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Other The OU Theorymon Project (CLOSED)
- Thread starter alexwolf
- Start date
- Status
I think how it went was we'd discuss the 4 Pokemon for a few days first, and then vote. After that, I'm pretty sure we get a new batch after a winner is chosen.
I believe its us waiting for the new slate.
While Snow Warn. K is a little suprising, it has its cons and pros that still make it a viable addition to the current theorymons ( might still get crushed by Poison Heal Lax and Tough Claws Drapion, but it does what it can). If anything in surprised by how few votes Cloyster got.
Snow Warning Kyurem is intriguing. It allows kyurem to be played almost the same as Kyurem-B, with a sub-fuckliterallyeverything set, but a bit more stally and such. The passive damage accumulating from the hail also allows him to kill a bit easier. As well, if I recall correctly, ice moves are powered up in hail, so... yeah.
Did the structure change or something? Last i checked, discussion was on the theorymon voted for, then after 4 days, a new slate came in.
Yeah the format has been changed. We discuss the slated theorymons for 4 days, and then go to the voting period which lasts one day, rinse and repeat.
The OP has finally been updated to account for the format change.
We have a bulkier Mega Bannette for that role? Hot damn thats scary.
With Slack Off, we gain what is one of if not the bulkiest Physical Wall this side of ubers. With phenominal HP/Def stat alongside an attack stat higher than that of Garchomp, there are very few things that could hope to threaten this behemoth (outside of x4 weaknesses) and live his retaliation. I would do the calcs but am on my phone so its a more than a tad difficult so all I can do is hypothesize.
Druddigon becoming a Dragon/Steel type is a true blessing as he fills roles similar to Dialga in that he is one of the few dragons to go a support route with the options of retaliating back. While some of his stats are not that impressive, he makes up for it through his new found resistances (x4 to Grass, Normal, Bug, Rock to name a few), neutralities (Fire, Dragon, Fairy, Ice), and useful toxic immunity. While he does gain new loses in Fighting and Ground, he can make up for it in a plethora of ways from SF abuser, Rough Skin tank, to just utility Mon, he really gets more upsides than down sides here in my mind.
Thick Fat Togekiss is the least interesting in my mind. With Thick Fat, we get another theory on tailored to handle the Char twins (thick fat with dragon immunity with actually great defenses?) and a lose of the dreaded ice weaknesses. While I love this idea in some ways, it just seems less interesting to me to make an already great Pokemon (who already walls 2/3rds of the perfect coverage combo most dragons use) even more of a dragon beater.
The Steel typing for Druddigon sounds interesting. It could be the answer to bird-spam that OU has been looking for, although the new weakness to Fighting type moves and Earthquake are not generally welcomed. Ironically enough, Flying types such as Talonflame could work well with this guy. Kinda reminds me of Heatran, but physically offensive.
With decent STAB options such as Iron Head and Outrage, it can deal at least neutral damage on most opponents. The typing change also helps in destroying Fairy type enemies. Druddigon now resists or is neutral to Gardevoir and Azumaril's sets unless the latter carries Superpower for some reason and is not locked to it.
With decent STAB options such as Iron Head and Outrage, it can deal at least neutral damage on most opponents. The typing change also helps in destroying Fairy type enemies. Druddigon now resists or is neutral to Gardevoir and Azumaril's sets unless the latter carries Superpower for some reason and is not locked to it.
Thick Fat Togekiss: 10/10 CharX counter. Although this will make Togekiss lose one of its niches in being a bulky paraflincher, it's still an excellent ability that will make Toge a lot more harder to take down, especially with being immune to two types in Ground and Dragon, while x4 resisting Fighting. Overall, it's got a pretty sweet typing and Thick Fat will be the icing on the cake. That, coupled with support options like Thunder Wave/Toxic, Heal Bell, Defog, and access to reliable recovery would all make Togekiss a pretty cool tank. It also 100% counters most fighting types now, not fearing ice punch on the switch.
Slack Off Rhyperior: This will get my vote. Rhyperior's issue was never its typing (although its a reason), it was lack of reliable recovery. With Slack Off, it'll be a much better check/counter to a lot of physical threats in today's metagame. Tyranitar, Dragonite, bird spamming, Mega Pinsir, CharX, and a lot more that I can't remember off the top of my head.
