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DPP SU Discussion + Resources Thread
DPP Sub-Zero Used (SU) is the lowest unofficial tier on Smogon, and it's titularly the tier below ZU. DPP SU saw early speculation after the formation and stabilization of DPP ZU over several years starting around 2022, and it's grown now into a stable tierlist after several tournaments and matchmaking organized through the SU Discord. We're looking forward to using this thread to share resources about the tier, discuss new trends and developments, and reach a larger audience for people who enjoy DPP lower tiers on the Smogon forum.
Pokemon are tiered as DPP ZU based on cumulative usage across DPP ZU tournaments, including the following: ZU Olympiad I-II, ZU Classic V-VI, and ZUPL V-VI. If a Pokemon has >~3.41% usage in ZU, it is tiered as ZU. This includes the following:
In addition, Pokemon tiered as ZUBL, PU, and so on are not allowed for use in SU.
DPP SU has its own banlist of Pokemon and metagame elements that are not allowed. This includes:
Baton Pass, Combusken, Damp Rock, Minun, Shelgon, Trapinch, Vigoroth, Sleep moves
DPP SU Viability Rankings
Last update: March 2nd, 2025
Sample sets are still being updated for the recent bans
To celebrate my favorite Pokémon metagame getting a forum thread, I'm going to be YAPPING like crazy. This is my first time ever making a real post on the forum, so my apologies if there's anything off about it. In this message, I’m not going to discuss Pokémon in order of their viability, but rather their role in the metagame.
Lopunny is the consensus best Pokémon in the tier. For anyone who's played PU or ZU, it’s basically the Purugly/Persian of the metagame. Just like those metagames, Lopunny’s speed, and access to Fake Out, makes it an extremely easy fit for most teams. While Lopunny lost its ability to pivot with the Baton Pass ban, it has an absolutely absurd utility movepool. Options like Thunder Wave, Healing Wish, Switcheroo, and SubPunch are all sets with justified usage and contribute to making Lopunny being so dominant.
Mightyena is considered either the second or third best Pokémon in the metagame. I personally think it’s the king to Lopunny’s queen. Mightyena has incredible defensive utility with Intimidate, nigh unresisted STAB, and game winning revenge killing. The fact that it can both be a great defensive wall, and a game ending sweeper with Howl is what seals the deal for me.
Normal resists are a role that is required on every team given the dominance of Lopunny, and a few other Pokémon that I'll mention later.
Sudowoodo is often considered the best Normal resist by far. Not only is Sudowoodo incredibly sturdy, but it’s also one of the biggest offensive threats in the metagame, with a coverage combination that is only stopped by Bronzor and Wormasand. Sudowoodo can run both offensive and defensive sets incredibly well.
While Bronzor is quite passive, it makes up for it by being immune to Toxic and by lacking a Fighting weakness. This makes Bronzor deceptively hard to stop, as it’s a great option for annoying Normals, and can even act as a win condition with Calm Mind.
Bastiodon is one of the only real answers to Mightyena, and it uniquely acts as a Normal resist that can check Cherrim and Gastly as well. Bastiodon is only really useful on Balance teams that can make up for its exploitable typing, but its place there is quite good.
Corsola is similar to Bronzor in that it's passive, but unlike Bronzor, it has Recover. This doesn’t entirely make up for its worse typing, but it’s not bad and it is worth using.
Magcargo is very similar to Corsola. Its specialty is spreading burns with Lava Plume and Flame Body, but I personally believe that the Stealth Rock weakness is just too bad for it to really be on Corsola’s level.
Graveler is mostly outclassed by Sudowoodo, but it has some very niche uses, like being immune to Thunder Wave, and having a stronger Earthquake.
Aron is ultra niche, but it’s able to share Bastiodon’s defensive profile, to an extent, while also having a really strong Head Smash.
Nosepass is another ultra niche option. I think I’m the only person who’s used it, in fact. The only thing Nosepass offers is Thunder Wave for paraspam teams. It’s extremely niche, but paraspam teams are good, so it’s worth considering.
Shuckle has Encore, which is an insanely good move, but is pretty bad otherwise.
Pidgeot is one of the fastest and strongest threats of the meta, and is only really held back by its Stealth Rock weakness and a lack of coverage. Brave Bird and U-Turn are all it really needs, however. Pidgeot can do all-out attack, Choice Band, Choice Scarf, and defensive sets all very well.
Furret is, in my opinion, the biggest winner of the Baton Pass ban. Now that Lopunny can’t pivot, Furret’s U-Turn has a really important role. Pidgeot’s Stealth Rock weakness makes it a very high risk high reward option. Furret, not having that weakness, is a lot lower maintenance. Of course, this comes at the cost of its power and speed, but Furret is able to make up for that through being more overall reliable. Given its typing, it’s also considered to be the best Pursuit trapper in the tier. While it may not have Roost, it at least has Trick to distinguish its Choice item sets.
While Normal can be considered the best type in the tier, Water is right up there with it, being another archetype that you have to fit on every team. Waters are not only very strong, but also good at checking each other.
In my opinion, Lumineon is the best Water in DPP SU. Lumineon shares Pidgeot’s speed tier, and while it doesn’t hit as hard, its lack of a Stealth Rock weakness makes it stupidly versatile. It’s the best Choice Scarf user by a country mile, but its flagship set is simply all-out attack. With such a riskless U-Turn, it’s hard to punish Lumineon for doing much of anything, and this trait is what allows it to clean late games and stop lower rank cheese so easily. Additionally, Lumineon also has good Choice Specs and defensive sets.
Octillery is the only real contender for Lumineon’s throne, and many do consider it to be better than Lumineon. Octillery is a phenomenal wallbreaker, with its only true checks being Munchlax, Clefairy, and Wigglytuff. Even Tentacool can get wrecked by a surprise Psychic. While it’s a fantastic breaker, it also tends to get worn down more easily than Lumineon does due to its low speed and lack of U-Turn.
Huntail is very similar to Octillery, and is often only used due to Swift Swim. Damp Rock is banned for a reason, however, as it’s a devastating option on HO teams. It also has Sucker Punch, which makes it a better physical attacker than Octillery.
Prinplup is basically Octillery with Stealth Rock. If you need the role compression, it fits really nicely.
Seaking is a more niche Rain abuser that trades most of Huntail’s traits for Megahorn. It has a genuinely solid place, but is also not very common at all.
Chinchou is a Water that can beat other Waters with Thunderbolt. It also beats Pikachu. It’s hard to fit and lacks defensive utility, but can sometimes find use.
Clamperl is ultra niche, but it used to have a genuinely decent niche on Baton Pass teams before that was banned. Nowadays, it finds itself used in more niche Screens and Trick Room teams.
Wailmer is an Octillery that can boom. Ultra niche, but usable.
Now that I’ve mentioned all of the archetypes that you have to either check or use, let’s go into some of those checks. Special walls are great for this, as they’re some of the best ways for non-HO teams to deal with Waters.
The best special wall is often debated, but I think it’s easily Tentacool. Tentacool not only hard walls Waters, but its Toxic Spikes have pretty much changed how the tier is played. Toxic Spikes are amazing for how they put Offense teams on a timer, and it allows Balance teams to get away with more passive options. As a result, being able to answer Tentacool has become essential for every single team style.
Kecleon has become more common as of late, as its enormous movepool has left a ton of room for discovery. Stealth Rock, Recover, Thunder Wave, Knock Off, and Sucker Punch are all options that few other special walls have, and the ability to swap between these makes Kecleon highly adaptable.
Munchlax is able to take advantage of the fact that Kecleon has no STAB because of Color Change. As a result, Munchlax operates as more of a tank than Kecleon does. This means that Munchlax has great options from offensive sets to defensive sets. Curselax is also a very good win condition with Pursuit support.
