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Pokémon Aegislash

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true thats why i put the HP Ice option in my set to counter gliscor and also landorus T 2huge threats

I don't see how you can fit HP Ice into any of Aegislash's movepools without taking a move out thats more important, let alone just to counter two pokemon... AND its the nerfed HP with only 60BP now, which is special too, so swords dance boosts wouldn't affect it.

What movepool does your Aegislash run?
 
Shadow ball
Iron Head
HP Ice/Sacred Sword/Kings Shield
Automotize
your forgetting that some pokemon have to sacrifice a move to cover certain things and hp ice is more important since landorius-T 76Atk impish nature = Earthquake: 52.46 - 62.96% is guaranteed 2hko against max hp max def impish aegislash but this is only one pokemon that has a very powerfull earthquake with little atk investment but as always this can be avoided by using an air balloon of course.
 
Shadow ball
Iron Head
HP Ice/Sacred Sword/Kings Shield
Automotize
your forgetting that some pokemon have to sacrifice a move to cover certain things and hp ice is more important since landorius-T 76Atk impish nature = Earthquake: 52.46 - 62.96% is guaranteed 2hko against max hp max def impish aegislash but this is only one pokemon that has a very powerfull earthquake with little atk investment but as always this can be avoided by using an air balloon of course.

I have to admit that movepool is quite unique, I like the look of it... but the lack of Kings shield is an interesting choice, do you use this guy as a revenge killer/setup sweep/hit and run?

Would you consider running flash cannon instead of iron head? that way you can invest EV's into SpAtk.

What is the damage calc for HP Ice vs Landorus-T?
 
The beauty of it too is that even if Aegislash bothered to King's Shield the Foul Play, it won't matter because Klefki's own attack makes no difference on the damage output, so Klefki has nothing to fear from the attack drop.
This is the main reason why I believe Foul Play is a good countermeasure for Aegislash. No offensive investment is needed to threaten Aegislash and you can put all that investemt into bulk to take its hits better. The best part is that most (bulky) users of Foul Play can handle both Stance Dance and Wallbreaker Aegislash; the former is threatened if it tries Swords Dance, and the latter is threatened as it cannot switch back into Shield Stance.

What is the damage calc for HP Ice vs Landorus-T?
252+ SpA (150 Special Attack) (60 Ice Special) vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-T: 384-456 (100.78 - 119.68%) -- guaranteed OHKO

A clean kill. This is why I don't rely on 4x Ice-weak Ground-types to beat Aegislash, instead relying on stuff like Hippowdon or the aforementioned Klefki to beat it.
 
well when i use this set i use a weakness policy and only late game sweeper/cleanup with enough Hp and Def to cleanly survive a stab boosted eq from adamant 252atk Landorus-T(with no life orb) and with an added bonus the weakness policy kicks in you can KO 252HP 252 SpDef Careful Landoris T and Gliscor same EVs with ease just note this is after weakness policy also this is without any atk / spatk investment at all iron head is better imo i like to utilize its amazing 150 atk/spatk
 
Shadow ball
Iron Head
HP Ice/Sacred Sword/Kings Shield
Automotize
your forgetting that some pokemon have to sacrifice a move to cover certain things and hp ice is more important since landorius-T 76Atk impish nature = Earthquake: 52.46 - 62.96% is guaranteed 2hko against max hp max def impish aegislash but this is only one pokemon that has a very powerfull earthquake with little atk investment but as always this can be avoided by using an air balloon of course.
Unless your team is having some troubles with Faries I'd suggest Sacred Sword over Iron Head because it hits Normals (immune to Ghost), and Darks (resist Ghost) and especially Tyranitar. I really don't think that any Steel type attacks are all that useful and they don't really give any extra coverage that Fighting doesn't already, besides Fairy which already takes neutral from Shadow Ball. Fighting really just hits more important Pokemon than Steel. Even though it's a dual STAB, Fighting+Ghost is an unresisted combination(also hits some of would-be checks/counters)

I have to admit that movepool is quite unique, I like the look of it... but the lack of Kings shield is an interesting choice, do you use this guy as a revenge killer/setup sweep/hit and run?

