SS OU Dual weather offense (current peak 1710)

[OctoMystic402]

Hi guys, so my other account somehow got logged out and I cannot remember the details so I created a new one, for awile now I've been trying to use the meta but everything has counters :p
I made a decent team with 3 sand Pokemon and 3 rain pokemon, really liking the outcome of this team and I am currently at 1710 on ladder, this team checks most things, lando-t, spectrier, toxapex, mandibuzz and everything weak to ground, electric, steel, or water.

https://pokepast.es/63c8a7d6f30a0505


The setters

Hippowdon
Hippowdon, this thing is a physical tank that can badly live a special move, I would use ttar but hippowdon is useful for switching out of barreskewda or pelipper to predict an electric move, I sometimes use ttar to check spectrier but we already have checks to it

Pelipper
The rain setter, I usually run physical bulk as it won't live an electric move anyway, it's other weaknesses are physical (rock) and even with max sp.def it won't live a h it. This thing is So good. 2 Powerful stabs, U turn, and defog, pairs well with hippo and can live basically any non electric physical move.



The sand sweepers

Excadrill
Band excadrill, this thing gets a kill, doesn't matter who it's on. Sand rush gives
It a base 550 speed, which outspeeds timid regieleki and every scarf user with speed lower than Barreskewda, or with +1 in speed, with base 608 attack after band
And stab with outspeeding everything at normal speed, enough said.

Dracozolt
Dracozolt, the pokemon that kills lando-t after rocks with draco meteor, kill everything else with Fire blast, eq, and bolt beak. The evs kill offensive Pokemon in 1 hit with Bolt beak, kill non sp def ferrothorn and eq deals with pesky electric and ground types that resist my other moves.




The rain sweepers

Barraskewda
The new OU Pokemon has had a very big impact on the ladder, being able to outspeed +1 pherosma is valuable and LO just increases the DPS, the moveset can OHKO most super effective offensive hits. Spectrier? click crunch Pherosma? Click Psychic fangs. Something weak to fighting? Click CC. Otherwise click liquidation and see everything die.

Zapdos
a staple on any rain team and for good reason, being able to have 2 100% accuracy stabs in rain, with specs and weather ball makes it the Pokemon it is, timid outspeeds a few threats and can leave a dent in not very effective Pokemon due to specs stab.

Please give suggestions and advice to me and rate the team, hopefully one of you will find it interesting and give valid advice about weaknesses, extra strats etc.

 

[Smashburn]

It looks like an interesting team, I like the dual weather aspect of it as many teams aren't prepared to answer both rain and sand in the same team, and I like the type coverage. One thing I don't like is how pinned you can get if you opponent brings out bulks or subs out, but as shown the team concept is quite simple and if you really run into certain threats you can run any kind of Ttar and it should work, unless your Ttar set is awful, in that case don't.

A.S.

I don't really like the weakness to Garchomp and other more uncommon bulky dragon types like AV Goodra or variants of Salamence this team has so in Barraskewda's set I decided on running Ice Fang instead of Psychic Fang mostly because we have 2 strong electric mons to deal with Toxapex, and ice fang gives us another check to grass, dragon, flying, and ground types. Also I would try HDB on Zapdos as it would be best because the team only has one answer to Spikes/Stealth Rock/Toxic Spikes and the stab and speed from Zapdos is already really significant.

SO MANY EDITS.

Update: Both of the changes I suggested have made the team much stronger and it answers just about everything you can think of and I love it, keeping this team as my main!

 

[OctoMystic402]

It looks like an interesting team, I like the dual weather aspect of it as many teams aren't prepared to answer both rain and sand in the same team, and I like the type coverage. One thing I don't like is how pinned you can get if you opponent brings out bulks or subs out, but as shown the team concept is quite simple and if you really run into certain threats you can run any kind of Ttar and it should work, unless your Ttar set is awful, in that case don't.

A.S.

I don't really like the weakness to Garchomp and other more uncommon bulky dragon types like AV Goodra or variants of Salamence this team has so in Barraskewda's set I decided on running Ice Fang instead of Psychic Fang mostly because we have 2 strong electric mons to deal with Toxapex, and ice fang gives us another check to grass, dragon, flying, and ground types. Also I would try HDB on Zapdos as it would be best because the team only has one answer to Spikes/Stealth Rock/Toxic Spikes and the stab and speed from Zapdos is already really significant.

SO MANY EDITS.

Update: Both of the changes I suggested have made the team much stronger and it answers just about everything you can think of and I love it, keeping this team as my main!

