Doubles DPP Suicune

ryo yamada2001

ryo yamada2001

ryo yamada2001
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[SET]
name: Calm Mind
move 1: Hydro Pump
move 2: Ice Beam
move 3: Calm Mind
move 4: Protect
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Calm
evs: 252 HP / 208 Def / 48 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
  • Suicune is a fringe sweeper that uses its bulk and favorable matchups against rain and weak special attackers to clean late-game once it has set up Calm Mind. However, Suicune doesn't offer great utility or offensive pressure compared to Water-types like Gyarados and Swampert, has a middling Speed tier, and is susceptible to a plethora of powerful physical attacks, notably Explosion. Suicune excels in a few matchups, but its shortcomings hold it back from significance.
  • Hydro Pump hits most of the metagame for neutral or super effective damage, though its damage is underwhelming without Calm Mind boosts; Suicune needs to be at +1 to OHKO Heatran, and even at +2, it doesn't always OHKO Tyranitar. Ice Beam is Suicune's best way of hitting Latias.
  • Suicune sets up Calm Mind against special attackers that pose little to no threat to it, such as Latias after Draco Meteor, Empoleon, Mew, and Cresselia. It prefers to not be revealed for as long as possible so its teammates can eliminate checks that would deter it from setting up and sweeping late-game.
  • Leftovers is Suicune's only form of consistent recovery, pairing well with its tendency to stay on the field for many subsequent turns to preserve its Calm Mind boosts.
  • The given EV spread lets Suicune take an Explosion from maximum Attack Metagross and a Thunderbolt from Choice Specs Rotom-A.
  • Other fringe options include Icy Wind, which Suicune mitigate its own middling speed tier at the cost of dealing less damage to Latias, and Substitute, which drops Ice-type coverage entirely in favor of blocking Thunder Wave and Toxic, defending Suicune from Explosion, and generally making it harder to remove.
  • As Suicune invests significantly in Special Defense, its biggest checks are strong physical attackers. Thus, Intimidate users such as Salamence and Hitmontop effectively increase Suicune's bulk by weakening foes. Suicune requires speed control to be effective, so partners with Thunder Wave, such as Zapdos and Gyarados, slow down foes for Suicune to pick off. Rhyperior's offensive coverage and ability Lightning Rod match up well against the Electric-types that otherwise pose a threat against Suicune. Teammates with immediate offensive pressure such as Choice Specs Latias make up for Suicune's middling damage output, making it a fearsome setup threat instead.
[CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/ryo-yamada2001.192134/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/qsns.230771/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/zee.501951/
Grammar checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/lumari.232216/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/zastra.558636/
 
Last edited:
ryo yamada2001 said:
[SET]
name: Calm Mind
move 1: Hydro Pump
move 2: Ice Beam
move 3: Calm Mind
move 4: Protect
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Calm
evs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD

ping me on discord when you want to discuss spread but this does not feel optimal considering you want to be able to switch into tar and meta + boost spdef with CM. might want spa to hit the benchmarks discussed below

[SET COMMENTS]
  • Suicune is a fringe win condition that uses its bulk and favorable matchups against rain and weaker special attackers to sweep late-game once it has set up Calm Mind. However, Suicune doesn't offer greater utility or offensive pressure compared to Water-types like Gyarados and Swampert, has a middling Speed tier, and is prone to a plethora of powerful physical attacks. Suicune excels in a few matchups, but its shortcomings hold it back from significance.
  • Hydro Pump hits most of the metagame for neutral or super effective damage, though its damage is underwhelming without Calm Mind boosts; it needs to be at +1 to OHKO Heatran, and at +2 it still doesn't always OHKO Tyranitar. Ice Beam is Suicune's best way of hitting Latios and Latias.
  • Suicune sets up Calm Mind against special attackers that pose little to no threat to it, such as Kingdra, Empoleon, Mew, and Cresselia. It prefers to not be revealed for as long as possible, so its teammates can eliminate checks that would deter it from setting up and sweeping the late-game. mention latios after draco meteor over kingdra
  • Leftovers is Suicune's only form of consistent recovery, pairing well with its tendency to stay on the field for many subsequent turns to preserve its Calm Mind boosts.
  • The given EV spread lets Suicune live two consecutive Draco Meteor from Choice Specs Latios.
  • Other fringe options include Hidden Power Water, which is its strongest fully accurate STAB attack but does pitiful damage until many Calm Mind boosts; Icy Wind, with which Suicune mitigates its own middling Speed tier at the cost of dealing less damage into Latios, and Substitute, dropping Ice-type coverage entirely in favor of being able to block Thunder Wave, Toxic, and generally be harder to remove.
  • As Suicune invests heavily in Special Defense, its biggest checks are strong physical attackers. Thus, Intimidate users such as Gyarados and Hitmontop effectively increase Suicune's bulk by weakening those foes. Suicune requires speed control to be effective, so partners with Thunder Wave, such as Cresselia and Gyarados, slow down foes for Suicune to pick off. Tyranitar is a good teammate for Suicune, as it matches up well against the Electric-types that otherwise pose a threat against Suicune. i really don't love TTar + suicune as leftovers healing is so so so crucial for suicune. Teammates with Helping Hand, such as Cresselia, mitigate Suicune's middling damage output, turning it into a fearsome attacker instead. i don't want these two 0 damage goobers on the field at the same time. would just mention teammates that put on immediate offensive pressure like le epic latios
Click to expand...