Would you consider running flash cannon instead of iron head? that way you can invest EV's into SpAtk.

What is the damage calc for HP Ice vs Landorus-T?
The set is really close to Ultimario's. Where you run max Speed max Special Attack with a minus Attack Nature. Personally I use it by switching Aegislash in after a KO or into a good resist/immunity then on their switch set up an Automatize. With almost everyone running the physical Swords Dance Aegislash people are generally taken off guard and Aegislash can usually score at least 1 surprise KO at worst and sweep an entire team at best, with enough prior damage/right pokemon taken out. It can, from my experience, take out around 2 pokemon, dying from either LO recoil or one of their pokemon tanking a hit. But by that point it has done the damage it needed.
 
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im pretty sure a standard pokemon with earthquake can ohko 252hp aegislash with no defence investment also fire attacks will make short work of aegislash forcing you to attack or switch out since you cant suvive the most standard users of these moves. being as common type coverage attacks as fire and ground are you will have to use air balloon on aegislash or some gimmick. also theres no official sets that are proven to work well yet so try and experiment with everything instead of using what everyone is using. tends to be the most helpful.
 
im pretty sure a standard pokemon with earthquake can ohko 252hp aegislash with no defence investment also fire attacks will make short work of aegislash forcing you to attack or switch out since you cant suvive the most standard users of these moves. being as common type coverage attacks as fire and ground are you will have to use air balloon on aegislash or some gimmick. also theres no official sets that are proven to work well yet so try and experiment with everything instead of using what everyone is using. tends to be the most helpful.

Exca with max attack and no item can't ohko 252/0 Aegislash with EQ, that should say something about its bulk in sheild form.

Genesects +1 flamethrower does like 50-55% to shield form Aegis.
 
This thing can tank SE hits much better than one might think. As long as you don't overestimate it's bulk, it can take a great deal of SE hits, set up, then kill them with boosted shadow sneak (which I've done quite a few times with the, I believe it to be, standard 252HP/252Attk spread.)
 
nobody denied its bulk its base 60/150/150 which is very good but it gives up a turn to setup and kings shield not triggering from an earthquake if you dont have an airballoon you get destroyed by it also it being weak to spikes 252+ Atk Excadrill Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def (custom): 260-308 (80.24 - 95.06%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock and 2 layers or Spikes or just 3layers of spikes without life orb i feel as though 252 HP with no def investment is just a 50/50 chance of succeeding also with the introduction of diggersby its immune to ghost type moves which keeps bringing up one of aegislash main weakness which is its speed just an example so i think it will come down to if the team is prepared or not for aegislash but from the looks of it everyone should be prepared since right now its the most used pokemon from my experience.
 
Wait, King's Shield does block EQ right? It won't lower the attack, of course, since it doesn't make contact, but revertin back to shield form can protect you from at least non-stabbed EQs. Also under certain circumstances Aegis can take out Excadrill. (Exca switchin in, or Aegis bein at full health etc). Diggersby on the other hand, it's a bit trickier since you can only kill it on the switch, otherwise it pretty much hard walls the standard spread and moveset of SD/sacred sword/s.sneak/king's shield.

But it is true that everyone gets prepared for it now, I got surprised by a sucker punch Latias the other day.
 
Wait, King's Shield does block EQ right? It won't lower the attack, of course, since it doesn't make contact, but revertin back to shield form can protect you from at least non-stabbed EQs. Also under certain circumstances Aegis can take out Excadrill. (Exca switchin in, or Aegis bein at full health etc). Diggersby on the other hand, it's a bit trickier since you can only kill it on the switch, otherwise it pretty much hard walls the standard spread and moveset of SD/sacred sword/s.sneak/king's shield.

