Unpopular opinions

[bdt2002]

Someone on Discord told me last night that a big part of why Scarlet & Violet run as bad as they do on the Switch 1 generation of, well, Switches, is because someone at Game Freak thought it was a good idea for the entire ocean surrounding mainland Paldea to all be rendered in simultaneously. I have no idea where my friend found this information or if that’s actually a true statement, but I’m not what’s worse, this or the fact that he said at one point that this region has good looking water. (Just in case it wasn’t clear, I think Paldea’s water looks bad AND slows the game down.)

On the subject of water graphics, though, obviously the game isn’t out yet but based off of what little we have seen from Winds & Waves, my opinion is that I have my doubts about if the game will run well even on the Switch 2 because unlike Paldea, I do actually think (insert the new region’s name here) I do think the water looked great in the reveal trailer by comparison. I sure hope it would given the title of the games, but if good looking water apparently does come at the cost of the game’s frame rate… I’m sorry, I think I would rather have the worse looking water if I had to choose. And as for my favorite water textures from all of the 2D games? Give me HeartGold & SoulSilver as well as Unova’s oceanic waters.

 

[Ear547]

Someone on Discord told me last night that a big part of why Scarlet & Violet run as bad as they do on the Switch 1 generation of, well, Switches, is because someone at Game Freak thought it was a good idea for the entire ocean surrounding mainland Paldea to all be rendered in simultaneously. I have no idea where my friend found this information or if that’s actually a true statement, but I’m not what’s worse, this or the fact that he said at one point that this region has good looking water. (Just in case it wasn’t clear, I think Paldea’s water looks bad AND slows the game down.)

On the subject of water graphics, though, obviously the game isn’t out yet but based off of what little we have seen from Winds & Waves, my opinion is that I have my doubts about if the game will run well even on the Switch 2 because unlike Paldea, I do actually think (insert the new region’s name here) I do think the water looked great in the reveal trailer by comparison. I sure hope it would given the title of the games, but if good looking water apparently does come at the cost of the game’s frame rate… I’m sorry, I think I would rather have the worse looking water if I had to choose. And as for my favorite water textures from all of the 2D games? Give me HeartGold & SoulSilver as well as Unova’s oceanic waters.

Click to collapse...

They didn't have as much time to optimize the games as they will have had with Winds and Waves. Given the region is surrounded by ocean, I'm preeeetty sure GF will figure out how to make the game run smoothly with that in mind. Switch 2 is a lot more powerful too. I get the cynicism though and feel free to wipe the egg off my face if I'm wrong.

 

[Bakugames]

Someone on Discord told me last night that a big part of why Scarlet & Violet run as bad as they do on the Switch 1 generation of, well, Switches, is because someone at Game Freak thought it was a good idea for the entire ocean surrounding mainland Paldea to all be rendered in simultaneously. I have no idea where my friend found this information or if that’s actually a true statement, but I’m not what’s worse, this or the fact that he said at one point that this region has good looking water. (Just in case it wasn’t clear, I think Paldea’s water looks bad AND slows the game down.)

Click to collapse...

thats pretty much people not understanding how graphics work. sv's water is not a unique take on how to render it and even with the waves i dont think it would take very little ram. i think stuff like All Ghimmighouls Active On Map is more damning (they fixed that)

 

[RocketSurgery]

Someone on Discord told me last night that a big part of why Scarlet & Violet run as bad as they do on the Switch 1 generation of, well, Switches, is because someone at Game Freak thought it was a good idea for the entire ocean surrounding mainland Paldea to all be rendered in simultaneously. I have no idea where my friend found this information or if that’s actually a true statement, but I’m not what’s worse, this or the fact that he said at one point that this region has good looking water. (Just in case it wasn’t clear, I think Paldea’s water looks bad AND slows the game down.)

Click to collapse...

I am always skeptical of claims of massive inefficiency in the games; they usually seem to be misunderstandings of what is actually going on or overly exaggerated. For this particular example I can only find the original tumblr post making the claim, one reddit thread thread claiming the author is wrong, and then a million other threads just uncritically repeating the viral post.

