Pinsir [QC 1/3]

[Peef Rimgar]

QC 1/3
Checked by Can-Eh-Dian/ /

[OVERVIEW]

+ Very high attack lets it break walls with ease
+ 2 very good abilities in Mold Breaker and Moxie
+ Great boosting option in Swords Dance to crumble anything that did try to wall it
+ Solid coverage moves like EQ, Knock Off, and Stone Edge
+ Priority that outpaces and dents Fletch in Quick Attacks
+ Odd but useful Stealth Rock + Mold Breaker combo to set up rocks on Magic Bounce users, making it stopped only by fast Taunt
- Mediocre Speed, allowing it to be revenged killed very easily
- Highly resisted STAB moves which hinder its ability to break walls
- Lead set is made a tad of a liability by Archeops being one of the tier's better SR leads, as it can OHKO easily
- Reliance on un-STAB quick attack to hit faster threats
- Poor defensive typing, sporting few resistances and a weakness to Stealth Rock
- Poor special bulk, allowing Special attacking threats to revenge kill it with relative ease

[SET]
name: Swords Dance
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: X-Scissor
move 3: Earthquake / Stone Edge
move 4: Quick Attack
item: Life Orb / Lum Berry
ability: Moxie / Mold Breaker
nature: Adamant / Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

• Swords Dance is for boosting Pinsir's already sky-high attack
• X-Scissor is for STAB damage, making Pinsir hit insanely hard
• Earthquake hits several important Rock Type, Poison Type, Fire Type, and Steel Type threats to this set, like Garbodor and Mawile
• Stone Edge hits Flying-Types which would otherwise wall this set, for SE damage, along with Fire and Bug types
• Quick Attack allows Pinsir to outprioritize Fletchinder, killing after rocks at +2

Set Details
========

• Life Orb, in tandem with Adamant nature, allows Pinsir to OHKO Fletchinder with Quick Attack after rocks
• Lum Berry lets Pinsir set up on Will-O-Wisp or other status users
• Moxie allows Pinsir to boosts its attack as it gets kills
• Mold Breaker is a great ability to beat Weezing despite Levitate, and break Quag through Unaware
• Adamant allows Pinsir's Quick Attack to kill Fletchinder after rocks while out-prioritizing it
• Jolly allows Pinsir to outspeed +Spe Mesprit, Samurott, and Kabutops
  
• Standard 252/252 Atk and Spe spread
• Don't put 4 in HP as Pinsir is weak to rocks

Usage Tips
========

• Come in on something that can't really touch Pinsir, such as Tangela or Torterra lacking Stone Edge, and set up freely
• Don't set up Pinsir if Fletchinder is healthy
• Try to avoid burns if you're using LO / have already used up your Lum Berry

Team Options
========

• Slow VoltTurners to get Pinsir in safely, like Uxie and Xatu, are nice to avoid taking unnecessary damage
• Hazard support to nab KOes is always nice, SR especially so Pinsir can OHKO Fletch with Quick attack at +2
• Special sweepers / wallbreakers are nice to use in conjunction with Pinsir as they can topple physically bulky mons like Regirock and Rhydon
• RP Torterra makes a very potent partner, as it beats Rock Types, Fire Types, most Poison Types bar Weezing, and Quagsire, all of which can cause this set trpuble

[SET]
name: Choice Band
move 1: X-Scissor
move 2: Earthquake
move 3: Quick Attack
move 4: Stone Edge
item: Choice Band
ability: Mold Breaker
nature: Jolly / Adamant
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

• X-Scissor will be your hardest hitting move vs. unresisting targets, as it gets STAB to hit extra hard off of
• Earthquake nails a lot of mons that take X-Scissors easily, like Rock, Poison, Fire and Steel types
• Quick Attack is some nice priority to hit frail, quick threats before they can you
• Stone Edge hits Flying-Types that would otherwise wall this set pretty hard, along with hitting Fire and Flying Types
• Close Combat hits similar targets to Earthquake, but pokemon such as Archeops can't dodge being hit by it
  
• Knock Off is a nice move as well, primarily ghosts who could potentially wall this set, like Gourgeist
• Stealth Rock could be used on this set as well, since Pinsir pressures out quite a bit of the metagame

Set Details
========

• Choice Band is the main point of this set, letting Pinsir be a very strong wallbreaker right off the bat
• Mold Breaker lets Pinsir's EQ hit Levitate pokemon like Weezing SE, and provides more utility over Moxie since you won't usually be attacking more than once at a time
• Jolly nature outspeeds the aforementioned +spe Mesprit, Samurott, and Kabutops
• Adamant increases Pinsir's power
• Standard offensive EV spread
• Don't put 4 extra EVs into HP since its weak to rocks

Usage Tips
========

• Come in on stuff that threatens your win condition's sweep
• Your opponent will probably assume you're going to spam your STAB move, so predicting switch-ins to them accordingly is advised
• With CB, Pinsir can take out max defense Uxie (2HKOes and Uxie can't do much back), Mesprit, Musharna, Exeggutor, Malamar, and can lure threats like Weezing to KO with its coverage
• Be careful locking yourself into Quick Attack, as it is quite weak

Team Options
========

• Slow VoltTurn users like Uxie and Xatu would be beneficial as to get Pinsir in safely to break whatever wall needs to be broken
• Flying Type/Rock Type checks/counters like Rhydon for Flying and Lilligant for Rock are of course appreciated, as Pinsir can't reliably beat them all
• A special sweeper like Lilligant would be especially potent with this set since Pinsir can blow through any special walls, while they take down any physical walls

[SET]
name: Stealth Rock Setter
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: X-Scissor
move 3: Earthquake
move 4: Stone Edge / Rock Tomb
item: Life Orb / Focus Sash
ability: Mold Breaker
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

