Breloom (Gen 4, full revamp)

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http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/breloom

I've used Breloom on my Uber team a while back, and its pretty effective, surprisingly. It can really put the hurt in many Ubers, so I thought that it could use an Uber analysis.

I'm not finished yet, so I'm just posting the first (and only) set that it can use, which is the SubPunch set. If any of you have had experience with another set, please let me know and I will look into it, but I haven't had much success with anything else. I will, however, mention that it can be used as a lead in the "Other Options" section.

Status: Incomplete.

Still need to do: Team Options, Other Options, Opinion, Counters.

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[SET]
name: UberLoom
move 1: Substitute
move 2: Focus Punch
move 3: Seed Bomb / Stone Edge
move 4: Spore
item: Toxic Orb
ability: Poison Heal
nature: Adamant
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Breloom has great potential at becoming a threatening offensive force in the Uber metagame. Scoring a high base 130 Attack stat and a powerful STAB Focus Punch, several Ubers will be in for a nasty surprise when faced against the deadly mushroom. Not only that, but it has access to the 100% accurate Spore, allowing it to immobilize threats for a short amount of time. This gives it the perfect opportunity to set up Substitute and attempt to wreak havoc.</p>

<p>Factoring in STAB, Focus Punch is nearly one of the strongest moves in the game, reaching a huge base power level of 225. It’s capable of severely hurting several Ubers, such as Palkia, Garchomp, and Darkrai. Since Focus Punch will fail when Breloom is hit by a direct attack, Substitute is used to remedy that problem, providing Breloom a shield to help it use Focus Punch successfully. Seed Bomb offers Breloom a reliable secondary STAB attack to use when it’s not behind a Substitute, and it also hits two of the most common Uber Pokemon in the game for super effective damage: Kyogre and Groudon. However, Stone Edge is a decent alternative move to use against Pokemon like Shaymin-S, Lugia, Ho-oh, and Rayquaza, as they all resist the Fighting- and Grass-type combination. Like mentioned previously, Breloom is one of the very few Pokemon that have access to Spore, and this set abuses it to its fullest potential. This buys Breloom enough time to set up a Substitute as the opposing Pokemon is switched out, and reply to the switch-in by hitting it with a powerful Focus Punch or another attack of choice.</p>

<p>Breloom’s defenses are not quite up to par with a lot of the Ubers running around, so it may be difficult to switch it in safely or to use Substitute without it breaking. With that being said, there’s a simple procedure to follow that will give Breloom a bigger chance at setting up. The best way to use Breloom in the Uber metagame is to switch it into a Pokemon that is slower than it or doesn’t pack any form of super effective or powerful moves, such as Wobbuffet, Tyranitar, or defensive Groudon. After that’s been accomplished, proceed to cripple the opposing Pokemon with Spore, attempt to set up Substitute as they switch out, and to try to damage as many Pokemon from the opponent’s team as possible. By following that, Breloom's effectiveness level becomes much greater and it becomes a much larger threat to the opponent, especially when it's behind a Substitute.</p>

<p>The Uber metagame carries two of the most bulkiest Pokemon in the game: Lugia and Giratina. These two Pokemon are basically like brick walls that Breloom will never be able to break through, as they both generally laugh at anything Breloom attempts to throw at them. Even if Lugia is hit by a super effective Stone Edge, it can still easily stall out Stone Edge by repeatedly using Roost and letting Pressure eat away at its PP, or go for the KO and use Ice Beam. Breloom must have teammates that can deal with these sturdy threats, or Breloom’s effectiveness will plummet. Mewtwo with Taunt and Calm Mind can easily dispose of Lugia; stopping it from using Roost or Toxic with Taunt and setting up multiple Calm Mind boosts, while taking pitiful damage from Ice Beam. Darkrai can easily obliterate Lugia with relative ease as well; sleeping it with Dark Void, setting up Nasty Plot, and firing off powerful Dark Pulse attacks. As for dealing with Giratina, Darkrai deserves to be mentioned again, as it can decimate Giratina with a boosted Dark Pulse. Dialga’s Draco Meteor can severely dent Giratina as well, giving Breloom the chance to be used with success. Aside from helping Breloom take out its biggest counters, providing it with entry hazard support is extremely recommended. The reason for this is because with Spikes and Stealth Rock support, Breloom can turn many of its would-be 2HKOs to solid OHKOs. For example, Timid Palkia takes 84% - 99% damage from Focus Punch, meaning one layer of Spikes and Stealth Rock set up will guarantee that it will be KOed. Same applies with Kyogre, taking 86% - 101% damage, yet again falling under a KO with a few entry hazards spilled onto the opponent’s field. With that being said, Deoxys-s is one of the most effective and fastest entry hazard supporters to use. It’s almost always guaranteed to set up Stealth Rock and one layer of Spikes, which is what Breloom needs in order to gain more OHKOs than usual.</p>