Other similar claims are that the game loads all of Lumiose's model at once (which turned out to only be used for the opening custscene):

The other big one was the claim that GameFreak was so incompetent that they made tons of Lily models for different locations/scenes instead of one adaptable model, which Kaphotics later explained was actually better for loading times (while also debunking some incorrect assumptions about cryptography in the games):

As is often the case, the corrections never gain as much traction as the original misinformation.

That said, clearly SV had problems, the actual problems are just usually not as catchy or as simple as "company behind highest grossing video game franchise can't program."

 

[Esserise]

Other similar claims are that the game loads all of Lumiose's model at once (which turned out to only be used for the opening custscene):
View attachment 873463

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“An incorrect assumption with the information that was available”

This shit pisses me off so much. Ego-deluded clout chasers like this always like to think of themselves as neutral actors who are just “reporting the news,” but the thing is, they are not obligated to give their opinion on a topic they obviously know nothing about. They just wanted to get their cheap dunk in for engagement (nO WoNdEr ThE bUiLdInGs ArE fLaT), because they know they have an audience of rubes who also lack any meaningful knowledge of the subject and want their rage boners tugged over a video game for 9-year-olds. Genuinely just some of the most pathetic ways to live on display.

 

[Ear547]

That said, clearly SV had problems, the actual problems are just usually not as catchy or as simple as "company behind highest grossing video game franchise can't program."

Click to collapse...

Duuude, I've come to really detest this specific talking point. It's such an incredibly surface level understanding of how things work and honestly I feel inclined to ignore people if they use it at all. Don't even get me STARTED on how the alleged budget leaks for several recent mainline titles pissed me off in how badly it fed peoples' confirmation biases...

“An incorrect assumption with the information that was available”

This shit pisses me off so much. Ego-deluded clout chasers like this always like to think of themselves as neutral actors who are just “reporting the news,” but the thing is, they are not obligated to give their opinion on a topic they obviously know nothing about. They just wanted to get their cheap dunk in for engagement (nO WoNdEr ThE bUiLdInGs ArE fLaT), because they know they have an audience of rubes who also lack any meaningful knowledge of the subject and want their rage boners tugged over a video game for 9-year-olds. Genuinely just some of the most pathetic ways to live on display.

Click to collapse...

Yeah for real. People like them and Centro have done a lot to poison the well in the Pokémon community and they can't pretend it's not their fault.

 

[Bakugames]

sv was unnoptimized but in mostly boring ways, like having too many spawns and not culling them properly, or too many parts of the map existing when it wasn't really necessary to try to achieve seamless transitions. its a lot of smaller things building up, and all things that they probably knew about but were fighting against a pretty tight deadline

the switch being a toaster certainly doesnt help tho

 

[pika pal]

Yeah for real. People like them and Centro have done a lot to poison the well in the Pokémon community and they can't pretend it's not their fault.

Click to collapse...

The kicker about Centro is that they don't even have real sources or report from anything reliable, just compile "leaks" from other second hand sources in one place while trying to look "professional" quality.

I remember an incident where a 4chan Leak thread for I want to say either SV early or the Teraleak of Pokemon content was intentionally putting fake screenshots in among the actual leak material, ranging from fanmade assets to fake Summary/Code images that included Centro-derisive statements and slurs, all things that Centro ended up posting on their Twitter without vetting and only pulling down when those were pointed out to them.

 

[Castersvarog]

The kicker about Centro is that they don't even have real sources or report from anything reliable, just compile "leaks" from other second hand sources in one place while trying to look "professional" quality.

I remember an incident where a 4chan Leak thread for I want to say either SV early or the Teraleak of Pokemon content was intentionally putting fake screenshots in among the actual leak material, ranging from fanmade assets to fake Summary/Code images that included Centro-derisive statements and slurs, all things that Centro ended up posting on their Twitter without vetting and only pulling down when those were pointed out to them.

