Houses of the Holy (Peaked #5)

[ManofSteele]

The entire Uber Metagame revolves around two Pokemon: Arceus and Kyogre. A bold statement, yes, but true nonetheless. Unbalanced teams quickly and easily fall to a Specs Water Spout Attack, or a boosted Extremespeed. But this brings a double edged sword. Because they are so powerful, everyone brings a counter or check for them. In the current metagame, there are two options for being successful. Run a team carrying the big threats with team support, or run an anti-metagame team meant to counter the biggest threats, and then clean up afterwards. This team is the former, Kyogre and Arceus wreaking havoc with team support. This particular team is all about synergy, and was the main focus of my team building. I only had one phase of actual team building, so I'm not doing to include that. I had a Rayquaza on the team, but was replaced by Dialgia.

And yes, the "Peaked #5" in the title refers to the Smogon Server. Peaking on the PO server means shit.

Now that the OU metagame has become a bit more stable, I'm doing an RMT for this team, getting some suggestions, and shelving it in case I feel the urge to get into Ubers again.

That being said, I always revolve my Uber teams around a Led Zeppelin Album. Houses of the Holy fit for this particular one.

At A Glance

The Team​

TheRainSong (Kyogre) @ Choice Specs
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SAtk / 4 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Water Spout
- Surf
- Thunder
- Ice Beam

The most powerful Special Attacker of the game, bar none. Everyone knows the raw destructive force of Specs Kyogre. Laughing at potential special walls like Ferrothorn and Chansey as they get 2HKO'd by Water Spout. Dare not invoke the wrath of Specs Kyogre, one misplay and game over. Standard set, Max HP for the bulk. Kyogre without Scarf isn't going to be outspeeding much, and the extra HP helps with opposing Kyogre, Palkia, and Groudon that might try to ruin the fun.

Kyogre is the focal point of the team, as far as synergy goes. Because nobody wants to take a specs Water Spout, they usually have something that can take a hit and retaliate quickly to stop the HP-Dependent Water Spout (Usually Palkia). Ferrothorn and Dialgia make a great combination with Kyogre, covering weaknesses and specific threats. Kyogre also provides Rain for Kabutop's Swift Swim, which in turn provides Rapid Spin to keep Kyogre healthier to fire off more attacks.

No Quarter (Dialga) @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 56 SAtk / 200 SDef
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Att)
- Stealth Rock
- Draco Meteor
- Fire Blast
- Roar

Aside from the occasional battle where all of the attacking moves miss, Dialga fills three important roles on an Uber team. One: Stealth Rocks. Two: A powerful Fire Blast to get rid of (or hamper in rain) Ferrothorn and Forretress who are the premier set-up users of the metagame. Three: Fills the mandatory Dragon-Type to fire off obscenely powerful Draco Meteor attacks. Dragon Tail to help with setting up, and to still give a punch after the Draco Meteor drop.

Dialga pairs extremely with Lugia, immune and 4x resistant to its two type weaknesses. From there, Lugia can also capitalize on Stealth Rocks being up with Whirlwind, or support the rest of the team with Reflect.

Dancin' Days (Kabutops) (M) @ Choice Band
Trait: Swift Swim
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Rapid Spin
- Stone Edge
- Superpower
- Waterfall

Hands down, MVP of the team. Kabutops makes a return from the lower tiers again to sweep entire teams without a second thought. Breaking 500 Attack with A Choice Band, a Waterfall in the Rain OHKOs Anything that doesn't resist after Stealth Rocks and Spikes that isn't named Skarmory (Still 2HKO'd though). Stone Edge smashes Giratina-O, who poses a large threat to the rest of the team. Dialgia pairs very well with Kabutops, as this set is utterly walled by Palkia, Giratina, and Grass Arceus, and Rayquaza. While Rapid Spin may seem odd on a glass cannon like Kabutops, it plays a key role in situations where Kabutops may not be so useful against the opponent's team, and hazards (Particularly Toxic Spikes) hamper the sweeping ability of Kyogre and Arceus. I have been in many situations where a Rapid Spin and sacking my Kabutops led to a successful Arceus set-up and sweep.