I like the idea of ttar, and ice fang kuda, but could you explain zapdos as it already doesn't get affected by anything except rocks and only really web affects this break. I used LO on my new zapdos to be able to switch between different Super effective moves

 

[GaryTheGengar]

Hey, I'm always a fan of dual weather teams. I have a few suggested changes for you, mainly in the form of moveset changes.

With two stealth rock weak pokemon, and three weak to toxic spikes, I think you'd benefit from a more reliable form of hazard removal than pelipper's defog. I'd suggest running rapid spin on excadrill. I'm not sure how much you benefit from a choice band, I think life orb might be optimal, as band can provide your opponent with free turns due to the immunities to exca's main stab; either way I would suggest dropping brick break for spin. With so many forms of speed control, I think you have a fine matchup vs. any screens teams you come across, as well as the fact that they should be less common without their two main abusers in zygarde and kyu-b.

On the other hand, I'd change barraskewda's life orb for choice band, as with sand+life orb(and possible rocky helmet damage), you might find yourself getting worn down faster than you'd often like. The power boost from choice band can be huge at times as well. I'm not a huge fan of crunch, as most targets are hit hard enough by your water stab, and slowbro doesn't mind crunch too much, so I'd suggest trying out flip turn for momentum. It can form a volt-turn chain with zapdos as well vs physically defensive targets that can tank two liquidations.

I'd try out toxic on hippowdon over yawn, as the chip damage can help you break through some targets that would otherwise give you some trouble, such as buzzwole. You could also try ice fang in that slot, if you're especially concerned about pokemon such as garchomp. Finally, since you have sand, weather ball isn't the most reliable stab move on pelliper. I'd recommend switching it for roost for recovery, so you can set rain multiple times per game. If you find yourself missing the water move, I'd make the shift to scald, which also has a nice little 30% burn rate.

In summary:
Excadrill: Choice band/brick break -> life orb/rapid spin
Barraskewda: life orb/crunch -> choice band/flip turn
Pelipper: Weather ball -> roost
Hippowdon: Yawn -> toxic

Nice team and good luck!

 

[Smashburn]

Hi guys, so my other account somehow got logged out and I cannot remember the details so I created a new one, for awile now I've been trying to use the meta but everything has counters :p
I made a decent team with 3 sand Pokemon and 3 rain pokemon, really liking the outcome of this team and I am currently at 1710 on ladder, this team checks most things, lando-t, spectrier, toxapex, mandibuzz and everything weak to ground, electric, steel, or water.

https://pokepast.es/63c8a7d6f30a0505


The setters

Hippowdon
Hippowdon, this thing is a physical tank that can badly live a special move, I would use ttar but hippowdon is useful for switching out of barreskewda or pelipper to predict an electric move, I sometimes use ttar to check spectrier but we already have checks to it

Pelipper
The rain setter, I usually run physical bulk as it won't live an electric move anyway, it's other weaknesses are physical (rock) and even with max sp.def it won't live a h it. This thing is So good. 2 Powerful stabs, U turn, and defog, pairs well with hippo and can live basically any non electric physical move.



The sand sweepers

Excadrill
Band excadrill, this thing gets a kill, doesn't matter who it's on. Sand rush gives
It a base 550 speed, which outspeeds timid regieleki and every scarf user with speed lower than Barreskewda, or with +1 in speed, with base 608 attack after band
And stab with outspeeding everything at normal speed, enough said.

Dracozolt
Dracozolt, the pokemon that kills lando-t after rocks with draco meteor, kill everything else with Fire blast, eq, and bolt beak. The evs kill offensive Pokemon in 1 hit with Bolt beak, kill non sp def ferrothorn and eq deals with pesky electric and ground types that resist my other moves.




The rain sweepers

Barraskewda
The new OU Pokemon has had a very big impact on the ladder, being able to outspeed +1 pherosma is valuable and LO just increases the DPS, the moveset can OHKO most super effective offensive hits. Spectrier? click crunch Pherosma? Click Psychic fangs. Something weak to fighting? Click CC. Otherwise click liquidation and see everything die.

Zapdos
a staple on any rain team and for good reason, being able to have 2 100% accuracy stabs in rain, with specs and weather ball makes it the Pokemon it is, timid outspeeds a few threats and can leave a dent in not very effective Pokemon due to specs stab.

Please give suggestions and advice to me and rate the team, hopefully one of you will find it interesting and give valid advice about weaknesses, extra strats etc.

OP can I also ask why the spreads are the way they are on Dracozolt?

 

[Smashburn]

Hey, I'm always a fan of dual weather teams. I have a few suggested changes for you, mainly in the form of moveset changes.

