Dark Desires - stall team

blackritual0

Ok, after much researching, testing, and failure i finally put together a team ive found fairly effective, any input you could put in would be great, thanks :)

at first glance
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Hippowdon.png

Gaia (hippowdon) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sandstream
EVs: HP 151 Atck 24 Def 192 SpD 40
Nature: Impish
Stealth Rock
Slack off
Earthquake
Roar

Hippowdons purpose is sand stream, start stealth rock, then act later on as a physical shield. hippowdon and abomosnow work together usually, countering each others weaknesses. When a water or grass lead comes in, Abomosnow switches in and vice versa. Roar is also good later on when spikes are set.



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Gelu (Abomosnow) @ Big Root
Ability: Snow Warning
EVs: HP 252 Def 148 SpD 110
Nature: Bold
Subsitute
Blizzard
Leech seed
Protect

Abomsnow is incredibly useful to stall teams, however, due to its large amount of weaknesses, it can only be used at certain points. Abomosnow serves as an effective counter for crass, ice and water types countering off suicune, raikou, jolteon, etc. its leech seed is also an effective stall and it can restart weather effects if there negated.

Vaporeon.png

Aequora (Vaporeon) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water absorb
EVs: HP 252 Def 92 SpA 92 SpD 74
Nature: Bold
Surf
Hidden power Electric
Heal Bell
Roar

Vaporeon serves as abulky water type and cleric, using heal bell to cure off any status conditions. Vaporeon is an effective and neccesary counter for heatran and infernape, as well as a gyarados counter with hp electric. roar can cause massive damage with spike support.


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Chalybs (Skarmory) @ Shed shell
Ability: Keen Eye
EVs: Hp 252 Def 74 Spe 184
Nature: Impish
Spikes
Whirlwind
Roost
Brave bird

The bread and butter of the team, without spikes set up the team will most likely fail. Skarmory packs a powerful defense and multiple resistances. once its spikes are set it can whirlwind to cripple the enemy.


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Umbra (Umbreon) @ Leftovers
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: HP 58 Spe 200 SpD 252
Nature: Timid
Toxic
Protect
Wish
Confuse Ray

My signature pokemon since gen 2, umbreon serves as an effective toxic stall. with its high defensive stats Umbreon can effectively stall out most of an opponents team. confuse ray serves to futher annoy the opponent. Main weaknesses are taunt users, and any steel or poison type pokemon. Umbreon can deal massive damage to the enemy, but shouldnt be used as a last resort due to no standard attacks, anything with taunt could destroy it. however when used effectively Umbreon wrecks havoc


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Phasma (spiritomb) @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: HP 252 Def 100 SpD 158
Nature: Calm
Rest
Sleeptalk
Dark pulse
Hidden power fighting


Spiritomb works mainly to counter rapid spin and keeps spikes on the field. simple enough.


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blackritual0
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The biggest weaknesses that ive come across so far are..
a. Lacks an effective zapados counter
b. Breloom with spore = failure
c. taunt leads

if anyone could give me some input and help me shape it up a bit itd be appreciated :) thanks


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Hey. You've got a decent enough start for a stall team here, and you've got a lot of the right ideas, but there's really so many simple changes you're missing out on that are stopping it being good.

To start with, I honestly have no idea what's going on with Hippowdon's EV spread. Not only does it seem completely random, but it doesn't even work in multiples of 4. Use the standard spread which can be found in Hippowdon's analysis.

One of the main things your team is really lacking right now is a way of dealing with fighting types. Unless you're lucky enough to find yourself with Hippowdon at 100%, SD Lucario beats you hands down, and you're going to have a lot of trouble with plenty of other fighters. Abomasnow is pretty unnecesarry here at the moment, and will be even more unnecesarry after I'm done making suggestions, so you can easily afford to replace it with a Stallbreaker Gliscor using Taunt/Toxic/Earthquake/Roost, which not only gives your team an extremely reliable check to fighting types, but helps out a bit offensively too.

