What about Roar > EQ or Scald? I'd assume that RestTalk Swampert would be potential set-up bait for some specially based sweepers.
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Creative / Underrated Sets in the UU Metagame
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What about Roar > EQ or Scald? I'd assume that RestTalk Swampert would be potential set-up bait for some specially based sweepers.
EQ is needed to ohko SubCM Chandelure specifically as stated by pif. And Scald is Scald which spreads burns and also helps hitting ground immunity like Aero which Pert counters.
I highly doubt dropping either is beneficial as Stall has other options in dealing with special boosters like SpDef Perish Song Celebi, Curse Spiritomb and Haze Crobat.
Putting this here again, don't know where it went.
Hydreigon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Fire Blast
- Flash Cannon
I have been defeated time and time again by this very set. Too many to count. So why not allow more people to murder me with it? :D Draco Meteor is the strongest STAB, unresisted by all but 2 types, Steel and Fairy. Pummel them all with it. Dark Pulse is a secondary STAB that has a flinch chance and doesn't lower your Special Attack. Can also be used on Steel types unresisted, and will 1-2HKO most things. (It also does major damage to the Ghost sword. Just saying.) Fire Blast is for those Steel types that will eat up your meteors as well as for other random types, and while least used, Flash Cannon for dealing with the Ice and Fairy types ready to clobber you with their STABs. All in all, powerful, fast, and powerful. Also powerful. Strong Dragon? Look no further.
Hydreigon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Fire Blast
- Flash Cannon
I have been defeated time and time again by this very set. Too many to count. So why not allow more people to murder me with it? :D Draco Meteor is the strongest STAB, unresisted by all but 2 types, Steel and Fairy. Pummel them all with it. Dark Pulse is a secondary STAB that has a flinch chance and doesn't lower your Special Attack. Can also be used on Steel types unresisted, and will 1-2HKO most things. (It also does major damage to the Ghost sword. Just saying.) Fire Blast is for those Steel types that will eat up your meteors as well as for other random types, and while least used, Flash Cannon for dealing with the Ice and Fairy types ready to clobber you with their STABs. All in all, powerful, fast, and powerful. Also powerful. Strong Dragon? Look no further.
Roar is such a good move for stall it can never really be ignored. I didn't put it because I personally don't use it because it doesn't work too well on my team for very specific reasons. It can be used over any move though except rest obviously (because sleep talk by itself is bad) although for an average team it wouldn't be that good because the other moves cover more threats.
Mahmudkipz was right about eq needing to ohko chandelure since otherwise it's only 3hko after a cm boost. It also ohkos nidoking and alakazam and nidoqueen. It's stronger than max attack flygon eq so it's hard not to use eq but if you have these threats covered go for roar I guess.
However you're not set up bait for special sweepers, none of them really can set up because eq is so strong. Pz Houndoom jirachi raikou alakazam diancie all get fainted if they try to set up on you. Celebi is a problem roar won't fix. Roar can delay crocune but in the same vein sub cm cune is getting quite popular especially among strong players and eq is sometimes better against them so blissey can take them down later rather than you just guessing with roar and scald.
"Scald is scald" yeah it's an incredible move hard to replace and definitely to be used over waterfall despite the huge difference in base attack and special attack.
There isn't much reason to use this over Gastrodon. Yes, I know that's technically not a UU pokemon, but you can still use it. I don't know much about rest-sleep talk, but I'm pretty sure recover straight up outclasses it. It makes up for Swampert's slightly higher bulk. And Gastrodon has the plus of having a useful ability in storm drain, meaning it can switch into water type attacks with ease.
Swampert's earthquake is stronger, but gastrodon still gets the 2HKO on CM chandelure easily with earthquake (OHKO after stealth rock), and Alakazam, which runs focus sash so often that OHKOes can be meaningless.
"There isn't much reason"
How about the fact mega swampert has like 200 higher base stat points total in relevant stats?
I honestly can't tell if you people are trying to troll me telling me swampert regular and gastrodon are better than mega swampert.
How about the fact mega swampert has like 200 higher base stat points total in relevant stats?
I honestly can't tell if you people are trying to troll me telling me swampert regular and gastrodon are better than mega swampert.
