VGC RMT VGC 2016

Hello, my team is not the best as of now (it has improved a lot since my last post) but I'm hoping that some of you guys will be able to help me make it better (Like Draconid997 and Bright Size), my team consists of these mons:


Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb

Ability: Desolate Land

Level: 50

EVs: 236 HP / 156 Atk / 12 Def / 100 SpD / 4 Spe

Careful Nature

- Precipice Blades

- Swords Dance

- Fire Punch

- Protect


Since you're allowed to bring two non mythical pokemon, I decided to bring Primal Groudon as my first non mythical pokemon, after setting up a swords dance if I choose to do so which I do a lot, Groudon can hit extremely hard, if used with Meowstic-M and its prankster Gravity, Groudon would be able to destroy and hit anyone extremely hard. Groudon is mainly used with Meowstic-M so that he can deal a great amount of damage to a lot of mons. Groudon is sometimes used with Mega-Salamence to take off some weaknesses and help each other out overall, groudon can take fairy moves and ice moves pretty well, while salamence can help groudon out by setting up a tailwind. Groudon is on my team to deal major damage and be a big threat to deal with.


Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb

Ability: Primordial Sea

Level: 50

EVs: 140 HP / 244 Def / 60 SpA / 60 SpD / 4 Spe

Bold Nature

IVs: 0 Atk

- Origin Pulse

- Ice Beam

- Thunder

- Protect


Since you're allowed to bring two non mythical pokemon, I decided to bring Primal Kyogre as my second non mythical pokemon. Primal Kyogre teamed with Raichu work really well as Raichu can take Electric type attacks and boost its Sp Attack, this also takes away one of kyogres weaknesses. Kyogre can hit extremely hard especially with Origin Pulse, his main STAB move (Unless you want to count water spout), ice beam is there to take care of any grass type pokemon as he is 2x weak to them (Icy Wind was another option for slowing opposing Salamence's but Ice beam OHKOs most if not all Salamence sets), thunder is there to deal some big damage to opposing primal Kyogre and in the rain has 100% accuracy. Kyogre is on the team to deal major damage and be a big threat to deal with.


Salamence-Mega @ Salamencite

Ability: Aerilate

Level: 50

EVs: 156 Atk / 100 SpA / 252 Spe

Naive Nature

- Double-Edge

- Hyper Voice

- Tailwind

- Protect


Salamence is used as my only mega, I decided to use Mega-Salamence as it was recommended to me by Draconid997 and because he helps out a lot on my team. Aerilate Double-Edge with a Helping Hand from a Meowstic-M makes it to where I am able to OHKO most non bulky Rayquazas. Hyper Voice can be used to hit multiple opponents and is used to hit physically defensive mons harder than Double-Edge without any drawbacks. Tailwind is used to double my Team's speed and when used with Groudon/Kyogre, can be very threatening. Mega-Salamence is overall a great pick for this team.


Weavile @ Focus Sash

Ability: Pressure

Level: 50

EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

Jolly Nature

- Icicle Crash

- Knock Off

- Fake Out

- Feint


Weavile is on my team to help out against opposing yveltal teams as well as fitting the role of Mega-Kangaskhan that I previously had on my team. Weavile with Fake Out is the second fastest user of Fake Out in the game, if I recall correctly. Weaville with Knock Off is amazing for its stab and its effect. Icicle crash is very strong, although it has poor accuracy, has a high flinch chance, and when used with a mon that will most likely out speed the opposing mon, is very good and helpful. Feint is there to hit through any protects or kill an opposing mon that is very weak that may have a priority move/or is faster. Weavile is very strong physical attacker and is a big threat on my team.


Meowstic @ Mental Herb

Ability: Prankster

Level: 50

EVs: 128 Def / 128 SpD / 252 Spe

Jolly Nature

- Thunder Wave

- Helping Hand

- Fake Out

- Gravity


Meowsit-M is on my team as a huge support pokemon. With Mental Herb, Meowstic is able to take a taunt and still use a Status move which is very crucial. Thunder Wave is used to cripple big threats by slowing them down and causing a chance to get fully paralyzed. Helping Hand helps boost my mons attacks and make them deal more damage. Fake Out on Meowstic is amazing because Meowstic is pretty fast. Gravity is used to make Groudon and Kyogre hit their moves 100% of the time (Origin Pulse and Precipice Blades). It also allows Groudon to hit mons with levitate and with the flying type. Meowstic is very crucial for the Primal Pokemon and helps my team out a lot overall.


