NOC Animal Mafia ~Game Over~

[Former]

I didn't no, otherwise I would have played differently obviously

 

[JALMONT]

why did you just say that then

 

[JALMONT]

Prophylaxis why did you allow moody to be lynched when as of 2110 you put him as town? that doesn't seem very consistent

 

[Prophylaxis]

What do you mean by letting Moody be lynched, he was NK’d

He’s been a universal townread for me all game

 

[JALMONT]

Sorry I meant Earlio

 

[Prophylaxis]

I was wavering on him being town because he wasn’t solving/present, iirc?

FH did the “If proph does trick you guys into this mislynch, my final request is to lynch proph tomorrow” and that made me get cold feet so I unvoted. I spent most of that night panicking but then I voted FH because I felt that he should not have been alive in lylo

 

[Prophylaxis]

i also expected earlio to show up and self pres but alas

 

[JALMONT]

nothing
fh/moody/3pk town : aubisio/leet for scum - good analysis too
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
poe stuff
nothing
aubisio stuff should be dismissed
nothing
activity prod ealrio
back to aubisio stuff before death
nothing
question leet
question
leet might be town
jalmont not mafia
nothing
fk ton of questions to get full claim picture
same as above
earlio/leet/3pk mafia pool, ignoring 3pk's behavior tho
earlio prob town + evidence
something aboutk nights
evid earlio town
same as above
earlio/leet/fh scum pool
now epik/fh town??
epik clear
leet last scum
same as above
same as above
worlds where leet might be town?
dealing with leet paranoia
role question stuff
question leet
durza irrelevant stuff
nothing
leet/fh/earlio as 3 mafia
nothing
nothing
gamestate is screwy
nothing
nothing
gamestate is leet is town????
obvious statement about needing to reread if leet is town
more fullclaim stuff
nothing
nothing
explanation for wanting all haruno info
leet/fh as last scum
nothing
iso earlio, is town
mechanics, earlio + jalmont = town
votes fh
nothing
extension request
nothing
nothing
stuff about leet (which i happen to agree with it re: the paranoia)
leet is expanding to poe (true)
interacting with leet
leet has to eventually die
response to FH
nothing
some self meta junk that looks bad
nothing
nothing
nothing
FH iso, doesn't know
inconclusive on FH
nothing
lock 5 town people instead of finding mafia lynch
some obvious f4 no lynch stuff
proph/moody/haruno/earlio as town
leet/fh/epik as poe mafia
nothing
setup speculation
nothing
nothing
nothing
FH is the last scum
some stuff about scum needing leet lynch turns to FH
nothing
argument with FH
ending "bickering" with FH
looks to moody for input
question response
discussion with fH
questioning fh
some stuff about texas
will look at epk but thinks hes town
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
fh conjecture
setup stuff
paranoia
setup spec/nothing
nothing
past proph noc games
earlio question
"if FH is town then who is realistically scum"
rethink jalmont
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
earlio epik town, jalmont/FH the scum
mechanics stuff
vote total stuff
nothing/the above
question moody
FH flip want
thinks jalmont is town
votes FH
nothing
3pk town, relook at FH
fh analysis, good stuff
fh argument
more fh argument
lets vote fh
fh argument
opening fh vote to everyone
unvotes fh
nothing
wants one more reread? extension request?
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing/fh's play in ocnoc
more fh analysis
nothing
vote FH
then unvotes?
nothing
earlio jalmont coasting
deadline stuff
nothing
back to vote FH
wants FH town?
question
unvote again
nothing
nothing
nothing
hedging
some general observations about the game
hedging
paranoia
nothing
jalmont paranoia
fh/earlio/jalmont coin flipping
jalmont/fh/earlio as the three scum
question response
FH/jalmont/3pk????????????????? lol.
votes fh
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
some stuff about earlio's flip
question response
talking about earlio play (bad)
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
nothing
3pk questions
questions...
3pk iso, "willing to lose game if he's mafia"
no lynch, but FH is scum
nothing, quick line about "oops i hammered" which is not a great look imo
nothing
fh question/action stuff
nothing
uhh something about a slip that im p confident is irrelevant

Yeah so I mean proph starts out really strong. I think he's reads are all on-point and his analysis (When he actually does it lol) is really good. It's much better than FH in any case. The issues I have are 1. the amount of nothing posts he has. He fluffs so much especially when it comes to making posts like "will do this in x amount of time" "cant do x now, will do it later" etc. I just really don't like those posts and it makes him seem more present then really he is. it's just a whole ton of fluff that makes it somewhat difficult to get done to actual relevant reads of his (which tbf could be hidden even better but still).