Click to collapse...

Centro, and RiddlerKhu when he wasn’t making stuff up, are just the worst I feel.
One guy is just a reposter who thinks he’s full of it because of it.
Meanwhile the other gives the final boss of vagueposting.

 

[LPBvgc]

Duuude, I've come to really detest this specific talking point. It's such an incredibly surface level understanding of how things work and honestly I feel inclined to ignore people if they use it at all.

Click to collapse...

Here's a paraphrased point from that (now deleted) video I quoted when bitching about how most anti-Pokémon videos suck:

They are the highest grossing media franchise that profits more from stuff like toys, anime, TCG, rather than the games, which exist as an engine to push this merchandising. Keeping that in mind, there's the factories and materials and studios needed to make said merch, and those come with their own costs.

Also iirc, GF only gets like 33% of the profits, so that also needs to be factored in.

 

[Karxrida]

Here's a paraphrased point from that (now deleted) video I quoted when bitching about how most anti-Pokémon videos suck:

They are the highest grossing media franchise that profits more from stuff like toys, anime, TCG, rather than the games, which exist as an engine to push this merchandising. Keeping that in mind, there's the factories and materials and studios needed to make said merch, and those come with their own costs.

Also iirc, GF only gets like 33% of the profits, so that also needs to be factored in.

Click to collapse...

A fraction of "highest grossing franchise of all time" profits is still a stupidly high number, and Pokémon games are best-sellers on top of that even if they are not the majority of said profits.

I am very much for prioritizing and seeking the truth, but that means acknowledging there is no angle that doesn't put some egg on Game Freak's face for things like how SV turned out. They are absolutely not blameless.

 

[Hyper Cutter]

honestly the gym leaders feel less involved with the wider world, and also feel like they are given less emphasis as an important role in XY.

Click to collapse...

It doesn't help that they (and the Elite 4, for that matter) are the only ones in the modern games not to engage with their generation's gimmick, since they have Kalos Pokemon as their aces and the Venn Diagram of "is a Kalos Pokemon" and "can mega evolve" was exactly Diancie at the time.

 

[Ear547]

A fraction of "highest grossing franchise of all time" profits is still a stupidly high number, and Pokémon games are best-sellers on top of that even if they are not the majority of said profits.

I am very much for prioritizing and seeking the truth, but that means acknowledging there is no angle that doesn't put some egg on Game Freak's face for things like how SV turned out. They are absolutely not blameless.

Click to collapse...

Yeah, they scheduled their game releases badly. And there are plenty of creative decisions they've made that I don't like. But I think that's different than an ad hominem like "they're just lazy and don't care because it sells anyway" or that they're "an incompetent dev studio". GF isn't blameless but they're not soulless profit-driven monsters either. They also aren't being strongarmed into rushing their projects by some Guy Upstairs at Nintendo or TPCi. If that were the case, Winds and Waves would be releasing in a week or two. It's really upp to Game Freak to set the dev timeline on things. They just can't delay if they're deep enough into the process. With WiWa they were clearly able to skirt that sooner, but at the cost of making the 30th anniversary year feel more complete. I suppose Pokopia and Champions' existence in part were able to justify the internal delay.

All of these things can be true at once. Content creators seem unwilling and/or unable to recognize this.

 

[Hugin]

It doesn't help that they (and the Elite 4, for that matter) are the only ones in the modern games not to engage with their generation's gimmick, since they have Kalos Pokemon as their aces and the Venn Diagram of "is a Kalos Pokemon" and "can mega evolve" was exactly Diancie at the time.

Click to collapse...

It's defensible not using megas for the first 5 gym leaders, since, beyond the ace question(I'd say lead the Mega to prevent setup and then end the battle with the Kalos Ace), giving Clemont Mega-Ampharos or Manectric would have been an overly-tough fight. And roughly the same for everyone before him, the only options would be excessive for that point in the game. But Fairy/Psychic/Ice absolutely could have used megas, and the E4 NEEDED 2 more team members to be competent, might as well make one of them a mega.

