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NOC Great Idea Mafia-Game Over! Mafia, vonFiedler, and More Cowbell win!
- Thread starter shinyskarmory
- Start date
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All right, I read your post wrong. I feel like a bastard now. ._.
I'm gonna go through and do a post-by-post analysis on every player ITG other than me, cleaned, and dead players. First up is Ace:
All in all I'm slightly leaning towards towny for Ace, although the reversal around Celever is very interesting. We'll have to see how that pans out.
RVS
Not much content here, an attempt to shift attention away from Obbmud. There were several reasons to lynch Obbmud, although they were all vague, so while this could be trying to save a scumbuddy it was probably an honest attempt to rediversify the discussion.
This post is interesting. Most of the post is repeating other people's content. The vote on Memoric is probably simply caused by a lack of lurking, and therefore not noticing that Memoric was cleaned.
Nothing much here.
This post seems towny. He does a good job of responding to Felony, and then makes good accusations against Felony, some of them are repeating what others had said but not all.
Similar to his second post, trying to get us onto a better line of discussion while putting a pressure vote on someone who hasn't been very active and who made quite a few--innocent or otherwise--mistakes.
Nothing much here, just clarifying a misunderstanding.
He does a good job of arguing against Tesung, getting a town read from this post.
Nothing much here TBH.
The first part is interesting. He's gone a long way from accusing Celever to being the most player who defends him the most. Just something to note, otherwise this post seems towny to me
Responds in the way any sensible person, village or mafia, would to my random accusation. Nothing much to see here.
This post seems good. Not really much to say here, he just made a few reads that make a lot of sense to me.
No content here.
All in all I'm slightly leaning towards towny for Ace, although the reversal around Celever is very interesting. We'll have to see how that pans out.
Subbed into a victory in this game that was literally 2 years ago. Actually plz don't read that I was a different user back then @.@ I control f'd NOC in the game listing and didn't see any others that rang bells, that might have been the only one?
I'm not saying you did, silly. I am saying that Obbmund asked you how you knew, when you said you didn't, which I found a tad scummy. Maybe I ought to attempt to quote the post for better clarity. As for starwars, I still don't like his responses. There's been a lot of discussion in the past few hours, and I feel as though I need to go back over the new "evidence" to form a solid opinion again. Neither obb nor starwars are impressing me in any way.
And, I did indeed jump the gun with Ullar a lot sooner than I thought I would. I thought his little metaphor was an incredibly shitty fool softclaim, but it seems rather ridiculous now. I really should stick to longer posts lest I jump to conclusions.
As of now, my Ullar impression isn't much different from the one in my bigass meaty post. Yes, Tesung is quite scummy. It seems like the "easy" way out, though. I am still awaiting a response from Tesung, so I'm not entirely sure whether I should share Ullar's sentiment or not.
What I think I need now is another moment of silence to read up on everything these people have been saying. Hopefully, it won't be nearly as long as the five or so days I took last time. So, I guess this'll be my last post today unless someone brings up something that makes me seriously consider my thoughts.
Also, thank you for making the effort, Ace. I'll try to thumb through that game to the best of my ability. And of course, I'll try to do a little digging of my own just to make sure you aren't holding out on me. :P
And, I did indeed jump the gun with Ullar a lot sooner than I thought I would. I thought his little metaphor was an incredibly shitty fool softclaim, but it seems rather ridiculous now. I really should stick to longer posts lest I jump to conclusions.
As of now, my Ullar impression isn't much different from the one in my bigass meaty post. Yes, Tesung is quite scummy. It seems like the "easy" way out, though. I am still awaiting a response from Tesung, so I'm not entirely sure whether I should share Ullar's sentiment or not.
What I think I need now is another moment of silence to read up on everything these people have been saying. Hopefully, it won't be nearly as long as the five or so days I took last time. So, I guess this'll be my last post today unless someone brings up something that makes me seriously consider my thoughts.
Also, thank you for making the effort, Ace. I'll try to thumb through that game to the best of my ability. And of course, I'll try to do a little digging of my own just to make sure you aren't holding out on me. :P
Double post edit :Ah, it looks like I have indeed mixed you two up. Really gotta work on this conclusion thing. :/
I'm not up to date with the thread at all atm, but I hope to be able to read through four pages of posts later today, and post something more substantial as well. I'll definitely be back full-time tomorrow, so I'll try to make up for my lackluster activity in the past few days then.
