Beginners Luck [Ubers RMT]

[mc2094]

At a glance:

After playing OU for the past few months I decided to take a break and start playing in other tiers. Ubers seemed interesting and I decided to play it. Being my first attempt at an Ubers team, I didn't want to make this team extremely different from other Uber teams, but tried using move sets that weren't seen very often to give me an edge in battle. I have tested the team quite a bit and made a few changes but don't have the knowledge to really make it the best it can be. Anyways, here's the team:



Kyogre@ Lum Berry
Nature: Modest
EVs: 252 HP/ 4 Def/ 252 SAtk
IVs: 30 Spe
- Thunder Wave
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Thunder

Thunder Wave Kyogre makes for an excellent lead. It isn't used as often so most people usually don't expect a non-scarfed Kyogre and that can give me an advantage early in the battle. Thunder Wave lets me cripple common pokemon that often switch into Kyogre as it isn't really needed aginst the common leads most of the time. Surf is the main form of attack. It lets Kyogre OHKO Darkrai and put a dent into anything that doesn't resist it. Ice Beam hits the likes of Groudon and Garchomp for SE damage while Thunder provides great coverage hitting several pokemon that switch into Kyogre for SE damage such as Palkia. Kyogre is not only a very good lead but it also makes for a good late game sweeper. After getting crippled, several of its counters are unable to switch in multiple times. With proper prediction, it can often manage to open up a sweep for my other pokemon just as well. The EVs allow for decent bulk while still being able to deal plenty of damage. Kyogre is also slower than the standard Groudon lead, thus being able to get up rain. It pairs up well with Palkia, due to having similar counters, if Kyogre can paralyze the counter, then it becomes much easier for Palkia to sweep. ​

​

Groudon@ Leftovers
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 HP/ 156 Atk/ 32 Def/ 60 SDef/ 8 Spe​

- Thunder Wave

- Earthquake​

- Dragon Claw
- Stealth Rock

Groudon is used for his bulk, and useful support moves, Stealth Rock and Thunder Wave. I originally used Toxic but I found Thunder Wave to be more useful overall. It makes it much easier to handle common counters such as Kyogre and Palkia who hate being paralyzed. Normally, I send him in against something that can't really harm him. Thunder Wave is used as most people don't send in Ground types to deal with Groudon. After the initial switch-in has been hit by paralysis, I set up Stealth Rock if it is safe or switch out to an appropriate counter. Earthquake and Dragon Claw provide pretty nice coverage and let me hit several pokemon for SE damage. Dragon Claw deal SE damage to Dragons, namely Rayquaza and Palkia. Due to the overall bulk, Groudon makes for a pretty good check to physical sweepers such as Rayquaza and Lucario. His immunity to electric is also very useful. Again, Thunder Wave support helps my slower pokemon get the jump on my opponents team and is usfeul early game.

EDIT: I changed the EVs so that way Bulk Up Dialga won't cause me as much trouble.




Dialga@ Choice Scarf
Nature: Hasty
EVs: 4 Atk/ 252 Spe/ 252 SAtk
- Draco Meteor
- Fire Blast
- Thunder
- Outrage

Dialga makes for a very good revenge killer. His typing lets me switch him in with relative ease and he attains very good coverage overall. Being part steel, Rayquaza and Lucario can't do anything thus letting me use Dialga as a back up to deal with these potent threats. Dialga is also one of my only ways to deal with Darkrai as Dark Pulse does mediocre damage while as Dialga can always OHKO with Draco Meteor. Draco Meteor is Dialga's main form of attack and will dent anything that doesn't resist it. Steel types like Scizor often switch into a predicted Draco Meteor and get nailed by a SE Fire Blast. Thunder lets me hit Kyogre and Lugia for SE damage, being able to 2HKO both. Outrage was chosen over Dragon Pulse as it lets me hit hard on the offensive side. Latias and Blissey can survive Dragon Pulse with little trouble so it is useful to have a way to deal significant damage to both. Groudon is a very useful teammate for Dialga as he can handle Tyranitar and Blissey, both of whome are relied on to beat Choice Scarf Dialga.




