OU Celesteela

[OVERVIEW]

* Great defensive typing in Steel / Flying coupled with good overall mixed bulk makes Celesteela a great tank and a useful check to several OU threats such as Tapu Lele, Latios, Mega Scizor, and Magearna.
* It can wear down various threats with Leech Seed + Protect.
* Base 101 Attack and base 107 Special Attack means Celesteela can put up a fight and not be complete setup fodder. This is further benefitted by good a STAB attack in Heavy Slam, which thanks to Celesteela's high weight has around 120 Base Power against most targets and useful coverage in Flamethrower and Earthquake that allows it to actively beat opposing bulky Steel-types and Electric-types.
* Beast Boost allows Celesteela to further boost its already good Special Defense, or its Special Attack if it opts for a more offensive set, if it achieves a KO.
* Its relatively low base 61 Speed leaves it outsped by various offensive threats.
* Lack of reliable recovery can be compromising for its bulk.
* Vulnerable to being trapped by Magneton more than Skarmory, as it lacks a form of reliable recovery to make up for not using Leftovers.

[SET]
name: Specially Defensive
move 1: Leech Seed
move 2: Protect
move 3: Heavy Slam
move 4: Flamethrower / Earthquake
item: Leftovers
ability: Beast Boost
nature: Sassy / Careful
evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

* Leech Seed allows Celesteela to recover health and whittle down its foe, and it is essential because Celesteela has no reliable recovery otherwise.
* Protect helps Celesteela gain more recovery from Leech Seed as well as it to scout for the foe's moves and potential Choice items.
* Heavy Slam is a great STAB option, thanks to Celesteela's weight.
* Flamethrower allows Celesteela to heavily damage other bulky Steel-types such as Mega Scizor, Skarmory, and Ferrothorn and avoid being setup fodder for Kartana.
* Earthquake can be used to lure in Heatran, Alolan Marowak, and Magnezone and hit them super effectively, which can come into Celesteela's other moves bar Leech Seed, and Flamethrower in Magnezone's case, with impunity.

Set Details
========

* Leftovers provides Celesteela with passive recovery alongside Leech Seed.
* Shed Shell can be used in order to avoid getting trapped by Magnezone, although losing Leftovers makes Celesteela easier to wear down.
* Maximum investment in HP and Special Defense allows Celesteela to effectively check Pokemon such as Tapu Lele and Latios.
* A Sassy nature increases Celesteela's Special Defense without sacrificing power from Heavy Slam or Flamethrower.
* If Earthquake is used instead of Flamethrower, a Careful nature should be chosen, as it allows Celesteela to outspeed uninvested Clefable and Speed tie with uninvested Tyranitar.

Usage Tips
========

* Celesteela should mainly be switched into Pokemon that cannot hit it super effectively in order to block their offensive presence such as Tapu Lele, Latios, and Mega Pinsir.
* Celesteela can also come in on some walls such as Chansey and Slowbro and cripple them with Leech Seed.
* As it lacks reliable recovery, Celesteela should not be forced in too often, as taking too much damage can severely limit its defensive capabilities.
* Thanks to Beast Boost, Celesteela can function as a wincon, as the Special Defense boosts gained from attaining KOs can make it much harder to take down.

Team Options
========

* Dugtrio can trap Electric-types such as Magnezone and Xurkitree that can be annoying for Celesteela, while in return Celesteela can beat bulky Steel-types Dugtrio can't manage to trap such as Ferrothorn, Skarmory, and Mega Scizor
* Mega Venusaur can handle Electric-types for Celesteela, while in return Celesteela deals with Flying- and Psychic-type Pokemon.
* Heatran and Rotom-W can absorb Fire-type moves for Celesteela, while Hippowdon and Alolan Marowak can cover Electric-type moves.
* Mega Sableye can ward off Will-O-Wisp and Stealth Rock for Celesteela and further help fending off opposing Celesteela.

[SET]
name: Autotomize Sweeper
move 1: Autotomize
move 2: Air Slash
move 3: Flamethrower
move 4: Giga Drain / Earthquake
item: Flyinium Z / Life Orb
ability: Beast Boost
nature: Modest / Rash
evs: 84 HP / 252 SpA / 172 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

* Autotomize doubles Celesteela's Speed, allowing it to clean late-game more effectively.
* Air Slash is Celesteela's STAB move of choice, as it has decent overall coverage.
* Flamethrower hits Steel-types for super effective damage, which otherwise freely switch into Air Slash.
* Giga Drain mitigates Life Orb recoil and hits the likes of Rotom-W, Greninja, and Hippowdon for the highest damage.
* Alternatively, Earthquake hits Tapu Koko, Heatran, and Nihilego for super effective damage, all which take Celesteela's other moves well.