• Stealth Rock is unblocked by Magic Bounce thanks to Pinsir's Mold Breaker ability, making it very reliable at setting them
• X-Scissor is a hard-hitting STAB attack, hitting common leads Uxie and Mesprit, and a common spinner in Claydol
• Earthquake, with mold breaker, nails most X-Scissor resists, along with an important spinner in Kabutops
• Stone Edge provides good coverage with the other two moves, nailing Flying and Bug types that otherwise wall you
• Rock Tomb is a nice option with Focus Sash to slow down anything trying to set up on you
• Knock Off is a good utility move to rid an opponent not threatened by above moves of an item

Set Details
========

• Life Orb lets Pinsir hit quite a bit harder, allowing it to more easily take down other leads
• Focus Sash is a good way to ensure Pinsir does something in the match-up, as it can't just be outright OHKOed
• Mold Breaker is very important as it allows Pinsir's rocks to be unblockable by Xatu
• Jolly nature allows Pinsir to outspeed important +speed threats right below it, like Mesprit, Samurott, etc.
• Standard offensive EVs
• Put extra 4 EVs anywhere but HP since its weak to rocks

Usage Tips
========

• This set is best played as a lead to get rocks up ASAP
• Avoid staying in if the opposing lead OHKOes you. Examples include Archeops and counter-lead Fletchs
• After rocks, if your opponent has no defogger/spinner, this set is essentially hard hitting death fodder
• If your opponent has a defogger/spinner like Pelipper or Kabutops, keep Pinsir around if possible so you can re-set rocks

Team Options
========

• Anything that appreciates reliable Stealth Rocks, like Lilligant, is a nice teammate for this set, as Pinsir can get them up just about guaranteed
• As with any Pinsir set, a counter to flying/rock types, such as Rhydon, would be appreciated
• Special Sweepers like Lilligant and Uxie work quite well with this set as well as they can take down Physically bulky mons that Pinsir can't handle

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

• Scarf
• Facade
• SubSD
• SubBU
• SD Rocks

Checks and Counters
===================

**Granbull**: Granbull can hard wall and Pinsir set, resisting its stab and dropping its attack with Intimidate

**Flying Types**: Flying types in general are a hindrance to Pinsir's usefulness, as most relevant ones, such as Fletchinder, Swellow, Archeops, Vivillon, etc. outspeed and OHKO. Defensive flying types like Pelipper and Rotom-S are also hard for Pinsir to handle, as it can't hit them terribly hard and they can heavily damage back

**Faster Choice Scarfers**: Pinsir isn't very bulky, so a lot of popular Choice Scarfers, like Mesprit and Rotom, can often times severely dent, if not OHKO it

**Bulky Rock Types**: Bulky Rock Types such as Regirock and Rhydon can easily switch into Pinsir's STABs, and can wall unless Pinsir is boosted.

**Faster Threats**: Faster Pokemon, especially special attackers, that can hit Pinsir SE, like Pyroar, Archeops, and Scyther can handily OHKO Pinsir and stop its sweep

 

[boltsandbombers]

Where is quick attack on sd??
Pinsir outspeeds fletchinder so its priority goes first, it probably deserves its own moveslot imo.

+2 252 Atk Life Orb Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 152 HP / 0 Def Fletchinder: 178-211 (58.7 - 69.6%)
If you get a Moxie boost as well it does 73.2 - 86.7%.

Also add a stealth rock set, being a Stealth Rock setter that doesnt have to worry about Xatu (mold breaker) is pretty awesome.

Not too keen on the content on this so far, in addition to the stuff above Rock Slide is mediocre at best since you need to hit the flying types on the switch as the offensive ones outspeed you anyways. Close Combat is garbage imo, I doubt it should even be slashed - being able to avoid Garbodor's helmet/aftermath is so beneficial.

 

[Peef Rimgar]

Where is quick attack on sd??
Pinsir outspeeds fletchinder so its priority goes first, it probably deserves its own moveslot imo.

+2 252 Atk Life Orb Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 152 HP / 0 Def Fletchinder: 178-211 (58.7 - 69.6%)

Also add a stealth rock set, being a Stealth Rock setter that doesnt have to worry about Xatu (mold breaker) is pretty awesome.

Not too keen on the content on this so far, in addition to the stuff above Rock Slide is mediocre at best since you need to hit the flying types on the switch as the offensive ones outspeed you anyways. Close Combat is garbage imo, I doubt it should even be slashed - being able to avoid Garbodor's helmet/aftermath is so beneficial.

I didn't think much of Quick Attack for some reason, will be placing that as opposed to Rock Slide
Close Combat is also out

I'll have to play around with a SR set for a bit, I haven't used it too extensively, what have you used personally thats good on it if you have?

 

[boltsandbombers]

Sr set should be rocks / x-scissor / eq / filler.

I'd like you to put this in WIP for the time being, one to add the above set and to expand on your points a lot. The overview barely tells me anything about pinsir in this meta, and there is a lot of important information and detail missing. Tbh I was considering rejecting this bc we'd have to help you so much with the information but take a second shot at it.

 

[Peef Rimgar]

This should look infinitely better, sorry the initial thing was pretty vague I wasn't sure how specific i had to be with the initial overview

Also I just kinda threw leftovers on the SR set, as I wasn't sure what else to go with. I contemplated sash but wasn't 100% sure

 

[ryan]

SD should be Moxie 99% of the time. It's the reason why SD Pinsir is so good--you don't even NEED to click Swords Dance to set up with it. And if you do manage to get up a Swords Dance, you're usually going to get a kill immediately and just kind of snowball. Moxie makes up for Quick Attack being so weak too. Just mention Mold Breaker in Set Details for hitting Weezing through Levitate and Quagsire through Unaware.

Band should get a set. Omfuga almost crushed me with it, did like 45 to my bulky Gurdurr (had like 88 Def EVs or some shit) with Close Combat. Shit is power. X-Scissor / Earthquake / Close Combat / filler, probably like Quick Attack / Stone Edge.