1/2
 
ryo yamada2001 said:
[SET]
name: Calm Mind
move 1: Hydro Pump
move 2: Ice Beam
move 3: Calm Mind
move 4: Protect
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Calm
evs: 252 HP / 208 Def / 48 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
  • Suicune is a fringe win condition that uses its bulk and favorable matchups against rain and weaker special attackers to sweep late-game once it has set up Calm Mind. However, Suicune doesn't offer greater utility or offensive pressure compared to Water-types like Gyarados and Swampert, has a middling Speed tier, and is prone to a plethora of powerful physical attacks. Suicune excels in a few matchups, but its shortcomings hold it back from significance. I would mention susceptibility to Explosion in particular, even though it isn't killing it doesnt threaten either of the two big boom users that well and taking that much dmg on the wincon is very sad
  • Hydro Pump hits most of the metagame for neutral or super effective damage, though its damage is underwhelming without Calm Mind boosts; it needs to be at +1 to OHKO Heatran, and at +2 it still doesn't always OHKO Tyranitar. Ice Beam is Suicune's best way of hitting Latias.
  • Suicune sets up Calm Mind against special attackers that pose little to no threat to it, such as LatiAs fix capitilization after Draco Meteor, Empoleon, Mew, and Cresselia. It prefers to not be revealed for as long as possible, so its teammates can eliminate checks that would deter it from setting up and sweeping the late-game.
  • Leftovers is Suicune's only form of consistent recovery, pairing well with its tendency to stay on the field for many subsequent turns to preserve its Calm Mind boosts.
  • The given EV spread lets Suicune take a max Attack Metagross Explosion and Choice Specs Rotom-A Thunderbolt.
  • Other fringe options include Hidden Power Water, which is its strongest fully accurate STAB attack but does pitiful damage until many Calm Mind boosts has this ever been used?? seems like we are reaching a bit, icy wind and sub are fine by me tho; Icy Wind, with which Suicune mitigates its own middling Speed tier at the cost of dealing less damage into Latias, and Substitute, dropping Ice-type coverage entirely in favor of being able to block Thunder Wave, Toxic, and generally be harder to remove.
  • As Suicune invests heavily in Special Defense, its biggest checks are strong physical attackers. Thus, Intimidate users such as Gyarados and Hitmontop effectively increase Suicune's bulk by weakening those foes. Suicune requires speed control to be effective, so partners with Thunder Wave, such as Cresselia and Gyarados, repeated mentions of double water in the zapdos meta don't sit particularly well with me, alternatives of salamence/zapdos seem better but i wouldn't mind if one of the gyara mentions is left slow down foes for Suicune to pick off. Rhyperior is a good teammate for Suicune, as it matches up well against the Electric-types that otherwise pose a threat against Suicune. give potential lightningrod a mentionTeammates with immediate offensive pressure such as Choice Specs Latias mitigate Suicune's middling damage output, making it a fearsome setup threat instead.
[CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/ryo-yamada2001.192134/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/qsns.230771/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user3.103/
Grammar checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user4.104/
Click to expand...