Clefairy was shrugged off for quite a long time, but has recently surged with the rise of Balance teams. All of the special walls mentioned previously are ones which struggle to beat balance teams in the long term. Clefairy, through having Magic Guard, is one of the best ways to stop these more passive teams. As a result, I consider Clefairy to be a very underrated Pokemon in the metagame.
Wigglytuff is a weird middle ground between Kecleon and Clefairy. I personally think it’s an awkward fit, but I have seen it work. Wish is the main thing it has over Kecleon, while bulk is the main thing it has over Clefairy. Otherwise, I think Wigglytuff works better as a Screens setter or an offensive lead.
Noctowl used to have a really good niche as one of the few Combusken checks, but then Combusken was banned. Afterward, it became one of the better ways to deal with Butterfree spamming Sleep Powder, but then Sleep was banned. Nowadays, Noctowl is really hard to justify with its Stealth Rock weakness. It has a small niche due its speed tier, however. Whirlwind is another cool move that I think it can take advantage of given the rise of Spikes teams.
Togetic is even more niche than Noctowl after the Baton Pass ban took a decent niche from it. I guess it has instant recovery over Wigglytuff as a screens setter at least.
Because of how good Waters are, Grasses become quite good as well. Unfortunately, the Grass-type selection isn’t nearly as strong given the lack of options. Even so, many of them are quite underrated.
Cherrim is THE Grass of DPP SU. It’s a Pokemon that is useful both offensively as a Water check, and defensively as an all purpose wall. This gives Cherrim a ton of sets despite its limited movepool, and it pulls off all of its sets incredibly well. Cherrim’s only real weaknesses are passivity on the defensive sets, and an awkward speed tier on the offensive sets. Otherwise, it’s one of the easiest Pokemon to fit on a team. Oh yeah, I guess Flower Gift can make it a funny anti-Sun mon as well.
Sunflora is another Pokemon that I consider to be quite underrated. Of course, though, no one can deny how good it is on Sun teams. Basically nothing switches into Sunflora, which makes it devastating with Chlorophyll, but that can even make it a solid option on standard teams. Its speed is a pretty big barrier as it's outsped by Octillery, but it’s otherwise quite good at its role, and even has Synthesis to boot.
Weepinbell is another Pokemon who is mainly used on Sun. While it can technically be used outside of it with a Swords Dance set, this has yet to really be experimented with. On Sun teams, though, it’s perhaps the best mix of speed and power for the team style.
Tropius is one of the more niche options on Sun, as its worse typing makes it more vulnerable to Ice and Rock type attacks. It can sometimes come in handy if you need an extra abuser.
Nuzleaf is an ultra niche option that I only just started using. It’s really bad, except for the fact that it has Explosion. Explosion is extremely good for Sun’s blistering fast pace, and it makes Nuzleaf another more unexplored part of the metagame.
Gastly is too unique for me to put it in an existing category, as it fills both the role of an offensive Pokemon, and an emergency Normal-type check. Despite its typing, Gastly has significantly better defensive utility than most attackers due to its immunities. This allows Gastly to uniquely stone wall certain variants of Lopunny and Munchlax, along with praying on Choice locked attacks. Gastly uses this utility to spray out its powerful STABS, or even get quirky with disruptive options like Pain Split and Will-O-Wisp. Because of how powerful Gastly is, certain teams, like Curselax teams, center their entire game plan around trapping it.
Croconaw is by far the best sweeper in the tier. Its fantastic Water typing allows it to set up with ease, while its offensive presence more than makes up for the turn it takes to set up. Croconaw opts to run Swords Dance instead of Dragon Dance in DPP SU, as its Aqua Jet is generally strong enough to take down most of what outspeeds it. With a Torrent boost, Croconaw can sometimes feel unstoppable. Part of why Water types are required is because they’re the best way to stop a Croconaw sweep from happening.
Pupitar is a lot less common, but don’t let that fool you. With a typing that allows it to take Normal moves in a pinch, Pupitar retaliates with great precision. Additionally, it also has other sets like Stealth Rock which haven’t been used a lot, but show potential.
Chatot is THE "potential" mon. Everyone knows it can cook due to its great stats and Nasty Plot, but its Stealth Rock weakness has pushed people away from using it a ton. That said, this thing has swept me before, and it is a force to be reckoned with. Options like Encore can also make it much easier for it to start sweeping.
Poliwhirl is extremely niche and hasn’t really been used in like a year, but it can sweep with Belly Drum sometimes.
Breakers, as you'd expect, do well against defensive Pokemon, but are easily revenge-killed by more offensive teams.
The best of these is largely subjective, but I’d personally give that title to Seviper. This is mostly because Seviper has access to Sucker Punch to get around faster options. A problem that every mid-speed breaker has is that they tend to live in Mightyena’s shadow, but Seviper is able to get around through mixed attacking options, and being one of the only Pokémon in the tier that can absorb Toxic Spikes.
In terms of breakers that are impossible to switch into, Meditite takes the cake. Its only defensive checks are defensive Pidgeot, Pineco, Wormasand, Slowpoke, and Drowzee. Part of why the tier is more offensive is because Balance teams really struggle to deal with it. Otherwise, Meditite gets pounded by Offense teams extremely hard due to its middling speed and terrible bulk.
Pikachu is more of a solid middle ground as a result. It’s the fastest Pokémon of this category, and it’s quite strong too. While Nasty Plot used to be the main set, the difficulty in setting that up resulted in Encore replacing it. With Encore, Pikachu is able to force switches and get its big damage out in strong bursts. It’s checked by most special walls, and uniquely checked by Marshtomp and Wormasand as well. Just like Meditite, it’s paper frail and gets ruined by the priority spam that Offense teams love enabling.
Exploud feels like the standard for this archetype. It’s the in-between of Munchlax and Pidgeot, and while that makes it less defined, it’s a role that still very much has its place.
Flareon is fascinating because it has breaking power similar to Combusken, which we banned, but it also has a Stealth Rock weakness that makes it much more volatile. Flareon is a fantastic breaker, and maybe even the most devastating one, but it’s also on the biggest timer out of any of them.
Like Pupitar, Magnemite can take a Normal hit in a pinch, and it uses this for some incredibly strong Thunderbolts. It also has the added bonus of trapping Bronzor, which many teams greatly benefit from.
At this point, I really should discuss the lead metagame. Some Pokémon are only used as leads, while others are already established Pokémon who happen to be great leads.
Lopunny is the latter. As soon as Baton Pass was banned and gave Lopunny an excuse to use other moves, Lopunny established itself as a dominant lead due to Encore. This allows it to lock Stealth Rock leads into their hazards, and offensive leads into the Protect they’d use to guard against its Fake Out. As a result of this, Lopunny is debatably the best lead in the metagame.
As for Stealth Rock leads, the usual suspects such are all useful for the same reason that they’re always useful.
There are only two Pokémon who are exclusively used as Stealth Rock leads, and Onix is one of them. As Onix has Taunt, it allows it to prevent hazards while also setting them. If it’s ever able to, it can also let off a devastating Explosion to start off the game for any HO teams.
Anorith is a lot more niche since it lacks Explosion, but it’s a great anti-lead against Onix leads. It outspeeds Onix’s Taunt, and it Rapid Spins away Onix’s Stealth Rock. It doesn’t match up nearly as well against the rest of the lead metagame, but is very good in this one matchup.
Abra and Gastly are both very good Taunt leads. Abra notably has Inner Focus to mess with Lopunny leads, while Gastly notably walls Lopunny leads. Abra also has Counter to help it better win trades.
Machop began seeing use after Machamp was banned from DPP OU, and it’s seen great success. Machop’s stats are too bad to be used outside of the lead slot, but as a lead, it’s impossible to switch into due to Dynamic Punch. The best way to beat it is to just hit it hard and pray that you win the 50/50. This makes it great for teams that don’t need to set Stealth Rock right away, and also great for teams that don’t need to prevent Stealth Rock.