[Team Options]

<p></p>

[Other Options]

<p></p>

[EVs]

<p>Max Speed and Attack is generally recommended when using Breloom in Ubers. Any investment in either of its defenses won't let it live through any notable moves, since its defenses are not that great to work with. Breloom needs as much Speed as it can get to outpace as much as possible, yet it still needs to retain its grand Attack to deal heavy blows.</p>

[Opinion]

<p></p>

[Counters]

<p></p>
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Thanks and happy reading!
 
Yadda, yadda.
Status: Incomplete.

Still need to do: Team Options, Other Options, Opinion, EVs, Counters.

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[SET]
name: Breluber[if thats the name I will kill myself. try something like UberSubPunch]
move 2: Focus Punch
move 3: Seed Bomb / Stone Edge
move 4: Spore
item: Toxic Orb
ability: Poison Heal
nature: Adamant
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Breloom has great potential at becoming a threatening offensive force in the Uber metagame. Scoring a high base 130 Attack stat and a powerful STAB Focus Punch, several Ubers will be in for a nasty surprise when faced against the deadly mushroom. Not only that, but it has access to the 100% accurate Spore, allowing it to immobilize threats for a small duration[eh, this doesn't sound good. "a period of time...", "a short amount of time...", etc... will be much better] of turns. This gives it the perfect opportunity to set up Substitute and attempt to wreak havoc.</p>

<p>Factoring in STAB, Focus Punch is nearly one of the strongest moves in the game, reaching a huge base power level of 225. It’s capable of severely hurting several Ubers, such as Palkia, Garchomp, and Darkrai. Since Focus Punch will fail when Breloom is hit by a direct attack["an attack" is enough], Substitute is used to remedy that problem, providing Breloom a shield to help it use Focus Punch successfully. Seed Bomb offers Breloom a reliable secondary STAB attack to use when it’s not behind a Substitute, and it also hits two of the most common Uber Pokemon in the game for super effective damage: Kyogre and Groudon. However, Stone Edge is a decent alternative move to use against Pokemon like Shaymin-S, Lugia, Ho-oh, and Rayquaza, as they all resist the Fighting- and Grass-type combination. Like mentioned previously, Breloom is one of the very few Pokemon that have access to Spore, and this set abuses it to its fullest potential. This buys Breloom enough time to set up a Substitute as the opposing Pokemon is switched out, and reply to the switch-in by hitting it with a powerful Focus Punch or another attack of choice.</p>

<p>Breloom’s defenses are not quite up to par with a lot of the Ubers running around, so it may be difficult to switch it in safely or to use Substitute without it breaking. With that being said, there’s a simple procedure to follow that will give Breloom a bigger chance at setting up. The best way to use Breloom in the Uber metagame is to switch it into a Pokemon that is slower than it or doesn’t pack any form of super effective or powerful moves, such as Wobbuffet, Tyranitar, or defensive Groudon. After that’s been accomplished, proceed to cripple the opposing Pokemon with Spore, attempt to set up Substitute as they switch out, and try to hurt[try not to use words to many times. you've used hurt (+variations like hurting) about 4-5 times before] as much Pokemon from the opponent’s team as possible. By following that, Breloom's effectiveness level[effectiveness level? take out level completely] becomes much greater and it becomes a much larger threat to the opponent, especially when it's behind a Substitute.</p>

