Download

[Nix_Hex]

Download

Download raises either the Attack stat or Special Attack stat by one stage depending on the foe's lowest current defensive stat; it will raise the Special Attack stat if the foe's current Special Defense is lower than its current Defense stat. If the foe's Defense and Special Defense are equal, then the Special Attack stat is increased. Download will add the two opposing Pokemon's stats and calculate the lower stat between both in double battles.

Pokemon Who Receive Download:
Genesect
Porygon-Z
Porygon2
Porygon

Download is a curious ability introduced in Generation 4 to only three Pokemon. Porygon-Z made use of it to boost its Special Attack to soaring levels. Porygon2, on the other hand, was usually used as a niche counter to Gyarados and Heatran, switching into them and cloning their abilities with Trace, lowering the former's Attack while absorbing the latter's Fire Blast. In any case, Download was shaky since the Porygon family has an inferior Attack stat and a +1 boost to Attack isn't going to help much. However, about two months ago, things changed for Download.

Enter Genesect:

Genesect is a natural candidate for Download. It is basically a win/win for Genesect, as getting an Attack boost allows it to hit harder with its STAB U-turn, a move it can fit on nearly any set. On the other hand, a Special Attack boost gives it a boost to its excellent special movepool. Flamethrower, Ice Beam, Thunder(bolt), and STAB Bug Buzz absolutely love the boost. On top of this, Genesect can run a Choice Scarf set that actually boosts its offense. Imagine a Choice Specs and Choice Scarf boost with no need (or capability rather) of setting up.

Using Download
Getting the desired boost is not too difficult; if you are running a specially based set, Genesect will get the SpA boost by switching into a physically defensive Pokemon or a Pokemon whose defense stats are equal. Otherwise, Genesect will receive an Attack boost. If you are running a mixed set, you are responsible for getting the boost that best benefits your situation. Most mixed sets are specially based, with coverage moves + U-turn to ... you know, do U-turn does. Imagine the following scenario:

1. You are running a Choice Scarf Genesect set of U-turn / Flamethrower / Ice Beam / Thunderbolt, and a standard Ferrothorn with Stealth Rock / Leech Seed / Thunder Wave / Power Whip.

2. You see Espeon on your opponent's team.

3. Your Ferrothorn is out on the playing field, ready and is ready to lay some hazards or cripple your precious sweeper.

What do you think is going to happen? Well, most likely, Espeon is about to come out and bounce back whatever hazard you use, use Reflect, and absorb your Power Whips. Or, it can switch into Power Whip, use Reflect, and survive the next one. Whatever the situation, it's probably best to just save Ferrothorn for later. You go with your gut feeling and decide to use Ferrothorn as bait. Genesect is switched in.

4. As you predicted, your opponent brings in Espeon.

Genesect gets a free +1 boost to its Attack. Congratulations! Even with minimal investment and a neutral Attack nature, 252 HP Espeon is punctured by Genesect's stingers, taking a lofty 119.16 - 140.71% should it decide to stay in. You have either taken Espeon out of commission for the rest of the match or have gained instant momentum.

On the other hand, imagine the same situation but instead of Espeon, you see Magnezone, and instead of Ferrothorn, you have a Forretress with Volt Switch + other Forretress moves. Surely your opponent will send in their SubCharge Magnezone. Predicting the switch, you click Volt Switch. As predicted, your opponent switches to Magnezone. It does pitiful damage, but you have opened the gate for Genesect to come in and get a free +1 boost to its Special Attack. Flamethrower does just enough to OHKO 100% of the time and you have eliminated your opponent's Steel trapper.