Palkia@ Lustrous Orb
Nature: Hasty
EVs: 4 Atk/ 252 Spe/ 252 SAtk
- Surf
- Spacial Rend
- Fire Blast
- Outrage

The surprise factor Mixed Palkia has is insane. It can net at least one kill on that alone. Sending this out against a pokemon that is either slower or paralyzed will let me fake a Scarf set. Common pokemon that switch in are Steels, such as Metagross, and Scizor who are promptly taken care of with Fire Blast. This version emphasizes on Special attack, which works well with Spacial Rend. Outrage is a very powerful attack, dealing serious damage to anything bar Steel types who get hit by Fire Blast anyway despite the low investment in attack and works well against pokemon that have bulk in Special Defense. Surf lets me get good coverage, hitting Groudon for SE damage which is useful. With Thunder Wave support comming from both Kyogre and Groudon, Palkia often finds itself to be outspeeding its usual counters and can KO them with relative ease. It is also able to take Specs Water Spout from the likes of Kyogre making it even more useful to my team.



Jirachi@ Leftovers
Nature: Careful
EVs: 252 HP/ 40 Def/ 216 SDef
-Wish
-U-Turn
-Protect
-Thunder Wave

Jirachi is the newest member of the team, replacing Scizor. Although it isn't quite as powerful, it is much better at taking hits from things like Specs Dialga which Scizor struggles to do. It can still keep Mewtwo and other pokemon that were hit by Scizor's U-Turn in check. Wish support is really useful and often gives me an advantage late game and lets me keep my main sweeper, Giratina-o in good health. Thunder Wave was chosen over Toxic to better fit the team. With three pokemon able to paralyze my opponents pokemon, I am almost always going to be faster. Without Scizor, I also don't have to worry too much about giving my opponent free switches due to Choice Band. The EVs makes Jirachi very bulky, letting it scoff at most Special attacks and take Physical hits pretty well also. It attains really good synergy with Giratina-O which is pretty nice. Thanks to darknessmalice for the suggestion.

Giratina-O@ Griseous Orb
Nature: Modest
Evs: 86 HP/ 112 Spe/ 216 SAtk/ 96 SDef
- Calm Mind
- Substitute
- Aura Sphere
- Dragon Pulse

I previously had a weakness to Ground and Fighting type moves, due to having no resists or immunities to them. Not only does Giratina-O help with that problem, but he also works really well late game. With all of the paralysis support Giratina-O is often able to outspeed pokemon that can hinder its sweep. Giratina-O works as my main late game sweeper, and my best weapon against stall teams. Being able to set up on things like Blissey and Forretress that lack Payback makes him a huge threat to stall teams. Dragon Pulse is his main form of attack, and deals heavy damage after he has managed to get a few Calm Minds under his belt. Substitute blocks status and makes it much easier to set up. Aura Sphere works nicley as it lets him hit pretty much every Uber for nuetral damage that happens to resist Dragon Pulse while dealing SE damage to Tyranitar, one of the best counters to this set. I have considered Thunder in its place but would like some suggestions on this before making the change. The EVs allow Giratina-O to outspeed Jolly Tyranitar as well as outrunning things like Kyogre and Groudon. The EVs in bulk alow Giratina-O to take things like Timid Palkia's Spacial Rend. Groudon fails to 2HKO Giratina-O, and will fail to 3HKO if Stealth Rock isn't in play. The rest is thrown into SAtk for extra power that is crucial against things like Latias. I haven't tested this set as much as my other pokemon as such I am not sure whether the Rest Talk set would be better as I lack a sleep absorber( though Giratina makes a pretty bad switch-in against Darkrai.)

