Metagame CAP 25 - Playtest Discussion

Birkal

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CAP Head Mod

In case you missed it, we held the inaugural match for our CAP 25 Celebration on Pokemon Showdown! reachzero's (our Topic Leader) went toe-to-toe against rising star Jho in a best-of-three series that showcased Caribolt, Snaelstrom, and Smokomodo! Find out who won by watching the three replays (game one is a CLOSE ONE):


As a result, all three new CAPs are available for use on Pokemon Showdown! Visit the CAP Project Room on Pokemon Showdown to chat with users, borrow teams, and find matches. You can read about all three Pokemon in the Final Product thread.

Another moderator will put up playtest tournament details soon. In fact, we're discussing the details of the tournament here if you're interested in participating. In the meantime, you may use this thread to post your experiences using Caribot, Smokomodo, and Snaelstrom. Feel free to share movesets, analyses, replays, and other commentary!
 
I've been really enjoying caribolt. Hits like a truck and has interesting levels of counterplay. I was surprised to see that offensive Snaelstrom is really quite powerful, especially on SE hits.
 

Deck Knight

Seize Your Doom
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I've had some success after a few trials with Sub/Leftovers Smokomodo:


Smokomodo @ Leftovers
Ability: Technician
EVs: 16 HP / 216 Atk / 24 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Bulldoze
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Substitute

A few replays:

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7cap-829308504
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7cap-829323300
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7cap-829334426

I'm still tinkering with the EVs a bit, but the 16 HP EVs is to get you to 321, which is a Lefties +1 number. Because you're using Flare Blitz, that extra 1HP recovery is helpful since Flare Blitz diminishes your HP. My experience with the set is that you really have to bring it out after Rocks are down so you can comfortably KO Lando-T with HP Ice, but the key to this set is the offensive pressure you get from Sub and Bulldoze. Smoko can force a switch to get a sub out, and now every one of its offensive checks has a serious problem: After the exchange taking out the Sub for a Bulldoze, they have to sacrifice their check or else Smoko gets another Sub up.

Game 1 shows some Bulldoze utility and the usefullness of Leftovers. Tomohawk switches in after a Sub and eats a Flare Blitz, which criticals, so Hawk has to Roost. I use the opportunity to hit with Bulldoze, knowing this will make Tomohawk slower than Snaelstrom so I can Toxic it. This succeeds, and later from Turn 28 on Tomohawk succumbs to Flare Blitz pressure because of Toxic damage, with Leftovers fueling more Blitzs. Crucibelle is once again forced to U-turn because a Sub is up, and Smokomodo's STAB combination is too threatening to the rest of the team.

In Game 2, the Opposing Snaelstrom sets up a Sticky Web, so Smoko is down -1 Spe. The Sub is set up and Zygarde switches in and goes for Coil, but it takes a Bulldoze and is back to being slower than Smoko, and falls to HP Ice. Even if Zygarde had attacked immediately and broken the Sub, it would be forced out. However, since the Sub was still up, all Crucibelle could do was Mega and U-turn on it. No matter which offensive check Tmi would have switched in on the Sub, it would have been threatened with a KO.

Game 3 displays Bulldoze pressure as well. At Turn 19 Smoko is Volt Switched into a Heatran, and none of the remaining Pokemon can effectively switch into Bulldoze (Caribolt and Kerfluffle are both faster, Scizor fears Fire STAB). Had it bean Earthquake, Caribolt could have gotten two attacks off, but because it's Bulldoze faster checks get fewer attacks.

Bottom line: Tech Bulldoze is great. Provides immense pressure, especially if you can get behind a Sub, and with Tech HP Ice warding off two of the best physical checks in the game (which you outspeed), I think this set has a lot of potential. It isn't the easiest to play (actually that kind of applies to Smoko generally), but when it works it works really well. I think if you aren't running Groundinium, at least consider using Bulldoze over Earthquake. Bulldoze has a lot more safe play pressure opportunities.
 
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Well if no one will make a big post about everyone's favorite Grass/Electric non-Lawnmower Pokemon, I guess I can do a little contribution.



Caribolt @ Zap Plate
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Return / Frustration / Double-Edge
- Power Whip / Horn Leech
- Swords Dance
- Quick Attack

Obviously Caribolt's best set (at this point in time) is a standard SD set. It's crazy how much Caribolt can break through at +2. I can post some exact calcs further along the line, but under Electric Terrain at 2, this thing does 70% to Tangrowth, which is absolutely shocking. I've often described this mon as Mega Pinsir with an item, and it's clear to see that this mon is making a big statement very early on in its lifetime. The EVs are obviously maxed for Attack and Speed, and the moves are pretty straightforward in terms of powerful STAB and everything. The best way for this thing to set up is often behind the screens set up by Dual Screens Koko, and from there it can proceed to wreak havoc on the meta. One thing aobut this set is that I really recommend Power Whip over Horn Leech on this set simply because the set is best suited for HO. Power Whip gets some nice KOs that Horn Leech misses out on. Of course, if you're more conservative Play Balance use Horn Leech. If you're using Double Edge, you HAVE to run Horn Leech so that you don't have a dead elk after two turns (personally I haven't used the DE/HornLeech set but it sounds dope and you should definitely try it)

