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Rarely Used (RU) Tier
- Thread starter Rising_Dusk
- Start date
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Also, Hippopotas is UU, not RU.
That Charizard reminds me of the Sub-Petaya Charizard back in RSE that abused the double boost from Petaya and Blaze to really power up Fire moves. This is obviously better, since unlike Blaze Solar Power not only power Fire moves, but also other Special moves. I can see this finish off 3-4 of the opponents remaining mons if your team mate can afford it a safe switch-in. Stuff like Sleep Powder, slow U-turn / Volt Switch / Baton Pass, or Explosion / Memento can do the trick.
Although, it'll probably be better if a separate Sunny Day suicide mon with Heat Rock sets up Sunny Day and go boom. Charizard could then sweep without slowing down. The final slot can be used for Flamethrower for accuracy, since Fire Blast is more likely than not an overkill. Cottonee seems particularly useful, thanks to Prankster and Memento.
Although, it'll probably be better if a separate Sunny Day suicide mon with Heat Rock sets up Sunny Day and go boom. Charizard could then sweep without slowing down. The final slot can be used for Flamethrower for accuracy, since Fire Blast is more likely than not an overkill. Cottonee seems particularly useful, thanks to Prankster and Memento.
Oh damn. I just checked this month's usage and assumed it was RU. I didn't even notice I was playing in UU until my last match :x
Also @ Pocket I've been using Eviolite Cottonee too. As for the last slot if Charizard opts not to run Sunny Day, I'd say Flamethrower or Overheat is best there.
The Charizard set I use in UU and Ultimately RU when he comes down here would be this
[SET]
name: Sunnyzard
move 1: Sunny Day
move 2: Overheat
move 3: Solarbeam
move 4: Flamethrower / Air Slash
item: Heat Rock
ability: Solar Power
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Sunnyday gives you nastyplot powered Fire moves
I find that My Charizard usually won't live long enough to sweep or pull off more then one attack so Overheat is generally a good option to eliminate or dent something, even pokemon that resist fire won't like being hit by a +2 Stab Overheat then switch to a chorophyll Sweeper, as Zard's weaknesses are water, electric and rock which Grass type resist (except rock)
You can technically use Overheat twice as the -2 SpA drop is negated by Solar Power and the Sun which leaves your Overheat at +0 power, so basically how strong Zard's overheat would be without the Sun
Solar Beam to hit waters on the switch or when you switch in on you or when you set up Sunnyday.
The last slot if a toss up between between Air Slash as a secondary Stab or Flamethrower, Flamethrower still hits incredibly hard in the sun, I think I OHKO a Nidoqueen with in once (No Hazards) in UU. Fire Blast can also be used but I've always personally been unlucky when using it ans tend to miss with it's lower accuracy, with Zard suffering 12.5% recoil from solar power every turn, he won't be taking more then 1 neutral hit, so something more reliable is general a good option.
Note is you opt for flamethrower in the last slot you're walled by fire types, especially fire types with Flash Fire.
Lilligant is also a solid Choice in Both UU and RU on Sun team as it can work outside of the Sun with Quiver dance, although I recommend using Giga Drain over Solarbeam on Lilligant as it's more of a set up sweeper.
[SET]
name: Sunnyzard
move 1: Sunny Day
move 2: Overheat
move 3: Solarbeam
move 4: Flamethrower / Air Slash
item: Heat Rock
ability: Solar Power
nature: Timid
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Sunnyday gives you nastyplot powered Fire moves
I find that My Charizard usually won't live long enough to sweep or pull off more then one attack so Overheat is generally a good option to eliminate or dent something, even pokemon that resist fire won't like being hit by a +2 Stab Overheat then switch to a chorophyll Sweeper, as Zard's weaknesses are water, electric and rock which Grass type resist (except rock)
You can technically use Overheat twice as the -2 SpA drop is negated by Solar Power and the Sun which leaves your Overheat at +0 power, so basically how strong Zard's overheat would be without the Sun
Solar Beam to hit waters on the switch or when you switch in on you or when you set up Sunnyday.
The last slot if a toss up between between Air Slash as a secondary Stab or Flamethrower, Flamethrower still hits incredibly hard in the sun, I think I OHKO a Nidoqueen with in once (No Hazards) in UU. Fire Blast can also be used but I've always personally been unlucky when using it ans tend to miss with it's lower accuracy, with Zard suffering 12.5% recoil from solar power every turn, he won't be taking more then 1 neutral hit, so something more reliable is general a good option.