Raichu @ Assault Vest

Ability: Lightning Rod

Level: 50

EVs: 28 HP / 4 Def / 220 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

Timid Nature

- Hidden Power Ice

- Volt Switch

- Fake Out

- Thunder


Raichu is on my team as a Kyogre switch in. Thunder is a very common move on Kyogre as it has 100% accuracy in the rain and it deals big damage to opposing Kyogre's. Raichu when switched in, not only takes the attack, but it boosts its own Special Attack. Raichu has Hidden Power Ice which hits ground type mons Super Effectively, which its weak to. Volt Switch allows Raichu to switch out on mons that threaten it and it also allows him to deal chip damage. Fake Out is a very OP attack overall as it has a 100% flinch chance, Thunder is on Raichu instead of Thunderbolt because Raichu is mainly used with my own Kyogre. Raichu is very crucial for Primal Kyogre to survive and is a well rounded pokemon.


I want your help with set recommendations/replacements for the mons I currently have, any and all help is appreciated.
 
hello there Milad, this looks like a standard dual primal team, with the basic components of groudon check / kyogre check / speed control / yveltal check. i like the look of this team, although it does come with a couple of flaws.

the only component this team is lacking is another way to control weather. switching in and out of primals is risky and forces you to go a linear path when choosing mons for your match. you have 2 options here, bronzong > meowstic, or cresselia > meowstic. bronzong is now a meta call and has two useful abilities that the opponent needs to scout for (although heatproof tends to be more popular). it is also another xerneas counter which isn't bad for any team, as well as a raayquaza counter which is a godsend to basically all groudon teams. it can also take the slower nature of your team to an advantage with trick room. cresselia can do the latter as well, while keeping other options of speed control in mind. cresselia is more passive mind you, but it has access to icy wind and thunder wave as well, so it isn't stuck to using trick room unlike bronzong. both of these are viable options, it's really what you prefer.

i feel as if av raichu should pretty much always be running endeavor. you've probably seen the success of this from Wolfe and other players at wolrds just a few days ago, and endeavor is able to chip down kyogre, groudon, and other bulky restricted mons for mence to clean up. nuzzle > thunder would be nice too to provide an extra form of speed control. running max hp lets you take origin pulses better than before and the loss of special attack isn't that big of a deal when your main attacking move is to pivot you in and out of the field.

that's about it. solid team man :)

Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
Level: 50
EVs: 236 HP / 156 Atk / 12 Def / 100 SpD / 4 Spe
Careful Nature
- Precipice Blades
- Swords Dance
- Fire Punch
- Protect

Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb
Ability: Primordial Sea
Level: 50
EVs: 140 HP / 244 Def / 60 SpA / 60 SpD / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
- Protect
Salamence-Mega @ Salamencite
Ability: Aerilate
Level: 50
EVs: 156 Atk / 100 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Double-Edge
- Hyper Voice
- Tailwind
- Protect

Weavile @ Focus Sash
Ability: Pressure
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Knock Off
- Fake Out
- Feint

Bronzong @ Mental Herb
Ability: Heatproof
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 212 Atk / 44 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Protect
- Skill Swap
- Trick Room

or

Cresselia @ Mental Herb
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 60 Def / 196 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 8 Spe (underspeeds primals by one point)
- Ice Beam
- Trick Room
- Skill Swap
- Helping Hand

Raichu @ Assault Vest
Ability: Lightning Rod
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Endeavor
- Volt Switch
- Fake Out
- Nuzzle
 
Ok, it looks like you're off to a decent start on the dual primal core. One of the biggest issues that stood out to me is that a lot of the EV spreads are bizarre, pointless, or inefficient. Meowstic is cool and all, but I think you'll be able to use Bronzong on the team to more success than Meowstic. I'll get into that in a bit.

So let's begin.


Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
Level: 50
EVs: 60 HP / 188 Atk / 4 Def / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

- Precipice Blades
- Swords Dance
- Fire Punch
- Protect​

So your move set here is fine; I don't have any issues with it. I've brought this move set to events myself. Your EV spread though seems kinda bizarre and random, so I've changed it. Having max speed on Groudon is pretty important. A lot of other Groudon also run max Speed in order to get their Precipice Blades off as soon as possible, and that's what you're doing here. If you lose a speed tie you'll also get the information that the Groudon is fast and therefore not likely to be very bulky. To win these match ups more often, you need to rely on speed control (which you have). The EVs I used here are some I got from a friend of mine who qualified for Day 2 of the Worlds Tournament in the Senior Division; it makes Hyper Voice from opposing Mega Salamence a guaranteed 3HKO with the rest of the EVs being dumped into Attack for damage.

252 SpA Aerilate Mega Salamence Hyper Voice vs. 60 HP / 4 SpD Primal Groudon: 76-91 (41.5 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO


Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb
Ability: Primordial Sea
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Def / 156 SpA
Relaxed
Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
- Protect​

Again, your moveset is perfectly fine and doesn't need to be changed. However, your EVs once again do need to be worked on. I'm not too sure what these EVs do, but it's pretty important that you get a Speed that matters. Often when I work on EVs for my Pokemon, Speed is the first thing I look to getting exactly where I want it to be. I will get more into the details of Bronzong later on, but the EV spread is made to function under Trick Room (which is on the Bronzong that I will be talking about soon). It allows you to take 3 Precipice Blades from a Jolly max Attack Primal Groudon without Intimidate. The rest of the EVs are put into SpA.

252 Atk Primal Groudon Precipice Blades vs. 252 HP / 100+ Def Primal Kyogre: 87-103 (42 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO


Salamence-Mega @ Salamencite
Ability: Aerilate
Level: 50
EVs: 20 Atk / 236 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Double-Edge
- Hyper Voice
- Tailwind
- Protect​

Again, small change to the EVs. Double-Edge is already pretty powerful on its own, so investing more into Special Attack to make Hyper Voice strong is ideal. The Attack EVs allow you to 1HKO even the bulkiest of Amoonguss.

20 Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Amoonguss: 222-264 (100.4 - 119.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
I don't really have anything to say about Weavile, it seems good. Really useful against opposing dual primal teams because they often pair up with Pokemon that are weak to its attacks (Mega Salamence, Bronzong, Thundurus, Cresselia)

Instead of Meowstic I think you'd be better off with Bronzong/Cresselia like GradeAGarchomp mentioned. I would choose Bronzong for its Xerneas match up.


Bronzong @ Lum Berry
Ability: Heatproof
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 140 Def / 116 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Trick Room
- Gravity
- Hypnosis

This move set gives you the option of Trick Room on the team to help counteract some opponent's speed control methods that lower your Speed. It also is meant to have nice synergy with Primal Kyogre. You still have Gravity similar to Meowstic, but now you can also abuse it with the same Pokemon in Hypnosis. Bronzong's also amazing in that it threatens Xerneas really hard; it does loads of damage to Xerneas that have used Geomancy. I took Heatproof > Levitate because you'll be losing your immunity to Ground anyway when you use Gravity. The Lum Berry allows you to set up easier. Usually a good lead into Big 6 variants. EVs may need some work, it's just some really bulky version I found. I don't think you'll need any Attack investment, though.


Raichu @ Assault Vest
Ability: Lightning Rod
Level: 50
EVs: 36 HP / 204 Def / 20 SpA / 68 SpD / 180 Spe
Timid Nature
- Endeavor/Feint
- Volt Switch
- Fake Out
- Nuzzle

or

Raichu @ Life Orb/Zap Plate
Ability: Lightning Rod
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Volt Switch
- Fake Out
- Thunder​

Nuzzle provides more Speed control to the team. Paralysis is good for you, unless you're under Trick Room. Generally I don't think you'll be bringing Bronzong and Raichu to the same match. One of the reasons Wolfe Glick (Champion)/Marcus Statder (Top 4)/Baris Ackos (Top 8)/Brendan Zheng (Top 8, Seniors)'s Assault Vest Raichu did so well at Worlds this year is because it was insanely bulky and that it was able to still dish out damage with Endeavor (received from an event; I tabbed Feint as another option in case you don't have it but it really should be Endeavor like GradeAGarchomp said). Thunder may seem nice, but without much investment it isn't going to be doing spectacular damage or anything. If you want to go with a high offense Raichu, go with Life Orb or Zap Plate for the damage it brings. Decent substitution if you don't have access to the Endeavor Raichu. I would definitely recommend the first Raichu to the second Raichu.

