What pokémon got affected most by changes in the remakes of their games?

[Hugin]

Gyarados. To the point I usually ban it from my ingame teams since I consider it to be the best ingame Pokémon there is.

Not only did it gain one of the best abilities in the game in the form of Intimidate (which is the one you usually find it with, it's regular ability), but it benefited the most from the physical/special split change. Also, when everybody else is still learning moves in the damage ranges of the 50s/60s, the thing has learnt Dragon Dance and Waterfall, a combination that carries the entirety of any Pokémon game with the addition of Ice Fang.

The funny thing is it's become even stronger in recent generations. In Generation VIII they changed the level of Dragon Dance from 44/45 to 36, and gave it fucking Waterfall at level 21. So, to make things simple, at level 36 you have a Water Flying Pokémon, which has been historically difficult af to hit with meaningful damage, with Intimidate, bulky af, with good speed and attack, Dragon Dance, one of the best water moves in the game with 100 acc and a chance to flinch, Ice Fang and Crunch just for coverage and to not waste Waterfall PPs when you OHKO anyways.

As I said, i usually ban it from my ingame teams. It's too much.

In addition to what Karxrida said, there's the Exp share/Lucky Egg/Exp Candies. As the games have made levelling easier, dead periods for Magikarp/Abra/Etc have become less meaningful. You still can't use them on the first gym, but the days of switch training something for 15 levels are a thing of the past.

 

[Sonikku A]

Golduck line is weird
Its RBY niche is strictly an event Amnesia distribution, or Stadium, so its otherwise disappointing in game
In game its movepool is depressing

The TM coverage is good, but too rare too late
FRLG? Well...

Great, the weak moves before evolving lvl 33 are even earlier. Despite comp, Cloud Nine is worthless in game for FRLG, and Damp is to this day still nothing 99% of the time. But the Sp Atk stat boost to 95 is nice, same with tutors that...still kind of are out of the way
So RBY -> FRLG is marginally better. Barely

GSC -> HGSS is a much better difference since Gen 4 actually gives Psyduck/Golduck early Water stab. Tutors are nice too

Sadly the stronger moves are noticeably physical outside Signal Beam (Bug...yay...), so TMs again are needed for special coverage outside Hydro miss

ORAS similarly is based on post Gen 4 movepool, so it's automatically better than RSE. Unfortunately like before, a lot of strong coverage for movepool and tutors are physical. But better than relying on Confusion :[
...they didn't increase its stat? Seriously? Freaking Beautifly did!?

FRLG -> LGPE

Well...it's better. I guess!
...Golduck is a really stagnant mon, huh?

DPP -> BDSP
Not so much better for Golduck, but Psyduck learns Water Pulse really early before evolving, and Hydro Pump lvl 36

So that's better overall, but still sadly boring of a moveset for both

Why Matsuda? It's your fav mon!

 

[Nokocchi]

I would have to say that Gengar and Gyarados are pretty big winner's in Let's Go Pikachu and Let's Go Eevee. They finally get to be in a Kanto-central game where they can use their higher attacking stats with their STAB moves. They also both have access to Mega Evolutions in the post-game, and for Gyarados said Mega gives it access to STAB Crunch.

I am mostly bringing all of this up mostly due to the severe lack of any mention of Let's Go.

I'll look into BDSP too at some point since that plenty of Pokemon that play a lot better in those games than they did in the original Diamond and Pearl, thanks to Fairy Type, Hidden Abilities, and misc. stat buffs given in Gen VI and VII.

 

[DreamPrince]

I’m surprised Yanma is not mentioned anywhere. GSC Yanma is a horrible Pokémon that is outclassed by Ledian of all things, and only exists to be an obnoxious Pokémon to complete your Dex.

But in HGSS, Yanma can actually evolve into Yanmega prior to the Hall of Fame; while rare, Yanmega is fantastic special attacker with an incredible ability. Definitely worth it in HGSS.

 

[mertyville]

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So much changed for the better for Corphish (even thought it might not matter much). With the exp-share, physical special split, early Crunch... there are so much things ORAS gave it since the 3 gens have passed. Also you get Razor Shell at lv32 which helps until you get Waterfall or Crabhammer.

 

[Volt-Ikazuchi]

Incredible thread idea.

The obvious suspects in RBY that lost their high crit rate, and one exception.

I'll name names.

Venusaur losing Razor Leaf as an incredible STAB option was a massive blow to its viability. Losing early Body Slam also crippled its coverage. Secret Power is nice, but the power difference is noticeable.

Persian instantly fell off a cliff without Slash. Still good as an HM Mon in-game because of Pickup tho.

Gyarados got massively nerfed by the special split too.

But the one that truly lost it all was Dugtrio.

No 140BP Slash for coverage, lost its crit rate, Dig nerf, LEVITATE...

Bro got straight pummeled by the nerf bat.