I was going to say they should bring back rematches, but XY did have the Battle Chateau and still didn't use Megas there, instead giving every oppt a half team for some silly reason.

 

[Esserise]

the Venn Diagram of "is a Kalos Pokemon" and "can mega evolve" was exactly Diancie at the time.

Click to collapse...

And even that wasn’t the case until ORAS

 

[ScraftyIsTheBest]

Imo Mega Evolution is easier to look at differently in the face of other super mechanics like Z-Moves, Dynamax, and Terastal being a thing now, but it is and still is pretty different from the three universal mechanics.

Megas are basically honorary new Pokémon in their own right imo, and from the start I saw them as more akin to new evolutions a la Electivire, Magmortar, Tangrowth, etc. XY may have only introduced 72 completely new Pokémon in a vacuum but when you add in the new Megas it did introduce the total number of new designs is around 102.

Even now that kind of aspect is highlighted in how new Megas comprised virtually the entirety of new Pokémon designs introduced in Z-A, unlike Arceus which had a mix of new evolutions, regional forms, and regional evolutions.

I do agree that the later Gym Leaders and Elite Four could've used them as their aces in XY though, since Megas are scaled for late game power level and would've been nice to see there. I feel like that might've happened if Pokémon Z came into existence at the time, but alas.

 

[Yung Dramps]

It's defensible not using megas for the first 5 gym leaders, since, beyond the ace question(I'd say lead the Mega to prevent setup and then end the battle with the Kalos Ace), giving Clemont Mega-Ampharos or Manectric would have been an overly-tough fight.

Click to collapse...

And then there's gigachad Urbain/Taunie who uses Mega Manectric at the same point in the level curve where in XY a Tyrunt was viable as the big end-of-gym boss mon

 

[Eeveeto]

And then there's gigachad Urbain/Taunie who uses Mega Manectric at the same point in the level curve where in XY a Tyrunt was viable as the big end-of-gym boss mon
View attachment 873697

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4 physical moves on a Mon that doesn,t even increase Attack when Megaevolved

On another topic, as much as I despite Hidden Power, without it Mega Manectric might very well be the worst Mega out of all of them. Especially since new (better) Electric Megas appeared. The guy clearly needs some new moves, Snarl is unacceptable as coverage.

 

[Karxrida]

4 physical moves on a Mon that doesn,t even increase Attack when Megaevolved

Click to collapse...

I'm pretty sure all moves used by Megas in PLZA are Plus Moves when applicable, which I believe can do more damage?

Considering this is a fairly early fight I think it's a fair balancing decision.

 

[AztecCroc]

4 physical moves on a Mon that doesn,t even increase Attack when Megaevolved

On another topic, as much as I despite Hidden Power, without it Mega Manectric might very well be the worst Mega out of all of them. Especially since new (better) Electric Megas appeared. The guy clearly needs some new moves, Snarl is unacceptable as coverage.

Click to collapse...

I mean, it's got Flamethrower/Overheat.

When Hidden Power existed it ran HP Ice (in addition to one of the Fire moves), and there's a reason most Electric types don't get Special Ice moves. The only ones that do are already Ice (Rotom Frost and Arctozolt) or Water (Chinchou line) and Iron Thorns, I guess as a carry over from Tyranitar?

 

[QuickBH]

I mean, it's got Flamethrower/Overheat.

When Hidden Power existed it ran HP Ice (in addition to one of the Fire moves), and there's a reason most Electric types don't get Special Ice moves. The only ones that do are already Ice (Rotom Frost and Arctozolt) or Water (Chinchou line) and Iron Thorns, I guess as a carry over from Tyranitar?

Click to collapse...

On the topic of this + the Eeveelution one from earlier, I really wish that Eevee got some of the more weaker types that are STAB in its evos as coverage. Similar to Let's Go, but with slightly lesser powered moves rather than blatantly overtuned ones. An Eevee with say, Aurora Beam, would be rather cool, as if Eevee has the capacity to harness different elements already there but needs an evolution to fully utilize. It would also be really cool to fix the Eeveelution's lack of movepool options, I can already see Jolteon appreciating a move like Aurora Beam.

