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SPOILERS! Datamine Thread - Pokemon Information - Some Datamines

Lectrys said:
I'm still thinking the list will be pretty darn restricted. I think Game Freak would rather cut us off hard-to-get-in-game but non-legendary and non-mythical mons like starters (especially past-gen starters - imagine us asking for Hisuian starters) or Gholdengo. (Game Freak even went to the length of cutting us off farming Gimmighoul Coins by baiting wild Dittos into profitably Transforming into our Gimmighoul-line Pokemon - Gholdengo's sole ability makes Transform fail (to the point that I think Game Freak built Good as Gold around this interaction), and Dittos Transformed into Gimmighoul drop no Gimmighoul Coins when defeated - so I don't think they'll even let that pass through.)

The only legendary(/mythical?) I think Game Freak will make an exception for with the "sanctioned (one-shot?) PkHex" is Terapagos. It looks default Normal-type (look at the raised Normal logo at the top of its shell!), has (probably) all the other type symbols on it, and therefore looks insanely customizable. It's also a Gen 9 mon, unlike its legacy counterparts Arceus and Silvally, so us getting one (or multiples?) right now won't be so bad.
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I think this is kind of a moot point.
Outside of Gholdengo (and even then...), breeding / optimizing pokemon has become *extremely* easy in this generation, to the point you can catch a wild pokemon and make it competitively viable in less than 5 minutes (sources: myself, it's what I do) assuming you are at a game state where you have plenty of resources from previous raids... which you are likely to be by the time the 2nd dlc is released.

Such feature doesn't exactly change gameplay in any real way.

Moreso, obtaining multiple copies of legendaries has been the n1 reason to use pkhex & similar tools for quite long time, and at this point, having a "in-game" pokemon editor would be significantly preferable to "force" every competitive player to use illegal tools on their switch.
 
Worldie said:
I think this is kind of a moot point.
Outside of Gholdengo (and even then...), breeding / optimizing pokemon has become *extremely* easy in this generation, to the point you can catch a wild pokemon and make it competitively viable in less than 5 minutes (sources: myself, it's what I do) assuming you are at a game state where you have plenty of resources from previous raids... which you are likely to be by the time the 2nd dlc is released.

Such feature doesn't exactly change gameplay in any real way.

Moreso, obtaining multiple copies of legendaries has been the n1 reason to use pkhex & similar tools for quite long time, and at this point, having a "in-game" pokemon editor would be significantly preferable to "force" every competitive player to use illegal tools on their switch.
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At the same time I wonder about the necessity since generating multiple copies of a Legendary saves you resources but isn't strictly necessary with the stuff GF has added to let you fully convert Natures and Hyper Train, save for very specific edge cases like Zero ATK for Foul Play or Min/Specific Speed for Trick Room Benchmarks.

My immediate guess is they will have some tie-in Website where you can customize Pokemon before importing them, and I would assume you don't have free control of the Mon species or generation. I would speculate (admittedly without objective evidence) the Pokemon come from some other source like Go, Sleep, contest prizes, or promotional events, and you can claim them through this site while being able to tweak aspects of them (since Go, for example, only has Poke, Great, Ultra, Premier, and Beast Balls for anything captured, maybe you could change the ball it's received in by routing through here).

You wouldn't be able to tell it "generate a Landorus/Incinceroar" from scratch, but you could send an extra Groudon or Lugia or such from Go to this app, make them more presentable/Hyper-Train them, and then send them to the base game from there. This to draw "Collector" players from the main series into trying out the side/mobile projects where some combination that's rare/impossible to get in the main series is available to them more easily, while being a cheaper/"free" alternative to buying the DLC for access to some returning species in SV
 
Lectrys said:
I'm still thinking the list will be pretty darn restricted. I think Game Freak would rather cut us off hard-to-get-in-game but non-legendary and non-mythical mons like starters (especially past-gen starters - imagine us asking for Hisuian starters) or Gholdengo. (Game Freak even went to the length of cutting us off farming Gimmighoul Coins by baiting wild Dittos into profitably Transforming into our Gimmighoul-line Pokemon - Gholdengo's sole ability makes Transform fail (to the point that I think Game Freak built Good as Gold around this interaction), and Dittos Transformed into Gimmighoul drop no Gimmighoul Coins when defeated - so I don't think they'll even let that pass through.)

