Battle Spot in the OR/AS era - two metas, one generation! (UPDATE: ALL MEGA EVO STATS LEAKED!)

[Feliburn]

Gallade: 68/165/95/65/115/110 Type: Psychic/Fighting Ability: Inner Focus
OMG I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS!
Outspeeds mega kang, and I doubt kang can kill with fake out or sucker punch, inner focus gives it the upper hand (still gg vs talonflame ;_;).
About some other megas:
Metagross: Speed + Bulk, something that shouldn't be taken lightly.

Camerupt: This pokemon will be scary in TR teams, eruption with 145 base special attack sure packs a punch.

Lopunny: Outspeeds mega gengar and can hit it thanks to scrappy, sounds like fun.

Hoopa: I did not expect this ?_?

Salamence: What can I say, good offenses, good speed, can get an intimidate/moxie pre-mega, has access to dragon dance, really solid pokemon.

Beedrill: 150 base attack + adaptability (solid 15 special attack), too bad it got low defenses.

That's all, I don't really have an opinion about other megas.

 

[Age of Kings]

http://pastebin.com/16baa7Yk

Sceptile gets Quick Guard, making Talonflame a questionable check for it in Doubles/Triples

Sableye gets Quash, Gallade gets Wide/Quick Guard, Crunch Gyarados, Coil Milotic, Boomburst/Bug Buzz Flygon, Quick Guard Crobat, Mystical Fire Mismagius, Coil Huntail/Gorebyss, Spiky Shield Cacturne, Leaf Blade/Hurricane Shiftry, HJK Lopunny, Water Shuriken Accelgor, Spiky Shield Maractus, Teeter Dance Grumpig, Hurricane Castform, Knock Off Ludicolo, Razor Shell Crawdaunt

http://pastebin.com/hzFmncB6

nothing notable so far, the first iteration of the list had placeholders so there were a lot of errors.

 

[cannibal]

I'm pretty new to the meta in general, but it seems to me that Mega Salamence will pretty much just rape everything in OR/AS league... Was kind of hoping they wouldn't make it quite as broken as they did, but at the same time kind of expected it.

I mean seriously, there are very few things I can think of that can take those hits and get through that bulk, especially after a Dragon Dance. Mega Slowbro could be a thing to help stop it... Any other thoughts on what can stand up to Mega-Mence?

 

[Feliburn]

I think mega manectric will help here, has intimidate and outspeeds, Hidden Power Ice still OHKOs so it is viable, just my opinion.

 

[NOVED]

I think mega manectric will help here, has intimidate and outspeeds, Hidden Power Ice still OHKOs so it is viable, just my opinion.

Well the only time manectric can really do anything to Salamence is before it DD's though. It can't reliably revenge kill it after a DD because it'll outspeed and neutral EQ ohkos.

 

[Dracomaster]

So is now the time start re-breeding pokemon for ORAS onwards?

Mostly the stuff I've bred on XY are new mons, and old mons with new egg moves, etc. I pretty much have a ton of stuff RNG'd from past games, so with all of them plus a complete supply of Dittos it should be relatively easy to make copies of the vast majority of breedable stuff no problem. I occasionally do use Battle Spot, and like most people I'll use ORAS as my main game once I get it. XY will be the home to all those older mons, while I'll just trade over Gen 6 bred mons as I go to stay current given these developments. Do you all think that Pokebank pokemon will just be barred from Battle Spot or do you think it will go further than that especially with future games?

A lot of mons will miss their previous gens exclusives though, Sucker Punch Skuntank is the first thing that comes to my mind.

Also any theories on why a content patch for XY won't happen? Do you think the two games (XY/ORAS) will be able to communicate and trade/battle with each other? (Don't know if this is confirmed yet or not)

 

[ProjectTitan313]

Also any theories on why a content patch for XY won't happen? Do you think the two games (XY/ORAS) will be able to communicate and trade/battle with each other? (Don't know if this is confirmed yet or not)

Well, Mega Lati@s and stones are coded in already, but for the rest, they'd have to add in sprites, animations, items, etc for each mega. Items would be easy, but adding sprites and animations in would be a bitch. At least that's my assumption. Battling XY vs ORAS is kind of like using Rotom-W on HGSS against someone playing Diamond.
Skuntank is obviously meant to spam Poison Gas, Venoshock, and Acid Spray in Doubles/Triples. Obvs. Yep, I totally have a Modest Skuntank with that set.

