And Lucario comes in for the sweep!

Bentendo1

Well, new team. I wish I could have come up in a more creative title withing such little time, but oh well. Format also probably sucks, but at least its readable. Oh well. *trudges on*

This is a team centered around a Lucario sweep. It has not been tested on Shoddy, therefore I cannot call it # whatever on Shoddy, taking the leaderboard, but whatever. Let's just get on with the team, right?

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The Lineup:

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Gengar @ Focus Sash
Nature: Hasty
EVs: 6 HP/252 Sp Atk/252 Speed
Ability: Levitate
Moveset:
-Counter
-Destiny Bond
-Thunderbolt
-Focus Blast

The lead. It laughs off Weaviles Pursuiting, Counters that back for the OHKO, and takes the next Poke with it. If used right, takes out at least 2 Pokes throughout the battle, giving me a humongous advantage.

Thunderbolt and HP Ice give me a bit better type coverage, although those are more of niche-like moves (for lack of a better word) hitting more things for x4 damage when compared to Shadow Ball and Focus Blast.

How this contributes to the Lucario sweep:

The lead. Takes out two Pokes, if played right, giving me an advantage knowing that I have more Pokes to deal with than he has. Plus, Counter is annoying as hell for stuff like Metagross or Weavile trying to Pursuit, while Destiny Bond, well, just takes out something.

Note: I'm debating replacing this Pokemon for a Pokemon that leads well but also contributes more to the team overall, but I'm rather stuck.

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Weezing @ Black Sludge
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/6 Sp Atk
Ability: Levitate
Moveset:
-Thunderbolt
-Fire Blast
-Will-o-Wisp
-Pain Split

The physical wall. Mainly a Gyarados and Heracross counter, that love taking on this team. Will-o-Wisp for status, and Pain Split for some kind of healing, although unreliable. Can also deal with Weavile if Gar can’t Counter a Pursuit back.

Fire Blast would hit Hera harder, but HP Ice could deal with dragons better, and can still deal decent damage to Hera, while it doesn’t do that much back. Just a thought.

How this contributes to the Lucario sweep:

This takes out two things that can switch in on Lucario: Gyarados and Heracross. Heracross can only be taken on with an SD under the belt, while Gyara can take it on even with an SD under its belt, unless I choose to carry Stone Edge, although I’m not exactly planning on carrying it.

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Blissey @ Leftovers
Nature: Bold
EVs: 148 HP/252 Def/104 Sp Atk/4 Speed
Ability: Natural Cure
Moveset:
-Aromatherapy
-Seismic Toss
-Softboiled
-Ice Beam

Pretty standard Bliss. I'm leaning towards Ice Beam as the last move. ST gives a more reliable way to deal damage and makes sure stuff like Raikou doesn’t set up on me that easily, and Ice Beam deals more damage to Gliscor, who is pretty happy with this team after Gengar is gone. Softboiled for the obvious healing.

How this contributes to the Lucario sweep:

It rids the team of dreadful statuses like burn, paralyze, poison, etc that this team doesn’t like at all. Walls special threats like Raikou and such that otherwise walk all over this team.

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Donphan @ Leftovers
Nature: Impish
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/6 Atk
Ability: Sturdy
Moveset:
-Stealth Rock
-Roar
-Earthquake
-Ice Shard

The other wall. Blissey can cover near all special attackers due to its amazing HP and special defense, but I think two physical walls are necessary because there are so many different types of physical attackers. Most physical walls specialize in countering one specific Pokemon, like say Gliscor, it is the best Heracross counter in the game, but it has trouble with other physical attackers like Blissey.

How this contributes to the Lucario sweep:

It sets up Stealth Rock, and starts Roaring things away, scouting for Pokemon that could possibly give me trouble. Earthquake is a massive STAB move, and Ice Shard is for those pesky dragons, 2HKOing all of them with standard spreads and such, if I recall correctly.

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Weavile @ Choice Band
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 40 HP/252 Atk/216 Speed
Ability: Pressure
Moveset:
-Pursuit
-Ice Shard
-Night Slash
-Brick Break

This is basically to trap things, and rid them of hindering the impending sweep. It hits stuff hard from behind a Choice Band at 373 speed, which let him outspeed Dugtrio and friends. Can deal with Garchomps stuck in Outrage and the like. Basically a revenge killer.