Okay, I guess I'll unvote for now. I'm gonna wait 'til later to make my first real meaningful post, so if you want to hear my full opinions, you're gonna have to keep waiting.
Unvote Obbmud
Lynch PokeguyNXB
I'm bored of waiting. Post. Now.
LW's post is so many pages back I'm going to have to go back a long way if he wants a response to answer it, and in some of the tl;dr posts (which I read this morning but had to go immediately after I was done) please can you point out to me what you want me to respond to? This includes LightWolf, since iirc there wasn't too much substance in the post.
One thing which I do want to talk about, though, is this:
1. Ace Emerald
3. Cancerous-Village-Town Innocent Child-Revealed Day 1
4. Celever
5. Tesung
6. spiresquire
8. LightWolf
9. Nitrox116
10. More Cowbell
11. Obbmud99
12. PokeguyNXB
13. starwarsfan
14. UllarWarlord (not sure though)
15. Walrein
Bold = First NOC Game in 2 years
Underlined = Experienced
Italics = Moderate experience, should really be helping the town in any way they can
This is essentially a beginner game now. DLL, Empoof and Paperblade were all experienced but they all subbed out, and B_T unfortunately died, leaving us with two experienced players and everyone else is ranging from brand new (the bulk of the game) to fairly experienced, but less than 3 games. That is how the Twilight Princess NOC which has been mentioned before in this thread was set up (link) and in that game the new players to NOC got fooled hard by AG, except for... well me. And Metal Sonic iirc but he also wasn't overly new, I think. I pulled a FUCK TIGER or w/e it is and got the guy lynched, but my point is, is that AG was extremely trusted in that game as a towny thanks to his helpful, pretty aggressive and active play style. Sound familiar?
I'm not at all saying that LightWolf is scum, I am saying that we shouldn't jump to conclusions. He has the experience to put on a facade and trick the majority of us here. People are even bw'ing on opinions here. I think it was Walrein who said he got an extremely towny read from LW, and then word started to spread, more people said "oh hey, LW is really towny!" and then people just subbing in like Tesung have got word of it and are trusting the guy immediately. Guys, LW is not clean. I don't know why people think that he is. I mean sure, he's contributing, but everyone thought that AG was in the Twilight Princess NOC too, and look where that got us.
Lynch PokeguyNXB
I'm bored of waiting. Post. Now.
LW's post is so many pages back I'm going to have to go back a long way if he wants a response to answer it, and in some of the tl;dr posts (which I read this morning but had to go immediately after I was done) please can you point out to me what you want me to respond to? This includes LightWolf, since iirc there wasn't too much substance in the post.
One thing which I do want to talk about, though, is this:
1. Ace Emerald
3. Cancerous-Village-Town Innocent Child-Revealed Day 1
4. Celever
5. Tesung
6. spiresquire
8. LightWolf
9. Nitrox116
10. More Cowbell
11. Obbmud99
12. PokeguyNXB
13. starwarsfan
14. UllarWarlord (not sure though)
15. Walrein
Bold = First NOC Game in 2 years
Underlined = Experienced
Italics = Moderate experience, should really be helping the town in any way they can
This is essentially a beginner game now. DLL, Empoof and Paperblade were all experienced but they all subbed out, and B_T unfortunately died, leaving us with two experienced players and everyone else is ranging from brand new (the bulk of the game) to fairly experienced, but less than 3 games. That is how the Twilight Princess NOC which has been mentioned before in this thread was set up (link) and in that game the new players to NOC got fooled hard by AG, except for... well me. And Metal Sonic iirc but he also wasn't overly new, I think. I pulled a FUCK TIGER or w/e it is and got the guy lynched, but my point is, is that AG was extremely trusted in that game as a towny thanks to his helpful, pretty aggressive and active play style. Sound familiar?
