Metagame BDSP NU (Tier Shifts @ Post #128)

[Trogba Trogba]

Sample team already out of date lol

 

[igiveuponaname]

Homefield Advantage was the last tour to include NU before the RU rises/drops shake up this tier. So now that Homefield is over I wanted to throw around some quick thoughts on the tier before the tier shifts happen. If this post is a bit all over the place, I'm sorry.

With webs having been banned post-BDSPPL, HO has definitely taken a noticeable hit but I still find it to be one of the best playstyles in the tier. The sheer power of threats such as double dance Gligar, SD Qwilfish, Quick Feet Ursaring, and many, many more in a tier whose defensive pieces can run the risk of being overwhelmed easily makes it really good at punishing unprepared teams/players. That being said I don't necessarily find it broken, there are enough ways to prep for HO in the builder which can fit on a wide variety of teams that I don't find it difficult to deal with HO, though I do need to consciously consider it when building.

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I built a good amount of teams between BDSPPL and Homefield and wanted to share the ones I like most/the ones I used during Homefield.


HO team with two suicide leads, one of them being Glalie, who offers the rare Spikes. The main idea was seeing if losing a sweeper/breaker slot in exchange for Spikes was worthwhile, and it kind of is.


Was looking through the builder and saw Lapras had Water Absorb + Freeze Dry which made it a funny Qwilfish check with scarf. Ended up actually building it with Ebelt Typhlosion as the main breaker, Sub SD Leafeon for more anti-HO shenanigans, Gligar/Regi as the backbone, and Skuntank to round the team out.


Weezing Tspikes paired with a bunch of mons who appreciate them wearing down their checks such as DD Whiscash, Kangaskhan, and Scarf Typhlosion. Shiftry offers hazard removal and a switch-in to Waters while providing offensive pressure with NP.


I have like 3 versions of this team but this one is probably the best imo. OTR P2 turns the tables on HO teams and BU Poliwrath can take advantage of the few turns where it's faster than the opposing team to set up or start clicking. Rest of the team offers a defensive backbone and speed control with scarf Typhlosion and Shadow Sneask Dusknoir.


Was planning in bringing this vs Carter if we played each other in Homefield finals but never got to that point. Wanted to try scarf Victreebel and this is how the team ended up coming out. Can't say much about in battle performance since I didn't get the chance to use it.

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Lastly I decided to make a personal VR with quick reasonings for placements included, the placement within tiers doesn't matter at all. Do take this with a grain of salt though since there weren't many NU games played during the tour and the upcoming tier shifts would likely shake this up a decent amount depending on what rises/drops.

S:
S-:
A+:
A:
A-:
B+:
B:
B-:
C+:
C:

Explanations

S
Amazing glue mon with that typing and utility movepool making it one of the defensive cornerstones of the tier. Double Dance sets on HO are also massive threats that need to be respected. Hard to justify not using at times.

S-
Another defensive cornerstone, reliable rocks setter, can check half the tier even if it is prone to being overwhelmed. Just all around good defensive mon.

Best offensive mon in the tier, expert belt sets break everything not named Whiscash or Poliwrath and scarf sets are good speed control with wallbreaking power thanks to Eruption. Power herb sets are good lures for the aforementioned waters too.

A+
Very strong offensive threat since very little can withstand a +2 Qwilfish, typing and Intimidate help facilitate that even further by offering setup opportunities

Even if Ursaring isn't picking up a KO it will at least force uncomfortable amounts of damage against opposing teams making it a great progress maker for any team that packs it. Jolly Quick Feet out-speeding even Scyther makes out-offensing it really only possible with scarfers and super fast mons such as Jolly CB Sneasel which has a big effect on the builder at times imo.

Nothing about Skuntank is particularly great but its combination of traits makes it a super splashable choice on plenty of teams. NP + dual STAB + utility move is probably its best set and its EV spreads are super flexible which I find quite nice.

Specs is still a disgusting breaker when it gets the right Download boost, and with coverage for Normal resists and decent bulk it's just as good as ever. Agility sets are also really good on HO, while OTR might be worth looking into a bit more I think.

A
Another great special wallbreaker whose STAB is even more spammable than P2's but has to contend with having a much worse defensive typing holding it down.

Less bulky compared to Regirock and a Fire neutrality and Ice weakness really bite it in the ass at times but having access to instant recovery is amazing. Its defensive profile is still really good since it can handle Water, Grass, and Ground types better compared to Regirock. Really good at keeping rocks up as well.

Really annoying to deal with 1v1 and/or switch into since it threatens so much with Will-O-Wisp burns or deal a bunch of damage to whatever is in front of it; makes this mon great at leading off turn 1 since nothing is able to outright OHKO it barring Adamant CB Sneasel. Shadow Sneak priority is also good for picking off weakened threats. Mandatory on stall.

Funny case of something being much better in practice than on paper. Good speed tier and coverage goobs most of the tier while STAB Volt Switch lets it pivot out and accumulate chip damage on its checks and bring in something that threatens them out. Hates Whiscash with all its being and wishes it weren't slower than Typhlosion.

A-
Still a good special check and pivot but the tier's more offensive nature as of late makes it harder to justify fitting Lanturn on a team as well as getting the most out of Lanturn while in battle. The loads of Grass types don't help it a lot either.

Good blanket check to most physical attackers while threatening Will-O-Wisp burns on so much of the tier. Haze is great at shutting down set up sweepers like double dance Gligar, SD Qwilfish, and SD Leafeon which makes it a good tool in the fight against HO. Toxic Spikes are also good but can be tricky to keep up with the ubiquity of Poison types like Skuntank and Qwilfish.

Sub SD turns HO suicide leads like Smeargle and Dugtrio into setup fodder while still being useful into non-HO teams since it sets up against mons like bulky waters, most Rocks, and Gligar with ease. I prefer Leech Seed in the fourth slot but Double-Edge is good too.

Very threatening after a boost and Water immunity via Dry Skin is also nice but Focus Blast accuracy is the worst at times

Makes Typhlosion and Electivire cry. RestTalk sets are good at sticking around while annoying stuff with Scald and EQ, while offensive sets can be very threatening after a Dragon Dance boost. Just don't run into any Grass types.

Best Glaceon answer in the tier, also has good utility but is very passive, great pick on balance and fat/stall

Great anti-offense mon with STAB Scrappy Fake Out keeping so many offensive threats honest. Appreciates the webs ban since now it can actually outspeed a lot of the slower threats such as Qwilfish, Skuntank, and Toxicroak and actually check them instead of being nothing but a Fake Out bot.

Hurt from the webs ban but is still a strong HO suicide lead that can consistently start games off strong with a fast Spore. Demands that you have some sort of plan to limit it

B+
Fighting type that can reliably beat Gligar and has good defensive utility thanks to partial Water typing and Water Absorb. Bulk up sets are good into teams that have Cradily as their Grass type or no grass mon at all but falter hard into stuff like Leafeon, Wisp Dusknoir, and Haze Weezing.

Fastest scarfer in the tier and has a good speed tier even without it, but being 4x weak to rocks in a tier with limited hazard removal options is rough, especially when you have to click U-turn a lot

Can be really annoying to switch into if you don't have a Cradily, or a Toxicroak to a lesser extent. Doesn't like being a Water type that's neutral to Fire in a tier dominated by Typhlosion.

Good with both scarf and specs, STAB combo is very good in a tier with no real Steel types, Trick and Healing Wish are also great tools to have for offensive teams

Does the same stuff in NU that Weavile does in OU (great revenge killer/speed control with decent wall breaking power) but placed in a less favourable meta for its talents

B
Good at wallbreaking with Reckless HJK... unless they have Gligar... or Dusknoir... or Weezing... or you end up missing. Can spin if really needed but not really worth it imo.

Can be very threatening and has a wide array of sets to choose from but faces lots of competition from other Grass types + being a Grass that doesn't resist Ground is rough

SD is good into fat although it really hates Poliwrath and Toxicroak, Knock Off is also nice to have

Probably one of the bigger losers from the webs ban imo, no longer out-speeding anything that wasn't scarfed or non-grounded makes dealing with it so much easier now that checking it offensively is a much more viable strategy. Can still very threatening against slower teams and is good at anti-leading HO teams thanks to hail chip.

