CAP 7 CAP 7 - Part 8 - Stat Spread Poll 2

Deck Knight or Gothic Togekiss?

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Magmortified

<b>CAP 8 Playtesting Expert</b>
is a CAP Contributor Alumnus
Our Pokemon so far:

Beej said:
Name: Ultimate Scout
Description: A Pokemon that is very capable of forcing the opponent to reveal vital information about their team members and their moves using various techniques.
Click to expand...

Type: Steel / Ghost
With a 0 to 20 (Somewhat Offensive) Style Bias, a 20 to Infinity (Physical) Build Bias, and a Quite Good (250-299) Base Stat Rating.
Ability: Frisk / Limber

To assist, the stats are ordered like so:

HP/Attack/Defense/Special Attack/Special Defense/Speed

Deck Knight said:
Since it appears Quite Good is going for a sweep:

Final Submission:
Name: The 3 Kings of Scouting
Spread: 70/100/92/70/73/118. BST: 523.

PSweep: 159 (Rank 5, Extremely Good)
PTank: 112 (Rank 1, Above Average)
SSweep: 111 (Rank 1, Above Average)
STank: 92 (Rank 0, Average)
ODB: 19.5 (Moderate Bias to Offense)
PSB: 30.3 (Large Bias to Physical)
Overall Rating: 298 (Quite Good)


This spread is named the 3 Kings because you can customize it to scout and threaten those pokemon that most threaten your team, providing you a way to protect your team from its specific weakness. Focused Kings can outrun opponents with 115 Base Speed, The Mixed King can outrun natured 100’s and Un-natured up to Base 115, but has inferior special defensive ability in exchange for hitting both sides of the spectrum. These are of course, not the only EVs you can run.

King 1:
Ifrit the Jolly: EVs: 248 Atk/32 SDef/ 228 Spe

King 2:
Ramuh the Naughty: EVs: 56 Atk/220 SA/232 Spe

King 3:
Shiva the Timid: EVs: 248 SA/32 SDef/ 228 Spe


Offensive Calculations:

Ifrit: Offensive Calcs:

Fake Out:
To Naive Infernape: 16-19%
To SubCM Stratagem: 10-13%
To Offensive Gyarados/DDMence: 13-16%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 4-5%

Iron Head:
To Boahtar: 50-59%
To CBTar: 52-62%
To SubCM Strategem: 91-108%

Shadow Claw:
To SubGar: 103-123%
To Max HP/SA Rotom A: 59-71%
To Max HP/Def Rotom A: 43-51%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 38-45%
To Defensive Celebi: 33-39%
To Choice Starmie: 83-99%
To Spinner Starmie: 63-73%
To BU Revenankh: 53-62%

Brick Break:
To Weavile: 137-163%
To BoahTar: 62-74%
To CBTar 65-77%
To Cleric Blissey: 38-44%
To Curse Snorlax: 32-38%
To SubCM Stratagem: 57-68%

Focus Punch:
To Weavile: 273-323%
To Boahtar: 123-146%
To CBTar: 129-153%
To Cleric Blissey: 75-89%
To Curse Snorlax: 62-76%
To SubCM Stratagem: 114-135%

Earthquake:
To Naive Infernape: 81-96%
To Timid Heatran: 106-126%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 100-118%
To Boahtar: 41-49%
To CBTar: 43-51%

Thunderpunch:
To Offensive Gyarados: 100-118%
To Choice Starmie: 60-70%
To Spinner Starmie: 44-52%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 34-41%
To Recover/Def Arghonaut: 27-32%

Ice Punch:
To DDMence: 99-117%
To Defensive Gliscor: 48-57%
To Standard Hippowdon: 21-25%

U-Turn:
To Defensive Celebi: 44-52%

Ramuh: Offensive Calcs:
(All Tyranitar Calcs assume Sandstream is in effect for special attacks)

Fake Out:
To Naive Infernape: 16-19%
To SubCM Stratagem: 10-13%
To Offensive Gyarados/DDMence: 13-16%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 4-5%

Iron Head:
To Boahtar: 46-54%
To CBTar: 48-57%
To SubCM Strategem: 85-100%

Shadow Claw:
To SubGar: 96-113%
To Max HP/SA Rotom A: 55-65%
To Max HP/Def Rotom A: 40-48%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 34-41%
To Defensive Celebi: 32-38%
To Choice Starmie: 77-91%
To Spinner Starmie: 57-69%
To BU Revenankh: 48-57%

Shadow Ball:
To SubGar: 77-91%
To Rotom-A: 53-63%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 44-53%
To Defensive Celebi: 41-49%
To Choice Starmie: 74-87%
To Spinner Starmie: 65-77%
To BU Revenankh: 34-40%