Set Details
========

* Maximum Special Attack investment with a Modest or Rash nature helps improve Celesteela's damage output.
* 172 EVs in Speed lets Celesteela outspeed up to Modest Pheromosa, while the remainder goes into HP for supplementary bulk.
* Alternatively, maximum Speed EVs plus a Timid nature allow Celesteela to outspeed Naive Pheromosa and +1 base 95 Speed Pokemon such as Tapu Lele and Mega Sharpedo.
* Flyinium-Z turns Air Slash into a one-time 140-Base Power move, providing it with a great option to achieve an early KO in order to trigger Beast Boost.
* Life Orb boosts the power of all of Celesteela's moves at the cost of slightly compromising its bulk.
* If Celesteela is using Earthquake, a Rash nature should be chosen in order to not sacrifice its power.
* Beast Boost is especially useful on this set, as it increases Celesteela's Special Attack after achieving a KO, allowing it to snowball through the opposing team provided it gets enough KOs.

Usage Tips
========

* Celesteela should aim to set up late-game once its checks and have been severely weakened or KOed.
* Try to aim for setup opportunities in Pokemon locked into resisted moves such as Tapu Lele's Psychic and Landorus-T's Earthquake.
* If needed, Celesteela can still be used in order to wear down the opposing team with its wide coverage in order for a teammate to clean later in the game.

Team Options
========

* Stealth Rock setters such as Heatran, Landorus-T, and Garchomp that can cover Celesteela's weaknesses are appreciated, as they can provide chip damage to the opposing team.
* Extra entry hazard support such as Spikes from Greninja is also appreciated.
* If it lacks Giga Drain, Pokemon that can pressure bulky Water-types such as Tapu Koko, Thundurus, and Tapu Bulu are useful partners.
* Dugtrio can trap Chansey and Heatran for Celesteela, allowing it to attack more freely.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

* A physical version of Autotomize with Heavy Slam, Earthquake, and Flamethrower could be opted for, but it is susceptibilty to burns and Air Slash is much more favorable than Heavy Slam due to its coverage.
* Substitute alongside Leech Seed can allow Celesteela to avoid status, although its lack of recovery apart from Leftovers and Leech Seed means Celesteela might potentially be too worn down by the move.
* Toxic helps Celesteela wear down bulky Pokemon such as Rotom-W, Slowbro, and Hippowdon, which circumvent Leech Seed's passive damage. However, it forces Celesteela to drop one of its more useful moves.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Magnezone**: Thanks to Magnet Pull, Magnezone is able to trap Celesteela and 2HKO it with Thunderbolt, although Celesteela can bypass this using Shed Shell. In that case, Magnezone would rely on Knock Off support in order to trap Celesteela.

**Electric-types**: Tapu Koko, Thundurus, and similarly other Electric-types can heavily damage Celesteela with their STAB moves and can usually avoid being crippled by Toxic or Leech Seed thanks to Volt Switch. Latios and Tapu Lele are also capable of luring Celesteela and hitting it with Thunderbolt

**Fire-types and Fire-type coverage**: Heatran, Mega Charizard X and Y and Alolan Marowak can switch into Celesteela's Heavy Slam or a predicted Protect and heavily damage it with their Fire-type STAB moves. However, with the exception of Mega Charizard Y, they should be wary of Earthquake. While Celesteela resists both its STAB options, Garchomp usually carries Fire Fang or Fire Blast to hit Celesteela super effectively.

**Mega Sableye**: Mega Sableye is immune to passive damage induced by Celesteela thanks to Magic Bounce, even being able to affect Celesteela with its own Leech Seed. Mega Sableye can also Recover stall Heavy Slam and cripple Celesteela with Will-O-Wisp.
 
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Question : can Giga Drain be a viable option over Flamethrower to annoy Water-Types if you have a Fire type in your team to take care of opposing Steel-Types?
 
If you haven't thought it out already Assault vest is pretty bad. Then again assault vest being an inferior option on something is a widely applicable case
 
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If you haven't thought it out already Assault vest is pretty bad. Then again assault vest being bad on something is a widely applicable cse
Think it might deserve a mention in the Other Options, at least? Even if you recommend against it in the same breath, it's a worthwhile mention simply because it's out there, IMO.
 