I'm not at all saying that LightWolf is scum, I am saying that we shouldn't jump to conclusions. He has the experience to put on a facade and trick the majority of us here. People are even bw'ing on opinions here. I think it was Walrein who said he got an extremely towny read from LW, and then word started to spread, more people said "oh hey, LW is really towny!" and then people just subbing in like Tesung have got word of it and are trusting the guy immediately. Guys, LW is not clean. I don't know why people think that he is. I mean sure, he's contributing, but everyone thought that AG was in the Twilight Princess NOC too, and look where that got us.
*leaving us with few.
Sorry, I just wanted to correct that before someone called me out on it :p
Wow, pressure. Since I finally have access to an actual computer, I'll post. TBH, I've only been posting at all so I'm not accused of being inactive. And I also don't want to be accused of bandwagoning or just repeating what others have said, and all there is to be said about most accused scum here has already been said. Well... I guess I have no choice but to bandwagon since I'm kind of lost here, even after reading through the whole game multiple times. But then again, maybe not. I think I'll just go and vote No Lynch because I'm honestly lost.
A no lynch is just a placement vote, but it would be better to say "IDK who to vote! ;O;" because otherwise people will start questionning you and consider it a serious lynch. Most of that post was "srry I couldn't cpu! :(", and the parts which weren't was "srry I couldn't understand! :(". Tell us what you don't understand. We want to help you the best we can so that you can be a good part of the village, saying "I don't get it ;~;" doesn't do shit.
Also this was typed on an iPad. No excuses about phones.
Okay first I will reply to Celever then post whatever comment I have on the last few pages.
First because it seems I have to say my last few points again:
A. The "Felony bandwagon was overfocused so smaller things were overlooked" line of thought was not a point against you but an opening statement
B. I feel you overreacted when I asked questions about your vote of DLE. You spent a decent sized paragraph to explain why it was not suspicious when all I expected to hear was "I might as well prod someone inactive while coming up with a suspect". If you yourself thought it was a reasonable curse of action, why would you give it so much thought that you felt you needed to express in your defense? That's my point about that case
C. In your reply for my first accusation targeting you, you replied with saying I was also one of the first to vote Felony as well, which heavily sounded like you are trying to discredit me, especially since your argument was over exaggerating what actually happened (I was the 4th of the 5 actual votes on Felony, sure technically one of the first, but being on of the first of the the first of 5 might as well mean everyone), naturally this could be just a case of misremembering or just a turn of whatever, but the whole argument boiled down to ", but you X Y Z"
As for your newest don't trust LW post. Yeah I made that point pretty early Day 1 when people started the whole I sound town thing, I made it pretty clear I play both sides the same(One game I got my partner aska lynched out of the blue when I found his behavior suspicious in one of my tl;dr posts, fun times). Alas I still have a problem with your post, namely you are targeting me specifically, yeah tons of people say they think I'm town, and I 100% approve of doubting everyone(paranoia is kinda my thing) but just as many have suggested Walrein as likely clean or cleanest, yet you just focus on me who has been trying to build a case on you. You could be warning people against MC and Walrein, I think we can agree on that no one should be trusted that easily from the underlined group (I'd put Ullar as an italic though, no offense Ullar, don't kill me in WotR).
First because it seems I have to say my last few points again:
A. The "Felony bandwagon was overfocused so smaller things were overlooked" line of thought was not a point against you but an opening statement
B. I feel you overreacted when I asked questions about your vote of DLE. You spent a decent sized paragraph to explain why it was not suspicious when all I expected to hear was "I might as well prod someone inactive while coming up with a suspect". If you yourself thought it was a reasonable curse of action, why would you give it so much thought that you felt you needed to express in your defense? That's my point about that case
C. In your reply for my first accusation targeting you, you replied with saying I was also one of the first to vote Felony as well, which heavily sounded like you are trying to discredit me, especially since your argument was over exaggerating what actually happened (I was the 4th of the 5 actual votes on Felony, sure technically one of the first, but being on of the first of the the first of 5 might as well mean everyone), naturally this could be just a case of misremembering or just a turn of whatever, but the whole argument boiled down to ", but you X Y Z"
As for your newest don't trust LW post. Yeah I made that point pretty early Day 1 when people started the whole I sound town thing, I made it pretty clear I play both sides the same(One game I got my partner aska lynched out of the blue when I found his behavior suspicious in one of my tl;dr posts, fun times). Alas I still have a problem with your post, namely you are targeting me specifically, yeah tons of people say they think I'm town, and I 100% approve of doubting everyone(paranoia is kinda my thing) but just as many have suggested Walrein as likely clean or cleanest, yet you just focus on me who has been trying to build a case on you. You could be warning people against MC and Walrein, I think we can agree on that no one should be trusted that easily from the underlined group (I'd put Ullar as an italic though, no offense Ullar, don't kill me in WotR).
