SS OU Wanted sixth member for a sun team

Hi everyone, I need help to finish my OU sun team. Their members are:

Torkoal (M) @ Heat Rock
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Lava Plume
- Yawn
- Rapid Spin
He is my sun and Stealth Rock setter. Standard Torkoal with Rapid Spin to act also as spinner, Yawn to force switches and/or bring in mates safe and Lava Plume to hit strong and maybe burn. Two things to say: I prefer Torkoal instead Ninetales because its bulk, which he will need to pivot frequently to set the sun; and it has 0 Spe IVs alongside relaxed nature to set sun at first turn against Pelipper and Tyranitar. Max investment in health and defense to make him as bulky as possible, and the rest in SpA to hit slightly harder with fire.

Venusaur (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Growth
- Sludge Bomb
- Weather Ball
- Giga Drain
I wanted a grass type to check water moves. The combination of Chlorophyll+Growth under sun is insane, and also he has acces to Weather Ball to hit hard steel-types. I chose Venusaur instead Shiftry because I like it and because its bulk, and he has Giga Drain instead Solar Beam to recover himself from Life Orb recoil. The last slot, Sludge Bomb, to hit also with STAB to fairies. Max investment in SpA (alongside modest nature) to sweep and Spe to exploit his ability.

Charizard (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Solar Power
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Flamethrower
- Air Slash
- Focus Blast
- Roost
Charizard is my wallbreaker. Its main move, Flamethrower, have a power of 90+45 (STAB)+27 (LO)+45 (Solar Power)+45 (Sunny Day effect)= 252 with 100% accuracy. He also has Air Slash (secondary STAB move), Focus Blast (the only fight-type move on the team) and Roost (to recover from LO and SP recoil). Max investment in SpA and Spe to hit fast and furious and 4 IVs on SpD to resist a little bit better to electric and water moves (does not make sense try to resist to rock moves, he will faint anyway).
Another good option is Darmanitan Scarf, but Charizard is my favourite pokémon and I want to test him first and see if works.

Mandibuzz (F) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Overcoat
EVs: 252 HP / 160 SpD / 96 Spe
Careful Nature
- Foul Play
- Roost
- U-turn
- Defog
She is the team defogger and invaluable mate to Charizard and Torkoal, with her Heavy-Duty Boots avoiding any Stealth Rock damage. She also can check Dragapult or Aegislash, recover from damage with Roost and use U-turn to bring in mates safely. Careful nature to maximize their SpD, but the IVs are copy-pasted, so I'm open to suggestions.

Dugtrio (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Sucker Punch
- Reversal
The main role of Dugtrio is to trap both Tyranitar and Toxapex with Arena Trap and eliminate them with Earthquake+STAB+Choice Band. The rest is a versatile moveset with Stone Edge to hit flyers/fire-type, Sucker Punch as priority move and Reversal if running low health. Max investment at Atk and Spe with a favourable nature to the latter and 4 IVs on SpD to (try to) resist water/grass/ice/etc.-types.

Clefable (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Wish
- Thunder Wave
This is the slot I want to change. Standard Clefable, as bulky as possible, with Wish to heal her mates and Soft-Boiled to heal herself, Moonblast to get STAB and Thunder Wave to give a chance to my sweepers. I thought Clefable was a good option to hit dragon-types and provide recover to the rest of the team, but after a few matches I feel it's not working. Pelipper gives me headaches, but without Clefable I don't have anything to hit effectively to dragon-types.

In summary, I think I have an utility (Tork), two sweepers (Char and Venu), a pivot defogger (Mandi) and a revenge killer (Dug). So, the question is: who can I add? A water-type? A fairy-type? Someone to check and eliminate Pelipper? I am missing some important role? Please tell me what do you think in the comments. Thanks forehand!
 
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Hi, welcome to Smogon! I'm locking your RMT for the time being as the forum rules require that you provide a completed team and have at least 3 lines of descriptions for each Pokemon to explain their roles. Please read the rules carefully and take a look at Team Showcase to see the level of detail we require. PM me with updated descriptions and I'll be happy to unlock this.

unlocked
 
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Heyyos! I was waiting for the unlock wew since I think I had the answer to your "last man slot" issue. Anyway, nice sun team you've got here and I like to give you some interesting options you can opt for to improve your game.