I’ve mentioned Choice Scarf Pokémon in brief sections, but as some Pokémon are only useful because of Choice Scarf, I figured I’d make this its own section.
Lumineon and Pidgeot are by far and away the best Choice Scarfers in the tier and it’s not even close. The general rule of the thumb with this meta is that speed is the most important thing that a Choice Scarf user can have. Pair that with bulk that can withstand priority and these two are a match made in heaven. U-Turn is amazing as well.
I already mentioned what makes Furret good, but it’s also a really good Choice Scarf mon.
I personally think it’s too risky to run Abra as a Choice Scarf user, but it can admittedly do really well into certain teams. It’s Pursuit bait, and it’s frail while also being outspeed by better Scarfers, but it has its place.
Cherrim is a Choice Scarf option that seems logical, but I never see. I think it can cook.
Gastly is one of the most common Choice Scarf users due to how it combines solid speed with defensive utility. Like Furret and Abra, it also has Trick.
Vibrava used to be one of the most common Scarfers until we started speed creeping the hell out of them. Nowadays, Virbrava sees use for its great typing, granting it incredibly useful immunities and STAB. Mixed sets have also recently started to see play to surprisingly solid effect.
Mankey is very similar to Vibrava, but it’s a lot worse defensively barring a Sucker Punch resistance. Thankfully, it makes up for this by being a Fighting type, which is generally more useful offensively in this meta given the abundance of Normals and Rocks it prays on.
Octillery is the slowest Scarfer to be genuinely good in my opinion. I think it’s overrated, but the surprise value is really strong when it’s wielding a Water Spout.
I only occasionally see Seviper and Flareon with a Scarf. They’re honestly kind of fringe, but they can work well as surprises.
Quilava’s Eruption is cool, but with that Stealth Rock weakness, Flareon is usually stronger. The speed tier only matters for Vibrava and Mankey, which isn’t really enough. It has its place, but is quite hard to fit.
copy/paste what I said about Wailmer last time.
Cranidos is a great Choice Scarf user 80% of the time. It is completely useless every time it misses a Head Smash or Stone Edge.
In a tier with Sudowoodo and Pikachu, Ground types fulfill a unique defensive role which, while hard to fit, can greatly benefit certain teams.
Marshtomp is probably the best of the two. As Pikachu runs HP Ice, Marshtomp is the best Pikachu answer in the tier, and it’s able to do this while being great offensively with a STAB Earthquake, while also having viable special sets. Stealth Rock is the final touch to ensure that Marshtomp can always contribute to a team. Unfortunately, Marshtomp is quad weak to Sudowoodo’s Wood Hammer, and this makes it significantly harder to fit as a result.
Wormasand doesn’t have this problem, but is held back further by a lack of Stealth Rock, which also makes it hard to fit. Thankfully, it makes up for it by being better overall defensively, and by having the extremely useful Sucker Punch.
Spikes is a strategy that has recently become more popular as the metagame has slowed down, and it has two viable abusers.
Budew has recently become accepted as the best Spikes user in DPP SU. While its stats are frankly quite bad, they’re just good enough to let it set Spikes on the extremely common Lumineon and Cherrim. As Budew also has Synthesis, this allows it to safely set Spikes on passive Pokemon like Bronzor as well. It’s because of this that Budew has emerged as a fantastic countermeasure to Balance, while also being quite good on Balance teams itself.
Pineco, on the other hand, is what you’d use on more offensive teams. It’s a swiss army knife of hazards, hazard removal, and momentum with Explosion. As a lead, it has some really good matchups, and outside of the lead slot, it can hold its own against Lopunny and other physical attackers due to its Fighting resistant typing.
Hazard removal isn’t a particularly important part of the tier given how big of a commitment it can be to continually remove hazards, as well as most hazard removers struggling to make progress against hazard setters. Even so, they still have a place for enabling Stealth Rock weak Pokémon, and for increasing the longevity of Balance teams.
Tentacool is the best Rapid Spin user by far and it’s entirely because it’s a near auto include on Balance anyway.
Because of this, Wartortle struggles to stand out as much. It doesn’t have the ability to make progress with Toxic Spikes, and this results in Wartortle being much harder to fit. It hasn’t been seen in a while, but I theorize that BO teams might pick it up since its superior bulk allows for more consistent spins.
Staryu has recently started seeing more use, and its speedy Rapid Spin has proven to be uniquely useful at removing hazards in a pinch. In my opinion, it’s best used like this when there’s Spikes or Toxic Spikes on the field. I don’t personally think you should stack Stealth Rock weak Pokemon with it when Staryu can sometimes get more out of just attacking.
This section is pretty much entirely going to be dedicated to Duskull, as I personally find Gastly to be quite bad at spinblocking. Not only is it frail, but it’s also outsped by Staryu, and can’t quite hit Tentacool or Wartortle hard enough. Duskull, on the other hand, is an amazing spinblocker, and pairs very well with Budew on Balance teams. Unlike Gastly, Duskull also isn’t Pursuit bait as it can just Will-O-Wisp Furret and Munchlax. For Pidgeot, it can use Protect to scout whether it’ll Brave Bird or not. As Duskull has a dodgier matchup into Pidgeot, it’s recommended to use it alongside a Rock type, but that’s only natural given how it’s a Balance mon. I find Duskull to be really underrated, and while it only functions on one style of team, it functions quite well on it.
Earlier, I mentioned how few checks Meditite has. Well, two of them are quite niche, but have that niche exclusively because of Meditie. Slowpoke is one of the best Meditite walls in the tier, with Thunder Wave and Slack Off to fight it off. Drowzee is a lot more niche, but it has high SpDef and Wish, so it can technically do something.
Stunky has surprised me a lot, as despite its stats being pretty ass, its movepool is just too good to ride it off. It resists Gastly’s STABs and can Pursuit trap it, it can revenge kill with Sucker Punch, and it can go for an Explosion. This role compression is quite good, and Stunky fits quite well on boom spam HO teams.
Dustox has become a lot better now that the meta has slowed down. The Stealth Rock weakness is still really bad for it, but it’s a great anti-Balance mon that can pivot in big wallbreakers.
Yanma is a niche Speed Boost sweeper that absolutely destroys Sun teams, but is pretty inconsistent against everything else.
Koffing is a Duskull that can use Explosion. It’s good on boom spam HO and not much else.
Ariados is an alternate Toxic Spikes user who has better PhysDef than Tentacool, along with priority. It still feels pretty outclassed, however.
If any of you somehow read all of that, you have my thanks. This took a while, but I love this tier so much and I really hope this rundown can be insightful for anyone wanting to get into the tier :)
I enjoyed yapping so much last time that I'll be back at it again, this time to explain the history of bans in DPP SU, as I chose not to go into those last time. DPP SU has had a long history of bans, but it's because of these bans that the tier has been able to get into such a balanced and stable point. This list will not include Pokémon who rose in or out of SU via usage.
Damp Rock was the first ban of DPP SU, being a transitive ban from DPP ZU. While there were early discussions of unbanning Damp Rock, the choice was made to keep it banned when our Rain abusers are as strong as they are. The fact that Huntail is still a good Rain sweeper without the item should make the problematic nature of the item quite clear.
Granbull falling to SU at all was fairly unexpected when it's pretty good in ZU. Expectedly, it was simply too good at trading with Intimidate increasing its longevity, and with a coverage movepool that blew basically everything into smithereens. This made Granbull impossible to wall, and it resulted in players having to take much greater risks than usual to revenge kill it. As a result, it only took a week after being legal for Granbull to get banned.
As soon as we knew Slaking would be dropping to SU, we banned it instantly. The damage calculator explains all of this, as it can 3HKO something as bulky as PhysDef Bronzor with its STAB. It's a 2HKO if you're a madlad running Giga Impact btw.