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HotFuzzBall

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Toxic should be slashed with Flamethrower since it allows her to deal with things like Lando-T and bulky waters that aren't Toxapex (and I guess Empoleon)
 
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Think it might deserve a mention in the Other Options, at least? Even if you recommend against it in the same breath, it's a worthwhile mention simply because it's out there, IMO.
Celesteela makes no use of AV whatsowever, it should not get any mention as a viable set. She doesnt have the offenssive stats to be a real threat with it and her only reliable recovery move then becomes Giga Drain. Waste of an item that goes way better with Magearna, who has better special bulk, way better Special Attack + Soul Heart, and even Volt Switch for momentum, if you're looking for an AV Steel-Type.
 
Celesteela makes no use of AV whatsowever, it should not get any mention as a viable set. She doesnt have the offenssive stats to be a real threat with it and her only reliable recovery move then becomes Giga Drain. Waste of an item that goes way better with Magearna, who has better special bulk, way better Special Attack + Soul Heart, and even Volt Switch for momentum, if you're looking for an AV Steel-Type.
Alright alright, point taken lol. I'm just saying, in the 25+ Celesteela builds I've seen, Giga Drain has never been there besides on Assault Vest builds.
 
Would a physically defensive Celesteela set be worth mentioning? Celesteela is bulky enough to cover both defenses and and most hits from special attackers like Magnezone and Tapu Koko will still most likely deal enough damage to Celesteela to the point of the Special Defense boost being irrelevant.
 
If I may suggest an offensive set

[SET]
Name: Specially Offensive
move 1: Air Slash
move 2: Fire Blast/Flamethrower
move 3: Leech Seed/Energy Ball
move 4: Autotomize
item: Leftovers
ability: Beast Boost
nature: Modest
evs: 252 SpAtk / 4 SpDef / 252 Spd

Moves
- STAB AS deals nice damage and has a nifty 30% chance to flinch
- Fire Blast deals with the likes of opposing Steel types bar Heatran
- Leech Seed and Lefties grant longlivety as Celesteelas natural bulk lets it take hits even uninvested
- Alternatively, Energy Ball hits Water, Ground and Rock types for supereffective damage
- Autotomize doubles Celesteelas speed, letting it function as a Cleaner or Sweeper (in conjunction with Beast Boost)

Set
- 252 Speed with a neutral nature hit 221 Speed, letting Celesteela outspeed full invested Mons up to 151 Base Speed ones (aka Pheromosa with 441 Speed vs 442) after one Autotomize
- 252+ SpAtk let Celesteela hit as hard as possible while boosting this Stat when knocking out a Mon

This Set is great as a late-game cleaner or even Sweeper once its Counters and Checks it can't get past have been removed. I would suggest trying it out yourself.
 
If I may suggest an offensive set

[SET]
Name: Specially Offensive
move 1: Air Slash
move 2: Fire Blast/Flamethrower
move 3: Leech Seed/Energy Ball
move 4: Autotomize
item: Leftovers
ability: Beast Boost
nature: Modest
evs: 252 SpAtk / 4 SpDef / 252 Spd

Moves
- STAB AS deals nice damage and has a nifty 30% chance to flinch
- Fire Blast deals with the likes of opposing Steel types bar Heatran
- Leech Seed and Lefties grant longlivety as Celesteelas natural bulk lets it take hits even uninvested
- Alternatively, Energy Ball hits Water, Ground and Rock types for supereffective damage
- Autotomize doubles Celesteelas speed, letting it function as a Cleaner or Sweeper (in conjunction with Beast Boost)

Set
- 252 Speed with a neutral nature hit 221 Speed, letting Celesteela outspeed full invested Mons up to 151 Base Speed ones (aka Pheromosa with 441 Speed vs 442) after one Autotomize
- 252+ SpAtk let Celesteela hit as hard as possible while boosting this Stat when knocking out a Mon

This Set is great as a late-game cleaner or even Sweeper once its Counters and Checks it can't get past have been removed. I would suggest trying it out yourself.
Already mentioned Autotomize sets go to Other Options, as Celesteela really lacks some sort of initial power to break through a sweep, to be fair. In my opinion, a more effectiver autotomize set would look like Autotomize / Heavy Slam / Earthquake / Fire Blast in order to maximise damage and coverage tbh; feel like there's no real reason to bother hitting water and ground-types, which the latter of can't check you anyway.
 
Would a speedy subseed set have any use in OU? It's all the rage in VGC right now.
Are you speaking of something like jolly 252 HP 252 Spe with Substitute/leech Seed/Protect/Filler? Cause I can see this set being huge trouble for a good portion of slow defensive mons. Now that I think of it, the QC team could really give their thoughts on it.
 

Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
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Don't try to compare the effectiveness of something in VGC to its effectiveness in Singles as they are not comparable in the slightest. Celesteela is a mediocre SubSeeder because it is criminally slow, and its whole niche knsingles comes from it being very specially bulky, and by running this set you are running an incredible suboptimal spread just in order to turn it from outright bad to extremely mediocre. The range available in VGC is very small, but in singles it is outclassed by both Whimsicott and Serperior who can put the strategy to significantly more consistent use, and the former isn't even a good SubSeeder.
 
Already mentioned Autotomize sets go to Other Options, as Celesteela really lacks some sort of initial power to break through a sweep, to be fair. In my opinion, a more effectiver autotomize set would look like Autotomize / Heavy Slam / Earthquake / Fire Blast in order to maximise damage and coverage tbh; feel like there's no real reason to bother hitting water and ground-types, which the latter of can't check you anyway.
physical is bad anyways so yea, it won't have the initial power to sweep. this set, however, does and its coverage is way better:

[SET]
name: Autotomize
move 1: Air Slash
move 2: Flamethrower
move 3: Earthquake / Giga Drain
move 4: Autotomize
item: Life Orb
ability: Beast Boost
nature: Rash / Modest
evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

this shit is nice af and deserves a set. offense has almost nothing for this nigga in the clutch. air slash is wicked strong. flamethrower is mandatory coverage. earthquake is for heatran, tapu koko, marowak, nihilego, and av magnezone. alternatively, giga drain healing is super useful for the longevity of your sweep as life orb stall is no longer an option and it hits rotom-w (big one) and netting harder hits on things like greninja and hippowdon for example.

flash cannon is a trash move since the only thing it hits is clefable, and we know what happened to that since its mediocre stats got exposed this generation with the power creep.

was able to hit #1 on the suspect ladder today with this monster. it's wild good.

also, i would unslash toxic on the specially defensive set. it's honestly bad :/
 
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Deck Knight

Blast Off At The Speed Of Light! That's Right!
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Already mentioned Autotomize sets go to Other Options, as Celesteela really lacks some sort of initial power to break through a sweep, to be fair. In my opinion, a more effectiver autotomize set would look like Autotomize / Heavy Slam / Earthquake / Fire Blast in order to maximise damage and coverage tbh; feel like there's no real reason to bother hitting water and ground-types, which the latter of can't check you anyway.
Autotomize weakens Heavy Slam by halving Celesteela's weight, so Flash Cannon is more desirable.
 
this shit is nice af and deserves a set. offense has almost nothing for this nigga in the clutch. air slash is wicked strong. flamethrower is mandatory coverage. earthquake is for heatran, tapu koko, marowak, nihilego, and av magnezone. alternatively, giga drain healing is super useful for the longevity of your sweep as life orb stall is no longer an option and it hits rotom-w (big one) and netting harder hits on things like greninja and hippowdon for example.
Sorry for sounding skeptical here but how is Air Slash wicked strong with 75 base power? And more importantly, what notable threats does it hit? most Grass types take enough from your Fire move anyways, besides Venusaur, and the relevant Fighting types are all hit super effectively by a coverage move. It's just not very strong, and I don't see why a 120 base power Heavy Slam isn't better most of the time, seeing as it can also 2HKO Venusaur. Giga Drain is cool to have a better matchup against Ground and Water types, but Air Slash is really the main move I'm skeptical about. If you could provide some replays showcasing where this set puts in work I'd appreciate it, meanwhile I'll get around to trying different Autotomize variants.

also, i would unslash toxic on the specially defensive set. it's honestly bad :/
Agreed, it's shit. Being walled by basically any Steel type is bad, without a Fire move you lose to Skarmory, Ferrothorn, Scizor, opposing Celesteela, etc.
 
the reason why air slash is good is the lack of resists to it making it a disgustingly ez move to spam given celesteela's coverage and good special attack

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pokebankoususpecttest-505896888

ignore the leech seed miss cuz i deserved it. dude played game like ass :/

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pokebankoususpecttest-505901349

shoulda just autotomized twice, but yea, i'm always on autopilot when i play on the ladder

also, you just beat me to it. i have been taking a second shot at the physical version of the set, so i will be back tomorrow to give my full thoughts on each version of the autotomize sets.
 

mulgokizary

Banned deucer.
I dunno, I've played like, 50 games with physical Autotomize Celesteela and it's performed decently well, but it gets annoyed by common checks. The set is super easy to actually set up with because you can revenge-autotomize on a locked moonblast, which happened in like, 70% of my games, but it really needs something like Spikes support (I used a really offensive Greninja spike stack team) and unless there's a meta shift I don't really think it belongs outside of OO.