So that's the team. As you can see, most of the pokemon are very bulky and are capable of taking quite a few hits. The low Speed found on the team is often not a problem due to the Paralysis support and how easy it is to force switches. Unlike other bulky teams, I find myself making sacrifices more often though I suppose that is quite normal considering all of the powerful threats found in Ubers. The team does really well early game, as I can often catch my opponent off gaurd with things like Thunder Wave and mixed Palkia, and that often gives me quick momentum. The only thing I have to do from there is maintain that adavantage for the rest of the battle which is easier said than done. Prediction is key with this team, as it is with most bulky teams. Late game is where this team starts to have trouble. If my counters against set up sweepers aren't in good health I often have to make sacrifices to get rid of my opponents poke. Scarfers can also be a bit of a problem, since my own Scarfer isn't very fast compared to things like Shaymin-S. Relying on Paralysis is often required to get me out of tough situations but that can only get me so far. With Wish support now on the team, I have lttle trouble late game and have a really easy time paralyzing pokemon. Thanks for reading and feel free to suggest what you feel is appropriate for the team. ​

Sprites were from Bulbapedia, Pokesho, and Smogon
Credit goes to everyone who put the time to test these sets

 

[mc2094]

Threats will be in Red
Medium threats will be Green

I don't have a sleep absorber so that's why he's a threat. Aside from that, Dialga can take him out, Jirachi has U-turn and can always pick him off at low health.He is commonly used as a lead which means Kyogre can take him out early.

Requires simple prediction. Switch in my resist and KO. It often tries to Ice Beam Groudon which is why I usually go to Scizor. I paralyze the leads since most carry Mirror Coat and switch to Groudon.

Leads almost always get up two layers( almost ebcause I go for the 30% paralysis chance with Thunder.) Aside from that, same as Doexys-A. It just packs less of a punch.

Bulky Up Dialga is one of those pokemon that I just can't stop if Groudon isn't in good health and even then EQuake deals very low damage. Aside from Bulk Up, Groudon makes for a pretty good counter though Specs Dialga usually manages a kill.

Most are choiced so predicting becomes very easy. CB still hits pretty hard but the loack of speed mskes it quite easy to get around him.

It usually switches into Groudon and often gets hit by Thunder Wave. I usually just send out one of special attackers and hit him with SE damage. I seem weak to min put never had any actual problems.

I have slight trouble beating rest talk versions. Thunder Wave makes him alot easier to deal with. If he lacks Aura Sphere then Dialga can usually stop any attempts to set up. Palkia can hit it with SE damage from either Spacial Rend or Outrage.

He often switches into Dialga just to be smacked by Draco. Kyogre makes a decent switch though I have to be careful not to take a T-wave. Palkia laso deals quite a bit of damage. He isn't really countering any of my members which is pretty good.

Dialga, Palkia, and Kyogre hit it for SE damage. Scizor is really the only pokemon it switches into. I may give Giratina-O Thunder to make it easier to beat Calm Mind Ho-oh.

My own Kyogre can usually cripple leads while Groudon can do the same to any that switches in. Palkia is a pretty good switch since it takes limited damage from Water Spout. Scizor can often chip away at its health and Dialga hits it for SE damage and can switch-in with little trouble. Rest Talk can be a little troublesome late game so I usually resort to a physical move, usually Outrage.

Not once has Latios not managed to get paralyzed. It will switch in on either Kyogre or Groudon. From there I can just kill it witch pretty much every other member of my team. I'll usually try trap killing early with Scizor.

Same as Latios. It's just a bit bulkier but that doesn't matter too much. Trap killing this is a bit easier since it isn't as powerful as her brother.

It often gets hit by T-wave from Groudon. Dialga can hit it with Thunder as can Kyogre. Scizor can beat it if it lacks Reflect for some reason. Aside from that, it gets quite a few chances to switch but Ice Beam is usually its only attacking move giving it poor coverage against my team.

Its too frail to really do much harm. Dialga can deal quite a bit of damage with Thunder and Palkia has little trouble against it. Groudon can get rid of the rain which is helpful on a predicted rest.

It switches in to Groudon often thinking it cant really harm Mew only to be paralyzed. Scizor can hit with U-turn. It can't take too many hits in my eaxperience. I have faced quite a few scarfed Mews for some reason but I usually trap kill with Scizor since Groudon is usually the only thing it usually tries to attack.

