For some reason bitter blade triage on ceruledge isn't working, plz fix it.
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AAA Almost Any Ability
- Thread starter Isaiah
- Start date
This isn't a bug. Bitter Blade doesn't have the flag that makes it boosted by Triage.
hands discussion post. the day has finally come where i mention that maybe it wasnt just unburden that was broken, maybe itself was an issue.
sets: furc, regenvest, and my main point, triage. when game freak was deciding base stats they knew they couldnt give good speed to something so bulky and tanky as iron hands. so 50 speed it was. unburden took away that issue, prompting me to make this post, and somehow unburden was banned shortly after ( stakeout got banned shortly after i made a mini post on it, is this a coincidence or a pattern? ). after the ban, it seemed to die down a little. until triage came into the picture. granted, this has been made more popular thru its best check ever, flutter mane, getting banned recently, allowing it to not actually die after setting up. sure mglo pult will outspeed, ignore drain punch and burn it but ice punch kills regardless (+6 252+ Atk burned Iron Hands Ice Punch vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Dragapult: 534-629 (168.4 - 198.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO) and gholdengo barely survives a burned thunder punch (+6 252+ Atk burned Iron Hands Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gholdengo: 211-249 (55.8 - 65.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery) after a burn and cannot threaten a ko on it unless it is furc offensive but a hex will 2hko (252 SpA Gholdengo Hex (130 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Iron Hands: 297-349 (58 - 68.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and burn damage) however, hex gholdengo does not exist. its ability to setup on many things, start sweeping and regenerating is too much for this tour imo. this will especially get worse with a furscales ban where nothing can wall it anymore.
tldr: ihands bad, unburden bad so no ban ihands, unban unburden. ban furscales ihands badder
sets: furc, regenvest, and my main point, triage. when game freak was deciding base stats they knew they couldnt give good speed to something so bulky and tanky as iron hands. so 50 speed it was. unburden took away that issue, prompting me to make this post, and somehow unburden was banned shortly after ( stakeout got banned shortly after i made a mini post on it, is this a coincidence or a pattern? ). after the ban, it seemed to die down a little. until triage came into the picture. granted, this has been made more popular thru its best check ever, flutter mane, getting banned recently, allowing it to not actually die after setting up. sure mglo pult will outspeed, ignore drain punch and burn it but ice punch kills regardless (+6 252+ Atk burned Iron Hands Ice Punch vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Dragapult: 534-629 (168.4 - 198.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO) and gholdengo barely survives a burned thunder punch (+6 252+ Atk burned Iron Hands Thunder Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gholdengo: 211-249 (55.8 - 65.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery) after a burn and cannot threaten a ko on it unless it is furc offensive but a hex will 2hko (252 SpA Gholdengo Hex (130 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Iron Hands: 297-349 (58 - 68.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and burn damage) however, hex gholdengo does not exist. its ability to setup on many things, start sweeping and regenerating is too much for this tour imo. this will especially get worse with a furscales ban where nothing can wall it anymore.
tldr: ihands bad, unburden bad so no ban ihands, unban unburden. ban furscales ihands badder
Maybe I account for triage Hands too much but I don't believe, or at least, have had much issue dealing with triage Hands nor using it has felt too overbearing on the opponent. Initially it needs conditions to setup BDrum which while isn't too hard also can be annoying and can lead to lots of chip which can be exploited. MGLO Pult burning it means most defensive mon can amply take care of it (+6 252+ Atk burned Iron Hands Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Great Tusk: 169-199 (38.9 - 45.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery) or even just regular resists. Scarf Ghold can trick it in a pinch and force Hands into EQ/TPunch and then it's not hard to beat from there. Granted, these both involve sacking the mon but specs Hadron Engine can straight go for the kill with Draco and SLFO and offensive Ghold can go for the kill after chunks of HP are taken off which isn't that hard given it needs a turn to setup and BDrum HP reduction (although screens/sub could potentially make this more annoying).
There's also a variety of common FC mons that can handle Hands as well. FC Hippo/Hands can tank a IPunch and EQ respectively and then whirlwind it out which is enough in the wide majority of games and more niche but decent options like FC ScreamTail, SlitherWing, Florges and hell Polteageist/Volc (or even just regular Bulkarona) can also handle it, able to Wisp in the case of Slither and some Polt/Volc sets (Shell Smash Polt also destroys it) while STail and Florges can tank and threaten 2HKO's/OHKO. Maybe you could say it's too hard to account for or ""forces"" you to run these options but I find answers are all plenty viable and common still and I don't find much trouble accounting for it and dealing with it on a majority if not all my teams neither did I find it that amazing against good teams that weren't low ladder messes.
How to beat Iron Valiant (aka why its not as good as you think)
I've been seeing a lot of discourse around The Ironic Valiante and how its so clearly broken and 2hkos the entire tier!
While it is a very strong breaker, i think there are many underlooked flaws it posses, and how these can be applied to limit its impact in the game, even if it looks very dangerous on preview/in theory. So think of this as a little PSA, or propaganda.
The main problem stems from how hard to use it is, while that may sound silly with 2 very high BP strong stabs, you cant actually throw them around too much. Much of your checks resist these moves, and fail to be 2hkod if they come in on one of them.
These are the more sturdy defensive checks, coming in on most moves
These force Valiant to have a specific move(s) to beat them. One of the most common flaws of IV is it suffering from 4mss, it never quite has all the moves you need it to. Its hard to 2hko the entire tier when they all mandate different moves. Now this alone is not the most solid reasoning on why a mon is okay, "so im supposed to just lose if it has the right move?". Well thats where the second big flaw of Iron Valiant comes in, much bigger than the first in my opinion:
Ontop of having the right moves, it needs to use them at the right times. To actually break through many of these common mons, you need to smack them with the correct move as they switch in, and then again. This leaves much room for counterplay from the opponent. alone practically only loses to shadowball, and only if it doesnt come in on CC, and theres of course much room for the Gholden to mix up its set (ice scales, bulletproof, mixed def, etc). only loses in the long run with knock off + rocks, but you also need to first get the knock off in the first place, if it comes in on your stabs you are forced out before being able to knock it off. Defensive shrugs off everything bar Zen Headbutt. always win the encounter if you come in on anything other than CC. And so on. These are all incredibly common mons (corv has like 60 or 80 or something% usage alone) and they cover different roles on a team, so often you can find multiple of them on one team, forming layers of predictions you need to get right to hit them correctly.