Plusle was an absolutely disgusting sweeper. With its speed tier, it outsped all but Lopunny. Depending on the moveset, it could beat pretty much any check. Grass Knot beat Marshtomp, Encore and Substitue beat more passive checks, and Endure + Salac beat any Choice Scarf user. This limited its checks entirely to priority users and Lopunny, which was simply too little counterplay for every team style to reliably fit.
Shelgon just spammed its insanely strong Choice Banded Outrage. Brick Break would destroy Bastiodon, and Fire Fang would ruin Bronzor, which gave Shelgon no defensive counterplay. It could even do a number to offensive counterplay by going for a bulky RestTalk Dragon Dance set, which sounded like a meme, but instead worked like a dream.
Vigoroth was a monster of a sweeper. Taunt would beat defensive counterplay, Sucker Punch would beat offensive counterplay, and its coverage movepool was enough to keep any team guessing on how to stop it. These traits let its sweeps snowball like crazy, and made it comparable in strength to Plusle.
Combusken's STAB was a coverage combination that had almost no switch-ins, and when you combined that with an incredibly strong priority STAB Vaccum Wave, you had a force to be reckoned with. The only real switch-ins were Noctowl and Tentacool, and even those would get absolutely manhandled by physical sets. The fact that it had such set variety was ultimately the final nail in the coffin for it.
Minun just did what Plusle did. It's slightly better at taking a priority hit, and slightly worse at hitting things, but that didn't change any of the fundamental things that made Plusle so broken.
Sleep moves became an incredibly controversial part of the DPP SU metagame, mainly due to how reliably Butterfree was able to set Sleep in the lead slot, due to Compound Eyes giving Sleep Powder near perfect accuracy. If your lead was slower than Butterfree, it needed a Lum Berry. If your lead was faster than Butterfree, it needed Fake Out... or a Lum Berry. If you didn't want to make your lead worse by forcing a Lum Berry on it, than you needed to force sleep immune Pokemon like Mankey and Noctowl onto your team, or Sleep Talk abusers like Munchlax... or spam the ever loving hell out of Lum Berry. The constant Butterfree mirrors became so obnoxious that players began resorting to Yanma, who while having lower accuracy due to Hypnosis, was much faster, while still having decent accuracy as a result of Compound Eyes. It was at this point that the playerbase was completely fed up with this and banned Sleep moves as a whole. The reason Sleep moves were banned instead of Butterfree and Yanma was to avoid players cheesing with Bronzor or Gastly's Hypnosis.
Baton Pass was banned almost entirely because of Lopunny, although more niche users did also contribute to this ban. While DryPass is amazing on Lopunny for how safe it is, there were two main sets that really pushed the move over the edge. The main one was SubPass. This would garuntee that Lopunny wouldn't lose anything, even if it got the read wrong. If the opponent doesn't switch, you're still able to play mind games. If the opponent riskily switches into a revenge killer, Lopunny gets a safer switch than usual. If the opponent switches into a Normal resist, then the Croconaw that you just passed to is now behind a Substitute and is successfully able to sweep as a result. Agility Pass was another disgusting set, and was even more broken behind Screens, turning otherwise bad Pokemon like Clamperl into probable game winners.
In terms of more niche users, my personal favorite was Drifloon, who was an Unburden sweeper that could use Baton Pass to evade a Sucker Punch while handing a Special Attack boost to another Pokémon. Flareon is another option that saw Baton Pass usage for its Salac Berry sets. Furret and Huntail were more creative cases, where they passed defensive boosts to attackers with reliable recovery like Pidgeot. The reason Drypass was banned alongside Substitute or stat passing was both to set a precedent against complex bans, and also to nerf Lopunny into a more honest Pokémon.
Trapinch was a ban that I initally disagreed with, the only ban in this post where that was the case. Despite this, I've come around on this ban and have since seen why it was justified. While Trapinch has absolutely dreadful stats, stats so bad that it is a complete matchup fish, it is also a Pokémon that made defensive teams completely non-existent. Because of Trapinch's god awfully low speed, its only targets would be defensive Pokémon like Munchlax, Kecleon, and chipped Sudowoodo. This severely limited defensive options for Balance and even BO teams, something that made Trapinch really strong on Special Offense teams. Even in games where Trapinch fails to do anything, the threat of it trapping something often leads to those defensive Pokemon having to make riskier plays. Even frail offensive Pokemon like Abra, Mankey, and Pikachu would get blasted by Quick Attack. Overall, Trapinch limited team diversity, and that was more than enough justification for a ban.
I hope this helped anyone who was confused about why we made some of our tiering actions. It's been a two year long journey, but after all of the bans that have been made, I'd personally consider this to be the best time to get into DPP SU, as the likelyhood of another ban seems low right now. This means we can now focus on pushing the limits of our existing metagame, and I'm extremely excited to do so >:)
Hi, we're coming to you with another small update: a Quick Claw ban!
We're actually copying OU's outfit this time instead of the other way around like with the sleep ban, but Quick Claw has finally reared its head as an uncompetitive and banworthy element of the tier. Quick Claw gives wallbreakers like Octillery and Flareon the ability to randomly steal KOs against faster revenge killers that they have no business beating otherwise. While there's opportunity cost to running Quick Claw (like with any item), especially when it's a luck-based element, it's popped up more and more as these Pokemon shirk options like Life Orb and resistance Berries to gamble for extra KOs. The council unanimously voted to nip this luck-based element in the bud, so we are opting to ban Quick Claw.
It's been a year since I last shouted to the endless void. DPP SU’s playerbase has mostly been on a hiatus since then, but of course, metagame shifts have still occurred. Last year, I gave a brief overview of the metagame. This post will be much longer, but will not include every Pokemon. The goal of this post will be to dive into further detail about how the metagame works, and why things exist as they are, which will naturally create much larger sections on top tier Pokemon. Additionally, I also want to focus on Pokemon who’ve changed. If a Pokemon hasn’t changed much, or if I have nothing to add to it, it will not be discussed. Trust me, this post is already long enough. Finally, I will not attempt to be objective in this post. Of course, I have to state objective facts, but those facts will often be spliced with subjective thoughts, analysis, and reflection of the metagame.
Most changes in any metagame come from innovations and developments. The only exception this year has been the banning of Quick Claw. I built a Quick Claw team as a joke last year. 9 months later, the tier exited an activity hiatus for a swiss tour in the SU Discord server. In it, Meth Master ran my Quick Claw team 3 times. Two of those three games resulted in moments where he would’ve lost without the 20% priority chance that Quick Claw provides.
When testing the team, I didn’t see much success with it. After all, I traded an item slot for a roulette. However, sometimes the jackpot can come at the most important times. The team itself was a fast-paced offense that used Octillery and Flareon as abusers. The best abusers were often ones that lacked both speed and priority. Octillery worked for its consistency, while Flareon excelled for how explosive its damage output was. I think other Pokemon that could’ve worked as abusers were Exploud, Magnemite, Marshtomp, and Sunflora. Otherwise, the rest of the team really wasn’t anything special, as it lacked consistent breaking power against balance, and also lacked longevity against those teams as well.
But ultimately, the team was good enough at what it did. Its purpose was to prove that Quick Claw was uncompetitive, and it did that fantastically. It made for some absolutely hilarious replays, but I also can’t help but feel bad for unleashing this horror for the public to use in tournaments. So many players crashed out over this item, but that’s also what helped get it unanimously banned by the council two months after the tournament, something I had been pushing for almost a year by that point.
Outside of Quick Claw, nothing else has been banned. While the current meta is defined by some incredibly central Pokemon and plenty of controversies, opinion has settled on the tier finally being balanced.
QUEEN
Lopunny is basically SU's equivalent to PU's Purugly or ZU's Persian. While its ability to pivot was banned, Lopunny has many other tricks up its sleeve. Like Persian, Lopunny is the fastest Pokemon of its metagame, but unlike Persian, Lopunny has better bulk, attack, coverage, and utility options. It's the kind of Pokemon that can tweak itself to deal with just about any threat.