I'll post my thoughts about the other 2 a later time, but Prankster Gourgeist is just.. jesus. I'd love to use that.
Slack Off Rhyperior: This will get my vote. Rhyperior's issue was never its typing (although its a reason), it was lack of reliable recovery. With Slack Off, it'll be a much better check/counter to a lot of physical threats in today's metagame. Tyranitar, Dragonite, bird spamming, Mega Pinsir, CharX, and a lot more that I can't remember off the top of my head.
I'll post my thoughts about the other 2 a later time, but Prankster Gourgeist is just.. jesus. I'd love to use that.
Thoughts on everything...
Thick Fat Togekiss: The first thing that comes to mind for me is that it becomes one of the best switch-ins to any Charizard, as both Megas fail to 2HKO with their Fire-STAB on a any defensive set. In addition, even though Thick Fat didn't change this, a physically defensive set also avoids the 2HKO from Jolly Banded Talonflame's Brave Bird, while still handling both Charizards. Kyurem-B still beats it with Fusion Bolt, and Heatran and Mamoswine will run Flash Cannon/Stone Edge more, respectively, to beat it. Not really much else that changes here outside of potentially handling Ice coverage better, but most Ice Beams I can think of right now can also run Thunderbolt.
Slack Off Rhyperior: Obviously reliable recovery is great on a defensive Pokemon. The comparison to Hippowdon is perfectly valid, since the only thing Hippo would have over this guy is some extra special bulk and a different typing. The choice to use them would probably come down to typing, with Rhyperior having extra Steel, Fighting, and Ground weaknesses, but also Normal, Fire, and Flying resistances. In this meta, I feel like the Flying resist is overall more helpful, allowing him to better handle Talonflame and Mega Pinsir, and potentially Mega Charizard X if they lack Outrage. As I might have hinted before, Hippowdon will probably go Specially defensive to help cover threats like Heatran better than Rhyperior would.
Dragon/Steel Druddigon: Interesting, the neutrality to Fairy and Dragon certainly seems beneficial, and he does get STAB Iron Head to abuse the new typing. Outside of the obvious support capabilities with all the new resistances, it could be used as a Fairy-killer for other Dragons. Togekiss and Clefable need heavy physical defensive investment to avoid an OHKO from Banded Iron Head, and Clefable can't even guarantee it. Sylveon and Mega Gardevoir are absolutely destroyed. Azumarill becomes even more useful of a Fairy due to its neutrality to Iron Head and access to Superpower to hit one of Druddigon's new weaknesses. Mega Mawile is another interesting one, as a Banded Earthquake will likely OHKO Mawile (but not guaranteed), while Mawile could still OHKO with Play Rough (though not guaranteed). What makes it interesting is that Mawile barely outspeeds Druddigon. Speaking of which, his low speed will be his biggest obstacle on Banded sets, while lack of reliable recovery somewhat limits his supporting opportunities.
Prankster Gourgeist: Well, this guy is pretty much like the perfect combination of all the other Prankster users we've seen so far. It takes SubSeed from Whimsicott, Will-o-wisp from Sableye, and Destiny Bond from Mega Banette, and though it likely won't use all of these at the same time, it does have more bulk than any of the other Prankster users (assuming Super sized of course). He also gets unreliable recovery in Pain Split and a decent 100 Attack for a wall, although it's stuck with weak moves like Seed Bomb, so Taunt from opposing Pranksters could be problematic, though it does outspeed Sableye, so he could get a Leech Seed/Wisp off before getting Taunted there. Special Thundurus seems like a decent answer, having a faster Taunt, not caring too much about Will-o-wisp and being able to 2HKO with HP Flying unless Gourgeist goes fully specially defensive, which is an option with priority Will-o-wisp I guess.
Thick Fat Togekiss: The first thing that comes to mind for me is that it becomes one of the best switch-ins to any Charizard, as both Megas fail to 2HKO with their Fire-STAB on a any defensive set. In addition, even though Thick Fat didn't change this, a physically defensive set also avoids the 2HKO from Jolly Banded Talonflame's Brave Bird, while still handling both Charizards. Kyurem-B still beats it with Fusion Bolt, and Heatran and Mamoswine will run Flash Cannon/Stone Edge more, respectively, to beat it. Not really much else that changes here outside of potentially handling Ice coverage better, but most Ice Beams I can think of right now can also run Thunderbolt.
