please help me and RM simple T.

Gairyuki789

Well here we go again, but i've got no choice as this team needs some help, and one pokemon needs to be swapped..
Leader
395.png

Empoleon@Focus Sash
Ability:Torrent
Evs:156hp, 252 SpA, 100 Spe
Modest Nature(+SpA,-Atk)
Hydro Pump
Aqua Jet
Ice Beam
Hidden Power [Elec]
Not much has changed since the last time I mentioned this thing, the differences are as you can see that it no longer uses Grass knot or Stealth Rock and instead opts for maximum type coverage, of course pokemon like Abamasnow and Lanturn can give it massive trouble, but anything else is pretty much DOA against this thing, however once the sash has been used it's pretty much going to die, but it serves very well as a leader. With Lucario this pokemon protects Gliscor and Salamance.

The Main Special Attacker
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Gengar@Life Orb
Ability:Levitate
Evs:252 SpA, 252 Spe, 4 hp
Timid Nature(+Spe,-Atk)
Shadow Ball
Focus Blast
Thunderbolt
Destiny Bond
As the name implies this thing is a special attacker, but has a nice suprise in the form of Destiny bond to deal with pesky Blissey's if they should manage to down it, as well as Tyranitar's and non scarfed Latias who come in thinking easy kills, of course Shadow Ball and Focus Blast can also counter kill the aformentioned threats if they manage to hit home, and with the life orbs power that's not too hard, Thunderbolt is to help deal with any water pokemon that enter, as far as threats against it go, Weavile Scizor and Dugtrio are the current biggest three, Latias and opposing Gengar's are only threatening if they go first or happen to have a choice scarf equipped over all though this pokemon is very solid at what it does. It also helps cover Lucario and Empoleon against Ground pokemon bar Dugtrio as it is faster and uses sucker punch or night slash.
The Main Physical attacker.
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Lucario@Life Orb
Ability:Inner Focus
Evs: 252 Atk, 252 Spe, 4 Hp
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
Swords Dance
Close Combat
Crunch
Extremespeed
Like Gengar this guy is a standard issue fighter that gets the job done, if it can get off a swords dance only faster pokemon or ones with high endurance can stay alive against it, but I think it explains itself as to what it does since alot of people use it, as i've said only faster pokemon with pirority moves, and ones with high defense can stand against this thing. Lucario helps Empoleon in covering Salamance and Gliscor against Ice pokemon.
Physical Backup.
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Gliscor@Leftovers
Ability:Hyper Cutter
Evs:202 Atk, 90 Hp, 218 Spe
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SpA)
Swords Dance
Earthquake
Stone Edge
Night Slash
A backup of sorts when it comes to physical attacking, Gliscor isn't as fast as most pokemon but it does outrun quite alot of pokemon, with Hyper Cutter pokemon like Gyarados and Salamance can't drop it's attack power, not to mention with swords dance it's attack is increased enough to crush many opposing threats, Stone Edge and Earthquake covers most of the ground for this guy, with Night Slash as back up to deal with Ghosts or Psychic's that might come in on it, of course ice is the pokemon's biggest fear but due to it's speed very few pokemon can outrun it to kill it. Gliscor helps cover Lucario's and Empoleon's threats as they cover him.
Mixed one.
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Salamance@Choice Scarf
Ability:Intimidate
Evs:252 SpA, 190 Spe, 68 Atk
Naive Nature(+Spe,-SpD)
Draco Meteor
Outrage
Earthquake
Fire Blast
This is my current "cleaner" so to speak, with it's powerful moves it can cripple pokemon from both sides of the spectrum and with the choice scarf he suprises many threats with his moves, Fire Blast helps deal with ice pokemon, Earthquake with Rock and Steel pokemon, and the dragon moves deal with everything else. Pokemon that know Ice shard of course have it's number, as do bulky pokemon like Swampert that won't fall to it's moves unless they are weakened. This pokemon helps out the rest of the team and is without a doubt the main force.
And now the pokemon in question.
Oddball
145.png

Zapdos@Leftovers
Ability:Pressure
Evs:248Hp, 228 Def, 38 Spe
Bold Nature (+Def,-Atk)
Heat Wave
Thunderbolt
Toxic
Roost
While the other five can cover one another, this pokemon can't do that and sticks out like a sore thumb, as you can see it's a defensively built Zapdos, but it leaves much to desired, sure it can take hits but it is unable to dish out pain in return, Toxic is there due to the fact that because of it's failing power putting a hidden power on this poor thing would be useless and therefore I went with Toxic to give it a way to deal with pokemon like Tyranitar and Swampert, Roost is of course for healing.
All i know is the first five pokemon can cover each other well but the sixth stands alone, I need help to replace it but I don't know with what..
 
