BW OU Guide to VoltTurn Offense

[Agent Gibbs]

Little nitpick. Under Darmanitan, it states that you can use Stone Edge over Rock Slide for a power/accuracy tradeoff. However, with Sheer Force, Rock Slide becomes as powerful as Stone Edge and with more accuracy, so Stone Edge becomes obsolete.

Other than than, nothing catches my eye. Looks pretty good.

 

[Nix_Hex]

Be sure to mention Landorus as a threat to Volt-turn. It resists U-turn, is immune to Volt Switch, and with a Choice Scarf, outspeeds any viable U-turners sans opposing Landorus. It's also hard to gain momentum even if you pull off a U-turn, since it can U-turn on your next Pokemon or spank them with pretty much any of its other attacks. Rotom-W is a check but it's not foolproof, as again, Landorus can U-turn out.

 

[asterat]

Iknow nobody will listen to this, but this is a trend in the metagame. Wouldn't offensive momentum be a better name?

 

[BTzz]

Nice guide :). I have a couple of suggestions for Volt-Turners

Zoroark should be mentioned simply due to the fact that it provides a unique aspect to Volt-Turning with Illusion.

Gliscor and Celebi could be mentioned to add a bit more deffensive back bone to a Volt-Turn team as well as support such as Stealth Rock.

Oh and you should mention fast Sleep inducers (or Sleep status in general) as a threat to these teams. Having one of your Volt Turners asleep kills mommentum and allows your opponent to switch accordingly. The player switching around a lot means the new sleep mechanics will really hurt.

 

[Harsha]

Alrighty, time to respond. First off, thanks for catching that, Agent Gibbs! I completely forgot about Sheer Force. I'll fix that immediately. I'll also add Landorus to the list of threats. Thanks, NixHex! As for the name, I think I'll keep it as Volt-Turn since the name has caught on with most battlers. Also, Baton Pass, which I'm not covering, is another part of offensive momentum. Thanks for the thoughts, Asterat! Though I see what you are saying about Zoroark, I tried to only mention the most common Pokemon as threats and users of Volt-Turn. I'll consider Gliscor for the article, but I'm trying to keep it to primarily Volt-Turn attackers that one will normally see in the OU meta game. Celebi will be added soon, though. I'll also be more clear about sleep in the threat list. Thanks Brizznetz!

At the moment, Wario and I, along with another user (Kira Light) have worked together to build a joint team that we'll try and incorporate in the article. I'm also working on a team on my own to try and give an example of Volt-Turn, though it will be really unconventional because I want to share the effectiveness of the rarer Volt-Turners (i.e. things like Jolteon, Infernape, Hydreigon, etc). Anyhow, we'll try and get this thing done soon. Thanks for all the input, guys!

 

[New World Order]

CM HP Fire Latias is a huge threat to Volt-turn. It can come into Rotom-W with impunity and can dispose of Scizor with Hidden Power Fire. Staraptor, Azelf, and Magnezone might also be worth tossing onto here.

 

[Harsha]

Oh, that's true. I forgot about Latias. And Magnezone I'll add, though I'm not positive yet as to whether I want to add Staraptor and Azelf. Thanks for the advice, though!

 

[New World Order]

Oh, another important thing you guys should consider adding, perhaps in the Volt-turn basics section, is that a lot of common Volt-turn users are Choiced. Teams that carry a ton of Protect users, such as Rain stall, would therefore eat them apart. If you U-turn/ Volt-Switch, they will know not to switch out (unless you've Volt Switching against a Politoed or something, in which case the opponent could just switch to a Ground type). If you opt for the killing move, such as Hydro Pump on Gliscor from Choiced Rotom-W, your Volt-turn chain ends.

 

[Harsha]

That's a good point; I'll add it. I've seen Protect screw over Volt-Turn numerous times in the past, and it neuters the momentum completely unless the Volt-Turner user has a good prediction ability.

EDIT: Done with the updates. Thanks!

 

[Dezza Laa]

Two more relatively solid counters to Volt-Turn would have to be the Ground/Flying combo of Gliscor and Landorus. Gliscor easily sponges U-turn's and has the ability to scout for the Hydro Pump or Volt Switch. Landorus takes a more offensive approach being able to do some major damage to either.

Also pretty skeptical about Blissey being a counter since Scizor can Pursuit Blissey when she's low on health to remove her completely.

One final thing, I personally believe that McMeghan's no Rain, no Gain would be a better sample team of just a Scizor Rotom-W core over Wario is OSSIM's simply because it exemplifies what teammates can do to aid Volt-Turn and vice versa. But I get that McMeghan's team is outdated so its up to you guys.

 

[Harsha]

As for now, I think Blissey should stay, though I may replace it with Chansey because it sponges physical hits better. no Rain, no Gain is sorta' outdated with Thundurus and all, so I think I'll keep Wario's team on right now. I'll add Gliscor and Landorus to the list though. Thanks!

 

[Roninord]

Isn't Modest nature rather counterintuitive with U-Turn on Celebi? I guess it could be viable if U-turn is use for scouting only, but then Attack EVs are rather useless too. Rash nature just seems better for me.

 

[Dezza Laa]

Sorry about the double post, by I want people's opinions. Do Gliscor and Landorus deserve mentions as counters even though they are weak to everything Rotom-W will offer? Of course, they can mess with Choice variants, but some people are good at predicting those switches, so that's why I was curious. Thanks!

Well you say Blissey is a counter to Volt-Turning yet she can't handle anything Scizor has to offer. Ground/Flying is a much better counter to Volt-Turning than Blissey, so if they don't get a shout out I think Blissey should get removed aswell.