Note is you opt for flamethrower in the last slot you're walled by fire types, especially fire types with Flash Fire.
Lilligant is also a solid Choice in Both UU and RU on Sun team as it can work outside of the Sun with Quiver dance, although I recommend using Giga Drain over Solarbeam on Lilligant as it's more of a set up sweeper.
One thing: NEVER relegate Charizard to setting up the Sun by itself, EVER. It's simply too frail for that, especially with the Stealth Rock weakness and Solar Power chipping away at its health at a greater pace than Leftovers can keep up with. Leave the Sunny Day to something like Claydol or Moltres.
Over what you suggested, I'd use:
Timid / Choice Scarf / Solar Power
- Overheat
- Air Slash
- SolarBeam
- Hidden Power Rock
4 Defense / 252 Sp. Attack / 252 Speed
Timid + Scarf Speed-trolls a great percentage of this tier, outpacing things like Sharpedo, Yanmega, Lilligant, and Venomoth (all at +1 Speed) and reducing them all to such a terrifying example of its power, not even ashes remain. Since it's a hit-and-run specialist, Overheat is the attack of choice, reaching an absolutely horrifying effective power of 472.5, with which 90% accuracy ain't too shabby. Air Slash is the second STAB, SolarBeam nabs coverage on otherwise-irksome bulky Waters, and since Charizard's short on coverage options (Solar Power + Dragon Pulse = illegal), HP Rock is its best option for opposing Fires, especially Moltres.
Of course, we don't know if it'll actually drop, I should point out.
Over what you suggested, I'd use:
Timid / Choice Scarf / Solar Power
- Overheat
- Air Slash
- SolarBeam
- Hidden Power Rock
4 Defense / 252 Sp. Attack / 252 Speed
Timid + Scarf Speed-trolls a great percentage of this tier, outpacing things like Sharpedo, Yanmega, Lilligant, and Venomoth (all at +1 Speed) and reducing them all to such a terrifying example of its power, not even ashes remain. Since it's a hit-and-run specialist, Overheat is the attack of choice, reaching an absolutely horrifying effective power of 472.5, with which 90% accuracy ain't too shabby. Air Slash is the second STAB, SolarBeam nabs coverage on otherwise-irksome bulky Waters, and since Charizard's short on coverage options (Solar Power + Dragon Pulse = illegal), HP Rock is its best option for opposing Fires, especially Moltres.
Of course, we don't know if it'll actually drop, I should point out.
Yeah That's probably the best Charizard set, how much extra damage would choice specs give you? It's probably allow you to use Overheat twice.
With Stealth Rock being a Big problem for Charizard, I found that lead Charizard using Sunny day and overheat is pretty effective if the your opponents lead can't out right counter Charizard and anything switching in usually takes a +1 Solar beam, unless you're munchlax.
But there are no leads in this game anymore sadly lol.
With Stealth Rock being a Big problem for Charizard, I found that lead Charizard using Sunny day and overheat is pretty effective if the your opponents lead can't out right counter Charizard and anything switching in usually takes a +1 Solar beam, unless you're munchlax.
But there are no leads in this game anymore sadly lol.
nitpick:
Vulpix is not BL the ability Drought is BL
I know not many people run TR teams, but I've been using one with an Ampharos in it for the past few weeks and it's actually doing pretty well.
Ampharos @ Leftovers
Static (because Plus is useless)
Quiet 252/0/0/80/176/0 (2 speed IV)
- Heal Bell
- Discharge
- HP Ice
- Power Gem
The speed IVs let HP Ice keep 70bp and also make Ampharos faster under TR, Heal Bell was because I needed a cleric, Discharge is for STAB against things like Honchkrow and Yan, and Power Gem is speciffically for things that it does a ton of damage to that Discharge wouldn't hit as well (like a yanmega that's been passed a QD). I think HP Ice was originally for coverage, but at this point I think Signal Beam might be a better option since Cress gets hurt more from it.
This thing hits a lot of pokemon in RU, and can usually do it's job pretty well without getting taken out quickly itself.