Can be an alternative to NP + Defog Skuntank with its Grass typing giving it an edge in matchups against Ground, Rock, and Water types but lacks Skuntank's overall better typing and set flexibility

If you were to ask me where the divide between NU and PU would be, I'd probably put it around here.

B-
Good at cleaning up weakened teams with Shell Smash though it is still outsped by scarfers after a boost

Fast Taunt + rocks and priority make it a good suicide lead for HO teams that want the lead advantage against opposing HO teams. Decent as a scarfer too.

CM Unburden can be okay at sweeping but without a boost it's way too weak and without Unburden it's a bit too slow.

This thing is too slow to pose a threat to most teams (Typhlosion outspeeds even max speed timid after a boost and ohkos with Eruption) but it has its matchups and QD + Strength Sap can be kind of annoying

Decent into HO teams as a scarfer thanks to its disgusting bulk, Water immunity for Qwilifsh Aqua Jet, and STAB Freeze Dry + Surf hitting pretty much everything on those sorts of teams for at least neutral. Really bad into balance and stall.

Bad but it's an offensive mon that can answer both Typhlosion and Glaceon with Thick Fat so it gets brownie points

Good offensive profile and a rocker who threatens the daylights out of the two primary hazard removers in the tier but being really slow and frail hinders it a lot

Specs Boomburst is about on par in terms of power with P2's Specs Download Tri Attack and it's much faster but its extreme frailty in conjunction with its rocks weakness and inability to do good damage to Rock and Ghost types holds it back

Cradily kind of took over the whole Rock type with recovery thing but Solrock's typing and Ground immunity give it the edge in some key matchups like Typhlosion, Electivire, and offensive Gligar. Also threatens Will-O-Wisp burns on most of the tier

C+
Very fast suicide lead for HO teams but not much else worth mentioning

Fake Out immunity + Icy Wind + Spikes makes it worth running as a second lead on some HO teams

Magic Guard + Focus Sash alongside good speed and power make it a decent check to certain HO threats, namely Qwilifsh, while also having Knock Off for fatter matchups. Would be better if it had Counter in BDSP or just a higher speed stat for Ursaring.

Rock type for HO teams, slow even at +2

Blanks Gligar's STABs, an Electric type that can threaten Grass types with its secondary STAB, decent speed tier for scarf, and choiced Trick for the bulky mons it blanks so unbelievably hard into. Also rocks weak which isn't ideal

Pretty decent with a good speed tier, respectable power, and good coverage, but being omega cucked by Lanturn, and to a lesser extent, Whiscash and Cradily makes it tough to justify using

Speedy Fire type with okay offenses, two good abilities, and recovery, but struggles to do much without a boost

Having access to Nasty Plot and actual Grass coverage in Energy Ball gives it a niche but without a boost it's really weak and even with one it needs the opposing team to be decently chipped enough to sweep

Great speed tier makes it decent into offense but can blank hard into bulkier builds with its only good tool for them being choiced switcheroo

C
Slow, unremarkable defensively, and passive, but can be role compression for certain teams

Big Swagcargo the funny Weak Armor suicide lead

Would be same rank as Rotom-Fan if Blizzard wasn't 70% accurate

Better special bulk and Ice Beam lets it leverage some matchups better than Solrock but is generally worse overall notably thanks to missing out on Will-O-Wisp

''Funny into fat teams'' -jawabarat and Trogba Trogba, 2024

Fast and has good utility moves but its bulk isnt the best and if wants to make use of Acrobatics it needs to forego Leftovers to get the most out of it

If you're disgustingly weak to Glaceon and P2 you can consider using this, otherwise don't

Electric type with Switcheroo who is otherwise walled by Lanturn and Whiscash where have I heard this before

And that's that, looking forward to what the tier shifts might bring and hoping more people come to enjoy this tier in the future thought it's bdsp so the answer to that is probably no.

 

[igiveuponaname]

New year, NU shifts.

The NU council decided on B+ and B- as the cutoff points for rises and drops respectively based on the latest RU viability rankings. As such the following changes will occur.

Rises:
NUBL -> RU
NUBL -> RU
NUBL -> RU
NUBL -> RU

Drops:
RU -> NU
RU -> NU
RU -> NU
RU -> NU
RU -> NU
RU -> NU
RU -> NU

Brief discussions were held among the council on whether or not any of the remaining NUBL pokemon should be unbanned. It was decided that none of the remaining NUBL pokemon were worth retesting at this point in time.

Tagging Tbolt to implement these changes when possible.

Also I don't believe it has been mentioned anywhere on the forums yet but sleid and I are now part of the NU council.

 

[igiveuponaname]

For those not in the BDSP or RoA servers, we're running a tournament for NU following these recent tier shifts. Sign up if you enjoy the tier or want to try a new tier!

Also new NU tier list maker, includes every NU/PUBL mon as well as major PU mon plus some potential noteworthy ones.

 

[missangelic]

With BDSP NU's post-shifts tour done, I'd like to post my personal VR and some explanations for my rankings!

S:

S EXPLAINED!

Both Gligar and Regirock are must-haves for most teams. Even though the usage stats for tour are pulling from a small pool, both of these Pokemon hardly make a team worse, and their moveset flexibility can easily tailor them to their team's needs. Regirock is a critical blanket check to major threats like Typhlosion, Normal-types, and Glaceon, and Gligar happens to be one of the best checks to Regirock. Together, they tend to form one of the best entry hazard cores in the metagame.

A+:

Top scorers

It shouldn't really be surprising to see a fire-water-grass core near the top of a lower tier metagame. Each of these Pokemon is a great and powerful presence in the tier that drives the rest of the metagame to contend with them.

Leafeon is a great wallbreaker when BDSP NU revolves around Regirock, and it's very capable of beating down other defensive Pokemon like Lanturn, Poliwrath, and Claydol. I find that Leafeon's solid physical bulk is a big help too, and there's a lot of ways to tweak its SD set to your liking.

Poliwrath is similarly incredible at taking advantage of Regirock, Ground-types, and even other Water-types thanks to its coverage from Earthquake. Having a Water-type on most teams is a necessity because of Typhlosion's presence, and Poliwrath distinguishes itself with well-rounded bulk, power, and flexibility.

Typhlosion was hard not to rank in S, but I don't think it's a perfect fit for most teams. It's certainly the most significant offensive threat to consider though. Defensively, the only ways to really answer Typhlosion are to have a Regirock, a Water-type, and a Thick Fat Pokemon, and Typhlosion can still find its way around many of these "checks" thanks to its coverage. It might be surprising to see Typhlosion outperforming Charizard, but lacking a 4x Rock weakness sets it ahead.

A:

Ayyyy

Everything in this rank feels like something that's more or less going to fill necessary gaps on teams, especially if you're not running something in S or A+.

Claydol's more well-rounded bulk than Gligar and lack of a 4x Ice weakness make it less scared of special attackers. However, Gligar clinches S for its access to reliable recovery.

Glaceon is a standout special wallbreaker that preys on the metagame Typhlosion cultivates, threatening bulky Water-types with its powerful STAB Freeze-Dry. It's also a beneficiary of the general shape of the tier, where there are few Ice-resistant Pokemon without falling back on Thick Fat users. Aggron isn't especially specially bulky, Typhlosion generally isn't switching into most attacks, and Grumpig is threatened by Shadow Ball.

Lanturn is a momentum machine and one of the best stop-gaps to Typhlosion in the early-game. Checking opposing Water-types and Magneton is another point in its favor, even if it has to be wary of Earthquake from Poliwrath, Typhlosion, and Electivire. Still, even just landing a paralysis or burn while deterring free Volt Switch clicks means Lanturn is usually bringing some value to its team.
Porygon2 is a menace if you can rig the Download boost and Tri Attack status fishing just right, and it's got ample special bulk for fighting back against other special attackers. Porygon2 users should be wary that defensive Trace has some caveats and flaws, such as Typhlosion running Blaze and Focus Blast or Lanturn having the opportunity to fish for status right back against Porygon2. Porygon2 also sees some competition with Miltank defensively, which has a much better Speed tier and access to Heal Bell.