Defending Against Download
As a defender, you too have control over Genesect's fate simply by the way you allocate your stats. Say you are EVing your Deoxys-D; it should cross your mind that since you are running max Speed and HP, you have 4 EVs do dump into a stat of your choice. Since Deoxys-D has equal base defenses, it's tempting to put those 4 EVs into Deoxys's Special Defense in order to "screw over" that Genesect by forcing it to get an Attack boost. I mean, why not? It'll be a just a crappy Genesect locked into some unSTABbed coverage moves. However, you think a bit longer and realize that maybe this is a bad idea. You just gave Genesect's physical STAB move, U-turn, to which Deoxys-D is weak, a nice little boost. What normally couldn't even do more than 46% now does 57.89 - 69.07%, allowing your opponent to send in something that can take on a Deoxys-D at less than full health. Sure, it gets off a layer of Spikes, but that's about it. A very rare but very deadly Pokemon to face is Choice Band Genesect. At +1 with a neutral nature, Genesect does a whopping 105.26 - 125%; OHKOing Deoxys-D is quite the feat, and very sad if it happens to you. Again, this is extremely rare, but why let it happen in the first place? Let's instead place those 4 EVs into Defense and give the potential Genesect a Special Attack boost. Returning to the specially based mix set before, we re-do our calculations and come up with the following calculations:

U-turn: 38.15 - 46.05%
Flamethrower: 31.9 - 37.82%
Ice Beam: 31.9 - 37.82%
Thunder: 40.46 - 47.69%
Thunderbolt: 31.9 - 37.2%
Bug Buzz: 90.78 - 107.23%


If you are paranoid about Bug Buzz happening, by all means swap those EVs, but don't blame me when you only get one hazard up after your opponent uses U-turn. Otherwise, you have made a wiser decision, giving Genesect a +1 SpA boost that, quite obviously, does not matter most of the time.


These are only a few scenarios. Don't expect me to cover everything or there is no discussion. Your job is to share with us some situations in which you have used Download to great effect or if you have successfully neutered an opponent's Genesect and how you've done it.

 

[SpecsX]

Genesect is really the best user of Download, as it actually can function as a mixed attacker. I run EBelt Gene with U-Turn/Iron Head/Zen Headbutt/Flamethrower. It's a great lure, but that's not the pint of this thread. Essentially, I get a SpA boost, I use Flamethrower on whatever comes in. If I get an Attack boost, I use the move that will be the most damaging to the likely switch-in. For example, a Fighting-Type comes in to take a resisted U-Turn, only to switch in to a boosted Zen Headbutt.

 

[BattleStar]

Download IMO is one if the most unique Abilties around and is a godsend for mix attackers like Genosect. Even for Pokemon like porygon-Z back when he was in RU he made good use of his ability. Which is knowing when to come in to get the desired boost. Though not often I actually seen some sets with a physical moves that could make good use of a download boost in Attack.

Though this also got me thinking. What are your thoughts on have intimidate being a Psuedo-Counter for download? Such as making sure your SpDef is higher and then the attack boost would negated.

 

[Nix_Hex]

Though this also got me thinking. What are your thoughts on have intimidate being a Psuedo-Counter for download? Such as making sure your SpDef is higher and then the attack boost would negated.

Sounds interesting but I must ask, what can take advantage of that? Currently, the only Pokemon in OU with Intimidate are Gyarados, Salamence, and Landorus-T. All three of those have a 4x weakness to one of Genesect's attacks. If they U-turn while you send in one of those Pokemon, they gain the momentum and get to send in a counter, which aren't all that rare for those Pokemon.

 

[HolyAvatar]

Download IMO is one if the most unique Abilties around and is a godsend for mix attackers like Genosect. Even for Pokemon like porygon-Z back when he was in RU he made good use of his ability. Which is knowing when to come in to get the desired boost. Though not often I actually seen some sets with a physical moves that could make good use of a download boost in Attack.

Though this also got me thinking. What are your thoughts on have intimidate being a Psuedo-Counter for download? Such as making sure your SpDef is higher and then the attack boost would negated.

Most common users are weak to it's special attacks anyway : Gyarados, Salamence and Landorus-T. All of them are OHKOed by the appropriate coverage move. And Genesect won't stay on Salamence fearing scarfed fire blast.
I guess scrafty and hitmontop could use it but meh, it's scrafty and hitmontop.