Haven't had one battle where Mewtwo wasn't paralyzed. Even without paralysis, I have Scizor who hits it with U-turn. Calm Mind Mewtwo can take special attacks well so I usually just let Palkia or Dialga Outrage. Giratina-o can take any Self Destructs which are usually easy to predict.

It likes switching in early against Kyogre so it gets hit by T-wave often. Choice versions are dealt with depending on what move they will use. Mixed versions though, can be a nasty surprise but usually don't manage more than one kill (usually Scizor.) Bulk Up Palkia is the same as Bulk Up Dialga, don't have a perfect counter to it. Though it's easier to deal with since it's weak to dragon and elecric type moves.

Dialga handles the set up variant as does Groudon. Mixed attackers pose less a threat late game and Palkia usually outspeeds. Scizor can pick it off if need be. It has a pretty tough time switching in without Wobbuffet.

Hax is enough reason to consider this a threat. Anyways, I usually use Dialga to beat it but it has a chance to KO with Earth Power if it manages two drops in a row. Scizor does quite a bit with Bullet Punch. I usually manage to paralyze it since it loves switching in on Groudon. I actually hate facing lead Skymin, especially if they predict Kyogre will switch early on in the battle.

I just hate it when it revenges Dialga. Scizor can force it out while Palkia has quite a fun time playing mind games against him. I don't care too much if he manages to set up one of his sweepers since I can usually deal with them.

Non-Ubers-

Scizor- I have Dialga to take U-turns and Giratina-o makes for a pretty good switch against the CB set since it is immune to Superpower and takes little from U-turn. I can often take him out early by baiting with Palkia.

Metagross- Similar to Scizor though a bit easier in my experience. Giratina-o has a pretty easy time with him and Dialga and Palkia can ruin him under the sun. Palkia can bait and kill the same way as Scizor.

Blissey- Palkia hasn't failed me yet. Usually if someone has a blissey, they send it out against Palkia. Scizor can force it out and Dialga can surprise it with Outrage. Aromatheropy is an ass though since it removes my paralysis. Giratina-o can always set up.

Heatran- Simple prediction. Scizor can smack it on the switch in. Kyogre usually switches in to get rid of the sun. I haven't faced many and the Sub set is the only one I am aware of.

Weavile- Scizor is a pretty good counter as is Dialga. It has a tough time setting up which is good.

Forretress- Palkia can bait and kill. Dialga can usually catch it on the switch. Giratina-o can set up if it lacks Payback.

Tyranitar- Scizor does quite a number and Groudon takes little damage from him. Usually only switches in against Dialga.

Magnezone- Palkia and Dialga can usually beat him with little trouble. Scizor can catch him on the switch. Groudon takes little damage if it lacks HP Grass and Giratina-o can switch in with little trouble.

Jirachi- Same as every other steel except it often carries Grass Knot so Groudon isn't a good idea.

Lucario- Dialga and Groudon deal with it pretty well.

Parasect- It only switches in on Water type moves for the most part and both Palkia and Kyogre hit it for SE damage.

Quagsire- Lack of recovery makes him a lot easier to deal with. I usually just try dealing as much damage as I can with things like U-turn and Draco Meteor.

Registeel- Fire Blast from Palkia can catch it by surprise. Doesn't usually switch in on much.

Weather- I have both Kyogre and Groudon to slow down Rain Dance and Sunny Day team. Dialga works well since he can switch in on Grass Knot while Palkia and Kyogre can usually stop Sunny day teams.

Stall Teams- Mixed palkia is a very good pokemon to use against stall. I usually keep it hidden until I'm certain it can get a kill. Giratina-O makes for a good counter to stall teams also though I usually need to get rid of a few pokemon first. Thunder Wave is great at crippling Latias and thus allowing my sweepers to have a much easier time. i'll usually just trap kill Latias when I get the chance since I can't risk my opponent using Aromatheropy.

Rest Talk users can be annoying in general since I can't paralyze them though most are slow enough anyways.

 

[mc2094]

This will be my last bump.

 

[Fireburn]

I don't actually have anything to suggest, as this team is really good, but I need to point out something in your threat list.

