I don't really see how DPP should have the same amount of slots as ORAS... The playerbase was thin last year and it's not looking better when another old gen (GSC) competes for a similar playerbase (hi BKC). Why not just remove 1 DPP slot for XY where there is an established playerbase for a more developed meta?
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Multi Gen Ubers Premier League discussion thread[Read Post #87]
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2 oras
2 bw
1 dpp
1 farceus
1 adv
2 bw
1 dpp
1 farceus
1 adv
If you're both talking retains I'm guessing 6 teams is a definite?
Hack's points are excellent, are there really 24 old gen ubers players?(assuming 6 teams and 1 GSC / 1 ADV / 2 DPP whether or not farceus). I think a lot of people would want to see GSC, ADV was successful last year so the logical leap there is to drop a DPP slot and replace it with one of ORAS or XY(anything having more slots than ORAS is stupid as it's the main current meta.)
Hack's points are excellent, are there really 24 old gen ubers players?(assuming 6 teams and 1 GSC / 1 ADV / 2 DPP whether or not farceus). I think a lot of people would want to see GSC, ADV was successful last year so the logical leap there is to drop a DPP slot and replace it with one of ORAS or XY(anything having more slots than ORAS is stupid as it's the main current meta.)
so bw is given the same importance as oras, even though it's the current gen? same goes for dpp where last year there were only barely enough players for. where did the 3 oras slots, or at least 2 oras/ 1 xy slot go? there's not that much to be gained from including adv either; removing it and 1dpp would give us 3 oras / 1 xy / 2 bw / 1 dpp / 1 gsc. looks good imo
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idk how much the budget will be, but i kinda like to see 3 oras starters and 2 bw's :o
idk how much the budget will be, but i kinda like to see 3 oras starters and 2 bw's :o
3 oras + 1 xy is too much, either 3 oras and no xy or 2 oras + 1 xy if it were to change (preferably 2 oras + 1 xy) what i'd like to see is something like this:
2 oras
1 xy
2 bw
1 dpp
1 adv
1 gsc
(fireburn's list with -1 dpp & +1 xy)
personally i'm not a fan of gsc or adv but I respect that at least adv should really be included in upl and as long as xy is in then gsc is fine too
2 oras
1 xy
2 bw
1 dpp
1 adv
1 gsc
(fireburn's list with -1 dpp & +1 xy)
personally i'm not a fan of gsc or adv but I respect that at least adv should really be included in upl and as long as xy is in then gsc is fine too
Hmmm, fair points. In that case we'll do:
ORAS x 2
XY x 1
BW2 x 2
DPP x 1
ADV x 1
GSC x 1
We'll go with this unless there are any major/compelling disagreements. Does this sound good to everyone?
How are managers supposed to decide which GSC player to pick when we don't even know how competitive these players are in this old meta? Do we just pick up an old player with a join date of 2004/2005 and then pray that they are good in this old meta? I don't know, that sounds very uncompetitive if you ask me. This tournament should be about the Ubers playerbase and nobody in this playerbase even plays this old meta. Even if we were to pick this old meta up, very few people are going to spend the time understanding and getting good at it. Lets leave GSC where it belongs; in the past.
I agree with this, either no gsc or no adv. Because right now 2 very unexplored gens are just as important as the current gen which should be the focus. I can understand not going with 3 oras slots, but now it seems to pale in comparison to 'the rest'. 8 tiers is a lot anyway, it's gonna be quite hard getting people to play both adv and gsc, and have enough for the rest :/ either the people you would consider the 'top players' (the highest bids) are going to pick up those tiers, remember there are few people who play adv let alone gsc. Even if the slots could be filled with people famiar with the ou metas, I still think that the current tiers are too shifted away from oras. Not a bad thing to explore those tiers, not at all, but maybe drop one of them? From what I have seen gsc is actually pretty good, so maybe no adv and go with gsc? It's either get people who don't play ubers to play them (I don't know what you guys want exactly concerning this) or force, force as in force development and force people to play, too much I feel. This would be way less of an issue with just one of the tiers.