With two stealth rock weak pokemon, and three weak to toxic spikes, I think you'd benefit from a more reliable form of hazard removal than pelipper's defog. I'd suggest running rapid spin on excadrill. I'm not sure how much you benefit from a choice band, I think life orb might be optimal, as band can provide your opponent with free turns due to the immunities to exca's main stab; either way I would suggest dropping brick break for spin. With so many forms of speed control, I think you have a fine matchup vs. any screens teams you come across, as well as the fact that they should be less common without their two main abusers in zygarde and kyu-b.

On the other hand, I'd change barraskewda's life orb for choice band, as with sand+life orb(and possible rocky helmet damage), you might find yourself getting worn down faster than you'd often like. The power boost from choice band can be huge at times as well. I'm not a huge fan of crunch, as most targets are hit hard enough by your water stab, and slowbro doesn't mind crunch too much, so I'd suggest trying out flip turn for momentum. It can form a volt-turn chain with zapdos as well vs physically defensive targets that can tank two liquidations.

I'd try out toxic on hippowdon over yawn, as the chip damage can help you break through some targets that would otherwise give you some trouble, such as buzzwole. You could also try ice fang in that slot, if you're especially concerned about pokemon such as garchomp. Finally, since you have sand, weather ball isn't the most reliable stab move on pelliper. I'd recommend switching it for roost for recovery, so you can set rain multiple times per game. If you find yourself missing the water move, I'd make the shift to scald, which also has a nice little 30% burn rate.

In summary:</p><p>Excadrill: Choice band/brick break -> life orb/rapid spin
Barraskewda: life orb/crunch -> choice band/flip turn
Pelipper: Weather ball -> roost
Hippowdon: Yawn -> toxic

Nice team and good luck!

1. I have to disagree with you on the Toxic for Hippowdon, overall I think Yawn is more useful as it makes setting up easier into certain mons, plus it forces switch-outs on mons that buildup momentum using stats, Toxic is useful but only if you have stall which this team obviously doesn't have as it is fast paced and offence based. Plus, with Hippowdon you have sandstorm damage to add to stealth rock damage and EQ chip.

2. I think that Pelipper and Zapdos having Hurricane is still a better option for coverage on mons like Buzzwole than Toxic. By the end of the day the team's strategy isn't stall, if it was this entire team would need complete rewiring (though I would like to see your double weather teams, I am learning about this meta myself as it has been a few years for me). Hurricane damage gathers more appreciation by the time you see the match through than roost ever could as Pelipper's defensive typing doesn't even match well for mons like Rillaboom, which are even worse to deal with for the entire time without answers on more than one mon.

3. I also have to heavily disagree with you on Barraskewda, it would make sense for it to have Flip Turn if it had more reliable switch-ins, but in this team it simply doesn't. Barraskewda requires one setup on Drizzle with Damp Rock to go absolutely bonkers and if you are wasting a turn on a switch-in for Flip Turn just for your entering mon to get slapped is awful as the other mons have no recovery and run off of LO or in general damage, basically the whole team. Plus the options from LO give it much more late game cleaning potential. One thing about this team that I have noticed is that you NEVER run Barraskewda Adamant after Sandstorm and it is a rare play if I do.

4. Another Hippowdon disagreement, why would Hippowdon run Ice Fang on a set that already needs Slack Off to get off those EQ, Rocks, and Yawns? It is a bad move for Hippowdon as its Attack, Speed, Special Defense, and Defense stats here don't justify Ice Fang. A good choice if you have more of a team based around Hippowdon, but the team only uses Hippowdon to get in nasty returning Rocks, Yawns, possibly switch-in EQ, and setup Sand Stream.

5. Rapid Spin LO would be good as fast Utility in a team with other mons to back it up more, but that doesn't happen often. Plus, if you use Rapid Spin to quickly get rid of Spikes, Toxic Spikes, or Stealth Rock you are often switched into and then if you do decide to attack you lose Hp to both Rocks/Spikes and LO, meaning a significant enough portion of your health will be gone to which sweepers like Sucker Punch Urshifu or Spectrier can clean and then end you. Plus not having Brick Break makes mons like Urshifu, Ferrothorn, Blissey, Magnezone (Air Balloon), Hydreigon, Bisharp, and especially Zarude a bigger threat than they already are. Although, I would say if you run Brick Break with LO it is worth it, and the CB is better with Rapid Spin, so I suppose it was a good thought just better in reverse.