SongRemains (Ferrothorn) (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SDef
Sassy Nature (+SDef, -Spd)
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip
- Spikes
- Thunder Wave/Protect

Any Uber team running Kyogre without Ferrothorn or Forretress is doing something wrong. Everyone knows how well Ferro does in the rain, able to sponge up attacks from all of Kyogre's top switch-ins. Combined with additional switching power of Lugia and Dialgia, the three create a powerful defensive core, broken only by odd sets and the ever occasional crit. Set is fairly standard, Protect and Thunder Wave have been mixed and matched, both have their pros and cons, but I find myself sticking with Thunder Wave more than anything. Getting that nice Paralysis on switches is very nice. The combination of Dialgia and Lugia play very well with each other. Lugia is able to sponge any sort of fighting attack that would otherwise demolish Ferro; in turn Ferrothorn resists Dark, Ghost and Electric attacks that would otherwise plague Lugia. Ferro still takes neutral damage from Ice, but with the Sassy EV spread, it's not gonna be doing much.

The Ocean (Lugia) @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Ice Beam
- Reflect/Toxic
- Roost
- Whirlwind

Which brings us to the final piece of the defensive core. Lugia is an extremely capable defensive wall that is often overlooked for Giratina, and even Skarmory. However, Lugia has many advantages that make it a much sturdier wall. First and foremost is its access to instant recovery, something that Giratina covets and tries to imitate with Rest SleepTalk sets. Second is Whirlwind, able to phaze the ever-so-common Sub SetUp Pokemon in the Ubers Metagame. Since Lugia takes the role of being the main Defensive Wall, Reflect is an excellent addition in order to help the rest of the team in case Lugia gets in a hot spot. Ice Beam is handy to have to take out Rayquazas who try to set up, only to be demolished. I have swapped out Ice Beam for Toxic as well, but usually Reflect is the more expendable move.

D'yer Mak'er (Arceus-Ghost) @ Leftovers
Trait: Multitype
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Spd / 4 SpAtt
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Judgement
- Focus Blast
- Recover

Whereas Kyogre is the focal point of team Synergy, Arceus is the glue that holds it all together. Ghost Arceus provides a much needed Spinblocker, as well as an answer to Sub Punch Palkia, an otherwise plague to the team. Also provides a handy check to opposing Extremekiller Arceus Sets. Pairs extremely well with the Darkrai-Ferro-Lugia core, providing an immunity against Fighting for Dialga and Ferrothorn, Lugia's screens allow for an easier set-up for Arceus. Set is very standard and simple. Max HP to allow for bulkyness, Timid to outspeed Adamant Ekiller, Judgement and Focus Blast for coverage, Recovery for additional bulk.

Threatlist:​

Giratina/O - God Dammit Giratina. It utterly counters two of my three primary attackers, and laughs at Lugia's attempt to do damage. Giratina-O is deals quite a chunk to Ferrothorn with HP fire, who would otherwise stall to hell with Leech Seed. The most common types of Giratina are Rest Talkers with Dragon Tail and W-O-W. While Ferrothorn can EVENTUALLY stall this set out, it phazes (Usually supported by Hazards) and spreads burns, taking its toll on the rest of the team. Best handled by an Ice Beam smacked to the face by good 'ol SpecsOgre, or a Draco Meteor my Dialgia. If I see a Giratina in the team preview, I always try to keep Kyogre alive as long as possible. Giratina-O is less of a problem, but always leaves a dent in everything. Dialgia is the best way to stop this, but a nice Ice Beam from Kyogre will work well too. Stone Egde from Kabutops helps alleviate the pressure (Pun intended) Giratina puts on the team.

Sub Punch Palkia - I hate this set, as it completely and utterly counters 4 out of 6 Pokemon on my Team. I don't see these often, so usually I'm safe. But if a Palkia subs up and starts a punchin, that's GG. A trade off I'm willing to put up with. If I'm lucky, Lugia can survive a Thunder and Whirlwind Palkia out, giving me a fighting chance. Ghost Arceus is the best counter to the set, but is for some crazy ass reason Arceus is gone, then SubPunch Palkia still has the upperhand.

Sub Hone Claws Zekrom - This set it the bane of my existence, as there is nothing my team can do to this set. Zekrom simply subs up and laughs at my attempts to do anything as it sets up. From there, it easily goes on a sweeping spree, dispatching all of my Pokemon. My best bet is usually to get rid of these as soon as possible. With some nice predictions it's very possible, and I've done it multiple times. However, there's always that one occasion that they're able to set up, and from there there's nothing I can do. Best handled by a Roar from Dialgia, and then kill later when momentum is back on my side.

That's the Team, feel free to rate, comment, steal, whatever.

