It's a visual bug AFAIK tied to how moves aren't shown to have their types properly swapped on move preview in battle. You'll do full damage if hitting with an originally physical move and half if hitting with an originally special move. It would be a nice QOL change if they did show properly but it isn't too big of an issue
-
Check out the relaunch of our general collection, with classic designs and new ones by our very own Pissog!
-
The leaders of this forum are April, dhelmise, and Giagantic. The moderators of this forum are Chessking345, KaenSoul, kenn, Ransei, QT, and Tea Guzzler.
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
Metagame Category Swap
- Thread starter zastra
- Start date
Lucario is a great EKiller with Nasty Plot, it definitely has a niche as a anti offense mon
just wanted to talk about some of the 'mons ive been enjoying lately.
Dragapult @ Heavy-Duty Boots / Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dragon Dance
- Shadow Ball
- Dragon Pulse
- Substitute
dd pulse is an extremely flexible 'mon whose set can probably be optimized to beat anything it wants. ive found a lot of success with tera normal sub+dd set. the idea is to sub against 'mons like mola which normally cant do much damage to you and avoid poltergeist from 'mons like (tera) gholdengo. often you'd set up with dd and win games. tera fire+fire blast also has potential imo, but i havent been able to test it much.
Gholdengo @ Leftovers / No Item
Ability: Good as Gold
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 192 Def / 64 Spe
Bold Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Poltergeist
- Low Kick
- Recover
the problem with iron head is that it doesn't rly do as much damage to darks as id like. low kick is a great option to destroy 'mons like roaring moon on the switch and hey, even 'mons like itemless corv. no item ghold is also an insane tech vs other gholds.
Primarina @ Leftovers / No Item
Ability: Torrent
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
- Calm Mind
- Encore
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
nothing much to explain here, encore utility+natural fairy typing is just, really good. you encore vs setup, and it even gives u the advantage vs potential tera. jet is also a decent way to pick off chipped targets. it's also a great anti rain 'mon.
Dragapult @ Heavy-Duty Boots / Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dragon Dance
- Shadow Ball
- Dragon Pulse
- Substitute
dd pulse is an extremely flexible 'mon whose set can probably be optimized to beat anything it wants. ive found a lot of success with tera normal sub+dd set. the idea is to sub against 'mons like mola which normally cant do much damage to you and avoid poltergeist from 'mons like (tera) gholdengo. often you'd set up with dd and win games. tera fire+fire blast also has potential imo, but i havent been able to test it much.
Gholdengo @ Leftovers / No Item
Ability: Good as Gold
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 192 Def / 64 Spe
Bold Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Poltergeist
- Low Kick
- Recover
the problem with iron head is that it doesn't rly do as much damage to darks as id like. low kick is a great option to destroy 'mons like roaring moon on the switch and hey, even 'mons like itemless corv. no item ghold is also an insane tech vs other gholds.
Primarina @ Leftovers / No Item
Ability: Torrent
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature
- Calm Mind
- Encore
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
nothing much to explain here, encore utility+natural fairy typing is just, really good. you encore vs setup, and it even gives u the advantage vs potential tera. jet is also a decent way to pick off chipped targets. it's also a great anti rain 'mon.
Just a quick announcement here but the first of 2 (possibly 3) suspect tours will be hosted tomorrow, Monday July 15th at 2pm GMT-4
Reqs will be given out to those that make it to the finals and, depending on the amount of people for the tour, possibly the semi-finalists as well.
Make sure to post in the suspect thread with proof of your reqs!
See y'all in the OM room then!
Reqs will be given out to those that make it to the finals and, depending on the amount of people for the tour, possibly the semi-finalists as well.
Make sure to post in the suspect thread with proof of your reqs!
See y'all in the OM room then!
