Media One Piece (spoilers!)

yondie said:
My only question is why are we worshiping Burgess' power when we haven't seen him fight? There's nothing to use from the manga to say he is on Luffy's current level, in fact I remember he couldn't even fight Ace because it would be a blowout

edit: zoro threw a building in alabasta... so what
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LOL, you say that as if its a bad thing. Ace was one of the strongest characters in the series. Whether you choose to admit it is up to you. As Oda implied it time after time. Being weaker than Ace is to be expected. The dude had an island level attack for gods sake.

Jesus Burgess right now should be in a level where Luffy is nothing but fodder against. This guy is the final villain of a Strawhat, so he won't lose this arc. Thats first. Second, depending where he ranks in his crews power rankings his strength fluctuates between Admiral/God level and a little weaker than current Luffy.

So while we don't know for sure, my bet is he should be the third strongest in BBs crew. Making him just weaker than the Admirals. And thats a level that Luffy still has no chance against. But like i said we don't know and won't know for a while. As Burgess will not be a main antagonist this arc and will not be beaten. I doubt Luffy even fights him making this debate pointless.
 
I'm sorry but you do realize if we only talked about facts there would be no thread right? My posts themselves admit its nothing but opinion. What this whole thread is.
 
some hero said:
This guy is the final villain of a Strawhat, so he won't lose this arc.
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I really wanted to say this, but bringing up plot reasons feels like cheating to me. Thanks for doing it for me.

@Chou your last two posts are getting dangerously close to "everyone is stupid but me" level.
 
One thing that we're not considering though Luffy is in a group against Sai and Don two combatanants that have numbers on their bodies like the cyborg that presumably beat Drake if they're on the same league as the cyborg luffy won't have an easy time especially if he can't use his devil fruit ability (If Franky didn't specifically warn him about it I really doubt he'd remember) and is instead relying on his nonexistant sword skills. Not saying he'll lose but it seems likely his cover will be blown way before luffy vs burguess happens. (Honestly I can't see the D block being interesting anyway it'd be fine to end the tourney prematurely with C block, establishes Burguess, reintroduces a reformed bellamy, introduces bartolomew who hopefully establishes himself further and destroys an improved bellamy, and ends with Luffy revealing himself)
 
Bringing up something from a while back. The WB Pirates were crippled when they fought the Marines. Which is why they were blown out so easily. Firstly, most of a Yonkous power comes from the captain. WB was a Haki-less, slow, damage magnet. All he could do is lead and blast people. A prime WB would have been much more terrifying and done a lot more damage. Then there is the problem of two WB commanders being taken out. Ace couldn't fight most of the war. And Thatch was dead. Thats two extremely powerful fighters that were unavailable to kick some marine ass.

So it was obvious that these were the weakest WB pirates ever. Which is why Kaido tried to take advantage of it.

DrRobotnik said:
There's an extremely obvious giveaway that Burgess is a ton stronger than Luffy physically. I'll give you three guesses.

As for the Haki comment, that was about why he couldn't fight Ace. I don't think Haki's going to be the deciding factor here.

Also I'm pretty sure Blackbeard knew what Haki was, pre-fruit he was able to injure Shanks and he was a member of the world's strongest pirate crew for at least 15 years. I guess he just hasn't used armament because it would be a waste of energy.
.
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BB DID know what haki was pre TS. Wether he could use it or not is the problem. Hehe, my lil theory on that is he can't use Haki at all.

Imo Burgess, and the rest of the BB pirates, were already as strong as they were gonna be pre TS. Already haki users if at all. They just got and mastered broken DFs. Increasing their powers considerably. Burgess having or not having Haki doesn't matter. Ace was THAT strong.

I get this feeling everywhere i go that the fanbase really underrates Ace.


Mario With Lasers said:
I'll laugh when we find out Jesusburger has eaten some broken DF already and can easily counterteam Luffy, so BB has an even more nefarious motive to want the Mera Mera.