Don't mention Hyper Cutter in Other Options. Hardly any Intimidate users in NU.

 

[Peef Rimgar]

SD should be Moxie 99% of the time. It's the reason why SD Pinsir is so good--you don't even NEED to click Swords Dance to set up with it. And if you do manage to get up a Swords Dance, you're usually going to get a kill immediately and just kind of snowball. Moxie makes up for Quick Attack being so weak too. Just mention Mold Breaker in Set Details for hitting Weezing through Levitate and Quagsire through Unaware.

Band should get a set. Omfuga almost crushed me with it, did like 45 to my bulky Gurdurr (had like 88 Def EVs or some shit) with Close Combat. Shit is power. X-Scissor / Earthquake / Close Combat / filler, probably like Quick Attack / Stone Edge.

Don't mention Hyper Cutter in Other Options. Hardly any Intimidate users in NU.

Did these things

I but band above SR since it just generally seems more effective, I can change if requested

 

[honchkrow]

- Overview: for solid coverage moves, put stone edge as it hits flying and fire types

- Overview: "Odd but useful Stealth Rock + Mold Breaker combo to set up rocks guarenteed" I wouldn't say guaranteed, i would say it allows it to get rocks up against magic bounce mons but is stopped by taunt users that outspeed it.

- under moves for set 1: I don't think knock off is relevant in the slightest however stone edge is. I would slash stone edge instead of knock off. Additionally, Golurk is not common at all in this current meta making knock off even less relevant.

- for the CB set, change moxie to mold breaker. Moxie isn't as relevant on this set as you aren't killing multiple mons in a row.

- under checks and counters; Fletch: remove the second sentence as it is unnecessary.

- under checks and counters; Faster Choice Scarfers: Scarf Pyroar isn't a thing, please remove it.

 

[Peef Rimgar]

- Overview: for solid coverage moves, put stone edge as it hits flying and fire types

- Overview: "Odd but useful Stealth Rock + Mold Breaker combo to set up rocks guarenteed" I wouldn't say guaranteed, i would say it allows it to get rocks up against magic bounce mons but is stopped by taunt users that outspeed it.

- under moves for set 1: I don't think knock off is relevant in the slightest however stone edge is. I would slash stone edge instead of knock off. Additionally, Golurk is not common at all in this current meta making knock off even less relevant.

- for the CB set, change moxie to mold breaker. Moxie isn't as relevant on this set as you aren't killing multiple mons in a row.

- under checks and counters; Fletch: remove the second sentence as it is unnecessary.

- under checks and counters; Faster Choice Scarfers: Scarf Pyroar isn't a thing, please remove it.

I honestly forgot Taunt lmao, all of this has been done

 

[Kiyo]

i'd prob mention stealth rock on cb, if not give it a slash. i really think you overvalue quick attack on all the sets, it shouldnt be the first slash like ever, lol.

 

[Peef Rimgar]

i'd prob mention stealth rock on cb, if not give it a slash. i really think you overvalue quick attack on all the sets, it shouldnt be the first slash like ever, lol.

I've meant to give Quick Attack its own slash on SD and CB I've just been getting distracted. Thats now done, along with the SR mention

 

[Punchshroom]

Time to r8

[OVERVIEW]

+ Very high attack lets it break walls with ease
+ 2 very good abilities in Mold Breaker and Moxie
+ Great boosting option in Swords Dance to crumble anything that did try to wall it
+ Solid coverage moves like EQ, Knock Off, and Stone Edge
+ Priority that outpaces and dents Fletch in Quick Attacks
+ Odd but useful Stealth Rock + Mold Breaker combo to set up rocks on Magic Bounce users, making it stopped only by fast Taunt
- Mediocre Speed, allowing it to be revenged killed very easily
- Fletchinder exists, which heavily hinders it since priority flying is everywhere
- Highly resisted STAB moves which hinder its ability to break walls
- Lead set is made a tad of a liability by Archeops being one of the tier's better SR leads, as it can OHKO easily

You don't need to mention Fletchinder that much, it's not like it's the bane of Pinsir's existence or anything. Other notable flaws Pinsir has include its poor defensive typing, plaguing it with a large weakness to entry hazards and not many resistances to fall back on, plus the limited BP of its attacks, with none of them breaching 120 BP, which can potentially hinder its KOing power. Reliance on unSTAB Quick Attack against faster threats can also be noted.

Edit: Peef Rimgar Bro I said low BP, not low PP

[SET]
name: Swords Dance
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: X-Scissor
move 3: Earthquake / Stone Edge
move 4: Quick Attack
item: Lum Berry / Life Orb
ability: Moxie / Mold Breaker
nature: Jolly / Adamant
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

• Swords Dance is for boosting Pinsir's already sky-high attack
• X-Scissor is for STAB damage, making Pinsir hit insanely hard
• Earthquake is best for Mold Breaker sets as it allows Pinsir to beat stuff like Rotom
• Stone Edge hits Flying-Types which would otherwise wall this set, for SE damage
• Quick Attack allows Pinsir to outprioritize Fletchinder, nearly killing after rocks at +2

Earthquake also allows Pinsir to hit Poison-, Fire-, and Steel-types, as well as threatening Rock-types. Mention that Stone Edge still retains coverage on Fire-types.

Usage Tips
========

• Come in on something that can't really touch Pinsir, and set up freely
• Don't set up Pinsir if Fletchinder still exists in the match-up
• Try to avoid burns if you're using LO / have already used up your Lum Berry

Name something(s) that Pinsir would have an easy time setting up on. Also you can mention that Pinsir shouldn't set up if Fletchinder is healthy, because boosted Quick Attack can pick off weakened Fletchs.