Last edited:
I'm loving this metagame. As always i try to make some pokemon shine. This time i found sand quite interesting -and also niche, sadly little bit overwhelmed by rain-. I feel that with the proper support some teams could be viable. In this sense, the beauty hipo sand setter its quite nice for this meta. I tried with this set:
Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 220 HP / 240 Def / 48 SpD
Impish Nature
- Scorching Sands
- Stealth Rock
- Muddy Water
- Slack Off
Hippowdon its pretty good overall and -in my opinion- overlooked. It has a great potential as a bulky physical defensive mon. It can easily tank mons like ddance roaring moon/dragapult and so on. Scorching sands 30% burn chance is the new physical scald to even secure more longevity. Tera water functions in order to counter some SE ice and water hits, and sand setting provides some playability -sadly almost all rock mons on this meta are quite bad to take advantage of spdef boost- but there are some ones that can take advantage of. For example:
Garchomp @ Bright Powder
Ability: Sand Veil
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Fire/Dragon
EVs: 40 HP / 216 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Flamethrower/Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Dragon Pulse
This set is hella nasty, but i love it. Finally Chomp gets its fire coverage that prays of in regular meta. Sand veil + bright powder provides high chances of setting without problem against some key mons. Once it boosts up, it break trough a lot of mons. Fire is excelent offensively, but also dragon its nice in this meta with a lot of pults/R-moon/latios
anyways. im still improving to make sand viable, i think it has great potential :)
Ability: Sand Stream
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 220 HP / 240 Def / 48 SpD
Impish Nature
- Scorching Sands
- Stealth Rock
- Muddy Water
- Slack Off
Hippowdon its pretty good overall and -in my opinion- overlooked. It has a great potential as a bulky physical defensive mon. It can easily tank mons like ddance roaring moon/dragapult and so on. Scorching sands 30% burn chance is the new physical scald to even secure more longevity. Tera water functions in order to counter some SE ice and water hits, and sand setting provides some playability -sadly almost all rock mons on this meta are quite bad to take advantage of spdef boost- but there are some ones that can take advantage of. For example:
Ability: Sand Veil
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Fire/Dragon
EVs: 40 HP / 216 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Flamethrower/Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Dragon Pulse
This set is hella nasty, but i love it. Finally Chomp gets its fire coverage that prays of in regular meta. Sand veil + bright powder provides high chances of setting without problem against some key mons. Once it boosts up, it break trough a lot of mons. Fire is excelent offensively, but also dragon its nice in this meta with a lot of pults/R-moon/latios
anyways. im still improving to make sand viable, i think it has great potential :)
We are planning to host 3 more suspect tournaments in the OM Room for the Tera suspect! The timings are as follows:
- 2:30 PM Saturday GMT
- 3:30 AM Sunday GMT
- 10 PM Sunday GMT
Found this as a cool niche thing and wanted to share.
Introducing to the REVENGE KILLER:
Greninja @ Choice Specs / Choice Scarf
Ability: Protean
Tera Type: Water (useless because of protean) EDIT: May normal or ghost be the right tera in some situations
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Retaliate
- Gunk Shot / Liquidation
- Shadow Sneak
- U-turn
No normal + retaliate mon on this gen... well, there is one! This thing is an excelente revenge killer. Specs 502 SPA stab boosted 140 power retaliate when a buddy faints is amazingly powerful. U-turn is great for pivoting and it also has shadow sneak in case of priority needed in order to -again- revenge kill some set-up sweepers. The last move is on your own. I prefer Gunk shot cause the base power. But liquidation could fit, even tough switcheroo. This mon works specially well with sticky web teams, but is an overall great option.
Im having a lot of fun playing this meta. Sadly i feel there is no much people playing it :(
Introducing to the REVENGE KILLER:
Ability: Protean
Tera Type: Water (useless because of protean) EDIT: May normal or ghost be the right tera in some situations
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Retaliate
- Gunk Shot / Liquidation
- Shadow Sneak
- U-turn
No normal + retaliate mon on this gen... well, there is one! This thing is an excelente revenge killer. Specs 502 SPA stab boosted 140 power retaliate when a buddy faints is amazingly powerful. U-turn is great for pivoting and it also has shadow sneak in case of priority needed in order to -again- revenge kill some set-up sweepers. The last move is on your own. I prefer Gunk shot cause the base power. But liquidation could fit, even tough switcheroo. This mon works specially well with sticky web teams, but is an overall great option.
Im having a lot of fun playing this meta. Sadly i feel there is no much people playing it :(
Last edited:
following the tera suspect, the council has voted on another slate!
Damp Rock, Dragapult, and Roaring Moon have been quickbanned from Category Swap!