Obviously the main core this thing is currently seeing usage in is a Cari/Koko/Lucha core, as both sweepers take great advantage of Koko's screens. However, one thing that I feel is really relevant is that Caribolt also is able to beat most of the components of this core as well. Quick Attack under opposing Lucha's terrain is a great way to revenge kill Lucha and I find that this mon is really of them most consistent stops for Lucha aside from Tomohawk. Frankly, I expect Caribolt to be the reason we see a rise in Lele/Lucha cores just so Caribolt can't abuse the electric terrain.

Caribolt @ Normalium Z
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Boomburst
- Horn Leech
- Celebrate
- Quick Attack

Another fun set that I've seen make a big dent in almost any team is Z-Celebrate Caribolt, which can do just as much damage via Boomburst even without terrain. I can't fid the calcs at the moments, but +1 Boomburst from Caribolt comes VERY close to 2HKOing Mega Latias. I suppose you could also throw Knock Off on there as well, but then again, you lose the priority and/or STAB that this set really enjoys. I suppose you may be able to use Giga Drain over Horn Leech, though that mostly comes down to how much you fear intimidate.

Caribolt @ Choice Band
Ability: Galvanize
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Frustration
- Horn Leech / Power Whip
- Quick Attack
- Knock Off / Volt Switch

Not gonna lie, I haven't used this set at all, but this set takes advantage of Caribolt's nice Base 106 attack. It also is a nice user of Knock Off here, which does do some nice damage to Defensive Kitsunoh *cough*iFeedback*cough) among other things. Horn Leech comes before Power Whip here simply because I REALLY like the recovery and therefore longevity it gives, though I can understand wanting raw power. I slashed Volt Switch here just so that Caribolt does have an opportunity to switch if necessary, though I think Knock Off is better in almost every situation. OBviously, this thing really really likes having Terrain, but that should be a given.

Partners are kind of obvious as it stands: Koko and Lucha are fun and pretty beneficial for providing support and clearing a few potent threats. One thing I do think could be kind of fun is doing a double Grass with Bulu since you also take less damage from any ground types directed towards Caribolt, and Caribolt can deal with common flying types Tomohawk, Lucha, and Torny-T. Mainly though things that can't really handle bulky Waters and Ground types, like Tran and even Smok. You're definitely going to want something that beats Cawmodore too since Caw shut down both of this mon's STABs.

Closing thoughts, Caribolt could also maybe run a Specs set with Boomburst (and go the Exploud route), Giga Drain, HP Ice and Volt Switch, and it could also maybe do some dumb stuff like a bulky RestTalk set with some passable 84/82/80 bulk, though I'm not sure if that's REALLY the best way to use a Caribolt. Body Slam is also a cool option if you want to try to have Para chances, though you lose quite a bit of power in the long run so idk if it's worth it.

Hope this is something you all can use and abuse, and here's to a great playtest tour!
 
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Granny Pie

Mafia Champion
imagine if this thing had Horn Leech, damn
No need to imagine. It does. :>

Caribolt @ Life Orb
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Horn Leech
- Return
- Quick Attack

Basically the standard SD Set, but with Horn Leech over Power Whip to stay healthy, healing off LO Recoil.
 
No need to imagine. It does. :>

Caribolt @ Life Orb
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Horn Leech
- Return
- Quick Attack
Editing my post now wow. Might as well just slash that with all Power Whip mentions.

EDIT: "Magnet is better than plate because if your item gets tricked and flinged it does less damage to you" so I guess use magnet if you're really seriously worried about fling
 
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Snaelstrom @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 248 HP / 72 Def / 188 SpD
Impish Nature
- Spiky Shield
- Leech Life
- Aqua Jet
- Swords Dance

Here's a nice Snaelstrom set for the playtests! I'll add some calculations to show Snaelstrom's defensive capabilities!

252+ SpA Alakazam-Mega Psychic vs. 248 HP / 188 SpD Shellos: 172-204 (44.6 - 52.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Poison Heal
252 SpA Alakazam-Mega Psychic vs. 248 HP / 188 SpD Shellos: 157-186 (40.7 - 48.3%) -- 98.8% chance to 3HKO after Poison Heal

252 SpA Choice Specs Greninja Dark Pulse vs. 248 HP / 188 SpD Shellos: 142-168 (36.8 - 43.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Poison Heal
252 SpA Choice Specs Greninja-Ash Dark Pulse vs. 248 HP / 188 SpD Shellos: 189-223 (49 - 57.9%) -- 9.8% chance to 2HKO after Poison Heal

252 SpA Volkraken Fire Blast vs. 248 HP / 188 SpD Shellos: 159-187 (41.2 - 48.5%) -- 99.7% chance to 3HKO after Poison Heal