 

[Smashburn]

I like the idea of ttar, and ice fang kuda, but could you explain zapdos as it already doesn't get affected by anything except rocks and only really web affects this break. I used LO on my new zapdos to be able to switch between different Super effective moves

Hey sorry I just got that this post was for me, I forgot about it after a little as I was working on the team. Well, Heavy Duty Boots on Zapdos do exactly what you just said, it is affected by Stealth Rock. It is a commonality for teams to run Stealth Rock as many of the mons in the meta have access to it, basically every team you face will have it. Zapdos is essential for this team as its speed allows it to outdo several threats by itself without any Drizzle help, and with Heavy Duty Boots takes no extra damage on those Rocks and isn't limited to one move based off of Choice Scarf/Choice Specs which were the options for this Zapdos.

P.S.

You wouldn't want Zapdos running LO either as that makes matters worse and runs it down way too fast.

 

[OctoMystic402]

						OP can I also ask why the spreads are the way they are on Dracozolt? Draco meteor kills lando-t after rocks and bolt beak still does heaps of damage, I now run Dragon claw and fire gang with 252 atk adamant

Hey sorry I just got that this post was for me, I forgot about it after a little as I was working on the team. Well, Heavy Duty Boots on Zapdos do exactly what you just said, it is affected by Stealth Rock. It is a commonality for teams to run Stealth Rock as many of the mons in the meta have access to it, basically every team you face will have it. Zapdos is essential for this team as its speed allows it to outdo several threats by itself without any Drizzle help, and with Heavy Duty Boots takes no extra damage on those Rocks and isn't limited to one move based off of Choice Scarf/Choice Specs which were the options for this Zapdos.

P.S.

You wouldn't want Zapdos running LO either as that makes matters worse and runs it down way too fast.

I decided in the end to use expert belt on zapdos, the reason being LO wears it down and most effective moves don't ohko the opponent, they only do with specs but not very effective switch ins can cripple it

Hey, I'm always a fan of dual weather teams. I have a few suggested changes for you, mainly in the form of moveset changes.

With two stealth rock weak pokemon, and three weak to toxic spikes, I think you'd benefit from a more reliable form of hazard removal than pelipper's defog. I'd suggest running rapid spin on excadrill. I'm not sure how much you benefit from a choice band, I think life orb might be optimal, as band can provide your opponent with free turns due to the immunities to exca's main stab; either way I would suggest dropping brick break for spin. With so many forms of speed control, I think you have a fine matchup vs. any screens teams you come across, as well as the fact that they should be less common without their two main abusers in zygarde and kyu-b.

On the other hand, I'd change barraskewda's life orb for choice band, as with sand+life orb(and possible rocky helmet damage), you might find yourself getting worn down faster than you'd often like. The power boost from choice band can be huge at times as well. I'm not a huge fan of crunch, as most targets are hit hard enough by your water stab, and slowbro doesn't mind crunch too much, so I'd suggest trying out flip turn for momentum. It can form a volt-turn chain with zapdos as well vs physically defensive targets that can tank two liquidations.

I'd try out toxic on hippowdon over yawn, as the chip damage can help you break through some targets that would otherwise give you some trouble, such as buzzwole. You could also try ice fang in that slot, if you're especially concerned about pokemon such as garchomp. Finally, since you have sand, weather ball isn't the most reliable stab move on pelliper. I'd recommend switching it for roost for recovery, so you can set rain multiple times per game. If you find yourself missing the water move, I'd make the shift to scald, which also has a nice little 30% burn rate.

In summary:
Excadrill: Choice band/brick break -> life orb/rapid spin
Barraskewda: life orb/crunch -> choice band/flip turn
Pelipper: Weather ball -> roost
Hippowdon: Yawn -> toxic

Nice team and good luck!

For exca I decided to go with life orb rapid spin, the rest I kept the same

 

[Smashburn]

I like the idea of ttar, and ice fang kuda, but could you explain zapdos as it already doesn't get affected by anything except rocks and only really web affects this break. I used LO on my new zapdos to be able to switch between different Super effective moves

						Draco meteor kills lando-t after rocks and bolt beak still does heaps of damage, I now run Dragon claw and fire gang with 252 atk adamant

I toyed with the EV spread you had, the Dracozolt couldn't knock out a lot by itself even after rocks so I changed it up some because I like the spread of SpA And Atk moves on the team.

132 SpA / 132 Atk / Spe 244

 

[OctoMystic402]

I toyed with the EV spread you had, the Dracozolt couldn't knock out a lot by itself even after rocks so I changed it up some because I like the spread of SpA And Atk moves on the team.