Well, thats not thaaat hard right? So ive finally cornered their mon, and maybe i had to run certain moves to do so but now im here to claim my kill. Now this is where the opponent comes in. They are well aware of what Valiant needs to do or needs to have to break through their team, and can thus outplay you. You did need to corner them, but what if they scout for your "unlikely" coverage moves? Common scenario: i have
and they go taking not that much in the process. Now you can go for a clean zen headbutt kill, but they can scout for that and go to their Ice Scales on the zen. Now youve made very little progress, as youre forced out and they took like net 20-30ish on thier Iron Moth, still in a range where Zen is forced. And thats provided you even have Zen. Similar situation with + . Are you really going to predict their double to Corviknight, and Close Combat the Ghost Type in front of you instead of just Shadow Balling it? So much can go wrong here.
And this is only looking from the lens of purely defensively checking a Pokemon, where you already have to work for your kills. Now we look at the greater context of the game, where it gets much harder to land your right moves on the right defensive pokemon to break through."
has little to no defensive utility, you have to get it in on double switches or u-turns or something. This is already some amount of work to do. The problem is its never clear what move to click with Valiant, every turn is a guess.
Very common scenario, with one of the most common mons you can find Valiant getting opportunities versus:
Now vs this do you moonblast it for the kill? If you dont then you will likely die or take heavy damage (paper bulk). But the last few times you moonblasted came in for free and put in so much pressure, or got a free U-turn. Do i knock midground? Not killing either but getting some progress on the turn? Do i CC the Corviknight? What if stays in on it and kills me? These scenarios happen every single time comes in and every turn is work, you have to make a call. You've got no truly clickable moves that generate momentum, let alone are even safe and kill whats in front of you. Rarely will the move that kills the thing youre trying to scare out is what helps you break through their defensive checks. And Valiant often needs multiple tries to break through, and so you need to run this same scenario multiple times.
Basically, shuffle your checks. Go to your half health Corviknight then Dragapult on the CC. Your Florges then something else on the Poison Jab.
is a one time entry or 1-2 Moonblasts switchin. Force Valiant to get the right turns because often the odds are in your favor. Many times i theoretically can lose to Valiant but it never gets close, because the user is never "bold" enough to get the CC's on my Corv, or can do so fast enough before i win. The speedtier really holds it back in the endgames.
Building naturally with some of the most common mons in the metagame gives you the tools to outplay Valiant. Its still an incredibly dangerous breaker but you can stifle it with shuffling your checks around. And they still need to get in the mon with 0 bulk and very few useable resistances in the first place. Exploit these facts to limit Valiant, you may not be able to cleanly 100% wall it like many others are() , but it can be limited with teambuilding and smart pivoting, and utilizing your faster breakers against its speedtier to win endgames vs it. You can stack multiple mons that lose to it if it has X move, and force them to have X move + Y move + Standard moves + a Z move. You can also build where the common points of entry (Great Tusk) leads them into bad moves vs your checks.
Oh and if all goes to worst i guess you can throw out a "stupid" Earthquake with your as the Valiant user "overpredicts" you :P
Or mayb im just tripping and
I've been seeing a lot of discourse around The Ironic Valiante and how its so clearly broken and 2hkos the entire tier!
While it is a very strong breaker, i think there are many underlooked flaws it posses, and how these can be applied to limit its impact in the game, even if it looks very dangerous on preview/in theory. So think of this as a little PSA, or propaganda.
The main problem stems from how hard to use it is, while that may sound silly with 2 very high BP strong stabs, you cant actually throw them around too much. Much of your checks resist these moves, and fail to be 2hkod if they come in on one of them.
These are the more sturdy defensive checks, coming in on most moves
These force Valiant to have a specific move(s) to beat them. One of the most common flaws of IV is it suffering from 4mss, it never quite has all the moves you need it to. Its hard to 2hko the entire tier when they all mandate different moves. Now this alone is not the most solid reasoning on why a mon is okay, "so im supposed to just lose if it has the right move?". Well thats where the second big flaw of Iron Valiant comes in, much bigger than the first in my opinion:
Ontop of having the right moves, it needs to use them at the right times. To actually break through many of these common mons, you need to smack them with the correct move as they switch in, and then again. This leaves much room for counterplay from the opponent.
alone practically only loses to shadowball, and only if it doesnt come in on CC, and theres of course much room for the Gholden to mix up its set (ice scales, bulletproof, mixed def, etc). only loses in the long run with knock off + rocks, but you also need to first get the knock off in the first place, if it comes in on your stabs you are forced out before being able to knock it off. Defensive shrugs off everything bar Zen Headbutt. always win the encounter if you come in on anything other than CC. And so on. These are all incredibly common mons (corv has like 60 or 80 or something% usage alone) and they cover different roles on a team, so often you can find multiple of them on one team, forming layers of predictions you need to get right to hit them correctly. Well, thats not thaaat hard right? So ive finally cornered their mon, and maybe i had to run certain moves to do so but now im here to claim my kill. Now this is where the opponent comes in. They are well aware of what Valiant needs to do or needs to have to break through their team, and can thus outplay you. You did need to corner them, but what if they scout for your "unlikely" coverage moves? Common scenario: i have
and they go taking not that much in the process. Now you can go for a clean zen headbutt kill, but they can scout for that and go to their Ice Scales on the zen. Now youve made very little progress, as youre forced out and they took like net 20-30ish on thier Iron Moth, still in a range where Zen is forced. And thats provided you even have Zen. Similar situation with + . Are you really going to predict their double to Corviknight, and Close Combat the Ghost Type in front of you instead of just Shadow Balling it? So much can go wrong here. And this is only looking from the lens of purely defensively checking a Pokemon, where you already have to work for your kills. Now we look at the greater context of the game, where it gets much harder to land your right moves on the right defensive pokemon to break through."
