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Pokémon Goodra [REVAMP]

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I'm finding it hard to get around this Pokemon, so I'm hear on how to beat it. It takes 3-4 hits to take down with Noivern using dragon moves, WTF, and 2HKO with Aurorus but ends up getting Focus Blasted being Ko'ed in 1 shot on it's first turn. Any way to Check this Pokemon with a team of...
Rhyperior, Delphox, Aurorus, Sylveon, Noivern and Chloro Venusuar?
EDIT: Sylveon hits 3 for KO but I don't get a chance due to poison moves.
 
Cheeze Ballz said:
I'm finding it hard to get around this Pokemon, so I'm hear on how to beat it. It takes 3-4 hits to take down with Noivern using dragon moves, WTF, and 2HKO with Aurorus but ends up getting Focus Blasted being Ko'ed in 1 shot on it's first turn. Any way to Check this Pokemon with a team of...
Rhyperior, Delphox, Aurorus, Sylveon, Noivern and Chloro Venusuar?
EDIT: Sylveon hits 3 for KO but I don't get a chance due to poison moves.
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Goodra, unless it is EV'd in Defense, cannot take physical hits. You want to take out Goodra? Don't hit it with Special Attacks.
 
False Sense said:
My apologies, I suppose I didn't word that correctly. I honestly didn't mean to suggest that Assault Vest Goodra should be used as a dedicated wall; on the contrary, I believe it should be used as an offensive tank that can hit hard while still being able to take hits. Naturally, without the benefit of support moves or even basic Leftovers recovery, AV Goodra is bound to be worn down over time and can't harm opponents via moves like Toxic. That's why I believe it's best to invest in its offensive power to deal as much damage as possible. Investing in Special Defense is, in my opinion, kind of redundant with Assault Vest as you take away from Goodra's offensive capabilities, which is its only thing it can do due to Assault Vest's downside. I suppose my comparison to Skarmory must have been rather misleading... I meant to show comparison between two pokemon with high defensive stats that granted them switch in opportunities. The difference is that one is a dedicated wall meant to set up hazards and phaze, while the other is much more suited to opening holes in teams with high-powered moves while having the benefit of being very bulky on one side of the spectrum. I apologize if I caused confusion...
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Oh, my mistake. In that case I totally agree with you.

I guess the bottom line is investing in spD with Assault vest is just silly. I would also agree with that investing in SpA is better than Def. In general though I just don't like AV on Goodra! lol

I'd doubt if it is more efficient or effective than a Specs Goodra with some investment in SpD or Def

A defensive set would be best off with leftovers and Def investment imo, though Sassy or Calm could still be good Natures for it.
 
Alright, it looks like a 252HP/252SpA/4Def (?) is best for Goodra. However, what nature? Are there any perks to running a Modest over a Calm?
 
Lol. After the Pokedex said that Goomy was the worst dragon so far. It's pretty funny to see Goordra come back with a shotty to every Pokemon's head that ever doubted it. Look at Magikarp that evolved into Gyarados. Though, Pikachu still made Electric Knock-Knock jokes. But Goodra doesn't suffer from x4 damage. And it has the coolest arsenal of moves I've ever seen.

But who is better? Goodra or Sylveon and what move set should be driven?
 
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I think goodra does ok offensively with no ev's in offenses; it may even do better. A lot of people see that 10 extra points and special moveset and say he's a special attacker. But with full defensive investment, which lets him live longer and deal more attacks effectively doubling his offenses, he also becomes more balanced than a full SpA or Atk goodra. It works really well (in singles this time) to have earthquake, flamethrower, thunderbolt and outrage. I find that in singles he does well with gooey too. Also, in response to saying there isn't much goodra has over latias, look at their abilities.
Also, we don't yet know if he gets reliable recovery, but he probably will. That, and milotic is rare the best of times so it might even be in the games
 
I was wondering if there is a magical number in Speed Evs for Goodra ( To OutSpeed some mons ) or I just stick with 252 HP - 252Spatk/SPDef?
 
A thought:

252 SpA LO Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD AV Goodra: 82 - 97 (21.5 - 25.3%)
252 SpA LO Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0+ SpD AV Goodra: 75 - 88 (19.7 - 23.1%)
252 SpA LO Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD AV Goodra: 64 - 75 (16.7 - 19.7%)

When you're not taking much damage in the first place, further investment doesn't make a particularly big difference.
 
