A core that isn't FWG! Gasp! *Updated*

**Changes in Bold**

Here Goes Something...​

Introduction:
So I have been playing pokemon since Red and Blue. I only started battling competitively when Diamond and Pearl came out. I have had some moderate success battling overall but I really would like to improve. I feel like what is holding me back is team building. To me, building a good team is more difficult than battling. With that said, I really would like some feedback for this team, a team that I have had a decent level of success with on the Pokemon Online server and a team that I actually enjoy battling with.​

At a Glance:​


I like bulky offense teams. I have been playing around with different cores for a while now, and I stumbled across one I like. Essentially the team uses the core of Jirachi, Gliscor, and Rotom-W to take the hits and wear down the opponent’s team. I try to end games by setting up Conkeldurr or just sweeping with Garchomp to clean up my opponent’s team. Thundurus is just a lead sort of guy.​

Weakest link: Thundurus. I really would like to find someone who compliments the team coverage wise and that can lead pretty effectively as well. (Am I trying to do too much with one teamslot?)​

Thundurus @ Life Orb
Hasty/Prankster
32 atk/224 Satk/252 Spe
-Thunderbolt
-Thunder Wave
-Hidden Power Ice
-Hammer Arm
If no one else seems like an appropriate lead, Thundurus comes out first. Generally, Thundurus can net me a few kills per game if I play him correctly. Bolt/HP Ice are like boltbeam and Hammer Arm kills T-tar, Blissey, etc. I use the priority Thunder Wave to slow down fast sweepers that my team may not be able to handle otherwise.​

Synergy
-Ice: Jirachi, Rotom-W, Scizor
-Rock: Jirachi, Garchomp​

Potential Changes: I like the nasty plot set but Im not sure that would work very well in the lead position. Thoughts?​

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Careful/Serene Grace
252 hp/216 SpD/40 Spe
-Substitute
-Wish
-Iron Head
-Body Slam
A combination of flinch-rachi and the specially defensive Jirachi. Sub keeps Jirachi status-free and Wish keeps Jirachi and all the rest of my team healthy. Iron Head is STAB/flinch and Body Slam spreads paralysis. As far as the evs are concerned, he takes special hits like a boss. max hp is a given and 40 speed gets him to 246 speed, which outspeeds many potential threats. The rest is in special defense.​

Synergy:
-Fire: Rotom-W, Garchomp
-Ground: Thundurus, Gliscor, Rotom-W​

Potential Changes: Is SR more useful than Sub?​

Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Impish/Poison Heal
244 hp/192 def/ 72 spe
-Taunt
-Swords Dance
-Ice Fang
-Earthquake​

I think Gliscor may be the pokemon that got the most out of Generation V. Poison heal makes him so good. Gliscor takes the majority of physical hits for the team. He can handle ground types like Excadrill and fighting types like Conkeldurr with ease. 244 hp gets him to a maximum poison heal recovery, 72 speed gets him past brelooms (im not sure if this is still an issue) and the rest is in defense. For the moves, Taunt stops opponents from setting up (I'm looking at you Ferrothorn). Ice Fang and Earthquake are the coverage moves and Swords Dance makes those moves hit harder.​

Synergy:
-Water: Rotom-W
-Ice: Gliscor, Rotom-W, Scizor​

Potential Changes: -
Rotom-W @ Leftovers
Modest/Levitate
200 hp/ 164 def/144 spatk
-Thunderbolt
-Hydro Pump
-Pain Split
-Will-O-Wisp
The final part of my core is Rotom-W. I initially thought that losing the ghost type was a bad thing for Rotom but I now realize that having a Water/Electric type with levitate isn’t half bad. The hp and def evs give him enough physical bulk to give Excadrill and friends trouble. The rest goes into spatk. The moves are pretty straightforward. T-bolt/Pump are stab and Paint Split is for recovery. WoW keeps physical attackers at bay and spreads some extra damage around.​