has little to no defensive utility, you have to get it in on double switches or u-turns or something. This is already some amount of work to do. The problem is its never clear what move to click with Valiant, every turn is a guess. Very common scenario, with one of the most common mons you can find Valiant getting opportunities versus:
Now vs this do you moonblast it for the kill? If you dont then you will likely die or take heavy damage (paper bulk). But the last few times you moonblasted
came in for free and put in so much pressure, or got a free U-turn. Do i knock midground? Not killing either but getting some progress on the turn? Do i CC the Corviknight? What if stays in on it and kills me? These scenarios happen every single time comes in and every turn is work, you have to make a call. You've got no truly clickable moves that generate momentum, let alone are even safe and kill whats in front of you. Rarely will the move that kills the thing youre trying to scare out is what helps you break through their defensive checks. And Valiant often needs multiple tries to break through, and so you need to run this same scenario multiple times. Basically, shuffle your checks. Go to your half health Corviknight then Dragapult on the CC. Your Florges then something else on the Poison Jab.
is a one time entry or 1-2 Moonblasts switchin. Force Valiant to get the right turns because often the odds are in your favor. Many times i theoretically can lose to Valiant but it never gets close, because the user is never "bold" enough to get the CC's on my Corv, or can do so fast enough before i win. The speedtier really holds it back in the endgames. Building naturally with some of the most common mons in the metagame gives you the tools to outplay Valiant. Its still an incredibly dangerous breaker but you can stifle it with shuffling your checks around. And they still need to get in the mon with 0 bulk and very few useable resistances in the first place. Exploit these facts to limit Valiant, you may not be able to cleanly 100% wall it like many others are
)Oh and if all goes to worst i guess you can throw out a "stupid" Earthquake with your
as the Valiant user "overpredicts" you :POr mayb im just tripping and
Hey you!
Don't like Gholdengo?
Don't like Scream Tail?
Don't like FC Hippowdon?
Well I have good news for you...
Introducing:
Your new King (Quaquaval) @ Leftovers / Covert Cloak
Ability: Ice Scales
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 236 SpD / 20 Spe
Careful Nature
- Aqua Step
- Taunt
- Bulk Up
- Roost
Being only weak to Iron Valiant and Desoland mons, this Quaquaval can easily spiral out of control, while also avoiding Whirlwinds from Ting-lu and Hippowdon alike. It is easily able to come onto the field so long as your opponent doesn't have a strong Flying/Electric type move, or a Meowscarada that's still alive. It also has just the right amount of EVs to outspeed Dragapult after 2 Aqua Steps.
Don't like Gholdengo?
Don't like Scream Tail?
Don't like FC Hippowdon?
Well I have good news for you...
Introducing:
Your new King (Quaquaval) @ Leftovers / Covert Cloak
Ability: Ice Scales
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 236 SpD / 20 Spe
Careful Nature
- Aqua Step
- Taunt
- Bulk Up
- Roost
Being only weak to Iron Valiant and Desoland mons, this Quaquaval can easily spiral out of control, while also avoiding Whirlwinds from Ting-lu and Hippowdon alike. It is easily able to come onto the field so long as your opponent doesn't have a strong Flying/Electric type move, or a Meowscarada that's still alive. It also has just the right amount of EVs to outspeed Dragapult after 2 Aqua Steps.
Oh, been used that. Of course I'd never post it on here unless it could no longer be played since any pokemon posted in a forum becomes borderline useless.hoooooly crap you may have just changed my life
---
Veluza @ Leftovers
Ability: Fur Coat
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 116 Def / 140 Spe
Lax Nature
- Fillet Away
- Liquidation
- Stored Power
- Recover
This thing is CRAZY, it eats hits from mons like Great Tusk, Cinderace and non-MB Baxcalibur. Easily comes in on choiced Tusk and Corvi. Scared easily by dark types like Kingambit and Chi-yu.
---
also atha's team is literally everywhere and its starting to piss me off so thats fun
Speaking of no longer playable, since both poison heal and tera change are banned disabling usage of these 3 ....
Behold! Peak Comedy!
(Toxapex) @ Toxic OrbAbility: Poison Heal
Tera Type: Water
Meanwhile, within the secret base mess hall
Qwilfish: "Did you see the new guy? He's so shiny and cool!"
Tentacruel: "I don't know (≖_≖ ) something seems off about him."
Sits tray at their table
Toxapex: "Hello fellow water/poisoned types, how do you do?"
Tentacruel: (മ ̥̆ മ) "Wait hold on, repeat that?"
Toxapex: "How do you do?"
Tentacruel: "No, before that."
Toxapex: "Water/Poison type?"
Tentacruel: (≖_≖ ) "hmmmmmmmm"
Toxapex: ( ⚆ _ ⚆ )
Qwilfish: "Look see, he's one of us. We can trust him."
Tentacruel: "Maybe you're right. Probably just my imagination."
Toedscruel: "Yeah dude, no one can get past you."
Tentacruel: "Heh, yeah. No one can get past me ... say Qwilfish, were there always 3 of you?"
Zoroark: (¬_¬”) "Yes."
Ditto: ( ゜￢゜) "Ditto"
And Double Behold! Your Worst Nightmare!
Menacing Stance (Avalugg) (F) @ Power Lens
Ability: Well-Baked Body
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
Gentle Nature
- Crunch
- Body Press
- Heavy Slam
- Mirror Coat
The Great Calamity of Armarouge City. This Avalugg was genetically engineered to make your life miserable. Immunity to both stabs. 1-2hkos with crunch. Becomes faster if you trick it. And mirror coat incase you change your set by trying to bring aura sphere ... which it lives.