<p>The Uber metagame carries two of the most bulkiest walls in the game: Lugia and Giratina. These two Pokemon are basically like brick walls[same as 'hurt', except this time you only used it twice but in quick succession] that Breloom will never be able to break through, as they both generally laugh at anything Breloom attempts to throw at them. Even if Lugia is hit by a super effective Stone Edge, it can still easily stall out Stone Edge by repeatedly using Roost and letting Pressure eat away at its PP, or go for the KO and use Ice Beam. Breloom must have teammates that can deal with these sturdy threats, or Breloom’s effectiveness will plummet. Mewtwo with Taunt and Calm Mind can easily dispose of Lugia; stopping it from using Roost or Toxic with Taunt and setting up multiple Calm Mind boosts, while taking pitiful damage from Ice Beam. Darkrai can easily obliterate Lugia with relative ease as well; sleeping it with Dark Void, setting up Nasty Plot, and firing off powerful Dark Pulse attacks. As for dealing with Giratina, Darkrai deserves to be mentioned again, as it can decimate Giratina with a boosted Dark Pulse. Dialga’s Draco Meteor can severely dent Giratina as well, giving Breloom the chance to be used to full effectiveness[you've used this word too many times. the thesaurus is your friend]. Aside from helping Breloom take out its biggest counters, providing it with entry hazard support is extremely recommended. The reason for this is because with Spikes and Stealth Rock support, Breloom can turn many of its would-be 2HKOs to solid OHKOs. For example, Timid Palkia takes 84% - 99% damage from Focus Punch, meaning one layer of Spikes and Stealth Rock set up will guarantee that it will be KOed. Same applies with Kyogre, taking 86% - 101% damage, yet again falling under a KO with a few entry hazards spilled onto the opponent’s field. With that being said, Deoxys-s is one of the most effective and fastest entry hazard supporters to use. It’s almost always guaranteed to set up Stealth Rock and one layer of Spikes, which is what Breloom needs in order to gain more OHKOs than usual.</p>

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Thanks and happy reading!
I call doing the Counters section Fuzz >_>
 
<p>Factoring in STAB, Focus Punch is nearly one of the strongest moves in the game, reaching a huge base power level of 225. It’s capable of severely hurting several Ubers, such as Palkia, Garchomp, and Darkrai. Since Focus Punch will fail when Breloom is hit by a direct attack, Substitute is used to remedy that problem, providing Breloom a shield to help it use Focus Punch successfully. Seed Bomb offers Breloom a reliable secondary STAB attack to use when it’s not behind a Substitute, and it also hits two of the most common Uber Pokemon in the game for super effective damage: Kyogre and Groudon. However, Stone Edge is a decent alternative move to use against Pokemon like Shaymin-S, Lugia, Ho-oh, and Rayquaza, as they all resist the Fighting- and Grass-type combination. Like mentioned previously, Breloom is one of the very few Pokemon that have access to Spore, and this set abuses it to its fullest potential. This buys Breloom enough time to set up a Substitute as the opposing Pokemon is switched out, and reply to the switch-in by hitting it with a powerful Focus Punch or another attack of choice.</p>
Why mention Palkia but not Dialga?
 
I didn't mention Dialga because it's pretty obvious that it will be severely hurt, considering it's hit super effectively by Focus Punch. I didn't really see the point to mention it.

Thanks for the proofread HD.
 
I don't play much Ubers, but this things seems completely inviable. It can't switch in on anything, especially with its offensive spread. Even if it does land a focus punch on the targets listed, none of them are OHKO'ed except darkrai. Additionally, there are only 3 common Ubers that breloom has even a hope of switching in on: Wobbs, Ttar, Blissey.
If you're switching in on Wobbs, it must have killed one of your pokes and it already did its job. Switching in on Groudon is complete idiocy. Any reasonable player will know their Groudon's speed while you will be forced to guess. If their Groudon is slower, they'll switch to their sleep absorber. If not, they'll OHKO you.

And how is this different from the spore punch set? It runs sub and a bit more speed, but plays identically.
 
I don't play much Ubers, but this things seems completely inviable. It can't switch in on anything, especially with its offensive spread.

Breloom can set up against numerous amounts of Pokemon in Ubers quite safely. These include: Deoxys-S (some variations), Deoxys-D, Dialga (not running max Speed, which most don't anyway), Groudon (bulkier versions that run less Speed), Kyogre (could take a Choiced Surf and set up, and also set up against slower variations), Palkia (Choiced Surf), Wobbuffet, Forretress, Tyranitar, Skarmory, Blissey. (I might be missing some.)

If you don't play much Ubers and if you've never used Breloom in Ubers, don't just this is completely inviable. It may look bad, but it may not be as bad as you think it is.