I'm not actually a moderator I lied on my sig
Also I didn’t imply that Gastrodon was better than Mega Swampert (it’s obviously not). I just implied that this set may be outclassed by Gastrodon.
And now that I think about it, Mega Swampert is actually slightly less bulky than regular swampert when you factor in leftovers, so Gastrodon can be a legitimate consideration over that considering it’s only slightly less bulky than normal Swamp. Again, recover is a lot better than rest-talk, you can’t deny that. I would probably use Mega Swampert rest-talk personally but don’t act like my suggestion was ridiculous when it clearly was not. Depends if you want reliable recovery or big offensive presence. You may not want to take up a Mega-slot also on a set that can be done almost as well by another pokemon. Just a consideration.
And now that I think about it, Mega Swampert is actually slightly less bulky than regular swampert when you factor in leftovers, so Gastrodon can be a legitimate consideration over that considering it’s only slightly less bulky than normal Swamp. Again, recover is a lot better than rest-talk, you can’t deny that. I would probably use Mega Swampert rest-talk personally but don’t act like my suggestion was ridiculous when it clearly was not. Depends if you want reliable recovery or big offensive presence. You may not want to take up a Mega-slot also on a set that can be done almost as well by another pokemon. Just a consideration.
Gee. Thanks for the citation, buddy.
Uxie @ Mental Herb / Rocky Helmet
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 8 Atk / 8 Def / 8 SpD / 232 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Imprison
- Knock Off
- Memento / U-Turn / Yawn
Uxie can make use of its access to Imprison and impressive base 95 speed to run a cool Stealth Rock lead set. Imprison functions similarly to Taunt on most leads, preventing the opponent from using Stealth Rock as long as Uxie is on the field. However, it also prevents opposing pokemon from using any other moves that Uxie also knows, namely Knock Off and U-Turn. By disabling Knock Off, Uxie renders many Pokemon such as Krookodile and Donphan incapable of dealing significant damage to it. Disabling U-Turn also makes it more difficult to get Uxie off the field and may force scarfers to KO Uxie with an undesirable move and become setup fodder. Memento allows Uxie to prevent Defog and Rapid Spin against slower hazard removers. It also can buy a frail teammate a setup opportunity. With U-Turn, Uxie can switch out to a teammate and potentially set up rocks again later in the match. Yawn is another option to force out opposing hazard removers. It also forces switches that can be exploited by smart double switching.
Mental Herb is probably the best item, stopping Taunt and practically guaranteeing rocks thanks to Uxie's massive bulk. However, Rocky Helmet can be better for non-Memento sets to punish Rapid Spin attempts.
The EVs allow Uxie to outspeed Jolly Krookodile, always live Adamant Mega Beedrill U-turn, and survive Timid Specs Hydreigon Dark Pulse 93.75% of the time.
Arcanine @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 HP / 252 SpD
Calm nature
- Flare Blitz
- Will-o-Wisp
- Snarl
- Morning Sun
The primary goal of this Arcanine is to serve as a mixed wall. After the opponent is Intimidated they will most likely make a switch to something that can check Arcanine mostly Water/Ground types. That's where Snarl comes in handy as you predict the switch and use it to lower the opponents special attack. After lowering your opponents Special Attack you can safely Will-O-Wisp it and use Morning Sun for recovery. I haven't really messed around with the EV spread much but the general idea is to spread burns and wear the opponent down.
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 HP / 252 SpD
Calm nature
- Flare Blitz
- Will-o-Wisp
- Snarl
- Morning Sun
The primary goal of this Arcanine is to serve as a mixed wall. After the opponent is Intimidated they will most likely make a switch to something that can check Arcanine mostly Water/Ground types. That's where Snarl comes in handy as you predict the switch and use it to lower the opponents special attack. After lowering your opponents Special Attack you can safely Will-O-Wisp it and use Morning Sun for recovery. I haven't really messed around with the EV spread much but the general idea is to spread burns and wear the opponent down.
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Enjoy!