The only legendary(/mythical?) I think Game Freak will make an exception for with the "sanctioned (one-shot?) PkHex" is Terapagos. It looks default Normal-type (look at the raised Normal logo at the top of its shell!), has (probably) all the other type symbols on it, and therefore looks insanely customizable. It's also a Gen 9 mon, unlike its legacy counterparts Arceus and Silvally, so us getting one (or multiples?) right now won't be so bad.
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There is literally no point in making it restrictive. PKHex + various bots managed by the community make it trivially easy to generate Pokemon as is so they are only shooting themselves in the foot if they make their official version restrictive. The point of a feature like this should be to remove reliance on PKHex and instead make it easier to build a team or use the Pokemon you want to use for everyone, not just people in the know about PKHex.
 
Magcargo said:
There is literally no point in making it restrictive. PKHex + various bots managed by the community make it trivially easy to generate Pokemon as is so they are only shooting themselves in the foot if they make their official version restrictive. The point of a feature like this should be to remove reliance on PKHex and instead make it easier to build a team or use the Pokemon you want to use for everyone, not just people in the know about PKHex.
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I think at least one restriction must be enforced in "sanctioned (one-shot?) DLC PkHex": no mons still snapped in Pokemon SV are allowed. There would be fairly massive feelbads if someone made, say, Aegislash in the sanctioned PkHex and then found, to their disappointment, that they couldn't put it in Pokemon SV. (Due to its rapidly shifting between forms in the middle of battle and thus not playing nice with Tera, I don't think I'm alone in thinking that Aegislash will never make it into Pokemon SV.)

With that restriction enforced, other restrictions seem easy to make. I suspect Terapagos is running the sanctioned PkHex and would justify it only being able to make Paradox-category Pokemon (because Terapagos is of Little Imagination otherwise). The suggestion from pika pal that you can only make Pokemon that are either being given away at events or you can present proof you have in another game (e.g. Pokemon GO) also makes sense. I just think that Game Freak will be determined that nobody will abuse the system (e.g. overload the sanctioned PkHex with mons that are inordinately hard to get in-game and especially in multiples, such as mythicals, legendaries, starters, and Gholdengo).
 
Worldie said:
Ya guys realize that the "pkhex" system doesn't necessarly need to be able to create pokemon, but just edit them right
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That’s actually what I’m hoping for, as a matter of fact. Being able to reduce a Pokémon’s IVs (to 0), as well as teaching pre-evolution-only moves (e.g. Spore for Breloom), remain the only obstacles left in being able to optimize any individual Pokémon no matter how it was obtained.
 
I'm doubtful that GF would release anything that allows us to create Pokémon, that would essentially render everything else obsolete, there would be no reason to catch Pokémon in any capacity, even if the drawbacks of using it were huge.

Editing Pokémon however, is something they are probably going to implement (Khu's PKhex comment basically confirms either creating/editing, but ruling out creating then.. it's this!) but I imagine that the usage/drawback is going to be pretty intense. Just to get perfect IVs on a Pokémon it requires a level of grinding for bottle caps/gold bottle caps, the same with changing tera types etc.

I imagine that EVs and IVs are going to the main focus - everything else already exists within the games (Except for Pokeball editing, but considering that they refuse to give us healthy methods of farming Apriballs/Beast Balls/Dream Balls I don't think this is going to happen, unless the feature is "hey bring us X ball to put them in") But the ability to instantly edit EVs and edit IVs to an exact figure do not exist.

Obvi the screenshot Kaphotics posted implies that shininess is potentially on the table too is quite insane.
 
Perriechu said:
Obvi the screenshot Kaphotics posted implies that shininess is potentially on the table too is quite insane.
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Knowing GF Spaghetti coding it could also just be that all aspects have to be included in the editor even if the user isn't going to be given (intentional) access to them.