Edit:
Changed the 30 Atk IV on Raichu to 0, that's what it should be (to minimize damage from Swagger). My bad. Also tabbed Brendan Zheng on the reference to the Raichu; he also used the team the other three used but in the Seniors Division (where he got Top 8).

Edit #2: I changed the Raichu's EV spreads on the first set to match the EVs that Wolfe Glick recently revealed in his Worlds Team Report. The Speed hits 168, which outspeeds Mega Kangaskhan. Here's the link to check out his report.

 
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hello there Milad, this looks like a standard dual primal team, with the basic components of groudon check / kyogre check / speed control / yveltal check. i like the look of this team, although it does come with a couple of flaws.

the only component this team is lacking is another way to control weather. switching in and out of primals is risky and forces you to go a linear path when choosing mons for your match. you have 2 options here, bronzong > meowstic, or cresselia > meowstic. bronzong is now a meta call and has two useful abilities that the opponent needs to scout for (although heatproof tends to be more popular). it is also another xerneas counter which isn't bad for any team, as well as a raayquaza counter which is a godsend to basically all groudon teams. it can also take the slower nature of your team to an advantage with trick room. cresselia can do the latter as well, while keeping other options of speed control in mind. cresselia is more passive mind you, but it has access to icy wind and thunder wave as well, so it isn't stuck to using trick room unlike bronzong. both of these are viable options, it's really what you prefer.

i feel as if av raichu should pretty much always be running endeavor. you've probably seen the success of this from Wolfe and other players at wolrds just a few days ago, and endeavor is able to chip down kyogre, groudon, and other bulky restricted mons for mence to clean up. nuzzle > thunder would be nice too to provide an extra form of speed control. running max hp lets you take origin pulses better than before and the loss of special attack isn't that big of a deal when your main attacking move is to pivot you in and out of the field.

that's about it. solid team man :)

Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
Level: 50
EVs: 236 HP / 156 Atk / 12 Def / 100 SpD / 4 Spe
Careful Nature
- Precipice Blades
- Swords Dance
- Fire Punch
- Protect

Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb
Ability: Primordial Sea
Level: 50
EVs: 140 HP / 244 Def / 60 SpA / 60 SpD / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
- Protect
Salamence-Mega @ Salamencite
Ability: Aerilate
Level: 50
EVs: 156 Atk / 100 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Double-Edge
- Hyper Voice
- Tailwind
- Protect

Weavile @ Focus Sash
Ability: Pressure
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Knock Off
- Fake Out
- Feint

Bronzong @ Mental Herb
Ability: Heatproof
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 212 Atk / 44 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Protect
- Skill Swap
- Trick Room

or

Cresselia @ Mental Herb
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 60 Def / 196 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 8 Spe (underspeeds primals by one point)
- Ice Beam
- Trick Room
- Skill Swap
- Helping Hand

Raichu @ Assault Vest
Ability: Lightning Rod
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Endeavor
- Volt Switch
- Fake Out
- Nuzzle
Thanks for the response, deinitely making the switch over to Bronzong and changing the Raichu set. :)
 
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Ok, it looks like you're off to a decent start on the dual primal core. One of the biggest issues that stood out to me is that a lot of the EV spreads are bizarre, pointless, or inefficient. Meowstic is cool and all, but I think you'll be able to use Bronzong on the team to more success than Meowstic. I'll get into that in a bit.

So let's begin.


Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
Level: 50
EVs: 60 HP / 188 Atk / 4 Def / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

- Precipice Blades
- Swords Dance
- Fire Punch
- Protect​

So your move set here is fine; I don't have any issues with it. I've brought this move set to events myself. Your EV spread though seems kinda bizarre and random, so I've changed it. Having max speed on Groudon is pretty important. A lot of other Groudon also run max Speed in order to get their Precipice Blades off as soon as possible, and that's what you're doing here. If you lose a speed tie you'll also get the information that the Groudon is fast and therefore not likely to be very bulky. To win these match ups more often, you need to rely on speed control (which you have). The EVs I used here are some I got from a friend of mine who qualified for Day 2 of the Worlds Tournament in the Senior Division; it makes Hyper Voice from opposing Mega Salamence a guaranteed 3HKO with the rest of the EVs being dumped into Attack for damage.

252 SpA Aerilate Mega Salamence Hyper Voice vs. 60 HP / 4 SpD Primal Groudon: 76-91 (41.5 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO


Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb
Ability: Primordial Sea
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Def / 156 SpA
Relaxed
Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
- Protect​

Again, your moveset is perfectly fine and doesn't need to be changed. However, your EVs once again do need to be worked on. I'm not too sure what these EVs do, but it's pretty important that you get a Speed that matters. Often when I work on EVs for my Pokemon, Speed is the first thing I look to getting exactly where I want it to be. I will get more into the details of Bronzong later on, but the EV spread is made to function under Trick Room (which is on the Bronzong that I will be talking about soon). It allows you to take 3 Precipice Blades from a Jolly max Attack Primal Groudon without Intimidate. The rest of the EVs are put into SpA.

252 Atk Primal Groudon Precipice Blades vs. 252 HP / 100+ Def Primal Kyogre: 87-103 (42 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO


Salamence-Mega @ Salamencite
Ability: Aerilate
Level: 50
EVs: 20 Atk / 236 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Double-Edge
- Hyper Voice
- Tailwind
- Protect​

Again, small change to the EVs. Double-Edge is already pretty powerful on its own, so investing more into Special Attack to make Hyper Voice strong is ideal. The Attack EVs allow you to 1HKO even the bulkiest of Amoonguss.

20 Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Amoonguss: 222-264 (100.4 - 119.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
I don't really have anything to say about Weavile, it seems good. Really useful against opposing dual primal teams because they often pair up with Pokemon that are weak to its attacks (Mega Salamence, Bronzong, Thundurus, Cresselia)

Instead of Meowstic I think you'd be better off with Bronzong/Cresselia like GradeAGarchomp mentioned. I would choose Bronzong for its Xerneas match up.


Bronzong @ Lum Berry
Ability: Heatproof
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 140 Def / 116 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Trick Room
- Gravity
- Hypnosis

This move set gives you the option of Trick Room on the team to help counteract some opponent's speed control methods that lower your Speed. It also is meant to have nice synergy with Primal Kyogre. You still have Gravity similar to Meowstic, but now you can also abuse it with the same Pokemon in Hypnosis. Bronzong's also amazing in that it threatens Xerneas really hard; it does loads of damage to Xerneas that have used Geomancy. I took Heatproof > Levitate because you'll be losing your immunity to Ground anyway when you use Gravity. The Lum Berry allows you to set up easier. Usually a good lead into Big 6 variants. EVs may need some work, it's just some really bulky version I found. I don't think you'll need any Attack investment, though.


Raichu @ Assault Vest
Ability: Lightning Rod
Level: 50
EVs: 36 HP / 204 Def / 20 SpA / 68 SpD / 180 Spe
Timid Nature
- Endeavor/Feint
- Volt Switch
- Fake Out
- Nuzzle

or

Raichu @ Life Orb/Zap Plate
Ability: Lightning Rod
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Volt Switch
- Fake Out
- Thunder​

Nuzzle provides more Speed control to the team. Paralysis is good for you, unless you're under Trick Room. Generally I don't think you'll be bringing Bronzong and Raichu to the same match. One of the reasons Wolfe Glick (Champion)/Marcus Statder (Top 4)/Baris Ackos (Top 8)/Brendan Zheng (Top 8, Seniors)'s Assault Vest Raichu did so well at Worlds this year is because it was insanely bulky and that it was able to still dish out damage with Endeavor (received from an event; I tabbed Feint as another option in case you don't have it but it really should be Endeavor like GradeAGarchomp said). Thunder may seem nice, but without much investment it isn't going to be doing spectacular damage or anything. If you want to go with a high offense Raichu, go with Life Orb or Zap Plate for the damage it brings. Decent substitution if you don't have access to the Endeavor Raichu. I would definitely recommend the first Raichu to the second Raichu.