Spikes make Qwilfish stand out as a utility Pokemon in a tier that relies on grounded defensive Pokemon such as Regirock, Poliwrath, and Lanturn. This makes Qwilfish one of the best supports for wallbreakers like Typhlosion, Glaceon, Magneton, Ursaring, and Kangaskhan. On top of that, Qwilfish isn't a slouch offensively or defensively. Threatening Gligar and Claydol with Water-type moves is great for a hazard setter, while Aqua Jet can pick off weakened Typhlosion and Ninetales. Qwilfish's typing is extremely annoying to Floatzel too. Unfortunately, Qwilfish's overall bulk is lacking. Intimidate doesn't work against Sneasel, Kangaskhan, and Sneasel. Like Lanturn, Qwilfish is threatened by many Pokemon it would want to check running Earthquake for coverage. However, I do think Qwilfish has a lot of potential, as I think Swords Dance sets can be pretty threatening wallbreakers.

Skuntank does a great job of keeping Grass- and Psychic-types in the tier more contained than they would otherwise be. Regirock, Gligar, and Poliwrath can be tough obstacles, but Nasty Plot and physically offensive sets can both distinguish themselves as good offensive threats and stallbreakers.

A-:

Tarnished Champions

Most Pokemon in this rank are ones I would say are still excellent, but they have some flaws that hold them back. In particular, I don't think they always make a team better with their additions.

Bellossom is a threat thanks to Quiver Dance. Leafeon, Claydol, Poliwrath, Lanturn, Regirock, and Gligar can quickly become setup fodder for Bellossom if they're not careful, and teams without a Poison-type are in major trouble if Bellossom gets a boost. Strength Sap and Sleep Powder are such broken clicks too. Miltank is hard-pressed to fit Sap Sipper when Thick Fat is so useful for answering Typhlosion and Glaceon. The lack of Toxic distribution is majorly to Bellossom's benefit.

Kangaskhan didn't pop up a ton in tour from what I saw, but it's a major lurking threat in spite of Regirock's hold on the tier. Kangaskhan's good synergies with Qwilfish and Spikes make it a big standout as a physical attacker. Most other Normal-resistant Pokemon in the tier are flawed in some way, with Aggron and Magneton having 4x weaknesses, so Kangaskhan is a major threat.

Magneton felt so good when I used it, and it thrives when Lanturn isn't in the picture. Analytic makes it crazy powerful, and I don't doubt that it can pull off some annoying Magnet Pull set to KO Aggron or get it low for Glaceon, Porygon2, and Psychic-types. Magneton's Rock resistance is a nice perk that sets it apart from Typhlosion and Glaceon, which tend to be dependent on entry hazard removers to function to last long after the early-game.

Toxicroak is a nasty opportunist that preys on the state of the metagame, taking advantage of Water-types and Regirock that neglect to run Earthquake. Its positive matchups against Water- and Grass-types like Qwilfish and Leafeon can't be ignored when this tier often trends to teams looking like Regirock + Gligar + Typhlosion + Water + Grass. Fighting is great offensive coverage against most defensive Pokemon in the tier, but Ground-types like Gligar and Claydol are annoying, common, and good.

Ursaring is a serious threat thanks to Quick Feet, and its massive power and great coverage threaten a tier that has few good Normal-resistant Pokemon. Regirock is really what holds Ursaring back from being entirely broken, but most Scarf users can finish it off thanks to the recoil it takes from Toxic and hazards. Flame Orb sets could be really deadly wallbreakers, and I wouldn't be surprised if it could pull off a Bulk Up set given how few Ghost-types are around.

Weezing's physical bulk is hard to match by anything besides Regirock, and it has much better matchups against Fighting-types and physically offensive Skuntank. Levitate + Poison is Weezing's classic distinguishing combination. Normal-types like Porygon2 and Miltank also love having Weezing around for its good matchups against Fighting-types. However, it's kind of passive.

B Ranks
B+:

The Queen Bees

This is more of a rank for Pokemon that I think have good qualities but are less dominant in the metagame, as they're more anti-meta and respond to the trends set by the top Pokemon.

Aurora Veil is the last bastion of cheese in BDSP NU, and the setup opportunities provided by it can open up frailer sweepers. Abomasnow's coverage and hail chip means that Magneton and Typhlosion don't get to safely switch around it, and its unorthodox defensive typing is still handy against Water-types like Lanturn, Lapras, and Whiscash. The Rock weakness is the biggest downside, but Ice Shard's utility against Gligar, Leafeon, and more is hard to ignore.

Aggron struggles with Regirock around as competition, but its Steel typing is genuinely handy against Glaceon, Psychic-types, and Toxic Spikes. It brings a lot to the table offensively with its strong Head Smash, but 4x Ground and Fighting weaknesses can leave it very vulnerable to coverage from Typhlosion, Ursaring, Kangaskhan, and others.

Dusknoir is the most real a Ghost-type can be in the tier, besides maybe Drifblim. Kangaskhan doesn't have a problem touching it, and Ursaring can hit Dusknoir with Crunch or Earthquake, but Dusknoir's superior coverage to Drifblim and better bulk than Misdreavus keeps it ahead of them. Dusknoir's best role is checking Fighting-types like Toxicroak and Hitmonlee for its Rock- and Normal-type teammates. Blocking spin from Claydol, Sandslash, and Hitmonlee is a nice perk too.

Electivire distinguishes itself from other Electric-types by actually having good coverage moves for the two best Electric-immune Pokmeon in the tier: Gligar and Lanturn. The downside is that Electivire is only tying Leafeon in Speed, but it's still one of the best fast Choice Scarf users in the tier. Electivire is both rewarding to people who can predict really well with its coverage while still supporting you if you need to play it safe early- to mid-game with Volt Switch. Strong wallbreakers like Typhlosion, Glaceon, Ursaring, and Kangaskhan also thrive when they can get a free switch. It's just unfortunate that Electivire doesn't bring much defensive utility and relies on Wild Charge for STAB compared to Magneton and other Electric-types.

Floatzel intrigues me as an offensive Pokemon that threatens Regirock and Gligar and is faster than Typhlosion and Quick Feet Ursaring. It's just so unfortunate that Floatzel flops against the bulky Water-types that Typhlosion pushes onto most teams. Aqua Jet is genuinely neat priority against Scarf Typhlosion variants, but it doesn't have as much use outside of that. Great offensive threat on paper, but probably one of the bigger momentum sinks.

Thick Fat and Grumpig's Fighting resistance make it a rare Pokemon that can withstand both of Typhlosion's Eruption and Focus Blast. It's also capable of handling Ice-type moves, but it has to be wary of Glaceon's Shadow Ball.

Hitmonlee's superior Speed and access to Rapid Spin help it find a niche when Poliwrath tends to offer a lot more defensive utility. Unburden sets with Close Combat + White Herb have potential against opponents lacking a good Ghost- or Poison-type, and Hitmonlee is faster than every Choice Scarf user after an Unburden boost. Even Limber has situational use for taking advantage of Porygon2 and Thunder Wave Regirock, though I don't think it's as good.

Kadabra is the second of the three Psychic-types I put in this subrank, and it's distinguished for Magic Guard + Focus Sash giving it some really good emergency value against offensive teams, even if it lacks Counter. Life Orb sets are pretty strong and fast too, as only a few relevant Pokemon outspeed Typhlosion. There are few good Steel- or Dark-types in the tier, much to Kadabra's benefit, but Skuntank is a tough presence.

Mr. Mime's access to Healing Wish is a big boon for teams that rely on Typhlosion and Glaceon, but it's just good utility in general. Mr. Mime even kept its access to additional utility like Trick, Thunder Wave, dual screens, and Encore, so it's hardly lacking support options.
Ninetales might seem like a tight squeeze when Typhlosion is such a dominant Fire-type, but its Grass-type coverage is great for preying on the Water- and Rock-types Typhlosion forces into the metagame.

B:

B-lieve it!

This is about the last stop for things I perceive as being BDSP NU. They're not bad by any means, but they have a lot of traits working against them, or I don't think they'll age well. That, or they might emerge as being even better.