Proph's actions in f5 are also pretty alarming. Granted i cant put the blame all on him, but his paranoia/hedging/random unvoting and voting is not a good look and is not consistent with his reads coming into the day. Too much emphasis is placed by him on who he should be voting, not necessarily on what everyone else is doing. it comes off as him not really being interested in where the lynch actually is, but in emphasizing where he thinks his vote should be. in other words, it's less about who is lynched then who his vote is in. i dunno i'm just really thrown off by all this emotion that occurs at the f5 vote. i do think it's consistent with the persona he has presented in this game, but it does still bother me that he went through all that effort only to decide that FH was the right call. a large part of me feels like all that might have been done for show. idk though

where am i right now? Still probably FH, but it's close. I need to think about how I feel about FH's continued use of mechanics to justify his scum reads late game, alongside his strange interaction with xnadroj + the inconsistency with the redirector. On proph, I need to consider his reads coming into day 5, with his actual behavior towards the end of day 5. namely, do i believe he is really struggling with whether to vote FH or not? or is he trying to put on a show in the hopes that earlio is lynched which makes his end game even easier?

that's essentially what i'm thinking about right now. hopefully i haven't missed anything.

ps the ISOs are mainly just for me to keep track about reads and general behaviors so dont feel like you need to read into them or anything.

 

[JALMONT]

I was wavering on him being town because he wasn’t solving/present, iirc?

FH did the “If proph does trick you guys into this mislynch, my final request is to lynch proph tomorrow” and that made me get cold feet so I unvoted. I spent most of that night panicking but then I voted FH because I felt that he should not have been alive in lylo

I mean you unvoted/voted FH repeatedly. The issue there is that it felt to me like you were acting within a bubble, only concerned about where you vote was, not necessarily what the collective thought/what you needed to do to convince people on a single vote, if that makes sense. I get that people weren't really engaged that day, but my general thought is that you weren't really concerned with getting FH voted and appealing to others to vote your way.

 

[Prophylaxis]

Jalmont, will get to you as soon as I return to my room.

 

[Da Letter El]

Jalmont
Prophylaxis
Former Hope

deadline is in ~2 hours

 

[Former]

oh, okay then

 

[Former]

why did you just say that then

I was trying to say that it's pretty obvious in retrospect that proph would know he'd likely be the last scum in retrospect given the situation of KOC/Aubisio/XX when he subbed in.

I was also saying if I was the scum I would also have similar knowledge

 

[Da Letter El]

I guess maybe I should tag MoodyCloud too

 

[Prophylaxis]

Yeah so I mean proph starts out really strong. I think he's reads are all on-point and his analysis (When he actually does it lol) is really good. It's much better than FH in any case. The issues I have are 1. the amount of nothing posts he has. He fluffs so much especially when it comes to making posts like "will do this in x amount of time" "cant do x now, will do it later" etc. I just really don't like those posts and it makes him seem more present then really he is. it's just a whole ton of fluff that makes it somewhat difficult to get done to actual relevant reads of his (which tbf could be hidden even better but still).

Fair enough. I really like to be active and present in a game, and I value real-time interaction highly, which is why I make these sorts of posts (it's because I like to update the thread on what I'll be doing/what to expect from me on a given Day). Do you expect all of my posts to be packed full of content?

Proph's actions in f5 are also pretty alarming. Granted i cant put the blame all on him, but his paranoia/hedging/random unvoting and voting is not a good look and is not consistent with his reads coming into the day. Too much emphasis is placed by him on who he should be voting, not necessarily on what everyone else is doing. it comes off as him not really being interested in where the lynch actually is, but in emphasizing where he thinks his vote should be. in other words, it's less about who is lynched then who his vote is in. i dunno i'm just really thrown off by all this emotion that occurs at the f5 vote. i do think it's consistent with the persona he has presented in this game, but it does still bother me that he went through all that effort only to decide that FH was the right call. a large part of me feels like all that might have been done for show. idk though

That's a solid evaluation of my posts.