The fourth moveslot is where Lopunny becomes so easy to slot into teams. Encore punishes setup, Shadow Ball hits Gastly, Thunder Wave cripples checks, Switcheroo punishes Bronzor and Duskull, while Healing Wish provides offensive teams a source of momentum. SubPunch is another common variant that punishes switches incredibly hard, but often prefers Pursuit support for consistency. SubPunch sets can also drop Fake Out for Shadow Ball if Gastly is a concern, but Duskull still walls it. Out of all of these options, I think Encore is the most consistent since it punishes almost all of its answers.
Ultimately, what balances Lopunny is that can't answer everything in one moveset. You always have to make some form of compromise with Lopunny. Both Bronzor and Duskull prevent Lopunny from destroying defensive teams by itself, while a lot of offensive teams can wall it with Gastly. Lopunny is also what makes so many Choice Scarf users viable in checking it.
WOLF AND RABBIT(i wanted to fit a beastars reference lmao)
Mightyena can only be described as the Landorus-Therian of DPP SU. 60% of my current teams contain it. It’s a physical tank that has an almost unresisted Dark STAB, Sucker Punch priority, and utility options. This makes Mightyena the best role compression pick in the metagame.
Mightyena @ Black Glasses / Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Crunch
- Sucker Punch
- Taunt / Substitute / Rock Smash
- Super Fang / Substitute / Howl / Toxic / Heal Bell
Just like Lopunny, the latter half of the moveset is incredibly customizable. Taunt and Super Fang are generally the most consistent. Taunt protects you from status afflictions that would otherwise heavily cripple Mightyena's chances to switch in and deal damage. Super Fang crucially allows Mightyena to win the war against opposing Mightyena and Sudowoodo. Personally, though, I've become a very big Substitute fan. It protects Mightyena from status more reliably, even if it can't prevent setup or hazards without Taunt. Substitute pairs very well with Toxic, an option that more defensive sets absolutely love. The move I've trended toward running the most, however, is Rock Smash of all things. Bastiodon has emerged as the only hard counter to Mightyena... until– Rock Smash also works decently against opposing Mightyena and Sudowoodo, although you admittedly need to get lucky on the defense drop 50/50s for it. Howl also works in this case, but only if the opponent lets you set up for it. Howl punishes passive play, but I’ve trended out of using it because it doesn’t provide instant value. Mightyena is best run as a swiss army knife, so having a moveslot for sweeping goes against that role for me. The only other move I see as worth running is Heal Bell, although I'd suggest that you don't rely on it for removing status. Taunt and Substitute are both more proactive, even if Heal Bell can support your whole team.
What sets Mightyena apart from Lopunny is their role. Lopunny is a fast attacker that will win when you let it. Mightyena is a jack of all trades that needs to be used incredibly carefully. You can’t over-rely on it as a wallbreaker or tank, or you'll miss being able to Sucker Punch a Choice Scarfer. This is what makes Mightyena so much fun. It's good at everything, so you need to make sure that you have a backup plan if it faints.
FREE BIRD
Pidgeot is unique in its status. I consider it just as strong as Lopunny and Mightyena, but is also far simpler, and holds a much more devastating weakness. A Stealth Rock weakness may be a devastating nightmare, allowing a maximum of only 4 switch-ins for it, but Choice Banded Brave Bird’s make up for that. That Free Bird guitar solo hits like a dream basically any time you can let this atomic bomb into the field. Even when a resist switches into it, Pidgeot’s U-Turn is often able to get in a special attacker that puts pressure on the opponent. Pidgeot is also an incredible Choice Scarf user. Sharing Lumineon’s spot as the fastest revenge killer, that also makes it the most reliable.
My favorite Pidgeot set, however, is hands down the stallbreaker. A Poisoned Sudowoodo absolutely hates a Pidgeot spamming Substitute and Roost against it. While Bronzor hard walls this set, that’s nothing Magnemite can’t fix. Defensive sets have always existed, but it wasn’t until the Baton Pass ban slowed down the metagame that defensive Pidgeot became a real threat. It's also one of the few checks that those teams have to Meditite. Due to both being an excellent piece for offensive and defensive teams, I think Pidgeot can now be argued as a member of the big three.
As a quick aside, Furret is basically a worse Pidgeot but without a Stealth Rock weakness, and with Trick to disrupt defensive Pokemon. Last year, I claimed that its speed tier being lower than Pidgeot was not that big of a deal. However, the better Pidgeot gets, the harder it becomes to fit Furret. It’s still good, though.
TOXIC SPIKES
Toxic Spikes have only gotten better over the past year, and while Tentacool has enough weaknesses to hold it back from the very top, it could still be argued that it’s the tiers most central force.
The only Pokemon who absorb Toxic Spikes are Tentacool itself, Budew, Seviper, Dustox, and Stunky. That list is tiny when you realize that Budew and Seviper are good, but not omnipresent. Additionally, Dustox and Stunky weren’t even considered good until a few months ago, when we desperately began looking for answers.
The biggest consequence of Toxic Spikes is arguably a healthy one, as it heavily nerfs Lopunny, and especially Mightyena. As a result, I almost always try to pair Mightyena with a Poison type when I’m building. Because of this, Pidgeot has gained both flexibility and viability due to ignoring Toxic Spikes, which makes it safer to use, and easier for some teams to fit.
There’s another consequence, however, and it’s much more controversial. With the exception of Abra, Magnemite, and Pikachu, Tenacool comfortably switches into every special attacker in the tier. Because both defensive and offensive teams enjoy such a splashable defensive backbone, Tentacool is now spammed as both the best answer and enabler of Toxic Spikes. One of the best ways to mitigate Toxic Spikes is with Pokemon who simply ignore it. A lot of these are Flying types that are weak to Stealth Rock. Tentacool’s Rapid Spin thus makes it an even better answer to Tentacool, creating a really goofy situation where Tentacool is almost always the optimal special wall for a team.
This all sounds stupid and meta centralizing. I’ve spent months with the belief that Tentacool is unhealthy. However, I came around to it after the swiss tour after a realization. Tentacool doesn’t fit onto everything and you need to build around its clear physical weakness. Tentacool also struggles to deal damage directly, with its attacks mostly just existing so that Cherrim, Gastly, and other attackers can’t beat it out. Thus, I think Tentacool is a balanced, but extremely centralizing part of the DPP SU metagame.
CAN YOU SMELL WHAT THE ROCK IS COOKING!?(a mediocre acting career)
Tentacool is such a fantastic Pokemon because it indirectly answers the big three. Normal resists, on the other hand, are your go-to direct answers on any given team.
Sudowoodo remains the best Normal resist. It’s sturdy as hell, but is the only Normal resist to pack a real punch. It’s additionally one of the few Pokemon that can trade with Mightyena, assuming it doesn’t miss any Stone Edges. Offensively, only Bronzor and Wormasand check it, and the latter still has to fear Explosion. I personally prefer Sucker Punch on Sudowoodo, since priority is extremely consistent in its utility. Rock Polish sets are also used on occasion, and while they’re hard to get online, the reward can be devastating.
Bronzor has aged like fine wine given how well it goes against both Lopunny and Pidgeot. Mightyena crushes it, but that’s also why Bronzor pairs so well with Tentacool to cripple it. Due to Bronzor’s Toxic immunity, it can even be a win condition with Calm Mind. I like running that on defensive teams as a way to beat opposing defensive teams.
Bastiodon, meanwhile, functions as the anti-Bronzor. It shares the incredible Toxic immunity and Stealth Rock resistance, but trades being terrible against Lopunny’s Fighting coverage for being excellent against Mightyena and Pidgeot.
