NOC Matrix 12 NOC - Game Over, Mafia Wins

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on the subject this is the other thing that gives me Great Pause about voting leet

two of my stronger/actual scumreads have been pushing him pretty hard, blazade since d1. again hawkie also has and is a strong tr but thats not As relevant imo

another person who has pushed but has some interesting interactions is texas and them scum together strikes me as weird?

im pretty anti-bus and against sacrificing my teammates which more comes into play as mafia in ocs so maybe i just struggle to understand the mindset of a scum deciding to push/wagon their own teammate on d1 and then sticking on it? but i have a difficult time reconciling any combo of blazade/id/texas (and pcake + texas + leet is an insane team to me) WITH LEET as scum. id actually find it easier to believe josh or asek are leet partners.

idk i just find that hitmonleet doesnt have enough resistance. there are a lot of people in favor of him. and we know the mafia are all too willing to let town v town wagons build up. haruno/king/ullar all town wagons then leet who is pretty easy pickings is another one??

like if you look at the d2 wagon josh by far looks like the most likely leet-savior partner in that he switches back and forth/unvotes several times before landing on king but i dont totally buy this? who on the king wagon yday WOULD be saving hitmonleet by being on king? leet got a lot of the same voters who put votes on him d1.

it feels Off to me hes the designated bus by his team this early. i mean i guess d3 isnt so early but the dude has amassed Quantities of votes all 3 days. yes he keeps living but theres also a sizable contingent who want him dead.
 
i assumed you were signalling him or haruno as afaik you play on ms together but harunos reaction read to me that it was josh or haruno was being oblivious to it

i still stand by that was a weird thing to do but it lead me to have a stronger tr on you as josh was tring you in the beginning
lol doing weird gambitty things is like my strongest town tell, scumtexas plays much safer

i figured either i signal to josh and we set up a starter town bloc to run the game through or i've created an ironclad way to scum read him in the late game, its the kind of advantage you only get to use once
 
okay bored of this gimmick now

magical info

are ya ready

that entire yeti tunnel was a long ass rxn test because this game confused me and i was bored

xD

Dx
  • empoof, you said during my gambit that you have a lot of the same thoughts as yeti. want to point out what specifically? what about yeti this game pings you as scum? my read on you was genuine, shubaka gets 11 scum points but you get 14 town points for a total net gain of 3 town points. youre on the line, keep it up dawg. also, see ironicdouble info for a bit more on shubaka

Her reads were more or less in line with how I was seeing the game around the time of me posting that. I can go snag posts later that resonated but sifting through yeti posts sounds horrible right now. I mostly still have yeti as town it's just that when she kept posting she had these far off thoughts ("unless the team is exactly x/x/x", "This is thin WIFOM but", etc) they felt either ridiculous or slightly hedgey, to the point that maybe they're made up. Also I didn't like her bringing up hawkie as an undisclosed questionmark which happened a couple times when the dude felt really cut and dry town to me. It got to the point where even right now I'm still considering going back and reading hawkie's jalmont interactions to see if I was wrong about the way it happened but I know I'm right. So I pushed on her a bit but I don't know what I got from pushing her tbh

also Hawkie sorry if I've misgendered you this game, what do you go by?
i assumed you were signalling him or haruno as afaik you play on ms together but harunos reaction read to me that it was josh or haruno was being oblivious to it

i still stand by that was a weird thing to do but it lead me to have a stronger tr on you as josh was tring you in the beginning

smh you two making me go back to read texas' first post of the game
 
i guess it might make sense that former hope doesn't bus leet, ironic double subs in and then is told by the scumteam to start bussing leet on d2 and cooperates. this would explain why fh didnt rly touch leet and his sub has been parked on him.
 
on the subject this is the other thing that gives me Great Pause about voting leet

two of my stronger/actual scumreads have been pushing him pretty hard, blazade since d1. again hawkie also has and is a strong tr but thats not As relevant imo

another person who has pushed but has some interesting interactions is texas and them scum together strikes me as weird?

im pretty anti-bus and against sacrificing my teammates which more comes into play as mafia in ocs so maybe i just struggle to understand the mindset of a scum deciding to push/wagon their own teammate on d1 and then sticking on it? but i have a difficult time reconciling any combo of blazade/id/texas (and pcake + texas + leet is an insane team to me) WITH LEET as scum. id actually find it easier to believe josh or asek are leet partners.