Team Options
========

• Anything that counters Fletchinder is nice as Pinsir can't do a ton in return
• Slow VoltTurners to get Pinsir in safely are nice to avoid taking unnecessary damage
• Hazard support to nab KOes is always nice, SR especially so Pinsir can OHKO Fletch with Quick attack at +2
• Special sweepers / wallbreakers are nice to use in conjunction with Pinsir as they can topple physically bulky mons like Regirock

The two bolded points contradict each other so remove that first point. Since Pinsir's 2 move coverage isn't perfect, Pokemon that can take down mons that would wall Pinsir's coverage should be listed as teammates. Also, name examples of mons that provide the respective support, and elaborate on any additional advantages these mons may have with Pinsir (defensive / offensive synergy).

[SET]
name: Choice Banded Wallbreaker
move 1: X-Scissor
move 2: Earthquake
move 3: Close Combat / Stone Edge / Knock Off
move 4: Quick Attack
item: Choice Band
ability: Mold Breaker
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

• X-Scissor will be your hardest hitting move vs. unresisting targets, as it gets STAB to hit extra hard off of
• Earthquake nails a lot of mons that take X-Scissors easily, like Rock and Steel types
• Quick Attack is some nice priority to hit frail, quick threats before they can you
• Close Combat hits similar targets to Earthquake, but pokemon such as Cryogonal with Levitate and Archeops with Flying-Type can't dodge being hit by it
• Stone Edge hits and Flying-Types that would otherwise wall this set pretty hard, at the cost of picking off frail threats
• Knock Off is a nice move as well, primarily for Haunter and other ghosts who could potentially wall this set
• Stealth Rock could be used on this set as well, since it pressures out quite a bit of the metagame

Just name the set Choice Band. EQ nails Poison-types as well. Since Quick Attack is the third move listed in Moves, it should be reflected in the Set itself. Why is Cryogonal mentioned as a mon that dodges Earthquake when Mold Breaker is the main ability? Stone Edge should be slashed before Close Combat since its coverage is far more valuable than Close Combat's, although CC is Pinsir's strongest attack against Fighting-types. Also, Knock Off doesn't actually seem very useful in this set if you're using Mold Breaker, as Mold Breaker EQ already does a number on Ghosts bar Gourgeist and especially Golurk I guess, but it doesn't seem good enough to be even slashed, just mentioned in Moves.

Set Details
========

• Choice Band is this set's crux, letting Pinsir be a very strong wallbreaker right off the bat
• Mold Breaker lets Pinsir's EQ hit Levitate pokemon like Weezing SE, and provides the most utility since you won't usually be attacking more than once at a time
• Jolly nature outspeeds the aforementioned +spe Mesprit, Magmortar, and Kabutops
• Standard offensive EV spread
• Don't put 4 extra EVs into HP since its weak to rocks

Let's try not to use the word "crux", shall we? Also for the bolded point, you'll need to directly state that Moxie won't be as useful on this set for that reason, since being Choice locked makes it harder to take advantage of the Moxie boost. <- Be sure to include this point when talking about Scarf in OO.

Usage Tips
========

• Come in on stuff that threatens your win condition's sweep
• Your opponent will probably assume you're going to spam your STAB move, so predicting switch-ins to them accordingly is advised
• Don't try to fight a threat that outspeeds you, as to avoid taking unnecessary damage

What kinds of Pokemon does Pinsir excel at taking out / threatening?

Team Options
========

• Slow VoltTurn users would be beneficial as to get Pinsir in safely to break whatever wall needs to be broken
• Flying Type/Rock Type checks/counters are of course appreciated, as Pinsir can't reliably beat them all
• A special sweeper would be especially potent with this set since Pinsir can blow through any special walls

Examples pls

[SET]

name: Stealth Rock Setter (WIP)
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: X-Scissor
move 3: Earthquake
move 4: Knock Off
item: Leftovers
ability: Mold Breaker
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

• Stealth Rock is unblockable thanks to Pinsir's Mold Breaker ability, making it very reliable at setting them
• X-Scissor is a hard-hitting STAB attack
• Earthquake, with mold breaker, nails most X-Scissor resists, such as Garbodor, Rotom, etc.
• Knock Off is a good utility move to rid an opponent not threatened by above moves of an item

X-Scissor's effectiveness on Uxie, Mesprit, and Claydol should be noted, as the former two are common opponents in the SR lead matchup, and the latter is heavily deterred from Rapid Spinning on Pinsir. Mention that EQ also hits Kabutops, which may otherwise attempt Rapid Spinning in Pinsir's face. Knock Off just doesn't seem very useful for coverage because again, Mold Breaker EQ. Rock coverage seems
more useful for Pinsir since it can't afford being completely helpless against Flying-types (especially when two of them are bulky Defog users). Two suggestions here: Stone Edge to allow Pinsir to strike Defoggers hard and also combat Xatu if you so wish; the other is Rock Tomb which serves to give Pinsir the upper hand against faster foes such as Archeops or Pyroar, as it outspeeds them next turn and allows it to plan its next course of action (attack to finish off the opponent, set up SR on the switch, set up SR and let a teammate avenge Pinsir against the slowed foe, etc.). Rock Tomb is only really worth considering alongside Focus Sash though, which I'd recommend in Set Details. You can keep Knock Off since this Pinsir is more focused on utility rather than sweeping, but I'd probably slash it after the Rock moves. You could mention that Knock Off nails Golurk hard.

Set Details
========

• Leftovers allows Pinsir to have some longetivity, setting up Rocks a few times if removed
• Mold Breaker is very important as it allows Pinsir's rocks to be unblockable by Xatu
• Jolly nature allows Pinsir to outspeed important +speed threats right below it, like Mesprit, Magmortar, etc.
• Standard offensive EVs
• Put extra 4 EVs anywhere but HP since its weak to rocks

Not sure if Pinsir is the kind of mon that takes advantage of longevity given its poor defensive typing; it'd probably leave a better impression with Life Orb boosted attacks. Focus Sash is another option to allow Pinsir to function against faster opponents that threaten to OHKO it, and works alongside Rock Tomb to allow Pinsir to control the flow of battle.