Duskull has risen enormously over the course of the last year, being the best Lopunny answer in the tier, and thus Bastiodon’s most reliable partner in crime. Even Pidgeot can’t beat Duskull since it can just click Protect on choice item sets. Duskull also pairs fantastically with Budew’s Spikes, denying Rapid Spin attempts from opposing Tentacool.
Corsola and Magcargo are more niche. I thought they’d become more common after the Baton Pass ban, but the meta ended up favoring other passive walls over them. Ultimately, they just compete for Sudowoodo’s role too much without offering enough that’s unique to them. Recover is nice, but is passive compared to Sudowoodo’s damage output. I will admit, though, Flame Body on Magcargo is incredibly annoying. Meanwhile, Corsola’s Natural Cure and Water neutrality are genuinely nice. They have niches and are usable, but are harder to fit than other options.
FLORIDA MAN
One of the biggest winners of the slower metagame is not a wall, but in fact, our favorite sweeper Croconaw. With good positioning, Croconaw is often able to break any defensive team after a Swords Dance. Aqua Jet and the threat of being put in Torrent range also makes it surprisingly good at sweeping offense teams as well.
Finding answers to Croconaw has repeatedly become more important. It demands a level of respect in the builder that has elevated it to top tier status alongside Sudowoodo and Tentacool. The most reliable check is often another Water type, such as Octillery or Lumineon. However, because those are also must-answer threats, you often need more to defeat it. Part of why Mightyena slots into teams so easily is because Croconaw is often one of the things that it has to check. Croconaw is also the main reason, apart from Choice Scarfers, that Mightyena is a Pokemon that you have to keep for the late game. Cherrim has also emerged as a strong Croconaw check. Since Croconaw has to hit Waters, it often runs Return instead of Ice Punch, which gives Cherrim an invaluable niche of both walling Croconaw and hitting it with a super effective STAB. Otherwise, prepare to spam priority if you’re an offense team. You’ll need it because Croconaw’s a beast.
SQUID GAME
Octillery, unlike Croconaw, doesn’t need a Swords Dance to deal damage. It breaks instantly, making up for its low speed. With the coverage of Surf, Ice Beam, and Energy Ball, it already hits almost the entire metagame for super effective damage. What truly makes it scary, however, is its shocking amount of set diversity.
Octillery @ Leftovers / Rindo Berry / Wacan Berry / Choice Specs / Expert Belt
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Surf
- Ice Beam / Fire Blast
- Energy Ball
- Thunder Wave / Substitute / Psychic
Octillery @ Mystic Water
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
- Surf
- Ice Beam / Fire Blast
- Energy Ball
- Waterfall
Yes, you read the spoilers right. Octillery has so many variations that it demands three separate categories of set. As you’ve read, the split is defined by whether you’re investing it in bulk or speed. Max HP spreads are the most common. While investing in speed can net Octillery some surprise KOs, it’s also slow enough that the bulk becomes far more consistent.
Octillery also has a cornucopia of items at its disposal. Leftovers helps it stay alive longer, resist berries give it more survivability on offense teams, Choice Specs gives it more power, and Expert Belt bluffs Choice Specs.
Your choice of move will also influence the item you pick. For example, if you’re running a Substitute set, you basically always want Leftovers so you can have the health to keep using it. Because of this, I believe that Thunder Wave is the most consistent option, as it gives Octillery the ability to permanently cripple offensive Pokemon, either being able to take them out the next turn, or later into the game. My personal favorite, however, is Psychic, because screw Tentacool. That thing is a poopooface.
There’s also the dilemma of whether to run Ice Beam or Fire Blast. Fire Blast is basically always better. It hits the exact same targets plus Bronzor for super effective damage, while also hitting harder. I still personally use Ice Beam, though, since the trauma of missing a Fire Blast is real and extreme.
Otherwise, the coolest part about max speed sets is that they trade risk for more options. Now, both Choice Scarf and Life Orb are unlocked. The former only works because of Water Spout’s strength. Because Octillery outspeeds Pidgeot with a Choice Scarf, it makes for a surprisingly good offensive lead, even if Lopunny’s dominance makes this set far weaker. The biggest advantage of speed EVs, however, is the flexibility of Life Orb. Since you aren’t lasting as long anyway, Life Orb provides a nice way of getting in extra damage, even if this set is extremely vulnerable to Toxic Spikes, and thus, should probably always run Psychic for the Tentacool matchup.
The final set is a goofy, highly niche set created by EternumTagerMain. It’s a mixed set where the fourth move is Waterfall and the item is Mystic Water, creating a really niche situation where Octillery can beat Munchlax and Clefairy, the only two Pokemon who otherwise hard wall it.
One final thing I want to address, given its versatility, is why I don’t believe Octillery belongs in the big three. The answer is simple. It’s slow, thus, can be worn down. Because of this, you always have to make a trade-off with it. This is true with every Pokemon in DPP SU, but Octillery feels it more because those trade-offs come from its stats instead of its moves. Additionally, Octillery’s best answer, Tentacool, is absolutely everywhere. If Octillery wants to answer Tentacool, it misses out on a lot of utility. This is why I believe Croconaw is better, as it has no such matchup restraints.
fish1107(I hate this is the joke I find funniest in the post)
Last year, I considered Lumineon to be the best Water type. This year, it has gotten noticeably worse as the meta has trended slower. Lumineon’s greatest strength was its speed and pivoting. Against defensive teams, those are still decent traits, but the lack of damage output has become far more noticeable. Before, Lumineon didn’t need to be strong to deal significant damage, but now it really does. Its biggest strength remains consistent, however, crucially sharing Pidgeot’s speed without being Stealth Rock weak. Because of this, I maintain that it’s still the best Choice Scarf user in the tier, and the best fast pivot. An adaptation I also want to consider trying is Toxic, which would make it worse against offense, but would be a huge way for it to threaten defense. Overall, my verdict is that Lumineon is still a great Pokemon that has faded from the top tier into the high tier, and that’s a perfectly respectable spot for it.
THE RAIN MON
Huntail is almost the inverse of Lumineon. Last year, I mostly just saw it as a slightly worse Octillery. Special attacking sets really had little that distinguished it from Octillery, outside of marginally higher speed. This is why Huntail became defined by physical sets. Unfortunately, Croconaw generally pulls off that niche better, even if Huntail boasts better immediate damage. However, I played a game this year that changed everything. I had brought a defensive team, and my opponent clicked Rain Dance on their Huntail. With the power of boosted Hydro Pumps, I lost very quickly. This niche as a Water type breaker is something that only Huntail can do because of Swift Swim. That speed boost in rain is what allows this set to also be devastating against offense teams. Of course, finding a turn to set up can be a challenge, but the metagame now makes that far more rewarding to do. Because of this, I’m gonna go out on a limb and say that this set has put Huntail on par with Lumineon, even if I know that opinion will be unpopular.
FUKO’S FAVORITE POKEMON TRUST
Staryu is a Pokemon well known for being handed out to random strangers in the hopes that they’ll attend a wedding. Now that I’ve established myself as an obsessive Clannad fan desperate to force references down your throat, I must demand you to watch the greatest anime ever written.
Serious PSA aside, Staryu is extremely close to being genuinely viable, and has seen a bit more experimentation throughout the year. While it has an absolutely horrible matchup to Lumineon, it otherwise outspeeds every other Water type. It uniquely carries Thunderbolt, a move with real utility, as it bypasses all of the Rindo Berry spam. I think that Staryu is best used as an offensive Pokemon, but its utility options are what help it stand out. I don’t think it’s a great Rapid Spin user due to its frailty, but I do really like Recover against defensive teams, and it pairs super well with Natural Cure. Staryu feels like one of those Pokemon that we’re super close to finding a strong niche for, but isn’t quite there yet.