Slack Off Rhyperior: Obviously reliable recovery is great on a defensive Pokemon. The comparison to Hippowdon is perfectly valid, since the only thing Hippo would have over this guy is some extra special bulk and a different typing. The choice to use them would probably come down to typing, with Rhyperior having extra Steel, Fighting, and Ground weaknesses, but also Normal, Fire, and Flying resistances. In this meta, I feel like the Flying resist is overall more helpful, allowing him to better handle Talonflame and Mega Pinsir, and potentially Mega Charizard X if they lack Outrage. As I might have hinted before, Hippowdon will probably go Specially defensive to help cover threats like Heatran better than Rhyperior would.
Dragon/Steel Druddigon: Interesting, the neutrality to Fairy and Dragon certainly seems beneficial, and he does get STAB Iron Head to abuse the new typing. Outside of the obvious support capabilities with all the new resistances, it could be used as a Fairy-killer for other Dragons. Togekiss and Clefable need heavy physical defensive investment to avoid an OHKO from Banded Iron Head, and Clefable can't even guarantee it. Sylveon and Mega Gardevoir are absolutely destroyed. Azumarill becomes even more useful of a Fairy due to its neutrality to Iron Head and access to Superpower to hit one of Druddigon's new weaknesses. Mega Mawile is another interesting one, as a Banded Earthquake will likely OHKO Mawile (but not guaranteed), while Mawile could still OHKO with Play Rough (though not guaranteed). What makes it interesting is that Mawile barely outspeeds Druddigon. Speaking of which, his low speed will be his biggest obstacle on Banded sets, while lack of reliable recovery somewhat limits his supporting opportunities.
Prankster Gourgeist: Well, this guy is pretty much like the perfect combination of all the other Prankster users we've seen so far. It takes SubSeed from Whimsicott, Will-o-wisp from Sableye, and Destiny Bond from Mega Banette, and though it likely won't use all of these at the same time, it does have more bulk than any of the other Prankster users (assuming Super sized of course). He also gets unreliable recovery in Pain Split and a decent 100 Attack for a wall, although it's stuck with weak moves like Seed Bomb, so Taunt from opposing Pranksters could be problematic, though it does outspeed Sableye, so he could get a Leech Seed/Wisp off before getting Taunted there. Special Thundurus seems like a decent answer, having a faster Taunt, not caring too much about Will-o-wisp and being able to 2HKO with HP Flying unless Gourgeist goes fully specially defensive, which is an option with priority Will-o-wisp I guess.
Thanks to amazing support moves such as Heal Bell, Thunder Wave, and Defog, i don't think that Togekiss will mind losing Serene Grace that much. Mega Charizard Y, Greninja, and Mega Charizard X are some of the biggest offensive threats, so being able to counter them is a godsend and something that would make Togekiss way more viable, as not being able to really counter most offensive threats was her biggest problem.
Out of those suggestions though, Slack Off Rhyperior and Prankster Gourgeist seem to be ones that would impact OU the most. Rhyperior is able to single handedly deal with any physical attacker without Water or Grass attacks, while Gourgeist is just a menace with great physical bulk, Prankster SubSeed, WoW, Disable, Pain Split, and Destiny Bond.
Out of those suggestions though, Slack Off Rhyperior and Prankster Gourgeist seem to be ones that would impact OU the most. Rhyperior is able to single handedly deal with any physical attacker without Water or Grass attacks, while Gourgeist is just a menace with great physical bulk, Prankster SubSeed, WoW, Disable, Pain Split, and Destiny Bond.
Who needs Band Iron Head when it gets SF boost with LO? :D
Thick Fat Togekiss: This is an odd idea, it seems weird falvor-wise, but is excellent battle-wise. Losing an Ice weakness and gaining a Fire resist is pretty sweet, and since Serene Grace was used mainly to be cheap with ParaFinch (and since neither of her other abilities helped her), trading abilities is a very minute loss. Her defenses are already pretty sweet, but with a new Fire resist and Ice neutrality, she can take on threats such as both Mega Charizards, Talonflame, Victini, Volcarona, Entei, Mamoswine, and Greninja, much more effectively. Her presence in OU would much more significant with Thick Fat, and would vote for if not for two other options that catch my eye.