But it is true that everyone gets prepared for it now, I got surprised by a sucker punch Latias the other day.
King's Shield blocks all damages, so yes, Earthquake is negated.
Speaking of that, though, Garchomp seems to be a solid counter; he at least has a good chance to OHKO Shield Forme Aegislash with Earthquake, and I'm pretty sure Aegislash can't OHKO him with +2 Shadow Sneak. Some calcs would help but I'm a noob.
 
Haven't had a chance to read through every post, but wouldn't Unaware Defensive Quagsire be a solid counter? Laughs at the SD boosts, threatens a burn with Scald or major dmg with Earthquake?
 
252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def (custom): 254-300 (86.68 - 102.38%) -- 18.75% chance to OHKO without life orb which is unlikely chomp wont have one unless its Swords variant yeah quagsire could work too if it gets the burn\ +2 252+ Atk (custom) Shadow Sneak vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Nidoking: 198-234 (65.34 - 77.22%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and nidoking has an 87.5% chance to OHKO and guaranteed OHKO after stealth rocks.
 
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252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def (custom): 254-300 (86.68 - 102.38%) -- 18.75% chance to OHKO without life orb which is unlikely chomp wont have one unless its Swords variant yeah quagsire could work too if it gets burn
Needs some prior damage, 2 layers of Spikes perhaps. Still does better than most, though.
EDIT: Cheers. The Nidoking calcs are also interesting, though idk if he'll get much usage in OU.
 
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252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def (custom): 254-300 (86.68 - 102.38%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock and Spikes guaranteed OHKO after 1 leyer of spikes and stealth rocks or just 2layers of spikes
 
252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def (custom): 254-300 (86.68 - 102.38%) -- 18.75% chance to OHKO without life orb which is unlikely chomp wont have one unless its Swords variant yeah quagsire could work too if it gets the burn\ +2 252+ Atk (custom) Shadow Sneak vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Nidoking: 198-234 (65.34 - 77.22%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and nidoking has an 87.5% chance to OHKO and guaranteed OHKO after stealth rocks.

I assume that Nidoking calculation takes into account max attack EVs investment, right ? And neutral nature ?

Honestly I always found Nidoking really underrated Pokemon with great wallbreaking potential even in OU. I asked you for those attack EVs, because I don't think going full physical on Nidoking is good idea (he needs some special attacks for coverage and to break through some walls), while he needs some Speed EVs as well to not be outspeeded by some nasty stuff (although with paralysis + sticky web support it's not that big of a problem). Because if you need to go full physical - I wouldn't really consider Nidoking for any serious OU team while going this way. It's just too easily walled, unless you want to go with some weird Hone Claws set.

BTW Quagsire thanks to Unaware ignores SD boosts from Aegislash, which deals pitiful damage to him without boosts, making him 100% counter.

Also this Nidoking calc on him shows that Aegislash as Swords Dancer is underwhelming if your team is somewhat prepared (or not really, I have a team where I use MegaBlastoise as main Aegislash check and it's working totally fine, even +4 Shadow Sneak is not close to OHKOing it and you easily 2HKO it back with Dark Pulse. If you switch on +2 Aegislash - you win anyway unless you get unlucky crit). Of course it's not bad, but calling it one of the strongest Pokemon in tier is overstatement (at least SD set, am I the only one calling it overrated ?). Anything relatively bulky and with a way to hit him for SE damage with special or physical attack ignoring his King's Shield is a good way to counter him without problems. Or you may phaze him out as well. I would rather say that mixed sets give more trouble than SD sets, because of good surprise factor they provide and good power.
 
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People keep using Shadow Sneak why? It won't KO very many of the threats unless at +6, even then manypeople that runT-tar use Fire Blast anyway.

Actually it's a great tool in decimatin frail sweepers or pokemon weak to it. I've taken out entire teams left with their frailer mons with +2 or +4 Shadow sneak (whether it bein late-game or just a team of frailer, offensive-oriented pokes), it is really useful on Aegislash.