I completely agree with you in that I place a lot of emphasis on where I'm voting and I don't really care about what everyone else is doing. That's for a couple of reasons:

1) I treat mafia like a puzzle to be solved, and me as the person trying to figure it out. I know from experience that the last mafia is typically the most difficult one to find, which is why I started analyzing things as soon as Aubisio died because we have the previous three scum's interactions to look at. I put more emphasis on who to vote for/who the scum actually is because that's what wins games. You can be really good at convincing others that you're right, but if you're wrong, then that means nothing.

2) I am typically used to people following me once I figure it out because I talk with others, show my work, and I ask people what they think of my analysis. If you read my previous town game here (Bard's College) it was essentially mostly me + Texas figuring out who the scum were telling everyone else to sheep us. Especially in endgame I don't have trouble convincing others on who to lynch, which is why a large part of my game was focused on who to vote for.

I was legit PANICKING at final 5 because I didn't think Earlio was scum at the end and I really wanted FH to be lynched, but Earlio wasn't showing up, so I was kind of in despair. I'm going through all this effort because I like to constantly re-affirm to myself that I'm right and that I have the game solved correctly, which is why you see me rereading a lot.

I was really struggling as to whether FH was the right call multiple times throughout this endgame because every time I've interacted WITH him in the thread he put out so many townie tonal tells that I had to constantly second guess myself. But when I reread the game, the evidence was there, if that makes sense.

 

[Former]

at the end of the day this is wifom and I would stick to my reads as well as to the lynch order I thought was correct

I can agree to you and jalmont this is wifom. But to me this is me trying to make sense of the game with the knowledge proph is scum.

also a mafian trying to set himself up to win lylo who keeps a claimed redirector around until said lylo instead of Earlio ?
a town limited shot redirector who uses his last shot before the mafia team is brought down to 1 last member ?

yes, that first part is what happened clearly.

and yes, someone who used his shot while he could to try and stop a kill. That said, we've argued this point enough.

 

[Former]

remember how jalmont got redirected and the kill wasn't

Yep, that can happen in situations of more than one scum

I notice you never brought back up the issue with what hosts say when the redirect happens. Can't remember if we solved that issue already but that still looks really weird to me

my bad. I was told initially that people are told. But then I got clarified later on that people are only told if they get information back on their target. ie I would assume someone like apricity would be informed if redirected, but people like yourself (or hell me) wouldn't be told if we were redirected because we don't get info back....if I understand MS right.

 

[Prophylaxis]

I mean you unvoted/voted FH repeatedly. The issue there is that it felt to me like you were acting within a bubble, only concerned about where you vote was, not necessarily what the collective thought/what you needed to do to convince people on a single vote, if that makes sense. I get that people weren't really engaged that day, but my general thought is that you weren't really concerned with getting FH voted and appealing to others to vote your way.

This is all true; see the above. I normally do not have trouble with convincing others how to vote - I simply just lay out my analysis and expect people to read and agree/disagree with what I've said. I place more emphasis on figuring out who the scum actually is versus convincing others. That's why I panicked in f5, it was because I was coming to the realization that FH wouldn't be lynched.

 

[Prophylaxis]

Pretty much around for the rest of the night, so take as much time as you need and ask questions if you need to Jalmont

I've been in your shoes multiple times and it's always rough, which is why I respect that you're taking the time to go through things and objectively weigh them in your head. Even though I gave you flak earlier on for being MIA, I think your process so far this f3 has been good.

 

[Prophylaxis]

zzzzzzzzzz

 

[Former]

well at least this game is going to end either way, it's been going on way too long

 

[Prophylaxis]

Yep.

Regardless of the outcome, was a pleasure playing with you all.

This game has definitely made me lose sleep at certain points, but it was still a fun one.

 

[Prophylaxis]

 

[Former]

better option

 

[Prophylaxis]

if we lose because deadline expires

nothing i can really do but shrug and laugh