With Naive, a DD boost, and Outrage / DD / Double Edge / Fire Blast, a specially defensive Mega Aggron can dodge a 2HKO (EQ is a joke to it) but.. without Avalanche, can't do anything back without taking grievous damage at the least. Mega Slowbro was pretty much the only thing I thought of that can switch in take it and KO with Ice Beam - but not if it switches in pre-Mega, because of the -70 base Def. Which is really, really shaky and means you have to lose /something/ to get a clean switch. Greninja, Noivern, Mega Manectric, Mega Sceptile, Mega Alakazam, Mega Gengar, Mega Pidgeot (HP Ice + SR) can all outspeed and OHKO, but DD immediately ruins that (unless Scarf Noivern is a thing?) and most of them eat your Mega slot too. Doubles/Triples, it has Aerialate Hyper Voice but double/triple teaming it makes it more reasonable to kill.

 

[Dracomaster]

Is there any hope for 6v6 Singles Rated Battle Spot or will we have quickie 3v3 battles forever?

 

[NOVED]

Is there any hope for 6v6 Singles Rated Battle Spot or will we have quickie 3v3 battles forever?

I think it's safe to say singles will most likely remain 3v3.

I wouldn't imagine any format being 6v6 in the future honestly.
except based triples of course :]

 

[Pyritie]

Is there any hope for 6v6 Singles Rated Battle Spot or will we have quickie 3v3 battles forever?

6v6 is too easy to timer stall and generally be an asshole on. I don't see it happening on battle spot any time soon.

 

[Dillon~]

I honestly did think Mega Sceptile's speed would be high but 145 is is crazy! With this I can see it working great in doubles, and triples.
Mega Swamperts defense's is crazy! 110 in both! This pokemon will be able to tank do many hits, and deal back HUGE damage. Where's water punch when you need it? I can see it's main hitting attack being waterfall, and most likely EQ.

 

[Valzy]

I honestly did think Mega Sceptile's speed would be high but 145 is is crazy! With this I can see it working great in doubles, and triples.
Mega Swamperts defense's is crazy! 110 in both! This pokemon will be able to tank do many hits, and deal back HUGE damage. Where's water punch when you need it? I can see it's main hitting attack being waterfall, and most likely EQ.

There's no such thing as water punch

 

[Dillon~]

There's no such thing as water punch

ik, it'd just be cool haha

 

[mhykah]

Heh. Water Punch.

The recent interview with Game Xplain and the acknowledgement that MKhan was everywhere months ago really gives me hope for the developers to expand on competitive BSpot specifically and taking the focus off the more commonly seen threats from XY. Not to say that we won't have a successor to MKhan but things are definitely feeling a bit less centralised at least for now. One concern I have though is the power creep from the new Megas, and how the meta will likely be a lot more focused around them as a win condition - this is definitely more prominent in BSpot with less mons.

It was mentioned before but I'm looking forward to a league without genies, eruption heatran, cresselia, etc.

 

[Valzy]

Does this seem like a good MSwampert set?

Swampert@Swampertite
Naughty
182 Atk/180 SpA/148 Speed
-Ice Beam
-Waterfall
-Earthquake
-Protect

180 SpA allows Ice Beam to OHKO Mega Salamence, Garchomp, and Landorus-T
148 Speed outspeeds Mega Sceptile in rain
Rest is dumped into attack

 

[EnGarde]

I know my first ORAS competitive team will be built with mega salamence, that's for sure. ^_^ Pssh, 4x ice weakness; I can live with that for such all around awesome stats.

Heh. Water Punch.

The recent interview with Game Xplain and the acknowledgement that MKhan was everywhere months ago really gives me hope for the developers to expand on competitive BSpot specifically and taking the focus off the more commonly seen threats from XY. Not to say that we won't have a successor to MKhan but things are definitely feeling a bit less centralised at least for now. One concern I have though is the power creep from the new Megas, and how the meta will likely be a lot more focused around them as a win condition - this is definitely more prominent in BSpot with less mons.

I've been thinking about this as well. I wonder if the speed stats of the current megas (so many are over 100 now) was determined so that they could easily outspeed mega mom?