Brick Break:
To Weavile: 127-150%
To BoahTar: 62-74%
To CBTar 60-71%
To Cleric Blissey: 35-41%
To Curse Snorlax: 30-35%
To SubCM Stratagem: 53-62%

Focus Punch:
To Weavile: 252-297%
To Boahtar: 114-135%
To CBTar: 120-142%
To Cleric Blissey: 69-82%
To Curse Snorlax: 60-70%
To SubCM Stratagem: 105-124%

Focus Blast:
To Boahtar: 51-61%
To CBTar: 54-64%
To SubCM Stratagem: 67-79%

Earthquake:
To Naive Infernape: 76-90%
To Timid Heatran: 99-117%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 91-108%
To Boahtar: 38-45%
To CBTar: 40-47%

Thunderbolt:
To Offensive Gyarados: 81-96%
To Choice Starmie: 58-69%
To Spinner Starmie: 52-61%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 25-30%
To Recover/Def Arghonaut: 32-38%

Ice Beam:
To DDMence: 97-116%
To Defensive Gliscor: 96-115%
To Standard Hippowdon: 41-49%

U-Turn:
To Defensive Celebi: 43-51%

Signal Beam:
To Defensive Celebi: 52-62%

Grass Knot:
To Defensive Swampert: 61-72%
To Standard Hippowdon: 52-62%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 27-31%
To Recover/Def Arghonaut: 34-40%

Shiva: Offensive Calcs:
(All Tyranitar Calcs assume Sandstream is in effect for special attacks)

Fake Out:
To Hasty Infernape: 13-15%
To SubCM Stratagem: 5-6%
To Offensive Gyarados/DDMence: 9-11%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 3-4%

Flash Cannon:
To Boahtar: 26-31%
To CBTar: 28-33%
To SubCM Strategem: 69-81%

Shadow Ball:
To SubGar: 78-93%
To Rotom-A: 53-63%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 45-55%
To Defensive Celebi: 43-50%
To Choice Starmie: 76-90%
To Spinner Starmie: 67-80%
To BU Revenankh: 35-41%

Earth Power:
To Hasty Infernape: 59-70%
To Timid Heatran: 76-91%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 88-104%
To Boahtar: 19-23%
To CBTar: 20-24%

Focus Blast:
To Boahtar: 53-63%
To CBTar: 56-66%
To SubCM Stratagem: 69-81%

Thunderbolt:
To Offensive Gyarados: 83-98%
To Choice Starmie: 60-71%
To Spinner Starmie: 53-63%

Ice Beam:
To DDMence: 100-118%
To Defensive Gliscor: 99-117%
To Standard Hippowdon: 42-50%

U-Turn:
To Defensive Celebi: 31-37%

Signal Beam:
To Defensive Celebi: 54-64%

Grass Knot:
To Defensive Swampert: 63-75%
To Standard Hippowdon: 54-64%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 27-32%
To Recover/Def: Arghonaut: 35-41%

Defensive Calculations:

Ifrit/Shiva (Ramuh shares physical attack Calcs, Any SE Special Calc becomes a KO.):

CBTar:
Crunch: 84-99%
Pursuit: 41-50% [84-99% on switchout]
Stone Edge: 52-61%
Earthquake: 140-165%
Aqua Tail: 62-74%

CB Scizor:
Bullet Punch: 30-36%
U-Turn: 17-21%
Night Slash: 47-56%
Pursuit: 41-48% [54-64% on switchout]
Brick Break and Superpower do 0

CB Metagross:
Meteor Mash: 52-61%
Earthquake: 140-165%
Thunderpunch: 52-62%
Ice Punch: 26-30%
Bullet Punch: 21-24%
Explosion deals 0

Naive DDMence (1DD, Lefties):
Outrage: 51-60%
Earthquake: 113-134%
Fire Blast: 84-99%
Stone Edge: 28-33%
Dragon Claw: 34-40%

Adamant Gyarados (1DD, Lefties)
Waterfall: 80-94%
Earthquake: 133-157%
Stone Edge: 33-39%
Ice Fang: 21-25%
Return does 0.

Timid Specs Scylant:
Bug Buzz: 22-25%
Ice Beam: 46-55%
Earth Power: 118-139%
Focus Blast does 0

Max SA Timid Rotom-A:
Thunderbolt: 59-69%
Shadow Ball: 50-59%
Overheat: 116-137%
Blizzard: 24-29%
Hydro Pump: 49-58%
Leaf Storm: 29-34%

Timid Specs Starmie:
Surf: 85-101%
Hydro Pump: 108-127%
Psychic: 40-48%
Ice Beam: 28-33%
Thunderbolt: 57-67%

Timid Specs Gengar:
Shadow Ball: 86-102%
Thunderbolt: 68-80%
Energy Ball: 28-34%
Focus Blast, Sludge Bomb, and Explosion do 0
Click to expand...