Ninja'd :(

 

[BattleStar]

Sounds interesting but I must ask, what can take advantage of that? Currently, the only Pokemon in OU with Intimidate are Gyarados, Salamence, and Landorus-T. All three of those have a 4x weakness to one of Genesect's attacks. If they U-turn while you send in one of those Pokemon, they gain the momentum and get to send in a counter, which aren't all that rare for those Pokemon.

Yeah that's what I thought of as well. I imagine the most usable Pokemon out of those Pokemon is Salamence who could only switch in on a Neutral or resisted attack. Even then I don't know the exact calcs for that and I would imagine Salmence can't even dream of surviving it with SR on the field.

The only two other options I can think of that might remotely work is Scrarty or Arcanine. But same as with Salamence, is that these two might not be able to handle Genosects attacks. Plus I know Arcanine is way to frail.

Edit:Ninja'd lol

 

[DEMo_Gorgon47]

The Classic Example is putting 4 SpD EV's onto something like Keldeo or Terrakion. Especially Terrakion as on most Genesect sets nothing Gene carries threatens it. While on Keldeo it ensures T-Bolt doesnt hit as hard.

 

[Danger Mouse]

The Classic Example is putting 4 SpD EV's onto something like Keldeo or Terrakion. Especially Terrakion as on most Genesect sets nothing Gene carries threatens it. While on Keldeo it ensures T-Bolt doesnt hit as hard.

Yeah, I ev'd my Keldeo that way so it can survive a T-Bolt from Gene. I use a combination of Keldeo and Thundurus. Keldeo can switch in on pretty much any of Genesects moves, barring thunderbolt, which Thundurus absorbs. The two have fantastic synergy in general.

Also, I have to add that Choice Band Genesect, while rare, is absolutely fantastic. A +1 CB STAB U-Turn is the stuff of nightmares.

 

[Electrolyte]

Sometimes, not playing with a Download boost could also win you some momentum. Download is great for playing mindgames as well. Just because you have a +1 boost to Attack and your opponent is weak to U-Turn doesn't mean that that's all you should be using. That one psychic type might not always be the biggest threat to your team. It might even be a Gliscor....

Back to NixHex's example:
4. Espeon vs Genesect
Genesect is at +1 Atk

VS

Espeon: 90% Genesect: 20%
So, we're here at Espeon vs a weakened Scarfed Genesect, who has gotten a +1 attack boost. You've gota 40% SD Lucario waiting in the wings, while your opponent has a 50% Banded Infernape. It looks like you'll lose at this point, but you cling to the fact that Lucario can sweep at +2. So let's take a look at how to do that. Espeon is definitely a threat to Lucario's sweep right now; it can outspeed and Psychic you to death, while Bullet Punch fails to OHKO. However, if you could somehow chase Espeon out, it can't switch back in, fearing Crunch. So Espeon is a threat. U-Turning and killing it right off the bat would be best, right?

But what about Infernape? He's certainly a very big threat. It's Mach Punch OHKO's both Lucario and Genesect- you have stupidly made Lucario choose Ice Punch instead of ExtremeSpeed. The only way to deal with Nape is to somehow hit it as it comes in- Lucario's CC and Genesect's Tbolt are both KO's right now. But you have to hit it as it comes in, and with the right move. Since your opponent is probably knowledgeable, he'll predict your U-Turn and switch to Nape. You've failed to KO it, and now it will sweep you. GG. Even if he doesn't switch and stays in with Espeon, you are forced to switch to Lucario, and your opponent sends in Nape, finishing you off as well. There's no way you'll win with this obvious route.

Wait, though. There's an alternative to this. It's soo easy to predict that a U-Turn is coming, so any pretty smart player would switch to Nape at this point. So, if you're even smarter than smart, you'll go for Thunderbolt- it KO's the Nape switch in. Nape falls, espeon comes in, you sack Lucario, and switch back in to OHKO with U-Turn. You win.