Dialga- Bulky Up Dialga is one of those pokemon that I just can't stop. Aside from Bulk Up, Groudon makes for a pretty good counter.

Groudon is actually a good BU Dialga counter. If anything, Specs Dialga gives you issues, as it can OHKO your whole team, but I can't change anyone without messing your your synergy.

Sorry I can't be of much help, but this is a really nice team.

 

[mc2094]

Actually, Groudon is dealing around 34% from EQuake after a single Bulk Up. I suppose I may want to change the EVs and make him a bit more offensive then. Thanks for helping and pointing out the specs dialga weakness. I haven't faced very many of those and wasn't aware of that. Dealing with it isn't such a huge problem, it usually switches in on Scizor and will probably get a kill (Groudon) but I can deal decent damage to it with almost every one.

 

[Darkmalice]

First off, Mixed Attacker Palkia is not a good idea with a Groudon. Palkia can KO a 4HP / 252 Def Bliss (standard) with Spacial Rend + Aqua Tail only if Rain is in effect. This may not be the case with Groudon around. And Spacial Rend + Outrage is unlikely to KO even with SR and Leftovers taken into account. I would just used the standard Mix Palkia with SpA EVs and Surf in place of Aqua Tail. You don't need the surprise factor of extra Atk EVs. It's mainly used for Blissey, who is already toyed around with by Groudon, Scizor and Giratina-O.

To handle your Specs Dialga problem, try replacing Scizor with WishPass Jirachi. You still handle Mewtwo, Latias and co. fine with Jirachi tanking attacks and U-turning to your own Scarf Dialga, or just switching in your Dialga immediately, and Mewtwo cannot directly switch into any members of your team. Jirachi can tank more readly than Scizor and heal off the damage, forcing Specs Dialga (and Palkia) to switch out. Jirachi can also take a Thunder from time to time. Jirachi sports resistances to Giratina-O's weaknesses (save Ghost, which Dialga does) and Gira-O is immue to Jirachi's Ground-weakness, giving Gira-O a free switch in; they have great synergy. Wish can also keep Groudon healthy for when it is needed for Bulk-Up Dialga.

Finally, keep SR over SD, as SR is an invaluable move for every team. If you want Groudon to inflict more damage on Bulk-Up Dialga, use the standard 252 HP / 156 Atk / 32 Def / 60 SpD / 8 Spe EV spread with an Adamant nature. Your Groudon doesn't hit it hard enough with Earthquake. You do lose some physical bulk, but you have Jirachi to take Garchomp's/Rayquaza's Outrage, and Lucario can be played around with, because Scarf Dialga can switch in as it uses SD (and any attack except Close Combat). In a dire situation, you can switch to Giratina-O to force Lucario to use Crunch, and then you swap to Dialga.

I do notice that DDRay is very hard to deal with if it gets a DD with my changes. However, this isn't an issue, as Ray cannot come into play on any of your Pokemon save Dialga locked into Thunder or Fire Blast or Kyogre's Surf, so I don't feel that will be a problem.

 

[mc2094]

Thanks for the rate. I will change up Groudon's EVs and start testing Jirachi and Palkia. Though I'm not too sure about Palkia as I usually only use Spacial Rend as my Special attack and it deals enough damage in most cases and the loss of physical power won't let me deal as much damage with Outrage. I really like the suggestion of Jirachi as Wish passing should help out late game where I usually have trouble and let Giratina-o remain in good health which is often a problem. I'm considering something like Thunedr Wave, Thunder, or Body Slam in place of Toxic to further increase the paralysis theme I have but I'm not too sure so I'll test that quite a bit.

 

[Blue_Tornado]

Hmm, this seems like a pretty good team.

Against Bulk Up pokemon like Dialga and Palkia, you can just use Roar on Groudon to eliminate them as a threat. You can insert it instead of Thunder Wave to keep SR as residual damage is always important.