How this contributes to the Lucario sweep:

Gengar Gengar GENGAR!!! This takes it out. Gengar loves to switch in on Lucario’s main moves, since the “type coverage” moves (Crunch, Stone Edge, etc) aren’t usually used on obvious switches. There’s always the chance the Luke will SD up, but Gengar still outspeeds it and hits it hard. I do have Bliss that can take care of Gengars, but this will surely take it out, and Blissey is often just set up fodder for the harder hitters. I try to get SR out early so I don’t have to deal with CounterSash Gars, so I usually send out Bliss on Gengar leads, then pull an immediate switch to Donphan while they switch in their physical attacker, I can set up SR with ease.

After Stealth Rock is up, I can then send in Weavile on the predicted switch or for the revenge kill, taking out possibly Lucario’s biggest threat (Gengar). Of course, I could always Crunch on the switch to Gengar, but then I'm stick without a Swords Dance.

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Lucario @ Life Orb
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Speed/6 HP
Ability: Inner Focus
Moveset:
-Swords Dance
-Close Combat
-Extremespeed
-Crunch

The sweeper the whole team relies on. Rather standard stuff, Swords Dance up, and hit whatever with Close Combat. I don’t really need to worry about Skarm or many other physical walls, because take a look at the calculations: (taken from the analysis)

Lucario with 1 Swords Dance:
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Skarmory 85.03% - 100.30%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Bronzong: 96.15% - 113.02%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Hippowdon: 76.43% - 90.00%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Forretress: 80.23% - 94.63%
Close Combat vs Max HP/Def Donphan: 82.81% - 97.40%

It takes out a good chunk of health from nearly all, and after SR, has a possible chance of KO’ing. Most usually shrug off a +2 Lucario and proceed to set up Stealth Rock, and after they see that it nearly OHKOs them, their in deep shit.
Now, Swords Dance, Close Combat, and Extremespeed are all standard on this Luke. However, it’s very hard to find the right last move on this Pokemon. I chose Crunch not for Gengar- which I have other things for, but mainly for Cresselia. A +2 Life Orb’d Crunch from Lucario will do 79.95% - 94.09% to modest Cressy with 32 HP/252 Def/224 Sp Atk, which is now standard.

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So, that’s the team, and to be honest, I did not work very hard on this RMT, although I worked pretty hard on the team itself. So I probably am missing a lot of stuff, but oh well.

Also, something just feels wrong with this team. I’m not sure what it is either. I’m still debating if I can get a better lead than Gengar, since it doesn’t really accomplish much besides taking out a few Pokemon and dying. I would like to lead with something that can get Stealth Rock out early, so I’ve been debating a jolly Gliscor, but it doesn’t really help with other leads besides getting a Taunt off with its mediocre speed and getting up Stealth Rock. It could deal with Heracross, but I already have Weezing for that.

Well, comments, questions, concerns? Constructive criticism only please, and I’m still trying to figure out just exactly what is wrong, so I can tweak it a bit… Whatever. I’ll stop rambling. Just rate and contribute... Please.
 
Good point... Gengar, the only offensive threat basically kills itself... without Lucario and Gengar, you have a semi-crappy stall team :(

I guess Weavile could do SOMETHING... but it's not gonna win you the game <_<
 
DarkSuicune said:
Well I like the lineup and the Lucario team idea. But what will you do if they manage to kill off Lucario early on?
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It's a late game sweeper, and only that. No way in hell would I bring in the center of the team so early, because I need to know exactly what my opponent wants to do first and such (Donphan helps a lot with that).
 
What's the point of the 40 HP Evs on Weavile? Just asking.

I like this team, and how your pokemon all contribute to your end-game strategy (i.e "team synergy")

I'd personally not even bother with Thunder Wave; Ice Beam and Seismic are both more neccesary and a Plot Azelf isn't sweeping a team with SD Luke, Gengar and Weavile anytime soon.

Go with Fire Blast on Weezing; the last thing you want to see happen is an SD Lucario team losing to SD Lucario, right? (especially if you choose not to run Focus Blast on Gengar), Speaking of Gengar, I'd go with Focus Blast and Thunderbolt for your set.
 
I really like this team - it covers a lot of stuff really well and the synergy is good. You don't really have any major weaknesses, besides the fact that if you lose Luke/Gengar, you really aren't that powerful offensively (CBWeavile is good, but Jolly plus low base-power moves doesn't add up like CBGross, but it does give you that revenge killing ability that you need to get Luke in).