It was mentioned before but I'm looking forward to a league without genies, eruption heatran, cresselia, etc.

If the promotional material is to be believed, all legendary pokemon are supposed to be available in ORAS, so it may just mean that people will need to collect new copies of the legendaries.

 

[NOVED]

Does this seem like a good MSwampert set?

Swampert@Swampertite
Naughty
182 Atk/180 SpA/148 Speed
-Ice Beam
-Waterfall
-Earthquake
-Protect

180 SpA allows Ice Beam to OHKO Mega Salamence, Garchomp, and Landorus-T
148 Speed outspeeds Mega Sceptile in rain
Rest is dumped into attack

Not bad actually. Would need a teammate that can handle rotom-wash very well though.

 

[Age of Kings]

It was mentioned before but I'm looking forward to a league without genies, eruption heatran, cresselia, etc.

Gamefreak devs have confirmed that the National Dex will be obtainable between XY and OR/AS, so this is all but confirmation that they will be eligible in OR/AS league (except Eruption Heatran):

"Shigeru Ohmori : I can not give a specific number, but I can say that with X / Y and Omega Ruby / Sapphire Alpha you can catch all the Pokémon and complete the National Dex, just to give you an idea of how many Pokémon available."

However, they will not be anywhere near as widespread because of how obnoxiously awful they are to soft reset.

 

[Hulavuta]

Hi everyone, looks like I'm really late to the party. No excuses at all, I was just playing Smash instead of Pokemon, but I'm back now!

I'm not worried too much about the separate leagues in all honesty! I think ORAS is going to bring a lot of newcomers to the forum (that will hopefully stay) and activity of a past metagame dying off is nothing new to Smogon (or the VGCs of years past for that matter). We've been having a (relative) buttload more activity than usual recently without the game even being out yet, so I think things will only kick up from here.

I'm really excited about the new metagame, although I'll leave the predictions of what's gonna be good to players that are better than I am. Personally I'm most looking forward to being able to try a whole bunch of crazy stuff on the XY ladder and not worry so much about my ranking, since ORAS will really be the big main thing.

 

[cant say]

dat smash tho

I remember in the early XY BS metagame Avalugg got a fair amount of use, it walls physical attackers with its massive defence stat, has sturdy + mirror coat for special attackers, can sustain itself with Recover and make use of both Lefties and Rocky Helmet. Because of these traits I think it would be a good check to M-Salamence (providing it hasn't boosted, but what can take it on reliably after that?). It can tank a physical hit and KO with Avalanche, or if you predict Fire Blast then Mirror Coat it.

Calcs done with M-Salamence's stats:

calcs

252+ Atk Aerilate Salamence Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 63-75 (31.1 - 37.1%) -- 77.8% chance to 3HKO

+4 252+ Atk Aerilate Salamence Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 187-222 (92.5 - 109.9%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO

252+ Atk Aerilate Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 75-88 (37.1 - 43.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

+3 252+ Atk Aerilate Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 184-217 (91 - 107.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO

4 SpA Salamence Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Avalugg: 178-210 (88.1 - 103.9%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

4 SpA Salamence Flamethrower vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Avalugg: 146-172 (72.2 - 85.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
____________________________________________________________________________________________________
-1 4 Atk Avalugg Avalanche vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Salamence: 168-204 (98.8 - 120%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO

Here we see that M-Salamence has to be at +4 to even have a shot at OHKOing Avalugg, and that doesn't even include Sturdy, while -1 Avalugg with only 4 attack EVs and a neutral nature (meaning you can go fully defensive) can OHKO back! (if you use Rocky Helmet the KO is guaranteed). I might go with something like:

Avalugg @ Rocky Helmet / Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
Impish / Relaxed Nature
252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
- Avalanche
- Mirror Coat
- Recover
- Earthquake / Curse / Barrier / Toxic

 

[mhykah]

However, they will not be anywhere near as widespread because of how obnoxiously awful they are to soft reset.