Team Options
========

• Anything that appreciated reliable Stealth Rocks is a nice teammate for this set, as Pinsir can get them up just about guaranteed
• As with any Pinsir set, a counter to flying/rock types, namely Fletchinder, Archeops, and Regirock would be appreciated
• Special Sweepers work quite well with this set as well as they can take down Physically bulky mons that Pinsir can't handle

Such as...?

Checks and Counters
===================

**Fletchinder**: Fletchinder can OHKO any Pinsir with a Priority Acrobatics like nothing

**Flying Types**: Flying types in general are a hindrance to Pinsir's usefulness, as most relevant ones, such as Swellow, Archeops, Rotom-S, etc. outspeed and OHKO

**Faster Choice Scarfers**: Pinsir isn't very bulky, so a lot of popular Choice Scarfers, like Rotom-S, and Magneton can often times severely dent, if not OHKO it

**Bulky Rock Types**: Bulky Rock Types such as Regirock and Rhydon can easily switch into Pinsir's STABs, and can wall unless Pinsir is boosted.

**Faster Threats**: Faster Pokemon that can hit Pinsir SE, like Pyroar, Archeops, and Scyther can handily OHKO Pinsir and stop its sweep

Granbull is by far the hardest counter to Pinsir in the tier, so it deserves its own section.

Just lump Fletchinder alongside the other Flying-types; it's not like they handle Pinsir substantially differently, and all bar Archeops need to watch out for boosted Quick Attack anyway. That said, you also need to take note of bulky Flying-types such as Pelipper, Mantine, and Rotom-S that can give Pinsir issues, especially if Pinsir lacks Stone Edge. If you want to avoid redundancy with Rotom-S in the offensive Flying-type bit, you can replace it with Vivillon and Scyther.

Faster Choice Scarfers can be combined with Faster Threats; just mention a few specific Pokemon that need Scarf to revenge Pinsir. Also note Pinsir's mediocre Special Defense, making revenge killing from the special side much easier (with attacker such as...?).

 

[Peef Rimgar]

Time to r8

You don't need to mention Fletchinder that much, it's not like it's the bane of Pinsir's existence or anything. Other notable flaws Pinsir has include its poor defensive typing, plaguing it with a large weakness to entry hazards and not many resistances to fall back on, plus the limited BP of its attacks, with none of them breaching 120 BP, which can potentially hinder its KOing power. Reliance on unSTAB Quick Attack against faster threats can also be noted.


Earthquake also allows Pinsir to hit Poison-, Fire-, and Steel-types, as well as threatening Rock-types. Mention that Stone Edge still retains coverage on Fire-types.


Name something(s) that Pinsir would have an easy time setting up on. Also you can mention that Pinsir shouldn't set up if Fletchinder is healthy, because boosted Quick Attack can pick off weakened Fletchs.


The two bolded points contradict each other so remove that first point. Since Pinsir's 2 move coverage isn't perfect, Pokemon that can take down mons that would wall Pinsir's coverage should be listed as teammates. Also, name examples of mons that provide the respective support, and elaborate on any additional advantages these mons may have with Pinsir (defensive / offensive synergy).

Just name the set Choice Band. EQ nails Poison-types as well. Since Quick Attack is the third move listed in Moves, it should be reflected in the Set itself. Why is Cryogonal mentioned as a mon that dodges Earthquake when Mold Breaker is the main ability? Stone Edge should be slashed before Close Combat since its coverage is far more valuable than Close Combat's, although CC is Pinsir's strongest attack against Fighting-types. Also, Knock Off doesn't actually seem very useful in this set if you're using Mold Breaker, as Mold Breaker EQ already does a number on Ghosts bar Gourgeist and especially Golurk I guess, but it doesn't seem good enough to be even slashed, just mentioned in Moves.


Let's try not to use the word "crux", shall we? Also for the bolded point, you'll need to directly state that Moxie won't be as useful on this set for that reason, since being Choice locked makes it harder to take advantage of the Moxie boost. <- Be sure to include this point when talking about Scarf in OO.


What kinds of Pokemon does Pinsir excel at taking out / threatening?


Examples pls


X-Scissor's effectiveness on Uxie, Mesprit, and Claydol should be noted, as the former two are common opponents in the SR lead matchup, and the latter is heavily deterred from Rapid Spinning on Pinsir. Mention that EQ also hits Kabutops, which may otherwise attempt Rapid Spinning in Pinsir's face. Knock Off just doesn't seem very useful for coverage because again, Mold Breaker EQ. Rock coverage seems
more useful for Pinsir since it can't afford being completely helpless against Flying-types (especially when two of them are bulky Defog users). Two suggestions here: Stone Edge to allow Pinsir to strike Defoggers hard and also combat Xatu if you so wish; the other is Rock Tomb which serves to give Pinsir the upper hand against faster foes such as Archeops or Pyroar, as it outspeeds them next turn and allows it to plan its next course of action (attack to finish off the opponent, set up SR on the switch, set up SR and let a teammate avenge Pinsir against the slowed foe, etc.). Rock Tomb is only really worth considering alongside Focus Sash though, which I'd recommend in Set Details. You can keep Knock Off since this Pinsir is more focused on utility rather than sweeping, but I'd probably slash it after the Rock moves. You could mention that Knock Off nails Golurk hard.


Not sure if Pinsir is the kind of mon that takes advantage of longevity given its poor defensive typing; it'd probably leave a better impression with Life Orb boosted attacks. Focus Sash is another option to allow Pinsir to function against faster opponents that threaten to OHKO it, and works alongside Rock Tomb to allow Pinsir to control the flow of battle.