Edit:
Changed the 30 Atk IV on Raichu to 0, that's what it should be (to minimize damage from Swagger). My bad. Also tabbed Brendan Zheng on the reference to the Raichu; he also used the team the other three used but in the Seniors Division (where he got Top 8).

Edit #2: I changed the Raichu's EV spreads on the first set to match the EVs that Wolfe Glick recently revealed in his Worlds Team Report. The Speed hits 168, which outspeeds Mega Kangaskhan. Here's the link to check out his report.

Made all of these changes, thanks for the very detailed response and also for winning the Rate of the week (Congrats on that), I have one question, is there a mon that suits this team better than Raichu, the mon doesn't have to play his role. I just find that I end up rarely using raichu and when I do, I only use him with kyogre, I need a mon that could pair well with the double primal combo (And have more uses rather than just one).
 
Yeah I was feeling that Raichu felt very bizarre on this team, though I thought it could still work. I didn't really mind it so I just left it because it wasn't necessarily bad. I think Mega Kangaskhan would work pretty well in that slot instead to help with big 6 variants (and honestly it's just a good bread and butter pick that works on basically every team). So you'd probably end up leading something like Mega Kangaskhan/Bronzong into those teams with your primals in the back.

Kangaskhan-Mega @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Parental Bond
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 172 Atk / 76 Def / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Double-Edge/Return/Frustration
- Low Kick/Power-Up Punch
- Sucker Punch
- Fake Out
Fairly generic set. You could go for a PuP variant or a Low Kick variant, either would work. PuP is generally better if you're good at making reads so you know who to hit to get that boost. Return/Frustration is usually paired with PuP; Double-Edge with Low Kick though you can do PuP and Double-Edge together for a lot of damage. EVs allow you to survive opposing Mega Kangaskhan Low Kicks 98% of the time. It takes 40 more Def EVs to survive it 100% of the time, so I think having that small chance is acceptable (and besides there are also crits that could happen and mess this up anyway). You need max speed for the fast Fake Out onto other Pokemon. You may be able to go slower if you plan on primarily using this with Bronzong in Trick Room to underspeed other Mega Kangaskhan, though always losing speed ties may not be worth depending on how you feel about it. I would at least recommend you give it enough investment to outspeed Smeargle (so 188 Spe EVs Adamant achieves this goal). You'd probably invest the remaining EVs into Attack or more bulk.

252 Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Low Kick (100 BP) vs. 4 HP / 76 Def Mega Kangaskhan: 154-184 (85 - 101.6%) -- 2% chance to OHKO
 
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Yeah I was feeling that Raichu felt very bizarre on this team, though I thought it could still work. I didn't really mind it so I just left it because it wasn't necessarily bad. I think Mega Kangaskhan would work pretty well in that slot instead to help with big 6 variants (and honestly it's just a good bread and butter pick that works on basically every team). So you'd probably end up leading something like Mega Kangaskhan/Bronzong into those teams with your primals in the back.

Kangaskhan-Mega @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Parental Bond
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 172 Atk / 76 Def / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Double-Edge/Return/Frustration
- Low Kick/Power-Up Punch
- Sucker Punch
- Fake Out
Fairly generic set. You could go for a PuP variant or a Low Kick variant, either would work. PuP is generally better if you're good at making reads so you know who to hit to get that boost. Return/Frustration is usually paired with PuP; Double-Edge with Low Kick though you can do PuP and Double-Edge together for a lot of damage. EVs allow you to survive opposing Mega Kangaskhan Low Kicks 98% of the time. It takes 40 more Def EVs to survive it 100% of the time, so I think having that small chance is acceptable (and besides there are also crits that could happen and mess this up anyway). You need max speed for the fast Fake Out onto other Pokemon. You may be able to go slower if you plan on primarily using this with Bronzong in Trick Room to underspeed other Mega Kangaskhan, though always losing speed ties may not be worth depending on how you feel about it. I would at least recommend you give it enough investment to outspeed Smeargle (so 188 Spe EVs Adamant achieves this goal). You'd probably invest the remaining EVs into Attack or more bulk.