Drifblim is something I'm surprised I didn't see more of for its access to some of the most defining support moves in the game between Defog, Strength Sap, Thunder Wave, and Will-O-Wisp. It's got some pretty positive matchups against physical attackers and hazard setters too, including Leafeon, Gligar, Swords Dance Toxicroak, and Kangaskhan.


Glalie's Ice typing makes it an anti-meta threat against the most prevalent entry hazard remover, Gligar. In addition, Spikes are fantastic for supporting Typhlosion, Normal-types, and many other offensive threats. Glalie's good Speed, access to Taunt and Explosion, and the limited amount of Ice-resistant Pokemon in the tier let it carve a good niche.

Lapras sees some fair competition from Glaceon for its much more substantial power. Lapras still distinguishes itself as a special attacker thanks to its secondary Water-type coverage to nail Regirock, Aggron, and Ninetales. The extra defensive utility of its Water typing and Water Absorb help it come in a bit more independently than Glaceon, but its poor Speed and middling power don't do it major favors.

Ludicolo has an unorthodox but neat defensive typing in tandem with its well-rounded bulk, giving it some leeway against special attackers like Typhlosion and Lanturn, and Leech Seed and Scald are punishing moves to deal with. Ludicolo also has manual rain sets as a possibility, and there are plenty of special wallbreakers that can open it up to sweep.

Piloswine has neat qualities thanks to Thick Fat helping against Typhlosion and Glaceon. Most entry hazard removers in the tier are Ground-types, making Piloswine pretty offensively potent for a setter. It also helps that its STAB moves threaten the two best Pokemon in the tier. Ice Shard is nice for compensating for its poor Speed and finishing off Grass-type setup sweepers like Leafeon and Bellossom. Still, Piloswine's Ice typing introduces some major weaknesses that leave it vulnerable to Focus Blast and Magneton.

Sandslash lacks Gligar's longevity as a hazard remover, U-turn for momentum, and a poison immunity for dealing with Toxic Spikes. Still, many teams, including Spikes teams, can appreciate a hazard remover that doesn't clear their own hazards. Glaceon, Typhlosion, and Normal-types in particular appreciate this quality.

Scyther may have greater Speed than most relevant Pokemon in the metagame, but its 4x Rock weakness is a major liability, so it's not especially long-lasting as an offensive pivot. The most common remover, Gligar, stacks an Ice weakness with Scyther as well. In addition, Regirock is very common, and other physical walls like Weezing don't make Scyther's day much better. It's pretty easy to revenge kill with a fast Choice Scarf user after Stealth Rock damage. Jolly Quick Feet Ursaring is also faster than Scyther. I'm not sure if I'm missing something, but Scyther just seems like a big victim of the way the metagame shakes out right now.

Smeargle is really cute as a dedicated entry hazard lead, but I think it will be eventually crept out by Glalie for its superior Speed and better offensive capabilities.

Sneasel might boast some of the best natural Speed in the tier, but it's relying on some weaker moves while packing a Rock weakness and little in the way of defensive utility. Poliwrath, Qwilfish, Regirock, and Weezing being what they are in this tier is not to Sneasel's benefit.
Victreebel is neat for its mixture of offensive and defensive value against top Pokemon like Leafeon, Regirock, and Poliwrath. Strength Sap and Sleep Powder are both broken, and Victreebel kept its access to them and other good moves like Knock Off, Encore, and Stun Spore too. Victreebel's mixed offenses keep it even more unpredictable, as it's got good physical and special STAB moves.

Whiscash might go on fraudwatch later, as it's really passive without the ability to set up entry hazards. Dragon Dance sets are really weak without a boost, still slower than even slow Choice Scarf users after a boost, and are food for Grass-types like Leafeon and Bellossom. Still, Water / Ground is a really good typing to deal with and pressure top Pokemon like Gligar, Regirock, Typhlosion, Lanturn, Qwilfish, and Magneton.

B-:

It's okay, but...

A lot of the Pokemon from here and below are not Pokemon I would say are "BDSP NU", even from the small slice of experience I got from tour. Some of this is due to them not popping up in tour, even though I think a lot of them have room to grow. Some of these are Pokemon that did pop up though, and I think some of them are just generally overshadowed or victimized by the shape of the metagame and its major threats.

I was surprised no one tried out Altaria in tour. Even if it's lacking a lot of the moves it would otherwise distinguish itself with (seriously, why did it lose Defog, Dragon Dance, and Heal Bell?), Altaria has an amazing defensive typing against top threats like Poliwrath, Leafeon, and Typhlosion on top of their common coverage moves. Haze inhibits sweepers like Bellossom from getting out of control too, and Altaria even has coverage to make sure that it's not entirely passive against the foes it's trying to check.

Charizard, like I mentioned in Typhlosion's section, really suffers from the 4x Rock weakness. Losing Hurricane didn't help either. I do think there is room for Charizard against Grass-types like Leafeon and Bellossom as well as Fighting-types like Toxicroak and Hitmonlee, but many of these Pokemon are still threatened by Typhlosion anyway. Needing to click Roost is a momentum sink, and no one is regularly using Altaria to justify Dragon Pulse. Dragon Dance sets will outspeed most Choice Scarf users, but they have to contend with Stealth Rock damage, Flare Blitz recoil, and the need to spend a turn setting up. Belly Drum sets seem like gimmicks with that in consideration.

Golem might look pretty strained in a tier that runs on Regirock and Gligar, but Sturdy + Protect and STAB EQ give it an extra edge. Sturdy's utility is neat in early- and late-game situations against offensive threats like Typhlosion and Quick Feet Ursaring.

Gorebyss has broken Shell Smash and Psychic coverage against Poliwrath and Qwilfish. Choice Scarf users like Electivire and bulky Water-types like Lanturn and Lapras are major hurdles, but there aren't many Pokemon that outspeed Gorebyss at +2.

Granbull's Fairy typing is a rare perk in the tier, but it doesn't have a ton of relevance when there's not major Dragon-types. Toxicroak doesn't care, even if Hitmonlee and Poliwrath are annoyed by Granbull. Intimidate doesn't even function against Kangaskhan and Sneasel because of their abilities. 45 Speed is really poor, and Regirock, Weezing, and Gligar are more competent physical walls.

Honchkrow might be strong on paper, but it contends with the presences of Regirock, Magneton, and Aggron. 70 Speed is really middling for a wallbreaker that's got as many weaknesses as Honchkrow, and it hemorrhages itself between Stealth Rock damage and Brave Bird recoil. Sucker Punch can mitigate some of Honchkrow's Speed issue, but this can make it more prediction-reliant. Night Slash isn't exactly strong either.

Jolteon is another example of a ladder Pokemon making its slow descent through BDSP tiers. Being an Electric-type with limited coverage for Electric-immune Pokemon like Gligar, Lanturn, and Piloswine is just a bad look overall, and Jolteon doesn't hit Grass-types particularly hard either. 130 Speed might be good on paper, but Jolteon's going to end up losing you momentum because of how badly some of its clicks can turn out. It also doesn't bring much in the way of defensive utility.

Jumpluff's STAB Acrobatics, Infiltrator, fast Encore, broken Strength Sap and Sleep Powder access, and opportunity to use U-turn make it a support Pokemon with a huge amount of potential. 110 is a really good Speed tier for BDSP NU, getting the jump on Typhlosion, Leafeon, and Quick Feet Ursaluna.

Kingler would appreciate if Lanturn, Poliwrath, and Toxicroak weren't here, but that's not the BDSP NU it's in. Needing to set up Agility to mitigate Kingler's bad Speed is a lot of pressure, while Qwilfish and Toxicroak pack a lot more defensive utility and access to priority.

Marowak is another gem in the rough that I think has some neat potential as a wallbreaker against defensive cores relying on Regirock, Lanturn, Aggron, and Qwilfish. 45 Speed is pretty bad, but there are paralysis spreaders like Regirock, Lanturn, and Qwilfish to help it out.

Monferno has a neat place as an entry hazard lead, and I can maybe see an argument for Choice Scarf sets, but it's frail and pretty limited.

