XY OU Abusing Underestimation - A revamp to a previous team. (Peak 1649 after 50 battles)

Introduction:

This will be briefer than most intro's I write as this is a new version of an older team of mine. Previously it was based on a core of Specially Defensive Aegislash with my own build of Bulky Charizard X. After bans and meta shifts this team fell out of use, until recently, after I built a Sun team I found myself going back to it. Despite the loss of a key member, it was still my most effective team in Gen 6 OU, previously peaking in the 1700's, exact number I can't recall. I still had a good base to work from to adapt the team, so I will leave my intro here and go into the rest of the RMT. One thing to keep in mind, like my first attempt at this team, if possible, I would like to avoid Legendaries, purely because it is also a team in Game, while I can easily IV breed regular Pokemon, soft resetting for perfect Legends is far too tedious and time consuming for me.

Brief View of the Team:
charizard-megax.gif
azumarill.gif
ferrothorn.gif
sableye.gif
gliscor.gif
garchomp.gif

My record with the Team at the time of this RMT
Alt: AnotherSeriousAlt
Current Rank: 1614
Peak: 1649
W/L/D
38/12/0
I will provide a screen shot for this at a later date
Previous Version:

For those who want to see the previous version here is the link:
http://www.smogon.com/forums/thread...erestimation-ou-semi-stall-peak-1692.3510212/
The premise is fairly simple, this is a Semi-Stall team, utilising a defensive backbone of Gliscor, Aegislash and Charizard X, with Sableye supporting alongside Hitmontop as an Assault Vest user with Rapid Spin (which eventually changed to Starmie to cover Keldeo). Garchomp was the last piece to check birdspam and offer a solid offensive outlet, it started out as a Rocky Helmet set before changing to Scarf to cover DD Zard X.
Team building:
The team building will pick up from after the Aegislash ban rather than go into the previous builds.
Due to how effective my Zard X set was for me, I decided to keep that from the original team, alongside Gliscor, Sableye and Garchomp. All of them except Gliscor kept the moveset of the previous team as they all served a unique purpose on the team, and all of them offer a good variety of resists and immunities.
charizard-megax.gif
sableye.gif
gliscor.gif
garchomp.gif

So with 4 Pokemon carried over I now had to figure out where to go, having a bulky Fire/Dragon I decided to go for a solid defensive core of Fire/Water/Grass. Despite my dislike of using it, I chose Ferrothorn as the Grass for the team for a couple of simple reasons, primarily it allows me to move Stealth Rocks off of Gliscor whilst giving them team another solid answer to Bird spam and a lot of the Physical threats out there. It's natural bulk and good typing allow it to switch in fairly freely to set up Rocks and it gives a key resist to Fairy.
charizard-megax.gif
sableye.gif
gliscor.gif
garchomp.gif
ferrothorn.gif

With Ferrothorn on board I had the Fire/Grass part sorted, and I also had the makings of Dragon/Steel/Fairy. Azumarill covers both off the remaining typing in the cores, and because of the popularity of the Banded, Assault Vest and Belly drum sets, it allowed me to utilise an unexpected and to be honest extremely effective defensive spread for it. Thanks to the hidden ability of Sap Sipper, Azumarill loses an exploitable weakness and turns into an immunity. This in itself can allow me to use it as a lure to common switch ins and proceed to take advantage. I found a set on Youtube showing a physically defensive set with Sap Sipper, however my team needed a Special Wall, so I chose to invest in special defence and in doing that I built a perfect Greninja switch in, as well as covering the old Keldeo weakness of the previous team.
charizard-megax.gif
azumarill.gif
ferrothorn.gif
gliscor.gif
sableye.gif
garchomp.gif
In Depth:
charizard.gif
->
charizard-megax.gif

Hitmonzard (Charizard) @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 248 HP / 164 Def / 96 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Claw
- Will-O-Wisp
- Roost