A) No comment I guess. :p
B) Possibly I did overreact, but like someone said above, I don't think there was much emotion in the post? You've played with me in Twilight Princess NOC, and you know that I tend to articulate things lengthily. The other thing was that I wasn't too keen on my play in the first place. Someone above said that "unvoting and not voting someone else" is scummy so I, like anyone in this game, wanted to avoid seeming scummy. I don't see what was wrong with that? I know that you care much less about the lynch itself now and more about the reaction, but I've explained my reaction as long, not emotional.
C) Seriously? Only 5 players? That point is totally moot then >_>. I said that statement as a more subtle "I don't fully trust you" kinda thing which some people (namely Ace iirc) picked up on. I did say just after it "this isn't accusing you of the lynch" or something, right? If not then I meant to... Oh well.
That's fair enough actually, but I'd been wanting to make the post since the start of the day and didn't really find the time to do it. I had limited access before I made my last few posts, and the long post I did on the inactives was more important to me at the time. There have only been a couple reads saying that Walrein was a most-trusted village, but I definitely should have included him. My mind was focused on you though, I have to say. More Cowbell is more interesting for you to point out, because he hasn't had that many positive reads at all? Most of it seems to be "leaning town" or "could go either way". Don't trust Walrein fully, either, just putting that there for disclosure. :p
PokeguyNXB alert spamming. Post more. Post better. Just be helpful ffs! ;o;
Day 2, Vote Count 5
(13) Still Alive: (majority is 7 votes)
Ace Emerald (0):
Cancerous (0):
Celever (1):Tesung, LightWolf
Tesung (3):Ace Emerald, starwarsfan, More Cowbell, UllarWarlord UllarWarlord
spiresquire (1): PokeguyNXB
LightWolf (0):
Memoric Nitrox116 (0):
More Cowbell (0):
Obbmud99 (1):Celever
Paperblade PokeguyNXB (2): Cancerous Celever Celever
starwarsfan (2):spiresquire, Nitrox116
UllarWarlord (4): Walrein, Ace Emerald, Obbmud99, Tesung L-3
Walrein (0):
No Lynch (1): PokeguyNXB
Deadline: 4:00 PM EDT (GMT-4) on May 7 (~24 hours away).
Carry on.
(13) Still Alive: (majority is 7 votes)
Ace Emerald (0):
Cancerous (0):
Celever (1):
Tesung (3):
LightWolf (0):
More Cowbell (0):
Obbmud99 (1):
Paperblade
starwarsfan (2):
UllarWarlord (4): Walrein, Ace Emerald, Obbmud99, Tesung L-3
Walrein (0):
No Lynch (1): PokeguyNXB
Deadline: 4:00 PM EDT (GMT-4) on May 7 (~24 hours away).
Carry on.
I feel like Celever does raise a good point when he states that the experienced players could be putting up facades... however, thanks to the large number of inexperienced people, a mislynch against another experienced player would have disastrous results. I'll look through the past posts in the thread and try to formulate an opinion.
Also,
Unvote starwarsfan
Lynch PokeguyNXB
I'm relatively convinced by starwarsfan's explanations (although I'm still a little bit suspicious and I'll definitely take another look at him), but Pokeguy needs to make a substantial post. This almost certainly won't be my final vote.
Also,
Unvote starwarsfan
Lynch PokeguyNXB
I'm relatively convinced by starwarsfan's explanations (although I'm still a little bit suspicious and I'll definitely take another look at him), but Pokeguy needs to make a substantial post. This almost certainly won't be my final vote.
Having read over the last few pages again in more detail, I wish to make some points on two people: swf and Ullar
Firstly, well, I'm really not convinced by your village fool thing Ullar, like okay you can have the same opinion as someone, but at the base I can't see it being exactly the same, you are basically doing nothing and this annoys me. Honestly it gives me Metal Sonic like vibes in that it's less about being suspicious or not and more about it just ticking me off! I can't really review it at all, please just start posting your opinions so I can shred them to pieces!