(≖_≖ )
The Triple Behold!
Prophecy foretold!
The one who is literally good as gold.
Literally (Forretress) @ Leftovers
Ability: Good as Gold
- Chilling Reception
What sets him apart from any other good as gold user? Oh ho ho! Elementary my dear Watson, for you see ... ಥ◡ಥ shiny forretress is gold ... Get it? Good. As. Gold? Eh? Eh?
cricket noises
What? Why are you still here? I don't really know what you were expecting. That's it, leave ... he's gold. That's the joke. .... ba dum tss
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I have come to submit a sample team 
BUBBA SHRIMP
TEAM DESCRIPTION
BUBBA SHRIMP
TEAM DESCRIPTION
Cinderace makes up 50% of this teams devastating offensive core and the team really wouldn’t work without it. It provides pivoting to get its partner iron moth in on wbb mons such as Corviknight and Gholdengo while smashing everything not named Dondozo in its path. Pyro Ball is its STAB, Sucker Punch is for revenge killing, U-turn is for funny pivot move, and wisp is to help it annoy garchomp and garganacl (mostly garchomp) that the team can sometimes struggle to break.
Iron Moth is the star of this team, it makes up the other half of the offensive core and is the main way of speed control. This shit WRECKS teams that rely on wbb to beat it, in sun this thing just nukes everything, it’s so amazing. Fire Blast is the stab you will be using 70% of the time due to sheer damage in sun but Fiery Dance is an amazing secondary stab option that I have personally used to completely 6-0 sweep several teams. Energy ball two shots ice scales garg if you catch them lacking after little chip and dazzling gleam 2 shots things such as chomp and bulky dnite ig. Modest because the only scarfer that catches you is chi-yu but who gives a fuck about chi-yu I want damage.
Garchomp is the start of the fat core I have expertly crafted for this team (not tryna brag or smth but I’m pretty proud of these four ngl). I kinda flip flopped around with what to use in this spot from garchomp to garchomp to garchomp but finally landed back on using garchomp (garchomp is a good mon ). It provides a very much needed dnite tusk and ceruledge check and is overall just fat. Oh also eject button because ain’t no corv uturning for free on my watch.
). It provides a very much needed dnite tusk and ceruledge check and is overall just fat. Oh also eject button because ain’t no corv uturning for free on my watch.Gholdengo is this teams cope against p-sea bundle because a team that has 5/6 mons weak to water don’t like bundle at all. It also is the most goated ass garg counter to ever exist in the history of existing. This mon also helps with things such as florges and scream tail which aren’t an issue for this team but let’s pretend they are. Also helps play around valiant which you don’t really need to do with this team because ace and moth handle it just fine offensively and tusk/chomp can even come in on cc eject out then go to one of the offensive mons. The evs ohko pult with shadow ball and speed creep tusk who speed creep gambit…because I can.
This tusk is literally my favorite set ever to use in the history of using. First of all we got the fire 4 attacks regen tusk, then we got the masterful ev set letting it live 252 spatk iron moth flamethrower in the sun while outspeeding modest armarogue (shutup specs rogue is a demon) and living sharp beak dnite e speed AND THEN to top it all off we got the sugary sweetness that is the drug called eject button. This tusk set helps handle garg chomp tusk slither wing you name it this thing can prolly either pivot in on to get in a breaker or help check it’s so dumb and I love it, 10/10 would recommend.
Ice scales garg…it beats special fire types…that’s it…explanation done. Nah but ice scales garg is the setter for the team and is really good at scouting choice locked mons and spreading chip with salt cure for moth to cleave through as it just needs a lil bit of chip on certain mons to send them to hell.
This team is more on the offensive side early game leveraging double eject button to stop opposing pivots and bring in your two main breakers cleaving through as much of the opponents team as you possibly can then relying on your fat core sitting in the back to finish up the job if needed. The team really only struggles against very very specific mons such as specs mold breaker bundle (I lied252 SpA Choice Specs Iron Bundle Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 148 SpD Gholdengo in Sun: 120-142 (31.8 - 37.6%) -- 91.1% chance to 3HKO) and mold breaker great tusk (I lied again just hit it hard and use regen tusk to pivot around). The team can struggle with gholdengo sometimes (sike moth handles it just fine). Overall solid team and I’ve had tremendous success with it both on ladder and in ghosting tour winning our R2 game with a clean 4-0.
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Let's Discuss the new SV AAA metagame, and some of the best new mons, abilities, and movesets.
Part One: Great Tusk
Tusk is a versatile bulky attacker with great utility, and can find a role on almost any AAA team. Yet he lacks special bulk and reliable recovery, decreasing his viability. He is quite popular in the Meta right now, so be prepared to use him - or defeat him
Pivot/Tank
Great Tusk @ Leftovers / (Heavy Duty Boots)
Ability: Regenerator/ (Intimidate)
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Close Combat
- Headlong Rush
- Rapid Spin
- Stealth Rock / Knock Off
Tusk loves having regenerator to provide reliable recovery, allowing this set to pivot in and out of physical threats and provide hazard support with near impunity. He can afford to run Close Combat and Headlong Rush over Body Press and Earthquake because of how much he benefits from switching out after attacking. However, Pivot-tusk can still be OHKed by powerful and super-effective special attacks, or he can be crippled by status conditions, so pair him with status absorbers and specially bulky mons to get the most out of regenerator. If you can't fit regenerator on tusk, intimidate is a viable, albeit less reliable, option.