Slack Off Rhyperior: This guy has always had awesome physical bulk, and Solid Rock really helped with his godawful. defensive typing, so giving him reliable recovery is a no-brainer. He'll certainly have competition with Hippowdon, who has better special defense, lacks any 4x weaknesses, and has half the number of weaknesses, but Rhyperior has Solid Rock, much more attack, important Fire and Flying resistances, doesn't have an ability that hurts teammates, and much better physical bulk. Other than that, what's already been said about Hippowdon can be said about Rhyperior. An excellent choice that I would love to use.
Dragon/Steel Druddigon: No flavor, not too much viability. Losing Dragon, Ice, and Fairy weaknesses is a godsend to Dragons, but gaining Fighting and Ground weaknesses is quite unfortunate. Dragon/Steel coverage isn't very ideal, since opposing Steel-types can wall this pretty well, and if running STABs, then he has a bit of 4 move-slot syndrome. Without Fire Punch, Scizor, Ferrothorn, and Skarmory fear nothing from him, without Sucker Punch, he has no way of keeping the pressure on opponents, and can't even outrun Blissey of all things, and without Earthquake, Heatran literally has a field day with him. Not the worst theorymon, but far from the best.
Prankster Gourgeist: This guy would be great if he got Prankster, with Will-O-Wisp, Trick, Destiny Bond, and Leech Seed making him quite versatile. But another trait that sets him apart from other Pranksters is having a decent base 100 attack to fight back with, and Seed Bomb and Phantom Force to deal damage and Seed stall, respectively. Though an interesting move to use could be Worry Seed, getting rid of troublesome abilities such as Gale Wings, Technician, Prankster, and Guts, really messing with some opponents dependant on their abilities. Another theorymon that I would love to use.
Right now, I can't decide between Slack Off Rhyperior and Prankster Gourgeist, both of which have their drawbacks and strengths, but I'd be fine using either one.
Slack Off Rhyperior: This guy has always had awesome physical bulk, and Solid Rock really helped with his godawful. defensive typing, so giving him reliable recovery is a no-brainer. He'll certainly have competition with Hippowdon, who has better special defense, lacks any 4x weaknesses, and has half the number of weaknesses, but Rhyperior has Solid Rock, much more attack, important Fire and Flying resistances, doesn't have an ability that hurts teammates, and much better physical bulk. Other than that, what's already been said about Hippowdon can be said about Rhyperior. An excellent choice that I would love to use.
Dragon/Steel Druddigon: No flavor, not too much viability. Losing Dragon, Ice, and Fairy weaknesses is a godsend to Dragons, but gaining Fighting and Ground weaknesses is quite unfortunate. Dragon/Steel coverage isn't very ideal, since opposing Steel-types can wall this pretty well, and if running STABs, then he has a bit of 4 move-slot syndrome. Without Fire Punch, Scizor, Ferrothorn, and Skarmory fear nothing from him, without Sucker Punch, he has no way of keeping the pressure on opponents, and can't even outrun Blissey of all things, and without Earthquake, Heatran literally has a field day with him. Not the worst theorymon, but far from the best.
Prankster Gourgeist: This guy would be great if he got Prankster, with Will-O-Wisp, Trick, Destiny Bond, and Leech Seed making him quite versatile. But another trait that sets him apart from other Pranksters is having a decent base 100 attack to fight back with, and Seed Bomb and Phantom Force to deal damage and Seed stall, respectively. Though an interesting move to use could be Worry Seed, getting rid of troublesome abilities such as Gale Wings, Technician, Prankster, and Guts, really messing with some opponents dependant on their abilities. Another theorymon that I would love to use.
Right now, I can't decide between Slack Off Rhyperior and Prankster Gourgeist, both of which have their drawbacks and strengths, but I'd be fine using either one.
Not to mention Gourgeist frees up your Mega-slot and Prankster doesn't work for Banette the turn it goes Mega.
Right now my favorite is Prankster Gourgeist.