Muk didn't get to pop up in tour, but I think it has a lot of potential when Leafeon and many special attackers are such major forces in the tier. The limited distribution works in Muk's favor and enables it to potentially run Poison Touch sets to fish against Regirock. Shadow Sneak helps against the fast and physically frail Psychic-types in the tier. SubPunch sets could also stick it to Regirock and Aggron hard, though Muk already has Brick Break. This seems a little underrated and underexplored.

Rapidash's absence surprises me as a Pokemon that has better Speed than Typhlosion, Qwilfish, and Leafeon. It still has Ground coverage thanks to High Horsepower, and it possesses Flash Fire, Will-O-Wisp, Swords Dance, Low Kick, and Morning Sun to boot. I think it has a lot of potential, but I didn't see it in action.

On-paper, Solrock is a Rock-type that isn't weak to Fighting and Ground. Its reliable recovery is another perk it has over Regirock, and Levitate's protection from Spikes helps keep it from being worn down. Still, Solrock's underwhelming stats and additional weaknesses to Dark, Ghost, and Bug don't help it. Lum and Substitute Leafeon can still set up in its face, Ursaring can run Crunch, and Typhlosion is likely to still blast past it with Eruption.

Tangela's absence from tour was another surprise to me. A Regenerator Grass-type has a lot of potential in a tier with Gligar, Regirock, Leafeon, and Poliwrath toward the top. It's retained all its good clicks of broken Sleep Powder, Knock Off, and Leech Seed, and it's not lacking power.

C Ranks
C+:

Surplus of C Plus

This is another pretty big subrank, but there's a lot of Pokemon that I think efficiently do one or two things and not much else, or a lot of Pokemon that have neat qualities but generally remain overshadowed.

Cacturne's access to Spikes is genuinely cool, but its typing gives it so many weaknesses that it's hard-pressed to really set up Spikes against anything but Choice item users. That 4x Bug weakness does no favors against Gligar.

Camerupt's unconventional Fire / Ground typing affords it neat defensive utility against Magneton, and Solid Rock mitigates the sting of Earthquake from Electivire and Typhlosion. However, Camerupt's lack of recovery, bad Speed, average bulk, and 4x Water weakness are big flaws. As a hazard setter, it doesn't have secure matchups against Ground-type removers.

Chatot sure has STAB Boomburst and workable Special Attack and Speed, but Boomburst's coverage is a little underwhelming against Regirock and other Rock-types. The opportunities of special wallbreakers like Typhlosion and Glaceon have to do super effective damage make them a lot more threatening. Boomburst going through Substitute can be handy against users like Leafeon and Poliwrath.

Dugtrio has amazing Speed, Stealth Rock, and the choice of Final Gambit or Memento to be an effective and efficient hyper offensive entry hazard lead. Techs like Bulldoze and Rock Tomb can further support Dugtrio's teammates.

Golduck is one of the strongest specially offensive Water-types in the tier, and it has Psychic coverage for Poliwrath and Qwilfish. Calm Mind sets could have potential, but Golduck's issues come down to its 4MSS and good-but-not-great stats. It's not super strong without a boost, it's not super fast without a Choice Scarf, and it's not very bulky. Leafeon, Lanturn, and Electivire are major issues.

Magcargo is a neat entry hazard lead, but it doesn't match up well against most hazard removers, and it's slow if it can't proc a Weak Armor boost.

Manectric's biggest flaw is being an Electric-type whose coverage is bad against Lanturn. Gligar, Claydol, and Sandslash being the entry hazard removers of the tier doesn't help its case, and Piloswine isn't even weak to Flamethrower. It's nice that it has a Speed tier better than Typhlosion, Leafeon, and Kangaskhan, but it's a little underwhelming that it's still slower than Quick Feet Ursaring and brings no defensive utility besides an Electric immunity.

Misdreavus, like Drifblim, can troll several Ground-types, notably the entry hazard removers. Unlike Drifblim, Misdreavus has some offensive presence with Nasty Plot and Dazzling Gleam, and it's just faster than Skuntank.

It's neat that Pinsir is a hazard setter that isn't weak to Ground, and Swords Dance and Choice item Moxie sets could work, but it didn't pop out in tour. 85 Speed is good but not on the level of Kangaskhan, Typhlosion, and Quick Feet Ursaring, which is a shame. Choice sets are Rock-weak and look prediction-reliant.

Raichu might have great Speed and colorful coverage for Lanturn and Ground-types, but it's not so strong against Grass-types. I think it has good potential though, especially with Encore and Nasty Plot.

Rhydon didn't show up in tour, which is a shame, as it has some sick coverage from Megahorn against Claydol and Grass-types, Avalanche and Ice Fang for Gligar, and the potential for double dance sets.

Rotom-Fan has some of the worst coverage of relevant Electric-types in the tier besides its freezer cousin and Jolteon. Will-O-Wisp is handy, and it does have more utility from Pain Split, but poor matchups against Lanturn and Magneton make it a liability.

Rotom-Frost would stand out a lot more as an Electric-type with great coverage if it was in a tier that didn't have Lanturn, Whiscash, and Piloswine. Its Rock weakness is a pain, and the unreliability of Blizzard compared to Glaceon's Freeze-Dry is a major downside. Electric-types like Magneton, Electivire, and Lanturn rock much better coverage overall.

Shiftry suffers from similar problems to Cacturne in spite of some better Speed. Leafeon's better bulk, defensive typing, and Speed put it ahead of Shiftry, and that's before considering other SD users like Qwilish and Toxicroak.

C:

C-ing is believing

Self-explanatory by it being at the bottom, but I see this rank as the last one for anything to have a relevant presence in the tier. I think this tier is underexplored, but I would be really surprised if any of these Pokemon meaningfully took off without major changes to the tierlist.

I think Arbok has potential for Coil and Intimidate, which lets it take advantage of Leafeon and ideally helps it better beat down Ground- and Rock-types.

Substitute Articuno with Freeze-Dry and Hurricane could be extremely obnoxious against teams lacking a Rock-type or that can't hit their Rock-type moves. Gligar and Claydol can enable Articuno to find these setup opportunities. Articuno's bad defensive typing and 4x Rock weakness are major downsides though.

Butterfree possesses the wholly broken combination of Quiver Dance and Sleep Powder, and it has access to Tinted Lens so it only needs Bug Buzz.

Ditto struggles a bit with the state of setup sweepers in the tier not being super favorable. Substitute Leafeon, Quiver Dance Bellossom, and Unburden Hitmonlee aren't easy to capitalize on.

Dodrio sounds cool on paper for its superior Speed to Typhlosion, Leafeon, and Scyther... until you realize that it doesn't have coverage for Rock- and Steel-types. Outclassed by Kangaskhan, Ursaring, and other Swords Dance users.

Lumineon differentiates itself from other hazard removers with Scald, U-turn, and better matchups against Water-types. Still, its bad stats and lack of recovery are letdowns.

Lunatone has potential for double dance sets, using its similar defensive qualities to Solrock as setup opportunities. Unfortunately, it doesn't have Meteor Beam to get the ball rolling.

Masquerain has Intimidate to generate setup opportunities that Butterfree might not get otherwise, and its coverage helps it punch through Regirock.

Noctowl has STAB Hurricane, Tinted Lens, Nasty Plot, and Agility, but this looks to be pretty inconsistent, even if it can find setup opportunities against Grass-, Ghost-, and Ground-types.

Probopass is outclassed by Regirock and Aggron for the most part, but it does boast neat qualities like IronPress and slow Volt Switch, even if most Ground-types easily sit on it.

Pelipper has some interesting potential for its defensive qualities: resisting Fire and Fighting is not irrelevant when Typhlosion runs the tier. Scald, U-turn, and Roost are great buttons.

Rampardos looks janky, but Sheer Force helps its coverage, with Zen Headbutt smashing Poliwrath and Crunch chewing through Claydol.

Regice is mostly outclassed by Glaceon, but it does have Rock Polish. Regice even takes advantage of other Ice-types as it sets up. Unfortunately, lacking Freeze-Dry is a major liability when Lanturn is so good. Needing Focus Blast for Piloswine is a pain, especially if you want to fit something like Charge Beam.

Relicanth is another in the list of "I bet someone could try to set up and sweep with this". Solid physical bulk and a 4x Fire resistance can help it find opportunities. Unfortunately, Poliwrath, Leafeon, and Toxicroak all being major presences is not good for Relicanth.