5.____ sends in Infernape!
Genesect uses Thunderbolt!
Infernape loses 50% health!
Infernape fainted!
_____ sends in Espeon!
DEAD

VS

6.You sent out Lucario!
Espeon uses Psychic!
Lucario loses 40% health!
Lucario fainted!
You sent out Genesect! Genesect's Download boosts it's Attack!

VS

DEAD

7. Genesect used U-Turn!
Overkill!
Espeon fainted!
You won the match!

DEAD

VS

Now, there's always the chance that your opponent keeps Espeon in and sets up Light Screen. Well, then you're screwed, and your opponent is even smarter than smarter than smart. I don't blame you for losing. Still, you went on the way that could have won you the match, instead of the one that would never have won you the match.

To summarize, abusing Download could not always be the best option. Of course, this is extremely situational, and probably will never happen, but I'm telling you guys to wait before you spam U-Turn. Sometimes, it won't work.

 

[ginganinja]

@Electrolyte

I get what your example is trying to achieve, however quite honestly, if your scenario came into play, I would consider it a pretty bad choke on the behalf of the Infernape player. Wouldn't a smart opponent sac Espeon, then bring in Infernape and Mach Punch everything to death?

 

[Electrolyte]

@Electrolyte

I get what your example is trying to achieve, however quite honestly, if your scenario came into play, I would consider it a pretty bad choke on the behalf of the Infernape player. Wouldn't a smart opponent sac Espeon, then bring in Infernape and Mach Punch everything to death?

Yeah, that's very true.

But either way, Tbolting is the safest idea here, as U-Turning will make you lose either way. Still, I get what you're saying, and I agree.

Anyway, that was an extreme example, because nobody runs Banded Nape anymore.

 

[Stallion]

Sometimes, not playing with a Download boost could also win you some momentum. Download is great for playing mindgames as well. Just because you have a +1 boost to Attack and your opponent is weak to U-Turn doesn't mean that that's all you should be using. That one psychic type might not always be the biggest threat to your team. It might even be a Gliscor....

Back to NixHex's example:
4. Espeon vs Genesect
Genesect is at +1 Atk

VS

Espeon: 90% Genesect: 20%
So, we're here at Espeon vs a weakened Scarfed Genesect, who has gotten a +1 attack boost. You've gota 40% SD Lucario waiting in the wings, while your opponent has a 50% Banded Infernape. It looks like you'll lose at this point, but you cling to the fact that Lucario can sweep at +2. So let's take a look at how to do that. Espeon is definitely a threat to Lucario's sweep right now; it can outspeed and Psychic you to death, while Bullet Punch fails to OHKO. However, if you could somehow chase Espeon out, it can't switch back in, fearing Crunch. So Espeon is a threat. U-Turning and killing it right off the bat would be best, right?

But what about Infernape? He's certainly a very big threat. It's Mach Punch OHKO's both Lucario and Genesect- you have stupidly made Lucario choose Ice Punch instead of ExtremeSpeed. The only way to deal with Nape is to somehow hit it as it comes in- Lucario's CC and Genesect's Tbolt are both KO's right now. But you have to hit it as it comes in, and with the right move. Since your opponent is probably knowledgeable, he'll predict your U-Turn and switch to Nape. You've failed to KO it, and now it will sweep you. GG. Even if he doesn't switch and stays in with Espeon, you are forced to switch to Lucario, and your opponent sends in Nape, finishing you off as well. There's no way you'll win with this obvious route.

Wait, though. There's an alternative to this. It's soo easy to predict that a U-Turn is coming, so any pretty smart player would switch to Nape at this point. So, if you're even smarter than smart, you'll go for Thunderbolt- it KO's the Nape switch in. Nape falls, espeon comes in, you sack Lucario, and switch back in to OHKO with U-Turn. You win.