Even things that would otherwise wreck it like Bisharp and Mega-Pinsir have to think twice because of priority Destiny Bond or Will-o-wisp.
Mega-Pinsir can only 3HKO the ghost plant with Quick Attack and that's with no defensive investment.
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Gourgeist-Super: 164-194 (43.8 - 51.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
Otherwise:
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 122-146 (32.6 - 39%) -- 10.4% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Frustration vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 312-368 (83.4 - 98.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Choice Band Talonflame can't come in on 'geist if it's behind a Sub because it can just Disable Brave Bird and force out a switch, which means its Leech Seed time. Banded Talonflame also can't KO 'geist at max bulk.
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 294-348 (78.6 - 93%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Against Life Orb Talonflame, after tanking a Brave Bird, 'geist can Disable it then Destiny Bond on Flare Blitz or Leech Seed if you think it'll Roost or just switch out.
252+ Atk Life Orb Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 257-304 (68.7 - 81.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
The fear of priority Will-o-Wisp is going to force out a lot of switches, giving it many opportunities to setup Sub/Seed. It can also eat up some low PP moves like Char-Y's Fire Blast with Sub spam and crap shoot for a miss or use Gengar's old Sub/Disable set to scout moves and shut down Choice users such as Specs Keldeo. It'll be hard to fit everything you want into Gourgeist's moveset, but even if you have the right Pokes to face it, Prankster Gourgeist is going to be annoying as hell to take down.
Can't we just have all of these because they're all really good?
Thick Fat Togekiss is a great dragon counter, as well as being able to paralyze everything and support with heal bell. It's also dangerous because somebody might be using ParaFlinch instead, just to throw others off. It's a pretty safe bet it'll be TWaving everything though.
Slack Off Rhyperior is probably the closest we'll get to a physically defensive wall of Blissey Proportions. With a monstrous defense stat of 130, great HP of 130, and Solid Rock to take less from SE hits, it's amazing. It's let down by its low special defense (but Blissey has low defense, nobody really cares anyway. Switching exists) and speed. A simple set with EdgeQuake, Slack Off, and something else would be really good.
Dragon / Steel Druddigon I don't have much to say about, but it's the same typing as Dialga, and with STAB Sheer Force Iron Head it'll be pretty solid.
Prankster Gourgeist is really trolly, effectively becoming a much better Sableye. It doesn't miss Frisk at all, and being able to WoW everything before it moves is really boss. It lacks recovery, but can stall endlessly with SubSeed, also hitting things with WoW to support your team more. Sadly, it still gets wrecked by Talonflame (then again, lots of things do) but it can Leech Seed on a predicted switch to whittle down an already frail attacker.
Thick Fat Togekiss is a great dragon counter, as well as being able to paralyze everything and support with heal bell. It's also dangerous because somebody might be using ParaFlinch instead, just to throw others off. It's a pretty safe bet it'll be TWaving everything though.
Slack Off Rhyperior is probably the closest we'll get to a physically defensive wall of Blissey Proportions. With a monstrous defense stat of 130, great HP of 130, and Solid Rock to take less from SE hits, it's amazing. It's let down by its low special defense (but Blissey has low defense, nobody really cares anyway. Switching exists) and speed. A simple set with EdgeQuake, Slack Off, and something else would be really good.
Dragon / Steel Druddigon I don't have much to say about, but it's the same typing as Dialga, and with STAB Sheer Force Iron Head it'll be pretty solid.
Prankster Gourgeist is really trolly, effectively becoming a much better Sableye. It doesn't miss Frisk at all, and being able to WoW everything before it moves is really boss. It lacks recovery, but can stall endlessly with SubSeed, also hitting things with WoW to support your team more. Sadly, it still gets wrecked by Talonflame (then again, lots of things do) but it can Leech Seed on a predicted switch to whittle down an already frail attacker.
I hate to be that guy, but Rhyperior has base 115 HP.
Good news guys, the March and April theorymons have been added to the ladder and they will be available in the next server restart. I also added the top 3 of the ladder to the Hall of Fame under the OP, for the month March. If you were using a nickname let me know so i can mention your smogon nickname next to the PS name.