idk i just find that hitmonleet doesnt have enough resistance. there are a lot of people in favor of him. and we know the mafia are all too willing to let town v town wagons build up. haruno/king/ullar all town wagons then leet who is pretty easy pickings is another one??

like if you look at the d2 wagon josh by far looks like the most likely leet-savior partner in that he switches back and forth/unvotes several times before landing on king but i dont totally buy this? who on the king wagon yday WOULD be saving hitmonleet by being on king? leet got a lot of the same voters who put votes on him d1.

it feels Off to me hes the designated bus by his team this early. i mean i guess d3 isnt so early but the dude has amassed Quantities of votes all 3 days. yes he keeps living but theres also a sizable contingent who want him dead.
you have to think that at a certain point ppl have to manage for themselves, scum can't defend a partner that won't defend themselves without outing themselves out to people
 
i guess it might make sense that former hope doesn't bus leet, ironic double subs in and then is told by the scumteam to start bussing leet on d2 and cooperates. this would explain why fh didnt rly touch leet and his sub has been parked on him.
i feel quite strongly this is not the case
 
I townread you in frog game and you were scum. you have a different meta on ms, I do too (mostly I don't lie as much because so many ppl there love triggerfingering LaL). I definitely don't know you're town here.
 
empoof i always do that tho whether to get my own thoughts out in the thread or to see if someone else connects with an off-chance idea and where they take it. if someone is suddenly like YES THAT SCUMTEAM MAKES TOTAL SENSE thats an Interesting response to consider. also my own paranoia about what if this narrow odds thing is happening and then postgame when we lose to it i can be like see!! it occurred to me!! for my own vanity

i think you just straight misunderstood whenever i brought hawkie up which was usually in the context of other people/votes rather than "lets look at hawkie's alignment" cause ive had hawkie as a townread p consistently. i think a couple early posts made me ? but thats true of everyone itg kek
 
Votecount
Hitmonleet (3): Pancake, Ironic Double, Josh
Empoof (2): Fort Colorcastle, KnightsofCydonia
Blazade (2): Moodycloud, Texas Cloverleaf
Ironic Double (2): Asek, Yeti
KnightsofCydonia (1): Empoof
Texas Cloverleaf (1): Hitmonleet

Not Voting (2): Hawkie, Blazade
 
I townread you in frog game and you were scum. you have a different meta on ms, I do too (mostly I don't lie as much because so many ppl there love triggerfingering LaL). I definitely don't know you're town here.
which is annoying because i set this thing up explicitly to be able to out you as scum but i still hard town read you :/
 
you have to think that at a certain point ppl have to manage for themselves, scum can't defend a partner that won't defend themselves without outing themselves out to people
no kidding, thats what made josh's claims X was king's partner for defending him so outlandish. there are certain slots itg you just dont bother defending as their partner.

what im saying is, hitmonleet amassed a fair few followers on d1.

that seems too early to me that his team would give him up for lost unless it was someone salty about his play in popcorn who figured he wouldnt get better.. maybe? blazade?

his team wouldnt be pushing him to respond better, or at all, in their team pm. just leaving him as a bus.

king DID get resistance and people defending him as a mislynch or noobtown. hitmonleet kind of has nobody who townreads him, at best he's a nullread or not someone's focus today. that just feels like a lot of people who are fine with him, and HAVE BEEN for longer than i'd expect.

jalmont dying n1 would make me a lot less confident as mafia to hard bus one of my 2 remaining teammates. esp if the ppl voting him d1 were all town, you wouldn't gain a ton of towncred for hopping onto the wagon of a scum that like 5 other people had already posited/pushed. it'd be easy cred to some degree, sure, but im not sure itd be worth encouraging losing leet over.
 
empoof i always do that tho whether to get my own thoughts out in the thread or to see if someone else connects with an off-chance idea and where they take it. if someone is suddenly like YES THAT SCUMTEAM MAKES TOTAL SENSE thats an Interesting response to consider. also my own paranoia about what if this narrow odds thing is happening and then postgame when we lose to it i can be like see!! it occurred to me!! for my own vanity

i think you just straight misunderstood whenever i brought hawkie up which was usually in the context of other people/votes rather than "lets look at hawkie's alignment" cause ive had hawkie as a townread p consistently. i think a couple early posts made me ? but thats true of everyone itg kek