(because that's the only way Luffy vs Burgess will even be slightly interesting. Plot Armor, we need some curveball here, etc)
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I agree with all of this. But remember, the Marines are about to crash the party. So no Luffy vs Burgess. Though in the end the marines will end up having saved Luffys ass.


Also Burgess should have a broken fruit. Thats what BB has been doing for two years.
 
I'm not underestimating Ace, I know he was ridiculously powerful and would've easily taken Burgess one on one. Why I think he and Auger didn't have Haki was that Blackbeard said they'd do nothing against him, although 3 on 1 is definitely still an advantage, especially considering Auger doesn't even need to be near Ace. And, as I've stated previously, there's really no reason why Burgess would know Haki and Auger wouldn't.
 
DrRobotnik said:
I'm not underestimating Ace, I know he was ridiculously powerful and would've easily taken Burgess one on one. Why I think he and Auger didn't have Haki was that Blackbeard said they'd do nothing against him, although 3 on 1 is definitely still an advantage, especially considering Auger doesn't even need to be near Ace. And, as I've stated previously, there's really no reason why Burgess would know Haki and Auger wouldn't.
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It's funny you say that... Sanji knows Haki. Yet Ussop and everyone not in the monster trio don't. And we haven't seen them(Sanji/Zoro/Luffy) offer to teach the others. So it may the same with the BB crew. No reason to think that if one knows it he has to teach the others and so all must know it.
 
DrRobotnik said:
I really wanted to say this, but bringing up plot reasons feels like cheating to me. Thanks for doing it for me.

@Chou your last two posts are getting dangerously close to "everyone is stupid but me" level.
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Who said but me? Panamaxis, loco, Mario, Aldaron, Alex, yondie-- plenty of smart posters here
 
And now we have chou creating a list of smart posters... Time to hit the ignore buttom.

DrRobotnik said:
I'm sure the rest of the Straw Hats will learn Haki. My bet is Franky and/or Usopp first.
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Why those two??? And how??? Ussop is pretty weak and while he did get stronger over the TS, him learning Haki might kill his character. He is supposed to be the "human" in the crew. So him being weak(compared to the rest) does serve a purpose. And Frankys battlestyle is... Umm.. What is it again? Is strong right like his only punch? Yeah, can't see him using it. Or at least it doesn't mesh well with his weaponry.

Choppa and Brook could use it though. Choppa especially since he is a Zoan. A close combat specialist.
 
Franky doesn't need Haki, only SUUUUU~PER-imbued punches. And Cola.

I can totally see Chopper getting it too, even though I wonder if an animal can have haki... dunno why.

DrRobotnik said:
And, I'm confused, was it ever confirmed whether or not Haki worked with ranged weapons?
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The Kuja Amazons ?__?
 
@some hero I meant to say Brook, not Usopp.

edit: wait, they do work on ranged stuff. If that's the case Franky would be a monster with it, proably the most useful.
 
personally I put Burgess as 7th strongest BB pirate at best. I put all the Level 6 guys + Shilliew above him (and BB himself ofc) because BB went to so much trouble to get those guys to join his crew - would he really go to all that effort / take that huge risk just to get a couple of guys that were weaker than crewmates he already had?

Burgess being just below Admiral level would mean he would have had a ridiculous jump in strength over the timeskip if he was fodder to Ace preskip, probably the biggest growth in all of one piece. So yeah, I put him as roughly luffy level but a bit below luffy.
 
So are we not making the poster tier list?

Atm, I agree with pana about Burgess. BB went through way too much trouble to get the Level 6 prisoners and for Burgess to just jump ahead of most of them wouldn't make much sense. I had thought Burgess v Franky before but I like the idea of Usopp v Burgess, it would be nice for the "Champion" to lose to someone that was always seen as the wimp.
 
Ussop is a gunner, he'd face Van Auger just like Yasop from Akagamis crew. I also nominate Ussop to get at least armorment haki, he needs haki infused bullets (and a proper gun) to compete with the worlds best snipers.
 