Now on swf. Honestly I went through Day 2, and then checked a few Day 1 posts to see if it's consistent, and honestly, to me it feels like you post a lot, but you add so little. I mean sure you add stuff to the discussion, but most stuff I see are nitpicks or answering questions(fair enough I nitpick a lot, but I explain why I think said nitpick bothers me enough to mention). Though, that's just a nitpick(SEE), my real problem is that Ace post of yours. It's pointless doing and posting a full post analysis of someone, if you don't really bring anything new to the table, if you aren't trying to point out suspicions. The only time accept such a post is if someone else specifically requests you to analyse X. In the end it still amounts to nothing in my opinion.
And since Celever has replied since I started writing this up:
I believe you misunderstood me, I'm not saying your post oozed from emotion, I merely felt like it was the kind of post I'd see someone being under pressure would make, as in only someone who thinks they did something wrong needs to make excuses kind of thing. And I don't really remember TP that was ages ago, I think, can't remember, and I don't really care since anything pointing at previous games is a WIFOM on the long run, I like to look at games isolated. As for the More Cowbelle thing, for one you had him underlined and on the other hand I didn't want to seem like I'm picking on Walrein only rather than making a point in favour of crippling paranoia.
Firstly, well, I'm really not convinced by your village fool thing Ullar, like okay you can have the same opinion as someone, but at the base I can't see it being exactly the same, you are basically doing nothing and this annoys me. Honestly it gives me Metal Sonic like vibes in that it's less about being suspicious or not and more about it just ticking me off! I can't really review it at all, please just start posting your opinions so I can shred them to pieces!
Now on swf. Honestly I went through Day 2, and then checked a few Day 1 posts to see if it's consistent, and honestly, to me it feels like you post a lot, but you add so little. I mean sure you add stuff to the discussion, but most stuff I see are nitpicks or answering questions(fair enough I nitpick a lot, but I explain why I think said nitpick bothers me enough to mention). Though, that's just a nitpick(SEE), my real problem is that Ace post of yours. It's pointless doing and posting a full post analysis of someone, if you don't really bring anything new to the table, if you aren't trying to point out suspicions. The only time accept such a post is if someone else specifically requests you to analyse X. In the end it still amounts to nothing in my opinion.
And since Celever has replied since I started writing this up:
I believe you misunderstood me, I'm not saying your post oozed from emotion, I merely felt like it was the kind of post I'd see someone being under pressure would make, as in only someone who thinks they did something wrong needs to make excuses kind of thing. And I don't really remember TP that was ages ago, I think, can't remember, and I don't really care since anything pointing at previous games is a WIFOM on the long run, I like to look at games isolated. As for the More Cowbelle thing, for one you had him underlined and on the other hand I didn't want to seem like I'm picking on Walrein only rather than making a point in favour of crippling paranoia.
Honestly I don't see a huge point in carrying on this discussion. We're going to nitpick every single little thing about the post until there's nothing left and then we'll just argue even more about it later on, lol. Similar things happened to me in Mario Kart NOC with Spiffy, (where I was village and Spiffy mafia) so I'm going to learn from my mistakes and try and get out ASAP. Honestly it's ok if that paragraph seemed like the sort of paragraph you think someone under pressure would vote because as you keep gloating about you are putting people under pressure. Village, mafia, whoever. And also only on the newer players (well Ullar is acting worse than most of the newer players, honestly.)
I would like you to post an analysis on the following users:
Walrein, More Cowbell and Ace Emerald.
I can't remember you posting (m)any thoughts on these guys, which is interesting because Walrein and More Cowbell are the two other most experienced players in this, and Ace Emerald has reacted well under pressure in the past. So you're just going for easy targets, apparently, and evading the better players... Anyway I want to hear your thoughts on them, please.
Of course I'm going for easy targets, because easy targets make themselves targets by making mistakes. More experienced people don't make that kind of mistake, they usually slip on the long run by contradicting their past posts or changing their playstyle so there is so little to grab onto. Not to mention they tend to die, doesn't hurt if you let the mafia narrow it down for you(We will miss you B_T). Honestly the sillyness of you presenting going after easy targets as something bad is driving me loco. I will look over them since you asked but don't be disappointed when my post amounts to "I got nothing"(Since as I stated previously I see not much point in saying they seem villagish).