Anyone who's played the meta recently would understand how potent rain is. primary abusers of rain include mons like basculegion and kingdra, which can spam moves like wave crash and weather ball in rain and outright 2hko, if not ohko, practically everything-- and the numbers are even crazier if you take choice items and tera into account. flip turn is also an amazing form of momentum, as youre not stopped by anything other than certain semi rare water absorb mons. other rain mons include overqwil and barraskewda, and these mons are also not to be underestimated, as overquil has a very useful typing and access to sd+sludge+dpulse, while skewda can click hpump / surf + ice beam under rain.
pult is one of the top faces on offense. dd pult is an extremely potent cleaner and breaker, and being one of the fastest mons in the tier, very difficult to offensively contain. generally run with a tera fire set, it's immune to wisp and fires off insanely powerful fire blasts at a boosted atk while being resistant to fairy. random tera water + hpump sets are also annoying to face.
very similar to pult, tho it's bulkier and carries roost at times. dark typing has it's own benefits too, like being one of the best answers to gholdengo. tho it can run tera fire and be pult 2.0 version Roost+dpluse, tera flying + hurricane is very potent bcuz it break past zamazenta, or at the very least, force a tera.
-----------------
was voted on, but ended up not being banned. bax is good, but it has to p much rely on its ice stabs and is comparatively slower and more bearable.
and that is all. thank you, and i hope everyone is enjoying catswap!
| zastra | kenn | velc | tea | FINAL | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Damp Rock | BAN | BAN | BAN | BAN | BAN |
| Baxcalibur | DNB | ABS | DNB | ABS | DNB |
| Dragapult | DNB | BAN | BAN | BAN | BAN |
| Roaring Moon | DNB | BAN | BAN | BAN | BAN |
Damp Rock, Dragapult, and Roaring Moon have been quickbanned from Category Swap!
Anyone who's played the meta recently would understand how potent rain is. primary abusers of rain include mons like basculegion and kingdra, which can spam moves like wave crash and weather ball in rain and outright 2hko, if not ohko, practically everything-- and the numbers are even crazier if you take choice items and tera into account. flip turn is also an amazing form of momentum, as youre not stopped by anything other than certain semi rare water absorb mons. other rain mons include overqwil and barraskewda, and these mons are also not to be underestimated, as overquil has a very useful typing and access to sd+sludge+dpulse, while skewda can click hpump / surf + ice beam under rain. pult is one of the top faces on offense. dd pult is an extremely potent cleaner and breaker, and being one of the fastest mons in the tier, very difficult to offensively contain. generally run with a tera fire set, it's immune to wisp and fires off insanely powerful fire blasts at a boosted atk while being resistant to fairy. random tera water + hpump sets are also annoying to face. very similar to pult, tho it's bulkier and carries roost at times. dark typing has it's own benefits too, like being one of the best answers to gholdengo. tho it can run tera fire and be pult 2.0 version Roost+dpluse, tera flying + hurricane is very potent bcuz it break past zamazenta, or at the very least, force a tera.-----------------
was voted on, but ended up not being banned. bax is good, but it has to p much rely on its ice stabs and is comparatively slower and more bearable. and that is all. thank you, and i hope everyone is enjoying catswap!
No more pult, moon and rain sweep abusers… Gholdengo is looking amazingly now, scarf trick set or t-wave plot, with the proper supporting, will thrive. Also the niche sand teams could possibly fit better now.following the tera suspect, the council has voted on another slate!
zastra kenn velc tea FINAL Damp Rock BAN BAN BAN BAN BAN Baxcalibur DNB ABS DNB ABS DNB Dragapult DNB BAN BAN BAN BAN Roaring Moon DNB BAN BAN BAN BAN
Damp Rock, Dragapult, and Roaring Moon have been quickbanned from Category Swap!
-----------------
and that is all. thank you, and i hope everyone is enjoying catswap!
Fun changes to the meta for this last week of ladder :)
So sad to hear this meta is only playable for one more week. Been having so much fun with this team thats had me peak at #19. Also i did not feel roaring moon was broken but i clearly was not running one of the more broken sets haha.
Keldeo @ Choice Specs
Ability: Justified
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Liquidation
- Close Combat
- Flip Turn
- Aqua Jet
Keldeo is easily one of the best special breakers in the meta imo, i had stone edge over flip turn for a while but rly youre just clicking cc 90% of the time anyway.