Interesting team.

Empoleon - If you don't use SR, don't use Empoleon. Although he is still a good lead, SR is really what differentiates it from other water-types. Having briefly used an Empoleon without SR, I realised that there was no point losing to Infernape, and tried Vaporeon in the lead position. As surprisingly good as Vaporeon is, your team really needs SR, since sweepers like Lucario require it to get their KOes. I would suggest Chople berry and Grass Knot/Hydro Pump/Aqua Jet/SR. The focus sash saves you from little, and this way Infernape is beaten. GK is for Swampert.

You have a large weakness to dragon dance salamence and Gyarados. Therefore I would suggest removing the scarf from Salamence, and finding space for a Scarf Latias, since it can easily revenge both of these. This would also make your team less weak to SR. Since your team would be a little pursuit weak, you could try either substitute or protect on your gengar so that it isn't trapped.

That Gliscor will very rarely sweep since it is very lacking in speed, and nor is it particularly powerful. There must be a better sweeper you could use?

Good luck.
 
jc104 said:
Interesting team.
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Thank you.

Empoleon - If you don't use SR, don't use Empoleon. Although he is still a good lead, SR is really what differentiates it from other water-types. Having briefly used an Empoleon without SR, I realised that there was no point losing to Infernape, and tried Vaporeon in the lead position. As surprisingly good as Vaporeon is, your team really needs SR, since sweepers like Lucario require it to get their KOes. I would suggest Chople berry and Grass Knot/Hydro Pump/Aqua Jet/SR. The focus sash saves you from little, and this way Infernape is beaten. GK is for Swampert.
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What's funny is someone over at Marriland told me otherwise, saying that what i bolded was a bad idea and that i should go with this moveset as Hydro Pump can as they put it 2shot Swampert over Grass knot, and Hidden power Electric was for dealing with opposing waters.

I'm very confused now cause one person tells me one thing then someone tells me something else^^;

You have a large weakness to dragon dance salamence and Gyarados. Therefore I would suggest removing the scarf from Salamence, and finding space for a Scarf Latias, since it can easily revenge both of these. This would also make your team less weak to SR. Since your team would be a little pursuit weak, you could try either substitute or protect on your gengar so that it isn't trapped.
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Perhaps there's a better way to modify Salamance? Because considering that Latias "could" become uber tiered soon i'm not too sure if I want to use it or not. Because then i'd have to modify my team again.

I agree about Gliscor, the only reason i put it on my team was cause i needed a stable ground pokemon for balance and it was the only one i could see working, but your right with out swords dance it can't do anything.
 
Hydro Pump vs. Swampert: 52% - 61.4%

With Leftovers, it has a chance to survive both hits. I agree that you should run SR on Empoleon since you could go with another anti-lead like Lucario otherwise.

I think you should just run the standard wall breaker set or the sweeping tank set because Earthquake and Stone Edge already have good offensive coverage and Gliscor can use Roost to set up more boosts. I'm also not sure you need Swords Dance at all since Lucario is already your main sweeper and Salamence can sweep through a weakened team, anyway, if Lucario falls.

Also, max out Salamence's speed so you can atleast speed tie with DD Salamence.
 
i must point out that your team could very easily get screwed by a swampert lead. most of your team gets hit hard by earthquake or icebeam, and also salamence would not appreciate switching into stealth rock.. to fix this, i would recommend using latias over gliscor, as it offers more sweeping potensial and packs grassknot, though it makes your team pursuit weak if you don't use HP fire as well. zapdos doesn't really fit with the flow of the team. you might want to consider a tentacruel for a better defensive pokemon (it is resistant to ice, fire and fighting, always helpful) and also happens to have rapid spin to deal with stealth rock. as you don't have a reliable status inflictor, you could also pack toxic spikes to have an entry hazard. tentacruel does give you a vulnerability to electric attacks, so be a bit cautious. as for your lead, i would recommend changing it to ninjask. your abundence of sweepers could really benefit from a baton pass ninjask, packing sword dance+ protect combo. you could sword dance, then protect, and then baton pass +2 speed and +2 atk to salamence or lucario, allowing you to get rid of sword dance on each and choice scarf on salamence.
 