TheFourthChaser said:
So are we not making the poster tier list?

Atm, I agree with pana about Burgess. BB went through way too much trouble to get the Level 6 prisoners and for Burgess to just jump ahead of most of them wouldn't make much sense. I had thought Burgess v Franky before but I like the idea of Usopp v Burgess, it would be nice for the "Champion" to lose to someone that was always seen as the wimp.
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Ok, i am a little biased since i love Burgess but no way hes that weak. Well he could be... But first, the level 6 inmates. BB didn't go after anyone specifically, meaning the level 6 prisoners don't have to be strongest in his crew. They are stupid strong though. We know this because they survived the battle royale. Had BB gone to rescue them then your argument makes sense. He would have gone through all that trouble to rescue certain prisoners. As is we just know they are strong, but not strong enough to make BB go looking for them. So none(except Shiryuu) have to be stronger than Jesus.

BB Pirates vs Strawhats:

Blackbeard vs Luffy
Shiryuu vs Zoro
Jesus Burgess vs Sanji
Pizarro vs Jinbei
San Juan Wolf vs Franky
Doc Q and his horse vs Choppa
The Mighty Drinker vs Brook
Auger vs Ussop
Catarina vs Robin
Laffite vs Nami

To be honest not sure at all who Brook will fight.


X5Dragon said:
Ussop is a gunner, he'd face Van Auger just like Yasop from Akagamis crew. I also nominate Ussop to get at least armorment haki, he needs haki infused bullets (and a proper gun) to compete with the worlds best snipers.
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Now he needs a gun?? I'm pretty sure he'll never use a gun... He'd have done so by now. He spent two years mastering his gardening skills, he isn't just going to throw away it for range. And tbh his range is incredible already. With a slingshot... Not as stupid as what Auger did, but i'm sure he will be able to do that with a slingshot.
 
Gun or not, ussopp needs that haki to compete with elite level snipers. And ussopp isn't supposed to be "human", remember he doesn't get sick like luffy.
 
Yeah I don't think the level 6 prisoners are much ahead of Burgess/Auger/Lafitte/Doc. I'm sure BB would've loved to have gotten a guy like Croc or Jimbe, but they weren't available, so he instead took guys like Sanjuanwolf. Also, just because BB told Auger and Burgess to stand down against Ace doesn't mean they don't have Haki, it's just means Ace would overpower them, which isn't saying much since pre-timeskip, Marco/Jozu/Ace were without a doubt stronger than those guys. It's basically implied that all Yonko are approximately equal and if BB's crewmates were significantly weaker than WB's commanders, Marco would be a Yonko, not BB. You also have to realize that during the timeskip, BB has been actively conquering the WB pirates' territory. Does anyone honestly think no major battles broke out between them? BB can't take on every WB commander at the same time, so it's safe to assume that guys like Burgess were taking on the others and probably had the upper hand as well. Even if we assume that WB held off both Marco and Jozu, Burgess was still able to take on Curiel level fighters, which means he could legitimately take on Marco/Jozu. And Chou, being able to fight someone on equal terms=/=equal strength, Marco/Jozu>Burgess is a given, but Burgess would almost certainly be able to hold his own, or else the BB pirates would get flattened. Jozu can take on Aokiji, but Jozu would also lose 9/10 fights.

As for growth rate, yes, Burgess absolutely grew as much as Luffy/the rest of the Strawhats during the timeskip if not moreso. Based on what we've seen in the manga so far, training is not the fastest way for someone to get stronger. Real fights are how someone gets stronger. While the SHs were busy training in remote parts of the world, Burgess/Auger/Lafitte/Doc were out there fighting actual high level opponents and getting experience for using their techniques in practical situations. The timeskip was just a plot device for Oda to set up Blackbeard/Akainu/Kidd/Law etc in the new world, give Luffy Haki without him suddenly waking up one day a master of CoA, and giving guys like Usopp/Nami/Chopper new techniques so they don't get fodderized by everyone and everything in the New World. There's no way that a guy who'll likely be a final opponent for a Strawhat would be weaker than Luffy halfway through the story. He's a main fighter on a Yonko ship for heavens sakes. If guys like Pekoms, who is supposedly a "second tier" crewmate of Big Mom is that strong (seriously the guy could legitimately take on any of the Monster Trio just with what he's shown so far), I have no doubt that Burgess would win 1v1 against any strawhat.