Oh and if I had to pick a tier to learn and play/play test in it would be gsv because gsc is a pretty cool gen and gsc uu is based as shit.
but how do you balance 8 slots? i personally believe there shouldn't be both xy and gsc, two completely obsolete metas (i mean, as fun as they are, the playerbase is almost as shallow as their relevance), but can't think of a viable alternative that maintains 8 slots + ties. of course, we could go with 7...
Untrue. XY > GSC for sure.
XY playerbase = maybe 75% of the currently active Ubers community, myself included among many others.
GSC playerbase = a few people popping their heads in just for this one tournament that happened to be Ubers.
i, too, can pull out arbitrary statistics! for example, 90% of your posts in this thread have been a faux, watered down version of whitequeen.
xy, even putting aside whatever word you appropriate to their playerbase, is exactly like the BW1 argument you were so against. your "75% of oras players play xy" can easily be wiggled to "75% of bw2 players play bw1", but you choose to be selective and bark up one tree. they are both irrelevant metas, and they both objectively shouldn't be included in an "official tournament".
however, I do want 8 slots > 7 slots. so i believe including both gsc and xy is a necessary evil. just throwing out the possibility of removing the more-so counter intuitive one, and possibly upping the quality of the player pool getting into UPL at large.
we play this game to enjoy it, people would enjoy playing both XY and GSC in this setting, if there's enough people who are competent at the tier and would enjoy playing it then why shouldn't it be included? This is a tournament for the community last time I checked, why are the arguments made being based on some form of protocol, it's a game lol. It's "irrelevant" cos it won't ever or wasn't ever in an official tour, who cares?
And wouldn't it just be... fun to learn gsc because it's something new? I'm not suggesting getting rid of xy, but since gsc is still 1. unexplored and 2. to the extent it is, it's not yet by that many people. Xy is also a pretty stale meta imo but that's just me. I'd say we shouldn't be too hesitant with trying out something new
90% whitequeen knockoff posts part of krau's post made me chuckle, heh
90% whitequeen knockoff posts part of krau's post made me chuckle, heh
it's also an official tournament, and quality of matches should be maintained - i'm not confident we can scrounge up a playerbase that will put out all quality matches in oras, xy, adv AND gsc together.
Yeah this ties into what I said earlier well; the current selection is just way too ambitious. What's wrong with 2/1/1bw/1dpp/1gsc? If 2 bw slots is really desirable then I guess we can also play without ties which I think would be bad because the scores will diverge more quickly this way. Maybe TD decides this but if we do choose an odd number of tiers the points should be 0/2, else 0/1/3 which is more like SPL and pretty much all competitions ever are done this way. So uhh yeah odd numbered tiers would be dumb. Oh shit now I actually understand why fireburn put both adv and gsc; I thought he'd gone mad before. Heh. 1 bw+gsc sounds better than 2bw+adv+gsc regardless. Really where is this magical source of players? 8 looked good to me, but not like this, and since this already is the best option (3 oras is lame I've realised) just go with 6 pls. Or 7, but 7 is dumb because 0/2 scores are dumb. Yeah those are actually really stupid because it's like really likely either 3 teams tie or 2x2 teams tie or 1x2 teams tie (not this is not mathematically evidenced, but that should work out idk maybe if minority suspect reads this and knows about this we could get some info)
Number of slots should be even, number of teams will be even. Posts saying ADV is unexplored, hard to fill the spots, or that it should be dropped for another slot are laughable. For those worried that the current gen only gets two slots with the eight slot lineup, if signup turnout is good you make it ten slots and get more representation for newer gens.
I think RBY Ubers would be good to add for next year. marcoasd, me and Ortheore will definitely play it (and to a high standard) and we had 1 mini tournament on my forums and a 64 man tournament (where Real FV13, Rain. and Tricking got into semis/finals) on Smogon forums. This year, they'll be another tournament on Smogon forums. Also, During Summer took an interest to it with a Throwback Thursday article.
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