Again, Vaporeons EVs make no sense at all here, they should be the standard 188 HP/252 Def/68 SpD, and you really need to be using Wish/Protect/Surf/HP Electric (or Roar over HP Electric), as Vaporeon simply doesn't function properly as a wall otherwise.

I'd recommend switching Skarmory to Careful with 252 HP/216 SpD/40 Spe, which makes it much easier to set up Spikes reliably, as well as giving your team a much easier time switching into certain attacks, most notably Draco Meteors. Even without a physically defensive spread, Skarmory can still easily take what it needs to.

Umbreon is the odd one out here, and it really contributes nothing to the team apart from Wish passing - which Vaporeon does much, much better now. You'd be much better off replacing Umbreon with a Blissey to cover the special attackers that can otherwise give you problems. Seeing as Vaporeon has Wish covered, you don't need to go with Wish Blissey, and as you don't have Toxic Spikes, a Thunder Wave set would be a pretty good idea. By using a Bold Blissey with 44 HP / 252 Def / 92 Spe / 120 SpA and Softboiled/Seismic Toss/Thunder Wave/Flamethrower, your team will get a solid special wall which is tailored specially for dealing with the kind of pokemon that still give your team issues.

Finally, while Spiritomb does work as a Spinblocker, I'd recommend using a RestTalk Rotom-H instead, which does the job much better, as well as being much more useful as a general stall pokemon. However, if you do keep Spiritomb, you're going to want to change the two attacking moves to Will-o-Wisp and Shadow Ball.

Good luck!
 
I generally agree with above. Rotom is generally far superior to Spiritomb: the only noticeable advantages are Dark neutrality and Sucker Punch, but neither of them are too useful as Spinblocker.

And I gree with Abomansnow being useless- Abomasnow is the only one to resist hail, so you're provably gonna suffer as much as the opponent.
 
ok thanks :) im making use of most of these suggestions... Im going to keep Umbreon on however, it has worked surprisingly well for me actually. ive taken down 5 out of 6 pokemon on the opponents team with my umbreon alone haha. but im changing around the EV spreads (btw, idk what the hell was up with hippodown EV spread, i had it written out differently, idk why that was like that) and mess with the attacks a bit. what would work as an effective zapados counter? i need a lucario and zapados counter mainly, Gliscor is an option but idk, taunting a lucario seems like an all around bad idea :P
 
blackritual0 said:
ok thanks :) im making use of most of these suggestions... Im going to keep Umbreon on however, it has worked surprisingly well for me actually. ive taken down 5 out of 6 pokemon on the opponents team with my umbreon alone haha. but im changing around the EV spreads (btw, idk what the hell was up with hippodown EV spread, i had it written out differently, idk why that was like that) and mess with the attacks a bit. what would work as an effective zapados counter? i need a lucario and zapados counter mainly, Gliscor is an option but idk, taunting a lucario seems like an all around bad idea :P
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Your only trouble with keeping Umbreon is that you're probably playing quite low down on the ladder at the moment. Pretty much every team higher up packs at least 2 steels, and you can do nothing to them. Stallbreaker Gliscor is a much better choice, and is the best (and only) counter to SporePunching Breloom, which you've mentioned having problems with.
 
iiMKUltra said:
Your only trouble with keeping Umbreon is that you're probably playing quite low down on the ladder at the moment. Pretty much every team higher up packs at least 2 steels, and you can do nothing to them. Stallbreaker Gliscor is a much better choice, and is the best (and only) counter to SporePunching Breloom, which you've mentioned having problems with.
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ok, ill put a gliscor in, but if i took out umbreon for it then id still have one more spot available with abomasnow gone.... and what about the whole thing with vaporeon? wouldnt heal bell be kinda neccesary? haha
 
blackritual0 said:
ok, ill put a gliscor in, but if i took out umbreon for it then id still have one more spot available with abomasnow gone.... and what about the whole thing with vaporeon? wouldnt heal bell be kinda neccesary? haha
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Vaporeon works well, it's fine as is. You could replace Hippowdon's Roar with Toxic, as you have it on Vaporeon, allowing it to out-stall Zapdos, and once it Roosts, EQ for the KO. Lucario is handled just fine by Hippowdon as it is, and SpecsLuke/any other special variant is taken care of Vaporeon. Predicting which set it is can be difficult, however. Look at what it switches into to take a clue.