Role on the team:
Mega Charizard X is one of the Physically defensive Pokemon on the team, it also offers a secondary Offensive outlet, and spreads status.
Description:
This is the one Pokemon that is not up for debate. The spread is something that I worked on for some time, and I believe I have created an alternate spread for Bulky Zard. Enough of bigging it up though, Zard is a key Pokemon for its very good typing (which helpfully removes its Fairy,Water and Ice weaknesses) and a very usable stat spread. It has base 111 Defence, which on such an offensive Pokemon is frankly incredible, and with the EVs it clocks in at 299, which is the equivalent of fully invested Base 100 (neutral nature). This combined with 248 HP EVs (for Stealth Rock) gives it very good bulk. To demonstrate - 252 Atk Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 164 Def Mega Charizard X: 282-332 (78.5 - 92.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO. This is a STAB Earthquake coming from base 147 Attack, and it is a 2HKO. While this example doesn't account for Rocks, it shows the type of hit I can take. The nature and speed EVs bring me to 286 speed, which outspeeds all positive base 80's, this includes 2 otherwise problem Pokemon in Mamoswine and Gardevoir. This allows me to beat both one on one, out speeding Gardevoir upon Mega Evolution and OHKOing. The moveset contains 3 Staple moves on such a build, Dragon Claw is a reliable STAB getting boost from Tough Claws to boot, Will-O-Wisp further helps it walling Physical hits and wear down troubling Pokemon, and Roost is reliable recovery. The last move was chosen with hard hitting in mind, Flare Blitz, despite the recoil, is the main attacking threat on the team bar none. Even with no investment this attack just destroys. While it leaves me open to Heatran the rest of my team can handle it with ease. Flare Blitz gets me the OHKO on Gardevoir as mentioned earlier, and it grants me better all round coverage.
Synergy:
Dragon - Ferrothorn, Azumarill
Ground - Gliscor
Rock - Ferrothorn, Garchomp
azumarill.gif

Hitmonrill (Azumarill) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Encore
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Role on the team:
Azumarill is the main Special Wall, it also helps prevent Set up attempts and is a status absorber.
Description:
This is the main set to explain the RMT title. Azumarill very rarely takes advantage of its excellent defensive typing, and thanks to Sap Sipper it gets even better. The reason this build was chosen is a mixture of getting around some usual switch ins, and giving me a consistent and reliable switch in to Greninja and Keldeo. The moveset is very self explanatory, as I am not utilising Huge Power, I have chosen Scald as the move of choice. In the change to Gen 6 Azumarill actually got an increase in Special Attack, taking it to base 60 (higher than its Attack). Scald spreads burn (you will see a theme here) and is just nice for consistant damage. Encore was chosen to either lock Pokemon into Grass moves and gain good switch advantage or if I can proceed to beat what is in front of me, or it can prevent set up attempts. I considered Perish Song, but that didn't seem to fit as well at the time of building the team. Rest and Sleep Talk round out the set, to provide Recovery, and enables me to absorb any status, alongside being able to function while sleeping.
Synergy:
Poison - Ferrothorn, Gliscor, Garchomp, Sableye
Electric - Charizard, Ferrothorn, Gliscor, Garchomp
ferrothorn.gif

Hitmonthorn (Ferrothorn) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Stealth Rock
- Thunder Wave

Role on the team:
Second Physical Wall, Hazard Setter, switch in to Bird Spam.
Description:
Ferrothorn here is one of the more Standard sets this team uses, and for good reason. While I have never really been a fan, I can't deny that it can handle hits all day, and is very reliable at setting up Rocks for the team. It has a very good support movepool and this allows me to better fit it into the team. The status move I have chosen is Thunder Wave, as this allows me to check some Scarfers, or Set Up sweepers, specifically Gyarados and Charizard (generally they Dragon Dance on an expected switch). Stealth Rocks is the hazard of choice, and everyone knows what it does, so no need to explain that one. Leech Seed is a key move, as Ferrothorn has no recovery otherwise due to Rocky Helmet. Gyro Ball provides some offense, and gets super effective coverage on Fairy types. The EV spread is for maximum Physical Bulk , though I am open to some. changes for more efficiency.
Synergy:
Fire - Charizard, Garchomp, Azumarill
Fighting - Sableye, Gliscor, Azumarill, Charizard (pre mega)
gliscor.gif

Hitmonscor (Gliscor) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 Spe
Impish Nature
- Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Protect

Role on the team:
3rd and final physical wall, item remover, Status spreader and switch in.
Description:
Gliscor functions much the same as before, the only change being a status user, with Toxic being the move to replace Stealth Rocks. The rest of the set is as before, Earthquake the main attack, pretty much only needed for Heatran. Knock Off compliments it nicely and adding a nice level of item removal. Protect is the final move, helping me activate Toxic Orb, and for scouting purposes. It also helps with health recovery in that respect also. Gliscor offers some key type immunities and resistances, covering a variety of weakness for all the team barring Sableye and Garchomp. The EV spread is standard for Physical builds, though I am open to trying the specially defensive variant, to see if it is as effective for me .
Synergy:
Water - Ferrothorn, Azumarill
Ice - Azumarill
sableye.gif

Hitmoneye (Sableye) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Taunt

Role on the team:
Secondary Special switch in, Stallbreaker, Item remover.
Description:
Sableye at first glance is the most underwhelming Pokemon on the team. However in practice it remains one of the more consistent members. It's typing grants many chances to switch in, due to immunity to Fighting, Psychic and Normal, while resisting Poison on top. It only has the one weakness, Fairy, meaning that it has more longevity than its stats would suggest. Onto the set itself, it is fairly standard spread, MAximum HP and Special Defence with the leftover in Attack. Knock Off is the offensive move on the set, removing Items, and gaining STAB. Will-O-Wisp to spread status, and grant pseudo mixed wall abilities. Recover obviously for healing. Taunt is the final move, and provides the team with a way to prevent any set up, be it stat boosting, hazards or status. The latter 3 moves all get the Prankster boost, allowing priority to set up.
Synergy:
Fairy - Ferrothorn
garchomp.gif