 

[BP]

truly lost it all was Dugtrio.

imagine CB Physical Sludge Bomb Duggy in Fairy Gens. RIP

 

[Basedwell]

Off the top of my head:

• Surskit is borderline impossible to find pre-Norman in the original RSE and quite underwhelming if you somehow do manage to get one since it doesn't have the best learnset, but I caught a bunch of them with the DexNav in ORAS and ended up getting one with Hydro Pump, and it became a one-mon wrecking crew. Obviously many Pokemon benefit from being able to acquire egg moves in the wild, but Surskit is a much more notable case since it's literally a 1% encounter on Route 102 in the original games.
• Charmander is way, way better in FRLG than it is in RBY, partly thanks to Fire Pokemon just generally becoming better since Gen I but mostly since it gets Metal Claw. It can actually take on Brock's Geodude and Onix and take care of wild Geodude in Mt Moon. One small addition to its movepool makes it miles better than it would otherwise be; Charmander is often thought of as the least useful starter in the earlygame but this makes it as good as Bulbasaur and Squirtle from the off.
• Conversely, Cyndaquil becomes a little worse in HGSS since it loses a lot of useful moves it had access to during Johto. I've soloed Johto with Typhlosion many times - it gets a decent array of options and it's very easy to fill four moveslots. But it loses Thunderpunch, Dynamicpunch, and Mud-Slap (and, uh... Fury Cutter) and doesn't get a whole lot back. Focus Punch isn't great in-game, Solarbeam and Brick Break come too late, and Aerial Ace and Rock Tomb have redundant coverage. It gets Shadow Claw but can't learn it until its final stage, which is likely too late for the main boss it's good against (Morty). At least it still has Headbutt and Hidden Power!
• Abra also forfeits a bit of its star power from GSC to HGSS thanks to the loss of the elemental punches. It's still good, of course, but it's left with Focus Blast as its only accessible coverage move until the player beats Morty and can get Shadow Ball and Charge Beam (unless one gets lucky and manages to get Charge Beam in the Dept Store Lottery).

I'm reading through the thread rn and I'm quoting to agree on Typhlosion. Everyone talks about Fire Blast and choice specs, but neither is a terribly appealing tool to use in-game. I have qualms about using Fire Blast competitively too, but the reasoning there is that you're hitting ranges you won't with a more accurate move. And choice specs are useful because you need extra power.

But in-game having a low PP inaccurate move is annoying because you need reliability and quantity. And with choice specs, being reduced to one move can lead to annoyances as well unless you're playing on Switch mode.

Focus Blast has similar problems lol. And due to power creep, a lot of the lower BP moves are less useful. Even if Typhlosion had access to thunder punch it wouldn't mean as much. I'd give my usual rant on the subject but I've done it enough times already.


Anyways to answer the topic:

Butterfree gets an excellent ability, which makes it stand out in Gen 3. Gyarados starts getting overrated allegations in Gen 3 without intimidate, although it was likely better in Gen 1.

Persian loses the crit stuff in Gen 3

Gligar gets a great evolution and can actually learn earthquake

Espeon and Umbreon are more accessible with the Soothe Bell. Getting them at the right level can be a challenge in GSC

A lot of Gen 2 Pokemons got new evolutions in Gen 4

Edit: every pokemon gets worse in HGSS because GSC has a superior art style

None of these are great examples, I'll have to think of more.

 

[Cobalt Empoleon]

Mawile's been mentioned as a success story, thanks to its busted Mega Evolution and its new Fairy typing, but I think you could also frame it as an intergenerational loser, along with Aron and Sableye. All three are victims of the new Granite Cave layout in ORAS, which makes the lower floors inaccessible without a Mach Bike. They're still only available at levels 10-12, but now you can't catch them until your team is likely about Level 20.

Someone intent on using one of these Pokemon can absolutely backtrack and get them caught up pretty quickly, but I suspect a lot of casual players just fill out their team with other mons and don't think to go back to Dewford until much later in the game.

Also, none of them are catchable in another location until you enter the Cave of Origin, by which point most players will already have all the (non-legendary) team members they're interested in catching.

 

[QuentinQuonce]

Mawile's been mentioned as a success story, thanks to its busted Mega Evolution and its new Fairy typing, but I think you could also frame it as an intergenerational loser, along with Aron and Sableye. All three are victims of the new Granite Cave layout in ORAS, which makes the lower floors inaccessible without a Mach Bike. They're still only available at levels 10-12, but now you can't catch them until your team is likely about Level 20.

Someone intent on using one of these Pokemon can absolutely backtrack and get them caught up pretty quickly, but I suspect a lot of casual players just fill out their team with other mons and don't think to go back to Dewford until much later in the game.

Also, none of them are catchable in another location until you enter the Cave of Origin, by which point most players will already have all the (non-legendary) team members they're interested in catching.

At least it's better than Mawile's dreadful availability in Emerald. They made it and Sableye catchable in the same title but... Sableye is available early on while Mawile bafflingly gets confined to Victory Road. One of that game's small number of misses.

 

[IcyMan28]

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Joining in on this conversation to talk about the Marill line’s glow-up, which is just progressively better gen after gen.

It starts off as a super rare encounter in GS with awful stats, rendering it horribly outclassed by nearly every over water-type in the game.

In the transition to Gen 3, it gains the Huge Power ability and a MUCH earlier availability - pre-Roxanne in Emerald and otherwise around the third gym in RS. This makes it a Pokémon with Groudon-level attack; CurlOut and Double Edge by Lv28 are nothing to scoff at and it gets STAB water moves to cover the Rock- and Steel-types that would otherwise trouble it, both of which tend to have low SpD.

Gen 4 gives the Marill line what it’s been lacking, physical water stab. The combination of Water/Normal is otherwise unwallable outside of Shedinja, which no trainers use, and Empoleon which is used by 1, perhaps 2 trainers in the game.

Gen 6 gifts the Marill line with Fairy type, which quickly establishes itself as an elite offensive and defensive typing both alone and in combination with the water type. By ORAS, which I believe is its best showing, Aqua Tail and Play Rough get relocated from the high 40s to the low 20s, making it crazy powerful for at the low low cost of getting it to level 18. It’s a great partner for either Treecko or Torchic and carries it’s weight all the way through the E4 and even competitive play.

It has fallen off a bit in more recent gens due to reduced availability and competition (in competitive formats), but in-game it is a great example of a Pokémon that yields dividends on a very low up front investment.