DDRMaster said:
Hydro Pump vs. Swampert: 52% - 61.4%

With Leftovers, it has a chance to survive both hits. I agree that you should run SR on Empoleon since you could go with another anti-lead like Lucario otherwise.
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Very well.

I think you should just run the standard wall breaker set or the sweeping tank set because Earthquake and Stone Edge already have good offensive coverage and Gliscor can use Roost to set up more boosts. I'm also not sure you need Swords Dance at all since Lucario is already your main sweeper and Salamence can sweep through a weakened team, anyway, if Lucario falls.
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Swords dancing does help Lucario kill more effectively, after all it did knock a Tentacreul unconcious on a hail team once.

I like the Gliscor idea though.

Also, max out Salamence's speed so you can atleast speed tie with DD Salamence.
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And give up which stat for this?

forestflamerunner said:
i must point out that your team could very easily get screwed by a swampert lead. most of your team gets hit hard by earthquake or icebeam, and also salamence would not appreciate switching into stealth rock.. to fix this, i would recommend using latias over gliscor, as it offers more sweeping potensial and packs grassknot, though it makes your team pursuit weak if you don't use HP fire as well.
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As I said above with Latias risking getting banned i don't want to use it.

zapdos doesn't really fit with the flow of the team. you might want to consider a tentacruel for a better defensive pokemon (it is resistant to ice, fire and fighting, always helpful) and also happens to have rapid spin to deal with stealth rock.
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True but then i've got a massive ground weakness to deal with.

This is a alot harder than i thought, Empoleon i know i need to change, Salamance i need to modify and Zapdos needs to be swapped..
 
well, if you don't want latias, you could always use celebi or azelf. either one of them can force swammpert to switch. i sincerely reccommend you do something about swampert.
 
Good team, just a few things.

First I would switch Lucario with a Forretress, because once SR is cleared Salamence could come in time and time again without losing that 25% HP from every switch, not to mention Zapdos takes 25% every switch as well. Here's the set:

Forretress @ Leftovers / Shed Shell
Relaxed
252 HP / 112 Atk / 144 Def
Rapid Spin | Spikes | Gyro Ball or Earthquake | Earthquake or Explosion

I'm not particularly sure how much you rely on your Lucario, but it seems that it and Gliscor are in some aspects doing the same thing.

The other option for Rapid Spin support would be to switch Gengar for Starmie. There are two sets you could use, but I'll give you the more offensive Rapid Spin Starmie. Here's the set:

Starmie @ Life Orb
Timid
4 HP / 252 Spe / 252 SpA
Rapid Spin | Surf | Grass Knot or Thunderbolt | Ice Beam

This Starmie could replace Gengar as your Special Sweeper only it could deal with Swampert via Grass Knot, as well as providing Rapid Spin support. Although forestflamerunner's idea of using Tentacruel over Zapdos makes a lot of sense as well.

Lastly for Gliscor I would recomend using Roost over Night Slash as Roost will add so much to his survivability. Also none of the EV's on Gliscor are divisible by 4, in other words they don't make any sense, instead use 252 HP / 40 Atk / 216 Spd
or 200 HP / 92 Atk / 216 Spd if the Atk means that much on him.
 
^I like the Gliscor Spread alot there, and the other spreads are good as well.

All I need now is a Celebii spread, I've never used it before though..so it will be tough, and of course I'm still trying to figure out how to make Salamance stronger but yet maintain it's domanant speed with the choice scarf too.
 
dude, for salemance, i can not tell you enough that you could use ninjask support via speed boost/sword dance. if you replace empoleon with it, you reduce vulnerability to magnezone.
as for celebi, i'd reccomendthis
celebi @leftovers bold
252 HP/ 220 DEF/ 36 SPE
grass knot
recover
HP fire
thunder wave

this gives you a status inducer, swampert revenge killer, and a scizor lure. recover is to keep you alive.
also, on your salemance, i'd reccomend flamethrower over fire blast. fire blast really doesn't change many 2HKO's into OHKO's
 
also, for lucario, might i recommend adding ice punch somewhere? i'd personally switch out crunch. actually, i also suggest ditching lucario all together in favor of choice band scizor, though without the choiceband if you use ninjask. in that case, life orb is great
 
forestflamerunner said:
as for celebi, i'd reccomendthis
celebi @leftovers bold
252 HP/ 220 DEF/ 36 SPE
grass knot
recover
HP fire
thunder wave

this gives you a status inducer, swampert revenge killer, and a scizor lure. recover is to keep you alive.
also, on your salemance, i'd reccomend flamethrower over fire blast. fire blast really doesn't change many 2HKO's into OHKO's
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Celebii there is intresting, but can it OHKO Scizor with that spread?