As for Don Chinjao/Sai/Boo's numbers, could they perhaps be numbers in Kaidou's zoan army? The first one to get an artificial fruit was "experiment #1", Android 18 (yes I'm calling him that from now on :D) was "experiment #18" etc. Although more likely than not they're power levels or district numbers. Speaking of Android 18, highly doubt he beat Drake. At most that fight ended up being a draw. According people on Shabondy Archipelago post timeskip, Kidd and Drake have been the most successful Supernovas. Getting a beatdown by basically an Impel Down Demon Guard on steroids can't bode well for your reputation, even if Android 18 is a Curiel level fighter.

Just for fun:
Blackbeard vs Luffy (obvious)
Shiryuu vs Zoro (need to cut diamond somehow)
Sanjuanwolf vs Jimbe+Sanji (Wadatsumi was a foreshadow ;))
Pizarro vs Sabo (fap)
Vasco vs new strawhat?
Catarina vs Robin (female vs female)
Burgess vs Franky (brawler vs brawler)
Lafitte vs Brook (they're both skinny, half-dead, and dance around a lot)
Auger vs Usopp (sniper vs sniper)
Doc vs Nami (I honestly have no clue what's going to be done with Nami)
Stronger vs Chopper (jk he'll end up fighting either Pizarro who has an "animal" sense to him, or Doc in a Dr vs Dr fight)
 
Well nobody said Ussop had to use only one weapon, he can strap on a flint or a hand gun like his daddy on the waist. The slingshot is great and as pointed out Usopp has prolly the most verstaile ammo (seeds) of any gunner worldwide, but two things the sling lacks and is badly needed:

1) Firing repeatedly
2) Infusing haki into bullets

Unless Ussop gains unhuman speed so he can sling as fast as a gun can fire, or finds a seed to infuse haki with, he's gonna need a gun (pun intended).


Edit: Congrats Phllip somebody copied your tatoo image to facebook.
 
Usopp probably won't get armament haki, his projectiles are living things and I don't think you can armament other living things. Mantra, definitely.

As for SH vs BB predictions:

Blackbeard vs. Luffy
Shiliew vs. Zoro
Van Auger vs. Usopp
Doc Q and Stronger vs. Chopper
Lafitte vs. Brook
Jesus vs. Jinbei
Sanjuan vs. Franky
Avalo vs. Sanji
Catarina vs. Nami
Vasco vs. Robin
 
Edit: and TFC and Crux... though more funny... Maybe funniest poster in the thread

Gdamn it crux making me have to list them all-- going to miss someone; I'm not even close to my 7k yet, I shouldn't have to think about social obligation
 
New World Order said:
Yeah I don't think the level 6 prisoners are much ahead of Burgess/Auger/Lafitte/Doc. I'm sure BB would've loved to have gotten a guy like Croc or Jimbe, but they weren't available, so he instead took guys like Sanjuanwolf. Also, just because BB told Auger and Burgess to stand down against Ace doesn't mean they don't have Haki, it's just means Ace would overpower them, which isn't saying much since pre-timeskip, Marco/Jozu/Ace were without a doubt stronger than those guys. It's basically implied that all Yonko are approximately equal and if BB's crewmates were significantly weaker than WB's commanders, Marco would be a Yonko, not BB. You also have to realize that during the timeskip, BB has been actively conquering the WB pirates' territory. Does anyone honestly think no major battles broke out between them? BB can't take on every WB commander at the same time, so it's safe to assume that guys like Burgess were taking on the others and probably had the upper hand as well. Even if we assume that WB held off both Marco and Jozu, Burgess was still able to take on Curiel level fighters, which means he could legitimately take on Marco/Jozu. And Chou, being able to fight someone on equal terms=/=equal strength, Marco/Jozu>Burgess is a given, but Burgess would almost certainly be able to hold his own, or else the BB pirates would get flattened. Jozu can take on Aokiji, but Jozu would also lose 9/10 fights.