252 Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Low Kick (100 BP) vs. 4 HP / 76 Def Mega Kangaskhan: 154-184 (85 - 101.6%) -- 2% chance to OHKO
Hey, I made the switch over, an option of 2 megas is better. I have some potential switches that I might make but I first want your opinion.

Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
Level: 50
EVs: 60 HP / 188 Atk / 4 Def / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Precipice Blades
- Rock Tomb over Swords Dance
- Fire Punch
- Protect

Allows Groudon to hit Flying types super effective without having gravity up.

Kangaskhan-Mega @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Parental Bond
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 172 Atk / 76 Def / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Double-Edge
- Fake Out
- Power-Up Punch
- Sucker Punch

Over Raichu

Bronzong @ Lum Berry
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 140 Def / 116 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 SpA / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Safeguard over Hypnosis
- Skill Swap over Gravity
- Gyro Ball

Since Groudon is able to hit Flying types with Rock Tomb there isn't much need for Gravity. Skill Swap gives me some weather control without needing to switch and also gives whatever my target is Levitate, I would mainly use it on Groudon giving him an Immunity to Groudon type attacks which is helpful because of his weakness but it also resets Desolate Land in case there is a Primal-Kyogre on the enemy team out in battle. Safeguard is a potential switch, Safeguard is there to get rid of Dark Void Smeargle as long as I get it up, hypnosis could put smeargle to sleep but I feel as Safeguard is better as it lasts longer and doesn't have the chance of missing. Please tell me if you think its a better switch overall. I also have one more mon switch which I may make and its Eject Button Hitmontop over Weavile. Here is a set that I put together (Saw that Eject Button Hitmontop worked really well with Wolfe's Team so I adapted the mon but changed the set a little). Here's what I came up with so far.

Hitmontop @ Eject Button
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: (I'm not great with setting EVs so I need help with that)
IVs: 0 SpA / 0 Spe
- Fake Out
- Wide Guard
- Endeavour
- Feint

0 Speed allows Hitmontop to function well in Trick Room so that's another great perk (May not do that as it could not be beneficial if it's not in Trick Room especially with that Eject Button). Fake Out is a great attack overall and with Eject Button, allows him to get multiple off in matches. Wide Guard is there to deal with the Primals as they usually run moves like Origin Pulse, and Precipice Blades. Endeavour can be very helpful especially with Eject Button and Trick Room (It also is there since Raichu is gone). Feint is there to break through Protects and also to finish off mons that are very weak. I'm open to any help and all help is appreciated.
 
Rock Tomb on Primal Groudon is fine, and you certainly won't do bad with it, but I think Swords Dance is better here. Your concern was being able to hit Flying types when Gravity is up though I don't think that's a huge issue; a lot of members on the team can hit the most common Flying types super hard without super effective damage (both of the megas and both of the primals with their weather control). For this reason, you'd use Rock Slide/Stone Edge > Rock Tomb. You'd use Rock Tomb for Speed control since it lowers the opponent's speed by 1 stage. Though like I said, I think Swords Dance works better here. When it gets set up, you're in a position in which you can still deal plenty of damage to Flying types and then some.

The Bronzong set you're suggesting is actually the one I often use (and was the Worlds winning team variant along with many other teams). I like it a lot; it's a more defensive variant to really help against Smeargle with Safeguard and it's able to use Skill Swap to help maintain weather control as you've mentioned. You're perfectly fine running this new set even with Swords Dance on Primal Groudon for the reasons I mentioned above -- you're still able to hit Flying types well without Rock Tomb on the team. I originally suggested the Gravity variant of the Bronzong because it's still very much a viable choice and it was keeping in theme with what you originally had on Meowstic.