The big thing GF would need to be selling on this feature is convenience. Access is available for virtually everything needed to make a Pokemon Comp-playable, so the appeal would be this lowering the time commitment to trying the game out, which lies in the ability to battle with one-offs trying different builds or cutting the time commitment to grind money for vitamins or to manually EV train (which is much simplified but still takes 20 minutes to max a stat for 1-6 Pokemon). SV already took steps towards that by having everything purchase-able with the "normal" currency (LP and Prize Money functioning the same in anything but auctions), even if expensive to do TOO haphazardly (to the extent of needing to money grind if you regularly build things, even with repeated Raid Den visits providing LP and Sell-Fodder). Whether for money or the time spent to avoid that money, convenient access is the next thing they can sell on the "raising to battle" side of things that pkHex would be valued for (collectors intrinsically will value something they got "legitimately" in game more by nature so this likely isn't going to change much for that part of the fandom)
 
So, I wasn't 100% sure where to post this, but there's potential confirmation that transferring Pokémon into HOME won't reset their movesets, and so transfer moves will be legal.

Some VGC players have noticed Hatterene running Expanding Force in Ranked, as well as Dual Wingbeat Dragonite, Burn Up Arcanine and Minimize Chansey. All of these are legal in Gen 8 due to learnsets and tutors, however in Gen 9 as we all know, they are technically not legit.

The game allows these users to play online, which means they aren't being flagged as illegal, does this mean somewhere within the coding that these Pokémon are flagged to learn these legitimately? I'm not certain on how things like that work, so forgive me, but does this bode well for transfer moves being a thing and that movepools are set to be go back to SWSH levels?

If you have the mobile version of HOME and have the battle data update, Hatterene's moveset does show that Expanding Force is #8 (Initially 9) in the Victories/ "moves used by this Pokémon" tab.

All of this could be a giant cock up on GFs end, which wouldn't surprise me, but transfer moves being legal also wouldn't surprise me - we'd have to wait for HOME I guess for solid confirmation (Considering there's a patch coming at the end of April I wouldn't be surprised if they synced the release of HOME with that)
 
Perriechu said:
So, I wasn't 100% sure where to post this, but there's potential confirmation that transferring Pokémon into HOME won't reset their movesets, and so transfer moves will be legal.

Some VGC players have noticed Hatterene running Expanding Force in Ranked, as well as Dual Wingbeat Dragonite, Burn Up Arcanine and Minimize Chansey. All of these are legal in Gen 8 due to learnsets and tutors, however in Gen 9 as we all know, they are technically not legit.

The game allows these users to play online, which means they aren't being flagged as illegal, does this mean somewhere within the coding that these Pokémon are flagged to learn these legitimately? I'm not certain on how things like that work, so forgive me, but does this bode well for transfer moves being a thing and that movepools are set to be go back to SWSH levels?

If you have the mobile version of HOME and have the battle data update, Hatterene's moveset does show that Expanding Force is #8 (Initially 9) in the Victories/ "moves used by this Pokémon" tab.

All of this could be a giant cock up on GFs end, which wouldn't surprise me, but transfer moves being legal also wouldn't surprise me - we'd have to wait for HOME I guess for solid confirmation (Considering there's a patch coming at the end of April I wouldn't be surprised if they synced the release of HOME with that)
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HOME not changing movesets between SwSh and SV would not surprise me in the slightest and to me would feel like the logical outcome anyway: SwSh and SV are both classic/traditional mainline games with proper PvP, the same moves with similar mechanics are in both games, and both follow the same structure with moves data and learning and whatnot.

Movesets being reset in PLA and that afterthought of a game they call BDSP are because moves and learnsets are completely different in PLA while BDSP was an afterthought of a game not made by Game Freak and was developed by a third party developer, and the coding in there is probably some weird logistical issue that stems from the fact that it's a third party game and not something that was made by Game Freak, as opposed to say, SwSh or SV.
 
If I recall, SwSh required Pokemon to have a "Native" or "Battle-Ready" Mark for Galar to be used in Ranked/VGC or some modes, the process of which included wiping its past-Gen moves from access.

In the case of the illegal-mons on Ranked, I would assume they are generated with anything like that attached even if not legitimate, so the game doesn't spot anything if they pass the "mark" check. This would mean VGC won't allow past-gen Transfer moves, but would matter for Singles/unofficial formats that don't call for the Symbol.
 
Perriechu said:
So, I wasn't 100% sure where to post this, but there's potential confirmation that transferring Pokémon into HOME won't reset their movesets, and so transfer moves will be legal.

Some VGC players have noticed Hatterene running Expanding Force in Ranked, as well as Dual Wingbeat Dragonite, Burn Up Arcanine and Minimize Chansey. All of these are legal in Gen 8 due to learnsets and tutors, however in Gen 9 as we all know, they are technically not legit.