As for growth rate, yes, Burgess absolutely grew as much as Luffy/the rest of the Strawhats during the timeskip if not moreso. Based on what we've seen in the manga so far, training is not the fastest way for someone to get stronger. Real fights are how someone gets stronger. While the SHs were busy training in remote parts of the world, Burgess/Auger/Lafitte/Doc were out there fighting actual high level opponents and getting experience for using their techniques in practical situations. The timeskip was just a plot device for Oda to set up Blackbeard/Akainu/Kidd/Law etc in the new world, give Luffy Haki without him suddenly waking up one day a master of CoA, and giving guys like Usopp/Nami/Chopper new techniques so they don't get fodderized by everyone and everything in the New World. There's no way that a guy who'll likely be a final opponent for a Strawhat would be weaker than Luffy halfway through the story. He's a main fighter on a Yonko ship for heavens sakes. If guys like Pekoms, who is supposedly a "second tier" crewmate of Big Mom is that strong (seriously the guy could legitimately take on any of the Monster Trio just with what he's shown so far), I have no doubt that Burgess would win 1v1 against any strawhat.

As for Don Chinjao/Sai/Boo's numbers, could they perhaps be numbers in Kaidou's zoan army? The first one to get an artificial fruit was "experiment #1", Android 18 (yes I'm calling him that from now on :D) was "experiment #18" etc. Although more likely than not they're power levels or district numbers. Speaking of Android 18, highly doubt he beat Drake. At most that fight ended up being a draw. According people on Shabondy Archipelago post timeskip, Kidd and Drake have been the most successful Supernovas. Getting a beatdown by basically an Impel Down Demon Guard on steroids can't bode well for your reputation, even if Android 18 is a Curiel level fighter.

Just for fun:
Blackbeard vs Luffy (obvious)
Shiryuu vs Zoro (need to cut diamond somehow)
Sanjuanwolf vs Jimbe+Sanji (Wadatsumi was a foreshadow ;))
Pizarro vs Sabo (fap)
Vasco vs new strawhat?
Catarina vs Nami (female vs female)
Burgess vs Franky (brawler vs brawler)
Lafitte vs Brook (they're both skinny, half-dead, and dance around a lot)
Auger vs Usopp (sniper vs sniper)
Doc vs Nami (I honestly have no clue what's going to be done with Nami)
Stronger vs Chopper (jk he'll end up fighting either Pizarro who has an "animal" sense to him, or Doc in a Dr vs Dr fight)
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You forgot Robin... You placed a new Strawhat and Sabo over Robin...


Well nobody said Ussop had to use only one weapon, he can strap on a flint or a hand gun like his daddy on the waist. The slingshot is great and as pointed out Usopp has prolly the most verstaile ammo (seeds) of any gunner worldwide, but two things the sling lacks and is badly needed:

1) Firing repeatedly
2) Infusing haki into bullets

Unless Ussop gains unhuman speed so he can sling as fast as a gun can fire, or finds a seed to infuse haki with, he's gonna need a gun (pun intended).
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I think that's the point. The loss of firing speed is made up by his weapons versatility. And CoO would probably be better for Ussop anyway. Hes not going to beat anyone with CoA that he can't already without it, doesn't match up with his ammunition and isn't supposed to be a close range fighter. CoO is much better for him. He can find targets. And know where they are so he can run away if they get too close. This essentially eliminates the need for a spotter. He can truly work alone with CoO.
 
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