You mentioned Darkrai being a big problem with no sleep absorber. You can easily fix this problem by adding Sleep Talk to Scizor's movepool instead of Pursuit. This will let you absorb sleep while still hitting hard with your Choice Band. An alternative option for this, if you want to benefit from the sleep more, is Choice Scarf Heracross:

Heracross @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Guts
EVs: 24 HP / 252 Atk / 232 Spe
Nature: Jolly
~Close Combat
~Megahorn
~Stone Edge
~Sleep Talk

With Guts powering up your attack when sleeping, Heracross will hit extremley hard with his attacks. Jolly and 232 Spe EVs outspeed +1 Adamant Rayquaza as well everything below it. Close Combat and Megahorn are your reliable STAB moves, both OHKO'ing Darkrai. Close Combat will also OHKO 6 HP Dialga with SR up (without any boosts). Megahorn can swiftly OHKO even 404 HP Mewtwo, as well as Latios and Latias. All of this is before the boost via Guts. SE is there for hitting Lugia and others hard on the switch. If you face a non-scarfed Shaymin-S, SE is for that too.

Eliminating the likes of Latias and Dialga will greatly aid Giratina-O, and will allow it to sweep more easily.

Good luck!

 

[mtr]

Thanks for the rate. I will change up Groudon's EVs and start testing Jirachi and Palkia. Though I'm not too sure about Palkia as I usually only use Spacial Rend as my Special attack and it deals enough damage in most cases and the loss of physical power won't let me deal as much damage with Outrage. I really like the suggestion of Jirachi as Wish passing should help out late game where I usually have trouble and let Giratina-o remain in good health which is often a problem. I'm considering something like Thunedr Wave, Thunder, or Body Slam in place of Toxic to further increase the paralysis theme I have but I'm not too sure so I'll test that quite a bit.

The Specially based Mix Palkia is a better choice on most teams. The Physically based Mix is a stallbreaker, and that's really it. The question you have to ask yourself: how much do you hate stall teams?

If you use a Jirachi, definitely use Thunder Wave or Thunder. This team derives less use from Toxic.

Bulk Up Dialga is uncommon, really, and I wouldn't worry about it too much. It can't take harsh special attacks too well anyways.

I like Shadow Ball over Dragon Pulse on Giratina-O. The reason is that you may find that a CM Latias can stall you out and beat you with Soul Dew, Recover, Calm Mind, higher speed, and Dragon Pulse. Shadow Ball, with the SDef lowering chance, ends this threat. Plus, Ghost/Fighting gives you perfect coverage, I think, and strikes Mewtwo and Mew for supereffective damage. Only use Dragon Pulse for Palkia, and quite a few are faster than you (and have Outrage!) anyways.

 

[mc2094]

Thanks for the rates.

@Blue Tornado- I've fixed up the Bulk Up Dialga issue for the most part. As far as Hera goes, I wanted to have him in but I just can't really fit him in anywhere. Darkrai isn't really such a problem, he might put something to sleep but I usually don't have too much trouble against him. Though I might tweak the team a bit so that I can properly test Heracross. I like the suggestion of Sleep Talk on Scizor so I'll test that out.

@mtr12-Yeah, I've been testing the other spread and it seems like the superior option. Though Palkia was often my main form of breaking Stall early in the battle. As far as Shadow Ball goes, I really find myself using Dragon Pulse quite often. Infact, I usually use only that and rarely use Aura Sphere. I'm often in situations where Palkia and other Dragons are my main targets. I never really had trouble with coverage since I usually use him late game. Mewtwo and Mew are almost always eliminated by then. I'm still going to go ahead and test it to see how it goes. Oh, and I went with Thunder Wave on Jirachi.

 

[Arb]

did you make those sprites yourself or is there is there a website? There amazing

 

[Lucariox17]

did you make those sprites yourself or is there is there a website? There amazing

They're platinum sprites.

I can't really see problems with this team, but then again, I'm a noob. IMO, though, having Kyogre and Groudon on a team seems slightly counterproductive...

 

[mc2094]

Actually Groudon and Kyogre are commonly seen on the same team and they aren't used simply because of their whether abilities.

As for the sprites, I listed all of that info. at the bottom of the OP.

You can find them here.