Hitmonchomp (Garchomp) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Stone Edge
- Fire Blast

Role on the team:
Garchomp is the Scarfer, which allow it to act as a revenge killer, check to +1 base 100 mons eg.DD Charizard X. Also functions as a late game sweeper once any walls or checks are out of the way.
Description:
Garchomp carries on its previous role from the first version as being the offensive threat on this team. I opted to keep it with the Choice Scarf to give me some much needed pace, and allow me to out speed otherwise too fast Pokemon such as Mega Manetric or Greninja. With the ability Rough Skin, it can still check Bird Spam and allows me to take a bit more advantage of switching in to Physical moves. The set is standard Scarfchomp, Earthquake and Outrage for STAB and are the 2 moves I usually click. Earthquake is consistent and is the main spammable one, once all Flying Types and Levitate users are out of the way, it also gives me a nice clean OHKO on Heatran. Outrage is a bit more risky due to the 2-3 turn duration, and if the opponent has a Fairy or Steel type, I can relinquish any momentum instantly and find myself on the back foot. This means I only use it when trying to clean up. The last 2 slots are to cover Pokemon that the STABs cant handle. Stone Edge grants me EdgeQuake coverage, and is a good way to deal with Charizard and Talonflame, both being 4x weak to it. Fire Blast is to catch both Skarmory and Ferrothorn, as both are 2HKO by it (some Ferrothorn are even OHKOd I believe). The EVs and nature are also standard, Max Attack and Speed, with the 4 in Special Attack for Fire Blast.
Synergy:
Ice - Azumarill
Dragon - Ferrothorn, Azumarill
Fairy - Ferrothorn


Known Issues:

On thing that this team lacks, in comparison with the original is that there is no hazard removal anymore. While I have tested it with Forretress with Rapid Spin, and the previous spinners, I felt it less effective, so here is somewhere that I know that needs work. Fitting removal would allow my walls to be that much more effective and help me match and beat Stall a lot more effectively.
Another Issue, though not as problematic, is that occasionally the team struggles to regain momentum, but as this is Semi-Stall that is not always going to be an issue for me.

Replays:
  • Game against Stall - This one shows how it matches against a Stall team, I'm testing out the Zapdos in the comments in this game and the hazard removal proved useful. There is some Hax, though I think only 1 time did it matter - http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-170721933

Threatlist:
  • Mega Medicham - One of the harder Pokemon in the Meta to deal wit. Usually I have to grab the Burn from Sableye or Charizard, or revenge with Garchomp. If any of them are down before Medicham shows up it is a lot harder to manage.
Importable:
Hitmonzard (Charizard) @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 248 HP / 164 Def / 96 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Claw
- Will-O-Wisp
- Roost

Hitmonrill (Azumarill) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Encore
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Hitmonthorn (Ferrothorn) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Stealth Rock
- Thunder Wave

Hitmonscor (Gliscor) @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 Spe
Impish Nature
- Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Protect

Hitmoneye (Sableye) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Taunt

Hitmonchomp (Garchomp) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Stone Edge
- Fire Blast
 
Last edited:
The issue there is what to drop for Defog, I could try dropping Will-O-Wisp though I'm unsure of how effective it will be.
 
Hey I Am Doz, nice team you got there. It seems like you have no specially offensive presence at all. Slowbro completely shuts down your team if you haven't set up a couple DDs with Zard. Gliscor can Knock Off, but then you will lose to scald + slack off. Same thing goes with Sableye. Eventually, Sableye will be burned and therefore it'll struggle with surviving since it's so frail. This is why I suggest getting rid of Garchomp and adding in scarf Latios. It does scarf Garchomp's job just as well and can Defog too, helping out your Zard from taking huge stealth rocks damage. It can also take Keldeo's water hits if, for some reason Azumarill goes down early game. It also catches many people off guard, allowing it to pick up KOs on weakened Mega Manectric and Greninja after setting up hazards.
Latios (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Defog
- Trick
Trick is an amazing move to carry on Latios vs. Stall teams. It outspeeds the bulky mons and can trick away its Choice Scarf to cripple them. Latios always baits in Heatran, Tyranitar, Mew and Chansey, so getting rid of their recovery/forcing them to lock themselves into one move is really helpful. Furthermore, you're able to go for Defog after tricking away your item, allowing Zard to set up.
 
I'll be willing to give Latios a try, but as mentioned in the intro, it would be preferable to not use Legends due to this being an in game team in addition to Showdown.