I've seen a lot of high ladder player testing out a bunch of options but for your team I think the best option that complements your squad is to run either Darmanitan or Kyurem and my thoughts is that running Specs Kyurem with Weather Ball & Freeze Dry over Clefable. This is because Freeze Dry allows you to safely threaten rain teams on the switch in and giving you advantage in the weather war. Against sand, just need to click Ice Beam every time Kyurem gets a free switch in. Of course, this also means that you have an added pressure to ensure hazard control with Mandibuzz but with the HO Sun is meant to be played, there is no reason to go too defensive with this team.

Other than this change, another that I would like to recommend tho I'm not sure if it will be as well received is to run Toxic over yawn on torkoal. The reason behind this is because when you're playing HO teams like these, putting mons to sleep to force the mons out is definitely useful but I think being able to cripple walls and fatter mons or opposing weather setters by dropping a Toxic has far more greater mileage in allowing you to end games quicker with your team.

Apart from that, I don't really think your team needs much adjustment since Sun HO is very simple in it's building and strong in it's output and that's the beauty of simplicity. Hope you enjoy the small change recommendations I've given you and have fun [:
Kyurem @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Draco Meteor
- Weather Ball
- Freeze-Dry
 
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Heyyos! I was waiting for the unlock wew since I think I had the answer to your "last man slot" issue. Anyway, nice sun team you've got here and I like to give you some interesting options you can opt for to improve your game.

I've seen a lot of high ladder player testing out a bunch of options but for your team I think the best option that complements your squad is to run either Darmanitan or Kyurem and my thoughts is that running Specs Kyurem with Weather Ball & Freeze Dry over Clefable. This is because Freeze Dry allows you to safely threaten rain teams on the switch in and giving you advantage in the weather war. Against sand, just need to click Ice Beam every time Kyurem gets a free switch in. Of course, this also means that you have an added pressure to ensure hazard control with Mandibuzz but with the HO Sun is meant to be played, there is no reason to go too defensive with this team.

Other than this change, another that I would like to recommend tho I'm not sure if it will be as well received is to run Toxic over yawn on torkoal. The reason behind this is because when you're playing HO teams like these, putting mons to sleep to force the mons out is definitely useful but I think being able to cripple walls and fatter mons or opposing weather setters by dropping a Toxic has far more greater mileage in allowing you to end games quicker with your team.

Apart from that, I don't really think your team needs much adjustment since Sun HO is very simple in it's building and strong in it's output and that's the beauty of simplicity. Hope you enjoy the small change recommendations I've given you and have fun [:
Kyurem @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Draco Meteor
- Weather Ball
- Freeze-Dry

Hi! I've been disconnected a while, sorry.
I like your Kyurem a lot! I will test it when I can.
As for Torkoal, I don't usually use yawn, so maybe toxic would be a good change.
Thank you so much for your help! If you have more suggestions, please let me know :)
 
I feel like you should likely switch out flamethrower for fireblast since you'll miss out on a few 1 and 2 hit KOs using it Which is really important given your using solar power + life orb which means you only get a few hits before you go down even if they dont have rocks or ever land a hit on you so you need to make ever single attack matter with it.

252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Flamethrower vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Clefable in Sun: 294-347 (74.6 - 88%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Vs
252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Clefable in Sun: 359-422 (91.1 - 107.1%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery

This is for normal spedef Clefable


252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Dragapult in Sun: 240-283 (75.7 - 89.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Vs
252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Dragapult in Sun: 292-344 (92.1 - 108.5%) -- 50% chance to OHKO


252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Flamethrower vs. 252 HP / 160+ SpD Mandibuzz in Sun: 308-363 (72.6 - 85.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
vs
252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 160+ SpD Mandibuzz in Sun: 376-445 (88.6 - 104.9%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO


252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Darmanitan in Sun: 305-360 (86.8 - 102.5%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
vs
252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Darmanitan in Sun: 374-441 (106.5 - 125.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO


252 SpA Life Orb Charizard Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Aegislash-Blade: 252-299 (96.5 - 114.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
vs
252 SpA Life Orb Charizard Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Aegislash-Blade: 307-367 (117.6 - 140.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

For most other pokemon it'll be just nicer in my option that you have higher damage rolls since it'll allow your other pokemon to make better use of the holes you punch in a team since you're only gonna get between 1 and 3 hits with it max no matter what and you'd rather have those hits be nuking things rather then fail to KO a pokemon by a few hit points because of a low roll and be forced to either switch to not use up 33% of your HP or take the extra HP to KO a weaken pokemon anyway


I also think Mandibuzz could do better with knock off to help you vs bulkier teams or knock-off pokemons items like an aggresive switch into Conk or choice scarf's
 
I feel like you should likely switch out flamethrower for fireblast since you'll miss out on a few 1 and 2 hit KOs using it Which is really important given your using solar power + life orb which means you only get a few hits before you go down even if they dont have rocks or ever land a hit on you so you need to make ever single attack matter with it.

252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Flamethrower vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Clefable in Sun: 294-347 (74.6 - 88%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Vs
252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Clefable in Sun: 359-422 (91.1 - 107.1%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery

This is for normal spedef Clefable


252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Dragapult in Sun: 240-283 (75.7 - 89.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Vs
252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Dragapult in Sun: 292-344 (92.1 - 108.5%) -- 50% chance to OHKO


252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Flamethrower vs. 252 HP / 160+ SpD Mandibuzz in Sun: 308-363 (72.6 - 85.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
vs
252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 160+ SpD Mandibuzz in Sun: 376-445 (88.6 - 104.9%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO


252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Darmanitan in Sun: 305-360 (86.8 - 102.5%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
vs
252 SpA Life Orb Solar Power Charizard Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Darmanitan in Sun: 374-441 (106.5 - 125.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO


252 SpA Life Orb Charizard Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Aegislash-Blade: 252-299 (96.5 - 114.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
vs
252 SpA Life Orb Charizard Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Aegislash-Blade: 307-367 (117.6 - 140.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

For most other pokemon it'll be just nicer in my option that you have higher damage rolls since it'll allow your other pokemon to make better use of the holes you punch in a team since you're only gonna get between 1 and 3 hits with it max no matter what and you'd rather have those hits be nuking things rather then fail to KO a pokemon by a few hit points because of a low roll and be forced to either switch to not use up 33% of your HP or take the extra HP to KO a weaken pokemon anyway


I also think Mandibuzz could do better with knock off to help you vs bulkier teams or knock-off pokemons items like an aggresive switch into Conk or choice scarf's

Hi! I'm a little bit paranoic with my bad luck at accuracy, but I can try fire blast though.
As for Mandibuzz's knock off, I totally agree; in fact I thought I already have changed it, so thanks to point that ^^'
By the way, arena trap is now banned, so Tyranitar and Toxapex are now again a problem. Who I could change for dugtrio? Or I should keeping him?
 
you could try this i place of dugtrio as it would allow you to have more momentum

Heliolisk @ Magnet
Ability: Solar Power
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Focus Blast
- Solar Beam

Personally i use Magnet over life orb/spec because 80% of the time i use volt switch unless they have a ground type. it would add ground weaknesses but you have 2 flying types and if you wanted you could run thunder for Rain teams.

Anyway, that's my 2cents as i use this on my Sun team and i find that having heliolisk is invaluable due to it helping protect zard and helps vs rain your worst match up ( weather-wise )
 
you could try this i place of dugtrio as it would allow you to have more momentum

Heliolisk @ Magnet
Ability: Solar Power
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Focus Blast
- Solar Beam

Personally i use Magnet over life orb/spec because 80% of the time i use volt switch unless they have a ground type. it would add ground weaknesses but you have 2 flying types and if you wanted you could run thunder for Rain teams.

Anyway, that's my 2cents as i use this on my Sun team and i find that having heliolisk is invaluable due to it helping protect zard and helps vs rain your worst match up ( weather-wise )
I used to play Heliolisk, but with a different setup:

Heliolisk @ Expert Belt
Ability: Solar Power
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Hyper Voice
- Grass Knot

Maybe I add him again to the team, thank you!
 
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