Tank/Sweeper
Great Tusk @ Leftovers
Ability: Good as Gold / Ice Scales
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Body Press
- Earthquake
- Bulk Up
- Knock Off / Rapid Spin
This tusk prefers to switch in and trade blows rather than pivot out. He has the mixed bulk to sit on threats, setup, and slug it out at least once in a battle. Good as Gold provides Immunity to defog, encore, will-o-wisp, toxic, and taunt - giving him ample opportunities to switch in - and makes him very difficult to wall and stall. Rapid spin offers greater utility, and the potential to outspeed counters, but without knockoff, tusk is vulnerable to EarthEater Gholdengo or other potential Ghost or Flying type counters, so choose wisely. This Tusk can be worn down over the course of battle, so I like to pair him with wish support (especially Triage Florges) for added longevity.
Edit: Ice Scales may be banned soon, but till then, boosting tusks special bulk is very powerful on the bulk up set.
Breaker/Cleaner
Great Tusk @ Flame Orb / Life Orb
Ability: Guts / Magic Guard
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Headlong Rush
- Close Combat
- Rapid Spin
- Knock Off
This tusk smacks hard right off the bat, and can outspeed the metagame after a spin. He clean 2HKO's physdef Corviknight with a guts boost. Life orb is almost as strong, but can be walled by a few dedicated physically bulky mons. Guts makes him unwallable and almost impossible to cripple, while magic guard offers him greater longevity, and better utility paired with rapid spin. (IMO guts is the better option! because magic guard is more optimal on a mon weak to rocks).
Part One: Great Tusk
Tusk is a versatile bulky attacker with great utility, and can find a role on almost any AAA team. Yet he lacks special bulk and reliable recovery, decreasing his viability. He is quite popular in the Meta right now, so be prepared to use him - or defeat him
Pivot/Tank
Great Tusk @ Leftovers / (Heavy Duty Boots)
Ability: Regenerator/ (Intimidate)
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Close Combat
- Headlong Rush
- Rapid Spin
- Stealth Rock / Knock Off
Tusk loves having regenerator to provide reliable recovery, allowing this set to pivot in and out of physical threats and provide hazard support with near impunity. He can afford to run Close Combat and Headlong Rush over Body Press and Earthquake because of how much he benefits from switching out after attacking. However, Pivot-tusk can still be OHKed by powerful and super-effective special attacks, or he can be crippled by status conditions, so pair him with status absorbers and specially bulky mons to get the most out of regenerator. If you can't fit regenerator on tusk, intimidate is a viable, albeit less reliable, option.
Tank/Sweeper
Great Tusk @ Leftovers
Ability: Good as Gold / Ice Scales
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Body Press
- Earthquake
- Bulk Up
- Knock Off / Rapid Spin
This tusk prefers to switch in and trade blows rather than pivot out. He has the mixed bulk to sit on threats, setup, and slug it out at least once in a battle. Good as Gold provides Immunity to defog, encore, will-o-wisp, toxic, and taunt - giving him ample opportunities to switch in - and makes him very difficult to wall and stall. Rapid spin offers greater utility, and the potential to outspeed counters, but without knockoff, tusk is vulnerable to EarthEater Gholdengo or other potential Ghost or Flying type counters, so choose wisely. This Tusk can be worn down over the course of battle, so I like to pair him with wish support (especially Triage Florges) for added longevity.
Edit: Ice Scales may be banned soon, but till then, boosting tusks special bulk is very powerful on the bulk up set.
Breaker/Cleaner
Great Tusk @ Flame Orb / Life Orb
Ability: Guts / Magic Guard
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Headlong Rush
- Close Combat
- Rapid Spin
- Knock Off
This tusk smacks hard right off the bat, and can outspeed the metagame after a spin. He clean 2HKO's physdef Corviknight with a guts boost. Life orb is almost as strong, but can be walled by a few dedicated physically bulky mons. Guts makes him unwallable and almost impossible to cripple, while magic guard offers him greater longevity, and better utility paired with rapid spin. (IMO guts is the better option! because magic guard is more optimal on a mon weak to rocks).
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I have had some success countering Hands with triage florges, unaware ghosts (esp dragapult), and prankster skeledirge
EDIT: Unaware does not include speed control, however dragapult still resists or is immune to the common punches (Unaware dragapult is a revenge killer that cannot be outsped by anything in the meta, setup or no, so you must realize how good that can be.)
And Prankster Skeledirge hard-counters almost all setup sweepers in the meta with encore + wisp.
Try the Ghosts - they are really strong right now.
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Unaware does not ignore opposing Speed boosts; Dragapult can still be outsped by setup.
I have come to submit a sample team
BUBBA SHRIMP
TEAM DESCRIPTION
Cinderace makes up 50% of this teams devastating offensive core and the team really wouldn’t work without it. It provides pivoting to get its partner iron moth in on wbb mons such as Corviknight and Gholdengo while smashing everything not named Dondozo in its path. Pyro Ball is its STAB, Sucker Punch is for revenge killing, U-turn is for funny pivot move, and wisp is to help it annoy garchomp and garganacl (mostly garchomp) that the team can sometimes struggle to break.
Iron Moth is the star of this team, it makes up the other half of the offensive core and is the main way of speed control. This shit WRECKS teams that rely on wbb to beat it, in sun this thing just nukes everything, it’s so amazing. Fire Blast is the stab you will be using 70% of the time due to sheer damage in sun but Fiery Dance is an amazing secondary stab option that I have personally used to completely 6-0 sweep several teams. Energy ball two shots ice scales garg if you catch them lacking after little chip and dazzling gleam 2 shots things such as chomp and bulky dnite ig. Modest because the only scarfer that catches you is chi-yu but who gives a fuck about chi-yu I want damage.
Garchomp is the start of the fat core I have expertly crafted for this team (not tryna brag or smth but I’m pretty proud of these four ngl). I kinda flip flopped around with what to use in this spot from garchomp to garchomp to garchomp but finally landed back on using garchomp (garchomp is a good mon
Gholdengo is this teams cope against p-sea bundle because a team that has 5/6 mons weak to water don’t like bundle at all. It also is the most goated ass garg counter to ever exist in the history of existing. This mon also helps with things such as florges and scream tail which aren’t an issue for this team but let’s pretend they are. Also helps play around valiant which you don’t really need to do with this team because ace and moth handle it just fine offensively and tusk/chomp can even come in on cc eject out then go to one of the offensive mons. The evs ohko pult with shadow ball and speed creep tusk who speed creep gambit…because I can.