FRAUDTORTLE
I think Wartortle has only gotten worse as Tentacool has gotten better. Tentacool is enormously threatening with Toxic Spikes. Wartortle just kind of sits there. It only fits on defensive teams… where Tentacool is almost always the better option. Higher physical defense and a lack of an Earthquake weakness are good traits, though, so it’s not like you can’t use it or anything.
YO MAMA SO FAT–
Since Octillery and Lumineon are the most important special attackers to beat in DPP SU, special walls have become popular answers.
Kecleon is the standard wall. Its stats are fantastic and its movepool is enormous. Color Change is a fascinating ability that is both a blessing and a curse. It can make matchups harder against Pokemon like Octillery and Sudowoodo. Of course, Thunder Wave can help mitigate that by giving it more turns to use Recover, but it’s still unfortunate. However, against Choice item attackers, or monotype attackers like Mightyena, it’s actually quite a good defensive ability. Essentially, Kecleon is a stats-based utility special wall.
Clefairy has risen enormously over the past year. In my opinion, it’s just as good as Kecleon. What it lacks for in stats to defend against certain offensive teams, it makes up for in Magic Guard, an ability that absolutely destroys unprepared defensive teams, and punishes anyone who builds too passively. For once, I actually think this makes Magic Guard a really healthy part of the metagame.
Munchlax has had a really rough year. Its role was to be a tank that could take damage and then deal it back, but that niche is really awkward when Kecleon walls better, and when Exploud breaks better. It’s not powerful enough to beat defensive teams, nor is it bulky enough to withstand an offensive assault before needing to Rest. I think that, because of this, Munchlax has fallen off. However, it still has one set that is genuinely very good. Curselax may need Pursuit support, but becomes one of the scariest Pokemon in the tier when it gets going. To me, this is what seems to be its main niche now.
MID-SPEED BREAKERS
But of course, when there’s walls, there’s always something to break them. Last year, I believed that DPP SU’s mid-speed wallbreakers were generally equal in viability. Now, I see a clear hierarchy. Of course, Mightyena and Octillery are the top tier breakers. Mightyena fills many other roles along with its breaking, while Octillery is too slow to be considered mid-speed. Because of their blind spots, all of the following Pokemon have respectable niches to fill in the gaps.
I think that the best breaker has by far become Meditite. Meditite arguably has the worst defensive standing of any breaker, but a well positioned Meditite is basically a 6-0 against a defensive team. You’d assume this wouldn’t be super consistent, as Meditite would also need to face offensive teams, but that’s negated by two factors. Firstly, it’s an excellent lead, a role where it’ll almost always provide value. Secondly, most offensive teams still have defensive Pokemon. Through the use of a sacrifice, or a pivot like Lumineon or Dustox, a well positioned Meditite basically always demands a KO. I think the most consistent set is Fake Out + Bullet Punch so it can still get in work against offense, but there’s some utterly brutal tools it can bring against defense. Substitute and Bulk Up are disgusting setup options. Basically the only reason Slowpoke and Drowzee have a niche, as small as they are, is because they resist Meditite’s STABs. However, even Slowpoke doesn’t want to eat a Thunder Punch. More viable checks include Cherrim, defensive Pidgeot, and Wormasand. Keep in mind that nothing counters Meditite, so these checks need to be piloted extremely carefully. All of these factors turn Meditite into the true gold standard of mid-speed breaking.
In the mid-tier of mid-speed breaking, I think Seviper has some of the most overall consistency. Just like Mightyena, Seviper has Sucker Punch. While not being able to spam its STAB as easily, it makes up for this with its incredible coverage. Unlike Mightyena, however, it can run into some tough matchups like Marshtomp and Wormasand. Its lack of defensive utility makes any rough spot even rougher, too. These weaknesses prevented me from truly loving Seviper. That was until I latched on to its status as a Toxic Spikes absorber. That alone has effectively let me replace Mightyena with it on some of my teams, establishing a very solid role because of it.
Magnemite, despite its polarized stats, is shockingly good. It switches into Mightyena and Pidgeot with ease, and its Thunderbolts hit incredibly hard in a meta where Tentacool is spammed so much. It’s funny that trapping Bronzor is only a bonus for it now, instead of its main draw.
Isn’t Pikachu a fast sweeper with Nasty Plot? Nope! Its speed tier isn’t reliable enough for how frail it is, and that frailty makes setting Nasty Plot very difficult. Because of this, Pikachu eventually adapted into a breaker that uses Encore to force uncomfortable switches. It’s very high risk, but the reward is often great, and it’s one of the Pokemon that defensive teams have to account for most. The only knock against it is that it’s incredibly inconsistent against offensive teams. At least Static procs can annoy the hell out of them, and technically makes Pikachu better defensively than Meditite.
I know I’ll get some flack for this, but I think that Exploud and Flareon are the weakest mid-speed breakers. The answer boils down to one simple concept. Neither of them have significant defensive utility, or strong priority.
Exploud’s lack of defensive utility is a deceptively big issue for the simple reason of competition. Normals are already excellent, after all. Mixed coverage, then, becomes its most unique strength, and here’s the evidence for how good that is for it.
Flareon, meanwhile, is most held back by its Stealth Rock weakness. It’s so strong that it’s arguably only walled by itself, but that Stealth Rock weakness is genuinely that bad.
HOLY MAGIKARP SWEEP ON GOD FRFR 67
Sweepers are often rewarded for the work of a breaker. Usually, Croconaw reaps that reward, but there are two other sweepers that hold important, yet less common niches.
Pupitar has been legit for quite a while now. Pupitar’s main claim to fame is easily setting up on Pidgeot, and it also often gets chances to set up against defensive teams as well. Of course, EdgeQuake also acts as fantastic coverage, making its power supremely explosive. However, I find that Pupitar is much less consistent than Croconaw. Its typing is full of holes, nor can it outspeed Lopunny after a Dragon Dance. There are absolutely cases where this will explode and take over a game, but Croconaw is absolutely better in most cases.
Chatot, meanwhile, has only recently become legit. Sharing Pidgeot’s speed tier instantly makes it more consistent of a sweeper than Pikachu will ever be. Early sets attempted to use Substitute, but that took too many turns to set up. Thus, Encore took its place, acting as a move that can help Chatot set up instead of competing for that setup. You don’t see it a lot, but its role is legit, and it’s honestly easier to fit than Pupitar nowadays, despite being less strong overall.
SPIKES
Spikes are an incredible move. Now that I’ve discussed every style of team in detail, I can now explain how Spikes can fit in basically all of them.
But that wasn’t always the case. Last year, Budew had only recently been accepted as the best Spikes setter. This is due to its incredible ability to absorb Toxic Spikes and recover its own health with Synthesis. This makes it a Spikes setter that defensive teams love. You may be surprised that Budew can even live hits when its stats are so bad, but it’s not expected to switch in against offensive Pokemon like an actual wall would. Because of this, it’s actually impressive that it can tank hits against Cherrim and Lumineon. Granted, it’ll usually just exploit defensive Pokemon. For these reasons, it also fits surprisingly well on bulky offense. Duskull’s spinblocking, however, ended up being what really elevated it beyond what we had expected.
But of course, every offensive builder likes having a Spikes option to consider, and Pineco fits well in that role for its ability to use Explosion after setting up. A recent idea I began to implement was Payback on lead sets to deal with Taunt leads. It’s a lot less common than Budew, but still has its place. It even has a uniquely solid defensive role against Lopunny.
I HATE DUST(and love The Amazing Bulk)
One of the coolest rises to stardom in the tier is Dustox. Dustox has been dismissed for its Stealth Rock weakness forever, but the meta is in a genuinely great spot for it right now. Because the meta has slowed down, being a slow pivot makes it absolutely amazing on certain bulky offense teams. Its Stealth Rock weakness still forces it to click Roost when it wants to U-Turn, but absorbing Toxic Spikes alone is enough to make this trade-off worthwhile. I think Dustox is a genuinely really solid part of the tier now.