Vigoroth intrigues me for its good Speed tier and access to Bulk Up, Slack Off, and Taunt, but it looks mostly outclassed by Kangaskhan and Ursaring.

I think there's maybe some Pokemon that went UR that could have potential. The format is pretty underexplored, and the centralization of certain options like Typhlosion, Regirock, and Gligar really opens up certain Pokemon to take advantage. Don't take this as gospel basically! I'm sure it will also become very dated after more play and eventual tier shifts as BDSP updates come.

Thanks for reading! Playing in BDSP NU tour was really fun, and I think BDSP as a whole is a pretty underrated format, so I hope more people join in the future!

 

[igiveuponaname]

We have an official viability rankings for BDSP NU with the recent additions to the tier! Thank you very much to demirab1, missangelic, and Zpice, for submitting their VRs alongside sleid and I for this slate.

Full voting slate can be found here for those interested.

 

[igiveuponaname]

BDSPPL Team Dump woohoo

Week 1 vs Emre Mor 9


Starting off the tournament and the only thing I can figure out about my opponent is that they managed the winning NUPL team, so they must be a solid player. If nothing else I've got the tier knowledge to back me up. I decided to build something simple that could cover most matchups, since I wasn't entirely sure what Emre Mor liked to use; Kangaskhan + Victreebel was my starting core because they covered the offense matchup and fat matchup, respectively. Kangaskhan often invites in Normal resists like Regirock in, which gives Victreebel a free double switch in to wreak havoc with Life Orb Leaf Storm. Power Whip was the secondary Grass move in order to target Cradily that could otherwise stomach some of Victreebel's moves as well as have a backup Grass option when at -2. Typhlosion is the speed control option that kinda fits onto most teams just fine and acts as the team's sole Ice resist. It also benefits from Victreebel breaking past Rock and Water types that would otherwise stifle it. I added Claydol and Regirock for the hazard game as well as their general good defensive utility (Electric/Ground immune + HO Gligar check and Normal resist + Typhlosion/Glaceon check). The last slot was initially Scarf Mr. Mime, with the idea of double Scarf so Mime could Trick it away to cripple something while still having speed control on top of Healing Wish giving my offensive guys a second life. However, I found that the team was way too weak to Whiscash, especially the Dragon Dance variant, with the only way to beat it at +1 being trading Kangaskhan for it, which could falter if it had taken any damage prior or if the Cash was behind a sub. I tried some other options, like Energy Ball over Hwish on Mime, but it still left the team flimsy defensively against Whiscash. Eventually I ended up swapping out Mr. Mime for Dusknoir, which could answer Whiscash well and gave the team more bulk to fall back on against a variety of threats (too many to list out so I won't). Without Mime I swapped out Victreebel's fourth move for Synthesis for longevity (tbh I forget what it originally was) and the team came together.

I don't want to talk about the game.

Week 2 vs Be1costa


Another guy who I know is involved with real NU stuff but who I have no clue what they like to use rip. I didn't have much info to work off of so I just decided to run whatever I felt like running tbh. Electivire is really good and I also knew it would get like no usage during the tour (and I was right) so I figured might as well give it some time to shine because it's fuckin awesome. Basic Expert Belt set, breaks defensive cores with little issue and pivots out against checks like Weezing and Dusknoir before they can do stuff to it. Obviously it needs a Grass type alongside it because Whiscash just walls it forever, there are plenty of options to choose from but I chose Abomasnow partially for the same reasons I chose Electivire in the first place; it's a good breaker and likely wouldn't get much use in the tour (and I was right again) so why not show it off. Altaria was my next choice because it provided an insane amount of defensive utility, being able to counter Typhlosion and Poliwrath, check most Grass and Poison types in tier, and provide a decent pivot into bulkier foes like Dusknoir/Weezing/Gligar/Whiscash that could otherwise be annoying to switch into. Roar was chosen to deal with setup and punished switches when hazards are up, while Hurricane + EQ hit most of what Altaria wants to hit. EV Spread lives +2 Qwilfish PJab from full and +2 Toxicroak Sludge Bomb after rocks as well as outspeeds Adamant Aggron. Team was rather weak to Ice and I already had an amazing Typhlosion answer so I ran Aggron as my Normal resist and Stealth Rock setter, it also checks Fairies and Psychics that could otherwise be annoying to deal with. An Impish Nature even without any Defense EVs lets Aggron live Ursaring CC from full as well as stuff like Electivire EQ/Cross Chop after rocks. Team needed hazard removal and was, ironically, weak to Electivire so I elected to run Claydol as my removal again, since it is pretty reliable into Electivire, blanking 3 of its move and avoiding the 2HKO from Ice Punch. I wanted speed control in my last slot, but I also wanted more defensive utility, namely a Water-type so Altaria didn't have to bear the entire weight of checking Typhlosion. Unfortunately all the Water-types are rather poor Scarfers, and although I do like Lapras as a Scarfer, the team was solid enough into HO and that's the main reason to run it imo. I ended up taking another look at Poliwrath though, it provided a good enough speed tier with solid defensive utility and power behind it. I tried it out with a Scarf and it worked really well! STABs + EQ hit everything it needs to hit, and Encore, though really just a filler slot, has its uses in shutting down slower setup/defensive mons. Water Absorb also meant it was a speed control option that Qwilfish couldn't try and stifle with Aqua Jet, and of course the typing is just as useful as ever. I liked using this team quite a bit.

Week 3 vs Lyra


At this point in the tournament nobody had yet used Porygon2 for whatever reason so I made it my goal to bring one and win with it no matter what, didn't give any shit about the scout. Standard Choice Specs set that I paired with SD Leafeon, which threatens Rock-types, Water-types, and SpDef walls while having useful defensive utility with its typing and physical bulk as well as Synthesis recovery. CB Sneasel is the team's fast mon that both takes advantage of the former two breaking down defensive cores to clean up late-game as well as being able to revenge kill anything that isn't a Choice Scarf user with ease. It also invites in physical walls for P2 to get a free Download boost against on the double. Gligar + Regirock is the standard defensive hazard core, not much to say here. Lanturn was the last mon because I wanted an extra check to Typhlosion as well as a way to actually deal with boosted Qwilfish, pivot support for P2/Sneasel was a bonus.

Going to talk about it here but I think the old more SpDef-oriented spreads on Lanturn are still fine but a bit outdated; max Defense Bold with 60 HP and the rest into SpDef is what I think is the best general Lanturn spread currently. With it Lanturn is able to live +2 Qwilfish PJab after rocks guaranteed, it takes 43% max from Ebelt Typhlosion EQ, so it isn't 2HKOed on the switch even with rocks up, it avoids the 2HKO from Adamant Life Orb Honchkrow Night Slash with rocks up, and it still has just enough EVs to go into SpDef to avoid giving P2 the SpAtk Download boost by a single point. It really added up perfectly. Special attackers that Lanturn would soft check are still more or less the same despite the lower special bulk, at most it takes 1-3% more, which isn't back breaking in most cases. It also just lets Lanturn take on a lot more shit like various physical attacks, which lets it act much better as the general sponge it was always meant to be.

Week 4 vs A Welcome Guest


Slugma's scout was full of HO which didn't surprise me considering Baddy was the manager and pushed HO hard last year and still felt strongly about it being good after the tiering changes. So of course my Cteaming ass went hard into the anti-HO angle when building. DD Whiscash, Foul Play + Taunt Skuntank, Abomasnow, Focus Sash Kadabra, the whole nine yards. Honestly I'm not a big fan of this team, partially because of how blatantly cteam-y it is, though I do like a lot of the ideas on it and the six itself is more or less fine I feel.