Oh I'm FlameSophist so yeah oh and btw if anyone was wondering what super cool team I used to ladder it is right here
This may be me getting preachy but can we try to use less theorymons this time on the ladder. I understand everyone wants to use the shiny, new Theorymons but I personally think its more important to see how these theorymon interact with the regular OU metagame and those effects are hard to see if everyone just sticks 4 theorymon on their team and then two OU mons. I think one or two theorymons is the ideal number for a theorymon team enough to see the impact your theorymon makes on OU matches on the ladder but not enough that the OU portion of OU theorymon is lost.
So now to the Theorymons
Thick Fat Togekiss: The more I think about this theorymon the more I like it. Yeah we've done way too many dual zard checks but this feels like it has so much utility outside of just countering both zards. Togekiss is a solid defogger with a typing that screws with lots of sweepers such as Garchomp. The reason I feel this one is so cool is that the ability while not the best helps Togekiss lots making it counter lots of fire-type mons and lessening its weaknesses.
Slack Off Rhyperior: Don't get me wrong I like this theorymon but it reminds a bit of Empoleon in that Rhyperior while liking reliable recovery usually either is an iron wall to some pokemon or gets one shot by others. I don't see this as effecting the metagame too much as Rhyperior is OU viable for his ability to counter a very specific set of mons not for walling the entire metagame so getting worn down isn't that much of a worry if your only job is to set up rocks and counter Talonflame for the match.
Dragon / Steel Druddigon: This is like the opposite of Togekiss the more I think about it the more I dislike it. Steel typing leaves it with lots more common physical weaknesses than it would like such as Ground and Fighting. I love Druddigon (Trick Room + Outrage Spam last gen ahh the memories XD) but I dislike the typing change, to be honest I would much prefer Dragon / Dark Typing. STAB sucker punch with the same attack as Bisharp 3 fantastic offensive abilities and the ability to smack fairies around with iron head makes me prefer Dragon / Dark to Dragon / Steel for Druddigon.
Prankster Gourgeist: Hmm I don't know what to think of this it does seem like the perfect ability for Gourgeist honestly being able to subseed pretty much anything feels kind of OP to me. I just don't feel like prankster Gourgeist adds much to the metagame and changes the overall shape except for maybe a lowering the emphasis on physical sweepers. I think I would find using and playing against the theorymon annoying and thats enough to make me uninterested.
As it stands I think Thick Fat Togekiss is my favorite unless someone can convince me on any of the others.
With a number of forms Gourgeist can choose to outspeed slower priority users with its destiny bond whilst also weakening its hp in order to ensure a ohko- but what will really make it a pain is its ability to subseed AND dbond at the same time- meaning if subseed goes wrong, you have a 25% hp gourgeist which will probably take you down with it.
Probably a set like:
substitute
leech seed
will-o-wisp
destiny bond
this would make me tear my hair out. Priority destiny bond I think is something which is generally unhealthy for the meta in the first place, but it was balanced on mega banette because it takes up arguably the most precious slot of the team and comes with several crippling features that punish you for using it- however you can just throw prankster gourgeist on almost any team and it'll reliably make something of equal or greater importance die- the only counters I can think of off the top of my head are talonflame and mega pinsir, but mega pinsir is ruined if you d-bond on the switch and then follow up with a priority will-o-wisp. I would be interested to see what other people feel about this. Obviously you can just switch out to avoid destiny bond, but having access to priority sub seed will really punish you for it.
Dragon steel druddigon seems really interesting, with three good abilities in Rough Skin, Mold Breaker and Sheer Force. Both offensive abilities seem great paired with an attack boosting item, for instance CB Mold Breaker Druddigon checks mega venusaur and can 2hko with fire fang, and means he can hit levitators with earthquake and ohko dragonite through multiscale. Supportive sets seem like they would be strong, with access to a mold breaker Glare/Stealth Rock and access to dragon tail for parashuffle, while a Life Orb sheer force set with Iron Tail and hone claws (??) would hit really hard. THAT being said, I dont think it would be particularly OU relevant as it doesnt really provide enough of any one thing and each set can only do so much, as the sheer force set is still slow as hell and unable to achieve several ohkos, while the mold breaker sets are way outclassed unless facing mons with abilities that get negated.