Such as...?



Granbull is by far the hardest counter to Pinsir in the tier, so it deserves its own section.

Just lump Fletchinder alongside the other Flying-types; it's not like they handle Pinsir substantially differently, and all bar Archeops need to watch out for boosted Quick Attack anyway. That said, you also need to take note of bulky Flying-types such as Pelipper, Mantine, and Rotom-S that can give Pinsir issues, especially if Pinsir lacks Stone Edge. If you want to avoid redundancy with Rotom-S in the offensive Flying-type bit, you can replace it with Vivillon and Scyther.

Faster Choice Scarfers can be combined with Faster Threats; just mention a few specific Pokemon that need Scarf to revenge Pinsir. Also note Pinsir's mediocre Special Defense, making revenge killing from the special side much easier (with attacker such as...?).

I believe all of this has been fixed

 

[Evan.]

QC 0/3
Checked by / /

[OVERVIEW]

+ Very high attack lets it break walls with ease
+ 2 very good abilities in Mold Breaker and Moxie
+ Great boosting option in Swords Dance to crumble anything that did try to wall it
+ Solid coverage moves like EQ, Knock Off, and Stone Edge
+ Priority that outpaces and dents Fletch in Quick Attacks
+ Odd but useful Stealth Rock + Mold Breaker combo to set up rocks on Magic Bounce users, making it stopped only by fast Taunt
- Mediocre Speed, allowing it to be revenged killed very easily
- Highly resisted STAB moves which hinder its ability to break walls
- Lead set is made a tad of a liability by Archeops being one of the tier's better SR leads, as it can OHKO easily
- Low PP moves, potentially limiting its KOing power (Remove this point, its moves arent even that low on PP)
- Reliance on un-STAB quick attack to hit faster threats
- Poor defensive typing, sporting few resistances and a weakness to Stealth Rock
- Poor special bulk, allowing Special attacking threats to revenge kill it with relative ease

[SET]
name: Swords Dance
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: X-Scissor
move 3: Earthquake / Stone Edge
move 4: Quick Attack
item: Lum Berry / Life Orb
ability: Moxie / Mold Breaker
nature: Jolly / Adamant
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

Slash Adamant and Life Orb first. Lum Berry and Jolly make it too weak imo and Ada LO really helps when you're trying to clean with QA

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

• Swords Dance is for boosting Pinsir's already sky-high attack
• X-Scissor is for STAB damage, making Pinsir hit insanely hard
• Earthquake is best for Mold Breaker sets as it allows Pinsir to threaten Rock, Poison, Fire, and Steel types it couldn't with its STAB

Remove the point about EQ being best for Mold Breaker because EQ is better on Moxie as well to hit stuff like Garbodor and Magneton which are everywhere

• Stone Edge hits Flying-Types which would otherwise wall this set, for SE damage, along with Fire and Bug types
• Quick Attack allows Pinsir to outprioritize Fletchinder, nearly killing after rocks at +2

With adamant LO it does OHKO fletch after rocks, another point why Ada LO is better

Set Details
========

• Lum Berry lets Pinsir set up on Will-O-Wisp or other status users
• Life Orb makes Pinsir hit even harder, at the cost of being susceptible to burn
• Moxie allows Pinsir to boosts its attack to even greater levels than SD alone could

Remove the point about "greater levels" because it doesnt make sense. Just say it boosts its Attack as it gets kills.

• Mold Breaker is a great ability to beat Weezing despite Levitate, and break Quag through Unaware
• Jolly allows Pinsir to outspeed +Spe Mesprit, Magmortar, and Kabutops

+speed magmortar is non-existent. Go with +speed samurott instead.

• Adamant boosts Pinsirs attack to even higher levels, but sacrifices outspeeding key threats
• Standard 252/252 Atk and Spe spread
• Don't put 4 in HP as Pinsir is weak to rocks

Usage Tips
========

• Come in on something that can't really touch Pinsir, such as Lilligant or Torterra lacking Stone Edge, and set up freely

Remove Lilligant for something like Tangela because lilligant can put Pinsir to sleep/hit it with SE coverage

• Don't set up Pinsir if Fletchinder is healthy
• Try to avoid burns if you're using LO / have already used up your Lum Berry

Team Options
========

• Slow VoltTurners to get Pinsir in safely, like Uxie and Xatu, are nice to avoid taking unnecessary damage
• Hazard support to nab KOes is always nice, SR especially so Pinsir can OHKO Fletch with Quick attack at +2
• Special sweepers / wallbreakers are nice to use in conjunction with Pinsir as they can topple physically bulky mons like Regirock and Rhydon
• RP Torterra makes a very potent partner, as it beats Rock Types, Fire Types, most Poison Types bar Weezing, and Quagsire, all of which can cause this set trpuble

[SET]
name: Choice Band
move 1: X-Scissor
move 2: Earthquake
move 3: Quick Attack
move 4: Close Combat / Stone Edge
item: Choice Band
ability: Mold Breaker
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

Remove CC, just mention it in moves since it literally doesnt hit anything that X-Scissor, EQ, SE, doesnt hit.