You bring up a good point about Fire Blast, Flamethrower is better, but how about Status and Natures? should I leave them or change them?
 
celebi can ko scizor with that sopread. SPD is the lower of scizors defences and it is double weak to fire. as for salemence, i don't agreee with the choice scarf set. it adds speed but can be set up on with protect and switch to something that resists the attack you chose. the person might make himself a bit open, but generally people can guess, especially if its your second time bringing it in. i'd recommend a mix sweeper using life orb over this. post a new salamence set with the attacks you want and i can give you a nature and spread. also, please tell me why you don't want to use ninjask. it appears to me as a huge asset to your team. IMHO your team fears magnezone a lot with empoleon and lucario.
 
the reason why i don't want Ninjask is simple, it's too predictable, Stealth Rock tears it to shreads and I don't want one pokemon to have to rely on another for status boosting.

I know the foundation of a team requires the pokemon to be able to counter for one another but at the same time they've gotta be able to handle themselves if the need arises, I don't mind using Swords Dance on Gliscor and Lucario because I do it when they catch others on a switch then go to work.

As far as Salamance goes the reason i run it as a Scarfmixer is because I find Dragon Dancing to be pointless, dragon pokemon are pratical targets for ice pokemon or pokemon with those moves, so if i'm trying to set up my opponent will switch to something that has ice shard or the like and knock it out come next round.

Besides that Salamance is one of the few pokemon that can hit hard from both sides of the spectrum and i want to take advantage of that, since it's got high attack and special attack already the choice is obvious on what to give it to help it obtain total power, sure it's not full proof or invincible but having a Scaf on can give it a nasty edge late in the game, but right now i'm sure if using it the right way as a scarfer.
 
well, in that case, i have one last suggestion. if you didn't like any of my other prospective spaps, i suggest using paraflinch togekiss instead of zapdos. it is an all around good pokemon that can keep slower sweepers at bay.
 
ok thanks dude.

so no one has any ideas for Salamance?

Edit:ok i'll admit there is a reason why i want to edit Salamance.

Recently i battled someone who blantantly tossed out a Blissey in it's path of fire when it was using outrage, now i'm not the sharpest tool in the shed but Blissey only took roughly alittle over half damage from the attack, i know Blissey's are endurant so i know it could've survived regardless but still the attack should've done more damage than it did.

That is why i'm questioning Salamance right now, I want to keep using it as a mixed attacker(mostly because it's the most reliable dragon pokemon i've ever used.), but I want it to be physically strong as well as it's special strong without losing speed, I just..don't know what to do with it, it's the most complicated pokemon i've ever used and is always changing on me, I thought i had finally found a good spread but the fight with the Blissey was an eyeopener that it's time to figure out once and for all what to do with it.
 
If you're not going to use Stealth Rock on Empoleon, you might as well use Starmie:

Starmie @ Life Orb
Timid
4 HP / 252 Spe / 252 SpA
Rapid Spin
Hydro Pump
Grass Knot
Ice Beam

Between Hydro Pump, Grass Knot, and Ice Beam, you can dent every Pokemon in OU besides Empoleon, Shedinja, and Abomasnow. Hydro Pump > Surf so you can get the guaranteed OHKO (or sash) on Azelf and Aerodactyl, and finish them off with a Rapid Spin. Hydro Pump + Life Orb means a 2HKO on Metagross, who can do little back bar 2HKOing with EQ if you miss.

An alternative spread for Starmie would be 40 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe. This is the spread I prefer, as it guarantees a win against Lead Azelf, but I'm too tired to post the entire thought process against Azelf leads. If you are really interested, tell me.

Should you choose to use Starmie, give SR to Gliscor. In the current Metagame, SR is omnipresent for a good reason. It allows you to turn some 2HKOs into OHKOs for Luke and Mence.
 
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