Zoroark-Hisui @ Life Orb
Ability: Illusion
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Poltergeist
- Body Slam
- Shadow Sneak
This single pokemon is the reason i ever got so high, poltergeist+shadow sneak is the deadliest combo, always great as a lead with dudunsparce as the illusion. Poltergeist just pulls of the craziest OHKOs and sneak is very strong too. Also there's very few ghost types as good as this, especially with pult gone, so rarely any body slam mindgames.
Bellossom @ Leftovers
Ability: Chlorophyll
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 204 Def / 52 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Strength Sap
- Drain Punch
- Triple Axel
This team slot has been torterra, zarude, golem-alola, ..., etc. So still a work in progress, but this has a lot of potential, tho it would work better on a team built around it.
Baxcalibur @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Thermal Exchange
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Freeze-Dry
- Dragon Pulse
- Ice Beam
This particular set struggles with steels but is still a nice wincon that can come in clutch, freeze dry always kills water types at +1 (also i was accidentally running 0 atk ivs on this set the whole time lol)
Dudunsparce @ Leftovers
Ability: Rattled
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Glare
- Coil
- Boomburst
- Roost
Mostly here to spam glare and be a physical wall. Can sometimes be solid with coil boomburst, which is already strong unboosted.
Roaring Moon @ Booster Energy
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Flamethrower
- Dragon Dance
- Dragon Pulse
Booster energy makes it a strong revenge killer which can often win the game with ddance and a welltimed tera. Gonna keep using this one till the ban comes through haha
Very fun meta . Thank god damp rock is gone
Keldeo @ Choice Specs
Ability: Justified
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Liquidation
- Close Combat
- Flip Turn
- Aqua Jet
Keldeo is easily one of the best special breakers in the meta imo, i had stone edge over flip turn for a while but rly youre just clicking cc 90% of the time anyway.
Zoroark-Hisui @ Life Orb
Ability: Illusion
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Poltergeist
- Body Slam
- Shadow Sneak
This single pokemon is the reason i ever got so high, poltergeist+shadow sneak is the deadliest combo, always great as a lead with dudunsparce as the illusion. Poltergeist just pulls of the craziest OHKOs and sneak is very strong too. Also there's very few ghost types as good as this, especially with pult gone, so rarely any body slam mindgames.
Bellossom @ Leftovers
Ability: Chlorophyll
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 204 Def / 52 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Strength Sap
- Drain Punch
- Triple Axel
This team slot has been torterra, zarude, golem-alola, ..., etc. So still a work in progress, but this has a lot of potential, tho it would work better on a team built around it.
Baxcalibur @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Thermal Exchange
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Freeze-Dry
- Dragon Pulse
- Ice Beam
This particular set struggles with steels but is still a nice wincon that can come in clutch, freeze dry always kills water types at +1 (also i was accidentally running 0 atk ivs on this set the whole time lol)
Dudunsparce @ Leftovers
Ability: Rattled
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Glare
- Coil
- Boomburst
- Roost
Mostly here to spam glare and be a physical wall. Can sometimes be solid with coil boomburst, which is already strong unboosted.
Roaring Moon @ Booster Energy
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Flamethrower
- Dragon Dance
- Dragon Pulse
Booster energy makes it a strong revenge killer which can often win the game with ddance and a welltimed tera. Gonna keep using this one till the ban comes through haha
Very fun meta . Thank god damp rock is gone
Another "discovery" that probably isn't playable post Damp Rock ban: Squawkabilly has Hustle + Hurricane. Feels like a one trick pony like Gale Wings Hurricane Talonflame, but it can take rocks damage and it hits ~10% harder.
252+ Atk Hustle Squawkabilly Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Dragapult: 306-360 (96.5 - 113.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
Base 96 attack/92 speed and paper defenses so I guess it needs to be Scarf to actually do anything. But finding a way to make Band work would be hilarious.
252+ Atk Hustle Squawkabilly Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Dragapult: 306-360 (96.5 - 113.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
Base 96 attack/92 speed and paper defenses so I guess it needs to be Scarf to actually do anything. But finding a way to make Band work would be hilarious.