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

• X-Scissor will be your hardest hitting move vs. unresisting targets, as it gets STAB to hit extra hard off of
• Earthquake nails a lot of mons that take X-Scissors easily, like Rock, Poison, Fire and Steel types
• Quick Attack is some nice priority to hit frail, quick threats before they can you
• Close Combat hits similar targets to Earthquake, but pokemon such as Archeops can't dodge being hit by it
• Stone Edge hits Flying-Types that would otherwise wall this set pretty hard, along with hitting Fire and Flying Types
• Knock Off is a nice move as well, primarily ghosts who could potentially wall this set, like Gourgeist
• Stealth Rock could be used on this set as well, since Pinsir pressures out quite a bit of the metagame

Set Details
========

• Choice Band is the main point of this set, letting Pinsir be a very strong wallbreaker right off the bat
• Mold Breaker lets Pinsir's EQ hit Levitate pokemon like Weezing SE, and provides more utility over Moxie since you won't usually be attacking more than once at a time
• Jolly nature outspeeds the aforementioned +spe Mesprit, Magmortar, and Kabutops

Again remove +spe magmortar

• Standard offensive EV spread
• Don't put 4 extra EVs into HP since its weak to rocks

Usage Tips
========

• Come in on stuff that threatens your win condition's sweep
• Your opponent will probably assume you're going to spam your STAB move, so predicting switch-ins to them accordingly is advised
• Don't try to fight a threat that outspeeds you, as to avoid taking unnecessary damage

Remove this point, its completely unnecessary

• With CB, Pinsir can take out max defense Uxie (2HKOes and Uxie can't do much back), Mesprit, Cacturne, Exeggutor, Malamar, and can lure threats like Weezing to KO with its coverage

Mention that they should be wary of locking into Quick Attack because its really weak.

Team Options
========

• Slow VoltTurn users like Uxie and Xatu would be beneficial as to get Pinsir in safely to break whatever wall needs to be broken
• Flying Type/Rock Type checks/counters like Rhydon for Flying and Lilligant for Rock are of course appreciated, as Pinsir can't reliably beat them all
• A special sweeper like Lilligant would be especially potent with this set since Pinsir can blow through any special walls, while they take down any physical walls

[SET]
name: Stealth Rock Setter
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: X-Scissor
move 3: Earthquake
move 4: Stone Edge / Rock Tomb
item: Life Orb / Focus Sash
ability: Mold Breaker
nature: Jolly
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

• Stealth Rock is unblockable thanks to Pinsir's Mold Breaker ability, making it very reliable at setting them

Dont say "unblockable" just say not blocked by Magic Bounce

• X-Scissor is a hard-hitting STAB attack, hitting common leads Uxie and Mesprit, and a common spinner in Claydol
• Earthquake, with mold breaker, nails most X-Scissor resists, namely Kabutops, a popular spinner

Kabutops doesnt resist X-Scissor so fix up this point a bit, I can see what you're trying to say.

• Stone Edge provides good coverage with the other two moves, nailing Flying and Bug types that otherwise wall you
• Rock Tomb is a nice option with Focus Sash to slow down anything trying to set up on you
• Knock Off is a good utility move to rid an opponent not threatened by above moves of an item

Set Details
========

• Life Orb lets Pinsir hit quite a bit harder, allowing it to more easily take down other leads
• Focus Sash is a good way to ensure Pinsir does something in the match-up, as it can't just be outright OHKOed
• Mold Breaker is very important as it allows Pinsir's rocks to be unblockable by Xatu
• Jolly nature allows Pinsir to outspeed important +speed threats right below it, like Mesprit, Magmortar, etc.

Same as above about mag.

• Standard offensive EVs
• Put extra 4 EVs anywhere but HP since its weak to rocks

Usage Tips
========

• This set is best played as a lead to get rocks up ASAP
• Avoid staying in if the opposing lead OHKOes you. Examples include Archeops and counter-lead Fletchs
• After rocks, if your opponent has no defogger/spinner, this set is essentially hard hitting death fodder
• If your opponent has a defogger/spinner like Pelipper or Kabutops, keep Pinsir around if possible so you can re-set rocks
• If

remove 2nd if

Team Options
========

• Anything that appreciates reliable Stealth Rocks, like Gurdurr and Malamar, is a nice teammate for this set, as Pinsir can get them up just about guaranteed

I dont think these 2 are the best examples, try stuff that gets threatened by fire and flying types like lilligant

• As with any Pinsir set, a counter to flying/rock types, such as Rhydon or Magneton, would be appreciated
• Special Sweepers like Lilligant and Uxie work quite well with this set as well as they can take down Physically bulky mons that Pinsir can't handle

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

• Scarf
• Facade
• SubSD

Checks and Counters
===================

**Granbull**: Granbull can hard wall and Pinsir set, resisting its stabs and dropping its attack with Intimidate

Pinsir only has 1 STAB.

**Flying Types**: Flying types in general are a hindrance to Pinsir's usefulness, as most relevant ones, such as Fletchinder, Swellow, Archeops, Vivillon, etc. outspeed and OHKO. Defensive flying types like Pelipper and Rotom-S are also hard for Pinsir to handle, as it can't hit them terribly hard and they can heavily damage back

**Faster Choice Scarfers**: Pinsir isn't very bulky, so a lot of popular Choice Scarfers, like Mesprit, Sawk, and Magneton can often times severely dent, if not OHKO it

Remove Sawk cause its not a common scarfer, go with something like Rotom or Jynx

**Bulky Rock Types**: Bulky Rock Types such as Regirock and Rhydon can easily switch into Pinsir's STABs, and can wall unless Pinsir is boosted.

**Faster Threats**: Faster Pokemon, especially special attackers, that can hit Pinsir SE, like Pyroar, Archeops, and Scyther can handily OHKO Pinsir and stop its sweep

changes in bold, once you implement ill take a second look.

 

[Peef Rimgar]

changes in bold, once you implement ill take a second look.

Implemented

 

[Evan.]

put lo > lum on SD

slash adamant on CB, not sure if it should get 1st but for now leave it 2nd

UT on CB, change Cacturne for a more relevant defensive threat, because obviously it beats cacturne

Sub BU and SD Rocks in OO

do that and you're QC 1/3
[insert cool badge here]

 

[Peef Rimgar]

put lo > lum on SD

slash adamant on CB, not sure if it should get 1st but for now leave it 2nd

UT on CB, change Cacturne for a more relevant defensive threat, because obviously it beats cacturne

Sub BU and SD Rocks in OO

do that and you're QC 1/3
[insert cool badge here]

Implemented :]

 

[boltsandbombers]

Remove Magneton mentions.