It was around middle ground posts, after you had caught up. There was just a number of times where you had hawkie in either a null/figure out category or had a lot of colors for people and they were black that it left me confused. Like I'm fairly confident that was the case and I'm not misrepping you. I honestly don't remember what your town game looks like so that might be the case that you throw out left field ideas often, but that's how I feel about them :P

Again I'm still town reading you and I'm pretty sure we still have roughly the same reads, it's just I'm probably going to actually read all of your posts again this game to double check and I just don't want to do that yet
 
the mafia sit back and let haruno/king/ullar/hitmonleet all get easy mislynches (rip the ullar mislynch dream for them tho) without being particularly active behind any of them. once town start getting onto the wrong track you get stuff like jalmont onto haruno who can say "walrein started it!!"

maybe im wrong and the half+ of stuff around leet that says THIS DUDE IS MAFIA is right.

im just very wary that every other wagon so far has been town and this is yet another. ullar stopped gaining much traction once i subbed in (lets be real there was no Big Push despite some ppls' efforts) bc im a much harder target to get mislynched. the other 3 are all Easy.
 
what if hitmonleet got hit by the roleblocker when he tried to shoot and the mafia know he's outed?
you mean jailkeeper?

does the jked target know they were hit by jk? like would a vt who was jked know they were jked (as protection) and would town vig or mafia kill who were hooked by the jk know they were hooked by it?

i dont rly know how this role works in nocs im not sure ive ever played with it? if it was in dbz it died super early
 
the mafia sit back and let haruno/king/ullar/hitmonleet all get easy mislynches (rip the ullar mislynch dream for them tho) without being particularly active behind any of them. once town start getting onto the wrong track you get stuff like jalmont onto haruno who can say "walrein started it!!"

maybe im wrong and the half+ of stuff around leet that says THIS DUDE IS MAFIA is right.

im just very wary that every other wagon so far has been town and this is yet another. ullar stopped gaining much traction once i subbed in (lets be real there was no Big Push despite some ppls' efforts) bc im a much harder target to get mislynched. the other 3 are all Easy.
i don't buy this argument though, hitmonleet isn't some Bad Player like king and haruno are, he's played mafia before and he's acquitted himself well. in every previous game he's been a part of he's been an active poster, he's responded to pressure, and so on and so on. iirc the only scum game was deathnote(?) or resistance but even there he just acted noobtown. he's not the kind of player to let himself get mislynched as town, in my estimation
 
you mean jailkeeper?

does the jked target know they were hit by jk? like would a vt who was jked know they were jked (as protection) and would town vig or mafia kill who were hooked by the jk know they were hooked by it?

i dont rly know how this role works in nocs im not sure ive ever played with it? if it was in dbz it died super early
hes saying leet was jkd and the jk would have a partial guilty because of it
 
you mean jailkeeper?

does the jked target know they were hit by jk? like would a vt who was jked know they were jked (as protection) and would town vig or mafia kill who were hooked by the jk know they were hooked by it?

i dont rly know how this role works in nocs im not sure ive ever played with it? if it was in dbz it died super early
jailkeeper yeah

afaik mechanics can be kinda variable? i've seen some mechs where the jk can talk to the person they target anonymously but unless its in the rules idk if the person would know

but, if leet were the mafia shooter he would know he was jk'd when the kill failed
 
you mean jailkeeper?

does the jked target know they were hit by jk? like would a vt who was jked know they were jked (as protection) and would town vig or mafia kill who were hooked by the jk know they were hooked by it?

i dont rly know how this role works in nocs im not sure ive ever played with it? if it was in dbz it died super early

vts don't know they were hooked/jailed. Town vig wouldn't know whether it was BPV or their target was JKd or they were JKd. Mafia kill don't know if they were JKd, target was JKd, or if they hit BPV.

Sometimes it works differently but that's my understanding of it this game.

Also the "open a night chat" variant of jailkeeper is called jailor which isn't how usual JKs work.
 
vts don't know they were hooked/jailed. Town vig wouldn't know whether it was BPV or their target was JKd or they were JKd. Mafia kill don't know if they were JKd, target was JKd, or if they hit BPV.

Sometimes it works differently but that's my understanding of it this game.

Also the "open a night chat" variant of jailkeeper is called jailor which isn't how usual JKs work.
okay this possibility i hadnt considered
 
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