My zard isn't DD so some of your points are a little irrelevant, though I agree on having a difficulty with Slowbro. At present I generally Toxic with Gliscor, Protect for a turn then proceed switching around it. A consistent answer to it would be greatly appreciated, in the previous version I at least had aegislash for that job .
 
I'll be willing to give Latios a try, but as mentioned in the intro, it would be preferable to not use Legends due to this being an in game team in addition to Showdown.

My zard isn't DD so some of your points are a little irrelevant, though I agree on having a difficulty with Slowbro. At present I generally Toxic with Gliscor, Protect for a turn then proceed switching around it. A consistent answer to it would be greatly appreciated, in the previous version I at least had aegislash for that job .
I'm sorry, my first post was pretty garbage and I didn't look at the team hard enough. I'm going to give it a second go after analyzing the team a bit more. Forgive me for this.
Extremely sorry for mentioning DD Zard in my comment. I must've been looking at multiple RMTs at the time so I probably got mixed up a lot. Anyway, with your comment about a consistent answer to Slowbro, maybe running Thunderbolt on scarf Latios would be good. It 2HKOs it with ease and it takes both STAB moves from Slowbro. Running a Life Orb variant of Latios wouldn't be a horrible idea too, as it breaks Slowbro + Venusaur core extremely easily. That way, you won't have to worry about Heatran at all considering you have a bulky Zard and Gliscor who can tank hits all day.

Zard X has great physical bulk already, so I would suggest a spread that can take on Rotom-W's Hydro Pump much better, being able to stall it out of Hydro Pumps and roosting up.
Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 224 HP / 28 Atk / 140 SpD / 116 Spe
Careful Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Flare Blitz
- Earthquake
- Roost
Enough speed EVs to outspeed Jolly Bisharp and burn it with a Will-O-Wisp.

Looking at your team, if hazards are up and you're forced to switch out, Mega-Pinsir can pressure your team a LOT. If it gets a chance to set up an SD, which it will try against a sleeping Azumarill or if Chomp was locked into EQ/confused with Outrage. Ferrothorn isn't taking a +2 Close Combat and Sableye has a 50% chance to live a Quick Attack after rocks, and, even then, you have to be at 100% health. The only way I see you beating Mega-Pinsir is by having Scarfchomp at 70% and hoping to hit a Stone Edge. This is why I'm suggesting Zapdos over Garchomp as another suggestion, along with Latios (test both out and see which one works best.) Not only does Zapdos provide amazing bulk for the team, but it counters Mega Pinsir, even at +2. It's able to take any 1 hit, even after Stealth Rocks and be able to OHKO it with Thunderbolt. You are looking for a consistent Slowbro answer, so Zapdos is a very good pokemon to use as well. It takes Scalds and can smack it with a Tbolt. This does, however, remove your way of revenge killing with Scarfchomp. Looking at the OU tier, Bisharp and Scizor love getting up SDs. You have Zard to switch on them, being able to cripple them with Will-O-Wisp. If an opposing Mega Zard X sets up a DD, you can come in with Gliscor to Toxic the first turn, then proceed to stall it out w/ Protect + switching into Azumarill to eat up any hits.

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 224 HP / 104 Def / 68 SpA / 96 SpD / 16 Spe
Bold Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Defog
- Roost
 
Zapdos strikes me as a better fit than Latios. So that is a definite option, with that spread what hits can it handle?

In terms of Zard, it never has any trouble as is against Rotom, so changing the set isn't something I feel necessary at present. But I will keep that spread in mind if that changes.
 
Zapdos strikes me as a better fit than Latios. So that is a definite option, with that spread what hits can it handle?

In terms of Zard, it never has any trouble as is against Rotom, so changing the set isn't something I feel necessary at present. But I will keep that spread in mind if that changes.

This Zapdos allows it to take a guaranteed +2 Frustration from Mega Pinsir and being able to OHKO it with Tbolt. The Def EVs are there to sponge Mega Medicham's hits if it's not carrying Ice Punch. SpDef EVs are there to take 2 hits from offensive Mega Venusaur and stall it out a bit.
 
Hi Doz, I battled your previous team before when aegislash wasn't banned yet. Even though I won, I have to say that it was really good! This team seems to be very good, other than the fact that it is rekt by mega manectric / scared landorus therian core. Therefore, I would suggest that you try out scared Greninja in place of scarf chomp is scarf chomp earthquake does not hit landorus t. I will admit, this sounds weird, but you could get the surprise 0hko on manectric and landorus with hydro pump and ice beam respectively.
 
That is a rather out of the box idea there, I honestly never considered Greninja to be viable with scarf, as it won't take full Advantage of Protean, it is something I could consider. A set of Hydro, Ice Beam, Extrasensory and one other could work nicely, maybe U-Turn for momentum
 
Back
Top