An extremely legitimate physical Celebi set:
The Legit Onion (Celebi) @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Seed Bomb
- Zen Headbutt
- Swords Dance
Switch it in on something like blastoise or swampert and set up a free swords dance. Then you can pretty much sweep with priority sucker punch and dual STAB seed bomb and zen headbutt. Life orb works very well as it increases its damage potential a lot, at the cost of a little HP, and unlike choice items, allow you to hit pokemon with the great coverage provided by grass, psychic and dark. Best used lategame.
Now for the legitimate special set:
Indigestion (Toxicroak) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Belch
- Nasty Plot
- Vacuum Wave
- Focus Blast / Shadow Ball
Set up nasty plot first turn on something you know can't ohko you, then after sitrus berry recovery start spamming belch and stab priority vacuum wave and stab focus blast to more or less ill anything. Best used lategame.
An extremely legitimate physical Celebi set:
The Legit Onion (Celebi) @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Seed Bomb
- Zen Headbutt
- Swords Dance
Switch it in on something like blastoise or swampert and set up a free swords dance. Then you can pretty much sweep with priority sucker punch and dual STAB seed bomb and zen headbutt. Life orb works very well as it increases its damage potential a lot, at the cost of a little HP, and unlike choice items, allow you to hit pokemon with the great coverage provided by grass, psychic and dark. Best used lategame.
Now for the legitimate special set:
Indigestion (Toxicroak) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Belch
- Nasty Plot
- Vacuum Wave
- Focus Blast / Shadow Ball
Set up nasty plot first turn on something you know can't ohko you, then after sitrus berry recovery start spamming belch and stab priority vacuum wave and stab focus blast to more or less ill anything. Best used lategame.
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I personally think that SubPetaya + Belch works better than NastyBelch because of the reliability. Toxicroak isn't very bulky, so there's a good chance Toxicroak will just blow up and die.Enjoy!
An extremely legitimate physical Celebi set:
The Legit Onion (Celebi) @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Seed Bomb
- Zen Headbutt
- Swords Dance
Switch it in on something like blastoise or swampert and set up a free swords dance. Then you can pretty much sweep with priority sucker punch and dual STAB seed bomb and zen headbutt. Life orb works very well as it increases its damage potential a lot, at the cost of a little HP, and unlike choice items, allow you to hit pokemon with the great coverage provided by grass, psychic and dark. Best used lategame.
Now for the legitimate special set:
Indigestion (Toxicroak) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Belch
- Nasty Plot
- Vacuum Wave
- Focus Blast / Shadow Ball
Set up nasty plot first turn on something you know can't ohko you, then after sitrus berry recovery start spamming belch and stab buum wave and stab focus blast to more or less ill anything. Best used lategame.
I've been playing with a similar Toxicroak a lot lately and in my opinion it's quite good. Using Nasty Plot when you know people can not KO you really catches people off guard which in my experience often makes them do dumb stuff.
Now for the legitimate special set:
Indigestion (Toxicroak) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Belch
- Nasty Plot
- Vacuum Wave
- Focus Blast / Shadow Ball
Set up nasty plot first turn on something you know can't ohko you, then after sitrus berry recovery start spamming belch and stab priority vacuum wave and stab focus blast to more or less ill anything. Best used lategame.
That's true.
Yet another thought: Run SubNP with a Salac Berry. Of course, Crobat would need to be out of the way. I'm thinking something along the lines of this:
Toxicroak @ Salac Berry
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Substitute
- Nasty Plot
- Belch
- Focus Blast
Run with Pursuit support (Ghost is the only thing off the top of my head that resists Poison/Fighting), beware of Crobat and Noivern. Or use Pursuit support + Rocks to get rid of Crobat and Noivern.
Toxicroak @ Salac Berry
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Substitute
- Nasty Plot
- Belch
- Focus Blast
Run with Pursuit support (Ghost is the only thing off the top of my head that resists Poison/Fighting), beware of Crobat and Noivern. Or use Pursuit support + Rocks to get rid of Crobat and Noivern.