I would definately run Seismic Toss on Blissey, otherwise Raikou can walk all over this team if it Subs while you switch. On Weezing, I would use Fire Blast, or even Flamethrower, over HP Ice. Your Weavile already has Ice Shard, and you don't have any other fire moves (which would let Scizor get in and do whatever).

Is there any need for Jolly on Weavile? As long as you outspeed Dugtrio and +Speed base 115s, I think you would be fine. Adamant provides a great boost in attack power. I'll edit more in later after dinner.
 
Melodius: Thanks.

I'll edit in Fire Blast on Weezing, since I already have two Sharders.

Edit: Bliss- the team needs a way to deal with Raikou and Gliscor, so I ditched T-Wave. Oh well, status is good, but not as important as being able to take out Raikou and Gliscor.

I like Focus Blast/T-Bolt/Counter/Destiny Bond a lot better than the pseudo- BoltBeam set. With pseudo- BoltBeam, I can't touch T-Tar leads, although I get relatively good type coverage. The last thing I want to do is let Boah get a Sub up, so will edit. :)

Bam: Thank you as well. :)

Like I said earlier, Luke is only for the late game, and I play him very carefully. I need to know exactly what my opponent will do before I bring him in, and Roar on Donphan helps with that- a lot.

Yeah, Fire Blast on Weezing. HP Ice is really not needed with two Sharders on the team.

Jolly Weavile is mainly for Azelf, so I don't have to sacrifice Blissey when it wants to Explode. Dugtrio loses to Pursuit when jolly, and can't really do much unless it's stuck on Stone Edge. Ice Shard takes it out, whether Weavile is adamant or jolly. Oh, and adamant can't outspeed base 115s, iirc.

Thank you all for the feedback. :)
 
I don't see the purpose in the "If you lose your sweepers, you have to stall" posts. Thats a given. We as raters have to take into consideration that the player himself is talented enough to use the team properly. 1. He already stated that he knows when to bring Lucario out and 2. From his OP, he seems like he knows how to use Gengar's ability to waste two of his opponent's Pokémon.

I do like the team a lot, actually. My advice just would be playing it right. I'm sure you know this already, but just make sure you use Lucario and Weavile wisely. Weavile is one of those hit hard and GTFO Pokémon, so if you're able to chip away on their team and clear a path for Lucario to sweep, you should be in a great position. Also, I'd test a Mild Nature on Gengar; since you're running counter, the extra attack boost might help out more than the speed. I haven't used that particular set, so I would just test Mild out and see if the attack boost helps you KO anything more than you already do.

Good luck, and may the aura be with you. ;D
 
Pulse said:
I don't see the purpose in the "If you lose your sweepers, you have to stall" posts. Thats a given. We as raters have to take into consideration that the player himself is talented enough to use the team properly. 1. He already stated that he knows when to bring Lucario out and 2. From his OP, he seems like he knows how to use Gengar's ability to waste two of his opponent's Pokémon.

I do like the team a lot, actually. My advice just would be playing it right. I'm sure you know this already, but just make sure you use Lucario and Weavile wisely. Weavile is one of those hit hard and GTFO Pokémon, so if you're able to chip away on their team and clear a path for Lucario to sweep, you should be in a great position. Also, I'd test a Mild Nature on Gengar; since you're running counter, the extra attack boost might help out more than the speed. I haven't used that particular set, so I would just test Mild out and see if the attack boost helps you KO anything more than you already do.

Good luck, and may the aura be with you. ;D
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Yeah, playing it right seems to be the biggest problem now.

Gengar does kind of need speed for Destiny Bond though, so I want to keep it hasty. It helps me take out Ape with Destiny Bond.

Thank you for the feedback. :)
 
I unno...I'd probably get rid of Weavile for something like Gyarados because another Lucario is just going to sweep right through you. More so the Specs version, but the SD version will hurt as well.
 
Aeroblacktyl said:
I unno...I'd probably get rid of Weavile for something like Gyarados because another Lucario is just going to sweep right through you. More so the Specs version, but the SD version will hurt as well.
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Well, Weavile is mainly to get rid of Gengar for the Luke sweep, and adding Gyara really wouldn't help me with Cressy.

For Cressy, I usually just send in Luke on an Ice Beam, SD twice while it feebly tries to Charge Beam, and then Crunch (Cressy only has about a 25% chance of surviving a +4 Crunch from Luke with max def and HP). If it carries Psychic, Donphan can come in on a Charge Beam and Roar it away.