Week 5 vs Incognition (Initial rejected team)


I wanted to make a more balanced team just cuz this week, I hadn't really used one yet and there were mons that I liked that fit well onto it. Miltank/Ludicolo/Weezing was my starting point because they synergize well together and they were the mons in question that I liked and wanted to use at some point during the tournament. Miltank provides a solid check to various special attackers, most notably Typhlosion and Glaceon, and it can set Stealth Rock and provide cleric support with Heal Bell. Ludicolo is a general check to a variety of mons but mainly Waters and Grounds, it forces loads of easy progress with Knock + Leech Seed + Scald, which is really only blocked long-term by Cradily and Bellossom. Weezing is the general physical wall and anti-setup mon with Haze, mainly it stops stuff like HO Gligar, Qwilfish, Leafeon, Bellossom, Whiscash, Poliwrath, etc. from getting out of hand. Both appreciate Miltank's special walling capabilities. SpDef Gligar covers Poisons and Fighters while providing Defog support and pushing progress with Knock Off. Regirock is mainly the team's Normal resist while still checking all the other shit it helps check; I ran a RestTalk set on this team because of the slower pace meaning Regirock would have longevity issues if it stuck with just Protect + Drain Punch in longer matches, Heal Bell support also helps justify this I find. Despite not having any Defense investment I ran Impish as its nature because it lets Regirock live a +2 Close Combat from Ursaring after Stealth Rock and hit it with a hefty Drain Punch, the lower special bulk is a bit unfortunate but most of the stuff Regirock is tasked with handling still has issues despite it. Scarf Poliwrath shows up again because I wanted speed control in case an offensive threat got out of hand, and I wanted the speed control in question to have good defensive utility. I liked this team and was really looking forward to pulling up with it this week.


And then Tremble Before Immense (turn)Count 106 minute-long game and paysa happened.

Week 5 vs Incognition (actual team)


I built this day of. I didn't want it to be able to play long drawn out games because I legitimately felt bad after what had happened the day before. HO wasn't something I felt like trying to figure out what with its disappointing performance so far in the tour so I kept it simple with Normal spam with Specs P2 and Quick Feet Ursaring. I decided to bulk this P2 out a bit in order to let it trade better against the many faster threats in the tier while still letting it outspeed uninvested Lanturn, which is an arbitrary benchmark to be honest. Leafeon for a fast attacker that can threaten Rocks/Grounds/Waters all that sort of stuff and has good defensive utility to boot, though I swapped it to Lum at the last second before the game started in case of opposing Dusknoir. SpDef Gligar to check fighters and Defog, Aggron to set Rocks and check opposing Normals/Psychics/Ices/Fairies, and Scarf Poliwrath for speed control with good defensive utility.

Semifinals vs White Atoq


Looked at the scout and saw a lot of Claydol, a Miltank on every non-HO team, and the rest being HO teams. Oh yeah there was also a grand total of one (1) Normal resist on the scout and it was Dusknoir. Kangaskhan/Cradily/Typhlosion basically filled itself out; if there's an HO team Kangaskhan would go in, if not there's still likely to be no Normal resist, Cradily is a rocker that beats Claydol easily and it's generally good as a wall, Expert Belt Typhlosion is a menacing breaker that can invite in potential Normal resists and bop em with Focus Blast, Miltank too.

Oh yea, Work Up Typhlosion. It was something I initially came up with during the post-shift tour as a way to avoid Sucker Punch being a guaranteed click vs Typhlosion, who otherwise ran all attacking moves. Substitute and Will-O-Wisp were other moves I considered, but I found Work Up to mesh well with Typhlosion's playstyle. After a boost it can reach some staggering damage thresholds such as:

+1 252 SpA Expert Belt Typhlosion Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 236+ SpD Miltank: 379-449 (96.1 - 113.9%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

and

+1 252 SpA Expert Belt Typhlosion Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Regirock: 298-353 (81.8 - 96.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

It also lets EQ do more to Lanturn and Flamethrower hit higher ranges but usually you'll be content with tossing those moves out unboosted, the main draw is +1 Focus Blast shredding through those two.

Back to the rest of the team, NP Skuntank was my removal choice cuz I wanted my removal to be offensively threatening as well as be able to beat potential Dusknoir. Speaking of Dusknoir, I added it as a general sponge/fat disruptor with Taunt + Will-O + Night Shade + Pain Split that could threaten both offensive and fatter teams. Scarf Poliwrath makes its last appearance of the tournament for the same reasons I had used it previously. I almost considered swapping its set to something else last minute (I won't say what) but decided against it last minute, which ended up biting me in the ass a bit ngl.

I played the game extremely poorly ngl, probably off a combination of insane tilt from the rest of the week and "please just let this end I need to get some sleep before I work midnight shift in a few hours". I almost had it locked down in the endgame once Typhlosion got its Work Up boost and removed Regirock, but I had swapped out against Sneasel fearing CB Throat Chop, which would do:

252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Throat Chop vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Typhlosion: 217-256 (73 - 86.1%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

But I hadn't clocked that it was more likely SD Sneasel due to the Scarf HWish Mr. Mime alongside it on the team, which would have made the calc instead look like:

252 Atk Life Orb Sneasel Throat Chop vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Typhlosion: 187-222 (62.9 - 74.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Rip my dumb ass I guess.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Going to cram quick meta thoughts here so I don't have to make another post and clog the thread.

Generally speaking I think the metagame hasn't really changed at all much from before tier shifts had occurred, unlike literally every other BDSP lower tier. Main reason being we lost literally nothing and out of the 7 new mons we gained access to, 2 of them (Jolteon /Torkoal ) dropped down to PU (with Torkoal being dogshit unviable even down there), 2 of them (Granbull /Cacturne ) are alright but nothing to write home about in terms of meta impact, another 2 (Claydol /Aggron ) are actually good mons but they mainly fill similar roles to the pre-existing top tier options of Gligar and Regirock , so although they are undeniable good mons they aren't really shaking the tier up too much. And lastly there's Honchkrow who upon first entering the tier looked extremely dangerous with its attacking stats, STAB Combo, STAB Brave Bird and Sucker Punch, and Moxie for snowballing, but quickly turned out to be way more of a hassle to build and use than is really worth it. I know there's like barely any games even during PL and usage stats are lowkey fucked in part because of that but like. Zero uses. Lmao.

I do think the metagame is in a good spot currently, though. There's lots of room for creativity once you get familiar with the tier I feel and most archetypes have the tools to play around the rest of the tier. Better play wins more or less if you wanna use that sort of buzzphrase. Personally I don't think there's anything that needs looking into currently, since I feel like everything has sufficient levels of counterplay, but if I had to choose it would either be Glaceon or Ursaring.


The former because it's a strong wallbreaker in a tier where Ice STAB is generally pretty tricky to safely switch into, especially when Freeze-Dry is tossed into the mix. There aren't many defensive answers and the only truly reliable one is Thick Fat Miltank, so it can be rather restrictive from a builder viewpoint. The Wish + Protect sets that started popping up during BDSPPL II two years ago have proven to be the go-to set because Glaceon really only needs its STABs and the ability to recover health lets it avoid being overwhelmed by hazards and weaker attacks. That being said I find Glaceon manageable due to how its poor typing, speed, and special bulk leave it vulnerable to being done in by hazards, aggressive switching, and faster attackers, making checking it offensively very manageable. Defensively it is difficult to truly manage but I find most teams should be able to soft check it with stuff like SpDef Regirock, Typhlosion, Sneasel, your own Glaceon, Thick Fat mons, and slower offensive mons that can afford to bulk themselves out to take a hit from it and fire back hard. Aggron joining the tier is also nice because it gives us a viable Steel-type that can check Glaceon on offense/BO teams.


On the other hand, my main gripe with Ursaring is that it is the thing that incentivizes teams to run speed control, more specifically a Choice Scarf user or something base 110 Speed or higher (aka just Jumpluff and Sneasel). Jolly Quick Feet conveniently outspeeding otherwise fast mons like Scyther and Kadabra restricts teams to having to run some form of the aforementioned speed control or bulking up to hell and back to withstand its assault (which is an approach mainly relegated to hard stall), can be restrictive when building. STAB Facade is strong as hell and an Ursaring that manages to pick up a Swords Dance safely is usually pretty scary to stare down. However, I find it tough to fit on teams outside of HO, since it doesn't provide much in the way of defensive utility, while other similarly strong (or even stronger) breakers would be able to do more than just click buttons and die. The tier's proactive nature also makes getting it a free turn to set up and/or activate its Toxic Orb a tricky task at times, though this can also be true for rewarding aggressive plays to set Ursaring up to break. Lastly, I find it still manageable to play around with slower stuff by being able to pivot around with Normal resists/immunities as well as ways to punish it like priority, hazards to dig into it early, Protect to rack up Toxic chip damage, and Skuntank Aftermath.