Hitmontop @ Eject Button
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 132 Atk / 76 Def / 44 SpD / 4 Spe
Adamant
Nature
- Feint
- Fake Out
- Close Combat
- Wide Guard​

I feel like Close Combat makes more sense here since it's still reliable damage that can hit a lot of threatening things like Mega Kangaskhan, Smeargle, and still chunk at Bronzong for a reasonable amount (Wolfe talks about this damage calc in his team report I believe) without have to worrying about being at low health. I get your reasoning with Endeavor under Trick Room, though the idea is flawed a little. Something to consider is that having Hitmontop under Trick Room means that you're also bringing Bronzong to the match which means that your other two Pokemon are presumably the two primals or one of the primals and a mega; I can't think of a scenario in which you'd want to do that (usually the primals/a mega/one of the supports). The EVs are straight up copied from Wolfe Glick's EV Spread for his Hitmontop since it now functions just like it; he has all of the reasons for the EVs in the video that I linked earlier in the thread.

Regarding the choice to switch to Hitmontop for Weavile, I think it can certainly work though I think it may make your match ups against Mega Salamence more diffcult to handle. Hitmontop is a much more defensive option to Weavile; which you want to use is probably up to how you want to play the team.
 
Rock Tomb on Primal Groudon is fine, and you certainly won't do bad with it, but I think Swords Dance is better here. Your concern was being able to hit Flying types when Gravity is up though I don't think that's a huge issue; a lot of members on the team can hit the most common Flying types super hard without super effective damage (both of the megas and both of the primals with their weather control). For this reason, you'd use Rock Slide/Stone Edge > Rock Tomb. You'd use Rock Tomb for Speed control since it lowers the opponent's speed by 1 stage. Though like I said, I think Swords Dance works better here. When it gets set up, you're in a position in which you can still deal plenty of damage to Flying types and then some.

The Bronzong set you're suggesting is actually the one I often use (and was the Worlds winning team variant along with many other teams). I like it a lot; it's a more defensive variant to really help against Smeargle with Safeguard and it's able to use Skill Swap to help maintain weather control as you've mentioned. You're perfectly fine running this new set even with Swords Dance on Primal Groudon for the reasons I mentioned above -- you're still able to hit Flying types well without Rock Tomb on the team. I originally suggested the Gravity variant of the Bronzong because it's still very much a viable choice and it was keeping in theme with what you originally had on Meowstic.


Hitmontop @ Eject Button
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 132 Atk / 76 Def / 44 SpD / 4 Spe
Adamant
Nature
- Feint
- Fake Out
- Close Combat
- Wide Guard​

I feel like Close Combat makes more sense here since it's still reliable damage that can hit a lot of threatening things like Mega Kangaskhan, Smeargle, and still chunk at Bronzong for a reasonable amount (Wolfe talks about this damage calc in his team report I believe) without have to worrying about being at low health. I get your reasoning with Endeavor under Trick Room, though the idea is flawed a little. Something to consider is that having Hitmontop under Trick Room means that you're also bringing Bronzong to the match which means that your other two Pokemon are presumably the two primals or one of the primals and a mega; I can't think of a scenario in which you'd want to do that (usually the primals/a mega/one of the supports). The EVs are straight up copied from Wolfe Glick's EV Spread for his Hitmontop since it now functions just like it; he has all of the reasons for the EVs in the video that I linked earlier in the thread.

Regarding the choice to switch to Hitmontop for Weavile, I think it can certainly work though I think it may make your match ups against Mega Salamence more diffcult to handle. Hitmontop is a much more defensive option to Weavile; which you want to use is probably up to how you want to play the team.

Ok I made the switch, I think I have one last question, do you think I should run a trick room Groudon as well? If I decide not to bring bronzong I can Tailwind on Salamence and Groudon will still be able to outspeed a max speed opposing groudon. Do you think it's worth it or not?
 
I prefer max speed Primal Groudon though I guess it's up to you. If you end up using it with Bronzong under Trick Room in a majority of your games, then go for it. What concerns me is that having both Primals at minimum speed means that in scenarios where you bring those two but not Bronzong you can be put in an awkward situation where you almost need to set up Tailwind in order to go first, and even then the opponent can set up their own Tailwind to counteract yours.
 
I prefer max speed Primal Groudon though I guess it's up to you. If you end up using it with Bronzong under Trick Room in a majority of your games, then go for it. What concerns me is that having both Primals at minimum speed means that in scenarios where you bring those two but not Bronzong you can be put in an awkward situation where you almost need to set up Tailwind in order to go first, and even then the opponent can set up their own Tailwind to counteract yours.

True, I'll just stick with the team I have now, thanks for your input.
 

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