IT’S MOUTH LOOKS LIKE A BUTT AND THAT’S FUNNY
Stunky is another Pokemon who I had dismissed, this time for its terrible stats. However, I think that it’s become genuinely viable due to having a shocking amount of strong traits for offense teams. Hands down, the most valuable of these is absorbing Toxic Spikes. Its movepool elevates it further. As established with Mightyena, Dark STAB is almost completely unresisted. Stunky trades Mightyena’s stats and utility for the incredibly valuable tools of Pursuit and Explosion. Explosion has made it the core of boom spam, a team style that I haven’t optimized, but I think will eventually get a place. Unlike Koffing, however, Stunky can fit outside of this rigid style. I believe that has made it a core, yet niche, part of SU.
IPAD BABY(but fast this time)
Speaking of niche, Elekid is definitely not good, but it’s recently established a small, unique niche for being able to outspeed Pidgeot and Lumineon while hitting them for a super effective, STAB Thunderbolt. It’s frail without Pikachu’s breaking power, but it’s not bad for what it does.
IT’S ALWAYS SUNNY IN DPP SU
There’s no lead up or transition here. Sun teams are better than ever.
I believe that Sunflora has fully become a part of the metagame. It still has the same insane power as before, and even has a tiny niche outside of Sun for its unique typing and breaking power.
Weepinbell’s sweeping is made distinct by its versatility. Swords Dance sets are fantastic on sun, as Sucker Punch still gives it a tool once the Sun wears out, thus why it can even be run outside of it. Special sets, meanwhile, are able to maintain Sunflora’s incredible coverage while still having higher speed for the late game.
Tropius is slightly more niche, but absolutely still worth consideration. Its typing has more holes for setting up, but its bulk allows it to set up better against the things it can tank.
However, I’d be remiss not to discuss the flaws of Sun. While the setters are adequate, only Furret, Lopunny, Onix, and Sudowoodo have the ability to generate reliable momentum after setting up. Of those, only Furret lives afterward. As Sun teams are naturally put on a timer, it can make Protect an extremely annoying move for Sun to play around. Its biggest weakness, though, is Cherrim. Because Flower Gift gives it 1.5x SpD in Sun, it’s shockingly good at walling and revenge killing special Sun sweepers. Choice Choice Lumineon and Pidgeot, other extremely common Pokemon, outspeed every Sun Pokemon. Yanma, meanwhile, is a more niche Pokemon who is generally quite weak, but utterly ravages through Sun teams. These weaknesses appear harsh, but they can be built around, as Sun’s strengths make that cost worth it.
CHOICE SCARF
Sun is generally understood to be good, yet flawed. The viability of Choice Scarf, however, is a far more contested part of DPP SU. In most tiers, Choice Scarf is elite. It’s certainly good in DPP SU when Lopunny’s running around. However, with the infestation of priority moves, Choice Scarf users really need to justify themselves in DPP SU.
Of course, I’ve already mentioned this, but I consider Lumineon and Pidgeot to be the gold standard of Choice Scarf. Not only are they faster than other options, but they’re also tankier, and crucially have U-Turn. Those are the three pillars of what makes an excellent Choice Scarf user.
I think Furret and Gastly are the next best Choice Scarf users. Furret is still very fast and has incredible utility in Pursuit, Trick, and U-Turn. While Choice Scarf is not Gastly’s best set, its immunities give it way more chances to come in than Abra, who I believe to be a pretty bad Choice Scarf user.
I’ve started to like Vibrava less as the years went on. Crucially, its base 70 speed pales in comparison to every other Pokemon I just mentioned. However, it has two saving graces that keep it viable. Firstly, its movepool is absolutely heavenly. Secondly, its typing is genuinely great defensively. Having both an Electric and Ground immunity allows it to switch in some truly unique things, and that absolutely keeps it viable.
Mankey, meanwhile, has fallen off, and is the reason this section even exists. While its offensive profile is still adequate, its defensive one just doesn’t cut it anymore. A Sucker Punch resist is literally it. Otherwise, this is just outright harder to fit than better options.
Any other Scarfer I haven’t mentioned was covered last year btw.
THE LEAD METAGAME
The lead metagame is where I want to end off this post, primarily because it will take us full circle.
Machop has become the most controversial Pokemon in DPP SU. Most arguments against its existence state that what’s broken is not the power of the Pokemon, but the competitive integrity of what it can do. Dynamic Punch is a roulette. Because of the guaranteed hit activating confusion, your only actual option against it is to kill it as quickly as you can. If you switch out, Machop is guaranteed to win the trade due to its Focus Sash, and a single hit of confusion prevents you from breaking that Focus Sash.
Stealth Rock leads are affected by Machop in different ways.
There are some Stealth Rock leads that are well equipped to wall Machop.
Meanwhile, suicide leads just don’t care.
However, bulkier Stealth Rock leads have taken a massive hit from Machop’s presence, and often need a Gastly or Duskull to switch into, otherwise, the Machop will take out two of your Pokemon. Of course, a Machop player can always read that with Payback.
No matter how difficult that sounds, I don’t believe Machop is broken, as it has many notable checks.
Lopunny is the best lead in DPP SU, and part of that is due to how broken Encore is. Prior to Encore, Machop would click Protect against Lopunny’s Fake Out. Now, because Lopunny can Encore that Protect, that set has diminished in viability. Encore is also fantastic against Stealth Rock leads. The only real exception to that is Pineco, who doesn’t mind clicking Spikes repeatedly.
Machop also hates fast, offensive Taunt leads. Sure, none can win the 1v1, but because they’re so fast, they’ll always break Machop’s Focus Sash. Lead Gastly is especially goated, as it's outright immune to Dynamic Punch, and also happens to be one of the best answers to lead Lopunny.
I think the biggest evidence against Machop being broken, however, comes in Meditite. Meditite is literally just a better lead than Machop, and it took surprisingly long to discover it. Meditite can break Machop’s Focus Sash with Fake Out before taking it, perhaps the strongest argument for why Protect Machop is still viable. Outside of the Machop matchup, Meditite is far more consistent due to its higher speed and power. Sure, it misses out on some insane value from confusion 50/50s, but I think it’s a much better fit on teams overall. Meditite, unlike Machop, can also put a real dent in Duskull as well, which makes its niche as a lead far stronger. Lead Meditite is a huge reason why I think the Pokemon has been elevated to true high tier status.
THANKS FOR READING
Okay, that was everything. This post was mammoth when I absolutely was not intending it to be. There are many times I could’ve gone into more detail, but I decided only to give that to the mons who needed it, or the mons that changed enough. I want to thank everyone who read all of this post. If the tier interests you, I’d highly suggest joining the SU Discord and sending a challenge. I’m usually down to play, even though I’m washed. As a final aside, my personal VR will be shown below. Given the subjective nature of this post, I feel like I can dump it here just fine. If anyone wants a post of me clarifying my rankings, I might do that, but this post is basically already that lol. Anyway, I’m just gonna keep rambling if I keep writing, so I'll see everyone when I escape the void again.
Lopunny
Mightyena
Sudowoodo
Lumineon
Octillery
Pidgeot
Bronzor
Cherrim
Croconaw
Gastly
Munchlax
Exploud
Flareon
Huntail
Kecleon
Meditite
Pikachu
Seviper
Tentacool
Abra
Furret
Magnemite
Mankey
Prinplup
Pupitar
Vibrava
Budew
Chatot
Machop
Marshtomp
Onix
Pineco
Wormadam-Sandy
Bastiodon
Corsola
Magcargo
Staryu
Sunflora
Tropius
Wartortle
Weepinbell
Clefairy
Graveler
Yanma
Anorith
Clamperl
Cranidos
Dustox
Noctowl
Quilava
Seaking
Slowpoke
Stunky
Togetic
Wigglytuff
Ariados
Aron
Duskull
Elekid
Poliwhirl
Porygon