Also yet again you misunderstand, as I said only someone who thinks they did something wrong makes excuses, and that's how your post felt like to me. I believe in that someone who thinks they are in the right wouldn't try to make that many excuses(minus if they are angry, but your post is the opposite of angry). I literally pressured you over a prod post, I honestly think for such an accusation that was an overreaction. This is my final argument on this matter unless you have a retort to this, though I do accept you to reply to my first paragraph.
For the requests I will do them in like 2-3 hours or tomorrow morning(23:35 here) depending on how sleepy I am in 1-2 hours.
Also yet again you misunderstand, as I said only someone who thinks they did something wrong makes excuses, and that's how your post felt like to me. I believe in that someone who thinks they are in the right wouldn't try to make that many excuses(minus if they are angry, but your post is the opposite of angry). I literally pressured you over a prod post, I honestly think for such an accusation that was an overreaction. This is my final argument on this matter unless you have a retort to this, though I do accept you to reply to my first paragraph.
For the requests I will do them in like 2-3 hours or tomorrow morning(23:35 here) depending on how sleepy I am in 1-2 hours.
Correct me if I'm totally wrong here, but Celever did post a comprehensive list of his reads on everyone in the game a bit earlier (I know that LightWolf commented on it, saying it wasn't the right move that early in the game), which would be an incredibly gutsy thing for a mafia member to do, as if he was lynched and revealed mafia, it would be an easy target for analysis.
At the moment, I'm still quite suspicious of Ullar and starwars. I'll keep my vote on Pokeguy for the moment to pressure him to post (and because I don't want to add too many votes to Ullar).
At the moment, I'm still quite suspicious of Ullar and starwars. I'll keep my vote on Pokeguy for the moment to pressure him to post (and because I don't want to add too many votes to Ullar).
Calling it right now LW and Celever are both mafia and they're starting this attacking charade so that when one flips mafia we trust the other :p
But seriously.
I'm watching this Celever/LightWolf showdown pretty closely, as I think everyone should. Celever has made it a point to state to everyone that LightWolf isn't confirmed, and LightWolf sees this as deliberate attack. I do understand where LW is coming from, Celever has made it a point several times to call LW out, and if it was me I'd probably react with a similar counter attack. But in my eyes Celever's posts don't cross the line separating a town warning and personal attacks.
Just my $.02 on the hot thread topic of the moment.
But seriously.
I'm watching this Celever/LightWolf showdown pretty closely, as I think everyone should. Celever has made it a point to state to everyone that LightWolf isn't confirmed, and LightWolf sees this as deliberate attack. I do understand where LW is coming from, Celever has made it a point several times to call LW out, and if it was me I'd probably react with a similar counter attack. But in my eyes Celever's posts don't cross the line separating a town warning and personal attacks.
Just my $.02 on the hot thread topic of the moment.
I think that LightWolf acknowledges that the expert players aren't automatically cleaned, and I think that this debate is good to spark some controversy and perhaps get some reads on the mafia. I've looked at both LightWolf and Celever's posts, and to tell the truth I don't see anything obviously mafia about them. LightWolf seems town to me, but like Celever said, an experienced player like LightWolf can put up a good facade. Nothing I can really do about that at the moment. Some of Celever's posts might be a tiny bit more suspicious, but I definitely feel like that read of everybody Celever did combined with his reasonable defenses render him town to me as well.
I was thinking that analyzing some of Blue_Tornado's posts might be a good idea. While Felony's posts were attacked by people of both the mafia and the village, we know for a fact that B_T was killed by the mafia specifically. While this very well might be because well-known players are important targets to take down, he could have been taken down since some of his ideas were getting too close to the truth.
I was thinking that analyzing some of Blue_Tornado's posts might be a good idea. While Felony's posts were attacked by people of both the mafia and the village, we know for a fact that B_T was killed by the mafia specifically. While this very well might be because well-known players are important targets to take down, he could have been taken down since some of his ideas were getting too close to the truth.
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