Synergy
-Grass: Thundurus, Jirachi, Scizor​

Potential Changes: Is Hidden Power Fire better than some kind of status move? (T-wave or WoW)​

@ Choice Band
Adamant/Technician
252 hp/252 atk/4 def
-Bullet Punch
-U-turn
-Superpower
-Pursuit

A Gen IV superstar. I use a bulky CB Scizor to create momentum/scout with U-turn and revenge kill with Bullet Punch. I realized that my Conkerldurr was starting to disappoint me (that and every Celebi I faced made me cry). I also needed some extra power with priority. The only difference with the priority is that BP doesn't do much to Excadrill, but Rotom and Gliscor handle him pretty well.​

Synergy:
-Fire: Rotom-W, Garchomp​

Potential Changes: The ev spread could definitely use work.

**Scizor replaced Conkeldurr. The Conkeldurr Set I used is at the bottom if any comparison is needed**

Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
Jolly/Sand Veil
6 hp/252 atk/252 speed
-Outrage
-Dual Chop
-Earthquake
-Fire Blast​

Scarfchomp is one of the best revenge killers in the game. I rarely send him out before the end of the battle, when he can clean up what’s left of my opponent’s team with Outrage or Earthquake. The moves are pretty standard: Outrage, Earthquake and Fire Blast are coverage moves and Dual Chop is used when I don’t want to be locked into Outrage/need to break subs Overall, Garchomp is an incredibly solid pokemon and rarely fails me. However, I may need to replace him soon as people are starting to see him the same way as he was seen in Gen IV: too good.​

Synergy:
-Ice: Jirachi, Rotom-W
-Dragon: Jirachi​

Potential Changes: -​

Well that’s the team. Any and all comments are tremendously appreciated. I encourage you to rate the presentation of my team, if nothing else. I would just like to say thanks for taking the time to read all of this. I hope you enjoyed it. Happy rating!​



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Scizor replaced this Conkeldur:
Conkeldurr @ Leftovers

Adamant/Guts
68 hp/192 atk/248 sdef
-Bulk Up
-Mach Punch
-Drain Punch
-Stone Edge

Which is better?
 
i am new at this but i think you have a good team.
i would replace stone edge with payback for conkeldurr because your team is good against flying types, but no one on your team is that good at taking out ghosts. the only drawback of payback is that it is very weak against slower pokemon and pokemon that switch out.
 
Thanks for the comment! I did exchange Stone Edge for Payback and so far so good. The coverage offered by fighting/dark is quite nice. I would like to think that my team is good enough that only small changes like that are necessary, but don't be afraid to criticize!

Thanks again!
 
Not only does Stone Edge hit all Ghosts except Golurk harder than Payback, it also has much better coverage (the same as Terrakion's feared dual STAB) as well as a high chance for a crit, incase you are unable to muster through the opponent. The spread personally I would go with is 120 HP / 252 Atk / 136 SDef with an Adamant nature.

On Jirachi I prefer Body Slam for that extra damage and ability to hit Excadrill's that get cocky. But if you have major Thundurus problems, which by the looks of your team you do, you may be better off keeping TW. Substitute is an interestin choice. You may want to consider Wish over it, really helps for the likes of ScarfChomp.

Speaking of ScarfChomp definately go Dual Chop. Helps with BP and FS users/abusers.

With GLiscor Taunt is a better idea. Put it over Protect. I would then remove Taunt from Thundurus and give him Thunder Wave. Your team seems to be centralised around Thunder Wave and Thundurus can just TWave anything which you let get out of control e.g. DD Salamence.

GL
 
I really like how this team looks, good job on making it! If you plan on using Thundurus on a lead, why not try a mixed set? I've been using this set on a few teams and it effectively allows you to shut down pretty much every common "lead" and still do a lot of damage.

move 1: Thunderbolt
move 2: Hidden Power Ice
move 3: Hammer Arm
move 4: Taunt
item: Life Orb
ability: Prankster
nature: Naive / Hasty
evs: 32 Atk / 224 SpA / 252 Spe

It allows you to OHKO Tyranitar, 2HKO specially defensive ferrothorn and Blissey with Hammer Arm, while Thunderbolt and Hidden Power Ice still hit really hard.