Bad wording on my part, I think this is more what I meant to say. Maybe we'll still see perfect clones on the top of the ladder

"Details have been posted on the official site about a scheme called Pokémon Scrap. With this, from November 1st you can start collecting cards which can give you codes to redeem on the campaign site from December 1st to get serial codes for various items in Pokémon Omega Ruby & Alpha Sapphire. While most of these are simply items, such as Nugget, Hyper Potion, Luxury Balls, Rare Candy & finally a Master Ball, three Mythical Pokémon are also obtained through this method. Shaymin, Keldeo & Victini are obtained this way. This campaign runs in Japan until April 30th 2015. The cards can be obtained in various merchandise including booster packs for the upcoming TCG set, Gaia Volcano & Tidal Storm" Serebii


This would mean that unless they are distributed through other events, Japan will be the only region to legally use these Mythical Mons in ORAS league.

 

[ethan06]

Avalugg certainly seems like a fun Pokémon to try, however it's an Ice-type so Salamence's teammates may give it a hard time and make it not worth bringing at the Team Preview level. Given the huge number of special attackers and Steel-types in the meta, the opportunity cost of using Avalugg may be too high. Mega Glalie can check it with screens support and can take 0 SpA Fire Blast even without it while KOing back with Return. CB Mamo can almost OHKO with Ice Shard, whilst Sash Mamo can OHKO with Icicle Spear if it gets more than 2 hits (even if it doesn't, Ice Shard will finish it off). I think that Salamence will be easier to manage in the Battle Spot thanks to the viability of Sash on so many strong Ice and Fairy attackers. Sylveon looks promising.

 

[Feliburn]

Avalugg certainly seems like a fun Pokémon to try, however it's an Ice-type so Salamence's teammates may give it a hard time and make it not worth bringing at the Team Preview level. Given the huge number of special attackers and Steel-types in the meta, the opportunity cost of using Avalugg may be too high. Mega Glalie can check it with screens support and can take 0 SpA Fire Blast even without it while KOing back with Return. CB Mamo can almost OHKO with Ice Shard, whilst Sash Mamo can OHKO with Icicle Spear if it gets more than 2 hits (even if it doesn't, Ice Shard will finish it off). I think that Salamence will be easier to manage in the Battle Spot thanks to the viability of Sash on so many strong Ice and Fairy attackers. Sylveon looks promising.

Let's bring sash spore + rock tomb breloom o/

 

[Karxrida]

Is there any hope for 6v6 Singles Rated Battle Spot or will we have quickie 3v3 battles forever?

I highly doubt it. 6v6 is the format where full stall really shines, and I've always gotten the impression that GF knows this and want to ensure games can't devolve into hour-long stall wars like in Gen II or that one SPL match from back in March that lasted 400+ turns.

Access to move tutors will make Pokemon like Sylveon and Gardevoir much more threatening in this meta, and hopefully we won't get dominated by Mega Mom this time around.

 

[cant say]

Bad wording on my part, I think this is more what I meant to say. Maybe we'll still see perfect clones on the top of the ladder

"Details have been posted on the official site about a scheme called Pokémon Scrap. With this, from November 1st you can start collecting cards which can give you codes to redeem on the campaign site from December 1st to get serial codes for various items in Pokémon Omega Ruby & Alpha Sapphire. While most of these are simply items, such as Nugget, Hyper Potion, Luxury Balls, Rare Candy & finally a Master Ball, three Mythical Pokémon are also obtained through this method. Shaymin, Keldeo & Victini are obtained this way. This campaign runs in Japan until April 30th 2015. The cards can be obtained in various merchandise including booster packs for the upcoming TCG set, Gaia Volcano & Tidal Storm" Serebii


This would mean that unless they are distributed through other events, Japan will be the only region to legally use these Mythical Mons in ORAS league.

Except Shaymin, Keldeo and Victini are all banned on ranked Battle Spot outside of special legendary competitions so it doesn't matter that Japan gets them... Unless you're a free battle enthusiast you have nothing to worry about

In response to ethan06 it seems like anything that wants to stop Salamence will need to have a Sash lol. You can't just bring in your usual birdspam counter because you'll just have to take an Earthquake or Dragon move and die in the process. Apart from Avalugg I've looked at Cloyster (can take a hit and Shell Smash, +2 outruns +1 'Mence) and WoW + Pain Split/Hidden Power Ice Rotom-W/H... 'Mence has so much power in 3v3 it's crazy, you'd almost always have to sack something to get your answer in safe. Maybe we will actually see some Stealth Rock with the tutor coming back?