-player"/second striker. He passes around well there, and I see no reason to why have him play in a spot where you have brilliant players (Anderson, Hargreaves, Scholes and maybe Carrick too). SAF only needs to play with two of Rooney/Tevez/Berbatov and everything will be fine for you guys.
I am starting to dislike Andy Gray and I can't understand why he despises A. Riera of Liverpool. I mean, sure, he doesn't have the pace but he has been absolute class with more than a few neat and useful touches. His crossing needs a bit of work, but hey, Liverpool without Peter Crouch haven't ever been very good in the air.
I am starting to dislike Andy Gray and I can't understand why he despises A. Riera of Liverpool. I mean, sure, he doesn't have the pace but he has been absolute class with more than a few neat and useful touches. His crossing needs a bit of work, but hey, Liverpool without Peter Crouch haven't ever been very good in the air.
Rooney is closer to being a striker than a midfielder. I don't think he could be utilized well enough to play in the midfield, when we consider that Carrick, Scholes, Anderson and Hargreaves can pick out a pass from anywhere and keep the ball under pressure. From what I've seen from Rooney so far, he often pannicks and gives the ball away under pressure when he's up infront of the midfield, let alone midfield itself - sometimes he flukes on the left-wing!
Do you want to know why? Because he isn't comfortable in those positions. He would rather be played upfront and scoring goals, including assists for the striker he plays a tad behind.
We can't really solidfy positions for certain players in our team, and that's because we are known for altering the formation dramatically in games. Switching wingers and playing them through the middle, etc.
I have know idea why you brought Werder Bremen up in this conversation. You seem to be giving them some credibility in their attacking potential, and I can't argue with what I haven't seen. So... sure?!
You was watching this on setanta sports, right? The games I have watched this season have been where the commentators coment on the lack of end-product within our team. You do realise we have had three home matches and one away matches? Of course that's not including the away, back-to-back fixtures with Chelsea and Liverpool. Suprisingly we had flare in the earlier stages of the Liverpool and Chelsea match, until the opposition pounded on us from there on then.
So... are you or are you not judging the players when you comment on their flare? You're only as good as your last game. We have had four matches, all not including those fixtures with Chelsea and Liverpool, as I have mentioned above. Certainly you can judge on what we have after three home games and one away game?
Do you want to know why? Because he isn't comfortable in those positions. He would rather be played upfront and scoring goals, including assists for the striker he plays a tad behind.
We can't really solidfy positions for certain players in our team, and that's because we are known for altering the formation dramatically in games. Switching wingers and playing them through the middle, etc.
I have know idea why you brought Werder Bremen up in this conversation. You seem to be giving them some credibility in their attacking potential, and I can't argue with what I haven't seen. So... sure?!
You was watching this on setanta sports, right? The games I have watched this season have been where the commentators coment on the lack of end-product within our team. You do realise we have had three home matches and one away matches? Of course that's not including the away, back-to-back fixtures with Chelsea and Liverpool. Suprisingly we had flare in the earlier stages of the Liverpool and Chelsea match, until the opposition pounded on us from there on then.
So... are you or are you not judging the players when you comment on their flare? You're only as good as your last game. We have had four matches, all not including those fixtures with Chelsea and Liverpool, as I have mentioned above. Certainly you can judge on what we have after three home games and one away game?
So to those who've been keeping up with the biggest game on the portuguese league, Benfica beat Sporting 2-0, goals from José Antonio Reyes and Sidnei, at 67 minutes and 72, the goals at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzegnxuHEFM
He was loaned to Benfica this season, I do hope Benfica and Atletico get to an agreement about buying the player.
Erm where the hell did you get that from?
17 goals, 19 goals, 23 goals then 18 goals in that order and the drop was due to him playing 12 less games than the previous season due to injury.
Why would you waste a £30m striker to play in midfield, he's not Dirk Kuyt. Rooney is a great second striker who happens to have tremendous work rate and clearly does not have the discipline to play in the centre.
Also btw Scholes, Carrick, Anderson/Hargreaves, Fletcher is the order of quality of our CMs.
I never denied there had been a lack of end product and in fact I admitted this. We had a problem at the start of last season which corrected itself as our attacking players started getting fitter, just like Rooney, Ronaldo and Berbatov need too especially Ronaldo and Rooney. To say Ronaldo, Rooney etc lack flair is clearly wrong and even in the games where we weren't winning big we were still playing intricate passes and making chances.
As I have said, it is plain to see that Tevez, Rooney, Berbatov and Rooney all have mountains of flair and talent; I have seen that through the past seasons for each of them. To say that you are as good as your last game is absurd; form is temporary class is permanent -- look at Tevez last season who only first scored in November and went on to deliver big time.
How is it absurd? If you're supposedly on-form for 4 consecutive matches, and then you play horribly in the following match, are you still on-form? Your form is based upon your last match.
What if you aren't producing the class within yourself? To say Ronaldo has no class because he performed poorly is absurd. No one is arguing whether or not Ronaldo has class, but we're in our rights to comment on his current form.
I acknowledged this by saying "Suprisingly we had flare in the earlier stages of the Liverpool and Chelsea match, until the opposition pounded on us from there on then." I didn't deny that there was, at times, flare existant.
The moments may have been rare, but there was, to some degree, flare.
What if you aren't producing the class within yourself? To say Ronaldo has no class because he performed poorly is absurd. No one is arguing whether or not Ronaldo has class, but we're in our rights to comment on his current form.
I acknowledged this by saying "Suprisingly we had flare in the earlier stages of the Liverpool and Chelsea match, until the opposition pounded on us from there on then." I didn't deny that there was, at times, flare existant.
The moments may have been rare, but there was, to some degree, flare.
He just wanted to mention it ?_? this is not exclusively the EPL thread you know...
I've been following this Bundesliga season mainly because of three Peruvian strikers playing there (JP Guerrero - Hamburg, Farfán - Schalke, Pizarro - Bremen) even though none of them play for the NT right now. Werder's game against Bayern last week was impressive, but I couldn't watch the Hoffenheim game since it wasn't on TV. I don't really like Schalke, Kuranyi is a useless player most of the time and their way of playing is generally boring. The competition is very good so far though.
I know. If you read any part of this thread then you would know I pay interest to other clubs in different leagues as well. I used 'conversation' as a word to describe the topic in hand, not the overall purpose this topic serves.
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