This tusk is literally my favorite set ever to use in the history of using. First of all we got the fire 4 attacks regen tusk, then we got the masterful ev set letting it live 252 spatk iron moth flamethrower in the sun while outspeeding modest armarogue (shutup specs rogue is a demon) and living sharp beak dnite e speed AND THEN to top it all off we got the sugary sweetness that is the drug called eject button. This tusk set helps handle garg chomp tusk slither wing you name it this thing can prolly either pivot in on to get in a breaker or help check it’s so dumb and I love it, 10/10 would recommend.
Ice scales garg…it beats special fire types…that’s it…explanation done. Nah but ice scales garg is the setter for the team and is really good at scouting choice locked mons and spreading chip with salt cure for moth to cleave through as it just needs a lil bit of chip on certain mons to send them to hell.
This team is more on the offensive side early game leveraging double eject button to stop opposing pivots and bring in your two main breakers cleaving through as much of the opponents team as you possibly can then relying on your fat core sitting in the back to finish up the job if needed. The team really only struggles against very very specific mons such as specs mold breaker bundle (I lied252 SpA Choice Specs Iron Bundle Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 148 SpD Gholdengo in Sun: 120-142 (31.8 - 37.6%) -- 91.1% chance to 3HKO) and mold breaker great tusk (I lied again just hit it hard and use regen tusk to pivot around). The team can struggle with gholdengo sometimes (sike moth handles it just fine). Overall solid team and I’ve had tremendous success with it both on ladder and in ghosting tour winning our R2 game with a clean 4-0.
Oh and Sammy yelled at me so SammyCe123 and Grim_Blazer helped with finalizing moveset choices and grim was the person who randomly said “what if we do orichalcum pulse ace + moldy special fire?”
that is intentional, if you hack triage and bitter blade on the same mon they don't synergize
I'm really awful at teambuilding but I really want to make this Veluza set work on a non-HO team. Any suggestions on either a team for it or further optimizations?
Veluza @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Psychic Surge
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 4 HP / 112 Atk / 252 SpA / 140 Spe
Rash Nature
- Stored Power
- Hydro Pump
- Liquidation
- Fillet Away
Veluza @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Psychic Surge
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 4 HP / 112 Atk / 252 SpA / 140 Spe
Rash Nature
- Stored Power
- Hydro Pump
- Liquidation
- Fillet Away
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This set is focused more on being an independent sweeper rather than relying on specific support as I don't really want to run HO. I just want to see if I can fit it on a non-HO team (probably should've mentioned that in my og post :/)
i would use tinted lens, but seeing as corvi walls it anyway rn with ice scales, it might not work. furc could work for a better setup opportunity or even scales, regen is gonna let it swap out and do it again (i guess?????)
Grim_Blazer
Banned deucer.
Fur coat veluza with recover is the way to go if you wanna use veluza, drop hydro for recover and make it fur coat with covert cloak or something
I second the opinion that regenerator veluza might be the best you can get out of the fish. Even after a setup, there are many priority attacks that veluza has to switch out of, so being able to setup again later is a good thing.
You mean Fur Coat, right? I don't see where anybody mentioned Regenerator. In fact, I'd even argue that being able to set up multiple times without having to switch is more valuable than trying to get multiple chances to set up with something as frail as Veluza.
Grim_Blazer
Banned deucer.
Don't have to swap out of priority if you run fur coat veluza
Here's the team I used for reqs and I feel like it's pretty emblematic of this meta. It's bad please don't use it.
/ 
1. Goober 1 - akaCyclizar Shed Tail
God this move is fucking stupid, at worst it's a fast slow teleport which ends up being only a free switch for 50% of an egregious mon with zilch defensive utility and at best and often most likely it passes a sub with any hp and lets immune/furscales stuff set up and break, not really "oh my god we have to ban it now" broken but still suspicious
2. Goober 2 - Iron Hands
he's balanced? but might be slightly overwhelming with Dragapult and Gholdengo gone (Foreshadowing)
/
3. Goober 3 - Iron Valiant / Dragapult
Iron Valiant was the main breaker of the team. Hadron engine helps electric types but generally it's an awful ability, i think SoR Valiant is the shit until people start running fur coat <insert valiant check> then you run SFLO/Hadron until people start running ice scales <insert valiant check> and then SoR will be the shit, obviously until........
not to mention the fact Moonblast/Close Combat/Gholdengo Move can run god knows what to beat whoever it wants, clodsire? popped by zen headbutt, florges? nah it can run poison jab, dondozo/corviknight, nope tbolt exists.
Personally I don't believe forcing everyone to run multiple soft checks to this mon and "just outplay lol" as well as my inability to use it correctly and only get a KO against corvi makes it healthy for the metagame
Dragapult was a late change to the team and admittedely it did not do a whole lot on this team although it has already proven itself in the tera suspect and against me. It's insanely fast by having the best speed in the whole tier which makes softchecking special pult without a scales user nearly impossible and suprisingly bulky mixed mglo set insanely threatening. I'll only send people to this great post by Heracross 2.0 because generally I agree with his points.
4. Goober 4 - Polteageist
Queue the random Fur swepeer that wins because i decided to win (S/O to ax who let me have this replay https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-1769318056-1c5xs3wefjtqpeok887tzwkfjvlef8fpw )
It's simply stupid, 60/65 with not even max Def investement not bulk investement, just Physical Defense investement it's able to setup with shell smash on physical attackers like Great Tusk or Aerilate!Dragonite and it's all thanks to Fur Coat, Dauntless/Tablets would make these matchups much closer, often turning them in the side of the attacker - EV's not put into SpAtk make it harder to break through SpDef mons but often the fact you totally outplayed, won the 1v1 you probably shouldn't have and got 2 smashes is enough to win
5. Goober 5 - Volcarona
or actually
I put Volca on this team only because "Oh lol I get swept by a bundle". DesoLand!Volca/Iron Moth and Scales!Corviknight are great mons at their own and very good counters to it which makes it feel like every team is weak to it and then there's a hard wall to it (ignore the fact 3a qd volca loses to it long term
). That makes bundle very hard to tier but personally I'd say it's centralizing and unhealthy for the meta.