This leaves you with one free space, and you need a decent Revenger, or something that can set up once their team is statused/weakened.

Maybe a Scarfed MixNite, or Offensive DDGyara?

MixNite would probably work better as you have resists to all its weaknesses.
 
iiMKUltra said:
Vaporeon works well, it's fine as is. You could replace Hippowdon's Roar with Toxic, as you have it on Vaporeon, allowing it to out-stall Zapdos, and once it Roosts, EQ for the KO. Lucario is handled just fine by Hippowdon as it is, and SpecsLuke/any other special variant is taken care of Vaporeon. Predicting which set it is can be difficult, however. Look at what it switches into to take a clue.

This leaves you with one free space, and you need a decent Revenger, or something that can set up once their team is statused/weakened.

Maybe a Scarfed MixNite, or Offensive DDGyara?

MixNite would probably work better as you have resists to all its weaknesses.
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MixNite? what is that, ive never heard of it :P
 
ah.. alright, ill consider that. hmm... what exactly is it that makes rotom H better than spiritomb?

and what can i do to counter taunt???
 
blackritual0 said:
MixNite? what is that, ive never heard of it :P
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A Dragonite that attacks from both sides of the spectrum - Mixed Dragonite.

The set I'm suggesting is:

Dragonite @ Choice Scarf
Rash/Mild
240 Spe/160 SAtk/108 Atk
Draco Meteor
Superpower
Thunderbolt
Flamethrower

240 Speed allows you to hit 384, outspeeding Max Speed Weavile, Dragonite's fastest counter.
 
No you don't. It's VERY useful, but IMO it's over-rated. Rapid Spin is only useful to eliminate entry hazards. Very helpful, but the common RSers are known and most teams have an RS blocker. I get along along fine without it.

Of course, I'm not telling you not to get it; you should. I'm warning you not to get it through a stupid trade. Recognize it's worth.
 
yeah, idk how to deal with another stall team without rapid spin though :/

Edit: ok i switched out skarmory for forttress with spikes, toxic spikes, rapid spin, payback

good choice?
 
Honestly? No, I'm saying. Toxic Spikes is near useless, again, Rapid Spin is overated, and Rotom's will kill you before Payback kills them. I'd stick with Skarmory.

Rotom H is better than Spiritomb at spinblocking, because, with the common spinners-

Against Starmie, Rotom can use Thunderbolt. Spiritomb can use Sucker Punch, but it fails if they switch.
Against Forretress, Rotom can Overheat, Spiritomb's useless.
Against Tentacruel, Rotom can Thunderbolt, Spiritomb's useless.
Against Donphan, Rotom can... Overheat. Spiritomb is, again, useless.

Yeah, I think you get my point.

And I agree with using Gliscor. Lucario can do virtuallly nothing against Gliscor with Earthquake, which they should have. +2 ESpeed does about 40% to standard Gliscor, and Gliscor can then EQ for a KO, or heal off the damage, outspeeding Lucario if they use any other move. The point of Stallbreakers are to... break stall... and that's the only reason Gliscor uses Taunt- to stop the opponent from healing, or from being Toxic'd.

So yeah, Gliscor all the way.
 
iiMKUltra said:
A Dragonite that attacks from both sides of the spectrum - Mixed Dragonite.

The set I'm suggesting is:

Dragonite @ Choice Scarf
Rash/Mild
240 Spe/160 SAtk/108 Atk
Draco Meteor
Superpower
Thunderbolt
Flamethrower

240 Speed allows you to hit 384, outspeeding Max Speed Weavile, Dragonite's fastest counter.
Click to expand...

Lol, weavile's carry ICE SHARD so even CS is useless

Hey, most of the suggestions are covered by TAB, and Tab is a good rater, so follow his advice and your team is good.

Good Luck ;)
 
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