Gothic Togekiss said:
80/103/85/55/80/110

PSweep: 161 (Extremely Good)
PTank: 112 (Above Average)
SSweep: 88 (Below Average)
STank: 106 (Average)
ODB: 20.0 (Bias to Offense) lol right on the mark
PSB: 36.2 (Large Bias to Physical)
BSR: 298 (Quite Good)
BST: 513 (Boom baby)

Holy Shit, I actually got it to be within Quite Good range while actually getting the ODB to be on the money. It's also have one of the lowest BST ever made on CAP just for those who one a Pokemon with low BST. 80/85/80 is theoretically above average defense with it's typing, while 103 in ATK is just strong enough to force some switches, but not enough to sweep properly and/or without stat-ups. 110 speed is what the generally public wanted for CAP7 so I stuck with that.

Defensive Calculations: No defensive EV in either spread.

Standard CBTar:
Crunch: 84.05% - 99.00%
Stone Edge: 62.79% - 73.75%
Aqua Tail: 62.79% - 74.09%
Earthquake: KO

Standard CBGross:
Meteor Mash: 52.49% - 61.79%
Earthquake: KO
Thunderpunch: 52.49% - 62.13%
Explosion deals 0

Standard (Hasty) SpecsClant:
Bug Buzz: 19.93% - 23.59%
Ice Beam: 42.19% - 49.83%
Blizzard: 53.49% - 63.12%
Earth Power: KO
Focus Blast deals 0.

Special LO Mixape:
Flamethrower: KO
Grass Knot (80 power assumed): 9.63% - 11.30%
Hidden Power [Ice]: 16.94% - 20.27%
Close Combat/Vacuum Wave deals 0.

Physical LO Mixape:
Overheat: KO
Blaze Kick: KO
Earthquake: 93.02% - 109.63% KO in any regards
Stone Edge: 27.57% - 32.56%
U-Turn: 7.97% - 9.30%
Close Combat/Mach Punch deals 0

Standard LO Salamence with 1 DD:
Outrage: 80.73% - 95.35%
Stone Edge: 53.82% - 63.46%
Dragon Claw: 53.82% - 63.79%
Earthquake: KO.
Fire Blast: KO.
Draco Meteor: 43.52% - 51.16%

Standard (Timid) SpecsMence:
Draco Meteor: 60.80% - 71.76%
Dragon Pulse: 39.20% - 46.18%
Fire Blast: KO
Hydro Pump: 69.44% - 82.06%

Standard (Jolly) CBDuggy:
Earthquake: KO
Stone Edge: 26.91% - 31.56%
Sucker Punch: 35.88% - 42.52%
Aerial Ace: 13.29% - 15.95%

Offensive Calculations: 252 Atk, 252 Speed, 4 HP. Jolly Nature

Iron Head
TyraniBoah: 50.50% - 59.90%
CBTar: 52.99% - 62.86%
SubCMGem: 93.18% - 110.39%
Weavile: 111.74% - 132.38%

Earthquake
TyraniBoah: 42.08% - 50.00%
CBTar: 44.16% - 52.47%
Heatran: 108.98% - 128.79%
Infernape: 83.28% - 98.29%

Brick Break
TyraniBoah: 63.37% - 75.25%
CBTar: 66.49% - 78.96%
Weavile: 139.50% - 165.12%
SubCMGem: 58.16% - 68.84%
Cleric Blissey: 42.09% - 49.77%

Focus Punch
TyraniBoah: 126.73% - 149.50%
CBTar: 132.99% - 156.88%
Weavile: 279.00% - 328.83%
SubCMGem: 116.32% - 137.09%
Cleric Blissey: 83.87% - 98.92%

Ice Punch
DDmence: 101.51% - 119.64% (Intimidate: 67.67% - 79.76%)
Celebi: 25.25% - 30.20%

Stone Edge
DDmence: 80.36% - 94.86% (53.78% - 63.44%)
LODos: 81.57% - 96.07% (54.38% - 64.05%)

Thunder Punch
LODos: 102.72% - 120.85% (Intimidate: 67.67% - 80.97%)
SpinnerStar: 45.42% - 53.56%
SpecStar: 60.54% - 72.03%

Fire Punch
SDScizor: 95.50% - 113.49%
Forrty: 48.59% - 57.63%
Celebi: 25.25% - 30.20%

Shadow Claw
Gengar: 120.31% - 142.53%
BU Revvy: 59.38% - 70.31%
SpinnerStar: 70.18% - 82.81%
SpecStar: 90.42% - 108.05%
Celebi: 37.62% - 45.05%
Max HP/SpD Rotom Forms: 65.13% - 76.97%
Max HP/Def Rotom Form: 51.32% - 61.18%

U-turn
Standard Celebi: 47.52% - 56.44%
Click to expand...

Use the clicky poll above to vote.
 