Probably a set like:
substitute
leech seed
will-o-wisp
destiny bond
this would make me tear my hair out. Priority destiny bond I think is something which is generally unhealthy for the meta in the first place, but it was balanced on mega banette because it takes up arguably the most precious slot of the team and comes with several crippling features that punish you for using it- however you can just throw prankster gourgeist on almost any team and it'll reliably make something of equal or greater importance die- the only counters I can think of off the top of my head are talonflame and mega pinsir, but mega pinsir is ruined if you d-bond on the switch and then follow up with a priority will-o-wisp. I would be interested to see what other people feel about this. Obviously you can just switch out to avoid destiny bond, but having access to priority sub seed will really punish you for it.
Dragon steel druddigon seems really interesting, with three good abilities in Rough Skin, Mold Breaker and Sheer Force. Both offensive abilities seem great paired with an attack boosting item, for instance CB Mold Breaker Druddigon checks mega venusaur and can 2hko with fire fang, and means he can hit levitators with earthquake and ohko dragonite through multiscale. Supportive sets seem like they would be strong, with access to a mold breaker Glare/Stealth Rock and access to dragon tail for parashuffle, while a Life Orb sheer force set with Iron Tail and hone claws (??) would hit really hard. THAT being said, I dont think it would be particularly OU relevant as it doesnt really provide enough of any one thing and each set can only do so much, as the sheer force set is still slow as hell and unable to achieve several ohkos, while the mold breaker sets are way outclassed unless facing mons with abilities that get negated.
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Hey, new ladder's up!
Oh, and ace's team was super cool, so check it out.
Anyway,
Thick Fat Togekiss sounds cool. It'll be able to check a ridiculous number of high level threats, and that's always good, but it's still deathly afraid of every electric type under the sun. Overall I really like this idea. It has potential on stall teams, as a stall breaker, classic tank, cleric, and probably more, without people judging it for it's "gimmicky" paraflinch set.
Slack Off Rhyperior seems like it could be really good, or really mediocre. It hits like a freight train, but since it's so slow it has to have amazing defenses, which it really just doesn't. Even with Solid Rock, every decent special attacker can 2HKO him, so Slack Off will be close to worthless against offensive teams, but then again, every physical attacker worth its socks can beat Chansey, so I might be judging too harshly. Plus, if you're like me and consider stall the bane of your existence, this guy is a great option.
Dragon/Steel Druddigon just doesn't seem like enough to make it viable. Still slow as smell, and now vulnerable in new ways. At least it'll get more switch in opportunities. Maybe it'll serve as a niche counter or something like that. Like, if if Talonflame's about to get attacked by Ttar, you switch him in and STAB Iron Head for the win, or wall break with outrage, or revenge kill with sucker punch. I just don't know right now.
Prankster Gourgeist, no. Just no. Maybe I'm biased after swagplay, or I just inherently dislike priority status moves, but I hate this thing already.
Oh, and ace's team was super cool, so check it out.
Anyway,
Thick Fat Togekiss sounds cool. It'll be able to check a ridiculous number of high level threats, and that's always good, but it's still deathly afraid of every electric type under the sun. Overall I really like this idea. It has potential on stall teams, as a stall breaker, classic tank, cleric, and probably more, without people judging it for it's "gimmicky" paraflinch set.
Slack Off Rhyperior seems like it could be really good, or really mediocre. It hits like a freight train, but since it's so slow it has to have amazing defenses, which it really just doesn't. Even with Solid Rock, every decent special attacker can 2HKO him, so Slack Off will be close to worthless against offensive teams, but then again, every physical attacker worth its socks can beat Chansey, so I might be judging too harshly. Plus, if you're like me and consider stall the bane of your existence, this guy is a great option.
Dragon/Steel Druddigon just doesn't seem like enough to make it viable. Still slow as smell, and now vulnerable in new ways. At least it'll get more switch in opportunities. Maybe it'll serve as a niche counter or something like that. Like, if if Talonflame's about to get attacked by Ttar, you switch him in and STAB Iron Head for the win, or wall break with outrage, or revenge kill with sucker punch. I just don't know right now.
Prankster Gourgeist, no. Just no. Maybe I'm biased after swagplay, or I just inherently dislike priority status moves, but I hate this thing already.
- Status