 

[AztecCroc]

On the topic of this + the Eeveelution one from earlier, I really wish that Eevee got some of the more weaker types that are STAB in its evos as coverage. Similar to Let's Go, but with slightly lesser powered moves rather than blatantly overtuned ones. An Eevee with say, Aurora Beam, would be rather cool, as if Eevee has the capacity to harness different elements already there but needs an evolution to fully utilize. It would also be really cool to fix the Eeveelution's lack of movepool options, I can already see Jolteon appreciating a move like Aurora Beam.

Click to collapse...

They've sort of done that a bit, it's had Stored Power since Gen 5 and SV gave it Trailblaze and Alluring Voice.

 

[Castersvarog]

Yeah, they scheduled their game releases badly. And there are plenty of creative decisions they've made that I don't like. But I think that's different than an ad hominem like "they're just lazy and don't care because it sells anyway" or that they're "an incompetent dev studio". GF isn't blameless but they're not soulless profit-driven monsters either. They also aren't being strongarmed into rushing their projects by some Guy Upstairs at Nintendo or TPCi. If that were the case, Winds and Waves would be releasing in a week or two. It's really upp to Game Freak to set the dev timeline on things. They just can't delay if they're deep enough into the process. With WiWa they were clearly able to skirt that sooner, but at the cost of making the 30th anniversary year feel more complete. I suppose Pokopia and Champions' existence in part were able to justify the internal delay.

All of these things can be true at once. Content creators seem unwilling and/or unable to recognize this.

Click to collapse...

I’d say it’s less laziness, and more like a decently sized dash of hubris.
Their games always sell incredibly well even with the lack of good polishing for the entirety of the Switch era.
Eventually that hubris gave us SV and Nintendo themselves giving apologies.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Nintendo themselves decided to step in and tell Gamefreak something to the effect of “We were willing to look past things because of your sales figures and our history together. But after that last release, we are not doing that again. You guys need to step up and make something that stands with the rest of our catalogue.”

So they decided to delay WiWa (and potentially even ZA as well) until next year in response. Which is 100% for the best, if WiWa ended up being a SV2 in terms of quality I’d genuinely burn my bridges with this franchise. It would come off as the developers just no longer caring, and if they couldn’t why would I?

4 physical moves on a Mon that doesn,t even increase Attack when Megaevolved

On another topic, as much as I despite Hidden Power, without it Mega Manectric might very well be the worst Mega out of all of them. Especially since new (better) Electric Megas appeared. The guy clearly needs some new moves, Snarl is unacceptable as coverage.

Click to collapse...

There’s been a lot of ideas for expanding Electric types movepools for coverage, and I still absolutely love the idea behind using Aurora Beam as this notable coverage move on Electric, Ghost and Psychic types. Electric types have some rough movepools and a lot of them need something new

 

[Ironmage]

Rather than going for Ice hitting both, I think it'd be better if Electric had different coverage for its two resistances. It used to have Signal Beam for Grass, I could also see increasing access to Overheat. Probably Water Pulse against Ground? It would work with the Rain side of Electric at least.

 

[Castersvarog]

Rather than going for Ice hitting both, I think it'd be better if Electric had different coverage for its two resistances. It used to have Signal Beam for Grass, I could also see increasing access to Overheat. Probably Water Pulse against Ground? It would work with the Rain side of Electric at least.

Click to collapse...

Heck there’s also Dazzling Gleam, an attack that’s just shining a bright light, Grass Knot which is so basic that plenty of other mons learn it including the Pikachu line, and the previously mentioned Overheat. Which could be a sliding scale of more machine Electric types having Overheat like Magnezone while more animal one could have Dazzling Gleam like Ampharos.

Or just being back Signal beam. Why they removed it I will never understand and lowkey hate them for doing so