Sticking with my decision in the other poll, Deck Knight all the way. This thing needs that speed.
 
I hope people realize that the two Pokemon you would outspeed with the extra speed don't need to be scouted, on top of the fact that Deck's spread is weaker physically. Going mixed is useless on a scout, especially with such a low base speed. Heck, Azelf has 125/125/115 stats and doesn't go mixed! Vote Gothic Togekiss.
 
Voted GT. Not liking the superspeed, and it could do well without it. GT's spread is just right. Speed isn't everything, but it is something. 110 is fine enough for a scout.
 
kaonohiokala said:
Deck Knight all the way. Gothic Togekiss's set just doesn't have enough speed.

Okay, so CAP7 loses to Dugtrio regardless, but at least with DK's spread, it can outspeed and U-turn away from any Magnezone.
Click to expand...
One question, if you're fully aware that CAP7 can outspeed and possibly kill your Maggy with just one move, would you still send Maggy in to stop CAP7? Also, can you really switch into a Maggy, survive it's first move and kill it before it can kill you?

Speed isn't everything people. You can be the faster thing on the planet, but if can't take a hit worth of damn then it's pointless. 110 speed and perfectly fine for CAP7's goal, beside went was it said that CAP7 had to outspeed Duggy and Maggy?
 
kaonohiokala said:
Okay, so CAP7 loses to Dugtrio regardless, but at least with DK's spread, it can outspeed and U-turn away from any Magnezone.
Click to expand...

You are aware that Scarf Magnezone is pretty rare in CAP, right? Out of the 380 Magnezones used in CAP total, only some 138 had Scarf. That's equivelant to #53 in usage: Crobat. You are about as likely to see Scarf Magnezone in CAP, as you are Crobat. That is not likely.

You might want to take into account what's actually present before jumping to conclusions on this. :S Either way, so what if Scarf Magnezone or Dugtrio can trap it? They can do that to plenty of other top-billed Pokemon. That doesn't make their usage plummet or make them any less usable (especially since Scarf Magnezone and Dugtrio really aren't that plentiful in the first place).

Bottom-line: Voting Deck just to beat Scarf Magnezone is paranoid (nothing against Deck's spread, personally. Just the Scarf Magnezone thing is... paranoid).

Voted GT. Extra defensive padding, plus the easily-acceptable Speed (marginally higher attack's a bonus) is go. Speed is not everything. Stop pretending Scarf Magnezone is going to trap you everywhere you look. It's not.
 
Yeah, the speed isn't really the appeal of DK's spread to me. Actually outspeeding Latias is nice, but isn't too significant to me. What really pulls me in is the usable Special Attack stat, which opens up some nice options. But both are very nice spreads.
 
Both are really good but i have to go with Deck Knight, the extra speed would help in its scouting a bit more imo
 
Went with Deck Knight. Outspeeding Scarf Magnezone is significant, even if it's not used much. Having a single pokemon able to merk this thing just by switching in will ruin it. If it becomes good, and scarf Magnezone is as cheap a fix for it as Magneton was for Skarmory in adv., then Magnezone usage will come up and it will become useless. That kind of thing makes for a decidedly unbalanced metagame.
 
ScarfMaggy TB against 32 SpD GT: 54.15% - 64.12%
ScarfMaggy TB against 32 SpD DK: 76.16% - 90.04%

ScarfMaggy HPFire/Ground against 32 SpD GT: 53.82% - 63.79%
ScarfMaggy HPFire/Ground against 32 SpD DK: 75.44% - 88.97%

-----------

My Spread EQ against Maggy: 116.73% - 138.08%
DK Spread EQ against Maggy: 115.30% - 136.65%

Now tell me, how is Magnezone a problem again? This thing can survive Scarfzone's fury and slap it's metal ass with an EQ, why is needing to outspeed it that much important?
 
Because this guy won't always be at 100%.

Regardless, I don't care about Scarf Magnezone. I voted for DK because something with Steel / Ghost typing doesn't need good defensive stats to switch into anything it wants.
 
Deck Knight, but the fact that Dugtrio is a counter regardless of which spread wins is a sweet relief. If it were a choice between Gothic Togekiss and a spread with base speed 120 or more, I would have voted Gothic Togekiss.

Overall, I would have preferred a spread with less than base 100 attack as well so that its physical sweepiness wasn't extremely good, but beggars can't be choosers.
 
Deck's is too fast for my liking. If the opponent wants to trap/kill you, you still learned something valuable about their team.

I'm surprised I overlooked Gothic Togekiss' submissionin during the bold vote, but what I voted for there (darkie) is entirely similar, so I naturally went with this ^_^
 
Gothic Togakiss, I dont really care if Scarf Magnazone can outspeed it, whilst you can just EQ it back. The extra attack should be enough to make Pokemon switch away more.
 
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