 

[New World Order]

Gliscor could perhaps be worth a mention as Substitute+Protect variants could be troublesome to Volt-turn teams. Scizor has incredible difficulty against Gliscor, and if Rotom-W gets hit by a Toxic while Gliscor is behind a Substitute, the Volt-turn chain is done for. Landorus could potentially lose to both Scizor and Rotom-W, and is definitely not worth a mention.

 

[Shurtugal]

Scizor + Rotom-W can both be stopped with a little sun abuser named Ninetails

Unless you include Landorus [which; isn't part of the core], Ninetails weakens Rotom-W STAB attacks, and can Energy Ball|Solar Beam on it, while Scizor can't do shit to Ninetials.

Unless Volt-TUrn has to be in weather, Ninetails is a good counter as well.

 

[windwolf777]

Honestly, if making a volt turn team, who would be the most synergistic members to use ? I was kinda thinking the scizz-tom combo, Gliscor, Infernape or Mienshao, and after that I'm stuck. Who else would possibly be best ?

 

[Shurtugal]

Well,

Lando|Rotom-W|Scizor|Hydreigon|Celebi [Bulky]|Mienshao could possibly work, just kinda random, not sure 'bout synergy and stuff.

Synergenic Pokes depends on your team, like Hydregion can use u-turn with specs, while celebi can wall with the turn, and they have dark|psychic|bug going on with scizor and stuff. It depends on your teammmates. But lets see:

Infernape|Gliscor|Infernape|Mienshao|Rotom-W|Scizor

Thats 6 altready so I don't see the question exactly. Might want to run Rotom-W SDef so you have some bulk here...

 

[Harsha]

windwolf777 brings up a good question though; I'll try and add a bit more about how to build Volt-Turn based teams in the article. However, with Volt-Turn, it really depends on the type of team. If it's solely based on Volt-Turn, then synergy is key. However, if it is an offensive team with Volt-Turn, synergy between the Volt-Turners is important, but it's not as big of a deal with the rest of the team.

Infernape|Gliscor|Infernape|Mienshao|Rotom-W|Scizor

He said Infernape OR Mienshao. Also, you included Infernape twice. Anyhow, this looks like a cool team in the making. Have you thought about Heatran? It takes pressure off of Scizor, and it also has a 4x resist to Ice-type moves.

As for the other comments, I'll get to them tomorrow. Thanks for all the suggestions, though!

 

[Shurtugal]

Rotom-W takes those ice type attacks quite nicely, I also mentioned running Rotom-W SDef for some bulk, alongside pain split, it does a decent job as it can still use volt switch.

I didn't realize he said "or".

Meinshao|Gliscor|Rotom-W|Scizor|LANDORUS|

Landorus is pretty ideal on this kind of teams, dealing with sun a bit better, and hitting sand hard. Gliscor + Rotom-W can be run as bulky pokemon in the opposite defenses, as your good there. The last Poke should be a fast special attacking mon, Here are a few goodm options

Jolteon: Speed is insanely high, Scizor and Rotom-W hate taking thunders in rain, so why not soften those up? Also V-Switches

Hydregion: Scarf sets out speed a lot, making good revenge killers. Can use U-tun efficently so this mon also works.

Hopre this helps wolf

 

[Harsha]

Alright, now time to get back to you guys. First off, that's a good suggestion NWO. I'll replace Landy for Gliscor. I'm not going to mention Ninetales, as Landorus quickly dispatches of that threat, and it actually cannot beat a Rotom-W unless it's using a specially defensive set. I'm going to replace Chansey with Blissey because it has better overall bulk. For now, those are the changes. Wario hasn't finished his portion yet because of school work, but that will be up as soon as he's free. Thanks for the advice, guys!

 

[Harsha]

I was planning on adding this team to the article after it goes through the #RMT Workshop because I tried to explain some aspects of Volt-Turn with it, and used Rotom-C to demonstrate successful uncommon Volt-Turners. Please share what you think! (Remember, this will be after it goes through the workshop)

 

[Sayonara]

You might wanna add Expert Belt Jolteon to your list of Volt-Turners. It's amazing. Nice work, overall.

 

[Mupa97]

While it's not a Pokemon, I believe that the move Protect should be mentioned as a threat to Volt-Turn. Since many Volt Turners are Choice Locked, things like Gliscor and Blissey/Chansey can always Protect first to see which move Rotom-W or Scizor will use, and move accordingly.

Especially in the case of Chansey, many will think Scizor takes care of it, but in reality, it causes massive headaches to Volt Turn teams.

Standard CB Scizor's U-turn on 252/252 Bold Eviolite Chansey:35.5% - 41.9%

And Scizor's U-turn is the strongest U-turn in the game...

Chansey can Protect to see whether Scizor will use Superpower or U-turn. If it Superpowers, switch into a resist. If it U-turns, stay in and Wish+Protect.

 

[Mupa97]

Oh, really? I must have been too quick seeing "Not much to beat Volt Turn" on that paragraph lol. Sorry for that.

And I think someone else mentioned it but Gliscor and Landorus are tough for their typing and Gliscor's Protect.

 

[Harsha]

Since Wario is OSSIM hasn't been able to get to this, I will be doing the sample teams section. As for the extra paragraph on each Volt-Turner, he can do it if it is completed soon. If not, we don't necessarily need them. I'm doing this because of the new Article rules. Also, should it be VoltTurn, or Volt-Turn?