qc 2/2
 
add remove comment
[SET]
name: Calm Mind
move 1: Hydro Pump
move 2: Ice Beam
move 3: Calm Mind
move 4: Protect
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Calm
evs: 252 HP / 208 Def / 48 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
  • Suicune is a fringe win condition wincon that uses its bulk and favorable matchups against rain and weak special attackers to sweep late-game once it has set up Calm Mind. However, Suicune doesn't offer great utility or offensive pressure compared to Water-types like Gyarados and Swampert, has a middling Speed tier, and is prone to a plethora of powerful physical attacks, notably being susceptible to Explosion. Suicune excels in a few matchups, but its shortcomings hold it back from significance.
  • Hydro Pump hits most of the metagame for neutral or super effective damage, though its damage is underwhelming without Calm Mind boosts; it Suicune needs to be at +1 to OHKO Heatran (RC) and even at +2, (AC) it still doesn't always OHKO Tyranitar (better flow). Ice Beam is Suicune's best way of hitting Latias.
  • Suicune sets up Calm Mind against special attackers that pose little to no threat to it, such as Latias after Draco Meteor, Empoleon, Mew, and Cresselia. It prefers to not be revealed for as long as possible (RC) so its teammates can eliminate checks that would deter it Suicune from setting up and sweeping the late-game.
  • Leftovers is Suicune's only form of consistent recovery, pairing well with its tendency to stay on the field for many subsequent turns to preserve its Calm Mind boosts.
  • The given EV spread lets Suicune take a maximum Attack Metagross Explosion and Choice Specs Rotom-A Thunderbolt.
  • Other fringe options include Icy Wind, with which Suicune mitigates its own middling Speed speed tier at the cost of dealing less damage into to Latias, and Substitute, dropping which drops Ice-type coverage entirely in favor of being able to blocking Thunder Wave (RC) and Toxic, defending from Explosion, and generally be being harder to remove. (parallelism)
  • As Suicune invests heavily in Special Defense (is it rly heavy investment? the set mentioned here has 208 def evs), its biggest checks are strong physical attackers. Thus, Intimidate users such as Salamence and Hitmontop effectively increase Suicune's bulk by weakening foes. Suicune requires speed control to be effective, so partners with Thunder Wave, such as Zapdos and Gyarados, slow down foes for Suicune to pick off. Rhyperior is a good teammate for Suicune, as its offensive coverage and possible ability Lightning Rod matches up well against the Electric-types that otherwise pose a threat against Suicune. Teammates with immediate offensive pressure such as Choice Specs Latias make up for Suicune's middling damage output, making it a fearsome setup threat instead.
[CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/ryo-yamada2001.192134/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/qsns.230771/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/zee.501951/
Grammar checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user4.104/
 
Last edited:
zastra: add remove comment
mari: add / fix remove (comments); (AC=add comma; RC=remove comma; SC=semicolon)
[SET]
name: Calm Mind
move 1: Hydro Pump
move 2: Ice Beam
move 3: Calm Mind
move 4: Protect
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Calm
evs: 252 HP / 208 Def / 48 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
  • Suicune is a fringe win condition wincon (sweeper is better here bc teambuilding context) that uses its bulk and favorable matchups against rain and weak special attackers to sweep clean (repetition) late-game once it has set up Calm Mind. However, Suicune doesn't offer great utility or offensive pressure compared to Water-types like Gyarados and Swampert, has a middling Speed tier, and is prone susceptible to a plethora of powerful physical attacks, notably being susceptible to Explosion. Suicune excels in a few matchups, but its shortcomings hold it back from significance.
  • Hydro Pump hits most of the metagame for neutral or super effective damage, though its damage is underwhelming without Calm Mind boosts; it Suicune needs to be at +1 to OHKO Heatran (RC) (keep comma) and even at +2, (AC) it still doesn't always OHKO Tyranitar (better flow). Ice Beam is Suicune's best way of hitting Latias.
  • Suicune sets up Calm Mind against special attackers that pose little to no threat to it, such as Latias after Draco Meteor, Empoleon, Mew, and Cresselia. It prefers to not be revealed for as long as possible (RC) so its teammates can eliminate checks that would deter it Suicune ("it" is fine) from setting up and sweeping the late-game.
  • Leftovers is Suicune's only form of consistent recovery, pairing well with its tendency to stay on the field for many subsequent turns to preserve its Calm Mind boosts.
  • The given EV spread lets Suicune take an Explosion from maximum Attack Metagross Explosion and a Thunderbolt from Choice Specs Rotom-A Thunderbolt.
  • Other fringe options include Icy Wind, with which lets Suicune mitigates mitigate its own middling Speed speed (capital) tier at the cost of dealing less damage into to Latias, and Substitute, dropping which drops Ice-type coverage entirely in favor of being able to blocking Thunder Wave (RC) and Toxic, defending Suicune from Explosion, and generally be being ("making it") harder to remove. (parallelism)
  • As Suicune invests heavily in Special Defense (is it rly heavy investment? the set mentioned here has 208 def evs), (ya significantly may be better) its biggest checks are strong physical attackers. Thus, Intimidate users such as Salamence and Hitmontop effectively increase Suicune's bulk by weakening foes. Suicune requires speed control to be effective, so partners with Thunder Wave, such as Zapdos and Gyarados, slow down foes for Suicune to pick off. Rhyperior's is a good teammate for Suicune, as its offensive coverage and possible ability Lightning Rod matches match up well against the Electric-types that otherwise pose a threat against Suicune. Teammates with immediate offensive pressure such as Choice Specs Latias make up for Suicune's middling damage output, making it a fearsome setup threat instead.
[CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/ryo-yamada2001.192134/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/qsns.230771/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/zee.501951/
Grammar checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user4.104/

GP Team done
 
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