Has the departure of jirachi left a gap in your life? A disgusting, cancerous gap left by subtoxic that you've found difficult to fill since? Well here's a solution:
Pidgeot-Mega @ Pidgeotite
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 220 HP / 96 SpA / 192 Spe
Timid Nature
- Substitute
- Toxic
- Roost
- Hurricane
You know how hurricane has that really really annoying 30% confusion rate while also simultaneously being a 110bp attack with a brilliant type? Abuse that hax fully and make your way past potential counters. Considering confusion has a pretty revolting 50% chance to make you do nothing, hitting them with a toxic puts everything on a tight timer. Even if its something like florges that can aromatherapy the toxic, confusion hax can get you a really long way and really quickly stacks with hurricane and toxic. Roost is simply for longevity and substitute lets you fish safely for self-hits and extra toxic damage. The spread creeps serp but that's not here anymore so w/e., and can't remember what the bulk reaches but ye lol.
I've been using this on stall just because sd flame orb hera is fucking annoying and I didn't want to use Crobat, so idk if it would fit anywhere else. It struggles with steel types but most of them have poor spdef anyway, and don't like switching in because they expect heat wave. It's not an amazing set, but embrace the cancer and it can be pretty useful and you can get wins from forfeits alone >:]
Pidgeot-Mega @ Pidgeotite
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 220 HP / 96 SpA / 192 Spe
Timid Nature
- Substitute
- Toxic
- Roost
- Hurricane
You know how hurricane has that really really annoying 30% confusion rate while also simultaneously being a 110bp attack with a brilliant type? Abuse that hax fully and make your way past potential counters. Considering confusion has a pretty revolting 50% chance to make you do nothing, hitting them with a toxic puts everything on a tight timer. Even if its something like florges that can aromatherapy the toxic, confusion hax can get you a really long way and really quickly stacks with hurricane and toxic. Roost is simply for longevity and substitute lets you fish safely for self-hits and extra toxic damage. The spread creeps serp but that's not here anymore so w/e., and can't remember what the bulk reaches but ye lol.
I've been using this on stall just because sd flame orb hera is fucking annoying and I didn't want to use Crobat, so idk if it would fit anywhere else. It struggles with steel types but most of them have poor spdef anyway, and don't like switching in because they expect heat wave. It's not an amazing set, but embrace the cancer and it can be pretty useful and you can get wins from forfeits alone >:]
Mienshao @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 40 HP / 216 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Poison Jab
- Knock Off
- U-turn
AV Specially Defensive Mienshao. Basically, the idea behind this was to have a threatening attacker that can repeatedly take special attacks to either force things out or keep momentum in battle. Regenerator is the main reason why this set is possible, but max speed EVs with a Jolly nature allow Mienshao to keep its high speed stat and retain its revenge killing and offensive presence. The 40 HP / 216 SpD allow Mienshao the best bulk for taking special attacks while also simultaneously allowing it to live a Close Combat from a Cobalion at full health and KO back with High Jump Kick if need be. As far as moves, these give this Pokemon the ability to deal with a number of threats and even match up very well against something like Florges, who under normal circumstances would force Mienshao out. High Jump Kick is for your main STAB move, Poison Jab is for Fairies like Florges and also good for inflicting potential poisons, Knock Off because it is the best move in the game, and U-turn to keep momentum while also giving health through Regenerator when you switch out. There are an impressive number of hits this thing can take so I'll just show some examples here
252 SpA Hydreigon Draco Meteor vs. 40 HP / 216 SpD Assault Vest Mienshao: 154-183 (54.8 - 65.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Meaning you can effectively switch into Draco Meteors and live a second one while taking it out with High Jump Kick
0 SpA Florges Moonblast vs. 40 HP / 216 SpD Assault Vest Mienshao: 168-200 (59.7 - 71.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
If it has taken some prior damage, this gives you the ability to switch it in and 2HKO with Poison Jab or if Florges is brought in on Mienshao, you can handle it in a similar fashion
252 SpA Chandelure Fire Blast vs. 40 HP / 216 SpD Assault Vest Mienshao: 147-174 (52.3 - 61.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Chandelure Shadow Ball vs. 40 HP / 216 SpD Assault Vest Mienshao: 106-126 (37.7 - 44.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Allows Mienshao to be a good switch in to revenge kill Chandelure or if coming in on a Shadow Ball, stay in to live another
252+ SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 40 HP / 216 SpD AV Mienshao: 222-262 (79 - 93.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Can switch into even if Stealth Rocks are up and kill with High Jump Kick or force out. Agility and Nasty Plot Sets can be revenge killed as it outspeeds Nasty Plot ones and can live a Tri-Attack from a Porygon-Z that only has an Agility boost
252 SpA Life Orb Shaymin Seed Flare vs. 40 HP / 216 SpD AV Mienshao: 160-188 (56.9 - 66.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
Can switch in and force out Shaymin, getting off good damage with U-turn if it stays in or giving switch initiative
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I don't really do a lot of UU, but this is a set that I've been playing around with in OU and really liked.