This has been bugging me for a while

What do you guys think about Goodra in comparison to Latias?
They are kinda simmilar in some respect, with massive Special Bulk and 110 SPA, the latter having 110 Speed, Levitate, reliable recovery in Recover, and Calm Mind, except Latias has several notable weakness(Ghost, Dark, Bug). On the flipside, some pokemon troubles Latias can also beat Goodra, namely Scizor(against weakened Goodra), Tyranitar(without Focus Blast)
 
JSND said:
This has been bugging me for a while

What do you guys think about Goodra in comparison to Latias?
They are kinda simmilar in some respect, with massive Special Bulk and 110 SPA, the latter having 110 Speed, Levitate, reliable recovery in Recover, and Calm Mind, except Latias has several notable weakness(Ghost, Dark, Bug). On the flipside, some pokemon troubles Latias can also beat Goodra, namely Scizor(against weakened Goodra), Tyranitar(without Focus Blast)
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Scizor can beat a weakened Goodra, but then again, a lot of weakened things are beaten by Scizor. Tyranitar just craps on Special Attackers in general that don't have Focus Blast, and even then, it can tank some if full SpD investment and Assault Vest.

Goodra and Latias, I feel have different roles. Latias is faster, has great support and utility, but is hampered by her Psychic typing. Goodra, however, is more of an offensive tank, with great coverage and SpD even without investment, and a superior typing. Goodra, if running Sap Sipper, is immune to Grass; if running Hydration is immune to status; if running Gooey has a way to hamper physical attackers. Latias has Levitate, which protects it from ground based entry hazards and Ground immunity. Whichever one is better suited for your team, use.
 
Assault Vest Goodra seems to be some hype sparked initially when youtuber Shofu first showcased it in one of his battles. In reality though, it's not all that great. Half the time all Goodra does is take Volt Switches/Hydro Pumps from uninvested Rotom Washes, and even if you're offensive, Rotom-W can't do any real damage to Goodra. Plus, Leftovers in this case is much more ideal. With no reliable recovery outside of Rest, Lefties are essential for Goodra!Assault Vest is just plain silly IMO unless you're planning on taking Specs Draco Meteors from Latios. I'm kidding. Please don't do that.

In a lot of aspects, Goodra is outclassed by Latias. They share similar stats and typing, but the latter provides Wish/Healing Wish support, Dual Screens, access to reliable recovery, and superior speed. They have the same special attack too, which is doing no favors for Goodra. The only thing Goodra has going for it over Latias is not being trapped by TTar and access to Fire Blast/Focus Blast to destroy Ferrothorn, Heatran, and Tyranitar.

It's a pretty good mon, and definitely staying in OU, but like a lot of the new Dragons this generation, Goodra is outclassed in most cases by the dragons of previous generations.
 
I just have to say that if you put gooey as Goodra's ability Malamar immediately has the chance to become a freight train depending on who is on your team because not only does he get the attack and defense boost from superpower but also the speed boost from gooey. So this is just something to think about.
 
Scootnalboond said:
I just have to say that if you put gooey as Goodra's ability Malamar immediately has the chance to become a freight train depending on who is on your team because not only does he get the attack and defense boost from superpower but also the speed boost from gooey. So this is just something to think about.
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And who is going to be using Malamar? Not many people. And also, who would keep Goodra, with its pathetic Defense, on a Malamar?
 
Thorhammer said:
A thought:

252 SpA LO Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD AV Goodra: 82 - 97 (21.5 - 25.3%)
252 SpA LO Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0+ SpD AV Goodra: 75 - 88 (19.7 - 23.1%)
252 SpA LO Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD AV Goodra: 64 - 75 (16.7 - 19.7%)

When you're not taking much damage in the first place, further investment doesn't make a particularly big difference.
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So the only difference between AV + Sp.D EVs vs no AV or Sp.D EVs is about 6%? What about with SE moves like Ice Beams?

EDIT: I just used a damage clac.
252 SpA LO Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD AV Goodra: 39.6% - 47.7% (3HKO)
Anything else results in 2HKO. So in short if you really want that bulk especially because you're slower, take all the sp.def you can get, if you don't go all out, then don't even bother with AV or S.DEF EVs because no matter what it will be a 2HKO.

I didn't even bother calculating entry hazzards
 
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shack said:
So the only difference between AV + Sp.D EVs vs no AV or Sp.D EVs is about 6%? What about with SE moves like Ice Beams?

EDIT: I just used a damage clac.
252 SpA LO Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD AV Goodra: 39.6% - 47.7% (3HKO)
Anything else results in 2HKO. So in short if you really want that bulk especially because you're slower, take all the sp.def you can get, if you don't go all out, then don't even bother with AV or S.DEF EVs because no matter what it will be a 2HKO.

I didn't even bother calculating entry hazzards
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That doesn't sound right...