Importable

TheRainSong (Kyogre) @ Choice Specs
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SAtk / 4 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Water Spout
- Surf
- Thunder
- Ice Beam

No Quarter (Dialga) @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 56 SAtk / 200 SDef
Quiet Nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
- Stealth Rock
- Draco Meteor
- Fire Blast
- Dragon Tail

Dancin' Days (Kabutops) (M) @ Choice Band
Trait: Swift Swim
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Rapid Spin
- Aqua Jet
- Superpower
- Waterfall

SongRemains (Ferrothorn) (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SDef
Sassy Nature (+SDef, -Spd)
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip
- Spikes
- Thunder Wave

The Ocean (Lugia) @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Ice Beam
- Reflect
- Roost
- Whirlwind

D'yer Mak'er (Arceus) @ Spooky Plate
Trait: Multitype
EVs: 208 HP / 148 Def / 152 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Swords Dance
- ExtremeSpeed
- Shadow Claw
- Recover

 

[waterwarrior]

Brace yourselves, a surge of this kind of Arceus is coming.


I really can't find a huge hole in this team, doesn't have trouble with things like Mewtwo and walls like Chansey. Just watch out for Gastrodon, as that can wall quite a bit of the team, and they're getting more common every day. I think you should run Protect on Ferro and Reflect on Lugia, but that's really just my personal preference, as they're both great moves for both pokes. Great team! :D

EDIT: While you put SubClaws Zekrom in the threatlist, I think CB Zekrom should also be there, as it demolishes most of the team with Bolt Strike, sparing only Ferrothorn and Dialga from a 2HKO, but he's 2HKO'd by Outrage, and nothing on the team outspeeds it when it runs a Jolly nature but Kabutops, but that can't switch in. And of course, if the weather changes...

 

[SJCrew]

My advice for Kabutops: just run both STABs. The absolute worst your opponent can do is run Scarf Terrakion, who is walled between Ferrothorn and Lugia. This way, you'll have slightly less trouble against Giratina, and more of an insurance against enemy Lugia and Zekrom. For this reason, I would also suggest, Arceus Ghost over Arceus Normal. Yeah, your Extremespeed is a lot weaker, but when you're getting to +6 easily, and mending that nasty Giratina weakness, I'd say it's a decent trade.

But then, hooollllly shit Darkrai. Add him to your threat list now, you are insanely weak to him.

 

[ManofSteele]

I really can't find a huge hole in this team, doesn't have trouble with things like Mewtwo and walls like Chansey. Just watch out for Gastrodon, as that can wall quite a bit of the team, and they're getting more common every day. I think you should run Protect on Ferro and Reflect on Lugia, but that's really just my personal preference, as they're both great moves for both pokes. Great team! :D

EDIT: While you put SubClaws Zekrom in the threatlist, I think CB Zekrom should also be there, as it demolishes most of the team with Bolt Strike, sparing only Ferrothorn and Dialga from a 2HKO, but he's 2HKO'd by Outrage, and nothing on the team outspeeds it when it runs a Jolly nature but Kabutops, but that can't switch in. And of course, if the weather changes...

Thanks! I thought about putting CB Zekrom, but the fact of the matter is that while it has the potential to get rid of all my Pokemon, because it's locked into one move I'm able to deal with it very well. With a bit of predicting dashed into the mix, CB Zekrom is usually handled, like you said, by Dialgia and Ferro, preferably the former. While I'll probably have to sack something to get a safe switch, Dialga bites back with a Draco Meteor, and can have Kabutops or Arceus clean up. At the end of the day, the fact that it's locked into one move makes it less of a threat to the team (Which is why SubHC Zekrom is the most threatening thing to the team).

But you're right, CB Zekrom is a large threat to the team, and should be played against with caution.

My advice for Kabutops: just run both STABs. The absolute worst your opponent can do is run Scarf Terrakion, who is walled between Ferrothorn and Lugia. This way, you'll have slightly less trouble against Giratina, and more of an insurance against enemy Lugia and Rayquaza. For this reason, I would also suggest, Arceus Ghost over Arceus Normal. Yeah, your Extremespeed is a lot weaker, but when you're getting to +6 easily, and mending that nasty Giratina weakness, I'd say it's a decent trade.

But then, hooollllly shit Darkrai. Add him to your threat list now, you are insanely weak to him.

I really don't see how Running Stone Edge (I'm presuming) would help me in the fight against a Giratina. Aside from Stone Edge being the most haxy move in the game, I don't see how it would help me. Stone Edge is Barely a 3HKO on Giratina, not factoring in Leftovers, in that amount of time it easilly gets a burn off with Will-O, and then I have a useless Kabutops. Rayquaza is not an issue for me at all, Lugia is a very handy check to that. Opposing Lugias are handled well by Ferro, and don't like taking any attacks from Kyogre.