[Overview]
Combine the first two points, because just saying it has high attack is super arbitrary and is something that you can see by just looking at the stats on the dex. The wording on the part about Swords Dance is a bit odd, just say something like "Access to Swords Dance combined with a high Attack stat to break through walls".
I'm iffy on the part about just listing coverage moves without any real meaning behind them since they're kinda arbitrary as well.
What should be in the overview is how it is one of the few good offensive Bug types in the tier, which is cool.
Definitely remove the part about quick attack outpacing Fletchinder.
Note that the Mold Breaker + SR combination is only shared by Rampardos.
I wouldnt call its Speed mediocre, its averag - there are still a good number of Pokemon it outspeeds.

[Swords Dance]
[Moves]
Don't say "x-types" if you're not going to list examples, and with Magneton removed Garb should not be the only listed target of EQ, because its not.
Give examples of what Stone Edge hits ~.~
Quick Attack is mainly used for Fletchinder but it also hits faster Pokemon in general, allowing Pinsir to pick off some weakened ones.

[Set Details]
Yeah its great that Adamant/LO lets you OHKO Fletch with QA after rocks, but that is not the main reason for the two things. Say that Life Orb is used for maximum damage output, and it also helps do the previously mentioned thing.
Remove last bullet point.
You can combine a lot of these points like saying "an adamant nature and maximum attack investment..." etc

[Usage Tips]
Tangela always run Sleep Powder and/or HP Fire so saying it cant touch Pinsir is wrong. Modest Leaf Storm hurts as well.
This needs some more info/detail.

[Team Options]
You say slow voltturners but dont list any Electric types >.>
Give examples of hazard setters and special sweepers/wallbreakers. I'll help you out - Tauros is a great partner because it is a great late game cleaner that appreciates Pinsir's wallbreaking, most notably how Pinsir puts a massive dent into Regirock, Tauros' most used answer [+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Pinsir Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 16+ Def Regirock: 294-348 (80.7 - 95.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock]

Put the Stealth Rock set before the CB set.

[SR Lead]
Slash Focus Sash before Life Orb.

[Moves]
With Rock Tomb, mention that it slows down Lead Archeops so that you can 2HKO it as it tries to Taunt you.
Mention that EQ hits Garbodor.
List examples of Stone Edge targets.

[Set Details]
Remove the last bullet point and combine stuff like I mentioned above.

[Usage Tips]
Well, nothing apart from Rock Blast mons can OHKO it if you're using sash, the better item, so change that.

[Team Options]
Yea there's more than just Lilligant that appreciates sr support. You even mention Lilligant twice ._.

[OO]
You have to actually explain what these things do, even if its brief, and why they deserve a mention, or if they're outclassed by something else.

This still needs work, tag me back and I'll look at this again.

 

[Peef Rimgar]

Remove Magneton mentions.

[Overview]
Combine the first two points, because just saying it has high attack is super arbitrary and is something that you can see by just looking at the stats on the dex. The wording on the part about Swords Dance is a bit odd, just say something like "Access to Swords Dance combined with a high Attack stat to break through walls".
I'm iffy on the part about just listing coverage moves without any real meaning behind them since they're kinda arbitrary as well.
What should be in the overview is how it is one of the few good offensive Bug types in the tier, which is cool.
Definitely remove the part about quick attack outpacing Fletchinder.
Note that the Mold Breaker + SR combination is only shared by Rampardos.
I wouldnt call its Speed mediocre, its averag - there are still a good number of Pokemon it outspeeds.

[Swords Dance]
[Moves]
Don't say "x-types" if you're not going to list examples, and with Magneton removed Garb should not be the only listed target of EQ, because its not.
Give examples of what Stone Edge hits ~.~
Quick Attack is mainly used for Fletchinder but it also hits faster Pokemon in general, allowing Pinsir to pick off some weakened ones.

[Set Details]
Yeah its great that Adamant/LO lets you OHKO Fletch with QA after rocks, but that is not the main reason for the two things. Say that Life Orb is used for maximum damage output, and it also helps do the previously mentioned thing.
Remove last bullet point.
You can combine a lot of these points like saying "an adamant nature and maximum attack investment..." etc

[Usage Tips]
Tangela always run Sleep Powder and/or HP Fire so saying it cant touch Pinsir is wrong. Modest Leaf Storm hurts as well.
This needs some more info/detail.

[Team Options]
You say slow voltturners but dont list any Electric types >.>
Give examples of hazard setters and special sweepers/wallbreakers. I'll help you out - Tauros is a great partner because it is a great late game cleaner that appreciates Pinsir's wallbreaking, most notably how Pinsir puts a massive dent into Regirock, Tauros' most used answer [+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Pinsir Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 16+ Def Regirock: 294-348 (80.7 - 95.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock]

Put the Stealth Rock set before the CB set.

[SR Lead]
Slash Focus Sash before Life Orb.

[Moves]
With Rock Tomb, mention that it slows down Lead Archeops so that you can 2HKO it as it tries to Taunt you.
Mention that EQ hits Garbodor.
List examples of Stone Edge targets.

[Set Details]
Remove the last bullet point and combine stuff like I mentioned above.

[Usage Tips]
Well, nothing apart from Rock Blast mons can OHKO it if you're using sash, the better item, so change that.

[Team Options]
Yea there's more than just Lilligant that appreciates sr support. You even mention Lilligant twice ._.

[OO]
You have to actually explain what these things do, even if its brief, and why they deserve a mention, or if they're outclassed by something else.

This still needs work, tag me back and I'll look at this again.

I'm gonna go ahead and drop this, I feel like there's a better person to write this than me rn

 

[Raseri]

ok moving