(Sorry, the image won't work for some reason)
Chesnaught (M) @ Salac Berry
Ability: Bulletproof
EVs: 12 HP / 244 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Belly Drum
- Drain Punch
- Iron Head / Wood Hammer
This set is pretty simple, send in chesnaught (preferably against shadow ball or something you're immune to from bulletproof) set up a sub on the switch, belly drum, then proceed to destroy. Some obvious threats to this set are aerodactyl and pidgeot, as they both out speed chesnaught even after salac berry ( only by 2 in pidgeots case), chandelure and noivern both resist/ are immune to your stab and hit for SE damage past your sub with infiltrator, and powerful priority will take you out if your sub goes down. Other than that, poisons, and can't think of anything else off the top of my head. Oh, except faster scarfers and alakazam once your sub is down. Oh, and the EVs should probably be changed to better fit UU. But, yeah, I think that's about it.
(Sorry, the image won't work for some reason)
Chesnaught (M) @ Salac Berry
Ability: Bulletproof
EVs: 12 HP / 244 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Belly Drum
- Drain Punch
- Iron Head / Wood Hammer
This set is pretty simple, send in chesnaught (preferably against shadow ball or something you're immune to from bulletproof) set up a sub on the switch, belly drum, then proceed to destroy. Some obvious threats to this set are aerodactyl and pidgeot, as they both out speed chesnaught even after salac berry ( only by 2 in pidgeots case), chandelure and noivern both resist/ are immune to your stab and hit for SE damage past your sub with infiltrator, and powerful priority will take you out if your sub goes down. Other than that, poisons, and can't think of anything else off the top of my head. Oh, except faster scarfers and alakazam once your sub is down. Oh, and the EVs should probably be changed to better fit UU. But, yeah, I think that's about it.
Why not Rock Slide (if it gets that) or Stone Edge instead of Iron Head/Wood Hammer? You at least get the best neutral coverage out of that combination of moves
Idk, I whipped the set together In like 30 seconds and just started using it with some success. I guess it would work though, I just had a fairy problem on my team.
The exact same set is posted one page ago.
On another note, I feel like this thread has lost its point when stuff like AV -random frail mon- or outclassed mons like Ambipom are posted.
Oh... Awkward. And here I was thinking I was being a hipster...
Here is a set that is fun to use and possibly under rated.
Note: It requires a bit of support to function optimally.
The goal is to come in on the majority of the rampant physical fire types dominating the tier and set up. Thanks to Kingdra's usable bulk and excellent typing it laughs out loud at sacred fire/flare blitz. Not much most fire types can do to touch it considering how the majority of fire types in UU are physical attackers. Get rid of its checks/counters then send it in to create chaos.
Kingdra @ Leftovers / Chesto Berry
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 176HP / 252 Def / 80 Spe
Impish Nature
- Rest
- Waterfall
- Dragon Dance
- Sleep Talk / Iron Head / Outrage
This set is easily walled and does not have much versatility but it fulfills it's role admirably with proper support and good timing.
Note: It requires a bit of support to function optimally.
The goal is to come in on the majority of the rampant physical fire types dominating the tier and set up. Thanks to Kingdra's usable bulk and excellent typing it laughs out loud at sacred fire/flare blitz. Not much most fire types can do to touch it considering how the majority of fire types in UU are physical attackers. Get rid of its checks/counters then send it in to create chaos.
Kingdra @ Leftovers / Chesto Berry
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 176HP / 252 Def / 80 Spe
Impish Nature
- Rest
- Waterfall
- Dragon Dance
- Sleep Talk / Iron Head / Outrage
This set is easily walled and does not have much versatility but it fulfills it's role admirably with proper support and good timing.
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