Even if it does land a focus punch on the targets listed, none of them are OHKO'ed except darkrai.

I don't know why this is such a bad thing. Breloom can nearly OHKO a ton of Ubers, which is amazing. By giving it a little bit of entry hazard support, it can OHKO Dialga, Palkia, Kyogre, Groudon, Garchomp, Manaphy, etc. It doesn't need to OHKO everything to be successful.

Additionally, there are only 3 common Ubers that breloom has even a hope of switching in on: Wobbs, Ttar, Blissey.

I realize it can't switch into many strong offensive threats, it's defenses are not that great as I stated in the analysis. If you read the analysis anyway, I mentioned how to use Breloom (switch it into slower things, etc.), so you can actually use it viably. There are some Pokemon it can switch in on, but there are some it can't. Just like with every Pokemon. Look at Primeape for example. It can't switch into much without taking a heavy blow, yet it's used in Ubers. Shiftry for example, it can't take a hit without getting nearly OHKOed, yet it's an effective sweeper. I don't see why Breloom should be forgotten about, it serves a great niche.

If you're switching in on Wobbs, it must have killed one of your pokes and it already did its job.

How do you know that? Don't start assuming things please. Even then, Wobb is most likely always bring down at least one Pokemon on your team anyway, whether it be Scarfed or Banded, or whatever it is. This just gives Breloom a free chance to set up and start hitting things, how cool is that?

Switching in on Groudon is complete idiocy. Any reasonable player will know their Groudon's speed while you will be forced to guess. If their Groudon is slower, they'll switch to their sleep absorber. If not, they'll OHKO you.

Any reasonable player will first find out the set Groudon is running, and then deciding on what to do next. Breloom can switch into slower Groudon when they use Earthquake, and set up from there.

And how is this different from the spore punch set? It runs sub and a bit more speed, but plays identically.

I don't understand what you're talking about here. This is a set for the Uber metagame, an Uber analysis? There's nothing else in the analysis other than that set.
 
I would suggest Facade over Seed Bomb as the 3rd slot. Focus Punch hits Rocks (Tyranitar), and Steels hard enough, and Facade will outpower Seed Bomb unless it is Super Effective, and is best against Dragons (Rayquaza, Lati@s, etc.) whom are resistant to Focus Punch.

Also, remove all Attack EVs, make it 240 HP, 12 Def and keep it Adamant, that still gives it 325 Atk (no Atk EVs), which is almost as high as a 252 Atk + Adamant Jirachi or Mew. This allows for a Leftovers #, and a small boost to it's higher Defense Stat to take resisted hits, like Scarf Chomp's EQ, Support Groudon's EQ, Tyranitar's Stone Edge, or Crunch, etc.
 
A scarfed kyogre does 82-97% to your current breloom spread, a good chance of an OHKO with a layer of spikes and a guaranteed OHKO with LO/specs. Deoxys-S will taunt you, rendering you useless. Agreed that it might have a niche role, but it's a rather small niche.
If you want UberLoom, go with a more defensive spread such as the one from hhjj and slash in leech seed next to seed bomb/stone edge. Leech seed allows you to do something to lugia/giratina and eases the next switch. Also notable is that (i think) you force rayquaza out if you seed him on the switch in the rain (with hhjj's spread). Most of your OHKOs are a stretch anyway and you'll probably be using this later in the game after entry hazards have worn down opponents and lugia/giratina have been eliminated.
 
How does this threaten anything in Ubers? 100% sleep move, fine, but when they see Breloom, they go to their Lum/Resttalker that they use to counter Darkrai (who pulls off the whole Sleep/Setup/Sweep thing a helluva lot better) and it constantly breaks your sub if not outright KO's you. He can't switch in to anything but a Foretress setting up (or something like that) and even then it just lets Foretress set up more...

He doesn't OHKO much of anything in Ubers and he has rather middling speed to top it all off. No, no, no. I wouldn't suggest him in Ubers at all. I'll fully admit I never playtested him in ubers, but I see no reason to based on any empirical evidence.

Edit: Also walled all day and night by Lugia and Giratina, the two premier physical walls on stall teams.
 
I'm locking this for now, because its viability is under question. I (and maybe Jibaku) will test this later, and unlock this thread if Breloom does decently.
 
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