252 SpA LO Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0+ SpD Goodra: 212 - 249 (55.3 - 65.0%)
252 SpA LO Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0+ SpD AV Goodra: 143 - 168 (37.3 - 43.9%)

These are the sorts of numbers I've gotten when using Goodra on Showdown, as well, so I'm confident they're the right ones. Even with no EVs, it takes about 40% with AV and 60% without.
 
SuperMeep said:
Thats weird. Im usually able to take a LO greninja's ice beam at like 30%, then KO w/ flamethrower.
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Same here. On Showdown, I've been running a Bold, 252 HP / 252 DEF Goodra with Assault Vest, just to see if pokelover32 knows what he's talking about. I can easily take an ice beam on the switch in, and take another before I OHKO with flamethrower.
 
It's kind of scary some of the things Goodra can safely 2 or 3ko with completely uninvested mixed offenses, simply scoring super effective hits. It wins trades with Greninjas, Starmies, Vaporeons, even Jolly Scizor, whom it 2KOs with flamethrower while surviving even a +2 Iron Head. For this reason I think Expert belt could even be worth using on some sets.
 
MicManGuy said:
Same here. On Showdown, I've been running a Bold, 252 HP / 252 DEF Goodra with Assault Vest, just to see if pokelover32 knows what he's talking about. I can easily take an ice beam on the switch in, and take another before I OHKO with flamethrower.
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The problem I see with this set is that since you aren't running any SpA you most likely will not hit too hard. And really that defense inve4stment will not help keeping you alive too much more. Max HP max Spa seems to be the way to go. Its still ridicolous if you think about it, I mean what dragontype can switch into a draco meteor from specs hydreigon? Unless you are steel type, it hits hard. Goodra laughs at it and OHKOS back with its own Draco meteor/pulse.
 
Cheeze Ballz said:
But who is better? Goodra or Sylveon and what move set should be driven?
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They wall different things, so it's team-dependent. Goodra is astoundingly great if your team needs a wall for Special attacks that don't target dragons; Sylveon is better for Special attacks that do, in general. Even Goodra's monstrous special bulk won't stand up forever if it's soaking Dragon Pulses or Ice Beams.

For example, Infernape would like the Goodra for a partner, since most of Infernape's weaknesses are walled pretty effectively by Dragon's resistances. (Just so long as you don't have a Hurricane coming out of nowhere!) Water, especially, is pretty much never going to bust through the blob.

A Garchomp or Gliscor or something might like to have Sylveon as a partner; the SE Ice and (for Chomp) Dragon attacks that could threaten them might also put a dent in Goodra, but Sylveon can soak Ice Beams all day and frolics daintily in the middle of Draco Meteors.
 
kefkakrazy said:
They wall different things, so it's team-dependent. Goodra is astoundingly great if your team needs a wall for Special attacks that don't target dragons; Sylveon is better for Special attacks that do, in general. Even Goodra's monstrous special bulk won't stand up forever if it's soaking Dragon Pulses or Ice Beams.

For example, Infernape would like the Goodra for a partner, since most of Infernape's weaknesses are walled pretty effectively by Dragon's resistances. (Just so long as you don't have a Hurricane coming out of nowhere!) Water, especially, is pretty much never going to bust through the blob.

A Garchomp or Gliscor or something might like to have Sylveon as a partner; the SE Ice and (for Chomp) Dragon attacks that could threaten them might also put a dent in Goodra, but Sylveon can soak Ice Beams all day and frolics daintily in the middle of Draco Meteors.
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Ahh. I see and thank you, but even both of them can be beat by an Earthquake from Garchomp right.

Would that make Garchomp a good Check using dragon physicals on Goodra or using a dragon tail of it's own after using a SR?
 
Cheeze Ballz said:
Ahh. I see and thank you, but even both of them can be beat by an Earthquake from Garchomp right.

Would that make Garchomp a good Check using dragon physicals on Goodra or using a dragon tail of it's own after using a SR?
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Any Goodra (or Sylveon) that stays in on a Garchomp that hasn't been confirmed to be some crazy special-attacking offbuild (dat 80 SpA bro) deserves what's coming to it.

Sylveon, at least, can come in and interrupt an Outrage. That means it can even force out a banded or scarfed Chomp if it's Outrage-locked. But Goodra would do best to GTFO before it gets obliterated; Earthquake is a solid 2HKO and even Dragon Tail, which is kind of an uncommon move for Garchomp, is a solid 1HKO after rocks.

That's less of a check, than it is just sending the wrong Pokemon against the wrong threat. Goodra cannot stop a physical sweeper, nor should you expect it to.
 
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