132 SpA / 132 Atk / Spe 244

I went with
196 Atk / 100 SpA / 212 Spa Naughty nature
Dragon claw, bolt beak, earthquake, fire blast

1. I have to disagree with you on the Toxic for Hippowdon, overall I think Yawn is more useful as it makes setting up easier into certain mons, plus it forces switch-outs on mons that buildup momentum using stats, Toxic is useful but only if you have stall which this team obviously doesn't have as it is fast paced and offence based. Plus, with Hippowdon you have sandstorm damage to add to stealth rock damage and EQ chip.

2. I think that Pelipper and Zapdos having Hurricane is still a better option for coverage on mons like Buzzwole than Toxic. By the end of the day the team's strategy isn't stall, if it was this entire team would need complete rewiring (though I would like to see your double weather teams, I am learning about this meta myself as it has been a few years for me). Hurricane damage gathers more appreciation by the time you see the match through than roost ever could as Pelipper's defensive typing doesn't even match well for mons like Rillaboom, which are even worse to deal with for the entire time without answers on more than one mon.

3. I also have to heavily disagree with you on Barraskewda, it would make sense for it to have Flip Turn if it had more reliable switch-ins, but in this team it simply doesn't. Barraskewda requires one setup on Drizzle with Damp Rock to go absolutely bonkers and if you are wasting a turn on a switch-in for Flip Turn just for your entering mon to get slapped is awful as the other mons have no recovery and run off of LO or in general damage, basically the whole team. Plus the options from LO give it much more late game cleaning potential. One thing about this team that I have noticed is that you NEVER run Barraskewda Adamant after Sandstorm and it is a rare play if I do.

4. Another Hippowdon disagreement, why would Hippowdon run Ice Fang on a set that already needs Slack Off to get off those EQ, Rocks, and Yawns? It is a bad move for Hippowdon as its Attack, Speed, Special Defense, and Defense stats here don't justify Ice Fang. A good choice if you have more of a team based around Hippowdon, but the team only uses Hippowdon to get in nasty returning Rocks, Yawns, possibly switch-in EQ, and setup Sand Stream.

5. Rapid Spin LO would be good as fast Utility in a team with other mons to back it up more, but that doesn't happen often. Plus, if you use Rapid Spin to quickly get rid of Spikes, Toxic Spikes, or Stealth Rock you are often switched into and then if you do decide to attack you lose Hp to both Rocks/Spikes and LO, meaning a significant enough portion of your health will be gone to which sweepers like Sucker Punch Urshifu or Spectrier can clean and then end you. Plus not having Brick Break makes mons like Urshifu, Ferrothorn, Blissey, Magnezone (Air Balloon), Hydreigon, Bisharp, and especially Zarude a bigger threat than they already are. Although, I would say if you run Brick Break with LO it is worth it, and the CB is better with Rapid Spin, so I suppose it was a good thought just better in reverse.

For exca I now use LO with Aerial ace instead of Brick break to deal with buzzwole, because alot switch into exca

 

[Novastar123]

I would suggest running thunderous-t instead of zapdos, it can setup on stall pokemon with nasty plot, gain immunity to electric and ground, the only downside is you lose hurricane but with defog this thing is a beast
Thundurus-Therian (M) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Thunder
- Weather Ball
- Defog

 

[OctoMystic402]

I would suggest running thunderous-t instead of zapdos, it can setup on stall pokemon with nasty plot, gain immunity to electric and ground, the only downside is you lose hurricane but with defog this thing is a beast
Thundurus-Therian (M) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Thunder
- Weather Ball
- Defog

Ive tried this a few times and it does well, it gets walled by ferrothorn, I like the switch in from pelipper but I'd say thunderous-I would be better for prankster defog and nasty plot, but this isn't effective against dark types, although this could be good but it gets walled by grass types, which are usually countered by hurricane, against ferro you could setup then go for thunder but that just wastes rain turns, overall I think you could chage defog to sludge wave/focus blast and hdb to LO/expert belt

 

[The_BlindingNova]

I always like dual weather teams, it’s a solid playstyle that can easily help you climb, however there are some obvious flaws with this team that I would like to pick up on
Barraskewda shouldn’t go down to life orb that quickly, it’s a pokemon that’s meant to come in, get 1/2 kills and then switching out, not to be almost killed by its own item, therefore I think using it with choise band and swapping psychic fangs for flip turn could help, and to check dragon types go with ice fang instead of crunch.

zapdos should be a glass cannon and with expert belt non super effective hits don’t hit hard enough, hdb doesnt hit hard and life orb wears it down and specs lock you into one move. I would replace this with thunderous-therian as it hits harder, has a more useful ability and can setup with nasty plot against a switching or setting up opponent I would recommend HDB, LO or expert belt to deal damage

moves
Nasty plot
Thunder
Weather ball
Sludge wave/ focus blast