It also wouldn't really help with Gengar either, needing 2 DDs with before I outspeed it. My only real way of dealing with Gengar then would be to Crunch it on a switch with Luke, win the speed tie with my Gengar- although mine usually goes down early, or wall it with Bliss, but Dugtrios are nearly everywhere...

What do you think?
 
you'd never bring weavile into cress because of thunder wave. and you can't revenge kill scarfed gengar or one with focus sash.
 
Aeroblacktyl said:
I unno...I'd probably get rid of Weavile for something like Gyarados because another Lucario is just going to sweep right through you. More so the Specs version, but the SD version will hurt as well.
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He shouldn't fear SD Luke because of Weezing, Specs Lucario is a bigger problem (one that might actually neccesitate using a T-Wave/SToss set with an investment of 200+ SDef EVs for Blissey)

I see your point but I kind of think Gyarados doesn't do anything for him in terms of overall strategy. And it certainly does not help against Cresselia.

As for switching Weavile into Gengar, it's risky but it's not the worst switch you could possibly make (Is Gengar Focus Blasting first turn?), same with Cresselia (Restalk is more common).

In my view, the team's weak link is Donphan; If I were subbing anything out, it'd be that.

you'd never bring weavile into cress because of thunder wave. and you can't revenge kill scarfed gengar or one with focus sash.
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Depends on what I'm switching out of. Focus Sash Gengar likely won't show up that late in the battle where one would usually be talking about revenge kills, and it's not like Weavile's dying to any of Gengar's moves not named Focus Blast. Hypnosis/WoW is a concern too though, but those tend to be seen on lead Gengars more than anything.
 
the Lexx said:
you'd never bring weavile into cress because of thunder wave. and you can't revenge kill scarfed gengar or one with focus sash.
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Aren't most Cressies ResTalk nowadays? You do bring a valid point though.

Stupid ScarfGar. :pirate: I can come in for the revenge kill if it's stuck on something like Shadow Ball or HP Ice though. And I usually try to get out SR early to get rid of those damn Sashes, but otherwise, there's nothing I can really do about a Sash...
 
Well Cressy can only have 4 moveslots people. 1-2 usually reserved for healing, primarily Moonlight/Resttalk. That leaves 3 moves maximum. You say it will have Thunder Wave, so that is Moonlight and Thunder Wave so far. Cressy ALWAYS has Ice Beam for dragons, so Moonlight / Thunder Wave / Ice Beam. Then they need Psychic, or else, lol, they are stalled and killed by Weezing due to Pain Split. If they have Charge Beam then Gyarados would be beaten, but then again you can Taunt Cressy, switch to Weavile and own it with Pursuit!

I have seen more Bold Max HP / Def Cressys still, despite not being "standard." I would use calcs for the maximum stat pokes, otherwise you are not covering every possibility. IMO Bullet Punch>Crunch for Gengar, Mismagius, Azelf, etc.
 
blasphemy1 said:
Well Cressy can only have 4 moveslots people. 1-2 usually reserved for healing, primarily Moonlight/Resttalk. That leaves 3 moves maximum. You say it will have Thunder Wave, so that is Moonlight and Thunder Wave so far. Cressy ALWAYS has Ice Beam for dragons, so Moonlight / Thunder Wave / Ice Beam. Then they need Psychic, or else, lol, they are stalled and killed by Weezing due to Pain Split. If they have Charge Beam then Gyarados would be beaten, but then again you can Taunt Cressy, switch to Weavile and own it with Pursuit!

I have seen more Bold Max HP / Def Cressys still, despite not being "standard." I would use calcs for the maximum stat pokes, otherwise you are not covering every possibility. IMO Bullet Punch>Crunch for Gengar, Mismagius, Azelf, etc.
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I've seen Psychic occasionallyon Cressies too, and Calm Mind shouldn't go unnoticed. Most people ditch the Charge Beam/Ice Beam/T-Wave/Moonlight set for the ResTalk set because of sandstorm and such running around.

I already have Weavile for Gengar, Mismagius, Azelf, etc, and Azelf is already decimated by an Extremespeed, so I don't really need to worry about that.

Out of the three listed, my biggest problem would probably be Mismagius, in which I can't send Weavile right away because it would Sub up on the switch, and then HP Fight me to death. I just realized this team is rather Mismagius weak.

I can either 1) send in Gengar if it isn't dead yet, 2) switch to Donphan and Roar it out, or 3) let something die and revenge kill it with Weavile.

Anyways, for Gengar I can send in Blissey, and then catch it the next time it wants to switch in (it's really not that hard to predict...) with Weavile.
 
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