+1 252+ Atk Zygarde Thousand Arrows vs. 248 HP / 72+ Def Shellos: 79-93 (20.5 - 24.1%) -- possible 6HKO after Stealth Rock and Poison Heal

252 Atk Landorus-Therian Supersonic Skystrike (175 BP) vs. 248 HP / 72+ Def protected Shellos: 121-143 (31.4 - 37.1%) -- 81.5% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Poison Heal

0 SpA Jumbao Moonblast vs. 248 HP / 188 SpD Shellos: 105-124 (27.2 - 32.2%) -- 98.6% chance to 4HKO after Stealth Rock and Poison Heal
252 SpA Jumbao Moonblast vs. 248 HP / 188 SpD Shellos: 127-151 (32.9 - 39.2%) -- 99.8% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Poison Heal
252 SpA Choice Specs Jumbao Solar Beam vs. 248 HP / 188 SpD Shellos: 243-286 (63.1 - 74.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Poison Heal

252 Atk Kecleon (Smokomodo) Flare Blitz vs. 248 HP / 72+ Def Shellos: 142-168 (36.8 - 43.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Poison Heal

And here you'll find more explanations about the set overall as well as a nice, solid core for the playtests!


off topic:
Knock Off here, which does do some nice damage to Defensive Kitsunoh *cough*iFeedback*cough
excuse me and my kitty:

252 Atk Choice Band Deerling (Caribolt) Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 248 HP / 228 Def Colbur Berry Kitsunoh: 131-155 (36 - 42.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Choice Band burned Deerling (Caribolt) Knock Off vs. 248 HP / 228 Def Kitsunoh: 88-104 (24.2 - 28.6%) -- 98.5% chance to 4HKO

defensive kitsunoh for the win :BOI:
 

Birkal

We have the technology.
is a member of the Site Staffis a Top Artistis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Top CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Battle Simulator Admin Alumnus
CAP Head Mod
So I've posted this a couple of times on Discord, but I really do believe that Snaelstrom is the best of the three CAPs we introduced. It's so splashable and can run a good variety of movesets. Poison Heal is a stupid good ability, especially in a metagame where lots of mons rely on poison to KO walls (Argh / Tomo / Bao), Snaelstrom can shrug it off while recovering a ton of damage through a combination of healing and Spiky Shield.

I also pointed out that I thought Gliscor would make a pretty hot partner. The amount of healing both could pull off in tandem with Poison Heal is insane, and they cover each other's weakness pretty well (outside of BoltBeam coverage from stuff like Krilowatt). Finally, they both have a pretty surprising amount of sets they can run, with both getting rocks, hazards removal, and potential setup with Swords Dance.

These are the sets Pipotchi made up for me, but I think you could run a pretty wide variety of sets and find success:


Snaelstrom @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 148 Def / 108 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Spiky Shield
- Ice Beam
- Toxic


Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 244 HP / 152 SpD / 112 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Defog
- Roost
- Knock Off

Pretty cool core that can provide a lot of utility. Between SR, Defog, Knock Off, and Toxic, you can cover a ton of threats on a variety of team builds. Roost and Spiky Shield provide further longevity to the core, and Ice Beam / Earthquake coverage isn't too shabby. You could pair this with something like defensive Heatran, CM Clefable, or Wishpass Jumbao to cover even more threats and provide greater longevity.

Anyways, here's a couple of replays with the core in action.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7cap-830431073
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7cap-830434473
(This one is proof I'm better than JGigs definitively)
 
So I've posted this a couple of times on Discord, but I really do believe that Snaelstrom is the best of the three CAPs we introduced. It's so splashable and can run a good variety of movesets. Poison Heal is a stupid good ability, especially in a metagame where lots of mons rely on poison to KO walls (Argh / Tomo / Bao), Snaelstrom can shrug it off while recovering a ton of damage through a combination of healing and Spiky Shield.

I also pointed out that I thought Gliscor would make a pretty hot partner. The amount of healing both could pull off in tandem with Poison Heal is insane, and they cover each other's weakness pretty well (outside of BoltBeam coverage from stuff like Krilowatt). Finally, they both have a pretty surprising amount of sets they can run, with both getting rocks, hazards removal, and potential setup with Swords Dance.

These are the sets Pipotchi made up for me, but I think you could run a pretty wide variety of sets and find success:


Snaelstrom @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 148 Def / 108 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Spiky Shield
- Ice Beam
- Toxic


Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 244 HP / 152 SpD / 112 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Defog
- Roost
- Knock Off

Pretty cool core that can provide a lot of utility. Between SR, Defog, Knock Off, and Toxic, you can cover a ton of threats on a variety of team builds. Roost and Spiky Shield provide further longevity to the core, and Ice Beam / Earthquake coverage isn't too shabby. You could pair this with something like defensive Heatran, CM Clefable, or Wishpass Jumbao to cover even more threats and provide greater longevity.

Anyways, here's a couple of replays with the core in action.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7cap-830431073
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7cap-830434473
(This one is proof I'm better than JGigs definitively)
is it possible to dislike a post
 
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