The game allows these users to play online, which means they aren't being flagged as illegal, does this mean somewhere within the coding that these Pokémon are flagged to learn these legitimately? I'm not certain on how things like that work, so forgive me, but does this bode well for transfer moves being a thing and that movepools are set to be go back to SWSH levels?

If you have the mobile version of HOME and have the battle data update, Hatterene's moveset does show that Expanding Force is #8 (Initially 9) in the Victories/ "moves used by this Pokémon" tab.

All of this could be a giant cock up on GFs end, which wouldn't surprise me, but transfer moves being legal also wouldn't surprise me - we'd have to wait for HOME I guess for solid confirmation (Considering there's a patch coming at the end of April I wouldn't be surprised if they synced the release of HOME with that)
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Honestly I can see it just them missing a few of these types of traits. I mean, at minimum, the fact they're legal now is enough of a "oh what did you do this time." Especially when Hisuian Zoroark is throwing out illegal flags.



Also this got me to look up Burn Up because I went "wait that's not a tutor, why is it..." where I realized that despite the Arcanine, Typhlosion, Coalossal and Moltres lines all being in the game and despite Burn Up still being selectable and despite Burn Up working (clearly): no one learns it. It was purely a level up move before (Growlithe lost it as an egg move in SWSH because Arcanine got it as a level up move and this was retained in this game, Tepig hasn't been in the games since USUM)
SWSH had a few moves in a similar situation, but said moves were also weird edge cases that were usually only learned by one or two Pokemon and the "primary" Pokemon wasn't actually available; or it was the inverse, a wildly available move just wasn't on a specific Pokemon. Weird!
 
pika pal said:
If I recall, SwSh required Pokemon to have a "Native" or "Battle-Ready" Mark for Galar to be used in Ranked/VGC or some modes, the process of which included wiping its past-Gen moves from access.

In the case of the illegal-mons on Ranked, I would assume they are generated with anything like that attached even if not legitimate, so the game doesn't spot anything if they pass the "mark" check. This would mean VGC won't allow past-gen Transfer moves, but would matter for Singles/unofficial formats that don't call for the Symbol.
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SV doesn't have the Battle Ready Mark at all. It was actually one of the things people saw and thought would point towards moves just being wiped on transfer.
I used to think it had a spot for it, but that's actually the spot where it marks a Pokemon as shiny.
 
Wasn't the battle ready mark introduced in SwSh as part of a patch?

The riddler leaker was going on about some sort of "moves won't be wipped" as well. TTBT, it IS something that wouldn't hurt.


It has been a few months of "X lost Y move" without bothering to wait, because the fandom is impulsive and doomerist.
 
Worldie said:
Definitely, however people are more obsessed about it as far as Smogon goes since Smogon always allowed transfer moves, and a lot of otherwise-top-tier mons suffer horribly due to the lack of things like Knock Off and Toxic.

Weavile in RU :zonger:
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I always get a chuckle reading posts akin to "THIS POKEMON LOST THIS MOVE" because anywhere outside of Smogon 80% of the time that move has been lost for a while, friend.

Like I get it, it's just funny.
 
Eriorguez said:
In previous gens it was "won't be there before Bank/Home", but this one gen the wording is "lost".
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Tbfh it's all due to Centro and couple other things deciding that since they did that fuckery with BDSP/LA in order to not have issues with moves not present in a given game, they decided that it's guaranteed to be what's going to be happening going forward, with absolutely 0 source, and ofc, half of the internet decided it's the mandatory truth :\
 
So, do we know if the new patch has undocumented changes beyond the trimming of Dex entries of stuff that is either in the coding or will likely return in DLC?
 
I guess this is a datamine potentially relevant to SV news:

Pokemon Masters is adding Nemona as its first Gen 9 character, but what is notable is that she becomes available at a weird time compared to when characters are normally released: Aug 8 at 13:00 UTC. This apparently coincides with the usual Pokemon Presents time, suggesting this could be a reveal during a Presents news drop three days before the World Championships start.

https://www.reddit.com/r/PokemonMasters/comments/15bzr09
 
An "available right after this presentation" type deal would make sense
Last year we did get a Presents before Worlds as well, though it was significantly earlier. August 3rd for the presents vs August 18th for Worlds.
 
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