It has A LOT of opportunities to set up Autotomize due to all-around good bulk, but it has big problems in that a lot of the stuff it needs to weaken in order to sweep are pretty annoying to get down... Zard X/Y are the biggest ones, they don't die to unboosted Heavy Slam even after rocks and use it as complete setup/roost bait since they underspeed after an Autotomize. I considered these matchups almost unwinnable because their main wincon simply beat mine. Lando is another obvious choice, Heavy Slam actually annoys it a lot but it weakens your attack stat to the point where sweeping usually isn't an option anymore. Opposing Celesteela take one hit from Fire Blast and threaten back with their own fire move or just wear it down with Leech/Tect.

I haven't used it, but I've personally never seen special Celesteela sweep in a situation where another Pokemon couldn't do it better (uh, seriously, Rock Polish Genesect, anyone?) unless it got a bunch of air slash flinches. It's way less hard to deal with than a 120 BP heavy slam.

Celesteela @ Groundium Z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Autotomize
- Earthquake
- Fire Blast
- Heavy Slam

Heavy Slam needs no explanation, it picks up a lot of OHKO and 2HKOs in the tier without the need for a Life Orb or boosting item due to its flexible base power, Tectonic Rage allows Celesteela to pick up the kill on annoying switchins like Alolan Wak, MMeta, and Toxapex and some other heavier stuff that cock-block Heavy Slam after just a tiny bit of prior damage and OHKOs them with the +1 boost, meaning that there are three less threats for the physical set to need to weaken in order to start sweeping. The powerful Ground lure helps you get that initial +1 boost so you can pummel the enemy team. Fire blast was purely for stuff like Kartana, M-Sciz, Skarmory, and Celesteela that wall the other two coverage options. I should reiterate that the biggest annoyances to the set were defensive Lando-T and opposing Zards, which are pretty damn common.

Also, unrelated, but I think Earthquake deserves an OO mention for the bulky set because it lets you deal with Magnezone (since, like, they're all AV right now) and Heatran coming in without wasting a team slot on Dugtrio.
 
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brought the physical set for another test round and it's pretty poor. landorus-t, the zards, every bulky water out there walls you making special completely superior
 

Colonel M

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I will say early in Sun Moon I did Groundium Z and was rather peeved on the missed KOes. IMO you have to go all the way with Life Orb. Celesteela needs a Beast Boost to really get going.

(To be fair I was using Physical).
 
[OVERVIEW]

  • Great defensive typing in Flying / Steel coupled with good overall mixed bulk make Celesteela a great wall and useful check to several threats such as Tapu Lele,

  • Useful coverage in Flamethrower and Earthquake that allows it to actively beat opposing bulky Steel-types and Electric-types, respectively.
  • Lack of roost can be compromising for its bulk.
  • Faces competition from Skarmory, which has access to Roost and several support moves such as both Stealth Rock and Spikes, Defog, and Taunt.

[SET]
name: Specially Defensive
move 1: Leech Seed
move 2: Protect
move 3: Heavy Slam
move 4: Flamethrower / Toxic
item: Leftovers
ability: Beast Boost
nature: Sassy
evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
  • Leech Seed allows Celesteela to recover health and wittle down its opponent and is quintessential as it lacks reliable recovery
  • Protect helps Celesteela gain more recovery from Leech Seed aside from allowing it to scout for the opponent's moves.

Set Details
========
  • Leftovers provides Celesteela with passive recovery alongside Leech Seed.

Usage Tips
========

Describe how to use the Pokemon in question.

Team Options
========
  • Dugtrio can trap Electric-types such as Magnezone and Xurkitree which can be annoying for Celesteela, while in return Celesteela can beat bulky steel-types Dugtrio can't manage to trap such as Ferrothorn, Skarmory, and Mega Scizor

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
  • Offensive Autotomize + 3 atks. Kinda lacks the power to pull it off.
  • Shed Shell to avoid getting trapped by Magnezone, but no other use whatsoever.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Insert Threat Here**: Describe why the Pokemon is a threat.
120 bP heavy slams hit only very slightly lighter than mega metagross meteor mash. I did the calcs. Just sayin, I don't deny that automize is bad.
 
Agree on Toxic getting the boot on the SpD set, you are better off using coverage to avoid being steel trapped or mitigate being setup bait.

EQ should be slashed instead of Toxic; flamethrower is still preferable to hit Skarmory, Genesect, Ferrothorn and Scizor, but EQ can hit CharX, Heatran, AV Magnezone, and other electrics.
 

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