I don't like using usage stats much when making arguments because, like I said already, they're lowkey fucked due to the small amount of games, with tons of good stuff just not seeing much use for whatever reason to boot. That being said I still think it's worth looking at its stats for a glance at how it's been performing since shifts.

Usage/WR

Post-Shift Tour

+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon            | Use  | Usage % |  Win %  |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1    | Regirock           |   24 |  48.00% |  50.00% |
| 2    | Gligar             |   22 |  44.00% |  59.09% |
| 3    | Typhlosion         |   20 |  40.00% |  40.00% |
| 4    | Claydol            |   14 |  28.00% |  35.71% |
| 5    | Glaceon            |   13 |  26.00% |  69.23% |
| 5    | Lanturn            |   13 |  26.00% |  46.15% |
| 7    | Skuntank           |   11 |  22.00% |  45.45% |
| 8    | Poliwrath          |   10 |  20.00% |  60.00% |
| 8    | Toxicroak          |   10 |  20.00% |  50.00% |
| 10   | Leafeon            |    9 |  18.00% |  88.89% |
| 10   | Porygon2           |    9 |  18.00% |  55.56% |
| 10   | Dusknoir           |    9 |  18.00% |  44.44% |
| 10   | Ludicolo           |    9 |  18.00% |  44.44% |
| 10   | Aggron             |    9 |  18.00% |  44.44% |
| 15   | Miltank            |    8 |  16.00% |  50.00% |
| 16   | Ursaring           |    7 |  14.00% |  14.29% |
| 17   | Qwilfish           |    6 |  12.00% |  33.33% |
| 17   | Honchkrow          |    6 |  12.00% |  16.67% |
| 19   | Grumpig            |    5 |  10.00% |  80.00% |
| 19   | Cradily            |    5 |  10.00% |  20.00% |
| 19   | Cacturne           |    5 |  10.00% |  20.00% |
| 22   | Magneton           |    4 |   8.00% | 100.00% |
| 22   | Victreebel         |    4 |   8.00% |  75.00% |
| 22   | Drifblim           |    4 |   8.00% |  75.00% |
| 22   | Mr. Mime           |    4 |   8.00% |  75.00% |
| 22   | Hitmonlee          |    4 |   8.00% |  50.00% |
| 22   | Scyther            |    4 |   8.00% |  50.00% |
| 22   | Whiscash           |    4 |   8.00% |  50.00% |
| 22   | Electivire         |    4 |   8.00% |  50.00% |
| 30   | Bellossom          |    3 |   6.00% |  66.67% |
| 30   | Kangaskhan         |    3 |   6.00% |  33.33% |
| 30   | Smeargle           |    3 |   6.00% |  33.33% |
| 30   | Granbull           |    3 |   6.00% |  33.33% |
| 30   | Sneasel            |    3 |   6.00% |   0.00% |
| 35   | Magcargo           |    2 |   4.00% | 100.00% |
| 35   | Piloswine          |    2 |   4.00% | 100.00% |
| 35   | Monferno           |    2 |   4.00% | 100.00% |
| 35   | Charizard          |    2 |   4.00% |  50.00% |
| 35   | Sandslash          |    2 |   4.00% |  50.00% |
| 35   | Lapras             |    2 |   4.00% |  50.00% |
| 35   | Weezing            |    2 |   4.00% |  50.00% |
| 35   | Abomasnow          |    2 |   4.00% |  50.00% |
| 35   | Ninetales          |    2 |   4.00% |  50.00% |
| 35   | Kadabra            |    2 |   4.00% |  50.00% |
| 35   | Jolteon            |    2 |   4.00% |   0.00% |
| 46   | Rampardos          |    1 |   2.00% | 100.00% |
| 46   | Jumpluff           |    1 |   2.00% | 100.00% |
| 46   | Shiftry            |    1 |   2.00% | 100.00% |
| 46   | Gorebyss           |    1 |   2.00% |   0.00% |
| 46   | Wigglytuff         |    1 |   2.00% |   0.00% |
| 46   | Kingler            |    1 |   2.00% |   0.00% |
| 46   | Raichu             |    1 |   2.00% |   0.00% |

BDSPPL IV

+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon            | Use  | Usage % |  Win %  |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1    | Gligar             |   18 |  52.94% |  38.89% |
| 2    | Claydol            |   14 |  41.18% |  64.29% |
| 3    | Typhlosion         |   13 |  38.24% |  61.54% |
| 3    | Regirock           |   13 |  38.24% |  38.46% |
| 5    | Miltank            |   12 |  35.29% |  75.00% |
| 6    | Qwilfish           |   10 |  29.41% |  10.00% |
| 7    | Leafeon            |    8 |  23.53% |  50.00% |
| 8    | Poliwrath          |    7 |  20.59% |  57.14% |
| 8    | Glaceon            |    7 |  20.59% |  57.14% |
| 8    | Skuntank           |    7 |  20.59% |  57.14% |
| 11   | Lanturn            |    6 |  17.65% |  66.67% |
| 11   | Bellossom          |    6 |  17.65% |  50.00% |
| 13   | Aggron             |    5 |  14.71% |  80.00% |
| 13   | Weezing            |    5 |  14.71% |  60.00% |
| 13   | Kangaskhan         |    5 |  14.71% |  40.00% |
| 13   | Mr. Mime           |    5 |  14.71% |  40.00% |
| 13   | Ursaring           |    5 |  14.71% |  40.00% |
| 18   | Dusknoir           |    4 |  11.76% |  75.00% |
| 18   | Porygon2           |    4 |  11.76% |  50.00% |
| 20   | Victreebel         |    3 |   8.82% |  66.67% |
| 20   | Abomasnow          |    3 |   8.82% |  66.67% |
| 20   | Sneasel            |    3 |   8.82% |  66.67% |
| 20   | Gorebyss           |    3 |   8.82% |  33.33% |
| 20   | Whiscash           |    3 |   8.82% |  33.33% |
| 20   | Grumpig            |    3 |   8.82% |  33.33% |
| 20   | Electivire         |    3 |   8.82% |  33.33% |
| 20   | Smeargle           |    3 |   8.82% |   0.00% |
| 28   | Cacturne           |    2 |   5.88% | 100.00% |
| 28   | Kadabra            |    2 |   5.88% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Altaria            |    2 |   5.88% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Scyther            |    2 |   5.88% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Toxicroak          |    2 |   5.88% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Granbull           |    2 |   5.88% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Cradily            |    2 |   5.88% |  50.00% |
| 35   | Glalie             |    1 |   2.94% | 100.00% |
| 35   | Chatot             |    1 |   2.94% | 100.00% |
| 35   | Mawile             |    1 |   2.94% | 100.00% |
| 35   | Pelipper           |    1 |   2.94% | 100.00% |
| 35   | Shiftry            |    1 |   2.94% |   0.00% |
| 35   | Dunsparce          |    1 |   2.94% |   0.00% |
| 35   | Lunatone           |    1 |   2.94% |   0.00% |
| 35   | Camerupt           |    1 |   2.94% |   0.00% |
| 35   | Rapidash           |    1 |   2.94% |   0.00% |
| 35   | Misdreavus         |    1 |   2.94% |   0.00% |
| 35   | Hitmonlee          |    1 |   2.94% |   0.00% |
| 35   | Magcargo           |    1 |   2.94% |   0.00% |

Somewhat respectable usage, hanging around the 14% mark, but with a win rate ranging from "below average" to "abysmal". If you want to dig even deeper and look to BDSPPL III when Sticky Web was still around, Ursaring was 2nd in usage but still has a win rate below 50%. Good mon, but these stats aren't particularly convincing that it's broken. Like I said though, usage stats are kinda fucked for BDSP lower tiers and this one is no exception.


I'd be fine with holding a vote on either one (or something else if that seems to be the appetite) if there seems to be a demand for one but I'd probably find myself voting DNB with both options.


Have a good one.