Ampharos @ Leftovers
Static (because Plus is useless)
Quiet 252/0/0/80/176/0 (2 speed IV)
- Heal Bell
- Discharge
- HP Ice
- Power Gem
The speed IVs let HP Ice keep 70bp and also make Ampharos faster under TR, Heal Bell was because I needed a cleric, Discharge is for STAB against things like Honchkrow and Yan, and Power Gem is speciffically for things that it does a ton of damage to that Discharge wouldn't hit as well (like a yanmega that's been passed a QD). I think HP Ice was originally for coverage, but at this point I think Signal Beam might be a better option since Cress gets hurt more from it.
This thing hits a lot of pokemon in RU, and can usually do it's job pretty well without getting taken out quickly itself.
Sharking, Choice Scarf certainly solves the Speed issue that Charizard may most likely face. Air Slash is redundant coverage with Overheat, though, and will most likely never be used. I'd suggest going with Flamethrower or Fire Blast, since Charizard has a good chance to sweep the opposing team without the need to switch out.
ok, my bad.
Chaotica Mortis, usually Trick Room are offensively based, since they only have 3-4 turns to make use of this altered dimension. That Ampharos though is more utility. A TR Ampharos should be more like Thunderbolt - HP Water - Signal Beam / Focus Blast - Volt Switch @ Life Orb, Max Special Atk and HP imo.
ok, my bad.
Chaotica Mortis, usually Trick Room are offensively based, since they only have 3-4 turns to make use of this altered dimension. That Ampharos though is more utility. A TR Ampharos should be more like Thunderbolt - HP Water - Signal Beam / Focus Blast - Volt Switch @ Life Orb, Max Special Atk and HP imo.
Why would you run Discharge, something used to spread paralysis, on a Trick Room team? It would make them faster than you as long as they aren't locked up by Para.
I don't play a lot of PO, but I've recently been playing a lot of RU. And I must say, this tier is quiete fun. When I first played it I fooled around with a Shelgon team, which was fun but not very successful. I changed it up a bit, and am playing with it to considerable sucess (considering I don't play a lot, and that when I do, I'm not the greatest of players...) I've been liking Yanmega, Porygon-Z, and Sharpedo the most. And after reading through this thread, I can see that they are some of the biggest threats in the tier. I can see why I'm having success using them.
However, these threats are also hard for me to counter, Sharpedo beng the most difficult. After having a few problems with them, I am curious as to what the best counters are. I've been using Eviolite Tangela (I have a lot of NFEs on my team), but it hasn't proven to be quite as successful as I hoped. In fact, most of the time, it's dead weight. So what are some good checks/counters to Sharpedo? Any suggestion would be appreciated.
Even with powerhouses like Porygon-Z, Cresselia, Sharpedo, and Yanmega within this tier, it is still very fun and enjoyable to play. Note on Ice Shard: I haven't seen it yet.
EDIT: Also want to know the best fourth move for Speed Boost Yanmega. Thanks.
~hoblaph
However, these threats are also hard for me to counter, Sharpedo beng the most difficult. After having a few problems with them, I am curious as to what the best counters are. I've been using Eviolite Tangela (I have a lot of NFEs on my team), but it hasn't proven to be quite as successful as I hoped. In fact, most of the time, it's dead weight. So what are some good checks/counters to Sharpedo? Any suggestion would be appreciated.
Even with powerhouses like Porygon-Z, Cresselia, Sharpedo, and Yanmega within this tier, it is still very fun and enjoyable to play. Note on Ice Shard: I haven't seen it yet.
EDIT: Also want to know the best fourth move for Speed Boost Yanmega. Thanks.
~hoblaph
for sharpedo u should run protect waterfall crunch aquajet
or ice beam if you must.
and any fighting priority kills sharpedo.
also, tangelas should be working VERY WELL. i used it in OU a lot... its quite good. try maax hp max defense bold
leech seed giga drain sleep powder hp fire (or sub/protect)
or ice beam if you must.
and any fighting priority kills sharpedo.
also, tangelas should be working VERY WELL. i used it in OU a lot... its quite good. try maax hp max defense bold
leech seed giga drain sleep powder hp fire (or sub/protect)
I know that TR is usually offensive, but I think it's also kinda cool to just automatically make all of my pokemon faster than the opponent. If Amphy switches in during TR it's GOING to go first, and that means it's going to hurt whatever I sent it at pretty bad, or it's going to heal my pokemon and either try to stay in or switch to something more useful.
And Thunderbolt probably would be a better move on Amphy now that I really think about it. Discharge was really just to spread status if my TR starters got KO'd.
Scarf Primeape is shit.
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