6. Über Goober - Gholdengo
I despise this Cheese String man. My horrendous team building works to joe's benefit - it's ability is nearly unguessable on MU. The IV variant doesn't have a good fire resist so WBB makes sense, it also lacks a Dragapult answer so Bulletproof/Scales makes sense, Tusk kinda cleaves as well so Earth Eater makes sense and Dazzlin Poltea + Fur Joseph seems more "normal" as well. Positioning around him when one of your "checks" is immuned is very difficult and oh boy don't get me started on "3 Volca checks + WBB joe" type of teams. My opinion: joe is teetering on the edge of suspectability but if !randability Gholdengo pops off I wouldn't be against sussing it.
I also wanted to talk about Fluffy or in reality boldly conjecture that the meta won't be healthy with Fluffy in it. While the idea of "Fur Coat but with actual downsides!!" might seem fine, the downsides seem to be miniscule. The contact part really is ignored only by Dragapult (darts), Meowscarada (flower trick), Cinderace (pyro ball), EQ users (pretty big group ngl) and uhh Aqua Cutter/Psycho Cut Sharpness users. Meanwhile the "2x damage from Fire moves" is not a large enough downside for Chomp or Dondozo and even mons like Great Tusk or Scream Tail aren't as threatened because of the abundance of WBB (PSea) steel types. So I assume with Fluffy in the picture the meta will centralize more around OPulse Cinderace as it in particular is able to nuke all Fluffy set up mons.
tl;dr if i was a dictator (like tnm ) if furscales gets banned, fluffy, pult, valiante get qbd, we keep a super close watch on golden joebert & bundle, think about hands, opulse, shed tail
/ 1. Goober 1 - aka
God this move is fucking stupid, at worst it's a fast slow teleport which ends up being only a free switch for 50% of an egregious mon with zilch defensive utility and at best and often most likely it passes a sub with any hp and lets immune/furscales stuff set up and break, not really "oh my god we have to ban it now" broken but still suspicious
2. Goober 2 - Iron Hands
he's balanced? but might be slightly overwhelming with Dragapult and Gholdengo gone (Foreshadowing)
/ 3. Goober 3 - Iron Valiant / Dragapult
Iron Valiant was the main breaker of the team. Hadron engine helps electric types but generally it's an awful ability, i think SoR Valiant is the shit until people start running fur coat <insert valiant check> then you run SFLO/Hadron until people start running ice scales <insert valiant check> and then SoR will be the shit, obviously until........
not to mention the fact Moonblast/Close Combat/Gholdengo Move can run god knows what to beat whoever it wants, clodsire? popped by zen headbutt, florges? nah it can run poison jab, dondozo/corviknight, nope tbolt exists.
Personally I don't believe forcing everyone to run multiple soft checks to this mon and "just outplay lol" as well as my inability to use it correctly and only get a KO against corvi makes it healthy for the metagame
Dragapult was a late change to the team and admittedely it did not do a whole lot on this team although it has already proven itself in the tera suspect and against me. It's insanely fast by having the best speed in the whole tier which makes softchecking special pult without a scales user nearly impossible and suprisingly bulky mixed mglo set insanely threatening. I'll only send people to this great post by Heracross 2.0 because generally I agree with his points.
4. Goober 4 - Polteageist
Queue the random Fur swepeer that wins because i decided to win (S/O to ax who let me have this replay https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9almostanyability-1769318056-1c5xs3wefjtqpeok887tzwkfjvlef8fpw )
It's simply stupid, 60/65 with not even max Def investement not bulk investement, just Physical Defense investement it's able to setup with shell smash on physical attackers like Great Tusk or Aerilate!Dragonite and it's all thanks to Fur Coat, Dauntless/Tablets would make these matchups much closer, often turning them in the side of the attacker - EV's not put into SpAtk make it harder to break through SpDef mons but often the fact you totally outplayed, won the 1v1 you probably shouldn't have and got 2 smashes is enough to win
5. Goober 5 - Volcarona
or actually
I put Volca on this team only because "Oh lol I get swept by a bundle". DesoLand!Volca/Iron Moth and Scales!Corviknight are great mons at their own and very good counters to it which makes it feel like every team is weak to it and then there's a hard wall to it (ignore the fact 3a qd volca loses to it long term
). That makes bundle very hard to tier but personally I'd say it's centralizing and unhealthy for the meta.6. Über Goober - Gholdengo
I despise this Cheese String man. My horrendous team building works to joe's benefit - it's ability is nearly unguessable on MU. The IV variant doesn't have a good fire resist so WBB makes sense, it also lacks a Dragapult answer so Bulletproof/Scales makes sense, Tusk kinda cleaves as well so Earth Eater makes sense and Dazzlin Poltea + Fur Joseph seems more "normal" as well. Positioning around him when one of your "checks" is immuned is very difficult and oh boy don't get me started on "3 Volca checks + WBB joe" type of teams. My opinion: joe is teetering on the edge of suspectability but if !randability Gholdengo pops off I wouldn't be against sussing it.