And about Aegislash and it's weakness to EQ, granted, most of the powerful ground-typed pokes can just smash it even if it's in defense mode. I even use an offensive SD Gliscor as a counter to it and I've always managed to OHKO it without boosts so far (but with an Adamant nature, haven't calculated the exact damage output with a calculator either, maybe someone could check on that one). What I said was that he can actually taken an UnSTAB-bed EQ relatively well, so if he can KO the opponent, then it doesn't matter too much imo. Quagsire does sound like a pretty solid counter, tho.
 
Haven't had a chance to read through every post, but wouldn't Unaware Defensive Quagsire be a solid counter? Laughs at the SD boosts, threatens a burn with Scald or major dmg with Earthquake?
I made a post about that on page 13 with the calcs and everything. Quagsire can even take a 252 Shadow Ball and hit Aegislash's Sword Forme for the OHKO.

252+ Atk (custom) Shadow Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def (custom): 58-70 (28.71 - 34.65%) -- possible 4HKO
252+ Atk (custom) Sacred Sword vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def (custom): 51-60 (25.24 - 29.7%) -- possible 4HKO
252+ Atk (custom) Shadow Sneak vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def (custom): 34-42 (16.83 - 20.79%) -- possible 7HKO

0 Atk (custom) Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def (custom): 170-204 (125.92 - 151.11%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Sword Forme)
0 Atk (custom) Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def (custom): 72-86 (53.33 - 63.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Shield Forme)

252 SpA (custom) Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD (custom): 108-127 (53.46 - 62.87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
 
Your Shadow Ball Calcs don't even use any of Spooky Plate, Life Orb, or +SpA. With any of those factors, if Quaggy switches into any move and then takes a Shadow Ball, it's dead. Or if it flat out switched in on +SpA LO Shadow Ball, dead. Being slower than Aegi sucks.
 
Your Shadow Ball Calcs don't even use any of Spooky Plate, Life Orb, or +SpA. With any of those factors, if Quaggy switches into any move and then takes a Shadow Ball, it's dead. Or if it flat out switched in on +SpA LO Shadow Ball, dead. Being slower than Aegi sucks.
Oh man ill go fix that. Sorry. But I did 252 Sp Atk evs with Modest nature in the calcs. It is a 2HKO unless you have 2-3 layers of Spikes and Stealth Rock on the field. As I said in my post you have to switch in Quagsire in after a KO when facing the special variant and tank a Shadow Ball and return with EQ for the KO. Making Quagsire far less effective at checking the Special/Mixed set. Being slower than Aegislash comes into play because that means that it will always get the hit on the Sword Forme allowing it to OHKO if aegislash stays in. As compared to a 2 shot if it were faster and had to hit the Shield.

252+ SpA Life Orb (custom) Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD (custom): 296-348 (75.12 - 88.32%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
 
+2 Shadow Sneak was doin about 25% on Offensive Gliscor, so yeah, tho I believe it was mentioned before, Gliscor is a pretty much solid counter for physical sets but .. anyone checked how the special ones fare against him? Tho I guess he should still be able to at least be a good check, unless if Aegislash is carryin HP ice, I guess? Would that be viable on him? Probably only good on the switch, for surprise value, imo.
 
+2 Shadow Sneak was doin about 25% on Offensive Gliscor, so yeah, tho I believe it was mentioned before, Gliscor is a pretty much solid counter for physical sets but .. anyone checked how the special ones fare against him? Tho I guess he should still be able to at least be a good check, unless if Aegislash is carryin HP ice, I guess? Would that be viable on him? Probably only good on the switch, for surprise value, imo.

252+ SpA (custom) Shadow Ball vs. 244 HP / 0 SpD Gliscor: 204-240 (57.95 - 68.18%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ SpA Life Orb (custom) Hidden Power Ice vs. 244 HP / 0 SpD Gliscor: 530-624 (150.56 - 177.27%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ SpA Life Orb (custom) Shadow Ball vs. 244 HP / 0 SpD Gliscor: 265-312 (75.28 - 88.63%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Shadow ball still puts the pressure on gliscor.
 
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