5.____ sends in Infernape!
Genesect uses Thunderbolt!
Infernape loses 50% health!
Infernape fainted!
_____ sends in Espeon!
DEAD

VS

6.You sent out Lucario!
Espeon uses Psychic!
Lucario loses 40% health!
Lucario fainted!
You sent out Genesect! Genesect's Download boosts it's Attack!

VS

DEAD

7. Genesect used U-Turn!
Overkill!
Espeon fainted!
You won the match!

DEAD

VS

Now, there's always the chance that your opponent keeps Espeon in and sets up Light Screen. Well, then you're screwed, and your opponent is even smarter than smarter than smart. I don't blame you for losing. Still, you went on the way that could have won you the match, instead of the one that would never have won you the match.

To summarize, abusing Download could not always be the best option. Of course, this is extremely situational, and probably will never happen, but I'm telling you guys to wait before you spam U-Turn. Sometimes, it won't work.

Or you could just U-Turn which is the best result 100 % of the time, because if he switches to Infernape, Extremespeed has priority over Mach Punch and it 2hkoes Espeon if it switches in. Poor example.

Edit: Who would ever use an Extremespeed-less Luke...

Edit two: Why would you just not sac Espeon and sweep with Infernape if Lucario has no Extremespeed? Mind games are a part of Pokemon, I don't think Download has much to do with anything.

Edit three: I didn't realise Ginga beat me to it gdi, he puts the ninja in ginganinja

 

[CrackinSkulls]

Or you could just U-Turn which is the best result 100 % of the time, because if he switches to Infernape, Extremespeed has priority over Mach Punch and it 2hkoes Espeon if it switches in. Poor example.

@Stallion
I am pretty sure that he said that the Luke doesn't have Extremespeed. That said every single SD Lucario should run Extremespeed because it is one of his main niches over other SD sweepers.

@Electrolyte
tbh i didn't really like your example because the situation was not very common unlike NixHex's which was a common situation that everyone could relate to, besides as Ginganinja pointed out you have 0 chance of winning anyway if your opponent sacks Espeon.


I have currently been testing Genesect out on multiple teams and I have found download to be an interesting toy. First off what really sets Genesect apart with download is that he is a special attacker with U-Turn. Although there are pokemon like Hydreigon and Infernape that can also pull this off Download makes Genesect (generally) a far superior option. Download combined with his awesome coverage means that your oppenent is constantly living in fear. Other U-turners like Scizor, he simply can't be walled. Your opponent is basically stuck between a rock and a hard place. Say for instance we have a Rotom-W and a Scizor against a Skarmory and a Blissey. Scizor and Rotom-W can keep on Volt-Turning but they will never crack there defenses. Put Stealth Rock into the mix and you are surely going to lose. Genesect however will tear the two down easily. say i bring it on on Skarmory, he goes to Blissey expecting the Flamethrower and bam, smacked by U-turn. The difference between him and Scizor is that a Skarmory would surely stay in on a Scizor whereas against neither of them are safe from Genesect. All you need to do is catch them on an overpredict and smack Skarmory with a Flamethrower and that is that. The reason Genesect does this so effectively is that because of Download he can actually dent Blissey pretty hard.

Basically Genesect places your opponent between a rock and a hard place because of Download, not only can he get an SpAtk boost combined with awesome type coverage to force out pretty much anything that isn't faster, He also has a Download boostable, STAB boosted U-turn to dent and gain momentum. As a result Genesect is a momentum machine. You can slap him in almost anywhere and get results, stall teams greatly benefit by his offensive pressure and the switches he forces, HO teams love the momentum to bring out the big guns and balanced teams can be glued together.

 

[chimpact]

Download is definitely an interesting ability. A lot of pokemon that have identical defenses may start using those leftover 4 EVs to "counter" that download boost. Even if they don't have identical defenses, you can still lower the IVs, making your pokemon more fragile, but help your team combat Genesect better.