I'm very open to using a secondary STAB on Kabutops, would you elaborate on how that would help? I guess I'm just in the right mindset to understand your suggestion.

Also, Darkrai is OHKO'd by Kabutops every time, Waterfall or Superpower, but Scarf sets do give me a bit of trouble. Aqua Jet and a proper switch usually alleviates that problem. Darkrai hasn't given me any trouble at all with the team.

 

[InSiiDiOuS]

Fire Blast on Dialga could be changed to Aura Sphere for a more consistent and infinitely more accurate move. In the rain, both moves are 2x effective to Ferrothorn, the only difference being the loss of power. With Aura Sphere, you get more PP and a way to hit other Dialga, EK Arceus, and more for SE damage. Forretress has pitiful SpD anyway and you will still deal heavy damage to it, also both moves with be 1x effective in the rain. GL

 

[Fireburn]

Your team is going to struggle against other Rain teams because you can't really break a Giratina/Ferrothorn/Tentacruel defensive core.

I'd honestly go with SJCrew's suggestions. Make your Extremekiller into a CM Ghostceus - it gives you a spinblocker, which aids against stall, and a potent offensive threat that can still beat stall teams it you get it burnt or normally poisoned or something to their Blissey can't Toxic you. SubPUnch Palkia also cannot usually break you since they don't normally run Water-moves (iirc its SubPunch with Spacial Rend and Thunder as the last two moves.)

The set is Calm Mind/Judgment/Focus Blast/Recover with 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Speed as the EV spread. Use a Timid nature.

Your SubClaws Zekrom weak is easily fixed by dropping Dragon Tail on Dialga for Roar and changing your nature to Modest. Zekrom can't do much with just Dragon Claw and you can just Roar and let hazards take care of it.

Aqua Jet on Kabutops is completely useless seeing as how its so fast and its still not bypassing Extremespeed. Dump it for Stone Edge so you can actually kill Tentacruel and smash Giratina-O's face in. Water/Rock also has generally good coverage in Ubers anyway.

Darkrai is also a huge threat but as long as you play smart with Kabutops you should be okay.

You should be fine with these changes. Nice job on the #5!

 

[polop]

I remember playing against this team so much! So many mulan/ hun references that I don't even know how I got <.< (well that and I think I'm the only guy that you've gone against that actually uses sub claws zeky :D) but oh well on to the rate.

There is a MASSIVE SPECS OGRE weakness on the team. Ferrothorn can try to switch into it but it will just get 2HKOed and cry. In order to alleviate this weakness and provide a spin blocker, I offer an alternate solution then making Arceus a ghost type, while keeping the ability to spin block. Why not try a Speccially defensive Giratina-a in the spot of Lugia? It spin blocks, and can run a mean Restalk set while permanently crippling all Physical attackers with Will-o-wisp and dragon tail or just phaze all with a combination of roar and dragon tail, also UNLIKE THE PREVIOUS COMMENTS, it actually keeps the ability to provide a specsogre switch in :D, and gets a sleep fodder enen though your relying on 33-66% chance of phazing darky out the turn you get sent to sleep since your not dying from a dark pulse!

Regardless great team and good luck with it!

 

[ManofSteele]

@Fireburn

I stopped laddering right around the time that Tentacruel got a big popularity hike (I.E. when people realized that Rain Dish Tent was actualy viable, probably popularized by that "Art Of Rain Stall" RMT), so I never actually faced the core that you mentioned, but I see exactly where you're coming from.

Ghost Arceus sounds great, I would deffinately appreciate a counter to SubPunch Palkia. I'll throw it in there, give it a shot.

Your other suggestions are great too, but I'm a bit hesitant about changing Aqua Jet, mainly because it has gotten me out of many pinch situations before. However, I would like to kick the shit out of Giratina, so I'll swap it out.

Thanks for the rate!! :D

@ Mr. lol

The huns... They are coming...

I actually tried replacing Lugia with Giratina in a couple of matches, but I really missed that great defensive core formed by Dialgia, Ferrothorn, and Lugia. And in all honesty, my Answer to Specs Ogre is Specs Ogre. After any Specs Ogre's HP has dropped past 50% (Or 75% depending on the spread), it becomes so much less threatening. I'm able to switch into a Water Spout and hammer out a Thunder. Although in most cases my opponent and I will both lead with Specs Ogre, and both hamper each other. Its a sacrafice, but SPecs Ogre has not been a problem.

Thanks for the rate and the battles dude!

 

[puregenius]

maybe it's best u put spooky plate on arceus