I'd also like to see a Specially Defensive Jirachi go over your current one, it's pretty spectacular in the current metagame with it's ability to effectively shut down a lot of popular Special Attackers and heal itself / it's teammates, and I think Rotom-W would love some healing.

move 1: Iron Head
move 2: Body Slam
move 3: Wish
move 4: Protect / Stealth Rock (You don't appear to have Stealth Rock on your team so this is an option!)
nature: Careful
item: Leftovers
evs: 252 HP / 224 SpD / 32 Spe

And finally, I think you should be running Will-O-Wisp on your Rotom in place of Thunder Wave. Will-O-Wisp prevents Pokemon like Ferrothorn and Swords Dance Virizion from switching in willy nilly and smashing you with super-effective attacks / setting up. I think these suggestions will make your team a lot better, and good luck!
 
@ Dezza Laa

First of all, thanks for spending time to critique my team! All of your suggestions are excellent and I will try them out. Even though I now have been suggested to use both payback and stone edge on Conkeldurr, your argument for stone edge was a little bit more compelling. Dual Chop for Garchomp is an easy switch, and I will be sure to give Gliscor taunt and Thundurus T-wave. Both you and Lord Liam suggested to play around with Jirachi's moves (like Body Slam and Wish) so I will try some different movesets.

@ Lord Liam

Again, thanks for rating my team! I really like the mixed Thundurus idea--hammer arm is probably much more useful than focus blast. For Jirachi, mine is already specially defensive, just with different moves. Like I mentioned earlier in the post, Jirachi's moves have been questioned by more than one person, indicating that changes are needed.

Thanks again to both of you for your time and excellent critiques!
 
Its been a while since this thread got any attention but my team has been updated, complete with a new member! Thanks in advance to any and all raters!
 
Okay a big thing that I woudl do is replace thundurus with a tyranitar. Like you said yourself Thundurus really isn't doing much for the team and I think Ttar would benefit you more for a couple of reasons. First he brings sand which is really great to abuse with Chomp since there's a chance your opponent will miss an attack. Since you'll want Ttar to stay alive I suggest a set like this

Tyranitar@ Chople Berry
Ability: Sand Stream
Nature: Sassy
EVs: 252 Hp/48 Spa/208 SpD
-Stealth Rock
-Pursuit
-Fire Blast
-Ice Beam

You only need 48 SpA EVs to KO gliscor 100% of the time with Ice beam so the rest goes into special defense to help you take hits. Pursuit is to deal with fleeing mons and can really help you win the weather war if you catch a choiced toed locked into Ice beam or just about any tales. It also helps with Lati@s and other random annoying weakened mons. My second suggestion is to change Chomp's moveset around scarf chomp is cool but with a swords dance chomp you'll be able to sweep really well.

Garchomp@ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Veil
Nature: Jolly
-Substitute
-Swords Dance
-Dragon Claw
-Earthquake

Boost and sweep thats the premise behind this and it works wonders. The EVs are simple Max Speed and Attack to wreck as much shit as possible. Anyways hope the changes work and good luck
 
I will definitely try that setup out! Thanks Puretrainer! My only problem is (well besides being horribly standard) dealing with other weather. Thundurus helped Rotom-W take care of rain teams and I don't know if Rotom-W can handle that role on his own.

Either way, I am going to try the changes you suggested.

Oh yeah, one more thing. If Garchomp loses the scarf, do you think my team overall won't be fast enough? Even Specs Latios could outspeed my entire team. I'm not sure Scizor's BP will be able to defeat every threat that is faster than Garchomp...

Thanks again for your rate and your time!
 

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