I also wanted to talk about Fluffy or in reality boldly conjecture that the meta won't be healthy with Fluffy in it. While the idea of "Fur Coat but with actual downsides!!" might seem fine, the downsides seem to be miniscule. The contact part really is ignored only by Dragapult (darts), Meowscarada (flower trick), Cinderace (pyro ball), EQ users (pretty big group ngl) and uhh Aqua Cutter/Psycho Cut Sharpness users. Meanwhile the "2x damage from Fire moves" is not a large enough downside for Chomp or Dondozo and even mons like Great Tusk or Scream Tail aren't as threatened because of the abundance of WBB (PSea) steel types. So I assume with Fluffy in the picture the meta will centralize more around OPulse Cinderace as it in particular is able to nuke all Fluffy set up mons.
tl;dr if i was a dictator (like tnm ) if furscales gets banned, fluffy, pult, valiante get qbd, we keep a super close watch on golden joebert & bundle, think about hands, opulse, shed tail
Well, I originally wasn't going to build for a while due to being busy and also due to the fact the meta might be absolutely blown up in a bit but hey I found some cool concepts to work around with and I thought might as well make a couple of teams before I can't make any good teams for the next 6 months if FurScales does get banned so here are the results. Also thanks to UT and Isaiah for helping me improve these teams.
As the name implies, the team is centred around spamming Fire at the enemy and hoping they melt. Really, fire is kinda busted with resists not being real (Garchomp is not real) but is held back by WBB existing. So removing that obstacle aside, they can become extremely terrifying (along with the fact Breaker ignores FurScales). QD Volc is main wincon here as against a fair few teams that rely on WBB to ward off fire types or just Scales Corv teams in general, it can just Quiver and GG. The set, however, is tentative. Running LO on Volc along with Giga Drain allows it to 2HKO Scales Gary (a large obstacle) on the switch with minor chip like rocks and also allows you to OHKO Clod with +1 Fire Blast in Sun or if you're real running SBeam guarantees Gary 2HKO with HDB or straight up OHKO's with +1 LO, however relying on Sun is unreliable on this team. If you do decide to run LO though, Court Change on Ace is near mandatory for extra insurance to keep Rocks off. Even a bulkier Wisp set to wear down more annoying walls could potentially work. Rest of the team is defensive backbone + pivot to support the team. All things considered I like parts of it although definitely could be improved.
I saw someone use FC BU Tusk to great effect within the AAA ghosting tour as well as some people advocating its potency so I decided to try it out and voila, this team appeared and it has worked pretty alright. Balance which takes its time chipping at the enemy and ideally getting situations for Valiant in or for Tusk/Corv to be a wincon. STail here provides nice Wish support and can cripple walls with Scarf which is fairly neat, although Spe investment might be better, I just really like the extra bulk as I find STail does little with the speed anyway. Main issue is that FC Tusk kinda sucks on this team. As the only form of hazard removal, it hates switching into common hazard setters who can often threaten it with Toxic, Knock and chip and thus means this team can get super worn down by hazard stack teams and as a FC wall can get worn down quick. It can act as a nice wincon in some situations, but perhaps my ladder luck is bad but I find those situations scarce. Defog U-Turn Corv could help, however BU has honestly been finding a lot value for me and you do technically have other options to deal with those passive hazard stack teams so meh, I haven't tested this team that much so maybe it's just bad ladder luck that puts the bad taste in my mouth and it's definitely not that bad and can work well in a lot of situations.
I like both concepts and the teams have performed decently (although I haven't tested too much) however the teams most likely could be optimised in some way, although if you want another fun concept to play around with, Tinted Mono-STABs mixed Valiant is very real, trust. Hopefully some find these teams useful, assuming they're even legal past the day after tomorrow.
As the name implies, the team is centred around spamming Fire at the enemy and hoping they melt. Really, fire is kinda busted with resists not being real (Garchomp is not real) but is held back by WBB existing. So removing that obstacle aside, they can become extremely terrifying (along with the fact Breaker ignores FurScales). QD Volc is main wincon here as against a fair few teams that rely on WBB to ward off fire types or just Scales Corv teams in general, it can just Quiver and GG. The set, however, is tentative. Running LO on Volc along with Giga Drain allows it to 2HKO Scales Gary (a large obstacle) on the switch with minor chip like rocks and also allows you to OHKO Clod with +1 Fire Blast in Sun or if you're real running SBeam guarantees Gary 2HKO with HDB or straight up OHKO's with +1 LO, however relying on Sun is unreliable on this team. If you do decide to run LO though, Court Change on Ace is near mandatory for extra insurance to keep Rocks off. Even a bulkier Wisp set to wear down more annoying walls could potentially work. Rest of the team is defensive backbone + pivot to support the team. All things considered I like parts of it although definitely could be improved.
I saw someone use FC BU Tusk to great effect within the AAA ghosting tour as well as some people advocating its potency so I decided to try it out and voila, this team appeared and it has worked pretty alright. Balance which takes its time chipping at the enemy and ideally getting situations for Valiant in or for Tusk/Corv to be a wincon. STail here provides nice Wish support and can cripple walls with Scarf which is fairly neat, although Spe investment might be better, I just really like the extra bulk as I find STail does little with the speed anyway. Main issue is that FC Tusk kinda sucks on this team. As the only form of hazard removal, it hates switching into common hazard setters who can often threaten it with Toxic, Knock and chip and thus means this team can get super worn down by hazard stack teams and as a FC wall can get worn down quick. It can act as a nice wincon in some situations, but perhaps my ladder luck is bad but I find those situations scarce. Defog U-Turn Corv could help, however BU has honestly been finding a lot value for me and you do technically have other options to deal with those passive hazard stack teams so meh, I haven't tested this team that much so maybe it's just bad ladder luck that puts the bad taste in my mouth and it's definitely not that bad and can work well in a lot of situations.
I like both concepts and the teams have performed decently (although I haven't tested too much) however the teams most likely could be optimised in some way, although if you want another fun concept to play around with, Tinted Mono-STABs mixed Valiant is very real, trust. Hopefully some find these teams useful, assuming they're even legal past the day after tomorrow.
Fur coat is a great option, but you shouldn't discount regenerator. The issue with fur coat, why it isn't always the optimal choice, is that veluza still dies to sucker punch.